Interview with Richardson Dilworth, Jr. (2/6/79) (at Mr. Dilworth's office) The first question is, what are your earliest recollections of your father's political activities? Now, I have to ask you about some of these dates...I guess that mayoralty campaign that Joe Clark managed against Bar­ ney Samuel was in '47. (WMP: That's right.) ...which is the first I remember. I was at the time nine years old. All of the children, that is, Mother's children, Dad's children, by their previous marriages, were all very active in the campaign. I was the youngest of the eight. (WMP: There were eight of you altogether.) Between Mother's, by her first marriage, and Dad's, by his first marriage...Mother had two, and Dad had four, and then together they had my sister Deborah and I. So my recollec­ tions were of the street corner campaigning, which is a thing of the past. At night, I guess we'd do four or five stops a night...Dad would speak from the sound truck. We'd get a crowd with a little string band, which is why I hate string bands to this day! And the crowds were sometimes hostile...a lot of heckling...which I think Dad sort of en­ joyed, in a way, being a trial lawyer...a very aggresive trial lawyer. (WMP: He sure was!) The bigger crowds, during the day...and I didn't go to those meetings because I'd be at school... those street corner rallies, at Broad and Chestnut they had a huge one close to the elec­ tion . (WMP: I remember that one.) That was enormous, yes. As you know, it was before television and it was the only way you could get a crowd unless you could afford radio, which nobody listened to unless you were FDR. (WMP: I think that onason Broad Street was right in front of the Belleview, wasn't it?) I think so. I think it was at...it would be Broad and Walnut, yes. The Republican committeemen would always try to make as 2 . much heckling and everything as possible. And initially, I don't think people took it too seriously...at least the Republicans ... they were so self-satisfied. My recollections were just those meetings... something that I was certainly not accustomed to. I remember he had a dri­ v e r . ^ very nice man...I can't remember his name, but... (WMP: I can almost remember it myself...) I think he drove him for a couple of campaigns. (WMP: What's his name now...you know, he was sort of like a bodyguard too. He was a strong fellow.) Well, oh, I know who you're thinking of...you're thinking of Babe...big Swedish guy. (WMP: Yeah!) That's right. Now, Babe came in on the 1950 gubernatorial race. And, that's right, he was the driver. But prior to that, there was a fellow who was a...couldn't have been a nicer fellow...but when Dad would get up to give a talk on the sound truck, this fellow would disappear in the near­ est taproom. By the end of the evening, we'd be driving figure eights all over the place! He was awfully nice, but he was useless by the end of the evening. And then, my situation in regard to those days was that I went to Episcopal Academy, and I was the only person in my class, I'm-sure, whose parents were Democratic. (WMP: You commuted from town out to Overbrook?) Yes, on the Paoli Local....which made for rather rough-going, because children that age have no understanding of politics; they just parrot whatever the parents tell them. And in that case, most of the parents didn't have any understanding of it either. Which made it fairly rough-going...less and less so. And then, of course, in '52, I went away. But I remem­ ber various incidents, most of them more amusing, because I really, at that age, was not privy to the more serious things. Do you remember Sam Regalbuto? (WMP: Yes.) Well, Sam had a plan, in the '47 campaign, to park Dad's car in front of the house, at 2217 Saint James' Street. And then Sam would have somebody.... (WMP: That was your home, wasn't it?) Yes. And Sam would have somebody come by and machine-gun 3 . the car...which would all be blamed on the Republican!!! And Sam really didn't understand...Sam was serious...and he really didn't understand why Dad didn't think that was a good idea!!! There were other various little incidents like that. I can remember...and I don't remember the details...I mean, I've read them, and I've gone back, but I sort of get them jumbled up. At one point, Dad was in jail, I think for crim­ inal liable...for a matter of hours...which of course, for somebody my age...it was the end of the world...he was in jail so I'm never going to see him again! I had no idea what he was in there for. Was O'Malley the chief magistrate there? (WMP: Yes, he had been once...and he was prosecuted by Earl G. Harrison...0'Malley was.) When was O'Malley... (WMP: What?) I always liked O'Malley, and he was such a bum. He was al­ ways in a drunken brawl. Almost every day in the newspapers, there'd be another headline on O'Malley arrested in another drunken brawl in some bar!! (WMP: He was magistrate...he had been.) Yeah, he was the chief magistrate. > -V . (WMP: Was he chief?) I think so. (WMP: Yeah, I guess so.) I think he was the magistrate who charged a criminal liable, which was a big mistake because that enabled Dad to call each and every person to the stand...which was something they really hadn't thought about. (WMP: Well, what did he do to them? Did his cross-examina­ tion ) Well, he had an opportunity to get them on the stand under oath. And however they answered, he was able to put, you know, the most embarrassing possible questions to them. And it gave them a forwnfor reading off all of the stuff that he and Senator Clark had accumulated. (WMP: What year was that?) Well, it was after the mayoralty election. 4 . (WMP: Of 1947.) Yeah, it would have been 1948. I remember small incidents of sort of continual harassments For example, in the summer of '48, at that point, the child­ ren...some of the children, would go up to Eaglesmere. Mother and Dad would stay in the city...Dad couldn't stand the coun­ try. But they'd come up for a weekend, and on the way back, we were driving back, and we were involved in an accident, which was....a person pulled out in front of us. And it was not a serious accident, and it was entirely the other person's fault...nobody was injured, it wasn't serious. And the state troopers arrived and the person who'd done it admitted that he'd pulled out...he hadn't signaled. But by the time the hearing came up, they'd gotten to this guy, and his story was completely different, so that Dad lost his license, and he didn't have a license for the summer of '48. So Mother had to drive him everywhere. But it was that kind of... constant little harassment like that....which he loved, act­ ually, he didn't mind it. (BF: You mean the Republicans had gotten to this person?) Yeah, because, of course, at that time the entire state was Republican, and that was the sort of petty little games that they played, and all it did was .... with people like Senator Clark, Mr. Phillips and Dad, it just egged them on!I It didn't slow them down, it just sped them up!!! But the campaign...now, let's see...they ran for...Senator Clark ran for controller in '49, I guess; Dad ran for treas­ urer. I don't remember who the other...at that time, he also had....who were the other two? They did away with the treas­ urers, as elective. They had four row offices. (WMP: In the old days, the controller and the treasurer were elected.) Right. But there were two more, I think.) (WMP: That would have been...) Maybe the sheriff? (WMP: Yes, I think it might have been.) And there was a fourth one, I think. Well, in '49, they ran for that, and that was really more of the same, only there were more people involved at the rallies. Well, I became more and more, J guess, aware ... I can't honestly say that I ever enjoyed the campaigning...because I never real­ ly knew what was going on. I would just be dragged out to these rallies. 5 . The older children would be involved at the headquarters with volunteers...that sort of thing. Louie Hill led a thing called the "Flying Squadron", I think. Being right after the war, everything had to ... tended to have a mili­ tary thrust to it, so that young volunteers were called the Flying Squadron. I think that was in the '47 campaign. But the children were quite enthusiastic about it. And Lou Hill was at Penn Law School at that time, and there were four girls...four of my...no, three of my sisters, who were right at that age where they had several beaux, and a lot of them came from Penn Law School, I think, because Lou was there.