Vol. 799 Thursday No. 350 3 October 2019 PARLIAMENTARYDEBATES (HANSARD) HOUSE OF LORDS OFFICIAL REPORT ORDEROFBUSINESS Questions Brexit: Divergence from EU Standards ........................................................................1773 Inequality .....................................................................................................................1775 British Citizenship ........................................................................................................1778 Brexit: Parliamentary Processes....................................................................................1780 Business of the House Timing of Debates.........................................................................................................1782 Review of Investigative and Scrutiny Committees (Liaison Committee Report) Motion to Agree............................................................................................................1783 Services, Procedure and Selection Committees Membership Motion ......................................................................................................1804 Deputy Chairmen of Committees Membership Motion ......................................................................................................1806 House of Lords Commission, Services, Liaison, Procedure and Selection Committees Communications Committee Social and Economic Impact of the Gambling Industry Committee Science and Technology Committee Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments Liaison Committee Membership Motions.....................................................................................................1807 Offender Management and Treatment Motion to Take Note.....................................................................................................1808 Brexit: Negotiations Statement......................................................................................................................1848 Human Rights: Future Trade Motion to Take Note ....................................................................................................1867 Lords wishing to be supplied with these Daily Reports should give notice to this effect to the Printed Paper Office. No proofs of Daily Reports are provided. Corrections for the bound volume which Lords wish to suggest to the report of their speeches should be clearly indicated in a copy of the Daily Report, which, with the column numbers concerned shown on the front cover, should be sent to the Editor of Debates, House of Lords, within 14 days of the date of the Daily Report. This issue of the Official Report is also available on the Internet at https://hansard.parliament.uk/lords/2019-10-03 The first time a Member speaks to a new piece of parliamentary business, the following abbreviations are used to show their party affiliation: Abbreviation Party/Group CB Cross Bench Con Conservative DUP Democratic Unionist Party GP Green Party Ind Lab Independent Labour Ind LD Independent Liberal Democrat Ind SD Independent Social Democrat Ind UU Independent Ulster Unionist Lab Labour Lab Co-op Labour and Co-operative Party LD Liberal Democrat LD Ind Liberal Democrat Independent Non-afl Non-affiliated PC Plaid Cymru UKIP UK Independence Party UUP Ulster Unionist Party No party affiliation is given for Members serving the House in a formal capacity, the Lords spiritual, Members on leave of absence or Members who are otherwise disqualified from sitting in the House. © Parliamentary Copyright House of Lords 2019, this publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 1773 Brexit: Divergence from EU Standards[3 OCTOBER 2019] Brexit: Divergence from EU Standards 1774 House of Lords Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con): Does my noble friend agree that the freedom to diverge from European Thursday 3 October 2019 regulations is, as the Prime Minister said, one of the important reasons for leaving the EU, although this 11 am will probably apply more to future regulation in evolving technologies such as fintech? Does he also agree that while, like any third country, such as the United States, Prayers—read by the Lord Bishop of Newcastle. we have to observe EU regulation when we sell into the EU market, when we sell into our own market or trade with each other it is a matter for the UK Parliament? Brexit: Divergence from EU Standards Question Lord Callanan: As always on these matters, my noble friend speaks great sense. I agree with the points 11.06 am that he has made. The ability to set our own regulations and to adopt a nimble and flexible approach to regulations Asked by Lord Wallace of Saltaire on future technologies would be one of the great To ask Her Majesty’s Government when they advantages of leaving the EU. intend to inform Parliament of their priorities and objectives in the areas in which they wish to diverge Lord Lea of Crondall (Lab): My Lords, does the from European Union standards by way of United Minister agree that the previous Conservative Kingdom regulations. Government, before the recent change, said that they would keep up with the changes to minimum standards? Is he saying that there has been no change in policy The Minister of State, Department for Exiting the since that time or that there has been a change in European Union (Lord Callanan) (Con): The UK already policy since that time? goes beyond EU minimum standards in a number of areas, such as working rights and environmental protections. Our high regulatory standards are not Lord Callanan: I am saying that one of the great dependent on EU membership. After leaving the EU, advantages of our new, upcoming independence will we will be free to set our own laws and the Government be the ability to set our own regulations and standards, will continue an ambitious and flexible approach to determined in this House. I am really not sure why the make smarter and more efficient regulation. Any future Opposition want Jean-Claude Juncker to determine changes to regulations will be subject to the appropriate our environmental standards rather than the British parliamentary scrutiny. people and the British Parliament. Lord Fox (LD): My Lords, during proceedings on Lord Wallace of Saltaire (LD): I thank the noble the international trade Bill, your Lordships’ House Lord for that Answer, which tells me exactly nothing. I spent a lot of time talking about regulations and am even more confused than when I put this Question standards. The Minister at the time made a lot of down, because I see in the various documents that we undertakings about maintaining or, indeed, exceeding had yesterday that we are now about to have, current standards. That Bill has now been summarily “continued regulatory alignment for a potentially prolonged period scrapped. Meanwhile, the Secretary of State, Liz Truss, across the whole island of Ireland”. talks about having a low-regulation economy. That is That suggests that, if we are going to keep Northern why we on these Benches are concerned about the Irish and British standards the same, we will not issue. Who is right: those on your Benches who talk diverge. The Written Statement in the noble Lord’s about high standards or the Secretary of State, who name says that, talks about a low-regulation economy? “we will be negotiating a revised Political Declaration”. I assume that that is about divergence of regulations, Lord Callanan: We believe in having high standards among other things. Are the Government trying to say and we believe that we should determine these matters different things to different audiences? I think that for ourselves. I can give the Liberal Democrats some they are. Are we planning to go back to what happened examples. On maternity entitlement, the UK standard before Margaret Thatcher developed the European is 39 weeks, whereas the EU standard is 14 weeks. On single market, which was to move towards adopting annual leave, the UK has 5.6 weeks, whereas the EU US regulations? Or are the Government simply not has four. We have higher environmental standards on going to tell us what we are doing? greenhouse gas emissions: we were the first in the world to legislate on that. We already exceed the EU Lord Callanan: I am not sure why this is such a minimum requirements.Weare a high-standards economy difficult concept for the Liberal Democrats to grasp. and proud of it. We should be able to determine these There are EU minimum standards. In most of these things for ourselves. areas—whether it be holiday pay, maternity entitlement, annual leave or emissions standards—the UK goes Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con): Will my beyond those standards as a matter of our sovereign noble friend answer a simple question? When we leave choice. Why do the Liberal Democrats not have any the European Union on 31 October, we leave the confidence in our ability to determine our own standards? jurisdiction of the European Commission to apply 1775 Brexit: Divergence from EU Standards [LORDS] Inequality 1776 [BARONESS MCINTOSH OF PICKERING] Lord McNicol of West Kilbride (Lab): My Lords, any environmental standards, but the Government over the past nine years we have seen a huge rise in the have not yet established the office for environmental number of food banks across the United Kingdom. protection. Which body will decide which environmental The Trussell Trust’s figures on this are just frightening. standards apply? If the Government truly wanted to end the widening