Vol. 639 Wednesday, No. 2 10 October 2007 DI´OSPO´ IREACHTAI´ PARLAIMINTE PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES DA´ IL E´ IREANN TUAIRISC OIFIGIU´ IL—Neamhcheartaithe (OFFICIAL REPORT—Unrevised) Wednesday, 10 October 2007. Leaders’ Questions ……………………………… 437 Ceisteanna—Questions Taoiseach ………………………………… 445 Death of Former Member: Expressions of Sympathy ………………… 476 Requests to move Adjournment of Da´il under Standing Order 32 ……………… 481 Order of Business ……………………………… 482 Charities Bill 2007: Order for Second Stage …………………………… 492 Second Stage ……………………………… 492 Ceisteanna—Questions (resumed) Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government Priority Questions …………………………… 508 Other Questions …………………………… 518 Visit of Northern Ireland Delegation ………………………… 524 Ceisteanna—Questions (resumed) Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government …………… 524 Adjournment Debate Matters …………………………… 536 Charities Bill 2007: Second Stage (resumed) ……………………… 536 Private Members’ Business Fire Services: Motion (resumed) ………………………… 587 Adjournment Debate Hospital Services ……………………………… 621 Pig Industry ……………………………… 624 Road Traffic Offences …………………………… 628 Fire Services ……………………………… 630 Questions: Written Answers …………………………… 633 437 438 DA´ IL E´ IREANN was a commercial decision on the part of Aer Lingus and the company has reiterated that it will ———— not change that decision. The Government is con- scious that this will create difficulties for the De´ Ce´adaoin, 10 Deireadh Fo´mhair 2007. region and several members have met all the rel- Wednesday, 10 October 2007. evant organisations from Shannon. ———— Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It has done nothing. Chuaigh an Ceann Comhairle i gceannas ar 10.30 a.m. The Taoiseach: Several of my colleagues have gone to the region and I have met several of those ———— organisations. I met all the main organisations who sought meetings with me in the middle of Paidir. August. Prayer. Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: What did the ———— Government do? Leaders’ Questions. The Taoiseach: As the Deputy knows, the senior officials group has put forward a prog- Deputy Enda Kenny: Every murder here does ramme, on which we are working, to address the us down as a people. I am appalled at the news obvious implications for Shannon, and the this morning that a young Swiss student, having Government admits there are implications. Those come to Ireland last weekend, has been murdered implications have perhaps, at times, been broad- in Galway. I hope the public responds to the call ened out in a way with which we do not agree for assistance from gardaı´ so that the perpetrator but there are negative impacts for tourism and of this latest murder is brought to justice. It does business people wishing to travel. We have pub- us all down to have such unfortunate and tragic lished the report of the senior officials group, on events foisted upon us. which we all worked, and we will endeavour to do This week, 11 October is a critical date because all we can to ensure connectivity for the business it is the date by which arrangements must be people in Shannon. The commercial decision, made for approval for slots into Heathrow Air- however, has been made and while protections port. We have had many conversations with and are afforded to the Government by its sharehold- heard much waffle from Government on the con- ing, those protections do not extend to its forcing sequences of the decision of Aer Lingus to move Aer Lingus to make a decision it believes is not its Heathrow slots from Shannon to Belfast. If in its interest. Aer Lingus does not submit a request for Shannon-Heathrow slots by Friday, to be Deputy Enda Kenny: This represents the approved at a conference in Toronto sometime in hypocrisy of Government. The Taoiseach prom- mid-November, then the decision stands. Words ised a White Paper, before the sale of Aer Lingus, of Government are supposed to mean something to deal with the regional strategic objectives and and a Government is supposed to stand by what he has been completely blindsided in this matter. it says. The Government retains a shareholding A major decision such as this, commercial or of 25.4% in Aer Lingus for a particular purpose otherwise, would not have gone ahead without that the Taoiseach identified as defending stra- the tacit approval of Government. tegic interests of this country. Those strategic interests were identified as Shannon-Heathrow, Deputy Ruairı´ Quinn: Hear, hear. Cork-Heathrow and Dublin-Heathrow. Can the Taoiseach explain how the strategic interest of Deputy Enda Kenny: It would certainly not Shannon is protected by the removal of the slot have gone ahead without reference to the board. from Shannon Airport to Heathrow? When discussions took place about the develop- ment of an all-Ireland economy I am quite sure The Taoiseach: I join Deputy Kenny and, I am they referred to this issue, at least in some form. sure, everybody in the House in conveying deep- The Taoiseach has not answered the question est sympathies to the family of Manuela Riedo. as to how the removal of the Shannon-Heathrow It was a callous murder of a girl who had only slots protects the strategic interests his Govern- recently arrived in Ireland. The Garda Sı´ocha´na ment specifically outlined as the reason for has launched a major murder investigation and retaining a shareholding of 25.4%. The Govern- whatever resources are necessary to apprehend ment recognises that this is not just a local the killer will be made available. whinge, nor that it is an issue confined to the mid- The decision at the beginning of August, on west. Substantial business interests have made the which the Government has made several state- point clearly that the removal of the slots will not ments outlining its position, to withdraw the be a major catalyst for moving out of the region. Shannon-Heathrow service from January 2008 However, it will certainly be a serious contribu- 439 Leaders’ 10 October 2007. Questions 440 [Deputy Enda Kenny.] and one we support. Through a new link up with tory factor and if anything were to happen to the a US carrier JetBlue access to and from Shannon transatlantic routes the Taoiseach will be faced will be possible via 50 airports in the US, Mexico with a very serious problem. and the Caribbean. New direct services to Ireland I listened to the Minister for Transport on the are possible under the open skies policy. radio the other morning. He made the point that the reason for appointing two further board Deputy Pat Breen: Not to Shannon. members is to ensure the board of Aer Lingus takes full cognisance of Government policy. The Taoiseach: Aer Lingus is launching new Government policy is to protect the strategic services to Washington, Orlando and San interests of Shannon, Cork and Dublin but the Francisco. Government has not done that. Does the Taoiseach accept that the original failure of Deputy Pat Breen: From Dublin. Government to appoint two members to the Aer Lingus board was negligent in the extreme and Deputy Eamon Gilmore: Not through meant that the commercial decision of which he Shannon. speaks was taken by Aer Lingus without the full cognisance and understanding of Government The Taoiseach: Yes, from Shannon. Experi- policy? ence suggests that 50% of North American visit- ors can be expected to include a trip to the mid- Deputies: Hear, hear. west region. Other initiatives can be taken. Deputy Kenny is right that this has created con- The Taoiseach: Deputy Kenny will recall that cerns for the business and tourism communities, the board did not make that decision — it was however we have met all the interested parties made by the senior management of the company. and we are acutely concerned about them. We are trying our best, if it is possible — but I cannot Deputy Tom Hayes: Why appoint members to guaranteed certainty — to assist them. the board, then? Deputy Pat Breen: Aer Lingus is the only The Taoiseach: If Deputies had been around in option. early August they would have known that to have been the case. The position in law is that it is not Deputy Eamon Gilmore: In less than three possible for Government to intervene directly to months it will not be possible to get a flight from restore the Shannon-Heathrow service and it is Shannon to Heathrow. There is no point in telling not open to the Government to reverse the Aer people that they can get a flight to Orlando if Lingus decision. That is the position. they want to travel to London. In less than three weeks time—— Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Sell the 25%. Deputy Michael Ahern: There are two other Deputy Dan Neville: What is the Minister for airports. Transport and the Marine going to do? Deputy Eamon Gilmore: ——due to deterior- Deputy Enda Kenny: What is the legal ating industrial relations in Aer Lingus, it may position? not be possible to get an Aer Lingus flight to any- where. Last weekend British Midland indicated The Taoiseach: That is the legal position. It is that it does not intend to run a service from the law that shareholders cannot overturn man- Shannon to Heathrow. I would like the Taoiseach agement decisions. It is no good having a debate to tell us the name of the proposed carrier that about what is legally and factually incorrect. will offer a service from Shannon to Heathrow. Deputy Kenny has asked his questions and he As I understand it, it was either British Midland does not need help from other Members. Clearly or Aer Lingus and if British Midland will not there are negative impacts arising from a loss of provide the service, then the only way in which a connectivity. Deputy Kenny asked how this service from Shannon to Heathrow can be pro- coincides with regional assistance.