The Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Project ASSISTANT SECRETARY GASTON J. SIGUR, JR. Interviewed by: Charles Stuart Kennedy Initial interview date: April 24, 1990 Copyright 199 ADST TABLE OF CONTENTS Background arly education Army Advanced education Years in Japan 1956-1961 Impressions of Japan Sophia )niversity Asia Foundation 1962-1966 fforts in Japan and Afghanistan NS, 1982-1986 Appointment as Asian affairs head ,ommuni.u/ 0ith ,hina President1s involvement Provisions 2esults Judge ,lark as national security advisor Type of people in NS, ,ooperation 0ith other departments 3ay of getting around bureaucratic slo0ness 2espect for career people in government ,ommitment to strengthen )S-Japan relationship 2ole as emissary bet0een leaders of )S and Japan Japanese response to American resentment Japanese military Development of 5orean economy Authoritarian nature of ,hun Doo H0an )S position6 civiliani7ation of government Student riots Intent of visit to South 5orea 1 North 5orea Assistant Secretary, AP 1986-1989 Appointment Impressions of AP 3orking relationship 0ith other agencies ,hina and Tai0an Intent of communi.u/ Tai0an 2elations Act Opposition to communi.u/ from ,ongress President and communi.u/ Opposition against sale of high-technology 9isits to ,hina from ,abinet Tai0an feeling reassured Message to ,hinese Proceeding arrangements Human rights in Tibet Breakfast 0ith congressmen and senators 3orking relationship 0ith ,ongress 5ey players in ,ongress George Shult7 Trust of department professionals Philippines American goal Marcos1 losing touch 0ith reality Trip to Japan President A.uino Importance of bases 9ietnam American position ,hinese support of 5hmer 2ouge Japan Importance of )S-Japan relationship INTERVIEW Q: I might mention that Gaston was in at the birth of this oral history program when it started at George Washington (niversity. Gaston, I wonder if you could give me a bit of your background before we get into your overseas e,perience. Where did you come from, education and that sort of thing. SIG)26 3ell, I 0as born and raised in Franklin, Louisiana, a small to0n. I 0ent briefly to Louisiana State )niversity, 1941-43. I started there at the age of 16. And then, of 2 course, the 0ar came and I 0ent into the Army in 1943. And after basic training, that's 0hen I began to study Japanese. Q: They grabbed you out for Japanese training. SIG)26 They grabbed me out for Japanese training. So I sort of continued that all the 0ay through the 0ar years. Q: Where did they send you. SIG)26 They sent me originally to the )niversity of ,hicago. Then I did some other things in the Army, briefly, and then 0ent on to continue the study of Japanese at the )niversity of Michigan and then at Fort Snelling, in Minneapolis, 0here I 0as commissioned. By that time, the 0ar 0as over. Then I 0ent over to Japan in the occupation and spent a year there. Q: What were you doing. SIG)26 I 0as the intelligence officer for Tachika0a Air Base. As you kno0, of course, in those days there 0as no separate Air Force. So I 0as attached to the Army- Air Force and stayed there almost all of 1946, then came back and got discharged. I didn't have my BA yet, so I decided to get my BA and go on and get an MA degree in area studies, Asia. I 0ent to the )niversity of Michigan, 0here I had been for a year during the 0ar Aor nine months, 0hatever it 0as). I 0ent back there and I got my BA and my MA and my Ph.D. from Michigan, in History. Q: /ut you were keeping up with your Japanese. SIG)26 I 0as keeping up 0ith the Japanese all the time. Later, I 0as in Japan from 1956 to '61 0ith the Asia Foundation and then at Sophia )niversity. Q: I wonder if you could talk a little about that. 0ou were at the Asia Foundation, and then you were in Sophia (niversity in Tokyo from 239 to 241. Could you tell me your impressions of Japan at that time, sort of a formative period. SIG)26 Japan 0as moving out from under the occupation Athe occupation ended in '52). And Japan 0as beginning to feel her 0ay into the post-0ar 0orld as an independent country-- closely allied 0ith the )nited States, of course. I think that's one of the significant factors here, that since that period of time, 0hen the occupation ended, the governments of Japan and the people of Japan, in their election process, have all strongly reinforced the tie 0ith the )nited States. This has been absolutely key in terms of their foreign policy and the 0ay in 0hich their foreign policy is 3 made and implemented. It is, first and foremost, the )nited States-Japanese relationship that affects the minds of the policy makers. So I think that's very important. But also, of course, by 1956 one could begin to see the Japanese economy rising .uite rapidly. There had been great devastation caused by the 0ar. Immediately follo0ing the 0ar, one sa0 devastation all over the country. But by '56 this had clearly begun to disappear. 2ebuilding had taken place, ne0 businesses 0ere going up. You got a sense of vitality. This is not surprising, given the fact that the Japanese educational system 0as one of the best in the 0orld. The literacy rate 0as almost a hundred percent, even in the pre-0ar days in Japan. Training 0as very good. The )nited States contributed mightily to the Japanese economic development and one got a sense of things moving for0ard. You could see again the rising of Japan. Q: What was your impression when you were in Sophia (niversity 5this was one of the top universities in Japan6 of the student body as far as its attitude towards outside Japan and particularly the (nited States. SIG)26 It's hard for me to say too much about that, because I didn't see that many of the students. I 0as engaged in a research project there 0ith a group of Japanese professors. Q: Well, to move on. 0ou were in Afghanistan from 242 to 244 with the Asia Foundation. What was the Asia Foundation doing, both in Japan and Afghanistan. What type of work was this. SIG)26 3ell, it 0as education, broadly defined. The programs 0ere .uite different in Japan and Afghanistan. After all, Japan 0as a 0ide-open, democratic society. Afghanistan 0as an authoritarian society, under a king. It 0as moving to0ard a constitutional monarchy 0hen 0e 0ere there, so things 0ere beginning to open up. But it 0as a different modus operandi in both places. In Afghanistan, 0hich 0as, of course, .uite far back in time in terms of development, the Asia Foundation there did most of its 0ork in providing advisors to Afghan institutions. For instance, 0e had several advisors at the )niversity of 5abul, helping them build up the university in the area of science--a science department--also in the area of sports. And 0e had advisors in the government. Advisors in the Ministry of ,ommerce, trying to broaden Afghanistan's eCport markets and this sort of thing. So that 0as the kind of thing 0e did in Afghanistan. In Japan, it 0as providing support to individuals, individual professors mainly, coming to this country, studying in this country, that sort of thing. And this 0as an essential part of institution building for democratic permanence. 3e did .uite a bit in the area of la0 education, legal education and so forth. T0o kinds, as I say, different programs, geared to the different stages of development in both countries. Of course, as 0e 0orked in Japan, obviously 0e began to think more in terms of 0ays in 0hich 0e could cooperate 0ith the Japanese in perhaps doing 0ork 4 together in other developing countries that needed assistance, so that the Japanese could also provide funds together 0ith The Asia Foundation. Q: Well, now, we2ll move 7uite rapidly up to your time in dealing with the government when you were with the National Security Council, from 19 2 to 2 4. How did you get into that job, and what were you doing. SIG)26 I served as a foreign policy advisor to then- candidate George Bush, beginning in late 1979 0hen he began to run for the 2epublican nomination for the presidency. He 0rote me a letter and asked if I 0ould serve in a foreign policy advisory capacity, and I said I 0ould. I liked him, and I thought it 0ould be a good thing to do. Of course, I 0as here at George 3ashington )niversity at the time. And then, after 2onald 2eagan got the nomination and Bush the nomination for vice president, I 0as asked if I 0ould join the foreign policy team for them, and I did. And so I became one of a fe0 0ho dealt largely 0ith Asia. This 0as a small coterie of about siC, I think. And 0e advised the 2eagan-Bush ticket on Asian affairs. After 2eagan 0on the election, I made it clear that I 0asn't interested in serving in the government, that I preferred to stay at the university. But then, in the spring of 1982, the then-national security advisor, Judge 3illiam ,lark, called me and asked me if I 0ould consider coming over to the National Security ,ouncil and 0orking for him and 0ith him, being the president's man for Asia, so to speak. No0 I had met President 2eagan t0o or three times before. Actually, I think once during the campaign and then a couple of times before he had been nominated, 0hen he 0as out of the governorship in ,alifornia, 0hen he 0as, I think, a fello0 at the Hoover Institution.