The Skating Lesson Podcast Transcript Federations, Chance, and the International Judging System: An Interview with Chuck Foster Part 2 Jenny: Now in 2003, Chuck, you were elected president of United States Figure Skating. What are the primary responsibilities of the president? Chuck: You’re sort of the CEO of the organization. So you have – it’s a volunteer-driven organization. So you have an executive committee that does – takes care of, oversees almost every aspect with a professional setup. So you’re just looking over the rest of the staff. Now at the time when, during your first month of president, you laid out your goals for the federation. And part of what you talked about was changing the way that US Figure Skating communicated with the ISU. And in part, you said: “We have to make alliances with other like-minded members to try to effect change. We need to improve our influence. This is where we have been lacking. We have not paid attention to the ISU. We’ve let things slip.” So in what ways did you feel at the time that US Figure Skating wasn’t paying attention to the ISU and had let things slip, and what was your fear if things continued the way that they had been? Chuck: The ISU is not unlike the UN. We are one vote with all these other – we have the equal vote as do all the other members. We got one vote – you know, Poland has one vote. And we didn’t have alliances or friendships with anybody. I thought maybe because I had been a judge internationally for so long that I would have a good relationship with a lot of people so that I could help the US Figure Skating by being part of the ISU decision-making. But I gotta tell you, it didn’t work. Jenny: So you felt at the time that US Figure Skating was just isolating itself a bit, not using its allies in a sense? Chuck: Yes. We were not a factor in the ISU. Dave: Now why wouldn’t the US have been more a factor given all of the success of skating in the US at the time? Chuck: Why aren’t we much more of a factor in the UN? Considering we pay for a lot of it? Just doesn’t work that way. Jenny: Okay, and what were you afraid of was going to happen if, like you said, it didn’t seem like anything changed, so what was your fear at the time? Chuck: Hm – I can’t recall what my fear was. I just felt we didn’t have enough say in the ISU, and that turned out – it’s true. We don’t have any. Jenny: So a few months before you became president, a new federation was formed, the World Skating Federation. And really their primary goal was to take some of that influence away from the ISU and back to the hands of the athletes. Personally, what was your opinion about this federation? Chuck: I knew nothing about it, and I was very surprised. I must have been the only person in US Figure Skating that hadn’t heard of it. But as I have said, I was – from the time I was with the Olympic Committee, I was really not involved in US Figure Skating from about 19 – I was a member of the board till ’96, I think, but from ’91 or so I was too busy with the Olympic Committee. I was out of it. So I wasn’t in the flow of what was going on, and I was as shocked as anybody. I read about it in the paper before I – I went to Washington as a spectator for the World Championships. I hadn’t heard anything about it. Other people had. I subsequently found out a lot of people had signed non-disclosure agreements. I don’t know if you’ve heard about that. They were informed about what was developing, but they had to agree not to say anything. I was never approached. Jenny: So when you found out about the federation and what they were doing, what then were your views? Chuck: I didn’t have any views, really, because I wasn’t involved. What it did create was, ultimately, later on in April or May, I became more or less a candidate to be president. But I had no particular views at the time. Jenny: And at the time, US Figure Skating got some flak for not publicly endorsing the World Skating Federation. Why did you think that was? Chuck: It was a coup de tat. Some members wanted to do it, some didn’t. They didn’t succeed in, this is the way I understand it, I wasn’t a part of it, but the executive committee met in Washington, of US Figure Skating – I think, and I’m not really the one to tell you about this, but my understanding is the executive committee met. Some members of the executive committee wanted to come out publicly in behind them and others didn’t. Weell, the coup de tat didn’t work, so they didn’t come out and support them. That was a vote I think of the executive committee at that time. Dave: Now during your career as president of the USFS, we start to see American skaters withdrawing from the Grand Prix events, specifically Skate America, which is really one of the hallmark events of the Grand Prix as well as obviously the United States’ own event. And in 2002, Michelle Kwan was actually paid by the US Figure Skating Association to participate in that event. And in recent years, we’ve seen that Evan Lysacek was scheduled to compete at Skate America and withdrew due to a financial disagreement with the federation. Did you ever pay athletes to compete at Skate America while you were president? Chuck: Not that I’m aware of. Dave: Okay. Do you think that they should be paid in order ot keep the stars there ad to make sure that our ratings… Chuck: Sure, if there was the money. But in terms of athletes being paid, I knew very little about that at all. I think if you go to the US Figure Skating 990, which is a required report to the Internal Revenue Service, you’ll see – Phil Hersh actually wrote a column about Michelle’s remuneration, so I would refer you to that. And look at their 990 where you have to list the top paid people in the organization. You just have to go to Phil Hersh’s column. He goes through it all. Same with Evan. Dave: Okay. Now one of the major events of your presidency took place when it came time for ABC Sports ot renew its contract with the International Skating Union. At that time, ABC had been paying $22 million a year to the ISU. You were quoted as saying: “I am very disappointed with Ottavio Cinquanta. He wouldn’t cooperate with any request we made. He didn’t talk with ABC at all, and he ended up without a [TV] contract.” What actually happened during those contract negotiations? Chuck: Well, I don’t know what happened to the ISU contract negotiations, but I can tell you when I said that again to Phil Hersh, I was disappointed with Ottavio. We wanted – we had these various competitions that were “made for TV” competitions that were part of our contract with ABC. You know, they didn’t just pay us $12 million a year for nationals. It was a matter of bundling hours of skating to put on TV and there were these five, I believe, “made for TV” skating shows. We wanted to, for the last group that skated, skate six, five, four, three, two, one. So the person that won the short program would be the last one to skate. ABC has data that shows that people clicked off is somebody like Michelle skated sixth instead of last, that they lost them. So this was not the nationals at the time, but it was our attempt to try to play ball with the TV and try to enhance our possibilities for the future contract. The ISU absolutely said that we couldn’t do that. It was a sanctioned event that had to be – you know, interestingly enough, my friends, everything I was thinking about then they have now done. Dave: Yeah, every Grand Prix! Chuck: Yeah – and everywhere, they’ve done that. It was something that was – couldn’t get it done, and it probably was one of the reasons that I left. I saw I just couldn’t have any impact at all. Dave: ESPN eventually signed a contract with the ISU for the $5 million dollars a year, which is a far cry from $22 million. Given the current success of the sport in Asia – Japan and Korea, do you think the ISU has taken a hit financially at all from the heyday of the nineties? You know, they keep their books very secret, so I don’t know how they’re doing. Yes, you’re absolutely correct. The whole sponsorship, I would say, has moved to the far east – Korea, Japan, China. That’s where the money is these days. TV, as you know in the United States and in Canada, it’s almost nonexistent. It’s moved to cable and pretty soon it’s going to be on-demand cable.