The Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Project Labor Series PROFESSOR WALTER GALENSON Interviewed by: Morris Weisz Initial interview date: March 15, 1992 Copyright 1998 ADST TABLE OF CONTENTS Education Columbia University Professor Hunter College$ Harvard University$ University of California, Berkeley$ Cornell University$ Cambridge University (U))$ Goteberg University (S,eden). Thesis .ival Unionism in the United States Author (Impending) The rise and Decline of Labor Labor Attach0 to Nor,ay and Denmark 1345-1347 Author, Books on Nor,ay, France and Denmark and US and International Labor 8ovements 9orld 9ar II 9ar Department OSS : .ussian division .ussian language proficiency Joined the Department of State Appointment$ Labor Attach0 to 8osco, (aborted) Trotskyite allegations Labor Union objections Personalities Tommy Thompson Bohlen Durbro, Harriman 8orris U. Schappes Le,is Feuer John Dunlop Sumner Slickton 1 Daniel Horo,itz James )illen Jerry Bro,n Tsongas Hans Singer Louis Emmerich George 8eany Communist Party American Federation of Teachers 1e, Union Chairman, John De,ey President Sidney Hook 8embers Oslo, Nor,ay Labor Attach0, .egional 1345- Haakon Lie His Books International reputation Israel Language study 9artime travel German military presence Ambassador Lithgo, Osborne Trade unions Communists 8artin Tranmael Labor Party victory (Sept. 1345) Labor reporting Trygve Lie Establishment of Nor,ay steel mill Denmark Social Democratic Party Denmark/1or,ay differences 1or,egian Labor Party International 9orkers of the 9orld (9.9 I.) Socialist International Israel visit Danish Employers Association Embassy colleagues 1or,ay Labor Party Congress, 1345 .ussian ,ould be defectors Conditions in .ussia 2 Comment Union officials as Foreign Service Officers Labor attach0s at Embassies .eporting quality Communism reporting Labor movement and politicking Je,ish Labor 8ovement Je,ish refugees to S,eden International Labor Organization (ILO) Secretariat composition 9orld Development Program 9orld Employment Program AFL-CIO Anti-Anti Israel elements 20th Century Fund The International Labor Organization. An American Aie, David 8orse US ,ithdra,al from U1ESCO INTERVIEW $: Today is Sunday, March 15, 1992, on a nice warm day in Florida and this is Morris Weisz and I am interviewing Professor Walter Galenson of Cornell University in Ithaca, ,ew -or., who has had early e/perience as a labor officer, mostly in Norway, but has been dealing with the whole field of international labor for a long time. Walter, will you please give us a brief summary of your career1 GALE1SO1 I ,as a Labor Attach0 for a very short period. I started in Nor,ay and in Denmark. I covered both countries beginning in June 1345 and I left the BForeignC Service in September 1347. So it ,as a little over a year. ThatDs all. 3 $: 2efore that you had been a professor or a teacher1 GALE1SO1 Before the ,ar I ,as a professor at Hunter College in Ne, Eork. During the ,ar I ,orked in various government agencies and then I ,ent into the BLabor Attach0C program. $: nd you left just after a year4s service as a Labor Attach6 in Norway and covering also Denmar.1 GALE1SO1 Ees. $: -ou then wrote a couple boo.s1 GALE1SO1 I ,rote a book on Nor,ay and a book on Denmark. $: Published by1 I am saying this so students will be able to loo. into your history. GALE1SO1 Published by the Harvard University Press. $: 7arvard University Press in that same series that Horowitz4s was on Italy... GALE1SO1 ...and Lor,inDs on France. $: ...which we remember well. After leaving the service, you began teaching directly at Cornell1 GALE1SO1 No. I taught for five years at Harvard, then I taught for 15 years at Berkeley, and since then I have been at Cornell. Although I am retired no,, for the last 10 years I have been teaching at a Cornell program in Ne, Eork City $: Could you go over the origin of your becoming a Labor Attach61 Please give specific reference to the consideration given to nominating you for the Soviet Union. The reason for this 8uestion is what happened later concerning the difficulties of getting somebody into the Soviet Union1 GALE1SO1 During the ,ar I ,orked for a ,hile in the Pentagon and then I moved over to the OSS and there I ,orked in the .ussian Division of the .esearch Section of the OSS, ,hich, as you kno,, ,as the predecessor of the CIA $: Did you .now Russian before1 GALE1SO1 Ees, I had learned .ussian as part of my graduate program at Columbia University. 9e ,ere required then to kno, t,o foreign languages, so I learned French and .ussian. ThatDs ,hy I ,ent into the .ussian Section, because they ,anted people ,ho kne, some .ussian. There ,erenDt many. 4 $: Did your Russian heritage give you any .nowledge of Russian1 GALE1SO1 No, both my mother and father came from .ussia, but they never spoke .ussian at home. I didnDt kno, a ,ord, but I studied it. Sometime in the beginning of 1344--I donDt remember eFactly$ it ,as so long ago--some ,ay I heard about this ne, program they ,ere starting in the State Department BcalledC the Labor Attach0 Program. Either that or someone told me about it. In any event, I got in touch ,ith... $: 7ad you been teaching labor economics1 GALE1SO1 BeforeG Ees. $: So that your specialty was labor1 GALE1SO1 ThatDs correct. 8y thesis ,as on labor. $: What was your thesis on1 GALE1SO1 It ,as called, .ival Unionism in the United States. $: Oh, I remember that. That4s a different part of my history and yours as well. Just to identify it for the possibility of use by students, it would be located where1 GALE1SO1 Any good library. It ,as published as a book. I heard about this program one ,ay or another. In any event I ,ent over to the State Department. 9hat ,as the name of the chap ,ho ,as running the program thenG $: Otis Mulli.en1 GALE1SO1 Otis 8ulliken. ThatDs the guy. He suggested that I be designated as the Labor Attach0 to the Soviet Union. That appealed to me. The OSS had been sending some people over to 8osco,. There ,as a fello, named Tom 9hitney, for eFample, ,ho ,orked in our division in OSS. He ,ent over there and he stayed on. He married a .ussian ,oman and stayed on and became a pretty ,ell kno,n journalist on the Soviet Union. But the idea of going to .ussia ,as interesting since I kne, .ussian, so I said, HFine.H I ,as appointed the Labor Attach0 to the Soviet Union. This ,as sometime during the spring or middle of 1344, I guess. $: During the war, so we were still on relatively friendly terms with the Soviets1 GALE1SO1 9e ,ere still on friendly terms, right, ,ith BshipsC going through to 8urmansk and they ,ere accepting Americans there one ,ay or another. So I moved over to the State Department. At that time the entire State Department ,as in ,hat is no, 5 the EFecutive Office of the President building on 17th and Connecticut there. That ,as the entire State Department. $: t 17th and Pennsylvania and it is now the OM2 building. GALE1SO1 O8B. IsnDt that in the EFecutive Office of the PresidentG $: Ees, ,ell thatDs part of O8B GALE1SO1 In any event I ,as ushered into a very large room there ,hich at that time contained the entire .ussian division in the State Department. They had practically no .ussian speaking officers. They ,ere all in that one room. Tommy Thompson, Durbro,... $: Did he spea. Russian at that time1 GALE1SO1 He BThompsonC did. Durbro,, Thompson and Bohlen and myself. 9e ,ere sharing that room. They all subsequently became Ambassadors to the Soviet Union. That ,as the entire staff. $: Kennan was in Moscow itself. GALE1SO1 He ,as in 8osco, itself. ThatDs right. That ,as the entire .ussian Division of the State Department, believe it or not. There I sat. I ,orked on the language a bit. I accumulated the stuff I needed. I had a tremendous list you had to take ,ith you. Toilet paper. The big thing ,as the stopper for the tub. All sorts of things like that. So I gathered it all together. There I sat ,aiting for a visa. And I sat there for around siF months. No visa. Nothing. Finally at the beginning of 1345, Harriman came back... He ,as the Ambassador then. He came to the United States and I ,ent to see him and I said, H 8r. Ambassador, ,hatDs ,ith my visa. 9hen am I getting over thereGH He said, HIf I ,ere you, I ,ouldnDt ,ait. Ayshinsky says you are a Trotskyite and I doubt very much ,hether you ,ill ever get a visa.H $: They evidently read your boo. on the split in the American labor movement. GALE1SO1 No, it ,asnDt so much that. There ,ere several things, I think. They had very good information. For eFample, my thesis supervisor at Columbia ,as a member of the De,ey Committee that ,as monitoring the Soviet sho, trials during the 13I0s, Paul Brissenden. But even more than that, I guess, ,hen I ,as teaching in Ne, Eork, I joined the American Federation of Teachers. They had a special local for the college teachers. It ,as a big local. It had about 1,100 members. There ,as only one problem ,ith it. It ,as run lock, stock and barrel by the Communist Party. 8orris U. Schappes ,as the big gun, and Le,is Feuer, ,ho at that time ,as a Communist. I ,ent to some of the meetings and it ,as perfectly clear that the BCommunistC Party ,as running it. First of all they ,ould 6 run BmeetingsC till midnight ,hen everybody ,as gone and they ,ould adopt resolutions tying us up ,ith every left ,ing outfit.