BRITISH-IRISH INTER-PARLIAMENTARY BODY COMHLACHT IDIR-PHARLAIMINTEACH NA BREATAINE AGUS NA hÉIREANN THIRTY-SECOND PLENARY CONFERENCE 24 and 25 April 2006 The Brehon Hotel, Killarney OFFICIAL REPORT (Final Revised Edition) (Produced by the British-Irish Parliamentary Reporting Association) Any queries should be sent to: The Editor The British-Irish Parliamentary Reporting Association Room 248 Parliament Buildings Stormont Belfast BT4 3XX Tel: 028 90521135 e-mail [email protected] IN ATTENDANCE CO-CHAIRMEN Mr Pat Carey TD Rt Hon Paul Murphy MP MEMBERS AND ASSOCIATE MEMBERS Mr John Austin MP Mr Jeff Ennis MP Senator Martin Mansergh Mr Henry Bellingham MP Mr Paul Flynn MP Dr John Marek AM Mr Joe Benton MP Mr Mike German OBE AM Senator Paschal Mooney The Baroness Blood MBE Mr Jim Glennon TD Mr Arthur Morgan TD Mr Johnny Brady TD The Lord Gordon of Strathbane Senator Francie O’Brien Deputy Alan Breckon Mr Dominic Grieve MP Ms Liz O’Donnell TD Rt Hon The Lord Brooke of Mr Robin Harper MSP Mr Jim O’Keeffe TD Sutton Mandeville CH PC Mr John Carty TD The Baroness Harris of Richmond Senator Mary O’Rourke Senator Paul Coghlan Senator Brian Hayes Mr Séamus Pattison TD Mr Paudge Connolly TD Ms Cecilia Keaveney TD Mr Chris Ruane MP Dr Jerry Cowley TD Mr Séamus Kirk TD Senator Brendan Ryan Mr Seymour Crawford TD Ms Julie Kirkbride MP Mr Jim Sheridan MP Mr Jeff Cuthbert AM Dr Dai Lloyd AM Mr Joe Sherlock TD Mr Jim Dobbin MP Mr Eddie McGrady MP The Lord Smith of Clifton The Lord Dubs Rt Hon Andrew Mackay MP Mr Iain Smith MSP Ms Helen Eadie MSP Mrs Rosemary McKenna CBE MP Deputy Mike Torode Mr John Ellis TD Mr Andrew Mackinlay MP Mr Robert Walter MP Mr Damien English TD Mr Michael McMahon MSP ALSO IN ATTENDANCE (FOR ALL OR PART OF PROCEEDINGS) The Minister for Foreign Affairs, Mr Dermot Ahern TD Mr Nigel Dodds MP Mr Peter Robinson MP Mr Jeffrey Donaldson MP Mrs Iris Robinson MP STEERING COMMITTEE Co-Chairmen Mr Pat Carey TD Rt Hon Paul Murphy MP Members Mr Seymour Crawford TD The Lord Dubs Mr Séamus Kirk TD Mr Dai Lloyd AM Rt Hon Michael Mates MP Deputy Mike Torode Mr Murray Tosh MSP OFFICIALS Joint Clerks Ms Alda Barry, British Clerk Mr Eoin Faherty, Irish Clerk Irish Policy Advisor Ms Dearbhla Doyle Delegation Clerks Mr Ian Perry (Scotland) Mr Peter Kellam (Wales) Ms Tara Wharton (Ireland) Committee Clerks to the Body Committee A: Sovereign Matters Ms Dearbhla Doyle Ms Nerys Welfoot Committee B: European Affairs Mr Mike Clark Ms Elaine Hollowed Committee C: Economic Ms Dearbhla Doyle Mr Mike Hennessy Committee D: Environmental and Social Ms Audrey Nelson Ms Elaine Hollowed Secretariat Mrs Veronica Carr Sir Michael Davies KCB Mrs Amanda Healy Media Adviser Mr Mike Burns Support Staff David Mulligan Garret Barry British-Irish Parliamentary Ms Adele Dodd Reporting Association reporting team Ms Janet Foster for 32nd Plenary Meeting Ms Hilary Headley Mr Mike Lowes Mr Paul O’Brien Mr Shon Williams BRITISH-IRISH Ireland. It is fair to say that all political parties are contributing to positive and creative debate on the INTER-PARLIAMENTARY future governance of Northern Ireland. The state- BODY ments on 6 April by Prime Minister Blair and Taoiseach Bertie Ahern have set a context for debate over the coming months. The recall of the Assembly on 15 May and the deadline of 24 November will, I have no doubt, concentrate minds COMHLACHT enormously. There have been discussions about IDIR-PHARLAIMINTEACH NA the reform of public administration, the education system, policing and parades. Those issues have BREATAINE AGUS NA been part of the debate, and they will inform the hÉIREANN Body’s discussions this morning. It is important that the Democratic Unionist Party THIRTY-SECOND (DUP) has accepted the BIIPB’s invitation to make PLENARY CONFERENCE a presentation this afternoon. As Members know, the Body took a decision, on which the Steering Com- mittee acted, to invite the DUP to make a present- ation. I am pleased that the DUP representatives will be here later this afternoon to make their presentation Monday 24 April 2006 and that we will hear their point of view. The DUP’s presentation will be followed by a TheBodymetat9.35am. question-and-answer session. There will be input from the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Mr Dermot Ahern TD, and he will have an opportunity to answer questions already submitted by the Body. PLENARY BUSINESS That is the context in which we meet. The Co-Chairman (Mr Pat Carey TD): The Body Today is an important step forward for the Body, is now in public session. You are all welcome. There and I have no doubt that I speak for all Members is one small housekeeping matter to address before when I say that I look forward to the day when all I begin: will all Members please switch off their political parties associated with the Body will find mobile telephones? I know that we are all practical it possible to take up their places around these politicians and we cannot live easily without them, tables. When that happens, parliamentarians who but the telephones interfere with the recording are best placed to discuss the issues of practical system. I would appreciate your help in that regard. significance and importance to the people that they represent will be able to articulate them in a Since we met in Edinburgh, significant develop- vigorous and robust way. ments have taken place that have been important to the Body. In Edinburgh, the Body received an The Co-Chairman (Rt Hon Paul Murphy MP): economic analysis from Stephen Kingon, and others, Thank you, Pat. On behalf of those of us who are on Northern Ireland, and that analysis has proved to not Irish delegates, may I say how pleased we are be an important kick-start to debate about Northern to be in such a magnificent hotel. The hospitality Ireland. Members will be aware that the Body focused and warmth that we have received so far have been on social and economic deprivation and that that issue exceptional; I would not expect any less, but it has was discussed in some detail by its Committees. been the case. Co-Chairman, we are grateful to you Today and tomorrow, the Body will be told the out- and your colleagues for your efforts in that regard. comes of some of those examinations. Among the issues discussed by the Body were the implications I do not have much to add to what Pat has said, of EU policy on the small farm sector. because he has covered the ground extremely well. However, the presence of the DUP represent- There have also been significant developments atives and their presentation this afternoon is sig- on the political side. IRA decommissioning — and all nificant; it is a great opportunity for the Body to that has flowed from it — has placed political debate engage in dialogue with them. I am also glad that on a new plane. The publication of the Independent Dermot Ahern is attending later, and I hope that he Monitoring Commission (IMC) reports has proved to gives us an insight into where we are with regard be of some reassurance to political parties in Northern to the process. 1 Monday 24 April 2006 The Bill being passed through Parliament this TRIBUTES TO MARGARET EWING MSP, week to enable the restoration of the Assembly is very MO MOWLAM MP AND important. The absence of devolved government in LORD MERLYN-REES Northern Ireland and the presence there of direct rule for some years — indeed, I was a direct rule The Co-Chairman (Rt Hon Paul Murphy MP): Minister for five years — have been hugely difficult. We will move on to the next item. Members, I know, Without power sharing, the Good Friday Agreement, were saddened to hear of the recent death of or any agreement that tries to bring together people Margaret Ewing MSP, and I propose that the Co- in Northern Ireland, is deeply flawed. It is not just Chairman, Paul Murphy, and Iain Smith MSP, pay a matter of people from Northern Ireland governing tribute to Margaret. themselves — that must be the case in a post- devolution United Kingdom — but it is crazy that The Co-Chairman (Rt Hon Paul Murphy MP): there is a National Assembly for Wales and a It was terribly sad to hear of Margaret’s recent Scottish Parliament but the Assembly in Northern death; like many of my colleagues I served in Ireland does not operate. Parliament with her for several years. She was a The continuance of direct rule would be disastrous doughty Scotswoman who stood up for social justice for the Good Friday Agreement or for any other and for her country. My own memory of her is agreement that is put forward to try to solve the from the last time I saw her when the Body met in problems of Northern Ireland. All parties, irrespective Edinburgh. We sat at the same table and discussed of whether they support the agreement, under- all manner of things. She was very vigorous and stood the significance of power sharing and the need did not in any way seem unwell, although obviously for devolution. Therefore the opportunity given to she was. Her death leaves a great gap in Scottish the Governments and the parties in Northern Ireland — and, for that matter, British and Irish — politics. makes the time from now until 24 November one On behalf of the Body, I send her family, friends and of the most important periods in the history of the constituents our condolences and most sincere process — although everybody hopes that a sympathy.