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Vol. 739 Tuesday No. 40 24 July 2012 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) HOUSE OF LORDS OFFICIAL REPORT ORDER OF BUSINESS Questions Nigeria Chilcot Committee: Intercept Evidence Finance: Loan Guarantee Scheme Public and Commercial Services Union: Strike Action Arms Trade Treaty Negotiations Private Notice Question Procedure of the House Motion to Agree Five Statutory Instruments Motions to Refer to Grand Committee Three Statutory Instruments Motions to Approve House of Lords (Cessation of Membership) Bill [HL] Third Reading Groceries Code Adjudicator Bill [HL] Third Reading Electoral Registration and Administration Bill Second Reading Grand Committee Local Government Finance Bill Committee (6th Day) Written Answers For column numbers see back page £3·50 Lords wishing to be supplied with these Daily Reports should give notice to this effect to the Printed Paper Office. The bound volumes also will be sent to those Peers who similarly notify their wish to receive them. 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Standing orders will be accepted. THE INDEX to each Bound Volume of House of Commons Debates is published separately at £9·00 and can be supplied to standing order. All prices are inclusive of postage. © Parliamentary Copyright House of Lords 2012, this publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Parliamentary Click-Use Licence, available online through The National Archives website at www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/information-management/our-services/parliamentary-licence-information.htm Enquiries to The National Archives, Kew, Richmond, Surrey, TW9 4DU; email: [email protected] 593 Nigeria[24 JULY 2012] Nigeria 594 Baroness Anelay of St Johns: My Lords, we are at House of Lords the beginning of Questions. Perhaps we may hear from the Opposition first. The noble Lord, Lord Chidgey, Tuesday, 24 July 2012. will then be next. 2.30 pm Lord Anderson of Swansea: The Minister will be well aware that Boko Haram is only part of an Islamist Prayers—read by the Lord Bishop of Bristol. tide sweeping across the Sahel. In northern Nigeria, a particular problem is the atrocities against the Lord Collins of Mapesbury took the oath. Christian community—the attempt, in effect, to cleanse northern Nigeria of Christians. What specifically are Nigeria the Government doing to assist Nigeria, possibly in Question co-operation with our French colleagues because of the general nature of the problem, and to what extent 2.37 pm do we fear for the unity of Nigeria? Asked by Baroness Cox Lord Howell of Guildford: The noble Lord is right that this is part of a larger series of trends and developments, To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment some of them of a very ominous and dangerous kind they have made of the recent escalation of violence —not least the instability in Mali and the attacks on in Nigeria. Timbuktu that have been very much in the news. All those events reflect and connect with the activities of The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Boko Haram, to which the noble Lord referred. We Office (Lord Howell of Guildford): My Lords, the are working with the Nigerians at all times to see how Islamist extremist movement known as Boko Haram we can help them increase security. At the same time has claimed responsibility for many attacks in Nigeria. we are working with the French and other EU partners Ongoing intercommunal tensions have also led to to address the whole issue of the Sahel, where all these conflict, which has recently been exacerbated by attacks dangers are arising. The noble Lord is absolutely right on places of worship such as the one in Kaduna state to call attention to them. on 17 June. The British Government utterly condemn such violence and work with the Nigerian Government Lord Chidgey: If I may, I will take that point a little and international partners to ensure the location of a further, although my noble friend has just offered us comprehensive strategy to tackle security threats. an answer. What assessment have our Government made of the links between Boko Haram, AQIM in Baroness Cox: I thank the Minister for his helpful Mali and al-Shabaab in Somalia in their logistical, reply. Is he aware that I recently returned from Kano, ideological and political operations? Bauchi and Plateau states, where Christians are living in siege-like conditions, especially on Sundays, when Lord Howell of Guildford: We keep a very close eye many have been attacked and killed during church on this in making assessments, as do our French services; where it is becoming increasingly difficult for colleagues—as I just mentioned to the noble Lord, Christian leaders to sustain their commendable efforts Lord Anderson—our United States colleagues and to prevent retaliation, with the risk of escalating others. The precise linkages are fluid and not always intercommunal conflict, as happened in Kaduna, to easy to identify, but there is no doubt that, where there which the noble Lord referred; and where there are has been potential instability and turmoil, al-Qaeda, concerns over the possible destabilisation of Nigeria or branches and franchises of al-Qaeda, tend to turn itself? Will Her Majesty’s Government raise with the up like flies around any corpses. This is always the Nigerian Government the concerns of the Christian danger and we should watch it very closely. As for communities, including the frequent failure of the al-Shabaab, we cannot see a visible connection at the authorities to prosecute and punish the perpetrators moment, but it too might be involved, although it is of violence against them? quite a long way away. The Lord Bishop of Durham: My Lords, I have Lord Howell of Guildford: I am aware of the noble made nearly 70 trips over the past 30 years to Nigeria, Baroness’s recent visits and I was very grateful for the many of which in the past few years have dealt with very informative report that she shared with Foreign conflict management. Do the Government also remain and Commonwealth Office officials on the situation. committed to working with private and civil society The British Government are appalled as well as deeply organisations, particularly the churches and religious and continuously concerned by what has gone on and leaders—I am thinking of organisations such as the by the situation that she described. I can only say that one run by the bishop of Kaduna, Bridge Builders—which we are fully engaged with the Nigerian Government in many ways have been especially effective in dealing on these issues and on the essential need to protect with an issue that has religious elements? minorities more effectively and to bring the perpetrators of violence to justice. Lord Howell of Guildford: The answer to the right reverend Prelate is indeed yes. To reinforce the point, Lord Chidgey: My Lords— although there are different religious groups in Nigeria we have always seen it as a state of tolerance rather Lord Anderson of Swansea: My Lords— than religious intolerance. That is not the main cause 595 Nigeria[LORDS] Chilcot Committee: Intercept Evidence 596 [LORD HOWELL OF GUILDFORD] Chilcot Committee: Intercept Evidence of the violence and horrors that we have seen recently, Question which arise much more from the provocations and extreme violence of organisations that have intruded 2.45 pm and invaded, such as Boko Haram. Asked by Lord Lloyd of Berwick Lord Clarke of Hampstead: My Lords, I am sure To ask Her Majesty’s Government when they that the whole House appreciates the efforts made by expect the Chilcot committee to report on the Her Majesty’s Government so far in trying to resolve admissibility of intercept evidence. some of these problems. Are the Government aware of the reports of the well-armed mercenaries who are The Minister of State, Home Office (Lord Henley): operating in the attacks on Christian churches? If they My Lords, the Government are conducting an extensive are, are they doing anything to find out the source of assessment of the benefits, costs and risks of introducing the supply of the sophisticated weaponry that is being intercept as evidence in criminal proceedings. Lawful used against Christians? interception is a vital but complex area, and so it is crucial to get it right. The cross-party advisory group Lord Howell of Guildford: We are aware of reports. overseeing this work will be further consulted. We always seek more information. These are very important matters in which we take a very close interest. Lord Lloyd of Berwick: My Lords, it is now four We take a particular interest in the arms trade issue, and a half years since the committee was asked by the which we will discuss later on this afternoon in this then Government to find a way of making intercept House.