THE BIG INTERVIEW: MELISSA ETHERIDGE Episode Number: 05 Episode Title: Melissa Etheridge Description: We sit down with legendary singer Melissa Etheridge whose intimate lyrics and signature voice have made her a rock and roll icon. In a candid conversation Etheridge discusses her music, gay rights, cancer and even the little bit of hot water she got into recently over comments about Angelina Jolie.
ACT 1
DAN RATHER (VOICE OVER)
TONIGHT ON THE BIG INTERVIEW… LEGENDARY SINGER/SONGWRITER AND ROCK STAR, MELISSA ETHERIDGE
RATHER
If we could only talk about one thing today, what would that be?
MELISSA ETHERIDGE
I mean I could say music, I could say where gay rights has - has come, we could talk about cancer, believe me, I’ll talk about anything with you.
ETHERIDGE (singing)
Come to my window
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
HER INTIMATE LYRICS AND SIGNATURE VOICE HAVE MADE HER AN ICON IN ROCK AND ROLL HISTORY
ETHERIDGE (singing)
Come to my window and I’ll be home soon. Yeah, I’m comin’ home.
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
TONIGHT -- ON THE BIG INTERVIEW
ACT 2
MELISSA ETHERIDGE (singing)
Oh is it other arms you want to hold you, the stranger...
DAN RATHER (VOICE OVER)
FOR MORE THAN THIRTY YEARS, MELISSA ETHERIDGE'S SOULFUL PERFORMANCES HAVE BEEN CELEBRATED BY CRITICS AND FANS ALIKE…
ETHERIDGE (singing)
Come to my window...
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
HER SONG “COME TO MY WINDOW” WON HER A GRAMMY AWARD IN 1995 - IT WAS HER SECOND… AND SHE’S BEEN NOMINATED 15 TIMES.
ANNOUNCER AT 2007 OSCARS
Please welcome Melissa Etheridge singing her Academy Award nominated song, “I Need to Wake Up” from An Inconvenient Truth
ETHERIDGE (singing)
I’ve been asleep, and I need to wake up now…
JOHN TRAVOLTA
And the Oscar goes to Melissa Etheridge for “I Need to Wake Up” from “An Inconvenient Truth”
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
THE SONG, WRITTEN FOR THE POPULAR FILM ABOUT AL GORE’S CRUSADE AGAINST GLOBAL WARMING, MARKED THE FIRST TIME A DOCUMENTARY HAD WON IN THIS CATEGORY.
ETHERIDGE
Let my life have been an inspiration to anyone - gay, straight, breast cancer, woman, mother...
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
FOR DECADES, MELISSA ETHERIDGE HAS USED HER HIGH PROFILE TO RAISE AWARENESS FOR ISSUES SHE CARES ABOUT. SHE IS A PASSIONATE GAY RIGHTS ADVOCATE AND WAS ONE OF THE FIRST CELEBRITIES TO OFFER THE PUBLIC A GLIMPSE OF WHAT A COMMITTED GAY RELATIONSHIP MIGHT LOOK LIKE…
ETHERIDGE (singing)
Thinly veiled intolerance Bigotry and hate But they tortured you and burned you They beat you and they tied you...
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
IN 1999, SHE RELEASED A SONG CALLED “SCARECROW” TO PAY TRIBUTE TO MATTHEW SHEPARD, THE GAY TEENAGER FROM WYOMING WHO WAS BRUTALLY MURDERED IN WHAT MANY SAID WAS A HATE CRIME…
AND SHE TACKLED THE SUBJECT OF GAY MOTHERHOOD ON THE COVER OF ROLLING STONE MAGAZINE BACK IN 2000...FAMOUSLY ANNOUNCING THAT HER FIRST TWO CHILDREN’S BIOLOGICAL FATHER WAS NONE OTHER THAN ROCK STAR DAVID CROSBY.
SHE IS ALSO A BREAST CANCER SURVIVOR... SHE WROTE THE SONG “I RUN FOR LIFE” FROM HER OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCES WITH THE DISEASE IN AN EFFORT TO RAISE FUNDS AND AWARENESS.
ETHERIDGE
Wanna go in my back yard?
RATHER
Sure.
ETHERIDGE
Come on. There’s lemon and lime over there and oranges…
RATHER
Well, it’s a lovely place.
ETHERIDGE
...tangerines...
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
I RECENTLY VISITED MELISSA ETHERIDGE AT HER SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA HOME WHERE WE SAT DOWN TO TALK ABOUT HER LIFE AND HER MUSIC.
RATHER
Well, Melissa Etheridge, thank you very much for doing this--
ETHERIDGE
My plea--
RATHER
--and thank you for welcoming us into your home.
ETHERIDGE
My pleasure.
RATHER
I have a lot of questions I wanna ask you. But if we could only talk about one thing today, what would that be?
ETHERIDGE
If we could only talk about one thing. There are so many facets of this journey that I've been on in my life that-- I mean, I could say music, I could say-- where gays rights has-- has come, we could talk about cancer, we could-- I-- believe me I'll talk about anything with you. (LAUGHTER)
RATHER
Well, journalism is all about storytelling. You're a great storyteller in your music.
ETHERIDGE
Thank you.
RATHER
So tell me the Melissa Etheridge story.
ETHERIDGE
Lord. Born in the Midwest. I think that's-- it's a big part of who I am 'cause I was born in Kansas, Leavenworth, Kansas. My father was a high school teacher and basketball coach. My mother worked for the Army actually. She was a civil servant. She started out kind of a secretary then they found out that she was really good with these new things called computers, so she became a computer programmer. (LAUGH)
So she's very intelligent and I got a-- kind of had a sporty dad and a really smart mom. And I grew up in the '60s and '70s in the Midwest with all the things that happened. I grew up with music, I loved it. RATHER
Well, I want to go back to the time when you first got enthralled by music. You were what, seven, eight? Or was it even earlier?
ETHERIDGE
I tell people the first really clear memory I have-- of my childhood even is I'm about-- between two or three years old and I'm-- probably in a diaper or just a pair of pants, I don't know. But I'm standing in the driveway and I have a transistor radio. And this sound is comin’ out of it and it sounds like angels. And they're singing, "I want to hold your hand," right? And it's like nothing I'd ever experienced in my whole two or three years of life. And it was from there that-- that I was just fascinated with music. My parents were music listeners. They-- they weren't really-- musical, but they had a great record collection, my older sister did. So I got a lot of that and then went out there on my own.
RATHER
And your first instrument was?
ETHERIDGE
Well, my first instrument was a guitar. Yeah, my father had brought it home for my sister, who was four years older than me, and-- I said, "I want to play it. I want to--" 'cause I'd been wearing out the badminton racquets, you know, jumping' around pretending and-- he went and he asked the guitar teacher, "No, it'll-- her fingers will bleed and it-- she can't--" and I said-- I bugged them until they let me. And indeed my fingers bled but I was bound and determined and I just-- so I started playing when I was eight years old, guitar.
RATHER
And then what happened?
ETHERIDGE
I taught myself how to play the piano, I picked up drums, I started-- writing songs, -- and- - I started writing in a very simple, like, folk-- this is early '70s, you know, folk songs.
So there was a talent contest and myself and my friends entered it and they sang-- it was like three of us. We sang one of my original songs. And we-- we didn't win, but we got a little trophy that I still have. It's next to my Oscar in there, so (LAUGH)
And-- We used to play at the prisons, you know, Leavenworth. We'd play at prisons and the old folks homes. Found-- a musician in that show that had a band called the -- Chuck Hammersmith and the Wranglers, and I started singing' country music in bars, you know, -- I loved it. It was a life that I loved. And I've done everything you can do.
RATHER
So you finish high school and you went off to college.
ETHERIDGE
My parents were very much about college. They really wanted me to go to college. I said, "Well, it's gotta be a music college." So we went around and we ended up -- at Berklee College of Music in Boston. It didn't last long.
RATHER
And why didn't it last long?
ETHERIDGE
Because I was ready to take on the world. I was-- I was sitting in the classrooms and I was learning about music and-- I wanted to do it, I wanted to play it. And so I went down the street, down Boylston, and-- went into a restaurant that-- that had, like, a piano in the corner.
And I said, "Can I-- you know, can I play here?" And they said, "Well, we got a guy playing' from 9:00 to 1:00 but you want to--" I auditioned. And I had the -- I got the cocktail hour from-- from 5:00 to 9:00 I got to play. And eventually I got the 9:00 to 1:00 slot. And I just started-- I was working, I was making money, and -- I wasn't interested in studying, so I dropped out.
RATHER
But then you got -- the urge to move West.
ETHERIDGE
Yeah. this is-- this is late-'70s. This is '79, '80. The East Coast was filled with a sort of rageful, dirty punk rock n' roll that I didn't relate to. I was an acoustic guitar player who listened to Bruce Springsteen, The Eagles, Jackson Brown, Fleetwood Mac and I said, "They're all in California. I need to go to California. I need to go to Los Angeles."
RATHER
You were at what age now?
ETHERIDGE
I'm 21 in 1982. And I-- set out in my car, I drive across America, which is-- everyone should drive across America someday, it's a beautiful country. Got here, I had an aunt who lived here. She let me sleep on her couch. And I started-- I thought, "Look, it worked for me in Boston. I'm gonna find a restaurant or something' that I can just play some music in."
RATHER
Now play some music. You're playing some of your music or but you're playing mostly country music, or?
ETHERIDGE
At this point I had worked up quite a repertoire of-- you know, piano lounge-- piano and guitar music. It was a combination--
RATHER
Well, you started the cocktail hour after all
ETHERIDGE
Yes, and so (LAUGH) I know my Barry Manilow medley, yes I do. And-- I didn't start playing original songs until I finally got a job here in L.A. Now it took awhile because lots of people had the same idea that I did (LAUGH) of comin’ here to Los Angeles and making it big and becoming a star. And so just when I was down to my last dollar I went- - on a date actually down in Long Beach and went to a girls' bar down there, and there was a piano in the corner. And I'm always looking for that.
And I said, "Well, do you have music?" They said, "Well, no we don't. We just--" actually it used to be a steakhouse and the piano came with the steakhouse.” And I said, "Well, can I audition and-- and set up?" And I came in and played and they said, "Hey, why don't you play cocktail hour," again right before the disco this time. And so I-- I sort of created my own space -- in Long Beach and ended up playing there for five years. And I was able to then take my original music and start playing it for people. And this is--- it's a thing that-- that I really see a lot of new artists now don't have the opportunity.
They-- they get their computers and they make-- a record and they've never sang for anyone, (LAUGH) in front of anyone. I had years of not only playing in bars but playing solo in front of five, ten people. And I got to try things out and go, "Well, that works, that doesn't work." And I learned how to be an entertainer, how to be a performer. I'm so grateful for these years that I spent really honing my craft.
RATHER
And how do you be an entertainer?
ETHERIDGE
(SIGH) Entertainment -- I think an entertainer is—has a duty to their audience to make sure that their audience is having an experience of joy, -- or just an emotional experience. I've never thought that-- that I was separate from them. What I do I do to engage them energetically.
RATHER
Connect.
ETHERIDGE
Yes.
RATHER
But in order to do that, you have to give a lot of yourself. Yours is a very personal music. You put it out there; you put it on the line. It's one of the attractions, one of the things that's made you. But let's talk about the risks with that and the rewards of that.
ETHERIDGE
I learned when I was playing in the bars, I would write a song that I would think, "Oh, people are gonna love this song. It sounds like what's on the radio, it's catchy, it's fun." And I'd go in and play and no one would pay attention to it.
But then I would go write a song about something that happened to me and I would write it for the-- just the cathartic purpose of getting it out and of feeling it. And I remember one of the first songs I wrote way back then was a song that's on my first album called Like the Way I Do. It was-- I was-- done wrong and I was-- I was gonna rise up above and it was that feeling.
And I write this song and that is the first song that someone came up to me one day at the bar and said, "Will you play that song that you wrote of yours?” The songs that people responded to, they were always the songs that were deeply personal (LAUGH) to me.
And I thought, "That must be the key. If I can make my songs resonate with emotion and truthfulness." I think that creates a performance or a song that then resonates with someone else.
RATHER
They can identify with it.
ETHERIDGE
Yes.
RATHER
Maybe mostly because it's authentic.
ETHERIDGE
It's-- it's a part of art that is hard to explain to people, but I think it's important.
RATHER
You mentioned, you said you never were a drinker.
ETHERIDGE
No.
RATHER
Were you into drugs at any point?
ETHERIDGE You know, there's a Midwestern attitude of, "You know, you play fair, you-- you do right and that's how you get far." You know, you work hard and--
RATHER
Keep your nose clean.
ETHERIDGE
Yeah, keep your nose clean and-- and life gives you what you need. And so I always came with that. And-- and I started playing in bars when I, you know, was 11 and 12 years old with my father. He'd come with me. And I saw what alcohol did. And it made grownups ridiculous. And it held no mystery for me whatsoever.
RATHER
But when you get into music--
ETHERIDGE
Indeed.
RATHER
--rock n' roll music-- which is in part fairly un-- fairly identified with not only drug use but hard drug use--
ETHERIDGE
It was always around me. -- it was available. I certainly, you know, dabbled in this and that. I found that cocaine was-- I had no-- interest in, you know, chewing my face off. -- it just wasn't-- it didn't-- it was never as much of a high as playing and singing and getting that-- that natural reaction from someone.
ETHERIDGE (singing)
Baby tell me does she love you like the way I love you? Does she stimulate you attract and captivate you? Tell me does she miss you existing just to kiss you Like the way I do?
ACT 3
MELISSA ETHERIDGE (singing)
For tonight while I’m making excuses Some woman is making love to you Somebody bring me some water Can’t you see I’m burnin’ alive?
DAN RATHER
I wanna go back now, you're still in Leavenworth, Kansas and you're beginning to play. But it's my understanding when you played in a band it was always a boy band.
ETHERIDGE
Oh, yeah.
RATHER
You were the only female in it. (LAUGH) Well, tell me about that.
ETHERIDGE
That's sort of always been my thing. And I didn't ever think about it that way. I didn't ever think, "Oh, I'm the only girl." It didn't really come into my-- you know, my sphere until actually put my first record out. And the-- the radio stations said, "Oh, w-- we can't play a woman. We're already playing a woman. (LAUGH) We already have one woman in our playlist and--" "Have-- you have a rule there's only one woman?"
And I didn't realize until then that-- that rock n ‘roll was kind of-- a man's thing. I mean-- oh, I grew up and I-- I listened to Janis Joplin, I listened to Linda Ronstadt, you know, Heart was out. There's not a lot of us but it was available. It was-- it was something I could do. And I never ever thought, "Oh, I'm a woman, I can't do that."
RATHER
But did you ever think-- gosh, maybe I should dress like the successful women do in rock n' roll." Get a bustier or get a teddy or (LAUGH) appear that way. Did that go through your mind? Did you say to yourself, "Well, maybe I'll have to do that. Maybe I better do that." And were you conflicted by that?
ETHERIDGE
Well, there was a lot of feelings goin’ into this. Entering into the '80s where I'm like, "Okay, I'm gonna be-- a rock star. What am I gonna wear" was a big question. Now this is the '80s where we're wearing the most ridiculous things anyway.
RATHER
Ridiculous things-- being short skirts and--
ETHERIDGE
Well, I was -- still am a lesbian, and-- I was sort of anti all of that. -- When I got the job down in Long Beach I fell in with a very eclectic lesbian women's political group. And it was this very exciting time. So I was very much anti-- the role of women and what we're supposed to wear. I was (WHISTLES) all the way the other side. So-- and those years playing in the bars, oh, I just wore jeans and t-shirts and mullets, you know. (LAUGH) That was what I was wearing. So when I did first get signed, I was so grateful and so lucky to have Chris Blackwell of Island Records who-- he's the guy who signed me. He owned Island Records, music mogul, signed Bob Marley, U2. And he looked at me and he wanted the girl that he saw in the bar.
RATHER
Wearing the jeans and t-shirt.
ETHERIDGE
Wearing the jeans and t-shirt. He did not want anything else. So that-- a lot has to do with him and my manager. They didn't ever, ever, ever, ever try to tell me what to wear or how to do it. They-- and that's pretty great for guys back in the '80s who were tryin' to make money on this.
RATHER
I'd say. Well, going back to your childhood, you mentioned before that you were raised in what you described as-- a typical maybe-- quintessential Midwestern view. Was yours a church-going family? Did you go to church a lot as a child?
ETHERIDGE
It's funny 'cause my father came from just abject poverty. He came from-- he was-- a migrant farmer family. He didn't have a church background. My mother grew up with-- in a family where it's very-- a Methodist church. So like a lot of I think people they had kids, they went, "We gotta take 'em to church." That's just what you do or else or else, you know. And in that church I became very involved with the choir, with the youth stuff, the Sunday school, -- I remember taking my guitar and playing. So I got very involved in the church. I was involved in churches until I graduated high school. I did some of my best stuff in church. I would go play-- on a Saturday night I would go play the Knights of Columbus, the Parents Without Partners dance on a Saturday night and then I'd get up Sunday morning and I'd go to church and (LAUGH) sing.
RATHER
And when did you drift away from church, or did you?
ETHERIDGE
When I graduated and I went to college I did not look for a church because at that point I'm 18, I'm well aware that I'm-- a lesbian. I'm a gay person and at that time it did not mix with religion. We were told that God didn't like us.
RATHER
You said you were 18 and by that time you were well aware that you were a lesbian. When did you become aware? Do you remember when you first became aware?
ETHERIDGE
It's a funny journey. I imagine nowadays kids can kinda be more aware of it because it-- it exists in our-- we talk about it. When I grew up, I remember in junior high someone saying, "Oh, she's a lesy," and I'm, "What's that?" I had no idea. And it was a bad word.
So when I finally realized when I'm about 15 that all my friends are, "Oh, Joe, Bobby, Mike," you know, and I'm "Jodie." You know, I'm like, "Wait a minute, what am I doing," that it's a scary thing. It was scary for my generation. The first time I kissed a girl I was 17 and that's when it was like, "Oh," it was a huge difference.
RATHER
Well, that would strike a lot of people as late on. A boy talkin' about kissing a girl, if he hadn't kissed a girl by the time he was 17 that would be considered fairly late.
ETHERIDGE
Well, I spent a lot of time kissin' boys tryin' to make it work (LAUGH) from 15, 16, but.
RATHER
Did you try to hide it then?
ETHERIDGE
Well, it's funny, you don't try to hide it, it's hidden because it doesn't exist. And so you know what you're doing is wrong and everyone's gonna be freaked out by you.
RATHER
Because we're in the 1970s and '80s--
ETHERIDGE
In 1978, yeah. Yet, before I left for Boston I sat down with my father-- 'cause I was very close with my dad, and I said, "Dad, I gotta tell you something'." I took the longest time of saying, "Dad, I'm-- I really-- I don't know how to tell you." And he's just lookin' at me and lookin' at me, and I said, "Well, I--" and I thought, "What word am I gonna use? I guess I'll use, 'I'm a homosexual.'" And he goes, "Yeah, is that it?" And (LAUGH) I said, "Yeah, that's it--"
RATHER
This is the coach. This is--
ETHERIDGE
Yeah, this is coach.
RATHER
--the coach.
ETHERIDGE
This is Coach Etheridge. This is coach-- he's like, "Well, I don't understand it, but as long as you're happy." So right outta the gate I have that support from my family. I know that no matter whatever happens to me in the world, my dad's like, "Well, as long as you're happy, okay." Which makes all the difference in the world. Those-- those that- - that don't have that family-- support, it's really hard for them to come out.
RATHER
Was there a time where you thought it would be a hindrance perhaps-- even-- a barrier to you doing what you dreamed of doing in music?
ETHERIDGE
Huh. I realized that it certainly wasn't gonna help me. (LAUGH) I also always believed in the work. In my-- in my talent. And I knew when I sang for people they-- they responded. And I also knew that I had work-- I'd been workin' five nights a week in a lesbian bar. So every r-- record company that would come, I just had to-- you-- I just had to believe, if they're not gonna sign me because I'm gay, then they don't get it. Then they're-- they would never support me anyway.
RATHER
But then you-- you came out to use the phrase the night of the Bill Clinton inauguration as president. Was that a big decision for you at the time? Did you think a lot about it beforehand? About how-- how you were going to do it, where you were gonna do it? Or did you just say, "Listen, tonight's the night I'm gonna do it."
ETHERIDGE
I did not know I was gonna do it that night. It had been a journey. We had three albums out. I was a known artist. And I had a -- underground lesbian following because that word went around, "She used to play the bars in Cal--" "Oh, yeah, she's gay." So it-- that spread fast.
When I finally decided I have to come out it -- it was comin’ on because I was starting to do interviews. People were becoming interested in me. They wanted to know the personal things behind my music. I would always answer in a very gender unspecific way, you know, "they," oh, "my lover, my partner," whatever I would say I would use these words--
RATHER
Must've been constantly walking on egg shells--
ETHERIDGE
Constantly. Constantly. Because there was one article I did where the guy changed all of my pronouns into boyfriend. And it-- I thought, "Oh, my God, people are gonna think I'm lying now. This is-- this is so not okay." So I said, "I'm gonna come out." I always thought-- I kinda thought, "I'm gonna come out on The Arsenio Hall Show." (LAUGH)
I thought he had been-- I had done a couple of interviews with him, he was nice, I thought, "There you go. I'm just gonna tell him next time I'm gonna go I'm sayin', 'I wanna come out on your show.'" It never got there because I became politically active right before then. The LGBT community of course going through the AIDS crisis had just completely come together.
RATHER
The AIDS crisis had really come to point during the 1980s, so by the time you got to the 1992 election-- it's big and the community--
ETHERIDGE
That community is huge. It's the first time that the gay community really got behind a candidate. Clinton was the first one who would even say the words gay and lesbian. It was astounding just to hear him say that. So that's-- I helped out -- the three organizations that had helped get Clinton and Gore elected. And so they had their own inaugural ball for the first time. We had the Triangle Ball. It was the best party, too. It was awesome. And I was there with my friends. We were celebrating, "Yes, we helped elect this president." And of course they said, "Melissa, here's the microphone." I said, "Well, I'm proud to-- to have been a lesbian all my life." And there it was, boom. And it sorta went out the next day. It was just a little thing in the paper. Oh, and Melissa Etheridge came out also at the inauguration. And it just started there.
RATHER
You're telling me that the gay and lesbian community had come together to support a president and in a close presidential election was part of what made a difference.
ETHERIDGE
Yes. And it was-- you could feel it. You could feel all the work. We were losing our brothers all around us. Gay men were dropping' like flies, and it was horrific.
RATHER
Because of the AIDS--
ETHERIDGE
The AIDS crisis. And so we found this new political reason to come together. We never had a reason before. We were just those weird partying sexual people before. (LAUGH) And we found a community. And it was very empowering. And when we found that we could make a difference in our American government, in politics, it was-- it was enlightening.
RATHER
Fair or unfair to say that was the breakthrough moment?
ETHERIDGE
Yes. Very much so.
RATHER
Well, looking back, I mean, you've now become a legend. (LAUGH) Melissa Etheridge, legend, it's almost as if it's one name. It must feel wonderful.
ETHERIDGE
Legend-- legendary's a funny thing because it's a story. And it's a story that just happens one step at a time. You don't plan on it. You hope you can do what you love. And what I loved to do was to sing and write songs and play music and entertain people, I love doing' that. And along the way I found out that I had to tell the truth. I had to just tell the truth. And as long as I told the truth I didn't have anything to hide or worry about. And this truth telling became legendary.
ETHERIDGE (singing)
I want to come over To hell with the consequence You told me loved me That’s all I believe I want to come over
ACT 4
MELISSA ETHERIDGE, Live… and Alone, 2002
“Oh what a pleasure to be here. Welcome, welcome to my Live… and Alone. That means if you hear any mistakes tonight, it’s me. That’s it. ”
DAN RATHER
We all know that-- that fame, it can bring sometimes crushing expectations. Didn't happen with you, why not?
MELISSA ETHERIDGE
Expectations are just planned disappointments. I have tried and succeeded mostly in my life to stay in the moment. To reach for what I wanted and to go for that, yet I certainly learned along the way that celebrity or success of fame or whatever you wanna call it, is-- is-- a graph that just goes up and down. And you have to be able to go down with it too, because you cannot sustain the high part at all. And, you know, I've done my tumbles. I've gone from, you know, selling number one records to not charting. I've done it all and-- it's just a part that you have to-- at the end of the day you gotta lock it up and go play with your kids, you know?
RATHER
But when you're on top, and you're feeling, "Listen, I'm invincible. (LAUGH) I'm the greatest thing that ever came along.” Let's talk about the narcissistic results of fame.
ETHERIDGE
Oh, (MAKES NOISE) wow. I often say fame is a drug because it gives you this false sense. I’m sure you are aware of what it’s like to walk into a room and everyone knows who you are. You--
RATHER Or thinks they know
ETHERIDGE
--well, they recognize you. You no longer have stranger status, which is actually a handy thing to have sometimes, to not be known. When you are known-- your reality becomes different. I mean, how many times have I assumed that someone knows who I am and they're like, "And what do you do?" And you're like, "Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot-- (LAUGH) I thought you knew who I was."
You know, so I often say that my Midwestern roots again come into play here. Where my father would say, "Look, you always thank your audience. If it wasn't for them, you wouldn't have anything." And it was a real sense of-- of humility about what I do that's it's a service. And that they don't have to be here, they chose to be here.
RATHER Well, you mentioned and it’s true, that while you’re on top you think it goes on forever but the fact of the matter is it goes away and up and down. But wham, you’re diagnosed with cancer.
ETHERIDGE
That-- the cancer diagnosis, that whole time period, -- I had-- just an awful breakup in 2001. Public. My first public breakup. And having been raised up to the -- this is the gay and lesbian-- they're having children. It was on-- on the cover of Newsweek and Rolling Stone. And now we're breaking up. And it was devastating.
It was-- I was, like, I've let my community down, I've let everyone down. I've let myself down; I've let my children down, whatever. All these-- you know. And so I tried-- I start to put myself back together. I record a couple albums, I'm making music, the music industry has completely changed by then. It's 2003, 2004, it's-- everybody's-- I feel like I'm swimming. And then I find a lump. And just think, "No, no, that's not-- I'm just-- it's a cyst. It's nothing."
And slowly the days go by and it's-- the diagnosis comes, "Yes, it's breast cancer." And my whole life just stopped. And it was good. I-- I always tell people I'm grateful for my cancer diagnosis because it was you greatest gift 'cause it completely changed my life. I was able to stop and let my whole life and world just crash over me like a wave. And I stood there and went, "Wow."
And for the first time I stopped everything. I had to. I was on-- did the chemotherapy that was-- it's called dose dense. It was--- because I didn't have to work, I was able to stay home, they just, (MAKES NOISE) you know, put this crazy chemo stuff in me. So I lay in bed for weeks. And all I had-- all I could do was think. But I thought-- I found a beautiful stillness.
There's a point-- I'm sure it's what yogis go to the mountain to do to get away from life. There's a point when -- your tape of life runs off the reel and there's this stillness of your own-- I got to know myself. And I got to understand spirit and body and health. And I came outta that a whole new person and excited about life, about my art. Dedicated to-- I am only gonna do what I love from now on.
RATHER
What did you learn about cancer that you think could be helpful to others who are having to go through now what you went through?
ETHERIDGE
A lot of what I learned a lot of people don't wanna know. Because the main thing I learned is that my health is my responsibility. Cancer does not just happen. It doesn't just come outta nowhere and strike you. Cancer is a long process in your body. My journey with it had been-- I found out all my doctors, all of them-- and they were the best doctors. Each one of them would say, "Cancer starts when cells go bad."
And then they'd go on into what I had and everything and blah, blah, blah, and all the-- and they'd give the numbers and the-- the percentages and it was this whole thing. And I kept saying, "Well, what makes cells go bad? What makes--" and none of them would deal with that. They only dealt with this part. So finally I started looking' up and finding old, old writings from back in the '30s from doctors who would say, "Cells go bad because the environment in your body is too acidic.
We are-- we are energy cells, we are much like batteries, and we run on alkaline and acid. Every processed food, all the sugar, all this Western diet is completely acidic. Changing your diet, changing your stress levels, changing your relationships-- whatever it is that's stressing you and causing you acidic-- literally acid to be released in your body, that's what gave me cancer.
And I believe this. You won't find-- there's not a lot of doctors who are willing to step out and say this. I have followed this. And I figure me living and living well is the one of the only things I can do to prove this. (LAUGH) That this -- more doctors are-- are starting to say it's about health, it's about how much water you're drinking. Very simple things to keep yourself healthy. That's what I would say. I would say -- and I do tell them, people come to me-- often I get the, "My friend is stage four, she's only got weeks to live. She just wants to meet Melissa Etheridge." I get that all the time. They come back stage. I pull them aside. I pull them aside and I say, "So what-- what are the doctors telling you?" "Well, they-- they can't do anything for me. It's there, it's just--" and I look at them and I say, “Awesome. This is great. Do you know what you have? You have the gift of saying, ‘I don’t have to do anything, cancer.” You could be the crazy --you could run off to the Amazon and be that person that finds the cure. Go-- I said, “Go change. Change something, anything. Go do it." And -- I actually have people that have been comin’ back to me now year after year saying, "I'm still alive."
RATHER
I would think it's a very difficult concept for many people to grasp that cancer is a gift.
ETHERIDGE
(LAUGH) Yeah. But it can be. Life is-- life is-- this is what it gave me was this really clear understanding that joy is the most important thing in our life. We cannot exist without joy, without creativity. We're of an age now where we see people dying all the time. And mostly you can probably say, "Oh, my father died right after he retired." Retired, the purpose goes away. The life force is done. When we get more connected with the emotional and spiritual side of our bodies and how it affects health, it's going to be revolutionary in medicine. It really will be.
RATHER
And you consider it revolutionary in your case.
ETHERIDGE
Oh, yeah. I think the gift of cancer gave me an understanding, I'm gonna live a long time now because of that.
RATHER
You're convinced of that.
ETHERIDGE Convinced and I will be-- I will be back comin' decade after decade to prove it.
ETHERIDGE (singing)
Oh, I’m gonna show you baby A woman can be tough I want you to come on, come on, come on, come on Take it, take another little piece of my heart, now baby…
RATHER
Your hair hadn't grown back when you appear at the music awards, your coming out from cancer, different thing from coming out before about your sexual orientation.
ETHERIDGE
Yes.
RATHER
Tell me about that because it's become part of the lore (LAUGH) of American music.
ETHERIDGE
It was very similar actually to coming out sexually because cancer had the same sort of tabooness. You couldn't say the word, it was the "c" word. My father died of cancer, my grandmother died of cancer and I didn't even know. It still felt like this-- there's something shameful about it, and I comp-- after having gone through that about my sexuality, I completely rejected all of that and went, "No, no, no, no. There's no shame in this at all. I'm gonna learn everything I can about this. And I'm gonna stand up and--" and I still do. Every night in concert I say, "I had cancer." I say, "Cancer, cancer, cancer." I say (LAUGH) it as much as I can.
RATHER
Just get it out there.
ETHERIDGE
Just to-- because so many people give it so much power. People would just-- knowing that I had cancer they would just look at me sadly. And it was like, "No, this is my body-- succeeding now." I'm nine years cancer free. Not a drop of it.
So it-- it energized me. Yet, the losing of the hair, I actually found to be the most debilitating thing about the whole cancer experience. Women, they would just go, "I can't believe my hair's gonna fall out." I'm like, "Wait a minute. No, let's talk about the cancer, not just the--" the-- that's a result of chemo. It's not even a result of cancer. It's a result of a chemical that they give you.
And when they asked me to pay tribute to Janis Joplin, which one of my favorites, on the Grammy's, -- I said yes because I didn't want anybody else to do it. I wanted to do it. (LAUGH) That's my place. And I thought, "Ooh, I'm gonna be bald." And -- I actually talked to my friends. I said, -- for a second I thought about a wig and went, "That's just ridiculous." It would fall off for one. -- It would never be able to stay on my head, and that's not me. I'm the girl who says, "Speak true." So you know what? I'm gonna-- I'm gonna walk out on stage and I'm just gonna be bald, and we'll just go from there. And the next day, again, my whole life changed. And to this day I still-- people at least once a week come up to me and say, "Oh, my mother was going through cancer when you”-- oh, I had an experience. This-- this young girl, I walked up to her, she was bald. You can tell when they're going on chemo. She was in a wheelchair. I just was drawn to her and I just came up and said, "Oh, honey." And the father-- and the father said, "Oh, remember that video I showed you, that's the woman." You know, come on. That's-- it-- sometimes the things that change the world are just because you're willing to just be yourself.
ETHERIDGE (singing)
You know you got it...
RATHER (VOICE OVER)
MELISSA ETHERIDGE HAS BECOME INCREASINGLY OUTSPOKEN ABOUT HER HOLISTIC PHILOSOPHIES ON CANCER TREATMENT. WHEN ANGELINA JOLIE ANNOUNCED HER CHOICE TO GET A PREVENTATIVE DOUBLE MASTECTOMY, ETHERIDGE PUBLICLY DISAPPROVED.
MELISSA ETHERIDGE
There was a small newspaper in Washington D.C., actually the gay newspaper in Washington D.C. asked me what I thought about this. And I gave them my honest answer as I am wont to do, as I do. (LAUGH) I speak truthfully. And I said, "Nowadays, to give into the fear of cancer," -- I also said that I was diagnosed with the BRCA-- 2 gene, I have the same gene she had. You know, the one where you're probably gonna get cancer, if whatever. I have all those things and to remove healthy tissue from your body in fear of cancer is a personal choice. You may absolutely do that. And-- and if fear is where you're gonna be comin’ from every day then I would say, "Yeah, you should do that," because that fear is acidic and that's gonna bring that to you. But to call it brave, I myself personally would not call it brave to remove parts of my body because I might-- because I'm afraid I might get something later.
I, myself, think a more courageous choice is to say, "Aha, I'm actually in-- in one of those percentages that I might get this, so I'm gonna look to my nutrition, to my body, to my stress, and make sure that I have the best percentage to live a healthy, full-bodied life.'" That's-- that's all I said is I wouldn't call it brave.
RATHER
There no desire here to get you in conflict because--
ETHERIDGE
Oh, I’ve already been in conflict about it. It already went around--
RATHER
Well, but – but it’s a very personal decision
ETHERIDGE Yes, it is very personal. Again--
RATHER
Very personal decision.
ETHERIDGE
Everyone is certainly-- can make their own personal decision—
RATHER
Well but--
ETHERIDGE
--absolutely.
RATHER
--that's their right. They're entitled--
ETHERIDGE
--that's their absolute—
RATHER
--to do--
ETHERIDGE
--it's-- it's--
RATHER
Well, let’s talk about, I believe it was after your challenge with cancer that you came out very vocally and regularly about the medical uses of marijuana.
ETHERIDGE
Uh-huh (AFFIRM).
RATHER
Let's talk about that.
ETHERIDGE
Well, like I'd said, I hadn't been-- a drug user before then. I had smoked cannabis-- recreationally. You know, it was always fun, social things. I definitely did that more than I did drink. But it was not -- a life choice. When I was going through chemotherapy, again the great doctors-- (LAUGH) gave me the, "Here, this is the pill you take to keep you out of pain and this is the pill you take because that pill's gonna make you constipated and then this is the pill you take to keep the anxiety down because this steroid pill we're gonna give you is gonna--"
RATHER
Wow.
ETHERIDGE
--yeah. And so all of a sudden I'm looking' at six or seven chemicals that they're asking me to put in my body, along with the big dose of chemicals that are poisoning my body (LAUGH) trying to kill cancer.
RATHER
The chemotherapy.
ETHERIDGE
Chemotherapy. I made a choice to use cannabis because this is one natural plant, no side effects other than some euphoria, -- instead of using the drugs. It relieved my pain, it gave me an appetite, -- that's one of the worst-- that's one of the biggest dangers of chemotherapy is you can't eat and you end up in the hospital. I would recommend it for anyone who's doing chemotherapy. I have slowly become part of this cannabis movement.
RATHER
And the movement now seems to be at an all-time peak if you will. That--
ETHERIDGE
Yes, well, it's heading there--
RATHER
--states other than California are in one way or the other legalizing, which I'd have to say as a reporter we've recently done some investigative reports in-- in California is leading such things as what used to be drug cartels moving in big time on this. Are you worried about that? Are you aware of that?
ETHERIDGE
Well, that's what I want-- as a mother, I don't wanna be a criminal. I don't wanna buy from criminals. I would like the same opportunity as someone who can go down to the store and buy a six pack and watch a football game. I would like to be able to know that the cannabis that I'm going to enjoy is comin’ from a place that I'm giving people jobs that is not criminally bound. So I deeply believe in the legalization of cannabis just for that purpose. So we can stop this drug cartels and stop this crazy stuff and-- and get the regulations that tobacco and alcohol both have.
ETHERIDGE (SINGING) “Oh it’s such a shame But there’s no one to blame Yet no one knows what I’ve seen”
ACT 5
MELISSA ETHERIDGE (SINGING) “Hello, hello This is Romeo Calling from a jackpot telephone”
DAN RATHER (VOICE OVER)
MELISSA ETHERIDGE HAS ALWAYS BEEN FEARLESS ABOUT LIVING HER LIFE IN THE PUBLIC EYE. THESE DAYS, SHE HAS A NEW PASSION IN HER LIFE…SHE IS NEWLY ENGAGED TO HOLLYWOOD WRITER AND PRODUCER LINDA WALLEM. WALLEM JOINED US TO TALK ABOUT THE DEFENSE OF MARRIAGE ACT AND WHAT IT MEANS FOR THEIR PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP.
RATHER
So Linda, if you’ll step in.
RATHER
Thank you so much for doing this—
RATHER
--I’m sorry--
WALLEM
Thank you. (LAUGH)
RATHER
--to ruin you afternoon (LAUGH) with--
WALLEM
Well--
RATHER
--intruding on your home and--
WALLEM
Oh, this happens on a daily basis here. (LAUGH)
RATHER
Oh, I see? It happens every day, does it?
WALLEM
No. I wish. This is thrilling (LAUGH) to have you here.
RATHER
No. WALLEM
Thank you. RATHER
But thank you very much. WALLEM
Thanks. RATHER Well, I have the two of you together.
WALLEM
Hi.
MELISSA ETHERIDGE
Hi. (LAUGH)
RATHER
Let me ask you about how—has your life changed with this recent, Supreme Court decisions? And if so, how?
ETHERIDGE
Absolutely. We were-- unfortunately, we weren’t together when the decision came down. I was in New York and she was here with our daughter. But I woke them up. I said, “You have to turn on the TV, you have to turn on the TV. It’s comin’ down now.” Because I had been asked to speak on CNN if it came down.
So I knew it was-- it was-- the decision was maybe comin’ down. And going through that as a family -- it was the end of this movement of trying to separate and say that this marriage is different than that marriage, and this love is different than that love.
And it was, you know, testing of America. And so for us, I think-- I mean, speak for yourself-- obviously. But-- it just-- there’s a little bit more sense of I’m no so afraid to hold her hand. It’s not so strange anymore. It’s starting to be a part of the American fabric.
WALLEM
And the other change is the stress (LAUGH) that comes along that all you straight folks have had about weddings for--
ETHERIDGE
Oh my--
WALLEM
--years. Now I’m like, (LAUGH) “Oh, no. Oh, Man. Now we really have to”—
RATHER
Well, you know, I hadn’t thought of that.
WALLEM
It is.
ETHERIDGE
Yes.
WALLEM
It’s a big-- it’s a new-- there’s new therapy popping up everywhere for us (LAUGH) gay folk for this ‘cause it’s a new stress of like, “Oh, wow. We really have to step up now. We have to make the wedding plans and call the relatives and go through all of the stuff”- - you know?
RATHER
I was gonna say it's germane in this moment because you're planning to get married.
WALLEM
Yes.
ETHERIDGE
Yes.
RATHER
How soon will it be?
ETHERIDGE
Well, hopefully, it will be in the next few months. We are-- we're choosing a date. The date has to be perfect. There's a lot of-- of course, we have two careers. We have four children and they're-- you know, all of our lives are very-- full, and we want to pick just the right time where we can prepare for it. And also-- those that we love can be there and we can be there.
RATHER
But it-- every wedding has its stresses: picking a date, (LAUGH) making sure the invitations get out on--
WALLEM
Oh, yeah.
RATHER
--time.
WALLEM
And do I really want them to come? (LAUGHTER) Or not? Or oh I have to have them come. Or well, let's elope. We say that a lot--
ETHERIDGE
--yes. It's very, very close to that.
RATHER
With these recent Supreme Court decisions, gay and lesbian rights have come so far. Let’s reflect on that a little bit. You must think about it sometimes and think is this really happening or wow, we went through a lot. What do you think?
WALLEM
Oh, I do. I think about being from the Midwest and closeted, and through college in Minneapolis, and then in New York. And then in the ‘80s and ‘90s, and then even coming out here as a television writer, I was closeted. I was afraid to bring that into a comedy room, you know? Like, just kind of keep that out.
And now it makes me laugh because I’m marrying (LAUGH) a rather well known rock star. So it’s-- it means-- I’ve come a long way I think about how I must feel about it ‘because I’m delighted. I am marrying my best friend, and I couldn’t be happier.
RATHER
Melissa, how has society changed for you?
ETHERIDGE I see society wanting to move forward. I see good people, smart people-- who understand that change constantly happens, really trying to move with this and be open to it even though it might be strange to them, and weird, and they don’t quite understand it all.
I see people -- it happens in-- in the school level. Our kids are in first grade and, you know, it's-- well, Johnny Rose's-- has two moms, you know? And it's-- and the kids go, "Oh? I wish I had two moms, you know?" And it-- the--
WALLEM
Well, no--
ETHERIDGE
--stigma--
WALLEM
--they have four moms now.
ETHERIDGE
Oh, it's true. They have four moms-- they have a lot of (LAUGHTER) moms.
WALLEM
They have a lot of moms.
ETHERIDGE
It's a large family. (LAUGHTER) Yet, it is--
WALLEM
You can tell she's a comedy writer.
ETHERIDGE
Yes, and--
WALLEM
I'm sorry.
ETHERIDGE
--- I laugh--
ETHERIDGE
--every (LAUGHTER) single day.
WALLEM
Sorry.
ETHERIDGE
I laugh every single day.
WALLEM
Well, I love that you put the drums right here so I can go ba-dum-bum--
ETHERIDGE
Ba-dum. (MOUTH NOISE)
WALLEM
--if something doesn't go well. (LAUGHTER) That's not the point. Get back to your point.
ETHERIDGE
Okay. So society absolutely-- everyone is-- is doing their best -- I really feel. And what it does is it causes those that really have a problem with it that so much to where they-- they would resist it or push against it, that comes to the surface, and it has to be dealt with and it has to be looked at as okay, why are you feeling-- why does this bother you so much? What's-- you know, what's goin' on?
RATHER
What's next for the gay rights movement?
WALLEM
I think we can all finally relax, you know? And just really focus on maybe being, you know, citizens of the world now. That we can just put that aside and go, “Oh, man. All that energy and the angst and all of that stuff, well, let’s pour it into contributing to our world, you know?” Not just gay issues. All issues, you know?
ETHERIDGE
I remember the ‘80s thinking oh I’m gay, I’m alternative. If you even said gay marriage, people go what are you talking about? We’re anti. We’re anti this establishment which was getting married, and we’re gonna be --until we started growing and going, “Wait a minute. I do wanna -- I wanna --I want this --I wanna be a contributing member to this beautiful, American fabric.
RATHER
Well, thank you both. You've been so generous with your time.
ETHERIDGE
Oh, my--
ETHERIDGE
--pleasure, Dan. What a--
WALLEM
We adore--
RATHER
Thank you so much.
WALLEM
--you. Any time.
ACT 6
MELISSA ETHERIDGE
Want to go-- go in my backyard?
DAN RATHER
Sure.
ETHERIDGE
C'mon.
ETHERIDGE
My son comes back here. He goes, "Mom, we have the Garden of Eden in our backyard." I said, "Yes."
ETHERIDGE
You want us to go that way or this way?
RATHER
Let’s go this way; we’ll make our own decision.
RATHER
"They're only two totally dependable things in life. True love and home-grown tomatoes."
ETHERIDGE
Yeah. (LAUGHTER) Indeed
ETHERIDGE
I never wanna eat any other kind of tomato once-- once you have one like that--
RATHER
Well, thank you for that. I'll take it--
ETHERIDGE
Oh it's straight--
RATHER
--back with me.
ETHERIDGE
Straight from the sun.
RATHER
Thank.
ETHERIDGE
You bet.
RATHER
Thank you.
ETHERIDGE Thank you. It's good for ya. Healthy.