Tuesday Volume 532 13 September 2011 No. 199

HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)

Tuesday 13 September 2011

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Mr Mark Spencer (Sherwood) (Con): Will the Minister House of Commons find time to meet me to discuss the case of a company based in Staffordshire that sold hot tubs and which Tuesday 13 September 2011 defrauded many of my constituents? It took their money, went into insolvency and became a phoenix company.

The House met at half-past Two o’clock Mr Djanogly: I shall listen to the circumstances of my hon. Friend’s case, but it might be one for the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills rather than the PRAYERS Ministry of Justice. If it is relevant to my Department, however, I will be happy to meet him. [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] Prisoners (Work in Custody) BUSINESS BEFORE QUESTIONS 2. Jessica Lee (Erewash) (Con): What recent progress LONDON LOCAL AUTHORITIES AND TRANSPORT FOR he has made in making prisoners work while in LONDON (NO.2)BILL [LORDS](BY ORDER) custody; and if he will make a statement. [71307] Second Reading opposed and deferred until Tuesday 11 October (Standing Order No. 20). The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Crispin Blunt): We have made clear our intention to make prisons places of work and industry. We are already making good progress towards longer prisoner working Oral Answers to Questions weeks at a number of prisons, including 13 early-adopter sites that are implementing regimes designed to facilitate increased working hours. We are continuing to develop a framework that will enable us to maximise this approach JUSTICE across the prison estate. To achieve this, we are looking at the experience of other countries and have established a business advisory group to help us to deliver prison The Secretary of State was asked— industries that operate on a commercial basis so that much more work can be delivered at no cost to the Insolvency Litigation taxpayer and can contribute to victims’ services while competing fairly in open markets. 1. Yvonne Fovargue (Makerfield) (Lab): What recent discussions he has had with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Jessica Lee: Does my hon. Friend agree that having Customs and the Insolvency Service on the viability of prisoners do real work will help not only by tackling the insolvency litigation following the implementation of culture of idleness in prisons, but by giving prisoners the reforms proposed by Lord Justice Jackson. [71306] valuable vocational skills that we all hope they will put to good use upon their release? The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): The Department has received Mr Blunt: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. There many representations about different aspects of will be substantial benefits from bringing this policy to implementing the reforms proposed by Lord Justice scale, which I am optimistic we can do. There will be Jackson, which we are taking forward in the Legal Aid, benefits to victims from the resources generated by the Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill. I and my work that prisoners do; to the taxpayer from relieving officials continue to have discussions with Government the cost of the regime; and to the stability of the prison Departments and others on implementation generally, regime, as she mentioned. However, there will also be a including with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs substantial rehabilitative benefit to prisoners who will and the Insolvency Service in relation to insolvency leave prison with a CV that includes skills training in proceedings. the work in which they have been involved as well as experience in the work itself. Yvonne Fovargue: In June, the Minister said that he was discussing with HMRC and the Insolvency Service the specific implications of the Jackson reform for the Mrs Jenny Chapman (Darlington) (Lab): We all agree punishment of dodgy directors of insolvent companies, that prison industry is good for rehabilitation, but how with a view to reaching a satisfactory conclusion. Three many additional prison officers does the Minister think months down the line, what conclusion has been reached? will be needed to supervise movement around the estate and to ensure that prison industries are secure and Mr Djanogly: Our current position is not to depart properly delivered? from Lord Justice Jackson’s recommendations on recoverability, with the sole exception that we have Mr Blunt: The hon. Lady is absolutely right. If we are outlined in the Bill. However, the Government are to change prisons from being simply places of security aware of the particular issues concerning the impact of and of warehousing people, where work is wedged in abolishing conditional fee agreement recoverability in when possible, there will be additional costs to the relation to insolvency and related proceedings. I and my prison regime. The businesses that go into prisons will officials will continue to assess and discuss the implications. have to generate the resources to support that. 873 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 874

Mr Julian Brazier (Canterbury) (Con): In strongly Mr Clarke: We are not changing the jurisdiction in welcoming my hon. Friend’s initiative, I urge him to this country, which certainly does entertain claims in consider the position of young people on remand. As personal injury cases and so on against multinational successive prison inspectors have said, it cannot be right companies that have some footing in this country. All to have young people, even though they have not been we are arguing about is how much is paid in legal costs. sentenced, sitting about not required even to undertake The reforms to the no win, no fee arrangements that we any education let alone work. are proposing would ensure that the costs would be fairer, more balanced and not out of proportion to the Mr Blunt: Again, my hon. Friend is right. Remand claim. We are not making any change at all to the prisoners pose a particular challenge, in the youth estate jurisdiction. Most of the cases against multinational as well as the adult estate, because of the speed with companies are not human rights cases; they are personal which they tend to turn over in those institutions. That injury cases. Many of those cases might be attracted makes getting work for them more difficult, but there here because our present system of rewarding lawyers is needs to be a proper focus on programmes for all people far more generous than can be found in any other in custody following a proper assessment of their jurisdiction in the world. rehabilitative requirements. Katy Clark: The Secretary of State will be aware that Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab): The Minister the UN Committee on the Elimination of Racial will be aware that women in prison are often under- Discrimination has also criticised the reforms, which occupied. Will he tell us what special attention he is would remove access to justice for the victims of corporate giving to creating working opportunities for women abuse overseas. Does he not recognise that the reforms who are serving custodial sentences? could result in there being no disincentive to environmental and other abuse? Will he not look at this again? Mr Blunt: This agenda has to apply to women as well as to men. The sad fact is that, overall, too many of our Mr Clarke: As I suggested a moment ago, I regard it prisoners are under-occupied, whether women or men, as just a little disingenuous—I hate to say that about and the same attention must be paid to the women’s UN agencies—to suggest that we are in any way estate as to the men’s estate. undermining the jurisdiction here for dealing with racial discrimination or serious personal injury cases involving Corporate Harm (Overseas Victims) British companies. What we are talking about is how much the lawyers are paid by way of success fees and 3. Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green): What other costs. The Trafigura case was a classic scandalous his policy is on the right of overseas victims of alleged personal injury case involving a British company and human rights abuses by UK multinational companies an incident in Côte d’Ivoire, in which £30 million in to access justice in the UK. [71308] compensation was awarded by the British courts to the plaintiffs and £100 million was paid in legal costs to those who brought the action. All we are doing is going 7. Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab): back to where no win, no fee used to be—in getting the What recent discussions he has had with the Secretary costs and the claims back in proportion to each other. of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs on his proposed reform of access to justice for overseas victims of corporate harm. [71312] Mr Andy Slaughter (Hammersmith) (Lab): What we are talking about is whether such cases will get into The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice court at all under the regime that the Government are (Mr Kenneth Clarke): Overseas victims of alleged corporate proposing. It appears they will not listen to Her Majesty’s harm by UK international companies are, where Revenue and Customs on insolvency, or to Amnesty appropriate, able to bring civil claims in the UK now, International, Oxfam or the United Nations on and that will continue to be the case following multinational cases. Now, Admiral, the leading specialist implementation of our reforms to civil litigation funding motor insurer, is saying that premiums will go up as a and costs. My officials and I are in contact with the result of the proposals. Is it not time to think again, and Foreign and Colonial Office—[Laughter]—the Foreign to stop favouring insurance companies, crooks and and Commonwealth Office as and when necessary to multinationals over their victims? discuss the impact of our proposed reforms to legal costs in this class of case in this country, the Commonwealth Mr Clarke: If the hon. Gentleman wants to widen or the colonies. this argument, which is perfectly legitimate, to include a general proposition as well as multinational company Caroline Lucas: I thank the Secretary of State for that cases, the questions must be: how much is proportionate interesting reply. Notwithstanding his response, he will to the claim when it comes to paying costs, and what be aware that the United Nations Special Representative effect does no win, no fee, since it was changed, have on on Business and Human Rights has said that clauses 41 the judgment on both sides? We do not want such cases to 43 of the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of to be such a high earner for the plaintiffs’ lawyers that Offenders Bill will present a major barrier to justice they are prepared to bring more speculative cases, which for overseas victims of human rights abuses by UK is happening at the moment. Nor do we want pressure multinationals, not least because of the significant increased to be put on defendants who have a perfectly sound cost burdens. Will he therefore withdraw those clauses defence, forcing them to say, “We cannot defend ourselves, from the Bill? because it will cost us less to pay a nuisance fee by way 875 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 876 of settlement.”Justice involves striking a balance between fact that it can lead to catastrophic effects, why not what the lawyers are paid and what the plaintiffs get by allow the CPS the right to appeal in limited circumstances way of compensation. against a decision of a Crown court judge to grant bail?

Bail Decisions (Right of Appeal) Nick Herbert: I have answered this question, and I thought I did so in very reasonable terms. I said that we 4. Mr Gordon Marsden (Blackpool South) (Lab): all appreciated that the case was very serious and that What assessment he has made of the proposal to allow the Government would consider the proposal. We have a right of appeal of decisions by judges to grant bail to be aware, however, that granting an appeal on a following the death of Jane Clough and other cases. decision of a Crown court judge—a more senior member [71309] of the judiciary than a magistrate—raises serious issues, which need to be considered with care. The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick Herbert): There is a right of appeal against bail decisions Sadiq Khan: I am really sorry to raise the matter made by magistrates, but not against those made by the again, but a justice Bill is going through Parliament and Crown court. This is not a straightforward matter; we it seems to the rest of us to provide the ideal opportunity are examining the issues very carefully to identify the to make the change required. The Minister will be best way to take this forward. aware that many colleagues—and not just those in the House—constituents up and down the country, victims Mr Marsden: Jane Clough was stabbed to death of crime and experts working in the justice system all outside Blackpool Victoria hospital by her former partner think that Ministers in the Justice Ministry are not fit who had been freed on bail after being charged with for purpose. They were out of touch when it came to the nine counts of rape, and a similar case took place in the issue of rape; they were out of touch when it came to Blackpool area in the previous year. Jane Clough’s providing a 50% reduction in sentence to those who parents’ MP, the hon. Member for Pendle (Andrew pleaded guilty; and I am afraid they are out of touch on Stephenson) has introduced a ten-minute rule Bill, which this issue. The Bill is in Committee, so will the Minister commands wide support. I wrote to the Lord Chancellor agree to support our amendment, which would allow this July, asking him to give families and the Crown the CPS in limited circumstances to appeal against a Prosecution Service the chance to appeal against this decision of a Crown court judge to grant bail? judicial bail decision. Will the right hon. Gentleman and other Justice Ministers at least consider making Nick Herbert: I am not sure how many times I can this change to the bail law? After such horrific events repeat to the right hon. Gentleman that I have said that have taken place, it is not good enough simply to wash the Government are considering these matters. I am not their hands of this subject when they have the power to going to announce policy on the hoof when very serious make the change. issues are raised. It is not proper to make a link between the provisions in the Bill and the case that arose because Nick Herbert: I am not sure whether the hon. Gentleman the restriction on custodial remands in the Bill applies is aware of it, but along with my hon. Friend the only to magistrates courts and not to the Crown courts—so Member for Pendle (Andrew Stephenson), I have met it would not have affected the case that gave rise to the Mr and Mrs Clough. This was an appalling case in question. which a young mother was tragically killed. No one could have failed to be moved by what the parents said. Office of the Chief Coroner They made a powerful case and I have said that the Government are considering my hon. Friend’s proposal, 5. Gavin Shuker (Luton South) (Lab/Co-op): but Crown court judges are judges of some seniority Whether his Department has undertaken a cost-benefit and we need to assess the issues with care. analysis of the implementation of the office of chief coroner. [71310] Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con): Ministry of Justice figures show that more than 10% of all crimes and 19. Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East almost 20% of burglaries are committed by people on Cleveland) (Lab): Whether his Department has undertaken bail. Is it not time that the Government clamped down a cost-benefit analysis of the implementation of the on the courts giving people bail and tightened the rules? office of the chief coroner. [71326] Is it not self-evident that the more people are remanded in custody, the fewer the crimes will be committed and The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice the fewer victims there will be? (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): An impact assessment for part 1 of the Coroners and Justice Act 2009 was published Nick Herbert: I am sure that my hon. Friend is aware by the Ministry of Justice in December 2008. It summarised that many people who are remanded in custody and the full costs and benefits of implementing the coroner subsequently found either to be either guilty or not provisions in the Act. guilty would not have merited a custodial sentence. That is an issue that the House has to confront. Gavin Shuker: I am grateful for that answer. Baroness Finlay, working with the president of the Royal College Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab): I am afraid that the of Pathologists, proposed a model with much lower Chamber will be concerned about the complacency of running costs—just £300,000—than those that the the language used in the Minister’s response. I am sure Government are talking about. So will the Minister he will agree that judges, like the rest of us, are not accept that the costs for the office he is proposing could infallible and make mistakes. If he accepts that and the be reduced? 877 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 878

Mr Djanogly: I have met and discussed this point Ministers, will fulfil that role. Does he think it acceptable with Baroness Finlay on a number of occasions. The to expect families to have to continue to pursue expensive previous Government said that the set-up costs were judicial reviews and litigation in respect of coronial going to be £10.9 million and the running costs would decisions, at great cost also to the taxpayer, and have no be £6.6 million a year. We looked at that those figures way of holding to account those coroners who do not and we agree with them. The problem is that as we have deliver for bereaved families? to maintain the independence of the judiciary, the chief coroner—if there were to be one—could, unfortunately, Mr Djanogly: As I have said, the Government are not be based in the Ministry of Justice, as Baroness committed to urgent reform of the coronial service, and Finlay wanted. this is exactly what we are going to be doing. We are putting in place all the provisions under the 2009 Act, Tom Blenkinsop: The delays and current practice in except the appeal process, which was going to cost the coroner system is having a direct impact on bereaved £2.2 million a year. We feel that the existing processes families, particularly in the Teesside area. What costs to are adequate. the UK health services arise as a result of the current coroner system? Mesothelioma Sufferers (Access to Justice)

Mr Djanogly: We remain committed to fundamental 6. Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab): What recent reform of the coronial system. I know that there are representations he has received from people with particular issues to address in the hon. Gentleman’s mesothelioma and mesothelioma support groups on constituency, and they are being dealt with. Implementing the potential implications of his proposed reforms to the office of the chief coroner would require new funding, legal aid. [71311] which simply is not available in the current economic climate. Our proposals will allow us to deliver those The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice reforms, but without those additional costs. (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): Legal aid for personal injury claims was abolished by the previous Administration in Sir Alan Beith (Berwick-upon-Tweed) (LD): Does my 1999, so I take the hon. Gentleman to be referring to hon. Friend recognise that there is a much cheaper and the proposed reforms to civil litigation funding and more cost-effective way of raising professional standards costs, and will answer on that basis. I have received and creating a head of the coronial profession? That several letters from MPs and others about the potential would involve designating a serving coroner as chief impact on mesothelioma sufferers. The Government’s coroner and give just minimal assistance to support him package of reforms includes a number of measures to in that role. help claimants. We believe that valid claims will still be brought under the new regime but will be resolved at Mr Djanogly: Unfortunately, the existing legislation more proportionate cost. would not allow that; the job would have to be done by a High Court judge or a circuit judge. The point of the Toby Perkins: Mesothelioma victims are often in the matter is that we are putting in place a ministerial last year of their life by the time they are diagnosed and committee, which will answer to Parliament in a way many are already too ill to seek redress. The proposals that a chief coroner never could. to prevent their being able to recover afterwards from the insurance premiums will mean a big up-front cost Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con): As the for many people. Derbyshire asbestos support team is repatriation of fallen soldiers through RAF Lyneham very concerned that they and their families will miss out and Wootton Bassett in my constituency comes to an on access to justice because of these proposals. What end, I know that the Minister will wish to join me in can the Minister do to ensure that those people, who are paying tribute to the first-class work done by the Wiltshire very ill and who do not have trivial claims, have access coroner over some four or five years. Will the Minister to justice? also now work closely with the Royal British Legion to ensure that the maximum possible support is available Mr Djanogly: The hon. Gentleman makes an important for bereaved families as these inquests proceed? point. We recognise that reducing the time from diagnosis of the disease to settlement of the claim without the Mr Djanogly: I certainly congratulate the coroner on need for litigation would be preferable. Proposals to his work in tough circumstances. I also wish to tell my introduce a scheme that will incorporate a fixed time hon. Friend that I have met representatives of the RBL scale and cost each stage of the claim so that only the on a number of occasions. I believe that our reforms most complex cases reach litigation are being considered. will improve the situation for the armed forces tremendously, through the national charter that we are providing and Referral Fees the ability to train coroners to military standards. 8. Mr Jack Straw (Blackburn) (Lab): What decisions Robert Flello (Stoke-on-Trent South) (Lab): There is he has reached on implementing the recommendation a long list of organisations that wish to see a chief of the review by Lord Justice Jackson to abolish coroner in post and just the Minister who thinks he referral fees. [71313] knows better. The Government’s fragmented proposals for the coronial system contain no mechanism to improve The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice the appeals and complaints process—that was to be a (Mr Kenneth Clarke): As the House was informed on key function of the chief coroner’s office. Nobody really Friday 9 September in a written ministerial statement, believes that the proposed coronial board, reporting to the Government have decided to ban referral fees in 879 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 880 personal injury cases as recommended by Lord Justice Mr Bain: I am grateful for that answer. Does the Jackson. The ban complements our wider reforms to no Secretary of State support Liberty’s campaign, entitled win, no fee arrangements, which are being taken forward “Common Values”, that seeks to separate the myths in the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders from the truths of the Human Rights Act, which has, Bill. for example, protected the victims of rape from being cross-examined in court by their assailants? Is this not Mr Straw: May I first express an unequivocal welcome the right way to tackle what the Prime Minister recently for the announcement that the right hon. and learned called the misrepresentation of human rights? Gentleman and the Under-Secretary of State for Justice, the hon. Member for Huntingdon (Mr Djanogly), made Mr Clarke: The best way to answer that is to say that on Friday not only in respect of motor insurance but I agree with the campaign, with the hon. Gentleman more widely about implementing this central plank of and with the Prime Minister. A perfectly serious debate Lord Justice Jackson’s recommendations? Since the Justice has taken place about human rights legislation and I Secretary used the word “ban”, which I think is the look forward to the commission’s advice. A lot of the correct word, may I ask him whether he accepts that, difficulty comes when human rights are invoked by given the level of malpractice we see across the legal and officials in excuse for bad decisions or in all kinds of paralegal industry, the ban will have to be backed by the cases that have nothing to do with any human rights criminal law? legislation. We would have an altogether more sensible debate if people understood the real problems and Mr Clarke: First, may I say that I am glad that my old difficulties—and that they are not all problems and friend the right hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) difficulties. and I are in complete agreement on this subject? It is not the first time. He got in first, really, because I waited for the opinion of the Legal Services Board, which I Andrew Bridgen (North West Leicestershire) (Con): have not followed but which I had to consider, and he For many, the perception of the application of human rightly prompted a decision. People who agree with us rights law is that the pendulum has swung too far away include not only Lord Justice Jackson but my noble from responsibilities and duties. Does my right hon. Friend Lord Young in his report, “Common Sense, and learned Friend agree that the commission will Common Safety”, the Law Society, the Bar Council and present a good opportunity to extend the understanding the Association of British Insurers. The main beneficiaries that with rights go responsibilities? will be claimants who are genuinely referred to the best expert to act for them and the justice system in general. Mr Clarke: I think the commission is a very helpful We are now considering the way in which to put this idea for getting some objective and balanced advice on into practice, but it is likely to be in the form recommended. the whole subject. Otherwise, I agree with my hon. Friend that there is no reason why human rights should Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): Developing interfere with the proper balance between the responsibilities on that point, does my right hon. and learned Friend and duties that one properly owes to society. Everybody agree that we should consider not only criminal law but in this country is in favour of basic human rights and close liaison with professional bodies to ensure that everybody wants to have an orderly society. I think the strict disciplinary action is brought against individuals commission will help to steer the debate in a more or bodies who seek to circumvent any ban by rebranding sensible direction. fees as other costs or, worse still, start an emerging black market in referrals? Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): Will the Mr Clarke: My hon. Friend makes extremely sensible Secretary of State take this opportunity to assure us and welcome suggestions. We have not decided exactly that any review of the Human Rights Act will not what form the ban will take yet, so I will not predetermine include withdrawal from the European convention on its eventual form. As the professional bodies strongly human rights or the European Court of Human Rights? support us, we look forward to their co-operation because Will he recognise that both those institutions have done they are in the best position of all to ensure that a great deal of good to improve the human rights of different types of abuse with the same bad consequences minorities and ordinary citizens across Europe and that are not used to evade the ban. the convention is worth staying in?

Human Rights Act Mr Clarke: The convention was largely drafted by British lawyers led by Lord Kilmuir. Successive British 9. Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab): If Governments have adhered to the convention and have he will make an assessment of the effectiveness of the put great value on it and the Court. Since the fall of the Human Rights Act 1998 in respect of the balance Berlin wall and the end of the cold war, the convention between fundamental liberties and obligations to society. has acquired new importance in making sure that we [71314] support advancing standards in eastern and central Europe. There is not the faintest chance of the present The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice Government withdrawing from the convention on human (Mr Kenneth Clarke): We have established an independent rights, and we are waiting for the commission to give commission to investigate the creation of a United us—[HON.MEMBERS: “Ooh!”] Have a look at our coalition Kingdom Bill of Rights. The commission is due to report agreement. Indeed, it is not just the coalition agreement—we no later than the end of next year and the Government have agreed to have a fresh look at this through the look forward to receiving and considering its findings. commission and we are not prejudging its findings. 881 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 882

Gang Culture Prison Population

10. Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con): What 11. Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab): What steps he is taking to eradicate gang culture within assessment he has made of recent trends in the size of prisons and young offenders institutions. [71315] the prison population; and if he will make a statement. [71317] The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Crispin Blunt): Youth and adult custodial establishments have access to a range of accredited The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice programmes that address offending behaviour, including (Mr Kenneth Clarke): Since the summer of 2008, the gang-related issues. Programmes include engaging prison population has been increasing much less quickly community and voluntary sector groups to help deliver than had been the case for a number of years. The solutions to gang-related issues, and the National Offender public disorder in early August has, however, resulted Management Service and the YouthJustice Board support in a sharp rise in the number of prisoners in recent this work. The Government are developing a cross- weeks, with the prison population reaching 86,842 on departmental programme of action to tackle gangs and Friday 9 September. Despite this unprecedented rise, gang violence. An inter-ministerial group will report to sufficient capacity has been maintained in the prison Parliament in October. estate to accommodate the prison population effectively.

Dr Coffey: I thank the Minister for that answer, Stephen Pound: Like any decent, reasonable human which goes part of the way to addressing these issues. being, I am grateful for that answer from the Secretary However, when I visited the Warren Hill young offenders of State. Could I ask him to give credit to the prison institution in my constituency last year after there had officers who have participated in this expansion, and been a riot, one of the reasons cited for the riot was the the people working within the prison estate? It cannot growing emergence of gang culture and the fact that have been easy for them. An additional 500 operational when people are placed in young offenders institutions, usable places have appeared in the last few weeks. proximity takes priority over gang dispersal. I would Where from? like him to look at this policy again. Mr Clarke: First, I agree strongly with the praise that Mr Blunt: I am very grateful to my hon. Friend for the hon. Gentleman gives to the prison officers. The the interest she takes in Warren Hill. I have followed up system did respond—the criminal justice system responded the discussions that we have had and I assure her in very well to the totally unexpected pressure of the riots. relation to gang violence that there is no absolute, rigid Partly it proved that our criminal justice system does rule that proximity should take precedence. When placing work well in such circumstances. Secondly, it was entirely young people and adults into custodial establishments, because of the public-spiritedness and good will of both the YJB and NOMS take proper account of all the prison officers, probation officers, policemen and court factors required and there is emerging good practice staff, all of whom responded to the events with horror, around identifying gang affiliations. as did every decent member of society, and decided to put the public interest first. Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab): As the Minister We always carry a cushion in the prison estate, because knows from the evidence that has been received about we do not know what number of prisoners will come. I the recent riots in London and other cities, a number of know the consequences, which some of my predecessors people involved in gangs were part of those riots. Will have encountered, of running out of places in the he ask his Department to deal with organisations such prisons, and for that reason, I am glad to say, we were as User Voice, which consists of ex-offenders who were able to cope—there is still sufficient capacity—and it is in gangs, which are willing to work with the Ministry of very important that we continue to do so. Justice and assist it in its projects?

Mr Blunt: The right hon. Gentleman has made an Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD): Has excellent suggestion, which I am very happy to pass on the Secretary of State had time to consider the Make to officials in the Department. Justice Work report, “Community or Custody?” which sets out clearly how much more effective properly managed Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): Many of the community sentences are than short-term prison sentences, foreign national prisoners in our jails are members of and the potential for greater use of community sentences foreign national EU gangs that commit organised crime to push down the prison population? in this country. What is the Justice Department doing to tackle this aspect of gang culture in our cities and in our Mr Clarke: We have to have all forms of punishment prisons? available, because no two cases are the same. What is likely to be most effective with one offender may not be Mr Blunt: Of course, where evidence and intelligence with another. We do have to punish, and then we have of that kind are received, they will be acted on to make to see what we can do to rehabilitate and prevent people sure that those gangs cannot operate within the prison reoffending. But I quite agree: for some prisoners, the estate and that gang members are properly dispersed by best effect from the public point of view—returning the placement decisions taken by NOMS. We will also them to an honest life—can be achieved by non-custodial want, as we do with all foreign national prisoners, to try sentences, and the Government hope to make them to make sure that those people go home to serve their more credible to magistrates and to strengthen them, so sentences. they can be used effectively in suitable cases. 883 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 884

Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab): The Secretary of State The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice has, on a number of occasions, said and written that he (Mr Crispin Blunt): Payment by results is gathering intends to reduce the prison population significantly pace. We are piloting a number of different approaches over this Parliament. As he has confirmed, 16 months to see what works best. Two prison pilots have been put into the Parliament, the prison population is at a record in place at Her Majesty’s Prisons Peterborough and high. It was also at a very high level before the riots. As Doncaster. he is aware, the prison estate is struggling to cope. Pilots also will begin in public sector prisons next Prison officers and probation officers are increasingly year. Six justice reinvestment pilots have been put in stretched, and prisoners are spending even longer times place through memorandums of understanding with idling in their cells rather than engaged in productive either local authority chief executives or local police activities such as work. In the light of that, is he still chiefs in Manchester and London. committed to reducing the prison population significantly, and if so, how will he do it in a way that puts public In 2012 two community pilots will commence to protection first? rehabilitate offenders while serving sentences in the community, in addition to one or more provider-led Mr Clarke: I do not think I have ever said that. I have innovation pilots. We are also working with the Department made it quite clear that the prison population responds for Work and Pensions through the Work programme to demand. I did not anticipate the riots, but we have to and with the Department of Health on drug and alcohol have a prison population that can cope with the judgment recovery to look more widely at payment by results of judges and magistrates who send us a number of mechanisms which fully— people who have to be dealt with and punished in that way. I have said that I expect to have a more stable Mr Speaker: Order. I advise the Minister, for next system, but I cannot understand why everything possible month the answers should be a bit shorter. They are just was done under the last Government to push up the a bit too long. total number of prisoners but to let them all out earlier, so that the system looked tough but actually turned into Ben Gummer: I thank the Minister for that careful something of a shambles. I am also hoping that prison reply. He will be aware of the Justice Committee’s can be made somewhat more effective, and that it might recommendation that contracts should follow the offender be better at putting people to work, getting them off through the criminal justice system, rather than attach drugs, tackling their mental health problems and getting themselves to the various institutions through which he fewer of them to go on to commit more crimes— or she might pass. What progress has the Department made in considering those proposals? Mr Speaker: Order. I am grateful, but we must move on. Mr Blunt: My hon. Friend will have realised, given Special Immigration Appeals Commission the number of pilots we are conducting—I am sorry, Mr Speaker, that the list was too long for me to deliver 12. Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con): What satisfactorily—that we are testing the different elements steps he is taking to improve the functioning of the of the system to identify the best and most effective way to deliver payment by results. I hope that, in the end, we Special Immigration Appeals Commission. [71318] can deliver the offender-centric process on which my The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice hon. Friend relies, once we have identified which part of (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): The operation of the Special the system makes offenders best respond to effective Immigration Appeals Commission is kept under regular rehabilitation measures. review. There are no present plans to change current arrangements. Fiona Mactaggart (Slough) (Lab): Do any of those projects help to test whether providing housing for Mr Leigh: Too often immigration cases are deliberately people leaving prison helps them to be less likely to spun out using never-ending reviews and ever-upwards reoffend? appeals. What steps will the Minister take to protect the much-needed immigration reforms proposed by the Mr Blunt: Housing—having a home to go to—is Government from such delaying tactics? plainly a key crime desistance factor, but an awful lot of other key factors, such as work and drug addiction, are Mr Djanogly: Parliament has on previous occasions well-documented. We want to get out of the business of decided against the ousting of the High Court’s judicial identifying exactly what inputs people must deliver to review jurisdiction. The Supreme Court recently indicated offenders, but make all sorts of institutions responsible that it considered it would not be appropriate for the for focusing on the outputs and let them take the Government to take that route. However, improvements decisions about which are the appropriate desistance are being made. The legal aid reforms currently before factors to address for the offenders whom they are Parliament seek to remove legal aid from repeat applications treating. for judicial review in immigration and asylum cases.

Reoffending Rates Victims of Overseas Terrorism

13. Ben Gummer (Ipswich) (Con): What recent progress 14. Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op): he has made in implementing his policy of payment by When he plans to bring forward proposals on results to reduce the rate of reoffending. [71319] compensation for victims of overseas terrorism. [71320] 885 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 886

The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice interest in improving the efficiency of the system and (Mr Kenneth Clarke): Compensation for victims of terrorism learning the best lessons that we can from our welcome overseas is being considered alongside the Government’s experience of the riots. review of victims’ services and compensation in this country, at the conclusion of which we will publish a Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab): It seems that in consultation document. We plan to make an announcement the immediate aftermath of the riots, in many cases, on the victims of terrorism overseas at the same time as courts completely dispensed with asking for pre-sentence we launch the consultation. reports. One of the consequences was that parents of young children received custodial sentences, and no Gemma Doyle: I thank the Minister, but the families regard at all was paid to what would happen to those of the victims of overseas terrorism and the survivors children. Does the Secretary of State agree that when were promised on 28 June that an announcement would parents are sentenced to custody, there ought to be be made “in the coming weeks”. Some two and a half automatic checks on what happens to the children? months have now passed with no announcement. How much longer should the victims and their families expect to wait? Mr Clarke: My colleagues and I have just been checking with each other, and we all think—well, we all know—that Mr Clarke: I have to confess that the hon. Lady has a pre-sentence reports were provided. One cannot proceed valid point on the timing, but the fact is that it makes to swift justice without getting the necessary information sense to consider the victim support that we give, the about the circumstances of the client and their family. I present criminal injuries compensation scheme and the am sure that pre-sentence reports were, in fact, required support that the Foreign Office gives overseas alongside by courts, and they can certainly be obtained at adequate the proposed terrorism compensation scheme. This has length in the time available if one is moving briskly. Of always been a great difficulty over the years. We can all course, all the sentences are open to appeal, and the recall that, probably over the past 20 years, people’s situation and the consequences can all be looked at in aspirations to help victims here and abroad have run the normal way that always follows a sentence involving rather ahead of the arrangements made to finance someone with family responsibilities. them. I assure the hon. Lady that we are having to look at this again. I realise that we are slipping behind the Criminal Justice System timetable that we announced, and we will proceed as quickly as we can. 16. Sajid Javid (Bromsgrove) (Con): What plans he has to improve the efficiency of the criminal justice Public Disorder (Courts) system. [71322] 15. Bob Blackman (Harrow East) (Con): What recent The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick assessment he has made of the operation of the courts Herbert): We are taking forward a programme of work during the public disorder of August 2011. [71321] to tackle inefficiency, including by streamlining the administration of cases, extending digital working, and The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice making greater use of video links. We will in due course (Mr Kenneth Clarke): The courts responded swiftly, bring to the House further proposals that will build on fairly and properly during the recent public disorder the effective response of the criminal justice system to and continue to process cases as soon as they are recent public disorder. brought by the prosecution. Although it is too early to make a final assessment of the courts response to the disorder, my Department is reviewing all aspects of the Sajid Javid: Does the Minister agree with me that we response to find out whether opportunities for continued can make better use of our magistrates courts? improvement in public service can be identified. Nick Herbert: Yes, I do, and we are looking to do Bob Blackman: I thank my right hon. and learned precisely that, so my hon. Friend is right. It is noticeable, Friend for that answer. One of the lessons of the riots for instance, that more than half of defendants in was that those who were responsible were arrested, held either-way cases sentenced in the Crown court receive a on remand and processed through the courts and, if sentence that could have been imposed by magistrates. found guilty, began their sentences almost immediately, The Government understand that the Sentencing Council thus protecting the public and acting as a significant is developing draft allocation guidelines to support deterrent to others. Surely, that should be the norm, magistrates in determining where cases should be heard, rather than the exception? and we will consult on the draft guidelines in the autumn. Mr Clarke: First, I have already praised the staff of all the services involved for the service that they delivered, and I think that we have all noticed that it was possible Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): In considering to handle certainly the straightforward cases much more the efficiency of the criminal justice system, does the quickly than we have become too used to regarding as Minister know whether there has been any discussion in the norm elsewhere. Obviously, we realise that we cannot Cabinet about what the appropriate punishment is for expect such extraordinary efforts to be made all the drug-related offences involving class A substances, such time and in all normal circumstances, but efficiency can as cocaine? be improved. My right hon. Friend the Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice is taking a particular Nick Herbert: No. 887 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 888

Sentencing (Human Trafficking and Drugs Offences) been put at risk by cuts to the local probation trust. Does the Lord Chancellor think that reoffending rates 17. Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): How will be higher or lower by the end of this Parliament? many prisoners are serving sentences for (a) human trafficking and (b) drug-related offences; and what the Mr Clarke: Criminal statistics are more reliable than average length of sentence is in each case. [71323] they used to be, but I still do not have total confidence in them, and I would certainly never make forecasts The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice with them because crime trends are very difficult to (Mr Crispin Blunt): Between 2006 and 2010, 109 people predict. However, I am glad that success has been were sentenced for human trafficking offences, with an achieved in Sunderland on reoffending, which we propose average determinate custodial sentence length of 50 months, to make the prime focus of our policy: punish offenders and 254,980 people were sentenced for drug-related effectively and, at the same time, try to stop them offences, with an average determinate custodial sentence offending again. length of 32 months. The average determinate custodial sentence length for trafficking for sexual exploitation T2. [71332] Sajid Javid (Bromsgrove) (Con): In was 50 months; in the case of trafficking for forced Worcestershire, we have had persistent problems with labour, it was 51 months, and in the case of drug Travellers who refuse to respect the law. My fellow MPs trafficking, it was 73.5 months. in the county have recently written to the Justice Secretary with some suggestions about that, and I know that he is Mr Bone: I think that the House will agree that there considering them. Does he agree that we should help is a bit of difference between the figures for human Travellers to preserve their way of life—their travelling trafficking and for drug-related offences, yet the two way of life—by moving them on? crimes—human trafficking and drug offences—are very difficult for the victims. We should surely rebalance the Mr Clarke: This is a difficult subject, and it certainly criminal justice system to ensure that more traffickers needs to be looked at all the time. I agree: my experience are caught. I know that the Government have produced in my part of the world is that many Travellers do not their human trafficking strategy, but there is a terrible travel as frequently as they are supposed to, and they imbalance at the moment. are fond of occupying vacant land and building houses on it, while still describing themselves as Travellers. The Mr Blunt: I am grateful to my hon. Friend, and I subject is more complex than that, and if we can make thank him for his energetic chairmanship of the all-party any improvements to the law that protect the legitimate group on human trafficking, and for continuing to interests of society as a whole we will certainly do so. bring the issues to my attention. Trafficking drugs and people are both extremely serious offences, and when Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): Last week, people are caught—obviously, we want to make sure the Under-Secretary of State for Justice, the hon. Member that they are, on every conceivable occasion—they should for Huntingdon (Mr Djanogly), defended the Government’s serve an appropriately serious tariff. narrow definition of domestic violence in the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill with Mr Speaker: I am grateful to the Minister both for his these words: succinctness and his control of his breathing, which was “We are concerned that to include admission to a refuge in the impressive. criteria would be to rely on self-reporting…We are not persuaded that medical professionals would be best placed to assess whether Topical Questions domestic violence has occurred. Although they may witness injuries…nor would the fact of a police investigation without T1. [71331] Bridget Phillipson (Houghton and Sunderland more evidence provide sufficient evidence”.––[Official Report, South) (Lab): If he will make a statement on his Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Public Bill departmental responsibilities. Committee, 6 September 2011; c. 359-60.] Women in this country will be appalled by those remarks. The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice Would the Under-Secretary like to take them back, and (Mr Kenneth Clarke): I begin by making a topical also change his definition in the Bill? statement, Mr Speaker, controlling my breathing carefully as I do. Last week, as well as announcing plans to allow The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice cameras into courts, I outlined plans to open up the (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): It is not a question of taking justice system by publishing unprecedented local data. them back; it is a question of making them in a very We will publish data on court performance, sentencing transparent way in our consultation. Having looked at and reoffending, and provide information on what happens the consultation, we came back and reassessed the next following a crime, alongside street-level crime data. definition of domestic violence, broadened what is included, That will allow people to see how the criminal justice and we are prepared to debate it in Committee. That is system operates in their area. We will also encourage the process that is under way, and the Government consistent publication of the names of offenders unlawfully stand by that. at large; that will help in apprehending them and returning them to custody. Those measures will place the crime T4. [71334] Elizabeth Truss (South West Norfolk) (Con): and justice sector at the forefront of the Government’s I fully support the plans to introduce television policy on transparency. cameras in courts to improve transparency. What plans are there to improve transparency in the Prison Service Bridget Phillipson: We have seen real success across so that we can see exactly what work and activity have Sunderland in reducing reoffending year on year. Of been undertaken in each prison so that justice can be course, more needs to be done to tackle that, but it has seen to be done? 889 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 890

Mr Kenneth Clarke: We intend to apply exactly the Mr Djanogly: I will meet my hon. Friend. The court same policy in all sensible ways to the prison system closed in April this year and Her Majesty’s Courts and generally as far as is practicable. We publish more Tribunals Service is progressing the disposal of the figures all the time about reoffending rates and we will courthouse. As part of that process it is due to meet certainly be open about our success in extending the officials from both Cambridgeshire district council and policy of providing more worthwhile working opportunities Fenland district council later this month. for prisoners, because getting them back into the habit of work is one way of getting them to live as responsible T7. [71337] Angela Smith (Penistone and Stocksbridge) citizens in a normal society. (Lab): In the aftermath of the riots that so rocked the country last month, what lessons does the Justice T3. [71333] Barbara Keeley (Worsley and Eccles South) Secretary think can be learned about the need to (Lab): Using a restricted definition of domestic violence, respond swiftly to public outrage at the actions of a as discussed a moment ago, will penalise victims of lawless minority, balanced with the need to deliver domestic violence, many of whom suffer for long periods justice? before they begin to report incidents to the police. Will the Minister, given that he appears to be in some Mr Kenneth Clarke: We obviously have to study the difficulty over this, consider meeting organisations working events closely, looking for any lessons we can learn from on domestic violence to work out how to make that recent experience. More and more facts will come to definition work? light, upon which we can base firm conclusions. The Mr Djanogly: I have met organisations and we have question that the hon. Lady raises about the rapidity of consulted on the issue. I am always prepared to meet the response in the early days to the first threats to organisations. I have to tell the hon. Lady that the key public order and to citizens is not primarily for my issue is having tests that are objective, and that is what Department, but I know that the Home Office is taking we are trying to achieve. it extremely seriously. It is easy with hindsight to criticise operational decisions. What is important is looking to T6. [71336] Laura Sandys (South Thanet) (Con): Does see how we can improve the response in the future. the Minister agree that it is a scandal that so many drugs are swilling around prisons? It is crucial that we Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con): Is it ensure that those who arrive in prison clean do not not bizarre that many Travellers originate in Ireland? leave as addicts. The Irish Government changed their law, so now the Travellers have moved to England. In his review, will the The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice Justice Secretary learn from how the Human Rights (Mr Crispin Blunt): I completely agree with my hon. Act in Ireland does not prevent Travellers from being Friend. Some 55% of those entering prison have been moved on? reported to have a serious drug problem, and 64% in a recent survey had used drugs in the previous month, Mr Clarke: I agree that there is a problem. Let us be which gives a sense of the scale of the problem. My clear. Travellers, like anybody else, are entitled to the hon. Friend is absolutely right: we must use all means protection of the law and are also subject to the law. We possible, in a multi-faceted way, to address the problem, have to deal with Travellers on the basis of how they and provide safe places in prison, at the very least, for behave, not start going against them as a class. But we those attempting to recover from drug addiction, which have to look at how the operation of the law at present is why we are beginning to develop drug recovery wings. is enabling people to lead a somewhat odd way of life which is totally at variance with that which is led by the T5. [71335] Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): There rest of the population, and to seek to disregard laws to are 66 people in Bolton and more than 10,000 across which everybody else is subject. I am not sure that the the UK who are still driving with more than 12 points Human Rights Act and human rights legislation generally on their driving licence. Many are repeat offenders of is terribly relevant, but if it gets drawn in, we will look the offences of speeding and driving without insurance and see what it can do to help with the case. and have more than 20 points. Is there a problem with the legislation or are judges being too lenient? Will the T8. [71338] Bill Esterson (Sefton Central) (Lab): The Secretary of State investigate? Government cancelled the building of the Maghull prison after work had already started. Will the Lord Mr Kenneth Clarke: I think the answer is that we will Chancellor take this opportunity to tell my constituents investigate. I am grateful to the hon. Lady for the what plans he has for the site, to allay their concerns figures. They sound astonishing, so I look forward to about the Maghull prison site and nearby greenfield her providing me with sufficient details for myself and projects, which developers are eyeing up? my ministerial team to find out what lies behind them.

T9. [71339] Stephen Barclay (North East Cambridgeshire) Mr Blunt: I am grateful for that detailed question (Con): The building that formerly housed Wisbech from the hon. Gentleman. I will write to him with a full magistrates court is owned by the Ministry of Justice answer. and is in a prime site next to the historic port in Wisbech and a couple of yards from a conference Mrs Helen Grant (Maidstone and The Weald) (Con): centre. Will my hon. Friend the Minister meet me to Does the Minister agree that prison is not the right discuss how we best use the site for regeneration so that place for women who pose no risk to the public, and it does not get locked in the stalemate that there has that robust community sentences would be a much been with the police service locally? better option? 891 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 892

Mr Kenneth Clarke: It depends on what they have Does the Minister agree that that is wholly unacceptable done for which they have to be punished. I do not think and that a much quicker process is needed in order to that prison is the right place for people who pose no risk resolve some of the cases relating to special needs? to the public, but if they have done something heinous, they have to be punished in a way that the public regard Mr Djanogly: If my hon. Friend would like to write as proportionate to the crime. We are paying considerable to me, I will look into that. attention to the problem of women in prisons. There are too many. The combination of problems is sometimes Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): Can the Secretary quite specific, and in many cases there are multiple of State inform the House what efforts he is making to problems. Anything that can sensibly be done to improve ensure that sentencing policy and practice is consistent the way we handle women prisoners, with proper regard to across all parts of the United Kingdom for rioters, and punishment and the protection of the public, we will do. that rioters in Rasharkin and Belfast who try to kill police officers and damage property will face the same T10. [71340] Gregg McClymont (Cumbernauld, Kilsyth swift, certain and good judgment faced by rioters in and Kirkintilloch East) (Lab): Further to the question England? raised by the hon. Member for Brighton, Pavilion (Caroline Lucas), without legal aid or Government Mr Kenneth Clarke: I realise that our fellow citizens financial backing for the fee arrangements, how can we in Ulster have unfortunately had just as much experience ensure that overseas victims of alleged human rights of rioting as some of our British cities have. Among the abuses by UK multinational companies get justice? many things that we must look at when we get the full facts about the very good response of our courts and Mr Clarke: They have the jurisdiction. Britain entertains criminal justice system to the recent English riots is how these personal injuries cases, these actions in tort, against it compares with the experience in Northern Ireland. I multinational companies that have an adequate presence agree with the hon. Gentleman that there should be here in a perfectly open way, but it is still necessary for some general consistency of approach, with swift and the costs of a case to be proportionate to the claim. We firm justice, particularly when rioting is taking place, do not want people coming here and bringing their because it stops people imitating it and lessens the cases in British courts because the costs available to the likelihood that the disorder will spread. lawyers greatly exceed those which could be attained by bringing similar cases in other jurisdictions. Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD): On the subject of payment by results, what guarantee can George Eustice (Camborne and Redruth) (Con): Does Ministers give that small providers will win some contracts the Secretary of State agree that we need to do more to and that small and large providers will have to make curb the compensation culture in this country and that information about their performance publicly available? one way of doing so would be to ensure that plaintiffs incur some form of financial risk in bringing their case so that they focus their minds on the merits of their Mr Blunt: Of course, anyone who is going to deliver case? payment by results would be crazy not to engage the voluntary and charitable sector as part of their delivery Mr Clarke: I am glad to say that I agree with my hon. mechanism. Some of those charities will not have the Friend’s every word. There is a compensation culture. resources to be able to underwrite payment-by-results We are taking practical steps to get it back to common schemes, but the prime provider would be mad not to sense. engage those services.

Meg Munn (Sheffield, Heeley) (Lab/Co-op): The John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington) (Lab): The Secretary of State has stated his commitment to Government are currently consulting on the criminalisation rehabilitation as a priority. Probation officers are key to of squatting. Has the Secretary of State seen the report this. They often need highly developed skills, particularly “The Hidden Truth about Homelessness”, produced by when working with violent offenders and sex offenders. the housing charity Crisis, which reveals that 39% of Is he committed not only to maintaining levels of vulnerable homeless people have at some stage resorted funding for probation officers, but increasing it in order to squatting to find a roof over their heads, and has he to continue the downward trend in crime that continued made an assessment of how the proposals he is putting under a Labour Government? forward will affect homeless people?

Mr Blunt: As the hon. Lady very well knows, we are Mr Blunt: The consultation will end on 5 October, having to manage a 23% reduction in our budget over and I will of course be looking at all the reports and the next four years in order to make the Ministry of responses to it, including the one from Crisis. Justice’s contribution to rescuing the nation’s finances. Sadly, probation services, like other elements, are not Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con): The Secretary of State exempt from this. However, for the reasons she has was good enough to accept on Second Reading of the given, they have been relatively protected under the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders spending review. We will of course continue to look for Bill that people who served indeterminate sentences for all available efficiency savings wherever we can, but the public protection had a very low reoffending rate, despite output of probation is very important. the fact that 29% of them have more than 15 convictions. Given that people with indeterminate sentences are in Alun Cairns (Vale of Glamorgan) (Con): An appeal prison for manslaughter, other homicide, rape, robbery, to the special educational needs and disability tribunal arson and other violent crimes, why does he want to let listed today will not be heard until late February 2012. them out? 893 Oral Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 894

Mr Kenneth Clarke: I made some cautious remarks a will apply from 18 January 2010, as originally proposed little earlier about criminal justice statistics. There is a by the previous Labour Government? very small number of people on indeterminate sentences who have ever been released, and I am very glad that Mr Clarke: I do not want to trail parts of the there has been a low level of reoffending. announcement that we will make when we are able to We are committed to ending that system. We have start the consultation, but I do remember very clearly 3,500 people who have finished their normal sentence—that that that was the commitment upon which everybody is, the tariff—and are unable to satisfy the Parole Board has been firmly proceeding. that they can be released, but we are looking at all those Several hon. Members rose— cases to find the best possible way of ensuring that the bulk of them do not reoffend. Some of them always Mr Speaker: Order. I do apologise to colleagues will, however, and we cannot avoid that. whom I have not been able to accommodate. I could listen to the Secretary of State all day—and indeed all Mr David Hanson (Delyn) (Lab): On the question of night for that matter. An additional session should be compensation for overseas terrorism, will the Secretary put on precisely perhaps for that purpose, but today I of State confirm that any scheme eventually brought in am afraid that we must move on. 895 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 896

Points of Order Motor Insurance Regulation Motion for leave to bring in a Bill (Standing Order 3.35 pm No. 23) Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab): On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am not sure whether I concur with your 3.39 pm last remarks, but I am sure that since noon on Monday Mr Jack Straw (Blackburn) (Lab): I beg to move, you have been considering your own boundary That leave be given to bring in a Bill to reform the regulation recommendations, as indeed have many other English and operation of the market in motor insurance; and specifically, Members of Parliament. Unfortunately, at the moment to ban the payment of referral fees; to establish new standards it is impossible to go to the Vote Office and get copies of relating to the evidence required and damages payable for whiplash; the boundary recommendations for the whole United to reform the Pre-Action Protocol for Personal Injury Claims in Kingdom. In fact, in the House of Lords they are not Road Traffic Accidents; to set requirements in respect of risk available at all. Can I suggest to you that it might be a pricing for personal injury claims; and for connected purposes. good idea if the draft recommendations were available The last time I had a ten-minute rule Bill was as a in the Vote Office, so that the whole of this House might young and callow Back Bencher— consider them, come to a firm view—and, I hope, reject them? Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab): You still are, Jack. Mr Speaker: The hon. Gentleman asks whether he Mr Straw: Thank you. can suggest that. He can, he has done. I do listen, I have That was in April 1980, with my Police Authorities listened on this occasion, and he is proving himself, as (Powers) Bill. Successive Home Secretaries were ever, the candid friend. I will make inquiries into the unpersuaded by the merits of my proposals until a new matter and try to ensure that satisfaction is provided. Home Secretary took over 17 years later, in May 1997, That would be a very happy state of affairs. and progressively implemented most of the Bill. Jack Dromey (Birmingham, Erdington) (Lab): On a The contrast between the fate of that first Bill and the point of order, Mr Speaker. The Government have now fate of the Bill before the House today could not be made a number of misleading statements about their more stark. Even before I had had this opportunity to increasingly chaotic planning reforms. Last week the move it, the Government announced last Friday that Minister of State, Department for Communities and they were accepting one of the fundamental propositions Local Government, the right hon. Member for Tunbridge of the Bill—the abolition of referral fees. The problems Wells (Greg Clark) told Parliament that the previous in the insurance market are, let me say, not of this Government’s successful “brownfield first”policy, whereby Government’s making. As I have already expressed previously developed land was to be prioritised before during Question Time, I am very grateful to the Justice building on greenfield land was considered, had been Secretary and his Ministers for recognising the need for retained. The Government’s own impact assessment in change, and to the backers of this Bill from across the the national planning policy framework, however, makes House in giving momentum to the campaign that I have it clear that the brownfield first presumption has been been mounting. Although there has been that welcome abolished. In addition, the Minister has been describing announcement by the Government, which will implement the policy as a “national ban”, when he knows that it is a key recommendation of the Jackson report, there are nothing of the kind. Has the right hon. Gentleman other necessary reforms that my Bill covers and which I indicated his intention to come before the House to put hope the Government will also adopt. right his misleading statements, and to explain to the First, let me spell out the concerns that exist in all House why priority is not once again being given to parties about the wholly unacceptable state of the motor using brownfield land, of which there is enough to build insurance market. In the past year alone there has been 1.2 million homes on? a 40% increase in the average premiums paid by Britain’s motorists to insure their cars. Youngdrivers face premiums Mr Speaker: I am sorry to disappoint the hon. of £2,500 or more, even if they can find underwriters to Gentleman, but the Minister in question has given no cover their risk. Older drivers with impeccable records such indication. That said, I am grateful to the hon. who live in certain urban areas have been especially Member for Birmingham, Erdington (Jack Dromey) hard hit. for notice of his point of order. I am always concerned The principal factor behind these rocketing premiums that the House should be given accurate information. I has been an extraordinary increase in the number and hope that he and the House will understand that it is value of claims for personal injuries—but this increase not really for the Speaker to compare the accuracy of in personal injury claims has in no sense been caused by remarks inside the House with that of those made any commensurate increase in the number of accidents outside, let alone to offer an assessment of the relative leading to such injuries. Indeed, the number of accidents merits or accuracy of comments that might appear on has been going down, not up. Britain’s roads, long websites. I am sure that the hon. Gentleman, who is among the safest in the world, have been getting safer nothing if not the proverbial woodpecker in these mattes, still, with fewer accidents and, where accidents do occur, will seek advice from the Table Office on the ways in fewer serious injuries. Those improvements have been which he can pursue his concerns. paralleled by a dramatic drop in the number of thefts of If there are no further points of order, we come to the and from vehicles. ten-minute rule Bill, for which the right hon. Member Instead, the increase in claims has been artificially for Blackburn (Mr Straw) has been patiently waiting. generated by a new industry, unheard of 20 years ago—a “claims industry”—with, I am afraid, the complicity of the insurance companies themselves. Claims management 897 Motor Insurance Regulation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Motor Insurance Regulation 898

[Mr Straw] injury has been suffered. Clause 2 provides for the need for such objective evidence. No one who has genuinely companies, personal injury lawyers, credit hire companies suffered an injury would be in any way disadvantaged and repair and recovery firms have built a lucrative and by the provisions in the Bill. self-serving merry-go-round in which the personal In my Blackburn constituency, and in many other information of anyone involved in any collision with constituencies, there are law firms with banners outside another vehicle, no matter how trivial its effects, is their offices promising £650 in cash in return for any traded like a commodity, typically for £600 to £800 a new personal injury claim. They can make those promises shot, with the aim of pursuing a claim—any claim— and pay out because the flat fee that insurers pay the provided that it brings rich rewards to all those involved lawyers for claims below £10,000 has been set too high. in this industry. Such claims are now processed through an electronic Some police and NHS employees have been unlawfully portal, which costs the law firm no more than £100 in engaged in this trade. Some police authorities have staff time to operate. The flat fee is £1,200, so even if a officially been charging recovery firms to pass on firm pays a £650 introduction fee it can make exorbitant information about drivers and vehicles involved in accidents; profits. Clause 3 would cut the fee in half. one such made over £1.3 million in two years. I can also I will now deal with the fourth provision in the Bill. tell the House that some NHS acute trusts have been Honest law-abiding drivers in my constituency, and in making money from this so-called industry, charging many similar urban areas, especially in the north and ambulance-chasing lawyers to advertise their services to the midlands, have faced even higher increases in premiums patients waiting in accident and emergency departments. than most drivers, despite their impeccable driving records I have here data which show that since 2006, in aggregate, and inherent low risk of a future claim. That is because 70 NHS acute trusts have received £2 million in this of postcode discrimination by insurers. Such practices way. As the Information Commissioner, Mr Christopher do not harm those involved in the rackets, but they do Graham, told the Justice Committee this morning, data harm entirely innocent people. Clause 4 would prohibit protection and telecommunication laws are routinely insurers from isolating the level of risk arising from broken by this claims industry as firms cold call, harass personal injury claims in an area smaller than Wales, or and browbeat individuals whose details they have purchased a standard English region. into pursuing claims. There are other measures that need to be taken Often such claims are for whiplash, which is not so alongside this Bill. There is already provision on the much an injury, more a profitable invention of the statute book for tougher custodial sentences for selling human imagination—undiagnosable except by third-rate and trading in data contrary to section 55 of the Data doctors in the pay of the claims management companies Protection Act 1998. Those provisions, in the Criminal or personal injury lawyers. Whiplash now accounts for Justice and Immigration Act 2008, should be brought 80% of all personal injury claims, adding about £66 to into force without delay. The prosecuting authorities every premium. Latest figures suggest that 1,200 claims should consider whether criminal proceedings under for whiplash are now made in the United Kingdom the Bribery Act 2010 should be instituted against some each day. The bait of £3,500 in compensation for no of the worst abuses, as the Bar Council has suggested. discernible injury and sometimes for no accident at all, All the regulators—not just the Information Commissioner which features so prominently in the text messages, who, commendably, is seeking to do so—must toughen telephone calls and high-pressure advertising, characterises up their approach. this extensive and grubby industry. The changes in my Bill would make a significant Driving out the parasitic practitioners and cleaning difference for Britain’s hard-pressed motorists. The insurance up the motor insurance system will be complex and will companies would have to start stabilising their premiums take time. I suggest to the House that my Bill would and, as their costs came down, would have to reduce make an important start. Clause 1 would make it unlawful their premiums. I commend the Bill to the House. to solicit, offer or pay a referral fee relating to a personal injury road traffic claim, although I would like to see Question put and agreed to. that extended across the piece. Breach would be a Ordered, criminal offence. That, in my view, is the only way to stamp out this unethical and unwholesome practice. I That Mr Jack Straw, Sir Alan Beith, Sir Peter Bottomley, was pleased to hear earlier from the Lord Chancellor Steve McCabe, Graham Jones, Penny Mordaunt and that he accepts that view. Mr David Ward present the Bill. Clause 2 deals with whiplash. Some jurisdictions Mr Jack Straw accordingly presented the Bill. abroad restrict the payment of damages for whiplash to Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on claims where there is clear objective evidence that real Friday 20 January 2012, and to be printed (Bill 229). 899 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 900

Today, the Opposition are asking the House to focus Opposition Day on things that the Government should and should not have done, but let us be clear: the challenges did not [20TH ALLOTTED DAY] suddenly emerge from a blue sky at the last election. The Minister for Universities and Science advocates the Opportunities for the Next Generation view that over decades, the older generation has in some way stolen the future from young people, and that we 3.49 pm have so rigged the rules of the game throughout our lives that the young have only half a chance—I apologise Mr John Denham (Southampton, Itchen) (Lab): I beg if I paraphrase cruelly. We hear similar views across the to move, political spectrum. Whether or not we share them—I That this House believes that young people face a more uncertain have very strong reservations—it is clear that the generation future which may not offer the increased opportunities and now in power has a huge responsibility to young people, prosperity enjoyed by their parents and their grandparents; notes that, following the Government’s decision to cut public spending and that the changes that are needed in our economy too far and too fast, it has targeted young people with cuts, and society are profound. Those changes will take resulting in nearly one million young people not in education, leadership, which Labour will offer, over many years. employment or training; further notes with concern that there However, I would not be doing young people any were no university places for around 100,000 applicants this year, favours if I pretended that it was only in the past year that tuition fees are trebling, university places will be cut next year and many universities will lose popular courses; highlights that that everything had gone wrong. the proportion of apprenticeship places for 16 to 18 year olds has decreased by 11 per cent., new apprenticeships are providing Mr John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con): In his motion, mainly short-term training for older workers, the Future Jobs the right hon. Gentleman states that one problem is that Fund has been scrapped, the apprenticeship guarantee abandoned, the Government have cut Education Maintenance Allowance ended, homelessness has risen “too far and too fast”, and homebuilding is at a 90-year low; believes the Government must take action to secure business growth to create opportunities but in their first year they increased spending by 5.3%, for young people; resolves that the Government should repeat the or £32 billion, and every extra pound that they spent bank bonus levy to create over 100,000 jobs through a youth jobs was, of course, borrowed. How much extra would he fund, to build 25,000 affordable homes and to support business have wanted to spend? through increased funding for the Regional Growth Fund; calls on the Government to expand apprenticeships for young people and to ensure that public sector contractors offer apprenticeships; Mr Denham: We know that the Government aim to and further calls on the Government to enact a temporary VAT cut sufficiently fast to eliminate the deficit in four years. cut to boost consumer spending, business confidence and support Our judgment was that the right balance between dealing the UK’s high streets. with the deficit and sustaining jobs and growth would The motion is in my name and those of my right hon. be to halve the deficit over a similar period. That allows Friend the Member for Leigh (Andy Burnham) and us to say not that there would never be any cuts in others. I thank the Minister for Further Education, public expenditure, but that there would be a very Skills and Lifelong Learning, who has given his apologies different trajectory to public spending. For reasons that for his absence this afternoon, which is for understandable I will give, that difference of choice would have made a reasons. I see that the Secretary of State for Business, big difference to the young people of this country. Innovation and Skills is not here to answer the debate; I have acknowledged that some of the problems are he seems to be curiously reluctant to answer when I deep-seated and long-term, but today’s Opposition day introduce Opposition day debates, but no doubt he is debates focus critical attention on the Government’s trying to work out how to be selected as the coalition actions. The charge is clear: the Government’s economic candidate for Richmond at the next election. policy has directly made the lives and prospects of We British people have always been confident that young people worse. They have not hit young people each new generation will do better than their parents along with everyone else; they have chosen—I think and their grandparents. There have been wars and economic “chosen” is the right word—to single out young people crises, and individual families have had their ups and and to make their lives and prospects worse. downs, but what my right hon. Friend the leader of the Labour party calls “the promise of Britain” has held Alok Sharma (Reading West) (Con): Yesterday the true. Parents have been able to say, “Our children have shadow Chancellor came to the House and, for the first had more opportunities, a better education and a higher time in 15 months, apologised for Labour’s mistakes. standard of living than we had.” Are we going to have an apology from the right hon. However, Members on both sides of the House will Gentleman today for the fact that social mobility has know that confidence in that British promise has never fallen and attainment in schools has declined by been more shaky, knowing that the average age of a international standards? By just about every measure, first-time buyer is approaching 40, and that there are young people suffered under the Labour Government. 1 million young people not in employment, education or training. At the same time, we have all heard young Mr Denham: We will have the opportunity in a few people asking whether the cost of a degree is worth it, moments to see whether that last claim is accurate, and what the alternative would be. We have all heard although I think that the hon. Gentleman might be parents asking how this country will pay its way in a disappointed. On the question of apologies, though, we fiercely competitive world, and what young people will did not hear yesterday an apology from the Conservative do. Only a quarter of parents and grandparents questioned party for urging the Labour Government to deregulate by YouGov believed that their young would be better further and faster in the financial services sector. The off than they were. right hon. Member for Wokingham (Mr Redwood) was 901 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 902

[Mr Denham] to cut spending too far and too fast, they decided to target young people, and they did it recklessly and one of those producing Conservative party policy without thought or heeding the evidence. They ended documents in that vein. I think that we should hear a education maintenance awards without understanding little honesty from the governing party. how important they were. As the Education Committee wrote: Mr Redwood: Will the right hon. Gentleman give “The Government should have done more to acknowledge the way? combined impact on students’ participation, attainment and retention, particularly amongst disadvantaged sub-groups, before determining Mr Denham: I will have to give way on that point. how to restructure financial support.” They got that wrong, and young people who want to Mr Redwood: As the right hon. Gentleman should stay on will suffer. know by now, the report that I co-authored stated Advice and guidance to young people is essential. clearly that the Government needed to regulate the cash The Government are wrecking the careers services—but and capital of the banks more strongly than they did. that is the subject of the second debate today. Labour’s Had they done that, they would have been in a much future jobs fund had a simple aim: to prevent a destructive better place. rise in long-term youth unemployment during the recession. All unemployment hurts, but long-term youth Mr Denham: But the problem did not come from the unemployment has the longest, most corrosive effect on cash or the capital; it came from the complex financial its victims. And the future jobs fund worked. When it instruments that were not being properly regulated, as started, the number of those not in employment, education we discussed yesterday. However, I am trying your or training fell by more than 200,000. The current patience, Mr Speaker, so perhaps I should make some Prime Minister praised it when in opposition, but after progress. the election it was scrapped, and nothing effective has The Government have chosen to single out young taken its place. In the past year, the number of NEETs people and make their lives and prospects worse. In rose by more than 100,000, with 119,000 19 to 24-year-olds June I visited the Bombardier factory in Derby and talked not doing anything productive. to three young apprentices. I asked them how they saw their future in the company. “To go as far as we can,” Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con): Will the right hon. said one. Mr Colin Walton, the chief executive officer, Gentleman acknowledge that, although there were 90,000 used to be an apprentice. That is what the promise of starts under the future jobs fund between October 2009 Britain was all about: if someone wanted to get on, they and January 2011, the analysis of the Department for could. We all know what happened, though. The Work and Pensions from March this year shows that Government missed the chance to reopen the Thameslink half the young people involved were back on the dole contract, despite the many changed circumstances. It just seven months later? was a disastrous failure of will and responsibility, and the dreams of those apprentices now hang by a thread. Mr Denham: I am proud of the effectiveness of my The decision to tackle the deficit by cutting spending Government’s policies in tackling long-term youth too far and too fast has had predictable results. The unemployment. The experience of having nothing to do economy was growing a year ago, but today it is choking. has a lasting effect on people’s careers, incomes and aspirations up to 20 years after the event, and we Mr David Evennett (Bexleyheath and Crayford) (Con) succeeded in tackling that throughout our period in rose— office from 1997. The reality is that that this Government have scrapped the future jobs fund and, far from introducing Mr Denham: And the hon. Gentleman will explain anything better, have put nothing effective in its place. why. The effects of that on young people are all too clear.

Mr Evennett: I will if I get an opportunity to speak Stella Creasy (Walthamstow) (Lab/Co-op): Does my later, Mr Speaker. I always listen to the right hon. right hon. Friend agree that the Government’s contempt Gentleman with great interest, but he is rewriting the for young people is illustrated by the fact that the Work history of the Labour Government of which he was a and Pensions Select Committee has pointed out the member. The present Government have increased the lack of evidence for the decision to scrap the future jobs number of apprenticeships dramatically. I would like to fund and called into question the value for money of refresh his memory: in May 1997 there were 664,000 the decision? The Government did not know what they unemployed 16 to 24-year-olds, but that had increased were doing to our young people. to 924,000 by May 2010. Is that not an indictment of the failure of the Labour Government of which he was Mr Denham: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The a member to manage affairs and to help young people truth is that it was more important for this arrogant and apprentices to get the jobs that they needed? Government to scrap something because it was a Labour scheme than to look at whether it was working not. But Mr Denham: I will deal directly with both those issues it is not the Labour party that has paid the price; it is in due course, if the hon. Gentleman will have patience. young people up and down the country. Every family is suffering, but young people are paying a particularly heavy price. Young people in Britain Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): Does the right today are not accidental victims of the cuts; what is hon. Gentleman accept that the scrapping of the education happening to them is not some collateral damage of maintenance allowance, the apprenticeships fund and Treasury policy. When the Government drew up plans the future jobs fund is having a more pronounced effect 903 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 904 in the regions of the United Kingdom? In my constituency, Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op): Does for example, 19,000 young people aged 16 and above do my right hon. Friend agree that the key choice in cutting not have employment. Does he accept that this loss of the deficit is the balance between growth and cuts? If benefits and opportunities is having a much more the cuts reduce our capacity to grow, as do the cuts pronounced effect there than it is having even here in to the future jobs fund and in proper apprenticeships, England? they will be completely counter-productive and economically illiterate. Mr Denham: The hon. Gentleman speaks with great authority about his constituency. Mr Denham: My hon. Friend is absolutely right, but It is a tragedy that the importance that was attached there is a further point. The refusal to link Government to young people and to avoiding long-term unemployment, procurement to the provision of apprenticeships has from the new deal onwards, has disappeared under this nothing to do with the deficit. It is wrong policy. The Government. Too many people are being pushed to the Government could take that action whatever their deficit edges of the labour market, where there are too few reduction strategy, but they refuse to do so. It is not just opportunities for them. Many parents, and young people, about the deficit; it is about missed opportunities. want apprenticeships. Labour rescued and rebuilt I am pleased to say that after what could be called a apprenticeships. There were fewer than 70,000 a year cock-up—I hope it is not an unparliamentary term—by when we took office, but the figure had increased to the Government Whips, Labour’s call for green nearly 280,000 in the last year of the Labour Government, apprenticeships is now in the Energy Bill, and it looks and those apprenticeships were more credible and successful as though it will stay there. One bit of Government will than those that had gone before. Again, however, the be doing the right thing, thanks to Labour, but more new Government were keener to rubbish our record than £200 billion of public procurement—taxpayers’ than to get their own plans right. money—could be working harder by providing I have to say that, on paper, it is hard to fault the apprenticeships. ambitions that the new Government set out: now, however, the truth is coming through. The great growth in Mr Stewart Jackson (Peterborough) (Con): The shadow apprenticeships has turned out to involve short-term Chancellor apologised yesterday for some aspects of training courses for adults. There is nothing wrong with Labour policy, so will the right hon. Gentleman take training adults, but it is certainly not what most people the opportunity to apologise for the previous Government think of as an apprenticeship, and it certainly does not reckless immigration policy, whereby people were imported provide new opportunities for young people. The proportion into low-skill and low-wage jobs, pushing many thousands of apprenticeships for 16 to 18-year-olds has actually of unskilled youngsters into welfare dependency? fallen. We need, but are not getting, longer apprenticeships in high-end technical subjects that are necessary to spur Mr Denham: I was very pleased that we ended unskilled growth; we need electrical, mechanical and construction immigration from outside the EU and introduced a apprenticeships. points-based migration system. I think the real issue now is the damage being done in higher and further James Morris (Halesowen and Rowley Regis) (Con): education, for example, to the country’s economic prospects I visited a forging business in Cradley Heath in my by restricting universities’ ability to offer courses that constituency on Friday. For the first time in five years, it attract high-paying overseas students. has taken on an apprentice from a local college. It is The point I was making a few moments ago was that offering a high-quality, high-tech apprenticeship to that the failures in apprenticeship policy have nothing to do young person, who will be able to develop the skills to with deficit reduction. They were calculated decisions get a high value-added job in the future. That is what is that harmed young people, as, indeed, did the decision happening as a result of Government policy. to let fees treble. That is why too many students and parents are now asking whether it is still worth going to Mr Denham: I applaud that company and those university.That policy was not required by deficit reduction. apprenticeships. That is a story that is being repeated in If higher education had been cut in line with other my constituency, but it was being repeated three or four public services, fees would have risen to less than £4,000 years ago as well. The myth is that the situation has a year. This summer, more than 100,000 determined, been transformed overnight. We are presented with hard-working and qualified students could not get a some impressive headline statistics, but close analysis university place. The first action of the new Government suggests that we are not getting an expansion of the was to stop 10,000 new places Labour had planned for high-quality opportunities that our young people and last September. Another 10,000 places will go next year. the economy need. Teaching and nursing places, too, will be cut. If the If the Government really had confidence in what they students who missed out this year get a place next year, were doing, they would not have scrapped Labour’s they will pay a £15,000 lifetime penalty for having guarantee of an apprenticeship for every qualified school missed out this year. leaver. They have also refused to require Government All this has happened because the Government lost contractors to provide apprenticeships. In the past, that control of fees, with most universities wanting to charge guarantee meant that investment in social housing also £9,000, so they are now introducing a bizarre auction to involved investment in training young construction workers. cut fees at the expense of quality. Those students who The Minister for Housing and Local Government described apply next year will find not only that they are paying that policy as “ridiculous” and “counter-productive”, higher fees and that fewer places are available, but that while the Minister for the Cabinet Office said that it many of the popular courses they thought about getting “wouldn’t be appropriate”. on to this year do not even exist. Over the next three 905 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 906

[Mr Denham] regulation lets good companies win new markets; and to build, in every region and nation, the universities, the years, 60,000 places will be taken from popular courses skills, the banking services and the leadership in cities and popular universities and given to cheaper providers— and regions that will let companies grow and create irrespective of whether students want to study them. jobs. A degree is a good thing to get, but recent reports have highlighted the difficulties too many graduates Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): Does my experience in getting a job, particularly one that rewards right hon. Friend think that the Secretary of State is their effort in today’s sluggish economy. That is not absent from this debate because he realises that, despite because we have too many graduates, but because the his many university qualifications, he is about to lose economy is creating too few challenging, demanding his job because of the democracy reduction Bill that the and high-value posts. Instead of being plunged into the Government have imposed and the fact that his constituency chaos of the last year and next, universities should have is about to disappear? Is it not symbolic that this been given one priority—to play their full role in creating Government reduce by 50 the number of MPs and in growth, getting their knowledge, research and skills into every sector of the economy they are reducing employment the businesses and companies of the future. That is as we speak? Sadly, the Secretary of State himself is what a Government with a single-minded focus on jobs included in that, but he did vote for it, so what one and growth would have done, but it is where the BIS reaps, one sows. Department, too, is failing young people and the country as a whole. Mr Denham: I have already made a passing remark about the Secretary of State’s role, but let me just say Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab): Does my right that I have tried to set out briefly the sort of lead we hon. Friend agree that it is perverse that, at the very should be getting from the Department for Business, time a generation of students are about to go to university Innovation and Skills. Active, intelligent government and pay huge tuition fees, setting themselves up for working with business is what we need to transform the decades of debt, they see people who made that choice shape of our economy, but all we are getting is the same three or four years ago leaving university with a degree, dogmatic argument: “Government should do less. It but no opportunities to move into? should do less in the regions, less in investment, less in research, less in working with business.” Our young Mr Denham: There is a huge responsibility on the people will pay a heavy price for that. Government to respond to my hon. Friend’s challenge—to take the measures necessary, get growth going, create Alok Sharma: The right hon. Gentleman is leaving jobs and reshape our economy so that we can pay our the House with the impression that the Labour Government way in the world in the future and make the full use of left this country with a golden legacy in dealing with the talents of young people and, indeed, older people in businesses. Let me remind him that his party was talking this country. I say that because there will not be about putting up corporation tax and was imposing opportunities for young people unless we build an economy such a level of regulation on businesses that they just that can compete with the best in the world. could not cope, and that we were left with the most The truth is that we had to wait a year for a growth complex tax system in the world. Is that what he calls plan and it was so weak and useless that it is already “government working with business”? being rewritten for October. When every taxpayer’s pound needs to work as hard as it can to build a new Mr Denham: We must remember the situation at the economy for Britain, the Government’s decision on end of the previous Labour Government. It is no part Bombardier means that taxpayers’ money will needlessly of my case that we were a flawless Government with no be spent abroad. When every pound of taxpayer’s money imperfections. Indeed, I am one of those who has needs to work hard to build the new economy, the acknowledged already in this debate the need for change, Government are refusing to ensure that public sector and the Labour party will undertake that. Let me just contractors provide apprenticeships. When there is tell the hon. Gentleman three things. First, there were £200 billion-worth of infrastructure for the new economy 1.1 million more small businesses thriving in this country that needs investment, the Government are dragging at the end of the Labour Government than there were their feet. To see that, we need only look at the way they at the beginning. Secondly, the OECD reckoned that are doing broadband: slowly, in inefficient penny-package this country was third in the world for ease of setting up projects. a new business. Thirdly, almost alone of the western When we need the Government to be working with European countries, we enjoyed net foreign direct business to build the new economy, all we get is the tired investment, because businesses around the world had mantra, “The less government does, the better.” If we the confidence to invest in Britain. Not everything was are to be the very best at the things we are good perfect, but that was not a bad record to show that we at—advanced manufacturing, creative industries, business worked well with business. services, pharmaceuticals and renewables—government What we need today is a plan B for the economy and has to work in partnership with business. It must do so: a plan B for young people to begin to restore the to understand what technologies and skills we need in promise of Britain. The Government must see that the future, so that companies have confidence to invest; cutting too far and too fast means sacrificing the growth to set clear priorities and stick to them, so that companies and jobs that make it easier to reduce the deficit. We have the certainty they need to invest; to look at what need a temporary reduction in VAT until growth is government buys and how we buy it, so that innovative re-established to put money in families’ pockets and to companies can grow; to must make sure that good boost shopping centres and jobs. 907 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 908

Yesterday, we saw long-term plans to restructure the Margot James (Stourbridge) (Con): My right hon. banks, whose irresponsibility around the world caused Friend is introducing our side of the argument with so much harm, but nothing to tackle the immediate great generosity of spirit, but does he not agree that the problems facing Britain. The Government should repeat tone of the motion encourages an extremely unhealthy the banking levy, raising £2 billion, and with the money sense of victimhood among our young people? I will they could reduce the damage done by ending the future not pre-empt his speech by giving a long list of all that jobs fund by establishing a £600 million youth jobs the Government are doing for young people, but we are fund. The Government could get young people back to doing a great deal and I trust that the Minister will give work by building 25,000 affordable houses. We could full voice to all that. boost opportunities by investing in high-growth small businesses. When every taxpayer’s pound needs to work Mr Willetts: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The as hard as it can, the Government should grasp the debate is an opportunity for me and all Government nettle and require public sector contractors to provide Members to set out very clearly what we are trying to apprenticeships for young people. do with more apprenticeship places, 80,000 work experience For too long, this Conservative-led Government have places, and a funding system for universities—however blamed everything bad that has happened in this country controversial—that has been set up on a reliable basis on the unavoidable effects of deficit reduction. They are for the future that will enable us to maintain the number not just wrong about the pace of deficit reduction, of places to students. That adds up to more education however. Deficit reduction cannot be used as a systematic and training places in total for young people than ever excuse for, in plain and simple terms, bad policy and missed before. We are also making bold reforms on schools opportunities. It will take more than this Government through free schools and the pupil premium, which will to restore the promise of Britain, but in the meantime help children from low-income families, as well as through they could at least stop making things worse. the spread of the academies programme and the arrival of university technical colleges. Going beyond education, we are also making bold reforms on housing with the new affordable homes programme bringing 170,000 new 4.16 pm affordable homes by 2015. That all adds up to a programme that is absolutely aimed at ensuring that young people The Minister for Universities and Science (Mr David get a fair deal. Willetts): Of course, the Government oppose the motion. I regret that we are depleted as a result of efficiency Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): Will the Minister savings, but I should explain that the Secretary of State explain how properties at 80% of market value rent are is battling for Britain and representing British business affordable and how that links to his party’s declared aim in Paris and, sadly, our colleague the Minister for of reducing spending on housing benefit? Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning is recovering from a minor operation in hospital. I hope that satisfies the House on our position. Mr Willetts: In our affordable homes programme we have set out arrangements whereby new providers will I assure the shadow Secretary of State that despite deliver extra homes for a given amount of rental income. our disagreement with many of the assertions in his We aim to generate and achieve more house building as motion we very much agree with the underlying principle a result. of which he reminds us. There is an obligation on all our generation to ensure that the younger generation Alison Seabeck (Plymouth, Moor View) (Lab): Will has better opportunities in life. One of people’s most the Minister give way? fundamental concerns is that opportunities for social mobility, getting started on the housing ladder and Mr Willetts: I want to make a tiny bit more progress. getting a good education should be at least as good for our kids as they have been for us. That is a principle that Although we are doing those very important things we absolutely endorse. on higher education, skills, schools and houses, the most important single way in which we can help the Opposition Members might be used to having rather younger generation is by reducing the burden of embarrassing books passed under their noses—such as Government debt that they will have to pay for. That is the memoirs of the right hon. Member for Edinburgh at the heart of our programme. Every time the previous South West (Mr Darling)—but I have with me a book Government introduced some unaffordable expenditure that need cause them no embarrassment: my book, programme paid for not out of taxes but by issuing “The Pinch”, which is on precisely this subject. I strongly Government bonds lasting for 25 years, they were paying recommend it to the entire Opposition Front Bench for public expenditure out of burdens being placed on team and they should each buy a copy—they are not tomorrow’s younger generations. That is the fundamental allowed to share it. moral failure behind the levels of debt that we inherited We support the principle of which the motion reminds from the previous Labour Government. us and it is a challenge to which successive Governments have had to rise. No Government can claim that they Stella Creasy: I am pleased to hear the Minister talk have been able fully to rise to that challenge, and the about the importance of debt levels. Will he comment right hon. Member for Southampton, Itchen (Mr Denham) on the figures from the Office for Budget Responsibility is right to challenge the Government in the House that show that directly as a result of the Government’s today to recognise it, which we do, and to ask us what plans an extra £10,000 of personal debt has been loaded we are doing about it. Let me try to explain what we are on to our hard-pressed households already in the past doing. year? 909 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 910

Mr Willetts: Given what happened to personal debt and the reason is that Labour left 2 million more people under the previous Labour Government, about which in jobs in Britain than we inherited in 1997? The future my colleague the Secretary of State was absolutely of keeping deficits down is jobs and growth—not stupid eloquent, I do not think that Labour can be taken cuts, like those he is pushing forward with. seriously on this subject. We are still waiting for Labour to learn from its fundamental mistake of having uncosted Mr Willetts: The crucial difference between our economy public expenditure programmes and irresponsible and and those that the hon. Gentleman listed is that our unfunded tax reductions, but it has not learned that economy has the benefit of a credible package for lesson as we can see from the motion, which is an bringing down the public deficit, as a result of which absolute example of that. It is full of extra public the markets have retained confidence in us. It is because expenditure promises, it has a tax cut in it and, once of this Government’s economic policies that we are not again, as always with Labour, the figures do not add up. facing the same risks. Andrew Bridgen (North West Leicestershire) (Con): The Browne review estimated that if all new students John Hemming (Birmingham, Yardley) (LD): Does it from 2012 paid Labour’s favoured 3% graduate tax, it not surprise the Minister, as it surprises me, that the would not provide sufficient revenue to fund higher Opposition seem to be unconcerned about the rate of education until the tax year 2041-42. Will the Minister interest paid and the fact that, as a deficit goes up, the estimate how much that would add to the record budget rate of interest goes up as well? deficit left behind by the Labour party? Mr Willetts: That is a very important point; indeed, I Mr Willetts: My hon. Friend is absolutely right that understand that with its latest debt issue the Bank the graduate tax favoured by the Labour leader would of England has secured historically low—almost make the fiscal crisis that we have inherited far worse. unprecedentedly low—interest rates, which is further That is one of the many objections to the idea. evidence of the confidence that people have in our Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East seriousness about tackling the deficit that we inherited Cleveland) (Lab): Will the Minister confirm that the from the previous Government. Chancellor’s own Office for Budget Responsibility has I now want to make progress on some of the specific stated that the borrowing requirement will have to points in the motion that the shadow Secretary of State increase by £46 billion and that unemployment figures put before us. First, let me focus briefly on youth will increase by 200,000 as a result of the Chancellor’s unemployment and those not in education, employment economic strategy? or training. Youth unemployment is a serious problem; it does need to be tackled, and of course we regret the Mr Willetts: I do not know which specific OBR fact that it now stands at 949,000, having been at forecast the hon. Gentleman refers to, but the OBR 924,000 when we took office. However, as we have work I have seen makes it clear that although there are heard, when Labour took office it was at 664,000, and reductions in public sector employment they are more the rise in youth unemployment began long before the than offset by increases in private sector employment. economic crisis hit. That is one of the many ways in which we are rebalancing The really serious question that parties on both sides the economy. We are now hearing claims to fiscal rectitude of the House need to address is why, even during from the party that left us the largest structural deficit Labour’s boom years, youth unemployment was already in the G7 and the largest level of borrowing in the starting to rise. That tells us that it is a deep-seated developed world. Unless the Labour party gets serious trend, which tells us that something has gone seriously about the importance of prudent management of the wrong with our education and training system—it was public finances we simply will not take seriously its not meeting employers’ needs. commitment to caring about the interests of future generations. Tom Blenkinsop: Will the Minister give way? Mr Evennett: My right hon. Friend, as always, is correct in saying that it is essential to repair the economy Mr Willetts: Just a minute; I want to make a bit more to ensure a good future for all our young people, and headway on this point. that if we had an economy like the one left by the last Labour Government, that future would be bleak. The There is a very similar pattern in numbers of NEETs. Wolf report on vocational education said that a significant On the current data series starting in 2000, there were proportion of the 14 to 19 cohort are being offered a 655,000 NEETs in 2000, and when Labour left office less effective path into employment than their predecessors. there were 874,000. I have looked up the figures for two Does my right hon. Friend agree that this Government’s dates that may particularly strike the shadow Secretary policies, particularly in respect of training and of State’s memory. When he arrived as Secretary of apprenticeships, will help address that serious problem? State in the Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills, there were 835,000 NEETs. During the following Mr Willetts: My hon. Friend is absolutely right, and I two years, until he left that post, he was remorselessly should have included Alison Wolf’s excellent report on harried on those figures by his Opposition spokesman. my list of the things that we were doing to try to offer a By the time he left the post, the number of NEETs had fairer deal for young people. risen to 954,000; we debated that many times in the House. We had an increase of 120,000 on his own watch Geraint Davies: Does the Secretary of State agree as the Secretary of State responsible. Actually, he got that sovereign debt in Ireland, Iceland, Spain, Italy, out just in time: the quarter after he left, the number Portugal and so on is much worse than that of Britain, went over 1 million, to hit 1.74 million. I had hoped we 911 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 912 would hear a slightly more frank account from him of I should like briefly to explain to the House why that the lessons he learned about the difficulty of tackling statement is both strictly speaking accurate and deeply the challenge of NEETs, drawing on his own experience. misleading. The shadow Secretary of State went on to complain We are talking about a nine-month period, because about our record, but I have to say that when in opposition we have only nine months’ data for the latest year. In the we warned about Train to Gain, which we said was not first nine months of 2009-10, 92,500 apprenticeships a serious investment in training opportunities; about were started for 16 to 18-year-olds out of a total of programme-led apprenticeships, which were losing contact 211,000 apprenticeships, so 43% of apprenticeships went with the jobs market; and about paper vocational to 16 to 18-year-olds. By comparison, in the first nine qualifications being churned out that did not meet the months of the 2010-11 academic year, under this real needs of employers. Those warnings, sadly, have Government, 102,900 16 to 18-year-olds started proved to be correct. apprenticeships—up from 92,500—out of a total number of apprenticeship starts of 326,000 in a comparable Tom Blenkinsop: I thank the Minister for giving way; period. So we have more apprenticeships for 16 to he is being generous with his time. We are experiencing 18-year-olds, as part of a big increase in the total not only record youth unemployment, but record female number of apprenticeships. Therefore, because the rate unemployment. I believe that the last time that such of increase in 16-to-18 apprenticeships was not as rapid rates were experienced was in 1988, when the Minister as that of other apprenticeships, 16-to-18 apprenticeships was last in power. in our first nine months constitute 32% of the total number. Mr Willetts: I was not personally in power then—but The shadow Secretary of State, using his knowledge absolutely, some groups are excluded from the labour and ingenuity as a former Secretary of State, constructs market whenever times are tough, and youth unemployment an argument in which, because 16-to-18 apprenticeships and female unemployment are both aspects of that. were previously 43% and are down to 32%, we are all supposed to regret the fact that they have fallen by Mr Stewart Jackson: My right hon. Friend omits to 11 percentage points given the increase in total mention one of the biggest catastrophes under the last apprenticeships. If anyone wants an example of the Government: the disastrous incompetence of the further Blairite attitude to statistics—using every trick in the education capital build programme under the Learning book to take an increase in the number 16-to-18 and Skills Council, for which the former Government apprenticeships as part of an increase in the total have not apologised. This Government are having to number of apprenticeships and to include in a motion pick up the pieces. an assertion that, somehow, there has been an 11 percentage point fall—we have just seen a case study. Mr Willetts: Absolutely; my hon. Friend the Minister If Labour Members want to be taken seriously, they for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning is must get serious not just about the economic challenge doing an excellent job with tight resources in trying to that we face, but about levelling with the country and ensure that we can make at least some improvement to dealing with the facts that we face in an honest way. the further education estate, but I want to talk about Referring to that 11 percentage point fall shows something apprenticeships in particular. deep in Labour’s instincts; the electorate got completely fed up with it, and we all understand why. We are Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): Before the delivering more apprenticeships across the piece. Minister goes on to talk about apprenticeships, will he acknowledge that the direction of travel is entirely Ian Paisley: Perhaps the Minister can give me reasons wrong? With many young people deterred from going why I should vote against the motion. There are 56,000 to college because of the loss of education maintenance unemployed people in Northern Ireland; that is the allowance and rising fees, and others deterred from jobless total. That has trebled over the past four and a going to university because of debt and rising fees, does half years. The Minister is telling the House that everything he not think that the situation will be considerably is going swimmingly, but I do not think that it is. What worse in a year or two, because of the policies that he are the Government doing to get those 56,000 people has already adopted? out of unemployment?

Mr Willetts: Let me now turn to what we are doing to Mr Willetts: I am trying to explain exactly what we ensure that young people have more opportunities, so are doing to deliver a significant increase in the number that the picture that the hon. Gentleman paints does of apprenticeships. We initially pledged to deliver 50,000 not come to pass. extra apprenticeships in our first year; we believe that I should now like to make some progress and to say we have achieved more than double that—100,000 extra that one of my other regrets about the Opposition apprenticeship places—and there is more to come. motion is that it repeats not only the economic mistakes that we associate with the Brown premiership, but the Toby Perkins: Will the Minister give way? spinning techniques that we recall from the Blair premiership, and that is not an attractive combination. Mr Willetts: I shall try to make progress. Those are The worst example of that in the motion, which the real apprenticeships. The shadow Secretary of State shadow Secretary of State repeated in his speech, is the said that they were short-term apprenticeships; let me statement that make absolutely clear how we are financing them. We “the proportion of apprenticeship places for 16 to 18 year olds are doing so from the savings that we are making on has decreased by 11 per cent.”. Train to Gain, which my party in opposition and the 913 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 914

[Mr Willetts] We never knew how that £600 million-worth of cuts was to have been delivered, but it was very hard to see how Liberal Democrats in opposition rightly criticised as an we could maintain the number of university places that ineffective programme with a large amount of dead-weight. we have done and continue to provide high-quality The average number of hours of training received under education given that we inherited that commitment to a a Train to Gain place was 33. We are replacing that with cut of £600 million. That is why we took the tough but apprenticeships, in which the minimum number of hours controversial decision, rather than simply face cuts and of training and directed learning are 280. That is what reduce student numbers, to base university financing on we are putting in the place of Train to Gain. For the student fees and loans—absolutely following the model shadow Secretary of State to complain about short-term used by the previous Government, with no payment up training when we are providing real apprenticeships front. I believe, given the fiscal pressures that we face, instead of his Train to Gain is a bit rich. that that is in the best interests both of universities, which will find, if anything, that they have extra cash as Toby Perkins: Will the Minister give way? a result of our reforms, and of students, as it has enabled us to maintain a high level of places, and to reduce the monthly repayments facing students. The Mr Willetts: No, I shall try to make progress. We are shadow Secretary of State failed to explain at any point delivering more apprenticeship places, which I very what Labour would do. much hope will be of value to the people of Northern Ireland, as it is to the rest of the United Kingdom. The Geraint Davies rose— figures are dramatic: the provisional figures for the first three quarters of the academic year 2010-11 show 330,000 Mr Willetts: I shall not give way, as I am going to try apprenticeship starts—an excellent record. to make progress, although I would welcome an intervention Let me turn to universities, briefly. Of course, we have from the shadow Secretary of State, who could usefully debated this issue many times in the House, and will clarify his position. We would like to know what Labour doubtless do so again. I begin by accepting something policy is. I have been to the House, as have my ministerial that the shadow Secretary of State said, and a point colleagues, to explain our policy, and we have heard a that he made when he was Secretary of State. It is range of suggestions from the Labour leadership. We painful when, in the summer, one is confronted with heard what Lord Mandelson, in his memoirs, thought young people who have done their best in applying for that a Labour Government would have done if they had university, and have not secured a place. It is painful for been re-elected: them, and we recognise the work that they have put in, “I assumed, as the Treasury did, that the outcome would have but in recognising the difficulties that they face, I cannot to include a significant increase in tuition fees. I felt that they do better than repeat the words spoken by the shadow would certainly have to double in order to offset the deficit-reduction Secretary of State when he was Secretary of State and measures that we too would have implemented had we won the was responsible for the matter: election. The alternative would have been a disastrous contraction of higher education.” “In terms of student numbers, going to university has always been a competitive process…we cannot afford to fully fund every Separately, the leader of the Labour party, the right single person who might like to go to university and we never have hon. Member for Doncaster North (Edward Miliband), been able to.” said: That is the correct position. We have been able to “I would not go ahead with the increase they’re going with. continue to provide record numbers of places at university, I want to have a graduate tax. Why do I want to have a graduate tax? despite all the funding pressures that we face and the Because I think it’s a fairer way of paying for higher education, because it says the amount you pay is related to the ability to pay”. need to make reductions. We have three options: recognising that fees and The previous Government, in their final days, had a loans were the way to help universities out of the fiscal plan for 20,000 extra places, as they called them, but pressures that they faced; having a graduate tax; or there was no funding attached beyond the first year. having a third policy of no policy whatsoever. Once There was no money to pay for years 2 or 3 of the again, we are having a debate in the House called by the studentship. Incidentally, contrary to the implication in Opposition with no indication whatever of how they the motion and to what the shadow Secretary of State would put our universities on a solid financial footing. said, that was explicitly described as a one-off funding Governments across Europe are battling to tackle their stream for one year—“extra one-off funding” were the deficits, and it is important that we hear from Labour words of the then Chancellor in the 2010 Budget. What what it would do. Instead, what we have in the motion, we have done instead is provide those 10,000 places last alongside the promises on NEETs and apprenticeships, year, and we will provide another 10,000 next year. and quotes on student places, is a reference to the Instead of having to reduce places, we hope to maintain £2 billion tax on bankers’ bonuses, which will pay for broadly that number, so that at least an equivalent those policies. Let me tell the shadow Secretary of State proportion of the cohort of 18-year-olds has a chance that that tax is already paying for reversing the consumer of getting to university. prices index-retail prices index switch for benefits and We inherited from the previous Government a simple pensions; for jobs and growth spending, which adds up statement, which I shall quote from the pre-Budget to £9.5 billion; to support the cancellation of the fuel report of December 2009. In their list of cuts, there was duty escalator, worth £1.7 billion; to enable the Opposition “£600 million from higher education and science and research to reverse the child benefit freeze, which costs £1.3 billion; budgets from a combination of changes to student support within to reverse the time-limited employment and support existing arrangements; efficiency savings and prioritisation across allowance, costing £1.1 million; to enable them to reverse universities”. the working tax credit freeze for £1 billion; and to 915 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 916 reduce the age-related payment every year, costing another west midlands but only 2.5 million jobs. That is an £600 million. In fact, we estimate that in total, the indication of the deep-seated problems that such areas £2 billion that the Opposition will raise from a bankers’ face. The west midlands skills partnership also predicted bonus tax will pay for £27 billion-worth of public that under Government policies there would be a net spending increases and other tax cuts. loss of a further 38,000 jobs. It said that with adequate The right hon. Gentleman has put his bid in and it is training for people in work and young people, there was on the list. If wants to be taken seriously as a member the potential to create 10,000 net jobs. If the appropriate of Government he has to tell us how he would make the investment is made and the required standards are figures add up. He does not rise to that challenge. We achieved, that would make a substantial contribution to are rising to the challenge of sorting out the mess in the reducing the deficit. nation’s finances that we inherited from the Labour We should recognise that there are deep-seated problems Government, and we are addressing that challenge while, with training and apprenticeships that we as a Labour at the same time, doing absolutely everything that we Government did not totally overcome, but it is legitimate can to ensure high-quality education and training to ask whether this Government’s policies will address opportunities for young people—and we are proud of them. One of the problems is that a huge sector of the the commitment that we are displaying to them. economy consists of small businesses, many of which are so small that they find it difficult to engage with the Several hon. Members rose— potential that apprenticeships offer. The figures quoted by my right hon. Friend demonstrate clearly that we are Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. Will not getting the number of new apprenticeships for hon. Members take their seats? A number of Members young people to which Government policy aspires. That want to participate in the debate, but we have not imposed is backed up anecdotally by conversations that I have as a time limit for speeches. However, if they speak for Chair of the Business, Innovation and Skills Committee considerably longer than six minutes, many other Members with businesses ranging from a boat building firm in will simply not be able to take part, so they should bear Cornwall to black country manufacturing small and that in mind when they make their contributions. medium-sized enterprises. The hon. Member for Halesowen and Rowley Regis (James Morris) mentioned an apprentice in the black country. I am pleased about that, but I had 4.44 pm a conversation with a representative of the Black Country Mr Adrian Bailey (West Bromwich West) (Lab/Co-op): chamber of commerce this morning who tells me that The debate is about future generations. The prospects apprenticeships are not happening. All the evidence for the next generation will impact profoundly on not suggests that the Government have not yet cracked the only very young people, but older people. The ability of problem. our young people—the next generation—to get skills and jobs that form the basis of economic growth will Gordon Birtwistle (Burnley) (LD): My hon. Friend provide the wherewithal to finance our ageing population the Member for Eastbourne (Stephen Lloyd) and I have and the policies that we need for our very young people. held meetings with local industrialists in our constituencies Although the debate focuses on a particular generation, and challenged them to take on 100 apprentices in it is crucial to the whole population. 100 days, working with the Government’s apprenticeships Getting the outcome wrong will have profound scheme. He has succeeded in Eastbourne and I have consequences, socially and economically. Areas such as succeeded in Burnley. Has the hon. Gentleman taken mine in the black country even now show the scars of on that challenge, and does he understand that if every the unemployment and lack of investment in education Member did so, 60,000 more apprentices would be that took place in the 1980s, and the intergenerational employed across the country? What effort has he made social problems that arise from families with low levels to raise the number of apprenticeships in his constituency? of educational aspiration and no head of the family in full-time work. Although any Government would have Mr Bailey: I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on needed a deficit reduction plan, a slowing economy that. I cannot comment on his constituency, but I am should not in itself be a reason for cutting investment in told that the problem in mine is that there are not education and training. It is education and training that enough young people aged 16 to 18 with adequate will enable an economy to grow out of recession as national vocational qualifications to be accepted by circumstances change. local companies. As representatives of our areas we My right hon. Friend the Member for Southampton, need to play a role in changing that, but with the Itchen (Mr Denham) acknowledged that the previous greatest respect, that will not be done by setting targets—it Government did not get everything right, but to listen is interesting that those Members seem suddenly to to Government Members one would think the previous have adopted the principle of targets—over a short Government did not get anything right. No mention period of time. has been made of the fact that the number of apprenticeships rose from 70,000 to nearly 280,000—a Jeremy Corbyn: I am glad that my hon. Friend has fourfold increase—or of the huge improvement in education come on to this point. Does he share my concern that and training qualifications. However, I accept that even too many colleges are closing high-skill courses in carpentry, at the end of the last Labour Government, there was engineering and electronics in favour of others, which still a problem. means that the whole industrial base of this country The west midlands skills partnership, which covers is declining rapidly? Intervention at college and school the skills profile in the west midlands, acknowledged level is essential if we are to get the number of that there were 3.5 million people of working age in the apprenticeships rising. 917 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 918

Mr Bailey: My hon. Friend makes a valuable point, I could also talk about the education maintenance and that is certainly a complaint I hear from local allowance, which was referred to earlier, because about manufacturers. I would hope that the new local enterprise 70% of the students in my local college of higher partnerships could address that by involving businessmen education receive it, but we have yet to see either the and further education provides in policy development, fallout from the changes to it or the potential consequences but we are yet to see any benefit. of that for encouraging young people to take up post-16 My great concern, which has been reflected in some education. of the comments made so far, is that the new higher I am conscious of the time, Mr Deputy Speaker, so I education funding regime will impact on the apprenticeships will not go on much longer, but I make the general point market. There undoubtedly appear to be real concerns that getting young people not only into vocational among young people about the financial consequences training but into higher education is a complex and of going to university and, as a result, they are looking difficult job. What the Government have done with for alternative routes by which to obtain qualifications. their cuts is to remove the infrastructure needed to That is not wrong in itself, as vocational qualifications encourage, and to provide the right backing for, young could be ideal for them and for the country. people in order to change the fears and attitudes that However, I have looked at some figures. Pearson have prevented them from going into training and higher Professional and Vocational Training reckons that 46% of education. a poll of 1,100 adults and 58% of 16 to 18-year-olds are We do not yet know the full consequences, but I now more likely to start an apprenticeship than they certainly have great fears that the consequences in the were before. Analysis shows that the number of internet 1980s—with the withdrawal of jobs, education and searches for “apprenticeship vacancies” has increased training from so many young people—will be lived out by 425%, and the website “notgoingtouni” has seen hits now. I very much fear that we could recreate the vicious soar by 150%. That is not necessarily bad, but it indicates cycle of intergenerational deprivation and marginality that a cohort of young people who might have gone to which has caused so many social problems, and which university are now looking to take up apprenticeships in retrospect proves so difficult to counter. or go into vocational training. Where will the young I therefore support the motion and welcome the people who would otherwise have taken those opportunity to make these points. In the new year, my apprenticeships go? I think that this is very likely to Select Committee will look at apprenticeships and, I result in a huge surge of NEETs. hope, secure a more in-depth analysis of what is happening That could be combated by reinforcing the policies and of what the Government should do. and structures, some of which were put in place by the Labour Government, intended to overcome young people’s Several hon. Members rose— concerns or resistance, and in some cases the cultural obstacles, that prevent them from going to university. Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. If The abolition of Aimhigher, which had an enormous everybody takes 14 minutes, it means that well under effect in areas like my constituency, is a matter of huge half the people present are going to participate, so I concern. The role of encouraging young people from implore hon. Members to take note of the six-minute relatively low-income families or deprived backgrounds guidance. to go to university has been outsourced. The problems have become much greater and the means for dealing with them have disappeared. 4.58 pm Margot James: Aimhigher was not without its merits, Esther McVey (Wirral West) (Con): When I became a but it did not succeed in getting students from lower Member, I said that one of the biggest issues facing the socio-economic groups into the more selective universities; coalition Government was the number of young people it succeeded only so far. I also take issue with the not in work, education or training. The figure stands at question of what help is now going to be provided, almost 1 million, and in some areas of the north-west it because the whole fair access programme, which underpins is one in four, which equates to a huge amount of young the rise in tuition fees, will enable many more people people, with a significant amount of energy and ideology, from lower socio-economic groups to access university who might not be able to do anything with their lives. education. Youth unemployment increased by 40% under Labour, and the number of people not working, in education or Mr Bailey: I agree with one element of the hon. in employment rose between 2000 and 2008 under Labour, Lady’s point, because the figures for the elite Russell while in the rest of the world it fell. Those are the group universities did not increase significantly, but let figures and that is the reality of the situation. Compounded me give her some UCAS figures. Between 2003 and with that, we have a global financial disaster. In addition, 2010, the number of disadvantaged people in the west Labour left the country with the largest deficit in the midlands applying to higher education and being accepted developed world, with a rising structural deficit for the rose by 61%, compared with 27% for people from more seven years before the recession. affluent backgrounds. Certainly within the higher education However, I do believe that Members in all parts of sector as a whole, there was a big improvement. the House entirely believe that opportunities for the I was just coming on to the point about outsourcing next generation are vital. There are a couple of things and the Office for Fair Access. If OFFA is given the that we have to do. We must learn to live within our teeth and the funding to clamp down on universities to means and learn to get the deficit down so that we do ensure that, as a result of their being allowed to levy the not pass on more debt to future generations and so that new increase in tuition fees, they carry out their function we do not always have to say no. When we have the successfully, it may work, but the jury is out on that. money, we will be able to say yes. 919 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 920

Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) to get one of those for the chemical industries and the (Lab): May I remind the hon. Lady that the UK had the built environment. I welcome the notion of free schools second lowest debt in the G7 in 2007 and only slightly and academies that will open up environments and worsened its position when it was recovering in 2009? I different ways of looking at things that possibly were would suggest that the flatlining of the economy due to not there before. I welcome the introduction of the this Government’s lack of economic policy is contributing pupil premium worth £430 for every pupil on free to the poor state of affairs. school meals. I also welcome the national scholarship programme to help the poorest students. We are also Esther McVey: I hear what the hon. Lady says, but I planning 250,000 more apprenticeships than were planned hope she recognises that we are paying £120 million per under Labour, which is the biggest ever boost to day on interest payments alone—not a healthy bank apprenticeships. balance if it were mine, not that it ever would be. Under Labour—this might be difficult for the Opposition One of the key things we have to do is focus on what to hear—the gap between the relative chances of poor resources we have. There must be a fundamental mind and rich students to go to university widened, the shift on what we are going to do genuinely to help attainment gap between those at private and comprehensive young people, with honesty, truthfulness, and no false schools doubled, and in places like Wirral the wealth hopes or expectations being created. The Opposition gap doubled. The life expectancy differential between are saying, “Too far, too fast”, but I would say to them, rich and poor men is now 15 years on the Wirral “You did too little, too late. You took your eye off the peninsula. I know that we are all hoping to come ball locally, nationally and globally, and the disconnect together to look at opportunities for the next generation, between the youth and what business wants expanded.” but we have to live within our means, see what we have Let me substantiate those comments. Before I came got, and have a fundamental mind shift to what businesses into Parliament, I set up and ran the biggest business want. women’s network in the north-west, with 9,000 women I am engaging with the National Youth Theatre, members. I am honorary president of WIN—Wirral which works with kids from all backgrounds to help Investment Network—which is for businesses in Wirral. them with their dreams, aims and aspirations, and to For 10 years, I worked with school children across all give them the realities of ambition, hope and desire. In platforms and all backgrounds, and wondered what every theatre production, we are saying to 1,000 kids, their hopes and aspirations were. We believe in creating “You can do it, but life will be tough and it isn’t easy.” opportunities, but the question is how we are going to I will finish with the country’s first ever female to set get there and achieve that. I spent the past three years up a public limited company, Debbie Moore of Pineapple interviewing the world’s top 100 women from top Dance Studios, who has said that “nothing good comes backgrounds. I asked them, “What did you manage to easy”, but that opportunities are out there for everyone, do and how did you manage to achieve it? What and that in times of economic hardship opportunities differentiated you from other people?” In helping me are still out there, but it might just be a little tougher. with those interviews, they too wanted to help the next generation of young girls in particular. The Opposition motion is flawed, inaccurate and misleading. For that reason, it needs to be opposed. Lilian Greenwood (Nottingham South) (Lab): Last week, my daughter, who is 14 years old and has just gone into year 10, came back from her school and told 5.6 pm me that this year it no longer had the funding to arrange Pat Glass (North West Durham) (Lab): I will focus work experience for her and her classmates. How is that on the reality of Government policies on the lives of going to increase opportunities for young women? our young people. The Chancellor tells us that unemployment has not increased since the 2010 election. Esther McVey: I find that hard to believe. I am not In my constituency unemployment has doubled, and sure how that has happened, because under the Department the number of young people who are unemployed has for Work and Pensions we are building and taking risen by 28%. The hon. Member for Stourbridge (Margot forward the biggest programme of work experience and James), who is no longer in her place, told us that the voluntary work. Opposition were encouraging a culture of victimhood I asked the women what they had that other people among young people. However, citing the 28% increase did not have, and they said that in life the great equaliser in youth unemployment in my constituency is not shroud has to be character and personality traits that will lead waving; those are real young victims with real young to success in individuals, irrespective of their background, lives that are being wasted. connections and schooling. They said that those key The Government talk about social mobility, narrowing things have to come from teaching, at a young age and the attainment gap, and focusing on the vulnerable and throughout life, determination, ambition, team playing, those living in deprivation and poverty. In reality, they trustworthiness, focus, working together, and the realities are presiding over a huge increase in the number of of life, and that that would be the great equaliser young people not in education, employment or training. whether someone was the daughter of a baron or a They have abolished many of the policies, such as the baker. future jobs fund and the education maintenance allowance, That is what I want to work on with the Government. that had a positive impact. Although the Government I welcome the new university technical colleges that say nice warm words about social mobility and narrowing want to expand education and ability—hands-on and the attainment gap, their policies appear to be designed mental—and will work with kids who want to do directly to exclude, rather than include, these young engineering and technical jobs. In Wirral, we are hoping people. 921 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 922

[Pat Glass] under Labour. Attainment outcomes improved more for the most advantaged, but that is because of the The number of young people not in education, complex set of barriers that face the most disadvantaged. employment or training increased by 54,000 in the last Anyone who has ever worked in that field—that probably quarter of last year. That is an additional 54,000 wasted rules out most of the Government—will say that it is young lives. Anybody who has worked with these young easier to improve outcomes for those who are already people sees them not as numbers but as wasted young advantaged. It is much harder to improve outcomes at lives. When the figures are broken down, it is clear that the same rate for the more disadvantaged. That takes the biggest proportion is made up of young people who consistent hard work from teachers, high levels of resources, would be classified as vulnerable, such as those with targeted interventions and, most importantly, commitment special educational needs and those living in poverty. by the Government, which is clearly no longer there for We have not seen this level of wasted young lives, or those young people. witnessed such indifference to such a tragedy from a EMA gave a leg-up to the young people who face the Government, since the 1980s. biggest challenges in life. It gave them access to the I accept that having people who are not in education, best courses by providing help with travel costs, books employment or training is nothing new. We had them at and equipment. It became the silver bullet for many the time of the last Labour Government. The difference disadvantaged young people. The Secretary of State is that we did something about it. We did not sit back came to this House and told us repeatedly that students complacently and just let it happen. In the period would go to college with or without EMA—presumably between its implementation in 2009 and its abolition in on the basis that if he told us often enough, someone, 2010, the future jobs fund reduced the NEET figure by somewhere would believe him—but that is not borne more than 200,000—that is nearly a quarter of a million out by the evidence given to the Select Committee on young people who were given hope and the possibility Education, and it is not what I hear from students in my of a future. constituency, who have seen a combination of the abolition The Government’s response to all this wasted youth of EMA and the tripling of tuition fees. Those together and potential is apprenticeships. However, what they have robbed them of their shot at further and higher say and what they do are two very different things. They education. That toxic combination has produced a barrier have scrapped the guarantee of an apprenticeship for that they simply cannot get over. That is not good for every 16 to 18-year-old who wants one. They are them or their families, and it is disastrous for the manipulating the figures on apprenticeships by claiming long-term interests of this country. that apprenticeships for those aged 25 and over have The Government say that they care about all children, increased by 234%. and that they want to improve outcomes for all children, The Minister for Universities and Science earlier and yet their policies directly contradict that. Their accused Labour of spinning statistics, and tried to give policies are about the fragmentation of the education us a lesson on it, but this is an example of high-grade system in favour of those who are already advantaged. spinning: the Government have rebadged Train to Gain— A bit of help from the pupil premium will not bridge in-work training for older people—as “apprenticeships”. that gap. The economy needs more proper apprenticeships for young Government cuts are wiping out youth services across people, not short-term courses designed for older workers the country. At the same time, the Government are simply rebranded as apprenticeships. Older workers deserve providing resources for the Prime Minister’s flagship better than to be pushed on to courses that do nothing national citizens service, which, frankly, will provide an for them, but are cheap for the Government to run. extra six weeks’ holiday for some rich kids, at the On education maintenance allowance, I have worked expense of desperately needed targeted youth services for many years wrestling with the dilemma of improving for others. That favours those who are already advantaged outcomes for poorer and more vulnerable pupils, narrowing over the disadvantaged. the gap between the most advantaged and the most Government policies and cuts in public expenditure disadvantaged, and improving participation in further that are effectively wiping out careers advice to school and higher education. In my view, the introduction of pupils favour the advantaged over the disadvantaged. EMA had a greater impact on the delivery of those The well-off can already open doors to opportunities difficult goals than almost anything else that I have for their children, but disadvantaged young people cannot seen, but it was abolished. I think it was abolished because rely on family connections to open doors for them, or to it was a Labour Government policy. If we can find get them work experience, unpaid internships with foreign £180 million to spend on an experiment such as university banks or similar opportunities. technology colleges, we can find the money for EMA. The Government’s policies are disadvantaging those EMA was a contract between the Government and young people and curtailing social mobility. In the long the student. Those on EMA had better attendance and term that makes poor economic sense. It is time for the attainment than their peers, and we were beginning to Government to rethink their policies on young people, make good on some of the seemingly intractable and and to start supporting all our young people, not just complex issues in education, such as improving boys’ some of them. It is time they stopped supporting the attainment, narrowing the attainment gap and raising advantaged over the disadvantaged, and stopped wasting the participation of the poorest. young lives and talents. The Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and 5.14 pm Skills keeps telling us—we heard this again today—that the gap between the most advantaged and the most Mr Robin Walker (Worcester) (Con): Today’s debate disadvantaged increased under the Labour, but the truth is on a vital subject, and I have no doubt that opportunities is that educational attainment for all children improved for the next generation are dear to the hearts of every 923 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 924

Member. I am sure that we all come to this place Just last week the Government announced plans to motivated to ensure that opportunity is as great as cut more red tape for apprenticeship providers and possible, and I have no doubt that Members of all businesses. That will be welcomed by businesses in my parties are passionate about delivering for the next constituency, which often say that it is fear of the red generation. It is tragic, therefore, that Labour Members tape involved that discourages them from supporting can only talk down the opportunities for the next generation, the scheme. The hon. Member for West Bromwich West given that their party in government did so much to (Mr Bailey) made an important point about how it is a blight them with debt and economic uncertainty. challenge to encourage small businesses to provide apprenticeships. It is a challenge that we must meet, Lyn Brown (West Ham) (Lab): Is the hon. Gentleman though, and one that I am depressed to see is not trying to convince the House that no young person in mentioned in the Opposition motion. It makes no his constituency has talked to him about the withdrawal suggestions for how to deal with red tape. of the EMA and its impact on their life? Businesses in Worcester are taking on apprentices, Mr Walker: Absolutely not. I have met young people though—businesses such as Worcester Bosch, Skills for in my constituency and I have been to my local technical Security, Yamazaki Mazak, Sanctuary Housing, Worcester college and explained to my constituents what we are Community Housing and Tesco. From engineering expertise doing to replace it. The people to whom I have spoken through to cooking and food safety, retail and have been satisfied with that, however, because they administration, young people are learning on the job, have understood that there will be support in the future. and more are doing so as a result of the Government’s determination to strengthen the apprenticeship route. It is important to consider how to create opportunities. Next Monday I shall host an apprenticeship fair at In my maiden speech I noted that some of the steps set Worcester’s historic guildhall, to celebrate the successes out in the Gracious Speech aimed to increase opportunities that have already been achieved and to launch a new for young people by supporting businesses that wanted challenge for apprenticeship recruitment in the city. It to hire, by increasing the number of apprenticeships will be aimed specifically at NEETs and will be a and by pursuing vital education reforms. Since then, all celebration of real success and a chance to create new three of those themes have been strengthened. In answer opportunities for the next generation. to a recent parliamentary question, I discovered that 38 businesses in Worcester—a significantly higher It is not through apprenticeships alone, however, that proportion than the average—have successfully registered opportunities will be created. Businesses must be supported and benefited from the national insurance holiday scheme in hiring and encouraged to invest in their staff and to allow them to hire new employees, and earlier this pursue opportunities for growth. Through scrapping year another parliamentary question revealed that Labour’s jobs tax right at the start of this Parliament, 400 apprenticeships were started between May 2010 the Government did exactly that. Is it enough? Of and the end of last year. Following the huge success of course we would all like to see more, but is it a step in the 100 in 100 campaign, championed by my excellent the right direction? Absolutely it is. We have also supported local newspaper, the Worcester News, I have no doubt small business through corporation tax reductions and that there will be even more this year. making the small business rate relief automatic. Apprenticeships are a fantastic pathway to opportunities We should never underestimate the vital role of SMEs for young people. I have no compunction about saying in providing employment and opportunities for young that the previous Government were right to start the people. The Opposition motion makes little mention of process of building them up, and I will not pretend that that, but it does mention the regional growth fund, all Conservative Governments in the past have given which is already backing opportunity in Worcester through them the priority that they deserve. However, it is its support for the plans for a Worcester technology churlish for this Opposition motion to decry the park. Once it gets the go-ahead, this project will provide achievements of the Government and the Minister for a new home for green technologies in our county and Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning in provide thousands of jobs for the next generation. In delivering more. As the Minister for Universities and contrast to the picture of doom and gloom painted by Science pointed out earlier, the statistics in the motion Labour Members, this body, created by the coalition are based on spin. I welcome the Government’s commitment Government, is already providing valuable investment to fund 360,000 apprenticeships in this financial year in growth and making a real difference in our communities alone, and we should all welcome the announcement in today. this year’s budget of a further 50,000 apprenticeship The Labour party calls for a VAT cut, and for many places and the more recent announcement that the businesses that might seem like an attractive option, but Government are beating their own ambitious targets for the best way in which this Government can help business apprenticeship starts. is to provide economic growth and stability. Neither will be possible, however, so long as we labour under a Lilian Greenwood: Does the hon. Gentleman not growing deficit and burden of debt. share my concern that even if we do see the apprenticeships that he is talking about, if growth does not return to the Toby Perkins: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? economy and if the Government do not do something to stimulate that growth, those people will do their Mr Walker: I will not, I am afraid; I have already training and then have no jobs to go to? given way twice. Mr Walker: I totally agree that we need to deliver With their unfunded tax cuts, the Opposition have economic growth. I welcome that intervention, and I neither a plan nor a blueprint for growth. The coalition will come later to that point and to some of my suggestions Government must do better. We must continue to invest for delivering growth. in apprenticeships, and continue to ensure that a world-class 925 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 926

[Mr Robin Walker] and speak to him. He will hear how our students in Wales are paying only £3,000 in tuition fees, and how higher and further education sector delivers real value we have managed to keep the education maintenance and opportunity. Most of all, we must support a business- allowance. Then let him come back here and say, “It’s led recovery. the only way.”In Wales we have a Labour Government. I would like to see more people taken out of tax, and In Wales we are delivering for young people. That is the more businesses participating in schemes such as the truth. national insurance holiday, apprenticeships and business I have been hearing about the wonderful idea of rate discounts. I would like to see a reform of the apprenticeships, but there is also a huge problem with business rates system, to give local councils more power them. I pay tribute to the companies in my constituency, to provide targeted discounts and to replace the antiquated including Axiom, Abingdon Carpets and Pensord, that valuation system. I would also like to see a real focus on are offering wonderful apprenticeships; those schemes the skills needed for the next generation—but today’s will build for the future. They face a problem, however, negative and dispiriting Opposition motion provides and I think that it comes from the 1980s. Many of the none of those things. I urge the Minister, in dismissing candidates do not have the necessary skills, such as this dismal motion, to show that the coalition Government timekeeping or communication skills, and that puts are continuing as they started out, by supporting skills, them at a disadvantage before they start. We need to backing business and opening opportunity for the next look at the education system. generation. Justin Tomlinson (North Swindon) (Con): I congratulate 5.21 pm the hon. Gentleman on his eloquent speech, but will he confirm that those very same potential apprentices were Chris Evans (Islwyn) (Lab/Co-op): I congratulate the educated under a Labour Government? hon. Member for Worcester (Mr Walker) on manfully standing up and giving us the Tory mantra. Looking Chris Evans: The apprenticeship scheme was during across at the Government Benches, I feel sorry for him, the Labour Government, and we have a Labour however. It is a pity that Government Members could Government in Wales. It is devolved. [Interruption.] not be bothered to turn up to listen to his speech. Look Will the hon. Gentleman repeat his question? how empty those Benches are. They should be disgusted with themselves. How many Liberal Democrats can we Justin Tomlinson: Is it not the case that those potential count? One, two, three—I cannot see any more. apprentices who do not have the necessary skills were educated under a Labour Government? Sajid Javid (Bromsgrove) (Con): Look behind you! Chris Evans: I apologise for not having caught part of Chris Evans: Has Christmas come early? Is this the the hon. Gentleman’s question. The point I am getting pantomime season? at is that this has been a problem that has come down I come to this debate remembering the experience of through the years. Sometimes the problems have not the 1980s. We cannot talk about opportunities for the been addressed by any Government. As my hon. Friend future without thinking about that period. I grew up in the Member for West Bromwich West (Mr Bailey), who the south Wales valleys, and I remember the headmaster is no longer in his place, said, because of the decline of saying to us on our first day at school, “Some of you the manufacturing base, a number of families had no will bring joy to the school. A tiny minority of you will jobs and were on benefits, as there was a benefit culture make us proud and you will go to university. An even there. That permeated through the education system. smaller minority will get into trouble with the police We need to take action now to ensure that when and bring shame on the school. The vast majority of apprenticeships are available, those people can go for you are only good for factory fodder, and until that time them. comes, we are going to make this the happiest period of your lives.” [Laughter.] We can laugh at that, and we The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, can look back and mock it, but he was putting across Innovation and Skills (Mr Edward Davey): The hon. the poverty of ambition that we felt. We felt ignored by Gentleman is making an important point, which is why the Tory Government; we did not fit in with Thatcher’s the Government have introduced the access to economic miracle. We simply wanted one thing. Well, apprenticeship schemes—to tackle that very problem. we wanted a few things, actually. We wanted to feel safe in our own homes, we wanted to feel secure in our jobs, Chris Evans: I agree with that, but I am saying that it and we wanted hope for the future. needs to go much deeper. I was talking today to a But, as we have heard today from the Opposition friend, Andrew Whitcombe, who is the director of skills Benches, there is no hope for the future. Education and business development at a local college. He told me maintenance allowance has gone and tuition fees have that those schemes were fine, but that more needed to trebled, but what do we hear from the Minister? “We be done within the education system; some sort of can’t do anything different. It’s the deficit. It’s the only driving licence was needed. way.” I congratulate the Whips, because that is all I have heard since I came into the House: “It’s the only way; Lyn Brown: Does my hon. Friend agree that the it’s the only way.” Well, if the Minister wants to find a biggest problem with this Government is that they take different way, I suggest that he phone the Welsh Assembly an awful lot with one hand, and give back a few pebbles and make an appointment with the Education Minister with the other hand, to the people we represent? The there, Leighton Andrews. He should then jump on the biggest problem young people have had to face in trying tube, go to Paddington, take the train to Cardiff and go to fulfil their aspirations in my constituency is the 927 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 928 removal of their education maintenance allowance, which Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): The usual is not being replaced by anything of equal value. The injury time will apply. replacement is certainly not going to provide for as many people in my constituency as EMA did. Although Lorely Burt: In that case, I will give way. Conservative Members can talk about their grandiose schemes, they are not replacing what they have taken Debbie Abrahams: Is the hon. Lady aware that debts away— in the City of London in 2009 stood at 245% of gross domestic product in comparison with a public sector Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. Will the debt of 60%. Is it not about time that the Government hon. Lady face the Chair so that the microphones can acknowledged that point and made sure that they targeted pick up her words? their action where it belongs?

Chris Evans: That is the point I was trying to make. Lorely Burt: I do not think that debt is a good thing. We in Wales have realised the importance of EMA, As has been mentioned, we are spending £120 million a which is why we have kept it. Why have we been able to day paying off our debts, which means that the money keep it? Because we have a Labour Government. cannot be used for all the things that hon. Members would like to spend it on. To pay off the deficit—yes, we do need enterprise and we do not want inertia, but there is a problem with the It is well known that Labour’s plans for the economy Government’s belief that people can somehow go into a would have cut £7 for every £8 that the Government are shop, see some sort of product on the shelves, drink it cutting. and then all of a sudden become entrepreneurs. What we need is a fundamental overhaul of how we look at Toby Perkins: Will the hon. Lady give way? our education system. We need to make work part of Lorely Burt: No. our education from day to day; we need to talk about self-image and communication skills, and above all, we The difference, other than the £1, is that the Labour need to talk to people about entrepreneurship. That is party has not had the decency to tell us where it would the only way forward for us. cut that from. The Opposition claim that it is this difference that has resulted in the number of people not To return to the motion, I do believe we need an in education, employment or training reaching 1 million. economic stimulus, and that could come about through That is the first of many interesting recollections in the a VAT cut—but we also need to look at fundamental motion, so let me highlight a few stark facts: in May problems in our society and try to address them. 1997, there were 664,000 unemployed 16 to 24-year-olds I have kept my points short, Mr Deputy Speaker, and in the UK, but in May 2010 there were 924,000. After have spoken for only six minutes. I hope that you will 13 years in government, the Labour party left youth remember that in future when I want to speak again. unemployment 40% higher than when it took office; it was Labour Members who took us to that level. Several hon. Members rose— What are the Government going to do about that? We have rolled out the Work programme across the Mr Deputy Speaker: Order. To make sure that everyone UK. It provides flexible and tailored support that will follows the hon. Gentleman’s excellent example, I am be of real benefit to our young people, unlike many of now going to introduce a six-minute limit so that all the unsuccessful schemes operated by the previous Back Benchers are protected. Government. We are yet to see the initial results of the Work programme, but I am confident that it will prove 5.28 pm more successful than the future jobs fund, which was heavily reliant on the public sector and provided little Lorely Burt (Solihull) (LD): I am speaking not just as more than a smokescreen for the increasingly poor a member of this coalition Government but, like the youth unemployment record. In Birmingham, 2,500 hon. Member for West Bromwich West (Mr Bailey), as positions were created under the future jobs fund, only a west midlands MP. In the west midlands, we have a 50 of which were in the private sector, and evidence youth unemployment rate of 9.6%, which is 2% higher shows that 50% of the people who took up a placement than the UK average. There is nothing I would like were back on jobseeker’s allowance when their placement more than to see young people given the opportunities ended. So that is not a programme that can be deemed a that they need, but this is not a new problem. Youth success. unemployment in the west midlands has been running The motion condemns this Government for leaving at about 2% higher than the national average since 100,000 people without a university place. Labour’s mid-2008, but is this motion the right way to deal collective amnesia appears to have struck again. The with it? shadow Secretary of State seems to have forgotten that I would say that the Opposition have failed because, in 2009, when he was universities Minister, he imposed once again, they have not faced up to the realities of the a strict cap on places, which led to 130,000 people situation. The Government are taking the tough action missing out. In 2010, the situation got worse, because needed to reduce the deficit—a deficit left to us by the 150,000 people missed out on a place. The Labour party Labour party. It is in that context that we have to view focused so much on the 50% target it had set that it the motion before us. forgot the minor detail of how it was going to pay for it. Members on the Government Benches will take no Debbie Abrahams: Will the hon. Lady give way? lectures on universities from Labour Members, especially as the intense focus they put on universities left other Lorely Burt: I have a six-minute limit, I am sorry. routes of education for our young people neglected. 929 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 930

[Lorely Burt] The decision to end the highly regarded Aimhigher programme recently came in for strong criticism from The Government have sought to rebalance that equation. regional universities, which fear that greater barriers to We have increased the number of apprenticeships social mobility in deprived areas will be the result. Despite by 100,000, smashing even our own targets. These what the hon. Member for Solihull (Lorely Burt) has apprenticeships will provide skills and training that just said, I have yet to find any support for the scrapping allow people to progress into the job market. Not only of Labour’s future jobs fund, which helped more than that, they will offer more flexibility than the traditional 5,000 young people get a foot on the job ladder in the route of education, allowing people to decide what is north-east alone, not to mention the coalition’s decision best for them, rather than being subjected to the conveyor- to allow universities to charge students up to £9,000 per belt style of the previous Government. year, with the maximum fee looking likely to be the The motion also, bizarrely, highlights house building norm, not the exception, despite the promises of Ministers. and claims that the Government are responsible for the That all adds up to a total lack of Government current slow-down. House building under Labour fell strategy to support young people at a time when youth to its lowest level since 1946. It got so bad that Labour’s unemployment has hit record levels. Some 949,000 16 to housing Minister advised our young people that it was, 24-year olds—more than one in five across the country—are “Time to give up the dream of home ownership.” What now out of work. Over the past 12 months the north-east kind of message is that for young people? What kind of has seen an 18% rise in the number of jobseeker’s message does it send after 13 years in government? This allowance claimants, one of the highest increases in any Government are building 170,000 affordable homes over region by some margin. For me—and for many, I am the lifetime of this Parliament. We have established the sure—that is very alarming. new homes bonus and the FirstBuy scheme, and we are Since I was first elected to this House, I have been a bringing back into use many of the 300,000 empty passionate advocate of apprenticeships and the important homes in the UK. We are taking action to help young role that they can play in supporting young people into people on to the property ladder—where the previous the workplace. To give him his due, the Minister for Government failed. Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning shares The Government have also set up the regional growth my passion. Indeed, I welcome his commitment to fund to boost businesses outside the south-east, and I expanding the number of apprenticeship places and to note from the motion the Opposition’s tacit approval build on Labour’s excellent work in government. I am for the scheme. They call for more money to be spent. seriously concerned, however, that the figures on We, too, would like to invest more money but, as the apprenticeship places are possibly being fudged, with right hon. Member for Birmingham, Hodge Hill (Mr Byrne) the number of places increasing by 234% in the past admitted, there was “no money left”. At the same time nine months, which is largely attributable to Train to as making spending commitments and opposing deficit Gain being rebadged. reduction, they have called on us to cut VAT. Cutting I also believe that we need to look very carefully at VAT to 17.5% would require £13 billion more of spending the quality and types of apprenticeships that are being cuts and I would be very interested to know where hon. created because we need to ensure that they genuinely Members feel that should come from. All the Opposition meet the needs of current and future employers and offer to pay for new homes, increased regional funding, match the skills that we need for Britain’s future economy. VAT cuts and a new youth jobs fund is a bankers’ bonus How will the Government ensure that new apprenticeship tax that raises less than our bank levy and failed last places are additional to any new jobs created? It is no time. It is economic nonsense. good converting existing jobs into apprenticeships just This debate is about chances for our young people. to say that a target has been reached; we need to offer We do nothing to help their chances if we do not take genuine opportunities to young people and provide the difficult decisions necessary to reduce the deficit. genuine support for businesses so that they embrace the We are investing in apprenticeships, building new homes, apprenticeship model. Despite many local employers getting people into work and securing the long-term taking up the apprenticeship agenda with gusto, many future of the economy. That is what this Government still do not appreciate the benefits that taking on an are doing. apprentice can have for their organisation. Indeed, that concern is borne out by a recent north-east chamber of 5.35 pm commerce report that found that companies wrongly believe that taking on an apprentice is “too expensive”, Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) or that apprenticeships are available only in a very (Lab): There is no doubt that this is a worrying time for narrow range of sectors. this and the next generation of young people. That is not just my view but that of those who see first hand the Caroline Dinenage (Gosport) (Con): Does the hon. damage being done to opportunities for young people, Lady agree that the emphasis that the Government have particularly across Newcastle and the north-east. put on apprenticeships has been fantastic PR in the The abolition of Labour’s education maintenance sense that people who would not previously have thought allowance came as a serious blow to thousands of of offering them now do so? I met a chap in my young people across the north-east, yet organisations constituency the other day who is a carpet cleaner and have stepped into the breach. Newcastle city council, who, purely because of the Government’s emphasis on now safely back in Labour hands, was not prepared to apprenticeships, suddenly had the idea of offering an stand back and abandon Newcastle’s generation of apprenticeship to kids from the hardest-hit areas of my young people and therefore established a new 16-to-19 constituency. That move has been a huge success and bursary scheme that is helping young people who face can be credited solely to the emphasis that the Government financial hardship to stay in full-time education. have put on apprenticeships. 931 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 932

Catherine McKinnell: I agree that apprenticeships Parliament I have taken on an apprentice in my constituency need a sales job to be done on them, but there is a office, and in my former role as a business owner I also greater need for real action that meets the needs of took on an apprentice, who has gone on to have a good businesses and the economy, and I am worried that the career. Government’s approach is just a PR job and does not In my constituency, we have launched a scheme with have much substance. Having met a number of apprentices a number of local businesses called plan 500, which has from across Newcastle who work in catering, construction sought to increase the number of opportunities for and as motor technician apprentices, I have seen how work experience and apprenticeships. I am such a huge beneficial they can be to businesses. I have a business fan of apprenticeships because they help businesses by apprentice in my constituency office in Lemington, who giving them an opportunity to train and shape apprentices just turned 18 last week and who is genuinely invaluable to their organisation’s needs. They are an affordable to my office. I encourage all hon. Members to take on step for businesses that are looking to progress and they an apprentice in their office and lead the way. provide an excellent opportunity for those who participate Clearly, the coalition needs to do more. In these in apprenticeships, often giving them far better career straitened economic times, the Government should use opportunities than traditional university graduate schemes. every lever in their power to increase the opportunities Having talked to local businesses and business forums available to young people. They should lead the way in my constituency, I know that they are extremely and they could make a huge difference by using public supportive of apprenticeships. procurement to achieve social and economic ends. They My hon. Friend the Member for Gosport (Caroline spend £220 billion a year purchasing goods and services Dinenage) made a point about the need to improve the from the private sector—from business support services perception of apprenticeships, which has continued to to new schools and hospitals to new trains. They are the improve over a number of years, and rightly so. One top single contractor in the UK. I introduced my problem is that many businesses still do not understand Apprenticeships and Skills (Public Procurement Contracts) how easy it is to employ an apprentice or what it entails. Bill, which is due to have its Second Reading shortly, so I have mentioned this in several debates, and I shall that all companies that win major public sector contracts repeat it because it is still an excellent point. All businesses give a firm commitment to create apprenticeships as receive a business rate mailer, and I call on the Government part of that bid. to include in it information on how to take on apprentices; I am delighted that my proposal has been adopted as it would lead to the creation of further opportunities Labour party policy, but I am disappointed that it has for young people. received only warms words from the Minister for Further We should do all we can to encourage the next Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning. As I have generation of entrepreneurs. Talking to young people, it said, this is not the time for warm words—it is the time becomes clear that they love, and are inspired by, “The for action. It is hugely disappointing that the Minister Apprentice” and “Dragon’s Den.” To make a sweeping for the Cabinet Office has repeatedly rejected the idea, generalisation, young people have enthusiasm, drive stating that using public procurement policy and cheek. These are all essential ingredients needed to “to stimulate the creation of more apprentices...wouldn’t be innovate and challenge the norm, especially in high-tech appropriate”. and traditional industries where new opportunities could I ask, “Why?” If getting the cheapest price for a contract be created. results in long-term costs and missed opportunities for To be proactive, I think we should encourage young young people and for the creation of our future skills enterprise schemes in schools; we should establish the base, that is short-termism at its worst and is an irresponsible network of 40,000 business mentors; we should support way of spending taxpayers’ money. That attitude is even global enterprise week, which for all those with diary more disappointing because the policy has the backing open and pen poised is 14 November; and we should of many people and major organisations, including the tap into inspirational projects, including the excellent Federation of Small Businesses, chambers of commerce, work of the Peter Jones Foundation and of the Premier the Association of Colleges, many unions, the Federation League, which has managed to deliver enterprise activities of Master Builders, the Electrical Contractors Association to more than 115,000 children in just two years. Too and indeed Lord Sugar. often we actually educate people out of entrepreneurial I urge all right hon. and hon. Members to lend their flair. I studied business at university, and only a handful support to today’s Opposition motion, because we simply of the 300 in our year went on to set up their own cannot take the risk of creating another lost generation business. My plea is that we just let people get on and be of young people. We have the tools to make a difference that next generation of business owners. and we have the spending power of public procurement—let I am particularly keen to see an expansion in financial us use them. education. It is essential that we equip the next generation to understand the increasingly complex financial 5.42 pm world, and to have the confidence to be savvy consumers. That will help young people make informed financial Justin Tomlinson (North Swindon) (Con): Given the decisions; it will help provide them with the confidence time constraints I shall cover a number of topics swiftly to manage their own money; it is good for their CVs, and litter them with personal requests in the hope that helping improve their likelihood of securing work in a the Minister will agree to every one of those requests. challenging market; and it encourages entrepreneurs. I First, on apprentices, about which several Members hope all Members will continue to support our all-party have made some excellent points, I welcome the increase parliamentary group on financial education for young in numbers both for young people and for adults as I people, which is calling for compulsory financial education am a huge fan of apprenticeships. As a Member of in the school system. 933 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 934

[Justin Tomlinson] of Strangford in Northern Ireland. I am conscious of the fact that, when young people come to me, I sometimes On housing and the challenges for young people in see desperation and anxiety about getting employment becoming first-time buyers, I would like banks to show and trying to do better for themselves, and I ask myself, flexibility rather than sticking to the crude method of “How can this happen? How can we help?” “timesing” income by a multiple to determine whether The hon. Member for North West Durham (Pat the young person can afford to pay a mortgage. A lot of Glass) gave an indication of the unemployment figures young people are already demonstrating that they can for her area, and the figures for my area do not make afford a mortgage by paying rent, which is nearly always good reading either. In July this year, 2,580 people were more expensive than the current mortgage. I would like unemployed in my constituency. That represents 6% of banks to look a lot more carefully at the person’s credit the economically active population—those aged 16 to history and disposable income to determine whether 64—and places my constituency 219th among United they can service a mortgage. Kingdom constituencies. Yes, it is in the bottom third, On student finance, we have a duty to provide information but the number of claimants is 250 higher than last year to allow young people to make the best career choice for and has increased by almost 80 in the past four months. their individual circumstances, so I welcome the setting So a clear trend is starting, and that worries me. up of an independent taskforce, led by Martin Lewis of Many of our young people are in this bracket; they moneysavingexpert.com, to provide clear, independent are seeking employment, improvement and opportunity. advice covering the good and, crucially, the bad of any I often see young, highly qualified university graduates changes. For example, the emphasis should be on the applying for jobs in Tesco stores. There is nothing question, is university really the right option for an wrong with them doing that, but they are qualified to individual? It is good for some people, not so good for do better. I am concerned that they are not getting others, and we have a duty to ensure that young people better opportunities. A new Tesco store is opening in make informed decisions to get them their best opportunities my area in October, and some 2,500 people applied for in life. the 160 jobs on offer. There are opportunities coming I was going to set out a series of observations on through, but not enough of them. We need to ensure student finances, but I will go straight to my plea that that opportunities are there for the future, and I believe under the new system graduates should be allowed to that the debate shows how we can do that. repay loans early. The reason that we need to do so is set I recognise clearly what the Government have done out in Martin Lewis’s “mythbusters” on the seven deadly and what they are trying to do, but I suggest that there sins of not allowing early repayment. First, we encourage should be more focus on other methods of doing things. everyone to try to manage debt responsibly, and the Internships are a route being followed by increasing policy flies in the face of that. It is unpopular; in a numbers of graduates. The Government must continue survey carried out on the website, 87% of people said to encourage employers to invest in students and graduates they wanted to repay early. It penalises people for good by offering work experience and internships, which help financial management and success. For some it will them to develop valuable skills and boost their employment mean that commercial loans are cheaper; student loans chances. will no longer be good debt for them. It pressurises I welcome the individual commitment by many hon. parents into stumping up so that students do not need Members to successful initiatives in their areas—that is loans; and higher repayment thresholds mean that people good to see—but apprenticeships are an essential are in debt for longer. mechanism. There must be in place encouragement I understand that the policy is being considered because schemes for employers to keep on their apprentices once we do not want to disadvantage people from challenging they are qualified. In Northern Ireland, where this is a backgrounds; I was one of the people who benefited devolved matter, the Department for Employment and from a full grant. But although a young person relies on Learning has a programme whereby those who hire their parents when they go to university, when they long-term unemployed people receive a financial incentive graduate their destiny is in their own hands as they for the first few months of the employment. It is my secure work, and if a graduate has secured a good job belief that, if we made a similar offer to those who and has disposable income, they should not be penalised employ people for the first time, more employers would with a lifetime of debt. I urge the Government to see the benefit of taking on additional employees. consider that. We are all too aware of the financial difficulties that most small and medium businesses face, and it is the 5.48 pm duty of the House to understand them, while encouraging sustainable employment. The motion refers to Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I am pleased to be “a temporary VAT cut to boost consumer spending”. called to speak. The first line of the motion before us There is some debate about whether that is a good idea, says that but I feel that it is. It would boost confidence and lift the “this House believes that young people face a more uncertain economy, and I believe that it is important to do so. I future” see the benefits of that proposal. than It distresses me to hear that a great many young “their parents and their grandparents” people are moving abroad. I know people who have ever did. None of us in the House could argue with moved from my area to Australia, which has a bit of an that, and it is the premise on which the debate is economic boom, or to New Zealand to get jobs. People founded—that things are not as rosy today as they were who were brought up in my area and have construction for us or our parents. I am proud to be a father and skills see opportunities elsewhere and move out of the grandfather. I am also proud to represent the constituency country to take them. 935 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 936

As has been said, there is another way if we look hard what is happening in other countries. Rather than focusing enough. The Northern Ireland Assembly has put a on a relatively small number of people working many ceiling on tuition fees for students in Northern Ireland. hours a week, trying to put everything together so that Initiatives can be taken if the will-power is there. I see a they can afford to buy a property, perhaps our long-term major problem in relation to the brain drain. We often aim should be that people need not necessarily work so think that that happens when people reach a certain many hours and that the work is shared out. age, but I am concerned that we must stop our young We have had disadvantages with the benefits system. people leaving our shores for pastures further away. The People have been discouraged from working part time. skills for life programme and further education have If they work part time, they do not qualify for benefits delivered much, but I am concerned—this terminology such as tax credits and the like. I hope that the universal was used by a previous speaker—about a lost generation. credit system will enable people to say, “Actually, by I see a lost generation for my area if we are not careful balancing out work and life, I don’t necessarily have to in how we plan our strategy for the future. The Government work full time.” We could then share out the work and are committed to doing better, but we must look at have greater numbers of people contributing to society things in a different way. A business constituent has and fewer people being described as NEETs. I do not suggested that people could do voluntary community like using acronyms to describe people. Perhaps people’s work for a few hours daily to get their benefits. They finances might not be so good, but if more people were could then build that up as a CV, as well as helping the in work but not necessarily working so many hours, constituency. they would have a better quality of life. I also welcome the part of the motion that refers to the bank bonus levy, which would have a financial Sheila Gilmore: If people work fewer than 16 hours, benefit if we took it upon us. We must look to the future they do not get support from tax credits. Under the and foster a generation of workers who have had the universal credit system, a ceiling will be placed on opportunity to gain expertise and experience from their people’s incomes. They will not get out of poverty as a education. The reality is very different out there, and I result of those proposals. urge the House to support the proposal, which was made with the best of intentions. Hon. Members should John Hemming: I am trying to move on from just look on it favourably. being party political about the next few minutes’ policies. If we want to design a society—okay, I do not believe in 5.54 pm centralised state management—we should consider our objectives. If our society is to be one in which a greater John Hemming (Birmingham, Yardley) (LD): Sometimes, proportion of people participate in its operation, we do I think that there is a tendency in politics to focus too not need to discourage people from working only two much on trying to avoid tripping over the hurdles in days a week, which is what the hon. Lady was referring front of us. We do not look at the horizon and see where to. That issue needs to be looked at. we are going in the long term. Rather than focusing on the minute issues about the immediate policy and the We cannot just solve things with economic growth. In motion—I oppose the motion and support Government practice, there are limits to the resources available for policy—I should like to consider the longer-term issues. growth. As colleagues might be aware, I chair the all-party It was rather sad to hear the hon. Member for Islwyn group on peak oil and gas. Putting aside climate change, (Chris Evans) criticise factory work. For my constituents, there are constrains on the availability of fossil fuels we try to maintain work at Jaguar Land Rover. Those and limits to the extent to which we can increase skilled jobs give people an opportunity in life. My view consumption. When we look at obesity in society—perhaps of work is that people should work to live, not live to I am a good example—we should consider whether we work. If people have skilled jobs or have gone to sixth need to increase consumption. form or university, they can find a house to live in, bring There is a wider view. We need to look critically at up a family and go on a few holidays. They have some what we are doing in the long term. In the short term, stability in their lives. That is a positive thing to have, we have to deal with the deficit; there is no question and it should not be downgraded as something that about that. If we do not, interest rates will go up, and society should not aim to have. The hon. Member for we will end up in a situation similar to that of Greece, Strangford (Jim Shannon) made the valid point that or various other countries that face serious financial jobs in Tesco are important. I am pleased that a Tesco problems. However, in the long term, our objective has will soon open in Yardley and provide people with to be a society in which everybody participates; in additional jobs. which we work to live, rather than live to work; and in Within all this, we need security. Young people need which we try to involve everyone. We cannot do it with a such opportunities in the first instance. Let us put aside command-economy approach, but we need to support party politics for a moment and look at what has people in doing what they can and working part time, happened over the past 20 or 30 years. Technology has rather than penalising them for that. improved things in one sense—obviously, we can do a I think that I have, in less than six minutes, managed lot more with fewer people—but we do not need so to make my point, so I leave the Floor to other hon. many people to do what we do. The hon. Member for Members. West Bromwich West (Mr Bailey) said that there are perhaps 1 million jobs short in the west midlands. 6pm Obviously, some people are now in education who would previously have been in work. Considering 50% Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op): It is a growth is a thought experiment; it will not suddenly great pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Birmingham, magic up massive employment. We need to consider Yardley (John Hemming), but in general, we have heard 937 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 938

[Geraint Davies] Geraint Davies: That is complete rubbish. The calculation is that Wales is underpaid by £300 million. We started in a rag-bag of rubbish from Government Members today. the same position. This is about economic choices. Let us think about the big picture: accelerating globalisation; There are tough choices; the choice in Wales was to cap climate change; the ageing of western populations; and investment in the health service. It was a tough choice, the emergence of developing markets, particularly in but the right choice, to invest in skills for the future and China and India, that are driving up energy prices, productivity to make Wales strong— which makes green technologies economical. In Europe, there is a sovereign debt crisis in the Mr Davey rose— aftermath of a financial crisis, but the UK, after 13 years of Labour Government, is in a pretty strong position. Geraint Davies What the hon. Gentleman is doing is As I pointed out earlier, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Portugal making England weak. and Spain are in a much worse position than Britain. Why? It is because Labour had created 2 million extra Mr Davey: The hon. Gentleman and his colleague jobs since 1997. Those people are working, paying tax, from Wales, the hon. Member for Islwyn (Chris Evans), and making their way. have praised the Welsh Government. Can the hon. Of course, we have a deficit, two thirds of which, as Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) explain the Institute for Fiscal Studies acknowledged, was created why the average spend per school pupil in Wales is by the bankers. The other third was due to the fact that, £604 less than in England in 2010-11? in the recession, we invested more than we earned, but there is no apology for that. Yesterday, the Government Geraint Davies: The average spend in Wales is less, attempted to say, “Oh well, we’ll sort out the banking but the reality is that the Welsh Government have given crisis,” but their remedy would take eight years. They an undertaking to increase that spend year on year. In also acknowledged that they would bail out Lehman fact, because the Government are cutting local authority Brothers and others, so that was no real solution. funding by 7% a year for four years, there will be less The big choice is in deciding what the balance should money for education in England. What there is will be be between growth and cuts to get the deficit down, and funnelled into middle-class free schools, to the cost of there is also the issue of timing. We have not heard poorer communities. Wales will put a cap on health much about what a growth strategy would look like. We spending, and more money will go into education. It have seen what a cuts strategy looks like; we are living will have a comprehensive system in which there is more that awful nightmare. What we need in a growth strategy money, instead of cuts, and a system in which people is a strategy for indigenous growth, in which we invest are enabled to go to university. That is investing in the in education, skills, apprenticeships, economic clusters, skills of the future. and an entrepreneurial culture; we have heard some As I have mentioned, UK Trade & Investment has reference to that. We need to build up trade links, which historically been very effective in promoting inward have been savaged by the Government’s disinvestment investment and trade in Britain, but crucially, that relied in regional development agencies, which means that on regional development agencies, which have been UK Trade & Investment cannot market the UK abroad abolished. When I spoke to UKTI in Brussels, Belgium, effectively and get companies to invest in Britain. We and in Düsseldorf, the same message came back: German need to invest in infrastructure and, in particular, in companies would come back with a computer platform, housing, as is mentioned in the motion, to crank up the saying, “We want to put a factory somewhere.” Where economy once again. are the RDAs to draw that down? They have been We need inward investment, resulting from the effective abolished. Well done, the Tories and the Liberals. marketing of Britain—something that has been cut to On infrastructure and construction, the Government the bone. We need to create economic conditions of have abolished the scheme to renew schools, which stability and certainty, not just in Britain but across basically means that construction workers are being Europe and globally, to give business the confidence to laid off. As for future markets, we have to look at invest. We need to spot the obvious fact that the emerging companies such as Tata Steel near Swansea, and Airbus opportunities are in future markets, not least in China in north Wales. Those big consumers of energy are and India. What is the verdict on the Government’s being penalised by the Government and their unilateral efforts so far? Pretty poor, frankly. Small business is carbon pricing. The Government forget that we operate starved of cash from banks. The news of massive cuts in in a European market, and do not understand how the public services means that consumers are saving instead markets work at all. Those companies are part of the of consuming, so companies are not investing in new solution. Tata Steel has a new generation of steel, with jobs. In construction, things are almost as dead as a seven layers, that generates its own heat and energy; that door-nail. reduces the carbon footprint by cladding a building. On education and skills, Government Front Benchers Airbus has a new generation of planes that use 30% less deny that it is possible to send students to university for energy. That is part of the solution, and we should be £3,000, yet in Wales that is precisely what is happening. supporting, not penalising, those big employers and A student from Wales will leave university with a debt companies. of £10,000, but in England, it will be £30,000. If there are three children in a family, that is £100,000 in England, Let me talk about Swansea. I am proud that people in versus £30,000 in Wales. companies such as Amazon are flying the flag and saying, “Come to Swansea.” We are in the premier John Hemming: Does the hon. Gentleman accept league, so we are a global brand. What is stopping us that Wales gets a lot more money per capita through the are the Government, who are cutting the coastguard, Barnett formula? which undermines confidence in tourism and investment 939 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 940 in wind farms offshore, and are stopping the electrification an intervention, about 50% of people who took part in of the railway from Cardiff to Swansea, which would the scheme went on the dole. I accept that there is link us to the European network. We just need a helping genuine concern in all parts of the House about young hand so that we can keep going for success, can build on people, but some of the policies introduced by the previous the intellectual clusters in the two universities in Swansea, Government failed to get to grips with the problem, can build on our team spirit in marketing Swansea, and which should have been acknowledged in the Opposition can make our contribution to a sustainable, inclusive, motion. growth-focused future for the rest of Britain. There is What is to be done? We must improve our schools, enormous opportunity for Britain to get up off the build up vocational education, and encourage the right floor and fight, but it is being held down by the Tories’ climate for employers to create jobs. We are already and Liberals’ ineptitude. seeing a massive expansion in academies, and free schools and simpler budget lines for colleges have been introduced. 6.7 pm All state schools will be assessed on maths and English, Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con): This is a very important and that new focus is yielding results. We must build up debate. As I said in my maiden speech, vocational education. As has been said, the Government “In Essex, nearly 4,000 young people are not in employment, are funding 100,000 sponsored work experience placements education or training, and Harlow is one of the worst-affected for jobless 18 to 21-year olds. All vocational training towns…If we give young people the necessary skills and training, will be free at the point of access, with costs repayable we give them opportunities and jobs for the future.”—[Official only when someone earns a decent salary. As has also Report, 2 June 2010; Vol. 510, c. 488.] been said, record numbers of people are signing up for I went on to say that that is not just about economic apprenticeships—real apprenticeships—and getting to work. efficiency; it is about social justice. That is what the debate The flagship, I believe, will be the 24 university technical is about—real, tangible, long-term opportunities for colleges, which are being driven by Lord Baker and young people, not false hope, short-term Government Lord Adonis. Their vision is for new 14-to-19 apprentice programmes, or a revolving door back to benefits. schools, which will be led by employers and will be It is worth looking at the history of the past few centres of excellence in manufacturing, building and years. In 2000, around 600,000 16 to 24-year-olds were engineering. That will be a conveyor belt to university not in employment, education or training. By 2010, the and high-skilled jobs. The first round of UTCs will be number of jobless had doubled to well over 1 million, announced this autumn, and Harlow college in my where it remains today. constituency has made a strong bid to be one of the first, specialising in building systems and the new internet Sheila Gilmore: If we are to have a history lesson, it is media that are helping to grow our economy at the perhaps pertinent to point out that the rate of youth London TechHub. It is shame that the shadow Secretary unemployment fell during the first years of the Labour of State did not mention UTCs and the advantages that Government. The 2010 figure that all Government they will bring. Members want to quote with such glee was after the recession. One must look at the whole period, and not As has been said, we must encourage the right climate simply take the beginning and end point and imply that for employers to create jobs. Like other hon. Members, the Labour Government did nothing to reduce youth I have employed an apprentice, and I am recruiting unemployment. another one at the moment. However, one problem experienced by my apprentice is that universities did not Robert Halfon: It is interesting to hear that, because give his NVQ the UCAS points that it deserved. youth unemployment rose steadily over the past 10 years. Apprenticeships are much harder in many ways than For those who call for a stimulus at all costs, such as A-levels, and we should recognise that in the UCAS the hon. Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies), system. Elsewhere in the Government there are initiatives that decade is a warning. Even during a boom, we cannot to create a job-friendly climate, including the Work spend our way to full employment. Other factors must programme, lower taxes for lower earners, welfare reform, be taken into account. From 2001, we asked teachers to and cuts in small business tax and corporation tax. In spread themselves too thinly, with too many competing the past few months, I worked with the National Union priorities. Maths and English suffered, and in the past of Students and major UK firms to launch a new 10 years, 500,000 children left primary school unable to apprentice card, which has received strong support from read or write, which is shameful. my hon. Friend the Minister for Further Education, Skills Our business culture is flawed. In Austria and Germany, and Lifelong Learning. It will give apprentices the same for example, one in four businesses offer apprenticeships financial benefits as those for A-level and university students. to young people, but in England it is just one in 10. I congratulate the hon. Member for Newcastle upon Twice as many Germans qualify to become apprentices, Tyne North (Catherine McKinnell) on her push for or gain technical skills, compared with British people. apprenticeships in public sector contracts. I urge the What has gone wrong in the UK for our skills levels to Government to implement that proposal, not just nationally be so low? I accept that the previous Government, as but in local councils. I have called for that repeatedly, many Opposition Members have said, were concerned and I have discussed it with members of Essex council, about youth unemployment, but far too often the schemes which is taking a serious look at it. that were introduced in the past 10 years worked like a The number of jobs available has been discussed, and hamster’s wheel: people were shifted around and around, I want to read something from a recent letter sent to me but they did not get anywhere. by Monster, the jobs company: The future jobs fund, which was celebrated by the “In order to meet…challenges, we have identified that the right hon. Member for Southampton, Itchen (Mr Denham), problem lies, not with the availability of jobs, but the failure to cost a huge amount—£6,500 per placement. As I said in match jobseekers to job vacancies.” 941 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 942

[Robert Halfon] In the UK, the OECD found that 50% of the economic advantage that high-earning fathers have over low-earning That is crucial: it is about information and changing the fathers is passed on to their sons. By contrast, in Australia, culture so that people know what jobs are available. We Canada and the Nordic countries, less than 20% of the must make sure that the National Apprenticeship Service wage advantage is passed on. Analysis undertaken by and other schemes work as they should. In the next few the London School of Economics showed that the weeks, I will launch a parliamentary academy—some bigger a country’s income differences the lower its social hon. Members will have received a letter from me about mobility. The American dream, it seems, is just that, as this—with Martin Bright and his charity New Deal of the US has the lowest social mobility, followed by the the Mind. UK. Again, the Nordic countries are the most socially Youth unemployment is devastating, and if we can mobile. We must look at all those factors in our policies improve school and vocational training— to make sure that we live in a country in which our young people can aspire to achieve their ambitions, and Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. in which they believe there is something for them. Policy reform can and should remove obstacles to Several hon. Members rose— intergenerational social mobility and to promoting economic equality of opportunities for all, but unfortunately Madam Deputy Speaker: Order. May I ask the remaining I see direct parallels with the policies that we endured in six Members who wish to speak—there were only five the 1980s. The cuts to public spending are ideologically on my list—to resume their seats while I am speaking? driven, with scant regard for the human costs. The scale We have to begin the winding-up speeches at 6.40 pm. and pace of the cuts mean that we risk abandoning yet Six Members stood up to speak, which means about another generation. We have already heard about the four minutes each. That is the good news. The bad news scrapping of education maintenance allowance and the is that if everyone takes longer than four minutes someone trebling of university fees, but we have not heard mention will fall off the end of the speakers list, and I am afraid of the introduction of commercial interest rates on that I cannot do anything about that. student loans and how that will make such loans even more off-putting for people from low-income backgrounds. 6.16 pm In addition, the Government have done away with the Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) future jobs fund and fudged the figures on apprenticeships. (Lab): I will be brief, Madam Deputy Speaker. I urge all Members to look closely at opportunities With a few notable exceptions, it is a shame that hon. for all our young people and to support the motion. Members have tended to conduct the debate on party political grounds. We are discussing the future of our 6.20 pm young people, which is much too important for us to take that approach, so I pay tribute to the hon. Members Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab): When young people for North Swindon (Justin Tomlinson) and for Harlow in my Scunthorpe constituency express exasperation (Robert Halfon). I have grave concerns about the about how hard it is to get a job and look me in the eye Government’s policies, particularly the spending cuts and say they have no future, I feel guilty because it is and what they will mean for our young people. our responsibility to ensure that young people have In my constituency, there has been a steady rise in hope. It is our responsibility to ensure that our young unemployment among 16 to 24-year-olds over the past people have a better future than their parents and their 18 months. That was not something that happened grandparents. Now, thanks to the actions of this before the Government took office—there has been a Government, that is in jeopardy. consistent increase in the past 18 months, and I have We all have personal experience of how motivating it looked at the figures for other constituencies, too. As is for someone to get on to a course or into a job. It is for NEET statistics, the figures are reaching 20% in particularly motivating for young people. I know this the north-west. In my constituency, there has been a from my 30 years’ experience in education, most recently 10% increase in unemployment in the past year. In the as principal of a large open-access sixth-form college. 1980s, when I began my working life as a community Students would grow in confidence in their first few worker with unemployed young people, I saw that weeks, encouraged and enthused by teachers and others. unemployment had a significant impact on them. We They would be amazed at their own abilities. We would must not forget the human costs, and I remember that unlock their talent and release their potential. those young people felt abandoned and separate from a We have all observed, I am sure, how someone loses society in which they had no stake. interest in life, becomes irritable with friends and family The hon. Member for Wirral West (Esther McVey) and is in danger of sinking into idleness as a result of said that opportunity is open to everyone if they can weeks of worklessness, and how that same person suddenly find it. That is not the evidence from the OECD’s recent grows in stature and confidence in their first few weeks report, which shows that, of the 30 developed countries, of work. Work is transformational for all of us, but the UK has one of the poorest records for social mobility, particularly for our young people. At the Crosby along with the US, France and Italy. Using income employment bureau I was privileged to witness first changes as a proxy measure for social mobility, the hand the transformational impact of work on youngsters OECD found that a hefty wage premium was associated on the future jobs fund. From being listless and desperate, with growing up in a better educated household, with a they became focused and enterprising. With the vast corresponding penalty for being raised in a less educated majority progressing on to jobs at the end of the family.That was particularly the case in southern European programme, this was a real success for individuals and countries and the UK. for society. 943 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 944

Figures show that one in four 18 to 24-year-olds are and Liberal Democrats run out of speakers a long time out of work, and that is worst for young men. Those not before the end because they have nothing left to say. We in education, employment or training were at a record have had about five speakers in a row from the Labour high of 18.4% last quarter. There is a danger of significant Benches because Government Members have given up. lifelong costs of long-term youth unemployment—a They have no idea what to say about this policy area. generation suffering for the rest of their working lives We could look at education maintenance allowance, from poor job prospects, and a return to the economic, at university tuition fees, as my colleagues have said, or personal and community despair of the 1980s. at the Government’s decision to abolish the future jobs The ladders of opportunity put in place by the Labour fund before they had even assessed its success. What has Government are being systematically kicked away by happened to all those show that we have a Government this Government. EMA, the future jobs fund and the who are careless of the damage that they are doing to September guarantee have all been scrapped, tuition the next generation. Why? Because the young are fees have trebled and student numbers have been slashed. dispossessed, they are less likely to vote and they pay Add to this the chaos in the careers service, which is to less in taxes—but times are changing. The student be debated later, and the dismantling of youth services demonstrations showed that young people are being up and down the land, which is well documented in a politicised as never before. The number of young people Select Committee report, and one wonders why the who have been joining the Labour party in Chesterfield, Government have got it in for young people. coming forward and wanting to have their voice heard EMA was the most transformational thing I have gives me great confidence about what young people will ever seen in my professional experience. It gave young do in future. people hope. It was demonstrably clear from all the We are facing a desperate graduate employment crisis. evidence that EMA impacted on their attendance, their The public sector is not growing. We have hundreds of achievement and their life chances. The fact that it has social work graduates out of work. It is no accident that gone is extremely worrying. Among the colleges in my we have a huge increase in graduate unemployment at constituency, John Leggott college last year received the same time as the public sector cuts. Perhaps that is £865,000 in EMA. This year it has £130,000 in bursaries. because the Government have some sort of plan for a North Lindsey college last year received £1,168,000 in private sector-led recovery. However, the private sector EMA and this year has £187,000 in bursaries. That is a recovery is not doing all that well, as we see from real impact, and it is being felt out there. examples such as Bombardier, where the Government I hope the House rallies behind the motion, recognising had an opportunity to safeguard jobs in British industry that although all of us have not always got it right, this but decided instead to send those jobs overseas. is an opportunity to move forward together in line with In the case of Forgemasters, the Government could the interests of our young people. have taken a decision that would have put Britain at the forefront of a new industry, but instead they pulled the ladder away. We see what they have done to growth in 6.24 pm our economy with the scrapping of the regional Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab): We can tell that we development agencies. In Chesterfield, when Auto have a Tory-led Government when we are back here Windscreens went into liquidation, more than 1,000 again debating how a whole generation can be looking employees turned to the Government for help and no forward to so challenging a future. I was desperately help was forthcoming. disappointed by the speech from the Universities Minister. The future looks bleak for graduates, but it looks He spoke for 28 minutes today and he kept promising even worse for those who have not had the opportunity that he was going to get on to what he was doing for to go to university. In the next debate we will consider young people. I heard him say about four times, “I’m the dreadful mess in the careers service. At every level about tell you what I’m going to do for young people.” we see a Government who are careless about the future He quoted Lord Mandelson and my right hon. Friend for young people and who are setting young people up the Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Mr Brown), to fail. If they do not take action soon, there will be a and he tried to sell us his book. Perhaps we need to buy wasted generation. his book to learn what his policies are, but he did not tell us anything about what the Government’s plan is to try to end the record level of youth unemployment. 6.28 pm The Minister told us that apprenticeships were the Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East way forward, but he was already doing that, so there Cleveland) (Lab): This debate is about the ability to was no reason for any young person listening to the provide skills, work and disciplined, self-organising working debate to leave with any confidence that we had a communities. That in turn provides revenue in tax and Government with a plan that would do something safeguards pensions, services and social security, on about youth unemployment. Never before have young which we all rely to support the next generation. people in our country been faced with such an economic I draw the attention of the House to a response that I assault on all sides. The lesson of our history is that received from the Minister to a written question. I when young people start on the dole, they stay on the asked him: dole. It is so important that we get them into the right “what assessment he has made of the potential effect on youth habits of working from the moment they leave school. unemployment of the change in higher education fee arrangements We urgently need growth in our economy. The Prime in 2012.” Minister said last week that the country was facing a He replied: growth crisis, yet we come to a debate here about the “The change in the fee arrangements enables the Government central issue facing our country, and the Conservatives to continue to finance a high number of places in higher education 945 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 946

[Tom Blenkinsop] 6.32 pm Chris Williamson (Derby North) (Lab): I want to talk for students in 2012, and therefore there is expected to be no adverse impact on youth unemployment as a consequence of the briefly about the promise of Britain and how it applies change.”—[Official Report, 7 September 2011; Vol. 532, c. 721W.] in Derby, with specific reference to the rail industry. Derby is renowned for its railway heritage. We have The poverty of that response from the Minister is been building trains in the city for 180 years, right back surpassed only by the poverty that the Government’s to the 19th century, but we are faced with a serious policy on tuition fees will induce in areas such as mine. situation in which the rail industry in our country hangs Last week Bill Gross of PIMCO said that the market in the balance. The industry has given hope and a good would look favourably on a change of the Government’s future to young people in the city for countless generations. economic plans. That is because the growth forecast has repeatedly been lowered. Inflation today was 4.5% of Before the general election, Members now sitting on the consumer prices index, although that is not reflected the Government Benches said that they would review in pay increases. We have seen an increase in unemployment, all the major rail contracts, so I assume that they looked massive public sector redundancies and the private sector in detail at the contracts before eventually deciding not slowing down and building up for redundancies. In to award the vital Thameslink line to Bombardier, manufacturing and construction purchasing managers’ which would have provided employment and security index figures have declined continuously in the past few for thousands of people in my city, including young months under this Government people with apprenticeships, and instead awarded it to Siemens, which will build the trains in Germany. It Middlesbrough, unfortunately, tops the league in the seems to me that Ministers have been very lax in their north-east as the area with the highest youth unemployment, scrutiny of the tender specifications, because the invitation with 31.6% of economically active young workers aged to tender clearly— 16 to 24 resident in the borough out of work. It is followed by Redcar and Cleveland, two boroughs that I Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con): On a point of order, also represent. Across the UK as a whole, almost one in Madam Deputy Speaker. I thought that this debate was five economically active young workers aged 16 to about opportunities for the next generation, not Bombardier 24 are unemployed. Around 949,000 16 to 24-year-olds railways. are out of work, following a rise of 15,000 in the last quarter, which is approaching levels last seen in the Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Mr Halfon, 1980s. Overall, unemployment rose by 39,000 in the I think that you will find that that is a matter for me, not three quarters to June this year, to top almost 2.5 million. you. The hon. Member for Derby North (Chris Williamson) The number of jobless women benefit claimants rose by will return to the debate. 15,600 to over half a million, the highest rate since 1996. Chris Williamson: I am trying to make the point that What is especially concerning for me, coming from an denying Bombardier the opportunity to fulfil this contract area where the mass unemployment of men from 1979 denies future generations the opportunity to enjoy long-term onwards led to a cultural phenomenon of long-term employment in the rail industry. This is a serious situation, family unemployment, is that we are now seeing massive because we face the prospect of losing the ability to unemployment for women. We have not seen such build a train ever again in this country—the country unemployment rates since 1988. That has a massive that gave the world the railways. We will never again be cultural impact on constituencies like mine, where we able to build a train because of a decision that this have had fathers, brothers and uncles unemployed, because Government have taken. The specifications of the invitation we will now see mothers, aunties and sisters unemployed to tender were very clear that the successful bidder must for the long term, too, as a direct result of these policies. have a proven solution. Siemens does not have a proven However, these concerns seem to be falling on deaf ears solution. It does not have a lightweight bogie. The in the Government. The Office for Budget Responsibility, tender goes on to state that it should be deliverable— which was set up by the Government, knows that the Government will have to borrow £46 billion more as a Madam Deputy Speaker: Order. Mr Williamson, I am result of their economic policies. That means that 200,000 sure that you are illustrating a point, as you said, and more people will become unemployed, also as a result mean to address the topic of the debate in your short of those policies. contribution, but it would be good if you talked about I suggest to the Government that their rebalancing of that topic, rather than the tender. the economy, along with the recovery, seems to be flatlining. The latest survey data from business organisations Chris Williamson: I am, Madam Deputy Speaker. I suggest that the manufacturing revival has run out of am merely pointing out that the Government have not momentum. Even as businesses complain about engineering fulfilled their obligations and are thereby denying skills shortages, the unemployment rate remains the highest opportunities for apprenticeships for building the lightweight in the north-east, at 10%. The fear is that the skills bogies, the carriages that will run on the Thameslink line. hoarding that we saw before is not happening. The There are opportunities to terminate that contract. I unfortunate position we are in at the moment is that the will not go into the detail in case you call me to order, same people are now going back on short-term working Madam Deputy Speaker, and because I want to finish agreements that they had only recently come out of. We my contribution shortly. However, I must refer to what are returning to a period in which the economy could the Prime Minister said when he brought his Cabinet to go either way. One suggestion that the Minister might Derby in March. He said: like to make to the Chancellor is to reverse the CFP “The point of the Cabinet today is to ask one fundamental policy, please look at primary industries, such as the question: what is it that we can do in government to help the chemical and steel industries, and please do not put economy to rebalance, to grow and for businesses to start up, to manufacturing in jeopardy from foreign competition. invest and employ people?” 947 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 948

I say to the Prime Minister and to the Government that 6.39 pm they should honour the commitment he gave to the people of Derby and the people of this country when he Mr Gareth Thomas (Harrow West) (Lab/Co-op): We brought his Cabinet there. They should give young have, as ever, had an interesting debate, with the first people in my city hope for a future in the rail industry, Back-Bench contribution coming from my hon. Friend and give our country hope that we can continue to have the Member for West Bromwich West (Mr Bailey), who a rail industry long into the future. If they do not do rightly raised concerns about young people being deterred that, I fear that people in Derby, and across the country, from going to university. will be denied forever the opportunity to work building My hon. Friends the Members for North West Durham trains in the rail industry. (Pat Glass) and for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin), in powerful speeches, rightly outlined the huge mistake that the Government have made in axing the education maintenance 6.36 pm allowance. Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): I shall address My hon. Friend the Member for Islwyn (Chris Evans) first some of the points that the Minister made, yet set out the stark difference between a Labour Government again, at the outset of the debate, about the inter- in Wales, committed to EMA and keeping tuition fees generational issue. What he said is a complete red down, and the Government here in Westminster. herring. His argument is that the problems that young My hon. Friend the Member for Newcastle upon people face today were caused by the previous generation Tyne North (Catherine McKinnell) rightly raised concerns stealing their children’s future. I declare an interest, as about what axing Aimhigher means for the delivery of one of the baby boom generation—the younger end of better access to university, and again she rightly pressed it. I accept that in many ways we are a fortunate Ministers to look afresh at the case she has been making generation. We are fortunate because we are the children for the use of public procurement to drive more of the welfare state. We are the ones who benefited from apprenticeship places. the better education, the better housing and the better health. We were the children raised on the cod liver oil My hon. Friends the Members for Swansea West and that peculiar-tasting orange juice. I do not know (Geraint Davies) and for Chesterfield (Toby Perkins) how many Members present remember that, but it did highlighted the absence of a clear and coherent growth us a great deal of good. strategy—a point that my right hon. Friend the Member for Southampton, Itchen (Mr Denham) clearly highlighted Government Members who are so concerned about in his opening remarks. social mobility should consider that the reason why social mobility rose for the generation who entered My hon. Friend the Member for Oldham East and adulthood in the 1970s was precisely because they had those Saddleworth (Debbie Abrahams) dwelt on concerns opportunities. If social mobility is held to have stalled about the impact on future social mobility of the measures in subsequent years, we must look at what was happening from the governing parties. when the young people of the first decade of this My hon. Friend the Member for Derby North (Chris century were growing up—the 1980s and early 1990s. Williamson) quite rightly exposed the Government’s Social mobility is a long-term matter. This is not failures on Bombardier, offering a devastating indictment about the selfishness of a generation, but about the of the Government’s approach to manufacturing industry way that we structure society. If we are to structure and of the future opportunities for young people not society and the economy for future generations, we only in that business but, as other Members have said, must put in place the sorts of measures that benefited in other firms such as Sheffield Forgemasters. us. My hon. Friend the Member for Middlesbrough Housing is extremely important. In Edinburgh, and I South and East Cleveland (Tom Blenkinsop raised the suspect in many other parts of the country, the problem fears that young people in his constituency will be is not planning, despite the planning controversy that deterred from going to university, and he also highlighted seems to have engulfed those on the Government the growing concern about rising unemployment among Benches. The problem is about money to fund affordable women, particularly in his area. housing. We have outstanding planning consents for buildings that are not being built. We have regeneration My hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh East schemes that have stalled after demolition has been (Sheila Gilmore) joined in the concern about the impact carried out, because we cannot afford to build. We on future mobility of the Government’s measures, but have a plan for regenerating our entire docklands area. she also highlighted the need for more social housing The development framework was developed five years funding in her constituency in particular, but also nationally. ago, before the recession, for 18,000 homes, but it has We also heard from the hon. Members for Wirral stalled. West (Esther McVey), for Worcester (Mr Walker), for How do we unlock that? We could do it by making Solihull (Lorely Burt), for North Swindon (Justin the investment that would allow affordable homes to be Tomlinson), for Strangford (Jim Shannon), for Birmingham, built. That would help to resolve the problem of young Yardley (John Hemming) and for Harlow (Robert Halfon), people being unable to afford housing. It would also but, apart from the hon. Member for Harlow, who create jobs in the private sector, and apprenticeships, joined the call from Opposition Members for a far which other Members have spoken about. That is very greater effort by the Government to use public procurement important, and we need to put it in place. That is where to secure still more apprenticeships, we heard little from the investment should be going. We need to think about Government Members, including little sadly from the that very seriously, because if we do it, there will be a Minister for Universities and Science, the right hon. future for our children. Member for Havant (Mr Willetts), who opened for the 949 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 950

[Mr Gareth Thomas] auction of places to the lowest bidder in order to help close the funding hole that trebling tuition fees has Government, that will encourage Britain’s next generation created in the Government’s higher education budget. to believe that this Administration are not playing fast and loose with their prospects. Mr Willetts: The shadow Minister attacks our higher We had no apology for the decision to treble tuition education policies, but are the Labour Opposition fees, no apology still for axing the future jobs fund; no committed to reversing our increase in tuition fees? apology for scrapping education maintenance allowance; no apology for an economic policy that is cutting our Mr Thomas: My right hon. Friend the Member for deficit too far, too fast; and no apology for its devastating Southampton, Itchen set out in his opening remarks impact on prospects for the next generation. what Labour would have done had we been in office. The Government instead claim that the impact of The Minister will recognise that we have in place a their deficit reduction plans will be shared, but the detailed policy review, but there was absolutely no truth, as the Institute for Fiscal Studies revealed this reason why his party needed to cut university funding week, is very different. It is the next generation in by as much as it did or needed to see—as a result— particular who are bearing the brunt of the Government’s university fees rise so much. misplaced economic plans. When almost 1 million young Instead, the right hon. Gentleman is taking places people are out of work and Government policies are from universities with international reputations and having little or no positive impact, it is surely time for seeking to auction them off to the lowest bidder. He the Government to come up with a plan B. Leaving makes much of student choice, but it will not be students young people on the dole is a waste not just of talent who decide which universities get extra places in that but of money, because it is pushing up the benefits bill. auction. One would have hoped that the current generation of The Minister, under pressure back in April, praised Conservatives had learned the lessons of the 1980s. For London Metropolitan university for keeping its fees years back then, even when recessions were officially below £9,000, but just days after his praise London Met over, youth unemployment continued to rise, and that is announced that 400 courses were being closed; and in why action is needed now to prevent another lost generation July, Carl Lygo, the chief executive of BPP, one of the of young people. Thanks to Labour’s youth jobs new providers that the right hon. Gentleman wants to programme, youth unemployment was falling. Now, see do more, said that his institution would be forced to with the future jobs fund axed, youth unemployment is increase staff-student ratios as it expanded. With higher rising. tuition fees on the one hand, and cuts in courses and We have also had to listen to the complacent assertion worse staff-student ratios on the other, this is a Government from Conservative and Liberal Democrat Back Benchers who clearly think that such measures are a price worth that trebling tuition fees will not discourage the brightest paying. “And the…financial cost”—these are not my and best of the next generation from going to university. words, but those of the independent Higher Education Never mind that independent analysts, such as London Policy Institute— Economics, advisers to Lord Browne’s inquiry, or the “to students and taxpayers—is likely to be considerable.” London School of Economics’ centre for the economics of education, both predict that the numbers of those As the Minister said in his opening remarks, the going to university will drop. Secretary of State—in his more saintly past—railed against the levels of personal debt. Now he aspires to huge increases in the levels of debt that students face on Robert Halfon: The hon. Gentleman says that graduation. If that were not bad enough, the Higher youth unemployment was falling under Labour, but Education Policy Institute also found in its analysis that Office for National Statistics figures show that from 1997 to 2010 it increased by 39.2%. Will he explain that, “social mobility is likely to be…” please? a “…victim of the Government’s plans, and the new methods of Mr Thomas: As my right hon. Friend the Member for allocating resources and controlling numbers look likely to Southampton, Itchen pointed out in his opening remarks, reinforce…disadvantage rather than remove it.” youth unemployment was actually falling under the The Conservative party is damaging social mobility vast majority of our period in office. Of course, there and entrenching disadvantage. Why, who on earth could was a global recession, and youth unemployment rose have predicted that? Almost 2,000 university nursing during that time, but thanks to Labour’s jobs fund places and 4,000 university teacher training places have youth unemployment was actually coming down when gone this coming academic year; 10,000 extra student we left office. places were axed last year by the former Chief Secretary Perhaps we need also to dwell on the quality of the to the Treasury, the right hon. Member for Yeovil higher education that will be available to young people. (Mr Laws); and 10,000 extra places are being axed next Before the summer recess, the Minister for Universities year. Each one is an opportunity gone for the brightest and Science presented a White Paper that could have and best of the next generation to fulfil their hopes and meant a dynamic future for universities and their students, their ambitions. that could have been the centre of our country’s plans The apprenticeships guarantee scheme has been axed, to rebalance the economy and that could have helped to EMA has been ended, there is rising homelessness and drive the growth of new jobs in the new industries; we have a Government in need of a plan B. They are instead, we had little more than a Coulson-esque smoke leaving young people with a more uncertain future than and mirrors exercise to try to disguise the coming at any time in the recent past. 951 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 952

The Government need a serious strategy for growth; Mr Thomas: If the hon. Gentleman aspires, as he they need a plan B; the motion offers them one, and I says, to high-quality apprenticeships, why is he part of a commend it to the House. Government who have abolished the apprenticeships guarantee?

6.49 pm Mr Davey: We are doing a lot better than under the The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, apprenticeships guarantee. The hon. Gentleman should Innovation and Skills (Mr Edward Davey): I welcome have apologised for his motion, because, as my right this debate because I believe that all Members of this hon. Friend the Minister for Universities and Science House came into politics with the intention of trying to clearly showed, it does not tell the real story—the ensure that the next generation has greater opportunities success story—about apprenticeships by suggesting that than the current generation. It is a debate that we need it is a negative story. The truth is that the absolute to take very seriously because there is a real problem in number of all apprenticeships is up, as is the absolute our country, and has been for many years, regarding number of young people on apprenticeships. opportunities for the most vulnerable and disadvantaged I am afraid that there was some misunderstanding of in our society. The UK’s performance in relation to that success story, despite the support for our overall youngsters who have never been in education, employment policy. That is not surprising, in a way, because Labour’s or training has been lamentable for many years; we have record is surprisingly poor in this respect. As my hon. been near the bottom of the OECD table for a very long Friends the Members for Wirral West (Esther McVey) time. The youngsters who have left school, are not and for Solihull (Lorely Burt) said, under Labour youth looking for work and are not in training are those we unemployment increased by 40%, and the number of should most worry about because their opportunities NEETs increased. One of the most surprising facts is are most scarred, and they are out of contact with the that as the number of NEETs was increasing under the many people who could help them. If we do not give Labour Government, it was falling internationally, so opportunities to those groups of young people, the we fell behind Hungary, Greece and the Slovak Republic scars will be with them for life, and it will be a big loss to in what we were doing for the most vulnerable young our whole economy and society; we need a national people in our society. That is not a record for Labour to mission to focus on them. be proud of. We heard passionate contributions from many Members in all parts of the House. There was a degree of consensus Mr Denham: The hon. Gentleman made a big point on apprenticeships. The hon. Member for Newcastle about statistics. Does he accept that the size of the upon Tyne North (Catherine McKinnell) and my hon. cohort of young people rose massively during the years Friends the Members for Harlow, for Worcester when Labour was in power, and that that is why we are (Mr Walker) and for North Swindon (Justin Tomlinson) right to say that up until the recession the rate of young talked about the important opportunities provided by people not in education, training or employment fell? the increase in apprenticeships. I was particularly impressed to hear about the apprenticeships fair being organised Mr Davey: The right hon. Gentleman will not admit by my hon. Friend the Member for Worcester and the that the percentage of unemployed young people increased. increase in apprenticeships that my hon. Friends the That takes account of all the issues that he is trying to Members for Burnley (Gordon Birtwistle) and for wriggle out of. Eastbourne (Stephen Lloyd) have managed to achieve There were complaints about parts of the coalition’s in working with businesses in their areas. policies, particularly on education maintenance allowance. There was some debate about the numbers involved. We heard impassioned speeches from the hon. Members This is only the second time that I have been able to for North West Durham (Pat Glass) and for Scunthorpe address the House on apprenticeships. The first time (Nic Dakin); they both have a lot of knowledge in this was towards the beginning of this Government’s time in area and I listened to them intently. The hon. Member office, when Labour Front Benchers pressed me on for North West Durham said that she was particularly whether our target of 50,000 apprenticeships in our first concerned, rightly, about the outcomes of the most year would be hit. I was rather nervous about responding disadvantaged. However, she failed to recognise that to that, and I said that I hoped it would. I could not our reforms—our different approach—to EMA will have told the House then that we would not just hit it mean that more resources are targeted at the most but do it twice over, doubling our target with 100,000 disadvantaged. The 12,000 most disadvantaged young new apprenticeships in our first year—a record that we people will get up to £1,200 in a bursary that will help are proud of. There is a lot of enthusiasm among them more than EMA managed to do. I am afraid that workers and businesses up and down the country for her criticism ought to be of the Labour Government. our approach to apprenticeships. Two of the coalition’s policies that are vital for young There was also some debate about the quality of people did not receive the attention they deserved. The apprenticeships—an important issue. We aspire to ensure first of those is a policy that we should celebrate across that the apprenticeship is the gold standard approach to this House because it was introduced by the previous vocational training. We want to ensure that in putting Government—increasing the participation age in education this investment into the apprenticeships scheme, we and training. We had to make a difficult decision during manage to reshape it. I have talked about the idea of the spending review about whether this Government access to apprenticeships to ensure that people who are would be able to find the funds to continue with that unable to persuade employers to take them on have the policy. It was a real challenge, but we found the money chance to experience that learning. We also want to despite the problems. The shadow Secretary of State look at higher apprenticeships. complains that we have somehow targeted young people 953 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 954

[Mr Davey] Cryer, John Jones, Helen Cunningham, Alex Jones, Mr Kevan in our policies, but nothing could be further from the Cunningham, Mr Jim Jones, Susan Elan truth. Despite the financial situation, we are going Cunningham, Tony Jowell, rh Tessa forward with raising the participation age in education Curran, Margaret Joyce, Eric and training to 17 in 2013 and to 18 in 2015. We should Dakin, Nic Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald Danczuk, Simon Keeley, Barbara be proud of that policy. We have gone further than the Darling, rh Mr Alistair Kendall, Liz previous Government did. We have increased the number David, Mr Wayne Khan, rh Sadiq of trials to ensure that the roll-out of the policy is more Davies, Geraint Lavery, Ian effective, and we have freed up local authorities to come De Piero, Gloria Lazarowicz, Mark up with new, more imaginative ways to deliver on it. Denham, rh Mr John Leslie, Chris These are the sorts of policies that will bring real Dobbin, Jim Lewis, Mr Ivan opportunities for the most disadvantaged in our society. Docherty, Thomas Lloyd, Tony Secondly, there are the reforms to vocational education Dodds, rh Mr Nigel Llwyd, rh Mr Elfyn that we plan to take forward following the report by Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M. Long, Naomi Professor Alison Wolf. She shook up the cosy consensus Donohoe, Mr Brian H. Love, Mr Andrew Doran, Mr Frank MacNeil, Mr Angus Brendan that was allowed to develop under the previous Government Dowd, Jim MacShane, rh Mr Denis and made it clear that things were not all hunky-dory Doyle, Gemma Mactaggart, Fiona and that we needed to back apprenticeships, which the Dromey, Jack Mahmood, Shabana Government were doing, but also, crucially, to increase Dugher, Michael Marsden, Mr Gordon the quality of vocational education and ensure that Eagle, Ms Angela McCabe, Steve those on such courses still managed to achieve basic Eagle, Maria McCann, Mr Michael skills in maths and English. This Government will take Edwards, Jonathan McCarthy, Kerry forward her recommendations because we believe that Efford, Clive McClymont, Gregg that will make a real difference. Elliott, Julie McDonagh, Siobhain Ellman, Mrs Louise McDonnell, Dr Alasdair We have discovered a number of things today. We Engel, Natascha McDonnell, John have discovered that there is agreement across the House Esterson, Bill McFadden, rh Mr Pat that issues of youth unemployment and the need to Evans, Chris McGovern, Alison increase opportunities for young people are a challenge Field, rh Mr Frank McGovern, Jim and a problem, and have been for many years, and that Fitzpatrick, Jim McGuire, rh Mrs Anne many of the Government’s policies, particularly on Flello, Robert McKechin, Ann apprenticeships, are a real way forward in tackling Flint, rh Caroline McKenzie, Mr Iain them. We have discovered that things got worse under Flynn, Paul McKinnell, Catherine the Labour Government, particularly for the most Fovargue, Yvonne Meacher, rh Mr Michael disadvantaged young people. We have discovered that, Francis, Dr Hywel Meale, Sir Alan despite the rhetoric of Labour Members, this Government Gardiner, Barry Mearns, Ian are determined really to do something for young people Gilmore, Sheila Michael, rh Alun and to put social mobility at the heart of our plans to Glass, Pat Miller, Andrew succeed where the previous Government failed. Glindon, Mrs Mary Moon, Mrs Madeleine Goggins, rh Paul Morden, Jessica Question put. Goodman, Helen Morrice, Graeme (Livingston) The House divided: Ayes 234, Noes 297. Greatrex, Tom Morris, Grahame M. Green, Kate (Easington) Division No. 348] [6.58 pm Greenwood, Lilian Mudie, Mr George Griffith, Nia Munn, Meg AYES Gwynne, Andrew Murphy, rh Mr Jim Abbott, Ms Diane Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben Hain, rh Mr Peter Murphy, rh Paul Abrahams, Debbie Brennan, Kevin Hanson, rh Mr David Murray, Ian Alexander, rh Mr Douglas Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Harman, rh Ms Harriet Nandy, Lisa Alexander, Heidi Brown, Mr Russell Harris, Mr Tom O’Donnell, Fiona Ali, Rushanara Bryant, Chris Havard, Mr Dai Onwurah, Chi Allen, Mr Graham Buck, Ms Karen Healey, rh John Owen, Albert Anderson, Mr David Burden, Richard Hendrick, Mark Paisley, Ian Ashworth, Jonathan Burnham, rh Andy Hepburn, Mr Stephen Pearce, Teresa Austin, Ian Campbell, Mr Alan Heyes, David Perkins, Toby Bailey, Mr Adrian Campbell, Mr Gregory Hillier, Meg Phillipson, Bridget Bain, Mr William Campbell, Mr Ronnie Hilling, Julie Pound, Stephen Balls, rh Ed Caton, Martin Hodge, rh Margaret Qureshi, Yasmin Banks, Gordon Chapman, Mrs Jenny Hoey, Kate Raynsford, rh Mr Nick Barron, rh Mr Kevin Clark, Katy Hood, Mr Jim Reed, Mr Jamie Beckett, rh Margaret Coaker, Vernon Hopkins, Kelvin Reeves, Rachel Begg, Dame Anne Coffey, Ann Hosie, Stewart Reynolds, Jonathan Bell, Sir Stuart Connarty, Michael Irranca-Davies, Huw Riordan, Mrs Linda Benn, rh Hilary Cooper, Rosie Jackson, Glenda Robertson, Angus Benton, Mr Joe Corbyn, Jeremy James, Mrs Siân C. Robertson, John Berger, Luciana Crausby, Mr David Jamieson, Cathy Robinson, Mr Geoffrey Blackman-Woods, Roberta Creagh, Mary Johnson, rh Alan Rotheram, Steve Blears, rh Hazel Creasy, Stella Johnson, Diana Roy, Lindsay Blenkinsop, Tom Cruddas, Jon Jones, Graham Ruane, Chris 955 Opportunities for the Next Generation13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Opportunities for the Next Generation 956

Ruddock, rh Joan Twigg, Derek Freeman, George Leech, Mr John Sarwar, Anas Twigg, Stephen Freer, Mike Lefroy, Jeremy Seabeck, Alison Umunna, Mr Chuka Fullbrook, Lorraine Leigh, Mr Edward Shannon, Jim Vaz, Valerie Fuller, Richard Leslie, Charlotte Sharma, Mr Virendra Walley, Joan Gale, Mr Roger Letwin, rh Mr Oliver Sheerman, Mr Barry Watson, Mr Tom Garnier, Mr Edward Lewis, Brandon Sheridan, Jim Weir, Mr Mike Garnier, Mark Lewis, Dr Julian Shuker, Gavin Whiteford, Dr Eilidh Gauke, Mr David Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian Simpson, David Whitehead, Dr Alan George, Andrew Lilley, rh Mr Peter Slaughter, Mr Andy Wicks, rh Malcolm Gibb, Mr Nick Lloyd, Stephen Smith, rh Mr Andrew Williams, Hywel Gilbert, Stephen Lopresti, Jack Smith, Angela Williamson, Chris Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl Lord, Jonathan Smith, Nick Wilson, Phil Glen, John Loughton, Tim Smith, Owen Winnick, Mr David Goldsmith, Zac Lumley, Karen Spellar, rh Mr John Winterton, rh Ms Rosie Goodwill, Mr Robert Macleod, Mary Straw, rh Mr Jack Wishart, Pete Grant, Mrs Helen Maude, rh Mr Francis Stringer, Graham Wood, Mike Gray, Mr James Maynard, Paul Sutcliffe, Mr Gerry Woodcock, John Grayling, rh Chris McCartney, Jason Tami, Mark Woodward, rh Mr Shaun Green, Damian McCartney, Karl Thomas, Mr Gareth Wright, David Greening, Justine McIntosh, Miss Anne Thornberry, Emily Wright, Mr Iain Grieve, rh Mr Dominic McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick Timms, rh Stephen Tellers for the Ayes: Griffiths, Andrew McPartland, Stephen Trickett, Jon Mr David Hamilton and Gummer, Ben McVey, Esther Turner, Karl Lyn Brown Gyimah, Mr Sam Mensch, Louise Hague, rh Mr William Menzies, Mark Halfon, Robert Metcalfe, Stephen NOES Hammond, rh Mr Philip Mills, Nigel Adams, Nigel Cairns, Alun Hammond, Stephen Milton, Anne Afriyie, Adam Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Hancock, Matthew Mitchell, rh Mr Andrew Aldous, Peter Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair Hancock, Mr Mike Mordaunt, Penny Alexander, rh Danny Carmichael, Neil Harper, Mr Mark Morgan, Nicky Amess, Mr David Carswell, Mr Douglas Harrington, Richard Morris, Anne Marie Andrew, Stuart Cash, Mr William Harris, Rebecca Morris, David Arbuthnot, rh Mr James Chishti, Rehman Hart, Simon Morris, James Baker, Norman Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth Harvey, Nick Mosley, Stephen Baker, Steve Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan Mowat, David Baldry, Tony Coffey, Dr Thérèse Heald, Oliver Mulholland, Greg Baldwin, Harriett Collins, Damian Heath, Mr David Munt, Tessa Barclay, Stephen Colvile, Oliver Hemming, John Murray, Sheryll Barker, Gregory Cox, Mr Geoffrey Henderson, Gordon Murrison, Dr Andrew Baron, Mr John Crabb, Stephen Hendry, Charles Neill, Robert Bebb, Guto Crockart, Mike Herbert, rh Nick Newmark, Mr Brooks Beith, rh Sir Alan Crouch, Tracey Hinds, Damian Newton, Sarah Bellingham, Mr Henry Davey, Mr Edward Hoban, Mr Mark Nokes, Caroline Benyon, Richard Davies, David T. C. Hollingbery, George Norman, Jesse Berry, Jake (Monmouth) Hollobone, Mr Philip Nuttall, Mr David Bingham, Andrew Davies, Glyn Hopkins, Kris Offord, Mr Matthew Binley, Mr Brian Davies, Philip Howell, John Ollerenshaw, Eric Birtwistle, Gordon Davis, rh Mr David Hughes, rh Simon Opperman, Guy Blackman, Bob de Bois, Nick Huhne, rh Chris Patel, Priti Blackwood, Nicola Dinenage, Caroline Hunt, rh Mr Jeremy Penning, Mike Blunt, Mr Crispin Djanogly, Mr Jonathan Hunter, Mark Percy, Andrew Boles, Nick Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Huppert, Dr Julian Phillips, Stephen Bone, Mr Peter Doyle-Price, Jackie Hurd, Mr Nick Pickles, rh Mr Eric Bradley, Karen Drax, Richard Jackson, Mr Stewart Pincher, Christopher Brake, rh Tom Duncan, rh Mr Alan James, Margot Poulter, Dr Daniel Bray, Angie Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain Javid, Sajid Pugh, John Brazier, Mr Julian Dunne, Mr Philip Jenkin, Mr Bernard Raab, Mr Dominic Bridgen, Andrew Ellis, Michael Johnson, Gareth Randall, rh Mr John Brine, Mr Steve Ellison, Jane Jones, Andrew Reckless, Mark Brokenshire, James Ellwood, Mr Tobias Jones, Mr David Redwood, rh Mr John Brooke, Annette Elphicke, Charlie Kelly, Chris Rees-Mogg, Jacob Bruce, Fiona Eustice, George Kennedy, rh Mr Charles Reevell, Simon Bruce, rh Malcolm Evans, Graham Knight, rh Mr Greg Reid, Mr Alan Buckland, Mr Robert Evans, Jonathan Kwarteng, Kwasi Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm Burley, Mr Aidan Evennett, Mr David Laing, Mrs Eleanor Robertson, Hugh Burns, rh Mr Simon Fabricant, Michael Lancaster, Mark Robertson, Mr Laurence Burrowes, Mr David Farron, Tim Latham, Pauline Rogerson, Dan Burstow, Paul Featherstone, Lynne Laws, rh Mr David Rudd, Amber Burt, Alistair Field, Mr Mark Leadsom, Andrea Ruffley, Mr David Burt, Lorely Foster, rh Mr Don Lee, Jessica Russell, Bob Byles, Dan Francois, rh Mr Mark Lee, Dr Phillip Rutley, David 957 Opportunities for the Next Generation 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 958

Sanders, Mr Adrian Vara, Mr Shailesh Careers Service (Young People) Sandys, Laura Vickers, Martin Scott, Mr Lee Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa Selous, Andrew Walker, Mr Charles 7.15 pm Shapps, rh Grant Walker, Mr Robin Andy Burnham (Leigh) (Lab): I beg to move, Sharma, Alok Wallace, Mr Ben Shelbrooke, Alec Walter, Mr Robert That this House believes that the Government should act Shepherd, Mr Richard Ward, Mr David urgently to guarantee face-to-face careers advice for all young Skidmore, Chris Watkinson, Angela people in schools. Smith, Miss Chloe Weatherley, Mike The motion is in my name and that of my right hon. Smith, Henry Webb, Steve Friend the Member for Southampton, Itchen (Mr Smith, Sir Robert Wharton, James Denham). The House this afternoon debated the challenges Soames, rh Nicholas Wheeler, Heather facing the coming generation; this evening, it is right to Spencer, Mr Mark White, Chris consider how, as a society, we help all young people to Stevenson, John Whittaker, Craig face up to those challenges, and how we give them the Stewart, Bob Whittingdale, Mr John advice and support that they will need to find their way Stewart, Rory Wiggin, Bill in a changing and highly competitive world. Stride, Mel Willetts, rh Mr David Stuart, Mr Graham Williams, Mr Mark It would seem that our debate is well timed. After Stunell, Andrew Williams, Roger today’s bombshell from the Boundary Commission, Sturdy, Julian Williams, Stephen perhaps a few more of us all of a sudden have a keener Swales, Ian Williamson, Gavin interest in preserving a good-quality careers service. Swayne, rh Mr Desmond Willott, Jenny However, our woes are nothing compared with the Swire, rh Mr Hugo Wilson, Mr Rob dejection, disappointment and sheer hopelessness that Syms, Mr Robert Wollaston, Dr Sarah many of our young constituents are experiencing. Jobs Tapsell, rh Sir Peter Wright, Jeremy are getting harder to find, with close to 1 million young Teather, Sarah Wright, Simon people now unemployed. Many are struggling to stay in Timpson, Mr Edward Yeo, Mr Tim education or training with the loss of the education Tomlinson, Justin Young, rh Sir George Tredinnick, David maintenance allowance and local authority travel grants. Zahawi, Nadhim Truss, Elizabeth For a growing number, university is quite simply no Turner, Mr Andrew Tellers for the Noes: longer seen as a realistic option. Tyrie, Mr Andrew James Duddridge and Not surprisingly, some young people are feeling lost Uppal, Paul Norman Lamb and do not know where to turn. Some are able to fall back on strong families and family connections to open Question accordingly negatived. doors, but that is not available to all young people. Those who feel lost need good careers and life advice more than ever. What is the Government’s answer? Having kicked away the ladders of support—the EMA, the future jobs fund and Aimhigher—they are now pulling up the drawbridge, leaving young people alone in the dark to fend for themselves. Let me say at the beginning that this debate is not about preserving the status quo, and nor is it special pleading for the Connexions service. The previous Labour Government commissioned a report that highlighted problems with that service and we accepted that there were areas where it needed to improve. I have not come to the House tonight to say, “Nothing must change.” The Opposition have previously said that we have no real disagreement with the Government over their vision for an all-age careers service. However, with every day that passes, it becomes less likely that the Government’s vision will ever become a reality, because careers services are disappearing, advisers are being made redundant, and young people are being left in the lurch. Schools are being given the statutory responsibility to provide careers advice, but no money to do so. It is a complete mess. Ministers promised a transition plan months ago, and tonight we ask them this simple question: where is it? They are treating dedicated careers professionals with contempt, and owe them the courtesy of some answers. That is why the Opposition have brought Ministers to the House this evening. We appreciate why the Minister for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning is not here today—the Opposition wish him well—but why is the Secretary of State for Education not leading this debate for the 959 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 960

Government? Where is he? I say this to the Minister of left a note at the Treasury saying, “There is no money State, Department for Education, the hon. Member for left.” There he has his answer. He should talk to his own Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb): what is colleagues, not lecture the rest of us. more important when young people all over the country face the difficulty of finding a job, uncertainty about Andy Burnham: The Conservative party has to change their futures and worries about the cost of education? the record. The hon. Gentleman stood for young people’s What could be more important than the Government votes— ensuring that those young people have access to good advice? Why is the Secretary of State not here to answer Alok Sharma indicated assent. those concerns? Andy Burnham: He is nodding. He promised them the The Minister of State, Department for Education education maintenance allowance, did he not? (Mr Nick Gibb): My right hon. Friend sends his apologies to the House, but he is meeting 100 outstanding head Alok Sharma indicated dissent. teachers in Nottingham who have travelled there to meet him to discuss the opening of the first 100 teaching Andy Burnham: He saw his Prime Minister make a schools. That is why he cannot be here. If it had not personal promise to those young people that they would been for that, he would have been here. continue to have their EMA. He also stood on a manifesto promising £200 million for an all-age careers service. If Andy Burnham: I thank the Minister for his reply, but he could not deliver those promises, should he not now debates in the House used to be more important than apologise to the House for seeking the votes of young that. This is an urgent situation facing the careers people in his constituency on a false premise? That service in this country. This is more urgent and it needs speaks for itself. to be addressed by the Secretary of State. We need him to provide leadership. Frankly, he has provided none to Our motion is deliberately broad so that we do not date on this important issue. On his watch, the careers get drawn into a debate about the merits of one service service in England has gone into meltdown, which is versus another. I have said that we are prepared to unforgivable considering all the pressures on young support the Government in their vision for an all-age people today. He has shown next to no interest in this careers service. We want to work with the Government subject and has his head permanently stuck in an ivory to make that service as good as it can be so that it is fit tower. Instead of obsessing about Oxbridge, he needs to for purpose in these times and for the challenges facing start engaging with the real world and the challenges young people. The motion is simple, then, and makes that young people face in trying to get on in life. two requests. I might say in passing that it is drawn directly from the report, published in the summer, to the Derek Twigg (Halton) (Lab): My right hon. Friend is Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister from right to pay tribute to dedicated careers professionals, the advocate for access to education, the right hon. who do a superb job, but is there not complete confusion Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon over who provides advice to young people and those not Hughes), who I am pleased to see in his place. In fact, in education, employment or training? Also, where has the motion repeats the words of his recommendation the money gone? verbatim. I hope, therefore, that he can support us this evening, given that the motion is his own Andy Burnham: My hon. Friend asks a good question. recommendation—but I know now not to come to any In opposition, the Conservative party produced a manifesto such conclusions where he is concerned. for careers that spoke of £200 million being allocated to Our motion makes two simple requests to the House. an all-age careers service. As well as asking this evening First, as Members of Parliament standing up for young where the transition plan has gone, we might pick up people in our constituencies, we ask the Government the question that my hon. Friend has just asked: where Front-Bench team to get a grip on this mess— has the money gone? Schools have not been given any [Interruption.]—to stop messing around on their extra money to provide a new careers service and to BlackBerrys and to stop going off to attend other fulfil the statutory responsibility that the Government events around the country. They need to get a grip on want to place on them. How can it be right at this time this mess, publish the transition plan, show some leadership to ask schools to do more and then not give them the for once in their lives and get on with the job of money to do the job for young people? It is utterly standing up for young people. Secondly, we want the disgraceful. House to send a clear message that we have high expectations of what we expect all young people in this Alok Sharma (Reading West) (Con) rose— country to get and that we want them to have face-to-face advice. Andy Burnham: I give way so that the hon. Gentleman We hear that the Government want to downgrade the can apologise for that. quality of careers advice to a phone or web-based service. The national careers service will be a phone or Alok Sharma: I was rather hoping that the right hon. web-based service! It seems that this cost-cutting drive Gentleman would apologise, as his colleague the shadow has been partly driven by the raid on the careers budget, Chancellor did yesterday, for the mess that the Labour to which my hon. Friend the Member for Halton (Derek party left this country in. The right hon. Gentleman Twigg) alluded, which the Government made having asked where the money has gone. His Government been forced to make a partial U-turn over EMA. I want managed to spend it. As he knows, his colleague, the right every Member to ask themselves whether they think hon. Member for Birmingham, Hodge Hill (Mr Byrne), that a remote and impersonal phone or web service is 961 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 962

[Andy Burnham] professions. They are the ones who need help to enter these closed worlds run often by a self-perpetuating good enough. Would that be good enough for their own elite. children when they are making life-changing choices and considering their options? Yasmin Qureshi (Bolton South East) (Lab): Is my right hon. Friend getting a bit sick and tired of Government Mr John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con) rose— Members talking about money issues, given that they will be wasting £3 billion on an unnecessary reorganisation Andy Burnham: I hope that the right hon. Gentleman of the NHS and £100 million on unnecessary unelected can answer that question. police commissioners? If they can find money for that, why can they not find a few hundred million pounds for Mr Redwood: I have a lot of sympathy with the idea these services? of high-quality careers advice, and I am listening with great interest. However, could the right hon. Gentleman Andy Burnham: My hon. Friend puts her question tell us exactly how the Secretary of State could guarantee very well. The Government have got their priorities face-to-face advice and what it might cost? completely and utterly wrong. If I were a young person watching these proceedings tonight, I would be asking Andy Burnham: The Secretary of State could guarantee why since the coalition Government came to power it by amending the Education Bill, which is in the they had singled out young people for this barrage of House of Lords at the moment— cuts. Do they think that young people are an easy touch? I do not know, but that is what I would be asking Alok Sharma: What about the cost? if I were them. I would also be asking what an elected police commissioner was going to do to improve life in Andy Burnham: I will come to that in a moment. the community. Very little, I would suggest. I return to The Secretary of State could guarantee it simply by the point that I was making earlier. If Government inserting the words “face-to-face”. Indeed, my hon. Members do not think that an impersonal, remote Friend the Member for Hartlepool (Mr Wright), the service is good enough for their children, they should shadow young people’s Minister, introduced such an not accept such a service for anyone else’s children in amendment to the Bill on Report. I find it extraordinary their constituency. that Government Members can troop through the Lobby voting against face-to-face advice for young people. Mr Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) (Con): [HON.MEMBERS: “And the cost?”] As I said a moment As my right hon. Friend the Member for Wokingham ago, the cost was put forward by the Conservative party. (Mr Redwood) said, everyone in the House would like It costed its own all-age—[Interruption.] I am trying to to see high-quality careers advice, but a little humility answer the question. The Conservative party promised might be required all round, not least from representatives and costed a fully funded, all-age careers service which of the previous Government, under whom the number maintained those currently employed in the Connexions of young people not in employment increased in this service. It promised £200 million. country despite the fact that it fell in other OECD countries. Furthermore, as their own report showed, at Nick Boles (Grantham and Stamford) (Con): Where the end of their term in office, the standard of careers has the money gone? advice for young people was palpably poor. Does the shadow Secretary of State agree with the Government’s Andy Burnham: Exactly, what have the Government intention to take the decision making down to school done with that money? Where have they spent it? Those level and let the school decide what is most appropriate? are questions for the hon. Gentleman to answer, not me. In many cases, that will involve face-to-face advice, although I do share his desire to see greater resource Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): May allocated to that. I correct my right hon. Friend? Is it not a fact that face-to-face careers advice will be available? It will be Andy Burnham: I thank the Chair of the Select available in the public schools, the independent schools Committee for his question. He calls for humility, but I and the most elite and privileged schools in the country; acknowledged at the beginning of the debate that we it just will not be available to most schools. did not get the Connexions service perfect and that we were prepared to work with the Government. I pay Andy Burnham: That is the point, is it not? This tribute to him in leading the Select Committee’s production well-connected Cabinet think that everyone’s lives are of a very good report that comes to the right conclusions like their own and that everyone can just call on a on this issue. It is possible for schools, with sufficient friend, uncle or whoever in a law firm or in the City. support, to provide face-to-face advice, although I do Sure, they will open a door—ring them up and they will not think that he or I would want to go back to the days give the advice. They live in a world, and constituencies when the PE teacher or some other member of staff was sometimes, where that advice is readily available through responsible for giving careers advice and did not do a informal family networks. They probably do not see the particularly good job of it. We need independent, good- need for careers advisers. They have used them themselves, quality, face-to-face advice. but do not see the need for them. However, there are There is an important point to be made about conflicts many young people in the constituencies that we represent of interest. At 16, young people face choices about who cannot draw on those family networks and connections, whether to go on to further education college or sixth-form who do not have role models to whom they can go college, or whether to stay at their school. It is important, and who perhaps have never had family members in the in the highly competitive world that the Government 963 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 964 are creating, that the careers adviser in the school If we allow the situation to continue in which there is should not have a vested interest in advising the young no careers advice and in which the only way in is person to stay there if that would not be the best option through having a connection with a company or for them. That needs to be thought through, but, without organisation and moving to London to work for free, a transition plan, we have no means of judging what we will limit the job opportunities in the most sought-after will happen. The Government have simply not provided careers in the country to less than 1% or 2% of the us with any detail. population. That is not a situation that I am prepared to accept. Parliament needs to step in and level up that Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): I agree with playing field, to ensure a fair distribution of life chances what my right hon. Friend is saying. Is he aware that a around the country. We need to help those young people generation of young people will get no support or who have the least. advice this year or next year? In particular, children whose parents’ first language is not English have no A statutory careers service is important because not opportunity to talk to them about their options. What all young people get the same support and advice at those children need is not a school-based service but an home. Dame Ruth Silver, chair of the Careers Profession independent, professional service that can assess them Task Force, says of the Government’s approach: in the round and give them support, help and, above all, “It will further deepen deprivation, because some people come inspiration. They will not get much inspiration from from families who have never worked; the ones who need it most trawling a website. are those who don’t have successful adults in their lives.” Andy Burnham: My hon. Friend speaks with customary Neil Carmichael (Stroud) (Con): The shadow Secretary clarity on these issues, and tells us what life is like for the of State rightly talks about levelling up the playing young people he represents, many of whom might be field. Does he acknowledge the concerns expressed by new arrivals in this country who do not understand how Dr Alison Wolf about courses leading to no employment, young people can open the doors to education, training or leading to a “road block” because they are not allied and jobs. He has put his finger on the problem. The to any specific employment prospects? Government take the view that schools can do everything, and that everything can be pushed down to the schools. Andy Burnham: I have some sympathy with that Some things need to be organised across the whole local argument, but it is an argument for more and better authority, however, if we are to maintain quality and careers advice, not less. We have some sympathy with expertise. the view that we need to ensure that all qualifications I am prepared to believe that schools could provide should be of a decent standard and should lead somewhere. the necessary advice, but the transition process needs to We accept that view and we will support the Government be managed so that the experts who are currently working in that regard, but that is not an alternative; we still for the local authorities can be brought into the schools need good quality careers advice alongside those routes. to provide the advice from those schools. Instead, this I feel passionately that, collectively, the whole lot of us lot are allowing those people to be let go and made here have failed the 50% or more of young people who redundant, even though they have many years experience are not going to go down the university route. We have in the careers service. They are being lost to the profession, not done enough to provide them with a proper structure and in a few months’ time the schools will be expected or a proper route through to good qualifications and a to subscribe to a phone or web-based service. good job, and it is about time that we addressed that Government Members might think that this is funny, balance. It is about time that this House, rather than but I do not. We are talking about young people’s life focusing on the top 20% and the English baccalaureate, chances, and those young people deserve better than thought about a pathway for all children, so that they what the Government are giving them. We owe them can all fulfil their potential. more, because the world that they are facing is far harsher than the one that we lived in 30 or so years ago. Elizabeth Truss (South West Norfolk) (Con): If the Youngpeople today can expect to have at least 10 different right hon. Gentleman thinks it important that all students jobs throughout their careers—probably more. Unlike have a pathway, why did the Labour Government remove their grandparents, who did specific jobs in large industries, the modern foreign language requirement in 2004? they will be most likely to work in smaller companies. They will need to be all-rounders, able to adapt quickly Andy Burnham: The hon. Lady was not here at the to new situations. It is also more likely that they will be start, and I am not sure whether she has heard the employers as well as employees. whole debate. Her point does not quite fit. We want The harsh truth is that it is getting harder for everyone young people to make the right choices for them. We to get on, but the odds are being stacked much more should strongly encourage the teaching of foreign languages, heavily against those who have the least. If we do not particularly in primary schools, but they will not be act, this century will see us return to a world in which right for all young people. The question I would ask her the postcode of the bed that people are born in will is this: why are young people who want to do engineering, pretty much determine where they end up in life. In information and communications technology, business today’s world, as traditional structures break down, studies, economics, music, art or other creative subjects social networks and connections are becoming the key being told that they are somehow second best because to jobs and opportunities. In some industries—sadly, those subjects are not in the English baccalaureate? we can count Parliament among them—it has become What is it that justifies the Government ranking some almost expected that a young person will have to work subjects above others—and, by definition, ranking some for free before they can get their first foot on the ladder. children above others? That is wrong; it is the exploitation of young people’s determination to get on. Neil Carmichael rose— 965 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 966

Andy Burnham: I give way one last time to the hon. Is someone in the family able to give you an opportunity?” Gentleman. I understand why they might say that because there are lots of pressures on schools, but that highlights the Neil Carmichael: Following the right hon. Gentleman’s dangers of what is being created. If we live in a world response to my previous intervention, will he shed some where people say, “The schools do it; we’ll leave it up to light on his view on the need to involve employers in them”, that can reinforce low expectations. It is basically creating the courses and qualifications that lead to telling kids that they cannot break out from their family outcomes for young people? One thing Professor Alison circumstances because they will dictate what they have Wolf made very clear is that employers should be much experience of and where they will set their expectations. more involved in the FE sector and in the formation of That is what is so wrong about that approach—this courses and qualifications. random laissez-faire approach to this crucial issue. My hon. Friend and other Opposition Members will Andy Burnham: The hon. Gentleman makes another remember a report by Alan Milburn on fair access to good point. I agree with him, but urge him, perhaps the professions during the last Parliament. He made the when the Minister is speaking, to stand up and ask his point that we need to do the reverse—take those young Front-Bench team what discussions they had with the people who have no connection with the powerful worlds CBI before they introduced the English baccalaureate. of the professions and transplant them into those worlds. What is the CBI’s view of it? Does it respond sufficiently We need the highest quality careers advice and work to the needs of employers. I see the hon. Gentleman experience for those young people. As the Opposition nodding and I hope he will direct those questions to his develop our policy, that is exactly what we should aspire Front-Bench team. Quite frankly, we risk preparing to deliver—alongside excellent careers advice, of course, young people for a world that no longer exists and we which has to be impartial, independent and personalised. need to ensure that young people have the crucial skills—good communication skills, critical thinking and Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark) good presentational skills—that they will need if they (LD) rose— are to survive in a workplace where much more is demanded of them. Andy Burnham: I agree, just as I did with the Education The Minister for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Committee report, with much of what the right hon. Learning is not in his place this evening, but when we Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark said in last debated these issues he said: his report. I look forward to hearing what he has to say “Let us once and for all kill off the bourgeois, left assumption and to his support for our motion. that working-class people do not aspire to the same things as their middle-class contemporaries. Their ambitions are the same; what Simon Hughes: May I absolutely endorse the comments they lack is the wherewithal.”—[Official Report, 11 May 2011; of the hon. Member for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy)? Vol. 527, c. 1257.] All the evidence from my conversations around England I agree with that statement. Let me share a shocking in the early part of this year showed that there was not statistic with the House; I genuinely find it appalling. It only very poor careers advice for many young people, is that 39% of 16 to 19-year-olds who went to a state but really poor work experience. In a difficult economy, school say that they do not know anyone in a career in the chances of getting a job from 16 onwards are, to put which they would like to work. This rises to 45% among it bluntly, reduced horribly for those who do not have the poorest young people who receive free school meals. work experience. What Ministers fail to recognise is that if someone does not know a single person in a career in which they Andy Burnham: I agree completely, but the right hon. would like to work, they might not be able to fulfil their Gentleman is in a position to do something. I say that aspirations in the same way as others. not to make a party political point. In some ways, this is not the most headline-grabbing of debates. We are Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab): What my right raising this issue out of a genuine concern about what is hon. Friend has just said ties in entirely with what I am happening to the careers service and what it might do to about to say. Three of my nephews came to do their damage the life chances of some young people. He has work experience here; they are mixed-race lads from produced what I consider to be a very good report for council estates in Luton. One of their friends—they did the Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister, but not have an aunt who was an MP—spent the night as a if Government Members troop through the Lobby against security guard in a factory where his dad sat watching this motion tonight, where does that leave the advice he telly all night, walking around the building once an is giving to the Government? Is he happy about that? hour to check that no one else was in the building. There has to be a change. Another friend did his work experience at Costa Coffee. That was because they did not know anyone who worked Simon Hughes: I will obviously wait to hear the in professions to which they could aspire. It is important Minister and I hope to be called to speak. My hon. for career advisers not just to try to get people into Friend the Member for Burnley (Gordon Birtwistle) internships, but to encourage young people through said to me earlier that this is exactly the sort of issue early work experience placements to stretch their horizons where we should avoid party politics and seek a consensus. and make connections with people in the professions. I commit myself again, as I have said to the right hon. Gentleman and to ministerial colleagues, to doing so, Andy Burnham: My hon. Friend makes an excellent even if it is sometimes very hard work to get us all in the contribution; she puts her finger on the problem. I hear same place. Careers, work and work experience seem to anecdotally that, increasingly, schools are saying to me to be issues on which there is much more than a young people, “Can you sort out your own work experience? party interest in getting to that right place. 967 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 968

Andy Burnham: I agree again with what the right hon. plans for a national careers service; the Education Bill Gentleman says. If there is some passion in my voice transfers the responsibility, but not the £200 million tonight, it is because I am standing up for people to that they were promised. Ministers need to tell us have a careers service that is under attack. It is quite tonight what has happened to that money, what is simply going before our eyes. It is no good saying “let us available for the new national careers service and when find consensus” complacently; we need to say that the it will be made available to save these services. Schools issue is urgent and it needs to be got a grip of right now. have a statutory responsibility to provide a service, but Otherwise, the damage will not be reparable. That is it is absolutely clear that if they are not given the why I continue to point out what I consider to be guidance or the money, these services will be of a unacceptable complacency on the part of the Government substandard quality. Front-Bench team. It promised us a transition plan on The Government have provided no transition plan, how this responsibility would be managed as it moved no funding, no clarity and no guarantee of face-to-face from local authorities to schools and on how we ensure advice. If they vote against our motion, they will be that we do not lose professionals. This plan has been completely isolated. They have not tabled an promised for weeks and weeks and weeks. Every day amendment—an alternative—which in itself illustrates that passes, more and more damage is being done to the their sheer absence of ideas on how to take this issue careers service. I say to Government Members who worry forward. If their own advisory group cannot support about these issues that the time has come for them to them, what does that say about the position the Government start holding their own Front-Bench team to account. are in? In August, the entire careers advisory group I agree with much of what the Minister for Further considered resignation, because it wanted to protest at Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning said when we the situation that it had been left in. These people did discussed the Education Bill on Report: not resign, but they must now be listened to if the “I find it inconceivable, or at least unlikely, that best practice Government are to retain any credibility on this issue. will not include face-to-face provision.”—[Official Report,11May In conclusion, I am proud that it is Labour Members 2011; Vol. 527, c. 1257.] who have spoken up for young people and for a service If that is the Government’s view, why do they not in crisis. I know that many careers professionals will guarantee it for all young people? The aim must be to have been watching this debate, and I am sure that give a basic minimum to all young people. I have to say many feel utterly demoralised and undervalued right that the Government are in danger of looking seriously now. If nothing else, I want them to know tonight that, isolated on this issue. The Education Select Committee—I on this side of the House at least, we appreciate what mentioned its report a few moments ago—highlighted they do for our young people. A bit of recognition is the need to protect face-to-face guidance. When a due, and Labour is proud to give it to them. Committee is chaired by a Conservative Member—the However, we also know now what we are up against. hon. Member for Beverley and Holderness (Mr Stuart) This is a Government who have a brutal approach to is no longer in the Chamber—and it makes that direct public service reform, and who are too lazy or too recommendation to the Government, one would expect arrogant to produce a transition plan for the careers them to do him the courtesy of making a proper response. service. We have Education Ministers who like to focus The hon. Member for Wirral West (Esther McVey) on the elite—on Oxbridge—when the kids who have put it this way when we last debated these issues: least are left to fend for themselves. The fact is that “We must not lose the knowledge on the internet, but we must some young people cannot call on well-connected families also not lose those people and their personal knowledge. We to open doors. When a family does not have role models cannot let something so vital slip through our fingertips when it or where there is little family experience of what it takes was within our grasp and when we had the ability to save to break into the professions, young people need youth it.”—[Official Report, 11 May 2011; Vol. 527, c. 1249.] workers, careers advisers and personal advisers to help Voices are speaking from the Conservative Benches, them open those doors. which I do not think Ministers can or should ignore, Just a few short weeks ago, this House reconvened to but the careers service is slipping out of our grasp. discuss the summer disturbances. Many theories were Research conducted by the university of Derby and put forward on that day to explain what had gone Unison reveals that just 15 councils are retaining a wrong with our young people to make some of them act substantial universal careers service. More than 4,000 in that way. Of course we will continue to debate those careers advisers have already lost their jobs and 50 things, but I suggest to the House something simple councils have closed their Connexions centres completely. that all young people need, regardless of their This expertise is being lost. According to the university circumstances—hope. They need hope of a job and hope of Derby, of a better life, but that hope is being taken from them. “the current environment is having a potentially disastrous So my appeal tonight goes beyond the Government impact on the careers profession.” Front-Bench team and to the House as a whole: is it not In a speech in November 2010, the Minister said: about time that this Parliament started standing up for young people? How much longer will we tolerate this “As we go about this, it’s important to recognise that we’re not starting from scratch. On the contrary, we will build on Next Step attack on aspiration? Let us say tonight that enough is and on Connexions because we must not lose the best of either.” enough. That is why I urge the House to support our motion. But that is exactly what is happening. We are losing the best of what we have, and this gross mismanagement is simply unforgiveable. It could damage the life chances 7.53 pm of up to 2 million young people, as the Association of The Minister of State, Department for Education School and College Leaders has estimated. Youngpeople (Mr Nick Gibb): I am delighted to be able to respond to appear to have been sidelined from the Government’s the right hon. Member for Leigh (Andy Burnham). 969 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 970

[Mr Nick Gibb] We have also allocated a significant sum to the pupil premium, which is worth at least £430 per pupil qualifying I had thought that this might be a policy area where the for free school meals this year, and the figure will rise to differences between us were slight enough that he would £2.5 billion by 2014-15. These are the extra sums that not feel the need to overstate his case. Alas, that hope we are putting into schools, at a time when our public has been dashed. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of finances are in a dire state. State would have liked to respond to the right hon. Gentleman but, as I mentioned earlier, he is in Nottingham Derek Twigg: Let us be clear about this, because the meeting 100 head teachers to discuss the future teaching Minister is trying to avoid the question and we should schools. I hasten to add that 100 people is more than the not forget that we are talking about £200 million. What number of Labour Members in the Chamber right now, extra is specifically being given to schools for careers and this is an Opposition day debate. The Minister for advice? Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning would also have liked to have responded to the right hon. Mr Gibb: This Government are not involved in ring- Gentleman, but he has just undergone minor surgery fenced budgets for schools. We have de-ring-fenced a and is recovering in hospital. He sends his best wishes large number of budgets into the dedicated schools and wanted me to pass on his apologies to the House grant, so that head teachers and teachers can decide for the fact that a lesser orator than he is responding. how that money is allocated within the priorities of their school. That is the approach that this Government It is hard to listen to the right hon. Gentleman when are taking to public spending in the schools sector. he clamours for £200 million here and £200 million there, given that he was in the Cabinet of a Government Jeremy Corbyn: Can the Minister tell us how many who left this country with the largest budget deficit in secondary schools are providing careers advice, what the G7 and interest payments of £120 million a day, means he has to survey what they are doing, and how leaving the country on the brink of financial collapse. many of the 100 “super heads” who are meeting the That is why we have had to take some very difficult Secretary of State this evening are providing careers decisions. Until Opposition spokesmen acknowledge advice? that point, nothing they say on public spending will have any credibility. Mr Gibb: The hon. Gentleman is asking me to provide a critique on the state of careers advice in this country Andy Burnham rose— today. I will come to that, because his party’s record is not one of which he should be proud. The Labour party Mr Gibb: I will make this final point and then I will has just been in power for 13 years and the state of give way to the right hon. Gentleman. I dread to think careers advice today is a consequence of what happened of the damage that would have been done to young during those 13 years, not of what has happened during people’s prospects had Labour won the last election and the first 16 months of this Administration. Hon. Members plunged our economy into a crisis such as those that in all parts of the House agree on the importance of Greece and Ireland have faced. pupils receiving good quality advice and guidance to help them make the right choices for their future; that is Andy Burnham: This evening, will the Minister at particularly the case in these difficult economic times. least tell us where the money has gone? Was the careers We have recently seen a welcome reduction in the proportion budget in the Department raided to pay for the patched-up of 16 to 18-year-olds who are not in education, employment version of the successor to the education maintenance or training—it has fallen from 9.4% in 2009 to 7.3% in allowance that the Government were forced to cobble 2010—and rises in the number of 16 and 17-year-olds together? in education. The youth labour market is also tightening, with unemployment for 16 to 24-year-olds who are not Mr Gibb: As I just mentioned, the £200 million to in full-time education growing each year from about which the right hon. Gentleman is referring would pay 420,000 in 2004 to its current level of 671,000. The for two days’ interest on the debt left by his Government. premium on achievement in particular vocational and In addition, we have put extra funding into tackling academic qualifications demanded by employers and post-16 deprivation and providing help for those who universities means that making the right choices becomes need additional support: we increased that by a third, to ever more important, and the consequences of making £750 million. That is how those sums have been prioritised the wrong choices are ever more damaging. by this Government. Liz Kendall (Leicester West) (Lab): The Minister is Derek Twigg: Following on from that point, can the talking a lot about 16 to 18-year-olds, but does he agree Minister tell us what money is actually being given to that if we are going to raise aspirations we need to start schools to provide careers advice? I would particularly young? Will he agree to look at some of the good work like to know the answer in respect of Halton, which is that Leicester Connexions has done with Folville primary one of the most deprived areas. Does how good the school in my constituency? Parents and pupils have careers advice is just depend on what money is in school been brought together when the children are still really budgets now? Is this a lottery? young to talk about what careers options might be possible. The events were really well attended—much Mr Gibb: Despite the appalling state of the public better attended than many other events involving parents finances that we inherited, we have managed to ensure run by the primary school. Does the Minister agree that that school funding is maintained, in cash terms, at a the new system that his Government are proposing consistent level over the next four years. That is despite must support and fund initiatives that start at such an the fact that we inherited a budget deficit of £156 billion. early age? 971 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 972

Mr Gibb: I could not agree more. We want to promote found that more than 90% were satisfied with the service such best practice and we want schools to be innovative, that they had received. That survey was carried out by but to do that they need control of their own funds. We his own Department. have tried to de-ring-fence funds and to delegate and devolve decision making on funding to schools so that Mr Gibb: I am not sure what service those people they can engage in such innovative activity. We have were receiving from Connexions, but there is no doubt also de-ring-fenced the early intervention grant for local that all the surveys showed dissatisfaction with the authorities, which now stands at £2.2 billion. That careers advice given by Connexions. There is more means that such initiatives can be undertaken by local satisfaction with the advice that it gives to vulnerable authorities to tackle the very vulnerable people about young people on how to get back on track and back whom the hon. Lady is talking. into the mainstream, and I acknowledge that that part of the service has been of a higher quality. Liz Kendall: The problem with the early intervention grant is that in Leicester it is being cut by £5 million this Mr Sheerman: Perhaps I can assist the Minister. year. The Minister says that the Government are not When I was Chair of the Select Committee, whenever ring fencing things, but I am not arguing for that. I am we considered that service we felt that it was very patchy saying that there will be less money for such innovative up and down the country. That made us very angry in projects, and I am asking what the Government are some circumstances, but it is, I think, called localism. going to do about it. Mr Gibb: I agree with the hon. Gentleman that the Mr Gibb: The hon. Lady makes a valid point. We service is very patchy. de-ring-fenced all the components that make up the early intervention grants, and that funding is £2.2 billion, Our starting point was that careers advice needed to rising to £2.3 billion next year. That is a very large sum. improve, and I think that there is unanimity across the I acknowledge that we had to reduce it by 10.9% as we House on that. We decided to split the provision of moved into the coming year, but that is a consequence careers advice from the provision of advice to vulnerable of the many very difficult decisions we have had to young people. They are very different disciplines requiring make in government as a result of the budget deficit. I different skills and different knowledge bases, so the am sorry to sound like an over-wound gramophone, but decision was taken to provide an all-age careers service—the those are the consequences of being in Government and national careers service. That is the responsibility of of inheriting a budget deficit that had to be tackled if the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, we were to get our economy moving again. Young and the service will be up and running from April 2012. people suffer more than any other group in society I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Minister for Further when an economy is floundering, and we are in the Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning for the work middle of a very difficult world economic crisis driven that he has put in to delivering that service. by world debt, so we have to get our budget deficit The duty to provide careers advice to young people under control if we are to survive as an economy will therefore be removed from local authorities and through such difficult periods. I think the best thing for transferred, subject to the passage of the Education young people is to get our economy growing as soon as Bill, to schools from September 2012. That duty will possible. That is why we have had to make those decisions. require schools to secure access to independent impartial Local authorities currently have a duty to provide careers guidance for their pupils in years 9 to 11. As careers advice, and they fulfil that duty through the part of the consultation process, we are also considering Connexions service—a service that has, I am afraid, whether there is a case for extending that duty down to had mixed reviews. The Education Committee’s report year8oruptotheageof18. said, in measured terms: “Connexions services have provided careers guidance to individuals Andy Burnham: Will the Minister confirm that it alongside wider support services targeted, in general, at more might be independent and impartial advice, but it will disadvantaged groups; and some Connexions services have been not be face-to-face advice? That is to say, the Government’s more successful than others in discharging these two duties equally plan is that it will be delivered over the phone or via the successfully.” internet. Alan Milburn, who was referred to by the right hon. Member for Leigh, was a little less circumspect in his Mr Gibb: The legislation states only that the advice report on access to the professions when he reported a must be independent. We are considering all the issues number of surveys that suggested low levels of satisfaction being raised in this debate, and by my right hon. Friend among young people with the careers guidance they the Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon received from Connexions, showing that 45% of over-14s Hughes). received either no careers advice or advice that was poor or limited. He went on to say: Stella Creasy (Walthamstow) (Lab/Co-op): I am ever “Throughout our work we have barely heard a good word so grateful to the Minister for giving way and for setting about the careers work of the current Connexions service.” out the schedule. What careers advice has he given all It is very difficult to listen to the emotional tones of the the careers advisers who have now lost their jobs because right hon. Gentleman when that is the legacy of the local authorities have had that funding cut and are very careers advice that he is so passionate about providing therefore no longer providing that service? Given that to young people. he is talking about the new service not coming on line until April 2012, and that there is no guarantee that it Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): I find it slightly will be provided by individuals face to face, what does odd that the Minister is not quoting from the Department he expect to happen to the people who are the experts in for Education survey of 5,000 young people, which this system? 973 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 974

Mr Gibb: Local authorities still have a duty to provide necessarily provide the rigour and quality that students careers advice, because section 68 of the Education and need. We are also introducing destination measures that Skills Act 2008 is still in force, and they are required to set out where school leavers go after they leave school— do so. They are making decisions based on the very whether into high-quality employment with training, to difficult financial settlement that we were left with by further education colleges or to university. the previous Administration, but there are good examples of good practice from around the country, including Neil Carmichael: The shadow Secretary of State asked Northamptonshire. In April we published statutory me to ask the Minister about the E-bac, and I do so guidance setting out how local authorities should continue with pleasure because I welcome its introduction. I to meet that statutory duty under section 68 to encourage think it will have a huge impact in improving opportunities and help young people to participate in education and for young people. Does the Minister agree that it respects training. We are publishing on the Department’s website and represents the preferences of many employers and best practice from around the country. universities in that it encourages students to do the right subjects and get the right range of qualifications? Julie Hilling: I thank the Minister for giving way yet again; he has been very generous. Will he confirm that Mr Gibb: Yes; my hon. Friend makes a very good the careers advice will be given by professionally trained point. Whatever people say, employers disproportionately and qualified careers advisers? Will he also confirm that employ people with the E-bac subjects amongst their as soon as the Education Bill goes through, local authorities qualifications. will retain responsibility just for the NEETs and not for Our approach is to measure and report on the everything else, which will transfer to schools, although outputs—on what schools achieve for their pupils. The schools have not been given any additional funding to destination measure will say more about the success of provide that independent careers advice and guidance? a school’s approach to careers advice and will do more to deliver high-quality advice than will any number of Mr Gibb: On the first point, the duty to provide detailed regulations. advice to vulnerable young people who face problems in The second reason for giving schools the duty is that accessing education will remain with local authorities, they are best placed to decide what support their pupils whereas the duty to provide careers advice is transferring need to make the right choices. We have considered to schools. Of course, schools currently have a duty to carefully the evidence about what works and what does provide careers education, within which an element of not work in the provision of information, advice and careers advice is also required. We are introducing that guidance. The approaches that are most effective work duty in the Education Bill at a time when we are acting because they are part of a wider approach in a school or to reduce bureaucracy and remove unnecessary duties college that promotes ambition and aspiration, and and burdens from schools to allow them to focus on encourages pupils to think about their future throughout driving up standards, so the fact that we are introducing their education. Effective careers guidance is not a that new duty is a signal of the importance that the one-off event. Government attach to high-quality careers guidance. There is no single right way; many different approaches We are giving schools that duty for two reasons. First, work, depending on the precise circumstances of the we believe in the concept of decentralisation and of school or pupil. That is why it is right to leave schools to devolving decision making. We trust schools to take decide how to provide impartial independent advice. decisions in the best interests of their pupils, and restoring How they choose to do that should be determined by trust to the teaching profession is the cornerstone of what works for them. In making choices about how to our approach to education reform. Some argue, as has provide impartial advice, they will benefit from independent been argued today, that schools have an inbuilt bias to benchmarks of quality—something that was recommended advise pupils to stay on in the sixth form regardless of by the taskforce on careers guidance led by Dame Ruth whether it is in their best interests. That is why the Silver, which was commissioned by the previous Education Bill imposes the duty on schools to give Government and reported to us last year. advice that is independent. Alongside the duty for schools, local authorities will Many of the incentives for schools were being distorted also have responsibility for encouraging young people by the structure of the league tables. Professor Alison to stay in education to the age of 17 or 18 by 2015. They Wolf set out this problem in her landmark report on are free to determine how best to fulfil that responsibility, vocational education. She said that false equivalencies taking account of local priorities. That is a duty that have encouraged schools to enter pupils for qualifications local authorities take seriously. that score highly in performance tables but are not There will also be free online and helpline services for necessarily valued by employers—effectively building young people, which will be provided through the national bad advice into the system. Some qualifications have careers service from April 2012. The motion mentions a been proclaimed as being equal to four GCSEs, but requirement to provide “face-to-face” guidance for every they do not provide the broad grounding that students young person, and that was also recommended by my need to progress. As a consequence, some pupils have right hon. Friend the Member for Bermondsey and Old been encouraged to make choices that significantly Southwark in his report as the advocate for access to reduce their prospects for success in later life. education. The issues that he raises in his report are That is why we are reforming performance tables—to important: making the right choices at the key decision end the damaging impact of false equivalencies, as well points in a young person’s education and career can as removing perverse incentives in the funding system open or close a lifetime of opportunities. We are still that have encouraged schools and colleges to offer considering all 33 recommendations in his report—not qualifications that are easier to complete but do not just the one recommendation that has been picked up 975 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 976 by the Opposition—so we are not, at this stage, ruling some of the best schools in the country, and many of anything in or out, and we will respond in full to his the eminent and pre-eminent Members of the House report in due course. have attended one or two of them. What the Government We also need to recognise that although advice is propose is absolutely right: it gives flexibility for schools important, other elements are also fundamental to a to decide which type of independent advice they think pupil’s ability to achieve and progress. If a pupil does is necessary for their pupils, but does not rule out the not have a thorough grounding in the basics of literacy selection of Connexions in future to continue to provide and numeracy, or is not given the opportunity to study some of those services. Can my hon. Friend confirm the subjects that are the best foundation for progression, that that is the case—that Connexions can continue in the best information and advice in the world will not the new framework? help that pupil to progress far beyond the constraints that a poor education has put on him or her. The Mr Gibb: Yes, my hon. Friend is absolutely right. I evidence is very clear that the longer someone stays in am grateful to him for his very sincere comments about education, the higher their earnings are and the less my speech. He is right that the purpose of the clause in likely they are to be unemployed. OECD figures show the Education Bill is to enable schools to buy in, to that the earnings premium resulting from a university procure those services—whether provided face to face, degree is between $200,000 and $300,000. People with online or by other means—for the young people in their two or more A-levels can earn 14% more than those care. We want to avoid the scenario painted by the right without. For those who secure five good GCSEs the hon. Member for Leigh (Andy Burnham) of a PE chances of being NEET are just one in 40, whereas for teacher providing careers advice in his spare time. We those who do not achieve five or more good GCSEs the want to ensure that advice is independent and high odds fall to one in six. quality. For young people who are set on pursuing a vocational I shall now bring my remarks to an end; I apologise route at an early age we are promoting university technical to my hon. Friend the Member for Windsor (Adam colleges and studio schools, we are encouraging FE Afriyie) for doing so. On funding, schools will make any colleges to consider recruiting students at age 14 and we provision for careers guidance from their overall budget. are allowing further education lecturers to teach in Schools already have, under the existing legislation that schools. That is also why we are increasing apprenticeship we are amending, a duty to provide careers education, places for 16 to 18-year-olds, with 102,900 young people which includes duties to provide impartial careers advice. starting apprenticeships in the first nine months of this Schools’ budgets are no longer ring-fenced and schools year compared with 117,000 for the whole of the last can make, and can fund, careers advice. academic year. That is why we have protected school budgets in cash terms, and why we have ensured that we We are a Government who believe in high-quality are funding participation at age 17 by 2013 and at age careers advice, which is what our reforms are about. We 18 by 2015. It is also why we make no apology for are acting at a time of fiscal constraint, as a consequence prioritising resources on funding for early years on the of the state of the public finances left by the last Labour pupil premium in schools and on funding for disadvantaged Government. I urge all hon. Members, therefore, to young people post-16. reject any motion tabled by the Opposition on any issue that requires funding, and in particular to reject their Mr Edward Timpson (Crewe and Nantwich) (Con): motion this evening. Perhaps the greatest benchmark for deciding whether we are providing the best careers advice for our children 8.21 pm is the advice that we provide to children in care, and we know that the outcomes for children in care, particularly Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): It in relation to their education, remain woeful. I welcome is a pleasure to be called in this debate. I shall start with the Government’s commitment to the continuation of a confession: when I chaired the Education and Skills the care to work project. However, will my hon. Friend Committee— look again—perhaps this could be a 34th recommendation to add to his list—at widening the Frank Buttle Trust quality mark, which provides looked-after children with Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): May I just real confidence that any higher or further education say that we have nine Members left to speak, and that if institution that they might want to go into has support the hon. Gentleman limits his speech to eight minutes it and guidance in place for them as a looked-after child will help everybody? or care leaver, to enable them to succeed and achieve their aspirations? Mr Sheerman: I was going to confess that when I was Chair of the Education Committee I never did an Mr Gibb: My hon. Friend makes some very good inquiry into careers, but in 2008 I was co-chair of the points. The gap between looked-after children and the Skills Commission and we undertook a major inquiry rest of society is unacceptable. The low proportion of into careers. Lord Boswell, Baroness Sharp and I were looked-after children who go to university—just 6%—is on the commission and we produced an all-party report, also unacceptable. Looked-after children qualify “Inspiration and Aspiration: Realising our Potential in automatically for the pupil premium, and I am listening the 21st Century.”Dame Ruth Silver, whom the Minister carefully to what my hon. Friend suggests. and anyone who knows anything about careers will know, the former principal of Lewisham college, was a Adam Afriyie (Windsor) (Con): My hon. Friend is very important influence on our inquiry, and she now making an incredibly powerful speech, and I have been chairs the Government advisory organisation that fell on the edge of my seat throughout. In Windsor we have out with the Government recently. 977 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 978

[Mr Sheerman] and higher education, and new apprenticeships—as well as high youth unemployment—stripping out the professional help available We found pretty simple things. We found that, yes, to them is not only foolhardy; it is potentially damaging to young information technology is very useful and that it will people’s lives and ultimately to the economy.” increasingly be used by many young people and older What a damning report by the Government’s advisory people, but at that stage—three years ago—it was used committee! It cannot be right to go in this direction. by only about 17% or 18%, which is not a lot. We also As a result of this kind of localism, schools with few found that it was not enough in itself—face-to-face resources will have very little careers advice. That is the experience and trusted professionals were vital. There truth. At the same time, local authorities up and down was no doubt that all the research, all the evidence that the land, under pressure of resources, are getting rid of we took, showed it could not be done by technology their careers services or slimming them down to the alone, and that we blanked out many people by relying very bone. We will not recreate a culture of high-quality only on the technology and the internet. careers service professionals in that way, even though We also found that yes, the careers service was not as the Government asked Ruth Silver to chair a committee good as it should have been. Anyone who does a PhD in to determine how to increase the professional quality of future about the Conservatives’ enthralment with localism the careers service. will have a wonderful time with the Minister’s speech Everything was going in the right direction, with tonight, because what is this localism? I intervened and all-party consensus. Localism could have worked in this said, “The trouble is that Connexions was patchy.” It is respect if the money had followed local responsibility true that in every local government service I know, and accountability. I worked closely with the Minister, much is good in some things, but less is good in others who was a good member of the Education and Skills and things are pretty average too much of the time. So Committee for some years, when I chaired it. He is a how does one, believing in localism, raise the bar in reasonable man, and he will understand that this is not careers? It is a great challenge, as Conservative Members a party political issue. Good-quality careers advice is will find. Pushing the responsibility back entirely on to absolutely essential to everyone of whatever age. I am schools, they will find the service very patchy indeed, one of those people who believe that it is shame and a especially if there are very few resources to some schools stain on our country to have a thing called NEETs. I and better resources at others. believe that anyone who is not in education, employment The Skills Commission report was accepted by all or training of whatever age is a NEET, and we cannot three parties and influenced all three manifestos, so have them. there was the start of a good cross-party agreement on the need for high-quality careers advice—absolutely 8.29 pm everyone from whom we took evidence agreed on that. But how do we push that forward? When we found that Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark) all the manifestos had been influenced by the cross-party (LD): I am happy to follow the hon. Member for consensus, we were very hopeful. But how did we get to Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman), with all his expertise as the Government advisory group on the all-age careers the former Chair of the Education Committee and his service? The Labour Government of 2008 did not want an reminder of what the Skills Commission, on which he all-age careers service. They were eventually persuaded— so honourably served, so clearly said. again, there was cross-party consensus. All three main I am grateful to the right hon. Member for Leigh parties agreed on an all-age careers service, and they (Andy Burnham) for choosing this subject. I shall let reconstituted it under a different name—the national him and the House into a secret: the more pressure that careers service advisory group. I understand that it is we as a House can put on the Government on this issue now in the Department for Business, Innovation and between us, the better. I am therefore grateful to the Skills, with the Education Department visiting, rather Minister for the way in which he responded. May I pass than its being in the Education Department. I have on through him my thanks to the Minister for Further some concerns, and I think hon. Members will have Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning, with whom I some concerns, about careers being put very securely in have had several pragmatic and good conversations, BIS rather than in the Education Department. and to his colleagues at all levels who have said that, Responsibility for providing face-to-face services is, having received the report that I gave them in July, they however, being transferred to schools, without funding. are taking seriously what I asked them to do? I have the report from the advisory group on the all-age careers service and the comments by Dame Ruth Silver May I now go back a step? In May, we sent the about its very real problems with it. It says: Education Bill from the House to the House of Lords. We held robust debates on this and other issues. It left “The new National Careers Service will include face-to-face with two relevant provisions. First, clause 27 states: services for adults, but not for young people. Instead, its service for young people will be confined to telephone- and web-based “The responsible authorities for a school in England…must services. Responsibility for providing the face-to-face services is secure that all registered pupils at the school are provided with being transferred to schools, without any transfer of funding: the independent careers guidance”. previous provision of around £200 million per annum for the I support that. Secondly, it states: service for young people has been allowed to disappear.” “For the purposes of this section the relevant phase of a pupil’s That is the Government’s advisory group speaking. education is” These are the leading people in the country advising on careers. The report continues: between 14 and 16. That is an adequate starting point. “There are widespread concerns about the destruction of careers Two months later to the day, the Education Committee, services across the country, with heavy staff redundancies. At a chaired by the hon. Member for Beverley and Holderness time when young people are facing massive changes in further (Mr Stuart)—a Conservative Back Bencher—produced 979 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 980 its report. The cross-party Select Committee had a Andy Burnham: I agree very much with the right hon. clear, unanimous view on the issue. It said specifically, Gentleman, and I welcome the spirit in which he is at paragraph 156: speaking. He would probably agree with Labour Members “Professor Watts told us that ‘we used to have a careers service that, as my hon. Friend the Member for Nottingham for young people, and all we had for adults was a strategy… What South (Lilian Greenwood) said, work experience is so we now have…is a careers service for adults, and a very loose” important that it should not be left to random chance. We have to find a way of offering structured opportunities, information advice and guidance particularly to those young people who have the least. “framework for young people’. Online career guidance, which With that in mind, may I ask the right hon. Gentleman allows young people to explore at their own pace and according to comment on the Government’s intention of removing to their own interests, is valuable; and we heard praise for the the requirement on schools, at key stage 4, to offer online careers services offered by DirectGov. However, this is no substitute for personal advice, given on the basis of an understanding work-related learning, which essentially is work experience? of a young person’s circumstances and ambitions. We recommend Is it not the case that if they remove that requirement, that the all age careers service should be funded by the Department provision will be completely random? Some schools will for Education for face to face career guidance for young people.” offer it, and some will not. It could not have been clearer. Simon Hughes: Let me be absolutely straight with the I did not know that the Select Committee would say right hon. Gentleman: I understand the Government’s that specifically, but the following week, on 21 July, I wish not to burden heads and schools with over- gave my report to Ministers. Let me summarise the prescription. I am chair of governors of a primary recommendations and then make a point about my school, and a trustee of a secondary school, so I understand passion for the issue and ask Ministers to consider that completely. However, some things have to be where we go from here. In passing, I pay tribute to all guaranteed, and in my view we have to guarantee the those in the careers services, including the Institute of opportunity of work experience during secondary school Careers Guidance and the trade unions, who have been time, and we have to guarantee face-to-face careers to see me and are absolutely passionate that this issue advice. I say that not because I have some theological needs to be accepted by the Government. view about it, but because the evidence that we have I was clear, because the evidence given to me was heard, and that I collected, is that youngsters are clear, that people should start to talk about careers in overwhelmingly saying, “We’ve had bad careers advice year 6 in primary school. I was clear, which is why I was and bad work experience.” so glad about the intervention made by the hon. Member In a tight economic situation, people even more need for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy), that work experience both careers advice and work experience. The figures was seen as something where the cleaner did not take a that I collected show that there are more than 4,000 child to work to clean or the accountant take another to different qualifications that a young person can gain do accountancy, but where the cleaner’s child had the between the ages of 14 and 18. There are millions of same exposure to the opportunities that the accountant’s combinations of qualifications that they can end up child would have and, to be honest, vice versa. with. Navigating a way through that requires more than a person’s ability to go online and discover what they think they might want to know; that, bluntly, is different Lilian Greenwood (Nottingham South) (Lab): I wonder depending on how bright the person is, what family whether the right hon. Gentleman shares my concern support they have, and other things. It is about more about what is happening in Nottingham and than having some books to look at; it is about speaking Nottinghamshire, where Futures used to charge £13 per to somebody who can relate to them where they are, and pupil to fix up work experience, but as a result of the engage with them. loss of a £500,000 Government grant, it now charges £31 per pupil. Many schools are unable to buy in the As my hon. Friend the Member for Burnley (Gordon service to match students with work experience Birtwistle) said to me when the debate began, in the end opportunities, yet individual parents can pay £150 to what is required may be more than one half-hour session; buy just those opportunities for their children to be there may need to be follow-up—mentoring, support, matched with work experience. What does that say to and continuous commitment. That might mean a local the children of cleaners and school dinner ladies about employer—PricewaterhouseCoopers could step over the the importance of their opportunities? river to my constituency—coming into a school to continue to support somebody as they work things out. It might mean working out how somebody who fluffs Simon Hughes: I absolutely share that concern. We some exams, and does not start very well academically, need a system that guarantees more than just one week can recover and be told, “You haven’t lost everything of work experience once in July—at the same time all just because you had a terrible year when your parents around the country—at one stage in a person’s career. separated and your family situation was a disaster.” We The Under-Secretary of State for Education, the hon. have to understand that people have only one school Member for East Worthingand Shoreham (Tim Loughton), time in which they can do work experience. and I were at city hall today with some young people who argued that they should have at least two weeks’ Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab): The right hon. Gentleman work experience. I am clear that it should be for those must be commended for speaking with great foresight aged from 14 through to 16, and be held at an appropriate and spelling things out with great common sense. Does time and in an appropriate place. It should not be he agree that there is real urgency, as is reflected in the something that people charge to fix up; we should motion? Youngpeople have only one chance, and getting develop it so that it is part of the expectation in secondary things right tomorrow is no good for today’s kids. We school, and part of youngsters’ lives. need to get things right now. There is a transition gap; 981 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 982

[Nic Dakin] and that he will encourage his colleagues to do the same. It is his call to vote with the Government and to be fair, the Minister for Further Education, Skills support them. I shall support young people in all of and Lifelong Learning has recognised that that is an this, as they need us now. issue in talking to me. That gap needs to be addressed We decided to call this debate on careers advice—not immediately. the sexiest subject out there—because it matters to us in the Labour party. This is about social mobility, and Simon Hughes: I do not disagree with that; I said it in if the Labour party cares about something, it is social my report, and I would remind the hon. Gentleman to mobility. If we get this wrong, it will make a huge go back and look at it. I just have time to list the difference to young people’s lives. recommendations and give my conclusion on where I think we should go. Simon Hughes: The hon. Lady rightly said that we all The second recommendation, which is relevant, is have to show that we are on the side of young people, that the Department for Education should continuously and I hope that I have shown that and that my colleagues consider how best to support schools and colleges in are, too. The Government must not just provide one their access activities, and in building up much more response to one question but respond comprehensively. available information. They also have to find the money. That is their job, not The third recommendation is that at the age of 13 and my job. I want them to do it, and we are putting 14—in year 9—every student should have available to pressure on them. Let me put pressure on in my way; if them a proper, broad base of information on what the the hon. Lady puts pressure on in her way, I am determined pathways are. Indeed, it is not just the young people that the Government will deliver. who need that information; their parents do, too, so Mrs Chapman: I listen carefully to the right hon. that they are not prejudiced by their own experiences Gentleman, and clearly he is far more experienced in and past. the ways of the House than I am. It really is not about The fourth recommendation is that the Government what we get up and say—it is what we do. We must show “should act urgently”—those are the words on the support for young people through our actions, not just Order Paper—to guarantee face-to-face careers advice by giving a fancy speech. for all young people in schools; that should be taken up to age 17 and 18, as the school leaving age increases. Dan Rogerson (North Cornwall) (LD): I am listening We need a plan on how to keep the expertise of carefully to the distinction that the hon. Lady is drawing current careers services providers, given the change in between how Members will vote on the motion and the system. I welcome the change in the system— their commitments more widely. Will she tell us whether Connexions was often not successful, but we must make the previous Government guaranteed face-to-face contact sure that we do not lose the expertise of the people who for every person, as the motion seeks to demand that delivered the service. We must hold events for parents the Government guarantee? and carers to make sure that they understand that. Someone in each school—not the independent provider— Mrs Chapman: There are issues with Connexions, should be responsible for access issues and someone for and if I am able to deliver the rest of my speech I will careers issues. Finally, Ofsted should evaluate the careers come on to that. service given to the school and report on it, and how it Satisfaction with Connexions varies a great deal, and makes use of destination data. the Minister rightly pointed out that its careers advice I am grateful for the Minister’s courtesy and was lacking. In his report, Alan Milburn observed that his Department’s consideration. I can hold back my only one in five young people questioned on the issue colleagues from voting with the Opposition only found that the careers advice offered by Connexions because of the undertaking he has given. [Interruption.] was satisfactory. That situation is not sustainable, and No: the Government are going to respond to all the we should not put up with it. My objection is that the recommendations, not one. I accept absolutely the point only young people who will receive guaranteed, face-to-face, about urgency made by Back Benchers. Our Liberal top-notch, good-quality careers advice are those in Democrat colleagues in the Lords feel equally strongly fee-paying schools, which no one in the House should that we must ensure the provision of face-to-face guidance. tolerate, regardless of their political affiliation, background I represent a strongly working-class constituency. If or education. we believe in social mobility, we must additionally assist The issue is not just the life chances of individual those who do not have the advantages of privilege and young people, although it certainly includes that, and I finance, which is why the Government must deliver. I am sure that will be the main focus of debate. This is await the recommendations and their response, but about economic regeneration. My constituency has an there must be a yes to the proposal. engineering heritage and I have some very large engineering companies. I am thinking of Cummins, which makes engines. I do not understand fully what the company 8.41 pm does, but I know the engines come in a range of colours. Mrs Jenny Chapman (Darlington) (Lab): I greatly The careers advice and guidance that I was given, admired the speech given by the right hon. Member for growing up in a town with such a strong engineering Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes), but heritage, was about the public sector, health care and I am slightly perplexed as to how he can speak eloquently social sciences. Nobody ever spoke to me about taking and passionately about something in which he clearly maths, about a career in engineering, about getting into believes but then, at the last minute, say that he will be technology—nothing. Not very much has changed in able to vote with the Government—that is extraordinary— that respect. 983 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 984

Damian Hinds (East Hampshire) (Con): Does the just about the children of people on benefits. It is about hon. Lady agree that it is the quality of advice that people whose parents are in professional careers but counts, more than its quantity? What does she recommend who lack the wherewithal to open other doors—people we could do to get more people into schools to talk like myself. about STEM subjects, for example, and to inspire pupils The biggest shame is that the Government have over- to take those—boys and girls? promised on what they will do. When they said that there would be an all-age careers service, people took Mrs Chapman: Exactly right; I agree with that. I look them at their word. They thought that that meant the at my own sons and wonder who is going to talk to same for everybody and that it would be fair, but that is them if they want to go into science, technology, engineering not what we will find. Adults can get face-to-face advice, or maths. Heaven help them if they look to me or their because the Government rightly recognise that they father for advice. I can give them advice on politics, need it, so why can young people not get it? They need it psychology, archaeology, retail and cake decorating. more than anyone else. They need someone to look Alan Milburn was right. I am happy to see the service them in the eye, work out their personal circumstances, devolved to schools. It is fine for schools to commission listen to their hopes, dreams and aspirations, perhaps the service as they see fit, but they need money to enable give them some if they do not have any, and work out them to buy quality face-to-face advice, and there needs the best thing for them. Otherwise, we are leaving young to be a proper inspection regime. people stranded.

Damian Hinds rose— Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): There are good examples across the United Kingdom, and some of Mrs Chapman: Please be brief. those will be in Northern Ireland. I suggest that that might be a way forward. Damian Hinds: Is the hon. Lady aware of the STEMNET ambassador programme, in which people from relevant Mrs Chapman: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman industries go into schools and get the benefit of continuing for that inspiring contribution. I find myself now in a professional development while they are sharing their situation in which everything has been said, but probably knowledge and enthusiasm with the young people? not by everyone. Mrs Chapman: Fantastic! I am all for that. That is marvellous, but is it happening in every school in the 8.50 pm country? Of course not. I have some brilliant engineering Elizabeth Truss (South West Norfolk) (Con): I fear businesses which go into schools and inspire young that the Opposition are on the wrong track with the people. They try to point young people in the right subject they have selected for today’s debate. I fear that direction and show them that there are wonderful careers much more damage has been done by the dilution of for them on their doorstep—international careers—but maths, sciences and languages in our schools than by young people need more than a visit from such a poor careers advice, and yet we have yet another Opposition company. They need proper face-to-face advice from day debate on education that does not address the core people who will inspire them. issue. We are not talking about what students actually The businesses in Darlington to which I referred are learn in school. recruiting senior engineers from Greece, Brazil and During their period in government, Labour presided Turkey, because we are not producing the people to fill over a hollowing core that failed to prepare people those senior roles. One reason for that is that people properly for the world of work. Britain has been left are not getting the right advice at the right age. I am with a skills shortage in crucial areas, and I fear that we not talking just about 16 and FE. I am talking about are losing the race against international competitors. year 6 in primary school, before they take their options, An OECD report published today indicates that there so that they know that they have to take good science has been a rebalancing of skills between west and east. subjects and maths. I am glad to see the hon. Member The leagues tables for the OECD’s programme for for East Hampshire (Damian Hinds) agreeing with me. international student assessment speak for themselves, Such careers advice will not happen via Google. It with the UK falling to 28th place in maths. needs to be face-to-face, inspiring advice. The previous Government, instead of addressing the I am fortunate to have in Darlington the Queen fundamental weaknesses in our education system, further Elizabeth sixth-form college. I shall shamelessly plug skewed education towards those subjects that employers the work of one woman, Stella Barnes, who provides did not want and spent money on careers advice that first-class careers advice to young people there. I am only a few people appreciated. Only 20% of students sure that despite the pressures that it faces, the college said that they thought the careers advice provided was will find the funding to keep Stella doing such fantastic useful. Alan Milburn, a former Labour Minister, said work, but that is one woman and she can only do so that the careers advice simply was not good enough. much. In the turbulent world that our young people are Simon Hughes: I recognise my hon. Friend’s interest entering, job prospects are not certain, the costs of in this wider subject. The really important thing is that higher education are putting people off, and EMA no both should work. The reason we need good, personalised longer incentivises young people to stay on post-16. careers advice is that it enables young people to make That applies not only to the at-risk, the vulnerable, the the right choices, for example on what subjects to study, people who would not have a job if their mother had so that they do not end up excluded from university not organised something for them. It applies to all courses—medicine, for instance—because they made young people from all kinds of backgrounds. It is not the wrong choices when they were 14 or 15. 985 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 986

Elizabeth Truss: I thank my right hon. Friend for his Elizabeth Truss: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. I advocate making the E-bac subjects that intervention. I support the idea that a good head teacher the Government are encouraging compulsory until age 16, will select those teachers who are the most inspirational as they are in Canada, Germany and France. It is to the students entering that school and encourage good for all students to get a core basic education. We them in their future lives and careers. In this country, currently have one of the lowest proportions in the however, we often look to the short term and the next OECD of students doing maths aged 16 to 18. We have job, instead of building up the capability for a lifetime a very poor record on foreign languages, history and of jobs—which could amount to 10 jobs. We are all sciences. going to work longer, because we are all living longer. To address the point that the shadow Secretary of I know from the previous comments of Labour Front State made in his speech, we need to get everyone up to Benchers that they do not always approve of traditional a good level in a core general education. It is no subjects such as physics, chemistry and modern longer appropriate to say that it is okay for students to languages—[Interruption.] Well, I have heard expressed cut off their options at age 14 and regret it later in their in this Chamber objections to the English baccalaureate. careers. I do not think that we need a lot of expensive However, even if the Opposition think that those subjects careers advisers telling students that; it should be a are old hat, which people in China and India certainly broad part of a general education that everyone in this do not think, as they are rushing to institutes of technology country studies, as is the case in most of our major to study them, I am afraid that we are not that great either competitors. I would like the Government to take up at teaching new subjects in the way that employers want. that point. The shadow Secretary of State mentioned ICT, and Employers say that they are most concerned about Dr Eric Schmidt of Google said: foreign languages—75% said that it was their major “Your IT curriculum focuses on teaching how to use software, concern. Yet in 2004 the previous Government dropped but gives no insight into how it’s made. That is just throwing away the requirement of a foreign language at key stage 4, your great computing heritage.” and since then the proportion of students studying I fear not only that we are not teaching enough rigorous foreign languages at GCSE has plunged from 79% to and traditional subjects, but that we are not teaching 44%. In mathematics, the UK is an outlier, with only the new subjects deeply enough, or in a way that imparts 50% of sixth forms offering further mathematics A-level, how things work, in order to give us the capability to and yet students who wish to study mathematics or build more effective programming and IT industries. physics at one of the top universities need a further The problem therefore is not just with the subjects, but mathematics A-level. That means that 50% of our young with the way ICT is being taught. people are unable to study those important subjects at The Government are taking absolutely the right approach university. That is absolutely disgraceful. Why are they by encouraging more students to study such core subjects, not able to do so? There are perverse incentives in the which will give them broad career options, rather than league tables, as the Minister said earlier, and we all cut off their options early, as many people have know that some subjects are more equal than others, unfortunately been doing. but there is also a fundamental dishonesty in how they are presented and reported. Julie Hilling: I thank the hon. Lady for giving way, One thing that no one has mentioned in the debate so because I have been sitting here getting increasingly far, however, is the role that teachers should play. We frustrated at the notion that history, geography, modern have seen their role diminished since 2003, and in particular foreign languages, maths and science are the only subjects since their terms and conditions restricted the activities that will give a student the breadth of knowledge with in which they may become involved. Teachers have a which to go forward in their lives. Is the issue not about crucial role in inspiring students to think about their academic rigour and young people learning to learn future and what they could make of themselves, but and learning to evaluate what they learn? That is the sometimes we focus too much on the student’s immediate important thing, not the subject that they are doing. career, rather than on building up their long-term capabilities. Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. Interventions are getting a little bit too long. It is better to have somebody who is close to a student giving them regular advice and being honest about their Elizabeth Truss: I thank the hon. Lady for her subject options. I have been into local schools and intervention. Perhaps in due course she could tell me talked to teachers, and often they are afraid of denigrating why Canada, France and Germany insist on those a subject for fear of seeming elitist, but unfortunately subjects being taken to age 16, and why all those countries that is undermining our meritocracy and meaning that are doing better than us in the OECD PISA—programme students from well-off backgrounds who attend independent for international student assessment—tables. schools are twice as likely to study maths and science at A-level, three times as likely to study modern languages The Government are taking absolutely the right approach and seven times less likely to study media studies. That, of strengthening the core, getting rid of modules from I am afraid, is the legacy of our system. exams, making rigorous assessments, and encouraging students to take the E-bac. It is so encouraging that this year the numbers of new entries to these subjects have Steve McCabe (Birmingham, Selly Oak) (Lab): What gone up. We are also offering proper apprenticeships to is the basis for assuming that unqualified teachers who get people the proper work experience that they need to flourish in the free-school experiment will be better build a successful career. We will not create careers with equipped to provide the support and direction that the more hot air; we will create careers through real learning hon. Lady hopes pupils will receive? in real subjects and real jobs. 987 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 988

9pm This is a school in a very deprived neighbourhood that has an excellent reputation and a high percentage of its Stephen Twigg (Liverpool, West Derby) (Lab/Co-op): girls going on to university. This is the first debate I have spoken in since the summer recess, so may I declare an interest that I Cardinal Heenan school for boys has pioneered a should have declared when I spoke in a Westminster particularly innovative approach to careers advice. I Hall debate on 6 July? Since March this year, I have had want to commend Dave Forshaw, the head teacher, and a part-time placement in my local office from a local his team for their industry day programme, which I have not-for-profit social enterprise, the Neighbourhood Services had the opportunity to visit on two occasions. The Company. Due to an oversight on my part, I did not programme draws on alumni, partners and a range of register that interest until 8 August. I am pleased to local organisations to deliver rich and effective careers have this opportunity to put that on the record. advice, starting in year 7. Its recent industry days have had contributions from a former pupil of the school, My right hon. Friend the shadow Education Secretary the actor Ian Hart, who appeared in the Harry Potter set the context for this important debate—rising youth films, as well as local and national journalists, sports unemployment, the loss of education maintenance professionals, solicitors, accountants and others. West allowance and the increase in tuition fees, with the Derby school has adopted a similar approach and held danger that today’s generation of young people could its first careers convention last year. be left in the lurch. He also made the important point that Labour Members are not arguing for preserving I cite those examples because they demonstrate two the status quo, and he made it clear that we want to important points. The first is the critical importance of work on a cross-party basis to deliver the terms of the giving information and advice at an early age. Too motion. I welcome the comments by the right hon. often, these things are left too late. The second is the Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon importance of drawing on expertise, including among Hughes), who reminded us of the recommendations in the alumni of the schools themselves, to inspire young his report. I gently encourage him and his colleagues to people. follow those words by joining us in the Aye Lobby. The head teachers of those schools said to me today The big policy challenge to which several Members that quality careers advice needs resources. They are have referred is how we can increase social mobility. We very concerned about what they see as a potential shift know from research, including last year’s “Going for in policy away from face-to-face interaction to online Growth” report from the OECD, that this country has and telephone-based services. My right hon. Friend the an appalling record. The strength of the link between a shadow Secretary of State set out the research published person’s income and their parents’ income is higher in by Unison that was done at the university of Derby, this country than in any other OECD country. That is a which shows the sheer scale of the cuts in careers truly shocking fact. I think that every speaker has services up and down the country. That is the backdrop mentioned Alan Milburn, so I feel the need to do so as for this important debate. well. In his 2009 report, Alan said: Some of this debate has focused on low-cost solutions “Birth, not worth, has become much more of a determinant of and how effective they are in delivery. I would like to people’s life chances.” bring the House’s attention to the work of an organisation We must ensure that we address that in this debate. called Future First. It has done excellent research on careers services. Like the head teachers of the schools in Mrs Chapman: On the subject of Alan Milburn, if my constituency that I have cited, it emphasises that my hon. Friend cared to read further on in his report, careers advice cannot be reduced to online information he would notice that Mr Milburn recommended that and telephone services. A complementary model is surely schools should be funded in order to commission such the best way forward. Future First seeks to increase careers advice. social mobility by building communities of alumni around state schools to inspire young people about Stephen Twigg: My hon. Friend is absolutely correct. their futures. I was going to make a similar point later, but she has made it very powerfully. Mr Graham Stuart: The hon. Gentleman is giving a The Minister for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong passionate speech. He has just said that careers advice Learning, who is not here this evening, has been cautious should be complementary, and I agree. However, the in his criticism of the previous Government’s programmes, Opposition motion does not say that the Government and rightly so. Of course, as Members on both sides of should seek to find additional funds to provide face-to-face the House have said, there were serious imperfections careers advice; it says that all young people should be with Connexions and Next Step, but we must be careful provided with face-to-face careers advice whether they not to write off the positive features and the important need it or not. That does not sound complementary; it work of many talented and committed professionals sounds like the cumbersome over-specified and overly who have worked, as some still do, in those programmes. expensive processes that we saw too much of under the Today, in advance of tonight’s debate, I spoke to previous Government. people in some of the secondary schools in my constituency. Those at St John Bosco school in Croxteth told me Stephen Twigg: Not at all. What I mean by about the work they have been doing with the Aimhigher complementary, and what I understand Future First to programme. They have drawn particularly on the mean by complementary, is that we need face-to-face importance of the role of face-to-face contact by employing advice, but that that is not enough. We also need the a graduate mentor to assist the girls at the school with other projects to which I and other Members have their university applications and career development. referred. 989 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 990

Eric Joyce (Falkirk) (Lab): On the subject of A number of hon. Members have quoted the former complementary services, my hon. Friend will be aware Member for Darlington, Alan Milburn, so let me do so that the Labour Government and my hon. Friend the as well. Having chaired the panel on fair access, he said: Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman) explored the “In my view, the service requires a quite radical rethink”. possibility of using social media as a complementary Indeed, the panel concluded: way of introducing kids at school to people who have the same interests. Does he think that we might take “We believe that schools and colleges need to be given direct responsibility, working with local authorities, for making their that idea forward in the future? decisions about information, advice and guidance”. That is exactly what the Government plan to do. Stephen Twigg: Absolutely; my hon. Friend makes an important point. Face-to-face advice is vital, and that is The current hon. Member for Darlington why the motion is about that, but it is not enough on its (Mrs Chapman) quoted a survey that said that only one own. We need other initiatives, whether they use information in five young people found Connexions helpful. Further technology or networks of alumni, as Future First does. surveys said that under Labour, six in 10 were unhappy with the quality of the careers that they were getting— Future First started as a project in London state [Interruption.] There has been an element of good secondary schools. It was founded by a team of graduates advice, but perhaps not enough, and we must acknowledge from state schools, who were motivated by their own that there was no golden age of careers advice under the experience. It seeks to improve the support offered to previous Government. We need to put the debate in that young people at school as soon as they start considering context. their future. It is now supported by a wide range of organisations, including the Sutton Trust. It is looking I agree with hon. Members who have made it clear to extend its excellent practice beyond London to other that careers advice is vital, and that young people need parts of the country. Recently, I had the opportunity to to get it as early as possible in their school careers. It is introduce Future First to Liverpool Vision, with a view important that we foster aspiration, which hon. Members to opening opportunities for it to take its programmes have talked about; that we expand the boundaries of to Liverpool. It will be meeting shortly with head what students believe is possible for them in their careers; teachers and business leaders in the city of Liverpool. and that we get young people to aim high. Future First’s study, “Social Mobility, Careers Advice The hon. Member for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy), and Alumni Networks”, to which my right hon. Friend who is not in the Chamber, spoke about that, and I the shadow Secretary of State referred, makes the point agreed with her, but the question is this: how do we that was made earlier by my hon. Friend the Member deliver that careers advice? We have heard that the for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman) about the contrast Education Bill will introduce a legal duty for the provision between what happens in private schools and state of impartial careers guidance in years 9 to 11, which is schools. When asked how they rated their careers service, absolutely right. I am pleased that the Minister spoke just 31% of young people in state schools said “good” about the fact that the Government are consulting on or “very good”, yet in private schools the figure was whether they should extend that duty downwards to almost double that at 57%. The figures from the independent year 8, which would be great. I would like to see it go sector and those from the state sector show a very down further, because we cannot start careers advice significant contrast, which highlights the scale of the early enough. challenges that we face. I agree that that responsibility should go to schools. At the end of the day, they know their pupils best and In-school services must get better. Schools need to know what is required. They will be able to commission improve them, but they cannot do that on their own; advice and services from the new national careers service they need partners, and organisations such as Future when that is up and running, and of course from other First provide ideal partners for that excellent work. I external sources. therefore urge the Government, following tonight’s debate, not only to guarantee face-to-face careers advice as set It has been implied—I do not whether it was deliberate out in the motion, but to go beyond that, and support or not—that providing online advice does not make and encourage excellent programmes such as the one at sense for young people. Some of us have young children Cardinal Heenan school in my constituency and the ourselves, and some of us know young people, and we ones that Future First has promoted in London. As my know that it is second nature for them to use the right hon. Friend the shadow Education Secretary said, internet to do research. Professor Alison Wolf, who led Opposition Members will work with the Government if the Government review of vocational education, has they genuinely seek to advance that vital instrument in said very clearly that there is a role for the Government the fight for a more socially mobile country. in providing online, updated information on what is available. It is entirely consistent that online provision is one of the things that will be happening. 9.10 pm Alok Sharma (Reading West) (Con): I do not know Lilian Greenwood: I agree that young people often whether you have seen the film “Groundhog Day”, want to access information through new technology, Mr Deputy Speaker, in which history keeps repeating but does the hon. Gentleman consider it an adequate itself, but this Opposition day debate and the one before replacement for guidance and the opportunity to discuss it feel very similar. We have heard the same old tired options face to face? arguments from the Opposition, with very little acknowledgment of the mistakes that they made or the Alok Sharma: Clearly, we need to have both. mess in which we find ourselves, in terms of both the [Interruption.] Hang on, let me finish! Schools will be economy and the careers advice service. able to access this information. 991 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 992

I want to talk about what is happening on my patch on them as a result of the position in which we were left in Reading. It is vital that not just schools, but businesses by the previous Government. Unfortunately, I cannot have a key role in providing careers advice, because, at support the Opposition motion tonight. the end of the day, they have an interest in interacting with their future employees. It is vital that we do not forget that element. As the Minister knows, because he 9.19 pm is opening it at the end of the month, we have organised Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): In the ’80s and an interactive careers fair—we have called it a “futures ’90s, I spent 10 years as a youth worker in youth fair”—open to all secondary schools in my constituency. co-operative project for unemployed young people. At We have organised it with the educational charity, Central that time, more than a quarter of young people were Berkshire Education Business Partnership, which I guess unemployed. They were a generation who had no jobs, is the sort of external service provider that we are no hope and no future. Some of those young people talking about. I have long thought it important—I am never recovered from that period. Some committed sure that other Members have too—that we connect suicide; others turned to drugs and alcohol, or ended up schools and business and that careers advice is not with long-term mental health problems. Even when the provided in isolation by schools and teachers. economy started to recover, those young people who When I began the initiative, I wondered how we had spent many years unemployed found it incredibly would fund it, but actually businesses bent over backwards difficult to get a job. Let us be honest, most employers to provide funding. We are holding it at the conference would probably prefer to employ a 16-year-old fresh centre at the Madejski football stadium in Reading—it out of school than a 26-year-old who has spent most of is going to be a very big event—and schools will not the past 10 years unemployed, with nothing to get up have to pay a penny because it will be fully funded by for and nothing to do. business. More than 60 organisations, including businesses, The youth co-operative tried to stop the cycle of multinationals and local companies, are taking part. An despair for young people. It helped them to gain skills hon. Member said that we need alumni and former and set up their own businesses. It gave them driving students in positions of responsibility in companies to lessons and taught them how to use computers. It built come and talk to pupils in schools, which is exactly up their confidence and gave them a reason to get out of what we will have—every sector will be covered, from bed, and it was open 365 days a year. It was about more engineering to IT and apprenticeships providers—along than skills education; it provided a support network, with seminars on practical skills, including on how to and it challenged attitudes. It helped people to believe write a CV, perform in mock interviews, secure an in themselves and gave them practical help. We helped apprenticeship, manage money and budget. There will young people who were sleeping in cars and on friends’ also be advice on pursuing a science career. Hon. Members floors to get rehoused. We then helped them to decorate have rightly said that we need to encourage STEM subjects. their new homes and find second-hand furniture. We helped young people whose schools and colleges said The careers fair is also about ensuring that before the that they were not good enough for university to get students arrive, they know exactly what to expect and there and to complete their degrees, and we supported that afterwards there will be follow-up sessions with young people into work. Then we were closed by Tory teachers. Hon. Members talked about the need to involve cuts in the youth service. families and parents. There will be an opportunity, after the school day, for parents to come back with their kids The Labour Government came along and introduced and talk to businesses. There are families in my the Connexions service, which offered careers advice-plus, constituencies—perhaps in all constituencies—who have in the form of straightforward careers advice for all never had a scientist, lawyer, accountant or whatever in young people and a dedicated support service for young their family, and this is an opportunity for parents to people not in employment education or training, or talk with businesses together with their kids. That is vital. those at risk of becoming NEETs. The service did many of the things that the youth co-operative did in the ’80s In the previous debate, the shadow Business Secretary, and ’90s. Now we have another Tory Government, and the right hon. Member for Southampton, Itchen youth unemployment is at its highest since 1992. We are (Mr Denham), talked about the need for long-term seeing the destruction of Connexions and the youth apprenticeships. We have companies coming to the fair service, and all support services are being slashed. It is offering three-year apprenticeships, and there is even a back to the future again. Young people again feel that seminar for teachers to learn about the local labour they have no jobs, no hope and no future. market and the types of skills that employers are looking We can argue about the effectiveness of the Connexions for. I am talking about this because we need to stop service. The Government like to use the result of an thinking one-dimensionally and assuming that the online survey of 510 respondents who said that they Government must provide everything. There is a clear were unhappy with the service, rather than the survey of role for businesses. They bend over backwards to help 5,000 young people carried out by the then Department schools and local communities because they know that for Education and Skills, which found that over 90% were at the end of the day they will see the benefits. We need satisfied with the service that they had received. Surely to find a way of getting the business community more no one can argue that online advice is a substitute for engaged. Bridging the skills and expectations gap between face-to-face advice. Like my hon. Friend the Member young people and potential employers is vital. for Darlington (Mrs Chapman) and, I suspect, many In conclusion, I think that the Government are on other Members, I did not get good careers advice— absolutely the right track with careers advice, and I [Laughter.] would ask the Opposition to think carefully about what the Government are doing and the constraints placed Stephen Twigg: Like all of us; that’s why we are here. 993 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 994

Julie Hilling: Perhaps—although I have to say that it Connexions was not just about careers advice. Funding is not a bad job. was made available to support young people like Thomas It is down to us to ensure that young people are or others who for other reasons were not making a inspired to follow certain careers. How can they find good transfer to further education or work. There was out what jobs and careers are out there? If they do not funding for programmes that provided support, training have friends, family or people in their neighbourhood and education for young people, including a summer who are in a variety of professions, how do they find programme for 16-year-olds from the New Opportunities out what they can do, or what their options are? That is Fund. An activity agreement provided an allowance in the situation that faces many of our young people, return for fulfilling an agreed action plan and funding especially those from poorer backgrounds. was provided to purchase experiential learning opportunities. There was a learning agreement aimed at engaging local employers and increasing the number of Damian Hinds: The hon. Lady is raising some very young people in jobs with training. The programme good questions, but is she implying that all those services offered financial incentives to employers and young have been working perfectly for the past 10 years or so? people, in combination with suitably brokered learning provision. Julie Hilling: I am quite happy to concede that they In Wigan there was a range of bespoke projects have not been working perfectly, but I have to tell the aimed at the most vulnerable young people in the House that the Government’s proposals will make things borough—including teenage pregnancy courses and a worse, not better. video production course for young offenders. The re-engage Many industries—not just the professions involving project built on the success of the activity agreement solicitors, doctors and so on—are very much family pilot by securing a discretionary fund for young people affairs, in which sons and daughters follow fathers and living in Wigan’s most deprived neighbourhoods. That mothers, aunts and uncles and grandparents into the also funded summer projects, in partnership with the workplace. Before I worked for a rail union, which was youth service, to keep school leavers engaged. An very much a family affair, I had no idea about the apprenticeship pathways project was delivered by Wigan range of jobs available in that industry. How does a college and local learning providers, which looked at young person without connections find out about such new ways of engaging and motivating closer to the jobs, and how do they ensure that they have the right labour market young people who were struggling to skills to apply for them when they do find out about find opportunities. Wigan council’s supported employment them? team was funded to assist young people with learning difficulties in accessing work opportunities. Of course, the advice that young people receive has to The council delivered a successful apprenticeship be good. I remember a member of my staff taking a programme, recruiting young people and supporting young person to meet a careers officer before the them through trained mentors. In partnership with Connexions service was established. Again, I am not local learning providers and colleges, it successfully saying that Connexions was perfect. That young women delivered a range of activities to engage and motivate wanted to become a vet, but the careers adviser very NEET and potentially NEET clients—including the kindly told her about how to become a veterinary nurse. clearing house, taster sessions, locality-based summer That was disgraceful. We need to be ambitious for programmes and careers events. young people. I worked with two young people who were told that they were too stupid to go to university. What happened as a result of all that support and One of them now has her master’s degree, and is a head all those programmes? Youth unemployment fell by of department in a sixth-form college. The other has a 40% from 1997 to the start of the global financial crisis, degree in Russian and splits his time between Russia and more than half the young people on jobseeker’s and Korea. A computer programme will not inspire allowance were off it within three months. But now it is young people. It will not be ambitious for them, and it all gone. will not stretch them. It will not build their confidence, Most young people from advantaged backgrounds or give them the support that they need if they are to will make the transition from school to employment, reach their full potential. probably via university, with few problems, but surely What if a young person has learning difficulties or we have a duty to support young people who, through physical disabilities? I want to talk about Thomas, no fault of their own, will find that transition difficult whose mum and gran came to see me in my surgery. or impossible. We owe it to young people to help them Thomas had not been diagnosed with a disability and fulfil their potential. We owe it to them to give them the there was a threat to take his mum to court because he best possible support and advice from trained and would not attend school. Eventually, through our qualified advisers. I hope that the Government will do intervention, Thomas was diagnosed with an autism-related another U-turn and save either the Connexions service condition. He would not leave home, go to school or do or the careers service—at least something that will be anything else. He had a Connexions adviser, however, valuable to young people. And while they are at it, I who regularly came to the house at the same time each hope that they will save the youth service, too. week—the sort of thing that a young person with an autism-related condition needs. By using the available funding, the adviser was able to take Thomas out to the Several hon. Members rose— library and various other activities, and to give him experience of work programmes. Thomas’s life was transformed, but his mum and gran are now absolutely Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): There are desperate about what will happen to him. two speakers and 12 minutes left. 995 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 996

9.28 pm One company in Burnley is looking for 300 skilled workers and cannot get them. It has suddenly decided Gordon Birtwistle (Burnley) (LD): I thank the shadow that taking on a vast number of apprentices, through Secretary of State for bringing this debate to the House, the Government’s apprenticeship scheme, is a good as I believe it is valuable—one of the most important idea. But a young person of 16 does not get to be a debates I have attended since being elected. It is only a skilled airframe fitter or aero-engine fitter by the time shame that so few Members are present to hear the they are 17. The process takes four or five years. For the contributions. [Interruption.] I am not naming names, past 30 years that process has not happened; we have let just making a comment. The principle of the motion is the whole thing fall apart. I am not blaming the Labour very good, but the way in which it has been written is Government or the previous Tory Government, but very poor. [Interruption.] Those might be the words of that has happened; this is where we are. my right hon. Friend the Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes) but they are not in this We have a careers service that has failed the young motion. The problem with it is—[Interruption.] The people of this country for the past 30 years, and we hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull East (Karl Turner) desperately need to do something about it. We do not has only just come into the Chamber, yet he seems to need the Government to do everything; we need to get think this is a joke. the professionals from industry involved. Why do we not invite Sir John Rose, who has retired from Rolls-Royce, The motion says: to talk to people and advise them about how he would “That this House believes that the Government should act run a careers service? He has run Rolls-Royce for donkey’s urgently to guarantee face-to-face careers advice for all young years and made it very successful. I do not think that people in schools.” the Government can do this on their own. People It does not tell us how many times, at what stage careers outside government can give better advice than anybody advice is needed, or how old the young people should within it. be. Let me explain why I believe it has been badly I suggest that the Government should examine what written. If it had been written differently I might have they are doing. I accept the need to do more and if been able to support it. money is available, I hope that they will do more. I also When I was leader of Burnley council some three think that the local colleges and further education colleges years ago, I went to a junior school to speak to some could do more. Twice a year Burnley college has a year 6 students who were just about to leave the school careers day, when it invites all the companies from and go on to secondary education. The headmistress Burnley and most of them attend. They put stands up had invited a number of prominent people in the town—the and speak to young people, and they take vast numbers mayor, myself and one or two more—to say what our of young people on as a result of those nights. One jobs were. After we had told the young people what our company took six apprentices on as a result of one of jobs were, we asked them what sort of vision they had these nights—young people who had never thought of for their future. One little girl said that she was interested going into that sort of industry. in becoming a nursery nurse, as she had some siblings We cannot take too narrow an approach to this issue. and was keen on looking after them. The shock for me We should expand it to include everybody involved in came when one young man said, “I want to be a benefit employing young people once they have finished school claimant.” That was the aspiration in life of a young or university. I implore the Government to examine all man of 11, and he had never been given any different the options. As I have said, I am disappointed that the advice. When I asked him why, he said, “My dad and motion has been so badly written. [Interruption.] It is uncle are benefit claimants and we live very well off it, not my right hon. Friend’s motion; it is the shadow so why should I get up every morning to go to work?” Secretary of State’s motion. It is badly written—but if it When I told the head teacher afterwards how stunned I had said, “We want to do this at certain times of was at that, she said, “I’m afraid that’s the way of the people’s education and there is some money for it here,” world round here.” I then decided that I would look into I assure hon. Members that I would have supported it. how that happened, and what we could do to try to Unfortunately, the Opposition motion does not say stop it. that. After that we got talking to people in the secondary schools. The secondary schools in Burnley have gone 9.35 pm through a torrid time, although I am pleased to say that they are now recovering. Nobody in here needs to tell Damian Hinds (East Hampshire) (Con): So much to me about privileged students; if they came to Burnley, say, and so little time to say it in. they would find that we do not have very many privileged Many of the contributions from Opposition Members students at the moment. I thought it would be a great have been about bad careers advice, stereotyping and idea to get the companies involved, and we managed to ambition limiting. The unfortunate point is that get a big company involved in every school. They carry guaranteeing that it will be provided face to face does out a lot of careers advice because they are the professionals; not get rid of bad advice; all that guarantees is that the they know what educational skills they need from the advice will be heard more directly. The title of this people who are coming to them. debate displayed on the annunciator is “Careers Service A lot of young people want to go on to university, (YoungPeople)”, but doing real service to young people and that is fine, but a lot of young people are going on in their careers is about much more than specifying a to university to study subjects that do not qualify them certain amount of time with the man from the council. for any jobs when they have finished studying them, It only happens when the whole education system and while there are a number of jobs in manufacturing, the economy work together on young people’s careers. particularly in Burnley, for which we cannot get staff. We must take a much bigger, broader, holistic view of 997 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 998

[Damian Hinds] that getting a GCSE in accountancy, law or financial services is a key step to starting a career in one of those this at a national level, in industry, throughout the professions. education system and in interaction with individual I welcome what the Government are doing to publish young people. destination data on schools as well as more information As we know, we live in a rapidly changing world that on higher education institutions, and I also welcome has already changed in many ways, not least through the reform of the key stage 4 league tables. I also the disappearance of many jobs that young people used welcome the somewhat controversial—in parts—English to do between the ages of 16 and 18 and in terms of the baccalaureate. The simple fact is that those core subjects types of skills we need for the jobs that we expect to be have a premium value among employers and higher available in the future. As the right hon. Member for education institutions, and we should stop fibbing to Leigh (Andy Burnham) rightly said, the range of different young people. It is not a full curriculum. There is plenty jobs that people might now do over their lifetime calls of room for options on top of the English baccalaureate, for much more flexibility. but the best advice we can give to a young person who We do not have a great record in this country, historically, wants to keep their options as open as possible is to of picking winners, but we need to recognise that certain include in what they study those core academic subjects. industries will be growth industries at which we need to Of course it will not be for everyone, and I also welcome excel. Without exception they are industries that need the Government’s moves to ensure that the league tables greater skills, and we need to help young people to focus and metrics recognise equally the progress of every on them. We need better links between industry and child. We must find new and better ways to ensure that education, both so industries can inspire young people post-16 students are more engaged with mathematics. to want to go and work in them and so that the skills In conclusion, the motion talks about guaranteeing sets that come out of the education system include the good careers advice. I put it to you, Mr Speaker, that the things they need as companies, and that we need as an only way to guarantee a good careers service for young economy and as a country to succeed in the world. people is if all the elements—at national level, in industry, There also needs to be a feedback mechanism so that in education, and direct advice for people—are working companies and sectors can tell the education system in concert. what they are looking for. We often hear complaints about what comes out, but it is not quite so clear what the mechanism for change is. 9.40 pm There must also be opportunities, of course, for Mr Iain Wright (Hartlepool) (Lab): May I begin by young people to experience, sample and gain experience extending the Opposition’s best wishes to the Minister and training in firms, and I welcome the expansion in for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning? apprenticeships and work placements. I agree that we He always makes these debates an absolute delight and must look again at how the internship system works. We pleasure; frankly, we have missed him today and we have heard about internships from Opposition Members, very much hope that he has a speedy recovery from his and a number of Members of Parliament have taken operation. the decision that they will ensure that internships are The debate has not been what I expected, which was paid, so that they are available to the full range of more of the yah-boo politics that we have come to young people. expect in the House. I expected to hear, “You spent too Education as a whole must guide young people towards much money,” coming from one side and, “You don’t fulfilling careers. I was surprised that the right hon. care about vulnerable people,” on the other. I have been Member for Leigh left colleges out of the motion, as struck by how much consensus there has been and what they are an important part of the education system. He a good, measured, well-informed and excellent tone referred only to schools, but of course the whole system there has been throughout. At its best, the debate has must work effectively. I do not think anybody could featured hon. Members being very much in agreement. doubt the Government’s commitment to reforming the I pay tribute to all hon. Members who have contributed education system, both to raise the average level of tonight, particularly to the spirit in which the right hon. education and, crucially, to narrow the yawning and Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon embarrassing gap between rich and poor. Hughes) made his remarks. What I did find regrettable, I am afraid that in parts of the education system too however, were the contortions that he and the hon. many young people have not been guided towards fulfilling Member for Burnley (Gordon Birtwistle) got into in careers. Let me quote the Wolf report: saying, “We agree with every single point that the “The staple offer for between a quarter and a third of the Opposition are making regarding the motion, but we post-16 cohort is a diet of low-level vocational qualifications, cannot possibly vote with them tonight,” for whatever most of which have little to no labour market value.” reason. At an even earlier stage—coming up to key stage 4—it seems that some young people are guided towards subjects Dan Rogerson: The point that might have escaped the that will boost the school’s performance in the league shadow Minister is that the Opposition have taken one tables more than they might boost the individual’s recommendation out of a whole report and sought to performance in the job market and their opportunities force a vote on something tonight that they never through life. Perhaps they get face-to-face advice: perhaps provided for when they were in government. Unfortunately, somebody tells them that all GCSE subjects will be that brings a yah-boo, cynical element to something worth the same to them as any other; perhaps somebody that goes much wider. It would be better to debate the tells them that equivalencies will always be accepted in full report from the Government and the reaction to the outside world; and perhaps somebody tells them that report. 999 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 1000

Mr Wright: I disagree. The right hon. Member for demand goes down, additional pressure is placed on Bermondsey and Old Southwark made an excellent and youth employment, but the Government’s policies are measured contribution about expanding the provision making a bad situation very much worse. of careers advice to younger pupils, about making sure As we heard in an earlier debate today, the loss of that we have a wide variety of work experience and EMA, the abolition of the future jobs fund, the scrapping about making sure that careers guidance is not offered of the young people’s guarantee, the trebling of tuition on a wet Wednesday afternoon, as we mentioned in the fees and the ending of Aimhigher have made it more Committee on the Education Bill. I agree with every difficult than ever for young people in this country to word. This is more complex than it just being about work hard, to get on and to succeed. That implicit face-to-face guidance, but face-to-face guidance is an contract that we had, in place since the post-war era important complementary step. I should have thought and shared by successive Governments, that somehow that he agreed with that and would want to show his the next generation would do better than the previous support and put pressure on the Government by joining generation, is in real danger of being broken. That was us in the Lobby tonight. made clear in an excellent contribution by my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, West Derby (Stephen Simon Hughes: The hon. Gentleman knows that I Twigg). respect his commitment to these issues both before he In difficult and confusing times such as these we came to the House and since he has been here. We are need, now more than ever, an effective, functioning and very clear that we want the same objective. Tonight is a professional careers service to support and navigate chance for the Labour party to put its cards on the young people through the turbulence. We need a table, and we have made our position clear about where personalised service, with close links between the young we want the Government to get to. I believe that they person and the adviser. We need, as the right hon. have listened and that the Minister will respond, and I Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark said tonight, hope that in not many weeks from now we will end up face-to-face guidance, helping to motivate, inspire and where we all want to be. enthuse young people in difficult times. Mr Wright: The Minister said earlier that he did not In the current economic difficulties, when a young want to rule anything in or out regarding the right hon. person receives rejection letter after rejection letter, it is Gentleman’s recommendations and I should have thought neither use nor ornament just to point them to a phone. that meant an abstention in tonight’s debate to make As my hon. Friend the Member for Huddersfield sure that all the cards were on the table, but that does (Mr Sheerman) said, IT is important but we cannot do not seem to be the case. I do think that the Minister is it with technology alone. We need a professional to say thinking about moving in that direction and I hope that to that young person, “Keep going,” or “I think you he will accept an amendment to the Education Bill—we should try this,” or “This might suit you.” As my hon. will certainly put pressure on him as the Bill makes its Friend the Member for Bolton West (Julie Hilling) said, way through the Lords—but it is disappointing that, in we need in the careers service trusted professionals who the spirit of consensus that we have seen in tonight’s know the young people—young people such as Thomas— debate, he cannot make more positive remarks to make who can help inspire and motivate them. Tragically, the sure that we get face-to-face guidance. cuts to such services mean that the professionalism and expertise of careers personnel has been lost, and lost for Two or three weeks ago, our young people got excellent good. GCSE and A-level results and, as hon. Members have said tonight, we should all celebrate their success. The Time and again in the debate we heard that our Minister said in August that young people from places across the country have been denied such opportunities. We heard that from my hon. “we have to make sure we prepare young people for the future, whether they are going onto further education, training or into Friends the Members for Huddersfield and for Darlington the workplace.” (Mrs Chapman), who in a powerful speech expressed her concern that high-quality advice might be confined He reiterated that tonight by saying that it is important to those in fee-paying schools. for young people to make the right choices in order for them to be guided in the future. We could not agree Ministers in the Department for Education pride more, but it is abundantly clear that the Government themselves on trusting professionals in making the right are failing to do that. decisions, but we have had in the last month the astonishing, and possibly unprecedented, situation where a Government As my right hon. Friend the shadow Secretary of advisory group of some 20 renowned experts and State has made clear, young people are facing the most professionals considered resigning en masse in protest difficult and turbulent prospects for at least a generation. at the Government’s shambolic and incompetent handling The modern world is complex and often disorienting of careers services for young people. Steve Higginbotham, and is unrecognisable from what it was a few short years president of the Institute of Career Guidance, blasted ago, both in its challenges and in its opportunities. The the Government and stated that the service certainties that we had in the labour markets in the 1950s and 1960s when the Minister of State, Department “will not be an all-age careers service. It is a rebranded Next Step for Education, the hon. Member for Bognor Regis and service for adults plus an all-age telephone advice line and website.” Littlehampton (Mr Gibb), listened to his gramophone As my hon. Friend the Member for Darlington said, if records have gone for good. Much of that change is due the Government truly wish to aid social mobility and to large-scale shifts in global forces, such as the economic break the cycle of multigenerational worklessness or rise of China. The present economic situation is made low aspiration, they need to provide all possible tools. more difficult by the current turbulence in the global By removing face-to-face careers guidance for all young economy. I fully accept that when global aggregate people, they are taking one of those vital tools away. 1001 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 1002

[Mr Iain Wright] We heard the same old script. Whether it is “Groundhog Day”, which was mentioned by my hon. Friend the Ministers also often cite international comparisons Member for Reading West (Alok Sharma), a wind-up to support their policies. The hon. Member for South gramophone—a phrase used by my hon. Friend the West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss) cited those a lot tonight. Minister—or an over-heated iPod, the shadow Secretary But international evidence shows clearly that devolving of State and the hon. Members for Halton (Derek such career advice to schools has not worked in other Twigg), who is not here, and for Bolton West (Julie countries. Professor Tony Watts, giving evidence to the Hilling) came out with the same old stuff: where is the Education Committee, stated that in studying 55 countries money? They should tell us where the money went. it emerged that three negative things happen when it Where did the money go? Why did we have such an comes to school-based guidance. First, impartiality goes inheritance, which meant that difficult decisions had to out of the window because schools have a direct and be made? Why has face-to-face advice become such a vested interest; secondly, there is a weakening in links totemic issue? If it was such a be-all and end-all that it with the labour market; and finally there is an unevenness had to be guaranteed, why did the previous Labour in performance in schools. Professor Watts said that Government, in 13 years of running the careers service, two countries, New Zealand and the Netherlands, have never offer that guarantee? Why has it become so totemic recently done what this Government are now doing, now? and in both cases it resulted in a significant erosion in the quality of help as well as the breadth of its extent. It was an understatement par excellence by the shadow Secretary of State when he said that the previous system I mentioned the Education Committee. In its excellent was not perfect. He is dead right that it was not perfect. report on participation in education and training by Labour Members left a system where youth unemployment 16 to 19-year-olds, it makes a valued point on the had risen from 664,000 to 924,000 on their watch and unease about the Government’s changes to careers. where the number of NEETs aged between 15 and That was highlighted several times tonight. It draws 19 rose from 8% to 8.8% when it was falling in other attention to the fact that the Department for Education’s OECD countries. They left far too many of our young funding commitments to an all-age careers service consists people without the basic literacy and numeracy skills only of online and phone services. As we heard tonight, that they need to get any career going at all. the Select Committee makes the very clear recommendation that the Departments should fund face-to-face careers Labour Members trotted out the same old platitudes guidance for young people under the age of 18. Opposition and clichés. The right hon. Member for Leigh (Andy Members very much agree. Burnham) said that we are interested only in the elites. So I ask the Minister—for the sake of his career, let If pioneering a pupil premium for the most disadvantaged alone the careers of hundreds of thousands of young young people from the most disadvantaged estates in people—to look again at this important matter. Will he this country is an elite, call me elitist. If giving special listen to the impassioned pleas made tonight by hon. treatment to those children in care who suffer appalling Members on both sides of the House? Will he consider outcomes after 13 years of Labour Government is elite, the almost unanimous view of professionals? Will he call me elitist. If it is elitist to offer 250,000 additional take on board the Education Committee’s reasoned apprenticeships and 80,000 more work experience places comments? Will he listen to what is best for young and to ensure that we will raise the participation age, people? Will he listen again to the right hon. Member despite the financial pressures at the moment, call me for Bermondsey and Old Southwark and act urgently to an elitist. Our view of elitism is to ensure that every guarantee face-to-face careers information, advice and child in this country gets a fair crack of the whip and a guidance for all and not just some young people in fair opportunity to get a decent career—something that schools? Listening to the speeches made by hon. Members got worse under the previous Government. on both sides of the House, that definitely seems to be the will of hon. Members tonight. I commend the The hon. Member for Darlington (Mrs Chapman)—the motion to the House in a spirit of consensus. successor to Alan Milburn, who came up in just about every speech that we heard—gave us the most unparalleled 9.50 pm outpouring of stereotypes that I have ever heard in 14 years in the House: the feminine qualifications of The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Education cake decorating and the colour of cars. She talked (Tim Loughton): First, I agree with the shadow Minister about social mobility and said, “If Labour is about that we have had a lively, good-humoured and balanced anything, it is about social mobility.” Why, then, after debate this evening, even if it has lacked the sagacity 13 years of Labour, at key stage 4 did 68.5% of non-free- and flair of my hon. Friend the Minister for Further school-meal pupils achieve five or more A to C grade Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning. I am sure that GCSEs or the equivalent, compared with only 30.9% of we all wish him well in his recovery. free-school-meal pupils? Why did only 8% of free-school- I must repeat that the Secretary of State is not here meal pupils take the E-bac, with 4% achieving it, as this evening because, heeding the shadow Secretary of against 24% of non-FSM pupils? Why, at age 18, are State’s advice, he is not hiding his head in an ivory 29% of young people who have claimed free school tower; he is out meeting 100 excellent head teachers meals not in employment, education or training? That who have gone to see him to talk about weighty matters— is more than double the rate for those who had not five times the number of Labour Members who bothered claimed free school meals, for whom the figure is 13%. to come to the Chamber to listen to the shadow Secretary If that is social mobility under Labour, I do not want of State when he opened the Labour party’s debate in any of it. It is up to this Government to do something this Opposition day earlier this evening, so let us get about social mobility, which Labour talked and talked things into perspective. about but delivered in reverse. 1003 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 1004

The hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman), Question put forthwith, That the Question be now put. whom I respect greatly as a former Chair of the Select Question agreed to. Committee, said that in his day technology alone would certainly not have solved the problem. Of course it Main Question accordingly put. would not; technology has moved on enormously in the The House divided: Ayes 220, Noes 288. past 10 or 20 years. Who, 20 years ago, would have envisaged ringing up NHS Direct to get medical advice, Division No. 349] [9.59 pm or using computer programmes to get mental health advice? It is horses for courses. He talks about localism; AYES what localism means for us is leaving it up to the Abbott, Ms Diane Dodds, rh Mr Nigel expertise in the schools—the professionals, teachers Abrahams, Debbie Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M. and heads—to decide whether careers advice should be Alexander, rh Mr Douglas Donohoe, Mr Brian H. given face to face, over the internet, over the phone, or Alexander, Heidi Doran, Mr Frank even by retaining Connexions. [Interruption.] If Labour Ali, Rushanara Dowd, Jim Members listen, they will learn something, I hope. I Allen, Mr Graham Doyle, Gemma have four minutes to try to get them to learn something, Anderson, Mr David Dromey, Jack but they are in denial about where the money went, Ashworth, Jonathan Dugher, Michael about where the £200 million exclusively to guarantee Austin, Ian Eagle, Ms Angela face-to-face interviews will come from, and about social Bailey, Mr Adrian Eagle, Maria mobility, when they know that it went the wrong way Bain, Mr William Edwards, Jonathan under Labour. Balls, rh Ed Efford, Clive Banks, Gordon Elliott, Julie I pay tribute to my right hon. Friend the Member for Barron, rh Mr Kevin Ellman, Mrs Louise Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes) for Beckett, rh Margaret Engel, Natascha the work he has done on the subject, and for his report. Begg, Dame Anne Esterson, Bill He is interested not in numbers, but in quality. He says Bell, Sir Stuart Evans, Chris that there has been a proliferation of courses and Benn, rh Hilary Field, rh Mr Frank qualifications, and he is absolutely right. That is why we Benton, Mr Joe Fitzpatrick, Jim are ensuring a concentration on good-quality, core subjects Berger, Luciana Flello, Robert that people can understand—subjects in which employers Blackman-Woods, Roberta Flint, rh Caroline want the people whom they take on to have qualifications. Blears, rh Hazel Flynn, Paul Blenkinsop, Tom Fovargue, Yvonne My hon. Friend the Member for South West Norfolk Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben Francis, Dr Hywel (Elizabeth Truss), in another excellent and typically Brennan, Kevin Gardiner, Barry thoughtful speech, said that we need pupils to have a Brown, rh Mr Gordon Gilmore, Sheila core general education. We need real subjects for real Brown, Lyn Glass, Pat jobs. Teachers, who did not feature much in the Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Glindon, Mrs Mary contributions of Opposition Members, have a crucial Brown, Mr Russell Goggins, rh Paul role in inspiring young people in the classroom. In the Bryant, Chris Goodman, Helen same way, people from industry—engineers, business Buck, Ms Karen Greatrex, Tom men and women, scientists, doctors—who were mentioned Burden, Richard Green, Kate by several hon. Members, have a crucial role to play in Burnham, rh Andy Greenwood, Lilian coming into classrooms and giving their face-to-face Campbell, Mr Alan Griffith, Nia advice, and experience of what it is like to go into their Campbell, Mr Gregory Gwynne, Andrew Campbell, Mr Ronnie Hain, rh Mr Peter career. Caton, Martin Hamilton, Mr David The hon. Member for Liverpool, West Derby (Stephen Chapman, Mrs Jenny Hanson, rh Mr David Twigg) gave some very good examples of good practice Clark, Katy Harris, Mr Tom in his constituency. He talked about an industry day, Coaker, Vernon Havard, Mr Dai when real people come in and share their real-life experiences Coffey, Ann Healey, rh John to inspire others. We are talking about people who have Connarty, Michael Hepburn, Mr Stephen lived those experiences, trained for those experiences, Cooper, Rosie Heyes, David and are making a living from them. All that can happen Cooper, rh Yvette Hillier, Meg under the new system; it is up to the schools to decide, Corbyn, Jeremy Hilling, Julie because we trust the schools. We trust the teachers and Crausby, Mr David Hoey, Kate head teachers to make the right decisions on the ground, Creagh, Mary Hood, Mr Jim Creasy, Stella Irranca-Davies, Huw locally, for the children whom they teach, and to have Cryer, John James, Mrs Siân C. an interest in what those children go on to do. Cunningham, Alex Jamieson, Cathy My hon. Friend the Member for Reading West (Alok Cunningham, Mr Jim Johnson, rh Alan Sharma) talked about “Groundhog Day”; he got it Cunningham, Tony Johnson, Diana absolutely right. You would not believe it from the Curran, Margaret Jones, Graham opening speech, or from other contributions from Labour Dakin, Nic Jones, Helen Members, but there was never a golden age of careers Danczuk, Simon Jones, Mr Kevan advice. It was as if things had suddenly gone down the Darling, rh Mr Alistair Jones, Susan Elan plug-hole after the election. The hon. Member for Bolton David, Mr Wayne Joyce, Eric West (Julie Hilling) talked about the youth service, as Davies, Geraint Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald she often does; she has expertise in the subject. De Piero, Gloria Kendall, Liz Dobbin, Jim Khan, rh Sadiq Ms Rosie Winterton (Doncaster Central) (Lab) claimed Dobson, rh Frank Lavery, Ian to move the closure (Standing Order No. 36). Docherty, Thomas Lazarowicz, Mark 1005 Careers Service (Young People)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Careers Service (Young People) 1006

Leslie, Chris Robertson, John Bruce, Fiona Greening, Justine Lewis, Mr Ivan Robinson, Mr Geoffrey Bruce, rh Malcolm Grieve, rh Mr Dominic Lloyd, Tony Rotheram, Steve Buckland, Mr Robert Griffiths, Andrew Llwyd, rh Mr Elfyn Roy, Lindsay Burley, Mr Aidan Gummer, Ben Long, Naomi Ruane, Chris Burns, rh Mr Simon Gyimah, Mr Sam Love, Mr Andrew Ruddock, rh Joan Burrowes, Mr David Halfon, Robert Lucas, Caroline Sarwar, Anas Burt, Alistair Hammond, rh Mr Philip Mactaggart, Fiona Seabeck, Alison Burt, Lorely Hammond, Stephen Mahmood, Shabana Shannon, Jim Byles, Dan Hancock, Matthew Marsden, Mr Gordon Sharma, Mr Virendra Cairns, Alun Hands, Greg McCabe, Steve Sheerman, Mr Barry Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Harper, Mr Mark McCann, Mr Michael Sheridan, Jim Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair Harrington, Richard McCarthy, Kerry Shuker, Gavin Carmichael, Neil Harris, Rebecca McDonagh, Siobhain Simpson, David Carswell, Mr Douglas Hart, Simon McDonnell, Dr Alasdair Slaughter, Mr Andy Chishti, Rehman Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan McDonnell, John Smith, rh Mr Andrew Clark, rh Greg Heald, Oliver McFadden, rh Mr Pat Smith, Angela Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth Heath, Mr David McGovern, Alison Smith, Nick Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey Heaton-Harris, Chris McGovern, Jim Smith, Owen Coffey, Dr Thérèse Hemming, John McGuire, rh Mrs Anne Spellar, rh Mr John Collins, Damian Henderson, Gordon McKechin, Ann Straw, rh Mr Jack Colvile, Oliver Hendry, Charles McKenzie, Mr Iain Stringer, Graham Cox, Mr Geoffrey Hinds, Damian McKinnell, Catherine Stuart, Ms Gisela Crockart, Mike Hollingbery, George Crouch, Tracey Hollobone, Mr Philip Meacher, rh Mr Michael Sutcliffe, Mr Gerry Meale, Sir Alan Davey, Mr Edward Hopkins, Kris Tami, Mark Mearns, Ian Davies, David T. C. Howarth, Mr Gerald Thomas, Mr Gareth Michael, rh Alun (Monmouth) Howell, John Thornberry, Emily Miller, Andrew Davies, Glyn Hughes, rh Simon Timms, rh Stephen Mitchell, Austin Davies, Philip Huhne, rh Chris Moon, Mrs Madeleine Trickett, Jon Davis, rh Mr David Hunt, rh Mr Jeremy Morden, Jessica Turner, Karl de Bois, Nick Hunter, Mark Morrice, Graeme (Livingston) Twigg, Derek Dinenage, Caroline Jackson, Mr Stewart Morris, Grahame M. Twigg, Stephen Djanogly, Mr Jonathan James, Margot (Easington) Umunna, Mr Chuka Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Javid, Sajid Mudie, Mr George Vaz, Valerie Doyle-Price, Jackie Jenkin, Mr Bernard Munn, Meg Walley, Joan Drax, Richard Johnson, Gareth Murphy, rh Paul Whitehead, Dr Alan Duddridge, James Jones, Andrew Murray, Ian Wicks, rh Malcolm Duncan, rh Mr Alan Jones, Mr David Nandy, Lisa Williamson, Chris Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain Kelly, Chris O’Donnell, Fiona Wilson, Phil Dunne, Mr Philip Kirby, Simon Onwurah, Chi Wilson, Sammy Ellis, Michael Knight, rh Mr Greg Owen, Albert Winnick, Mr David Ellison, Jane Kwarteng, Kwasi Pearce, Teresa Winterton, rh Ms Rosie Ellwood, Mr Tobias Lancaster, Mark Perkins, Toby Woodcock, John Elphicke, Charlie Latham, Pauline Eustice, George Laws, rh Mr David Pound, Stephen Woodward, rh Mr Shaun Qureshi, Yasmin Evans, Graham Leadsom, Andrea Wright, David Raynsford, rh Mr Nick Evans, Jonathan Lee, Dr Phillip Wright, Mr Iain Reed, Mr Jamie Evennett, Mr David Leech, Mr John Reeves, Rachel Tellers for the Ayes: Fabricant, Michael Lefroy, Jeremy Reynolds, Jonathan Mark Hendrick and Fallon, Michael Leigh, Mr Edward Riordan, Mrs Linda Gregg McClymont Farron, Tim Leslie, Charlotte Featherstone, Lynne Letwin, rh Mr Oliver NOES Field, Mr Mark Lewis, Brandon Foster, rh Mr Don Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian Adams, Nigel Bingham, Andrew Francois, rh Mr Mark Lilley, rh Mr Peter Afriyie, Adam Binley, Mr Brian Freeman, George Lloyd, Stephen Aldous, Peter Birtwistle, Gordon Freer, Mike Lopresti, Jack Amess, Mr David Blackman, Bob Fullbrook, Lorraine Lord, Jonathan Andrew, Stuart Blackwood, Nicola Fuller, Richard Loughton, Tim Baker, Norman Blunt, Mr Crispin Gale, Mr Roger Luff, Peter Baker, Steve Boles, Nick Garnier, Mr Edward Lumley, Karen Baldry, Tony Bone, Mr Peter Garnier, Mark Macleod, Mary Baldwin, Harriett Bottomley, Sir Peter Gauke, Mr David Maude, rh Mr Francis Barclay, Stephen Bradley, Karen George, Andrew Maynard, Paul Barker, Gregory Brady, Mr Graham Gibb, Mr Nick McCartney, Jason Baron, Mr John Brake, rh Tom Gilbert, Stephen McCartney, Karl Barwell, Gavin Bray, Angie Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl McIntosh, Miss Anne Bebb, Guto Brazier, Mr Julian Glen, John McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick Beith, rh Sir Alan Bridgen, Andrew Goldsmith, Zac McPartland, Stephen Bellingham, Mr Henry Brine, Mr Steve Goodwill, Mr Robert McVey, Esther Benyon, Richard Brokenshire, James Grant, Mrs Helen Mensch, Louise Berry, Jake Brooke, Annette Green, Damian Menzies, Mark 1007 Careers Service (Young People) 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 1008

Metcalfe, Stephen Spencer, Mr Mark to children’s rights and urges that any European Union-level Miller, Maria Stevenson, John action in this area supports rather than supplants the role of Mills, Nigel Stewart, Bob Member States.—(Miss Chloe Smith.) Milton, Anne Stewart, Rory Question agreed to. Moore, rh Michael Stride, Mel Morgan, Nicky Stuart, Mr Graham Morris, Anne Marie Stunell, Andrew PETITIONS Morris, David Sturdy, Julian Morris, James Swales, Ian Swansea Coastguard Station Mosley, Stephen Swayne, rh Mr Desmond Mowat, David Swinson, Jo 10.16 pm Mulholland, Greg Swire, rh Mr Hugo Martin Caton (Gower) (Lab): I present a petition on Munt, Tessa Syms, Mr Robert Murray, Sheryll Tapsell, rh Sir Peter behalf of the “Save Swansea Coastguard” campaign, Murrison, Dr Andrew Teather, Sarah which in a few weeks has collected more than 100,000 Neill, Robert Timpson, Mr Edward signatures in opposition to the closure of the coastguard Newmark, Mr Brooks Tomlinson, Justin station at Mumbles, Swansea. Newton, Sarah Tredinnick, David The petition states: Nokes, Caroline Truss, Elizabeth The Petition of people concerned about maritime safety in the Norman, Jesse Turner, Mr Andrew Bristol Channel, Nuttall, Mr David Tyrie, Mr Andrew Declares that the recommendation of the UK Government Offord, Mr Matthew Uppal, Paul to close the Swansea Maritime Rescue Coordination Centre at Ollerenshaw, Eric Vaizey, Mr Edward Tutts Head, Mumbles, would endanger the lives and wellbeing of Opperman, Guy Vara, Mr Shailesh people on the water and around the coast of the Bristol Paice, rh Mr James Vickers, Martin Channel. Patel, Priti Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons Penrose, John Walker, Mr Charles press the UK Government to retain the Swansea Maritime Rescue Percy, Andrew Walker, Mr Robin Centre as a 24-hour staffed coastguard station. Phillips, Stephen Wallace, Mr Ben And the Petitioners remain, etc. Pincher, Christopher Walter, Mr Robert Poulter, Dr Daniel [P000957] Ward, Mr David Pugh, John Watkinson, Angela Raab, Mr Dominic 10.17 pm Weatherley, Mike Randall, rh Mr John Webb, Steve Lauderdale Avenue Tram Crossing (Blackpool) Reckless, Mark Redwood, rh Mr John Wharton, James Rees-Mogg, Jacob Wheeler, Heather Paul Maynard (Blackpool North and Cleveleys) (Con): Reevell, Simon White, Chris I should like to present a petition from the people of Reid, Mr Alan Whittaker, Craig Blackpool and Cleveleys. Robathan, rh Mr Andrew Whittingdale, Mr John The petition declares: Robertson, Hugh Wiggin, Bill The Petition of the people of Blackpool and Cleveleys, Robertson, Mr Laurence Willetts, rh Mr David Declares that the Petitioners are opposed to the permanent Rogerson, Dan Williams, Mr Mark closure of the Lauderdale Avenue/Blandford Avenue crossing to Rudd, Amber Williams, Roger traffic and pedestrians. Ruffley, Mr David Williams, Stephen The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons Russell, Bob Williamson, Gavin urges the Government to encourage Blackpool Council to ensure Rutley, David Willott, Jenny that the Lauderdale Avenue/Blandford Avenue crossing remains Sanders, Mr Adrian Wilson, Mr Rob open. Sandys, Laura Wollaston, Dr Sarah And the Petitioners remain, etc. Selous, Andrew Wright, Simon [P000959] Sharma, Alok Yeo, Mr Tim Shelbrooke, Alec Young, rh Sir George Skidmore, Chris 10.18 pm Zahawi, Nadhim Smith, Miss Chloe Port of Falmouth Masterplan Smith, Henry Tellers for the Noes: Smith, Sir Robert Stephen Crabb and Soames, rh Nicholas Norman Lamb Sarah Newton (Truro and Falmouth) (Con): This petition states: Question accordingly negatived. The Petition of the residents of Falmouth, Declares that the Petitioners believe that the dredging of Falmouth Harbour should be permitted to go ahead so as to Business without Debate enable the implementation of the Port of Falmouth Masterplan which is essential to the future prosperity of Falmouth. The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons EUROPEAN UNION DOCUMENTS urges the Government to ensure that the Marine Management Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Organisation strikes the appropriate balance between environmental Order No. 119(11)), protection and social and economic development, with particular regard to the Port of Falmouth Masterplan including the dredging of Falmouth Harbour. RIGHTS OF THE CHILD And the Petitioners remain, etc. That this House takes note of European Union Document No. 7226/11, a Commission Communication on an EU Agenda [P000958] for the Rights of the Child; welcomes the Government’s commitment 1009 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Microgravity Research 1010

Microgravity Research We can create such low gravity here on earth in drop towers—something like those found at Alton Towers—or Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House through parabolic flights. However, the best place for it do now adjourn.—(Miss Chloe Smith.) to happen is in space. It can be done by a sounding rocket; at the moment, it is done at the international 10.19 pm space station. Why conduct the research? Put simply, gravity adds complexity to certain experiments by Dr Phillip Lee (Bracknell) (Con): This is a rather contributing to convection currents, shear stresses and esoteric subject on the face of it, so I should like to buoyancy, and that can impact on processes that we explain why I have chosen it. I am vice-chairman of the would like to study. In order to try to remove those parliamentary space committee, and as a consequence potentially confounding variables from the experiment, of that role I have come into contact with many people one needs to go into a microgravity environment, and in the space industry who have spoken to me about the best place for that is in space. microgravity, the research thereof and its potential value to the British economy.I do not have any direct constituency Let me turn to the sectors that may be impacted on, link, although I have a local company that provides both economically and in terms of human knowledge equipment for satellites. In the past decade, the UK and pushing back these boundaries. First, I will mention space industry has been growing, year on year, in excess bio-medicine; as a doctor, I would be expected to do so. of 10%. I genuinely think that it should be part of the The bio-medical applications are numerous. Essentially, Government’s growth strategy and that it would contribute it is thought that putting cells—any cells—into a to the diversification of this country’s economic base. I microgravity environment affects the way in which they have had the particular pleasure of meeting Tim Peake, work. Understanding how cells work and how they who is the only British astronaut on the European communicate with one another will have broad applications Space Agency manned programme, and who also happens in the study of cancer, coronary heart disease, AIDS to be a champion of microgravity. That is quite important, and diabetes. We can all understand that that might because it indicates how good we are in Britain at lead to the development of new therapies and drugs research in this area. that would benefit mankind. In economic terms, if Why have microgravity research? First, as I said, the British patents were attached to such developments, UK is very strong in that area. Microgravity crosses a UK plc would benefit. large number of fields, and that may contribute to why One can also grow pure protein crystals in microgravity, it has not always received support from the research and by doing so aid the understanding of the immune councils. Secondly, it has huge potential economic benefits, system, which would again benefit health care. One of particularly in bio-medicine. Thirdly, I do not think I the most noted areas is musculoskeletal systems and the am alone in this House in thinking that we should have response of bone and muscle. I am sure that most hon. a manned space flight programme. We need to do that Members know that spacemen who have spent lots of with partners—perhaps with Europe, Russia or the time in space have been found to have reduced bone United States—but I genuinely believe that we are better density and muscle wastage. Why that happens is not off seeking out new knowledge, endeavour and aspiration. fully understood. By trying to understanding that and All those things are positives, and Britain was at its best how tissue remodels, we may very well find new techniques when it was displaying those facets. to treat musculoskeletal disorders. Let me explain the structure of my speech. First, I Another sector where microgravity can be used is will explain microgravity. I am sure that all colleagues fluid physics. The understanding of the forces that here understand it fully and do not need a definition, affect fluids has wide applications. If we can understand but I will provide it for the benefit of the many people them better, it might contribute to the miniaturisation who have tuned into BBC Parliament for this debate. I of electronic devices. The BlackBerrys and laptops that will then touch on the sectors that microgravity research we use have all benefitted from greater knowledge in can impact on; talk about the history of the involvement this area. Using these developments will undeniably in microgravity research, or the lack thereof, of lead to a reduction in costs for the customer when Governments, this one and previous; and put some they buy such electronic devices at John Lewis and questions to the Minister. elsewhere. As life evolved on this earth, lots of physical and chemical change took place in the environment that caused adaptations to take place in life, be it plant or Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I am not an expert animal. The only thing that has been constant in 4.8 billion in microgravity research—far from it—but I had a wee years is gravity. It is therefore thought that organisms look at it before the debate. I understand that some now have little or no genetic memory of how they microgravity research has looked at earthquakes and would respond to low gravity, and that the low-gravity the pre-warning of earthquakes. Perhaps the hon. environment could uncover some novel mechanisms Gentleman would comment on that, because obviously and responses to adaptations that may benefit the economy if people can be warned of earthquakes and tremors, it through commercial applications. That is basically why might save life. researchers are so eager to get into space, so to speak, to test the impact of microgravity. Dr Lee: I have absolutely no idea about the prediction This definition is just one of many I have read: of earthquakes and I am struggling to think why an “Microgravity research = the research into the impact of low understanding of microgravity would help to determine or zero gravity on human health and on other materials, and the when there might be an earthquake. The hon. Gentleman exploitation of the low gravity environment to conduct research has given me something to look up when I leave the into pure science and human applications.” Chamber. 1011 Microgravity Research13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Microgravity Research 1012

The final area is material science. Understanding met people, and it is interesting that there is not one, how materials or composite materials behave in a single voice for microgravity. Microgravity perhaps needs microgravity environment might help to develop new that one voice, but does the Minister have any views on alloys and ceramics. That has broad applications. We that? are at the cutting edge in Formula 1 and the use of Finally, more generally, as a new boy in town, I get composite materials and alloys. That knowledge originally the distinct impression that Whitehall is risk averse. If came from the space sector. By doing this research we there is one thing that we cannot be when it comes to will enhance our standing in that area. space, it is that. We have to go for it. I am encouraged This list is not exhaustive. A variety of different that the Government have in the last year announced sectors are involved. In the area of plant biology, I have changes to legislation with regard to aiding the space seen the suggestion that plant stem cells could be grown industry—it relates to space insurance—but ultimately, on an industrial scale in space, thereby assisting us in Whitehall remains risk averse. I would be interested to our need to develop biomass for energy. I could go on. know the Minister’s view on that. Moving on to the history of Government involvement The best way to conclude is by quoting an e-mail that in microgravity, the Pippard report of 1989 was the first somebody sent. He ended one paragraphs as follows: mention that I could find. It made some interesting “In addition to providing benefits to society” observations that have since proven to be true. The Wakeham review of 2003 found a lack of interest microgravity among the research councils, which goes back to the “research will also help the UK to maintain some degree of point I made at the start of my remarks that microgravity scientific relevance - scientific capability in a nation is a recognised does not have a single voice. That is why it has not necessity for economic development.” received funding in the past. As a result of the Wakeham I could not have put it better myself, and that is why I review, Britain did not contribute to the European called for this debate. Programme for Life and Physical Sciences—ELIPS—with the European Space Agency, which was started in 2001 and is ongoing. The ELIPS 4 funding round is due at 10.32 pm the next ministerial ESA meeting in 2012. I would push for us to participate in that, not least because doing so David Morris (Morecambe and Lunesdale) (Con): I would allow us to work with NASA, which will not congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Bracknell work with us outside ESA as I understand it. (Dr Lee) on securing this important debate, which is particularly timely given that we are gearing up for the Finally, I have some questions for the Minister. First, ESA conference in 2012, in which the funding priorities will he confirm that the Government are not against for the industry will be set for the future. As a result, the manned space flight? For some time in this country, it UK’s involvement in the ESA will also be forged. was Government policy to be against manned space flight. I think that manned space flight is inspirational. May I thank Tom Gunner and Sarah Chilman from Anybody who goes into a school on a science, technology, the parliamentary space committee for the work that engineering and mathematics day will find children they do all year round in promoting space? Unlike building rockets and looking at pictures of planets. The many other industries, space does not have lots of reality is that space inspires children and that we will lobbyists with huge budgets, but the small team at the need more scientists and engineers in the future. I spoke PSC is none the less effective. I must also thank Astrium about the inspirational quality of space in my maiden for allowing Tom and Sarah to undertake their important speech—I do not know how many hon. Members who work. are present were here for that. I strongly believe that The space industry has grown 10% year on year. It is there has to be a man on top of the rocket for it to be one of this country’s major success stories, but it has inspiring. not been sung out loudly. For most people, the space Secondly, will the Minister outline the Government’s industry seems distant—both literally and figuratively—but position on the ELIPS programme and the ESA manned we need the public to understand just how big an space flight programme in anticipation of the 2012 impact that high-tech industry has on our lives. ministerial meeting? I ask that because for about Like my hon. Friend, I am a vice-chair of the PSC, £200 million a year we could participate in that programme. and many of my constituents ask why an MP from a Over a 20 to 25-year period, we could perhaps participate northern Lancashire constituency would take an interest in the exploration of the moon and, further, of Mars. in space. I point out to them that there are important That may seem an extravagance to some, but it is not. benefits from the space industry, including high-tech For every $1 spent on the Apollo space programme, it jobs in places such as Bracknell and the M4 corridor. was estimated that the US economy got $14 in return. Perhaps more importantly, however, space technologies We can make money out of space—it is as simple as impact on areas such as Morecambe and Lunesdale and that. Britain is outstanding at space, and we do it on a people’s day-to-day lives. shoestring in comparison to some of our competitors. I Owing to the space industry, people can get around think that in future, we should be a greater player in easily by sat-nav and explore areas of the country that space. I know that the Minister shares my feelings on they would not ordinarily be able to go to and find their that. I forget the figures, but we are projected to increase way around; we can roll out fast satellite broadband to our space industry over the next 10 years, and I am rural areas; and we can watch satellite television, which wholly supportive of that. has brought a wider entertainment choice to everyone. What is the Minister’s opinion on a microgravity Those industries are direct spin-offs of the space industry. forum? I have had e-mails from around the world since I Even though the space industry does not have major tweeted that I would introduce this debate, and I have funding, it is a success story year in, year out. 1013 Microgravity Research13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Microgravity Research 1014

[David Morris] crucial to scientific and technological advance. We undoubtedly conduct high-grade scientific research through Space delivers a host of everyday benefits—some the space programme, and the technological challenges might even say that they are mundane—but we are not posed by the programme drive technology forward. always very good at pointing out those successes. We As we have heard, with 10% growth a year, the space can all agree that although we have led the way on space sector is a rapidly growing part of the British economy. in general, we have lagged behind badly in microgravity There are not many parts of the British economy growing research. as fast as China, but the space sector is. I absolutely I add my name to the list of those who believe that we agree with the final point from my hon. Friend the should be involved in ELIPS and, by extension, the Member for Morecambe and Lunesdale that the excitement international space station. It cannot be right that Germany of space can get younger people involved in science. As funds 50% of it. The widely accepted tradition of the someone who wants more and more young people UK being negative about putting scientists into space excited by space, I believe that, by and large, it is space should end, not least because space tourism and exploration and dinosaurs that interest young people in science. In are going to become boom industries in the future, in America, they still talk of the generation of scientists the same way as transatlantic shipping and air travel and technicians that came through as a result of the Apollo became hugely popular in a short space of time. We do effect getting them interested and involved. The space not want to be on the list of countries left behind by this sector has a lot to contribute, and within the inevitable exciting new development in human history. constraints on public spending, we do our best to I have asked the Secretary of State about our back it. preparedness for the next European Space Agency I was asked some specific questions that I will try ministerial council, and I am glad that things are progressing briefly to answer. The first was about manned space well, but we need the Government to set, as a central flight. I should make it clear that the UK has historically aim for that conference, greater UK involvement in focused its space investments on areas such as microgravity research. It is important that we ride on telecommunications, earth science and robotic exploration the back of this industry. Future generations are looking of the universe; and, as we are not directly involved with to science as a cool subject to be involved in. A report the international space station, we have not developed by the Science and Technology Committee, of which I human space flight technology, although we have the am a member, has shown that young people are engaging relevant technology for the future exploration of the particularly well in anything to do with space exploration. moon and Mars, including advanced robotics—of which Amazingly, when I was a small boy, I made an Apollo the ExoMars rover programme is a classic example— rocket, like many Members here, from an Airfix kit. I communications systems and small satellites. So that is am sure that we can all remember sitting at the kitchen the view that we have taken, historically. table gluing our hands to our faces and everywhere but I was asked whether we had any objection in principle the model itself. Funnily enough, my little boy, Robert, to a manned space flight, and the answer is no, although found my Saturn 5 rocket that I made—I had forgotten there will always be pertinent questions about cost that I still had it. I grudgingly put it back together. It effectiveness. The Government are delighted that Major brought back happy memories, but I looked at my Tim Peake has been selected on merit to join the ESA eight-year-old son, and he turned around and asked, astronaut corps. That will be a great opportunity for “Dad, why are we not going to the moon again?” I think him to inspire young people in the UK; indeed, I know that that was very poignant. that he is already doing so. So that is our attitude to manned space flight. 10.36 pm I was also asked specifically about microgravity. It The Minister for Universities and Science (Mr David would be correct to disentangle microgravity research Willetts): This has been a rather special Adjournment from the manned space flight issue. It is possible to debate in which the passion of colleagues for space research microgravity without getting involved in manned travel and the space sector has been exposed to wider space flight, and we do understand the value of microgravity debate. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for research. There are difficult obstacles to overcome, however. Bracknell (Dr Lee) on securing the debate and leading it First, the range of topics is so wide that there is no so well. I also thank my hon. Friend the Member for coherent voice to articulate the needs of the researchers, Morecambe and Lunesdale (David Morris) for his speech, as my hon. Friend the Member for Bracknell said. I because he also spoke with the authority that comes understand that point. Secondly, materials researchers from being a member of the parliamentary space committee. do not normally work with biomedics or astrobiologists, It is also great to see in his place my hon. Friend the but they would all find microgravity important in pursuing Member for Windsor (Adam Afriyie), who does an their research. The researchers who would benefit from excellent job as the chair of that committee. We have microgravity research therefore comprise a rather people here who rightly care about space. fragmented and diverse group, but my hon. Friend I would like to make it clear that the Government eloquently argued that it would be helpful if they could realise the significance of the space sector, which is why come together to provide a more coherent voice. we have tried to support the space industry even during Historically, the UK has had little involvement in the tough fiscal decisions that we have had to take. microgravity research, so the researchers are largely Through my role as co-chair of the space leadership unaware of the possibilities involved. Let me make it council, I have a good and constructive dialogue with clear that I would welcome new collaborations, including the industry, and we were able to get a section of the the ones that are now developing, and new ways of growth review devoted specifically to the space industry. serving the interests of UK researchers and those of The space sector matters in lots of different ways. It is our international partners. 1015 Microgravity Research13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Microgravity Research 1016

Stephen Barclay (North East Cambridgeshire) (Con): a diverse and different range of disciplines that could I was interested to hear about the Government’s support benefit from it. I can see the argument for them coming for a forum. Would my right hon. Friend support together in a more coherent way and I would be happy ministerial attendance at such a forum, if one were to be to look at that. Of course, many of the decisions would established? ultimately be for the research councils. Let me briefly say in the few minutes remaining that a Mr Willetts: As I hope those in the space sector lot of this stuff will come up as we plan for the European know, I personally am committed to working closely Space Agency ministerial council in 2012. No doubt we with the sector. The idea of a microgravity forum is very will be invited by the ESA to join its microgravity worth while, and it would be great if people who could research programme, ELIPS. I am told that the UK benefit from microgravity research came together. If it Space Agency has already held a workshop with researchers would make sense to do so, I would be willing to meet and providers of facilities to explore their mutual interests, such a group, but I must stress that I am working within and it will be holding a further workshop in November a fixed science budget. We have the protection of the to examine the opportunities presented through the ring fence around the £4.6 billion, and we are all very ESA’s programmes. As we prepare for the next ESA proud of that illustration of our commitment to science, ministerial, we are of course considering this alongside but I have to work within that budget. So, provided that many other options. ministerial attendance did not give rise to the assumption Let me conclude by saying that we recognise the that the Minister would come to the meeting armed significance not just of microgravity, but of the presence with a cheque book, I would be happy to attend. We of people like Major Tim Peake who are aiming to could then purse the matter from there. become astronauts. I am delighted that Tim Peake has said that he will act as an ambassador for microgravity Adam Afriyie (Windsor) (Con): The research council research in the UK. Because of our ambition that he model for funding research has worked incredibly well should be able to engage in space flight, it is great that over the decades since it was established in the 1980s by he is willing to take on that role. I am confident that, as Lady Thatcher when she was Prime Minister. I wonder part of that role and of the UK Space Agency’s work, whether the Minister might write a letter urging the we will consider the proposed strategy for space biomedicine research councils to consider such a forum or meeting that the UK space biomedical consortium is developing to facilitate an interest in it. with Tim’s help. It will continue to facilitate negotiations between UK research groups and prospective international Mr Willetts: It would be best if there were ways in partners. which the research community could come together, but I should like to assure the several Members in their I am always wary of anything that could be taken as a places today who all share this interest in space breach of the Haldane principle, which hovers over all research—my hon. Friend the Member for Bracknell these debates. We have to be very clear in regard to has done an excellent job in bringing this crucial subject giving instructions or directions on areas of research to our attention—that I will undertake, given my ministerial activity. One of the reasons that we have an excellent responsibilities, to follow the debate on microgravity science research base in this country is that, by and research very closely as we prepare for the ESA ministerial large, Ministers have kept their grubby hands off these next year. issues. Question put and agreed to. As I said, I have tried to indicate that I recognise that microgravity research could play an important role. It 10.47 pm has suffered from the structural problem of having such House adjourned.

189WH 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 190WH

Greg Mulholland: Thank you, Mr Hancock. I am Westminster Hall asking my question now. Can the Minister, in his discussions with the Treasury, ensure that sustainable development cannot include the deliberate closure of pubs and other Tuesday 13 September 2011 community assets, which are enormously important to the whole of Yorkshire? People are cashing in those assets for the one fast buck of development, but that is [MR MIKE HANCOCK in the Chair] not sustainable development. Mr Mike Hancock (in the Chair): That is not a Tourism in Yorkshire precedent for anyone else. Mr Mulholland, I think you Motion made, and Question proposed, That the sitting owe the House apologies for that; it was an intervention, be now adjourned.—(Mr Goodwill.) not a Member’s speech or a speech in lieu because you had to leave. May we bear that in mind for future reference? 9.30 am Nigel Adams (Selby and Ainsty) (Con): I thank the Nigel Adams: I appreciated that intervention, despite Minister for attending this debate, which is important its length. I echo what my hon. Friend the Member for for the Yorkshire region. I also thank my Yorkshire Leeds North West (Greg Mulholland) said about pubs—I colleagues for getting up early this morning for a debate am a fellow member of the all-party save the pub group. on an industry that means so much to our great county. The point that he made is incredibly important. The tourism industry is a rare wealth generator for Not only is this country well worth a visit, but the this country and one of our most important industries. tourism industry is vital to our economy, and the The variety and history of our landmarks, monuments, 200,000 businesses directly involved are key contributors countryside and culture are powerful magnets for visitors to Britain’s economic recovery. They provide £52 billion from all over the world. Important events such as next of our gross domestic product and 4.4% of our jobs, year’s Olympics will continue to contribute greatly to and they have contributed to making tourism one of the putting Britain firmly at centre stage, globally. fastest growing sectors, providing employment in our A little more than a year ago, the Prime Minister gave most rural communities and enjoyment to millions. a speech on the importance of tourism in the UK and The industry accounts for almost £90 billion in direct launched the first ever tourism policy in this country. spending each year and, equally importantly, it rises That landmark policy set out targets for attracting above north-south or regional divides and creates wealth 4 million extra visitors to Britain over the next four and employment in all parts of the country. It remains a years and is backed by £100 million-worth of marketing fantastic, cost-effective way to rebalance the fortunes of campaigns. Along with that increase in visitor numbers, the country away from past reliance on financial services, the policy aims to increase the proportion of UK residents construction and the south-east. who holiday in the UK to match that of those who I turn to tourism in Yorkshire. As I am sure we are all choose to holiday abroad each year. aware, Yorkshire is England’s largest county, with a This country has some of the most spectacular and population of 5.5 million—equal to that of Scotland wide-ranging scenery and holiday destinations, most and twice that of Wales. Tourism is the county’s third particularly—I am sure those present will all agree—in largest industry and continues to support a quarter of a Yorkshire, God’s own county. It is important that we million jobs and more than 25,000 businesses, many of encourage the British people to make the most of what which are in rural and coastal areas that depend solely they have on their doorstep. on visitors for their livelihoods. I am pleased to see Members representing coastal areas in the Chamber Greg Mulholland (Leeds North West) (LD): I thank today. my hon. Friend and Yorkshire colleague. He will be All my Yorkshire colleagues present today are well pleased to know that I was happy once again to take my acquainted with the county’s official destination family to Yorkshire on our summer holiday. I apologise management organisation, which is called Welcome to to him and to you, Mr Hancock, because I have to leave Yorkshire. I am delighted to see the senior management for an equally important event for Yorkshire; it is the team of Welcome to Yorkshire, who are—by sheer launch of the Leeds city region bid for the green investment coincidence—in the Chamber today. The organisation bank—something that colleagues will also support. is widely heralded as a national success story that has My hon. Friend is right about the offering that Yorkshire transformed the UK tourism landscape. I confess to has, with two national parks, some of the finest coast in being, in a previous life, a director of its predecessor, the the country and a host of attractions. I pay tribute to Yorkshire Tourist Board. What now exists is a completely the wonderful and important work that Welcome to different beast; Welcome to Yorkshire is doing a fantastic Yorkshire does in promotion. I ask the tourism Minister job. not only to be a champion for tourism in this country, which I am sure he will be, but to ensure that he speaks Neil Carmichael (Stroud) (Con): Yesterday, I launched to his colleagues in the Treasury— the Stroud special train, which is designed to pick people up from Paddington and take them to Stroud Mr Mike Hancock (in the Chair): Order. You are and, obviously, Gloucestershire. The train will run every pushing your luck; this is an intervention, not a speech. day, with cheap tickets and advice on what people can You have apologised for having to leave, so ask your and should do once they reach their destination. It question and then we will move on. seems to have caught the imagination of people in 191WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 192WH

[Neil Carmichael] goes back to the Treasury in tax receipts. There is not much not to like about that; it is a great return on Stroud and the rest of Gloucestershire. Does my hon. investment. Friend think that that kind of thing should be done for The tourism policy’s aim is to attract greater numbers Yorkshire? Can he not imagine trains going from King’s of visitors over the next four years, and Welcome to Cross to Yorkshire, with the same sort of promotion, Yorkshire has become an innovative international tickets and, effectively, navigation of people to the right ambassador, tirelessly promoting Britain and, of course, place? Yorkshire, as leading tourism destinations. It has even been suggested that, within the tourism policy, Yorkshire Nigel Adams: That is an excellent example. Yorkshire has become an attack brand, capable of rivalling London is fortunate to have a good railway service to and from as a super-destination for international visitors—although London, but I am sure that the railways Minister might we do not want to stir up too much rivalry. be interested in a similar proposal that involves taking advantage of the high-speed rail network in a few years’ According to independent research from Visit England, time—such a train could be up in Yorkshire within we are succeeding in the role of encouraging more several minutes, I imagine. The Stroud train is a great people to visit Yorkshire, to stay longer, and to spend initiative and, although we are well served in Yorkshire, more. In the first quarter of 2011, visits to Yorkshire it is certainly something we could take on board. were up 14% on the same period last year, compared with just a 5% increase throughout the UK as a whole. Since Welcome to Yorkshire was launched in 2009, During the same period, length of stay increased by the value of Yorkshire’s tourism has increased from 15% in Yorkshire, compared with a 2% decrease nationally. £5.9 billion to £7 billion, adding more than £1 billion to Yorkshire also experienced a 25% growth in visitor the economy.Its role is to change perceptions of Yorkshire, spend, compared with just 5% for the UK, with overseas by projecting a new, dynamic and vibrant county sitting spending at 70%, compared with a 7% expenditure alongside its tradition, history and natural beauty. The increase in the UK overall. In the two years since Welcome to Yorkshire gates at King’s Cross station fill Welcome to Yorkshire was launched, 4,000 new jobs me with great pride every Monday morning when I have been created in the tourism industry in Yorkshire. arrive in London, reminding everyone that they would I have listed many figures, but they are impressive and surely rather be spending their time in Yorkshire than worth mentioning. London. It goes without saying that Yorkshire is awash with The organisation has won numerous awards, including tourism assets, which are the envy of the nation. I do the world’s leading marketing campaign and Europe’s not mean to upset any of my Yorkshire colleagues, but I leading marketing campaign, and has been shortlisted am sure that they will allow me to mention a handful for status as the world’s leading tourist board 2011; I and that they will put me right if I miss a few. We are believe that it is England’s only representative, and it is lucky enough to host, in the constituency of my hon. up against the likes of Malaysia, the Maldives and New Friend the Member for Scarborough and Whitby York. We wish it well with that award. However, the (Mr Goodwill), the world’s oldest and greatest cricket progress and success of Yorkshire’s tourist industry is festival, at Scarborough. We have two world heritage now at risk. sites, Studley Royal and Fountains abbey, and Sir Titus When Welcome to Yorkshire was launched, it had Salt’s vision at Saltaire. funding of £10 million a year for three years, but that We have some fantastic churches, abbeys, minsters funding stream ends on 1 April 2012. When it ceases, in and cathedrals—none finer than Selby abbey in my own just over seven months, its resources will be vastly constituency. The weekend before last, I visited a fantastic reduced, leaving it to be funded through a cocktail of small church in the village of Birkin in my constituency, revenue streams, including strong private sector support a Norman church which has lasted for all those centuries from several thousand businesses that partner the and is an absolute gem, and a great potential tourist organisation, local authorities and the newly created destination. Hopefully, it will not be blighted by the local enterprise partnerships. proposed wind farm adjacent to it. Those new methods of funding are concurrent with Other great examples of what we have in Yorkshire the tourism policy’s stated aims for tourism bodies to be are UNESCO’s first and only world city of film, Bradford, less reliant on public funds, and more locally responsive. and six national museums. Yorkshire is arguably the I support that. It seems all very well, self-sufficient and food larder of Europe, and we have 190 independent in order, until one discovers that Visit Scotland received breweries, which many of us are doing our best to £66 million in funding in 2009-10, the majority of ensure that we visit in the course of this Parliament. We which came from Westminster. As I pointed out, the have the seventh most visited attraction in the UK in populations of Yorkshire and Scotland are the same, Flamingo Land. We have more blue plaque awards for with similar sized tourism industries, employing quality beaches than any other county, and the world’s 240,000 people in Scotland and 254,000 in Yorkshire, No. 1 heritage railway—North Yorkshire Moors railway— yet Scotland received six times more funding than which was featured in ITV’s “Heartbeat” and in Harry Yorkshire in that financial year. Potter movies. I could go on. When centralised funding ceases on 1 April 2012, Our destination management organisation has Visit Scotland will continue to receive funding from revolutionised the approach of the UK’s tourism industry Westminster, but England’s largest county will receive as a whole by raising standards and redefining the role nothing. If we are successfully to rebalance the UK of traditional tourist agencies. Its return on investment economy, as we all know we must, it is clear that some is impressive, with £40 delivered to the local economy central funding, not necessarily at the same level as in for every £1 invested in the organisation, £18 of which Scotland, is needed in England for super-destinations 193WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 194WH such as Yorkshire, which the Government have already of birth, I was born in Salford, but I have lived and identified. I urge the Minister to consider that in great worked in Yorkshire all my life, and was educated there, detail. so I hope that that will not be held against me. I fully understand the importance of the tourism industry to Mr Gerry Sutcliffe (Bradford South) (Lab): I congratulate Yorkshire, and during my intervention on my hon. my hon. Friend on securing this debate. He is rightly Friend I referred to the importance of tourism to economies making the point that tourism is important to local such as Bradford. economies, particularly in cities such as Bradford, as is Welcome to Yorkshire and its predecessors have brought the investment that comes to Bradford from tourism, people together. In the past, tourism involved competing whether in Haworth or the variety of other assets that city against city, area against area. The good news is we have, and which I will talk about later. Should not that Welcome to Yorkshire has brought the whole of the Government recognise that if that funding ceases, Yorkshire together, and collectively its assets and other and Welcome to Yorkshire does not succeed, local fantastic attractions, such as culture, sport and recreation, economies such as Bradford will be affected? have been packaged together. It fills me with pride whenever I watch adverts about Yorkshire, wherever I Nigel Adams: My hon. Friend makes a good point. am in the UK or indeed the world. Welcome to Yorkshire The days of going cap in hand to the Government, and has united the county to ensure that we maximise what of organisations such as Welcome to Yorkshire being we can from the tourism industry. funded totally from the public purse, are gone, and The hon. Member for Selby and Ainsty discussed rightly so, but we must be mindful of the impact of Yorkshire’s various assets, and I could go on at length complete cessation of funding. That is the point that I about the wonders of Bradford. He mentioned Sir Titus want to raise with the Minister, and I have another Salt’s village, Saltaire. It has a festival this week, and suggestion for a way of squaring the circle. The people will be coming from all over the UK to enjoy its Government’s tourism policy has identified Yorkshire benefits and delights, not least the Saltaire brewery. as one of a few elite areas capable of being an internationally Talking about breweries was a noble attempt by the attractive super-destination, with pulling power alongside hon. Gentleman to encourage us to go to as many as the likes of the Cotswolds, Cornwall, the Peak district possible during the lifetime of this Parliament. I will try and the Lake district. The risk is that, without continuing to help him, not least by visiting the Timothy Taylor funding, Yorkshire may no longer be able to keep up. brewery in Keighley, which is world famous for its bitter One idea being bounced around and discussed is that and other delights. It is a brewery, and it employs the Government should match-fund the private sector people. membership of England’s attack brands over a minimum Yorkshire has breweries but also culture, and it is subscription level of £1 million; Welcome to Yorkshire amazing what Yorkshire has produced in terms of film, is capable of extracting money from the private sector— culture and arts. Last week saw the launch of the film from industry in Yorkshire. That would be extremely “Jane Eyre”, and I understand that a remake of “Wuthering cost-effective in helping to fulfil the Government’s goal Heights” is due to be released shortly. That shows the of rebalancing the economy geographically, investing in impact of Yorkshire. Behind those films are the great the success of areas that they have identified as being delights and wonders of the Bronte family at Haworth, examples of excellence in UK tourism and helping to but jobs are connected to those great assets. increase a major local and national industry, safeguarding jobs and generating additional wealth. We have mentioned breweries and culture. As a former Sports Minister, I wish to talk about sport in Yorkshire. I welcome the Secretary of State’s recent announcement It is fantastic that we have got the Olympics, and it is that £3 million will be made available for tourism in great to see the Minister, and the shadow Minister my connection with the Olympic games, and I am keen to hon. Friend the Member for Ashfield (Gloria De Piero), hear from the Minister how much money Yorkshire is in the Chamber today. We will have the delights of the likely to receive from that £3 million. Continued support Olympics next year; there are training camps in Yorkshire, of our leading tourism agencies will also help the which is fantastic and will boost the economy. Young Government to achieve their three stated aims of attracting people will draw benefits from having international more visitors to Britain, increasing the number of Britons athletes in our community. who holiday at home, and improving the sector’s competitiveness and efficiency. Sport is important in many other regards. Yorkshire has nine great race courses, which is more than any I realise that I am biased towards Yorkshire, as are other county. The race course at York is the jewel in the many of my colleagues. I am Yorkshire born and bred, crown with the one at Doncaster not far behind, but and I urge the Minister to look at the facts and figures people also enjoy the smaller courses such as those at that I have mentioned, all of which prove that Yorkshire Wetherby and Ripon. Those assets are important, and is a worthy investment—not only for our visitors’ time, Welcome to Yorkshire has increased its spend in Yorkshire but for the national economy. and brought people together. 9.48 am The hon. Gentleman is right to say that the days of handouts are gone, but the Government must recognise Mr Gerry Sutcliffe (Bradford South) (Lab): I am how important it is that organisations such as Welcome grateful to my hon. Friend the Member for Selby and to Yorkshire continue to operate. We must encourage Ainsty (Nigel Adams) for raising this important debate. more people from the private sector and more individuals I am delighted that members of Welcome to Yorkshire to become members of Welcome to Yorkshire and to are in the Chamber and that parliamentary colleagues join the crusade of extolling the virtues of Yorkshire. from all parties are united in saying how wonderful The Government have a role to play not only at national Yorkshire is. I say that as a Lancastrian. By an accident level, but at local level, and we must keep the momentum 195WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 196WH

[Mr Gerry Sutcliffe] industry. From family holidays to short breaks, no destination can better match the heady mixture of landscape going. Those who support Welcome to Yorkshire do a and heritage offered by Yorkshire. Underpinning much fantastic job, and we must ensure that people are behind of that is the stunning natural landscape. Yorkshire them. men often refer to our county as “God’s county”. I have I hope that the Government will listen to the hon. occasionally had a bit of a joke or banter about that Gentleman’s comments about the possibility of matching with tourism Ministers in the past, but we continue to funding and about whether there are other ways we can refer to Yorkshire as God’s county because it is. be creative. As I have said, in cities such as Bradford the Last week, Mintel’s annual British lifestyles survey tourism industry is perhaps akin to the engineering and rated Yorkshire as the happiest place to live in the UK. textile industries in the past—tourism is a key player in Yorkshire men and women are more satisfied with their the city’s regeneration. Bradford has a diverse population, lives than people in any other part of the country, and and we have the opportunity to enjoy wonderful one reason for that is the abundance of open spaces. international cuisine. We are proud of the curry run in The range of accommodation and hospitality available Bradford, and people can come for the weekend and in our county has breadth and quality. Visitors can be enjoy the flavours of Asia. catered for in different styles and to different budgets, Bradford has been called “The World in a City” and the product is very good. It is not possible to drive because of the make-up and diversity of its population. an industry if the product is poor. That developed over centuries and is based on the wool The tourism sector has had a strong product for some capital of the north that Bradford once was. I know that years, so what is driving growth and causing visitor the Minister, and the shadow Minister, will recognise numbers to accelerate? I think that it is the combined the importance of the tourism industry, not only in effort by the industry and the way in which the county terms of the beautiful and wonderful things that we see has set about selling itself. We saw a change some years in Yorkshire, but because of the impact that has on our ago with the move from marketing campaigns based on economy. I would be worried if organisations such as destinations, where towns and cities marketed themselves, Welcome to Yorkshire were not supported by the to more co-ordinated campaigns based on the types of Government and others, and this morning’s debate holiday and break available. That is a more customer-driven provides a wonderful opportunity for us to state our approach that shows fantastic insight and has been a thanks to Welcome for Yorkshire for the work it does in practical way forward. It has meant the promotion of the region. I hope that the Minister and the shadow heritage, art, sport, spa breaks or whatever type of Minister will do what they can to ensure that the holiday people are looking for. I say sport with a heavy momentum that has started will continue. heart, because yesterday Yorkshire county cricket club was relegated. [HON.MEMBERS: “ Shame”.] It is a shame, but I cannot really say any more about that. 9.54 am That change in the tourism industry has proved extremely Andrew Jones (Harrogate and Knaresborough) (Con): successful and combined with the great efforts made to May I start by congratulating my hon. Friend the improve the offer available and create new products. Member for Selby and Ainsty on securing this debate? Tourism entrepreneurs are bringing new developments Tourism is an important issue in Yorkshire, and it has to market. Around the Harrogate and Knaresborough been important for me during my career. I spent many area alone, we are seeing new rooms and a spa at years working in the tourism sector, first running the Rudding Park hotel, a new golf resort is planned at marketing team at Going Places, and more recently on Flaxby, Harrogate’s Turkish baths have recently been the board of Harrogate International Centre. Tourism refurbished, and we have the Royal Horticultural Society’s is a critical part of our local economy, and it is a sector Harlow Carr garden and its successful partnership with that drives our economic growth. It is the third biggest Bettys tea rooms. Across the county there is ongoing sector in the county as a whole, and it is the biggest investment in some of our major stately homes, such as sector of the economy for my part of the county, North Harewood house and castle Howard, a location that my Yorkshire. Overall, the industry employs 250,000 people hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty will and accounts for just less than 10% of our economy. know well as he used to live about a mile away from it. There is an enormous scale to our tourism industry. There are efforts to keep what Yorkshire offers live, Tourism is a marvellous success story. Visitor numbers fresh and new. People will have read recently about are up by 12% this year, which vastly outperforms other aspirations to bring the opening stages of the 2016 Tour parts of the country even when building on high levels de France to Yorkshire, and to host the British leg of of visitors in the first place. I read that we have about the World Rally Championships. Aspirations are high. 215 million visits to Yorkshire every year, which is more Underpinning all that, however, must be a culture of than to Disney worldwide, so the scale is significant. I service. A holiday destination is not only about product want to say why the tourism sector in Yorkshire is doing but about the service offered by individuals. That is so well, mention a little about the business tourism firmly understood. In Yorkshire, there is always friendly sector, which is often ignored, and comment on where service and a welcoming approach. we might perform a little better. There has been a recognition that the area must There are a number of reasons for the encouragingly compete and win as a whole. Community groups and strong performance by Yorkshire, but the main reason local authorities have been playing a major role. The is the quality and variety of the tourism offer. The excellent work of the In Bloom teams, which I support product is excellent, but it is not a single product and locally, makes our communities not only better places the key is in its variety and choice. Yorkshire delivers a in which to live, but better places for visitors. The world-class offer in many different sectors of the tourism Harrogate In Bloom team and their partnership with 197WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 198WH the borough council’s very good parks department play I was recently at the opening of a trade show, the a critical role in making Harrogate Britain’s premier home and gift show, in the Harrogate International floral town. Centre. The organisers told me that they would use the The improvements in Waterside in Knaresborough, new facility, but I have also spoken to many delegates, driven by the Renaissance Knaresborough group, have who have commented on the importance of transport improved the walk and the views of the river, the castle connections to the decision about where to locate a and the crag. That iconic Yorkshire view has been much conference. improved. The biggest single show in Yorkshire is a mixture of My point is that we are seeing growth coming from a business and leisure. The Great Yorkshire show, organised quality product, good service, an entrepreneurial spirit by the Yorkshire Agricultural Society, is a magnificent and effective partnership working, but also from the event. It has bucked the trend in agricultural shows by entrepreneurial vigour with which that is sold. At this going from strength to strength. Indeed, this year it was stage, I join the praise for Welcome to Yorkshire. The just four visitors off its record attendance, so if the whole team, under the dynamic leadership of Gary Minister had been able to visit God’s county for the Verity, has displayed professionalism and zeal and has show and brought his family, we would have had a really made a difference. It is good to see some of the record! He should take that as a standing invitation. If team in the Public Gallery today. he can come up to future events, I will be delighted to provide him with tickets—I would happily buy those. I There is one part of our tourism industry that does hope that we can enjoy attending such an event in due not receive as much attention but that can be an important course. driver of business growth—business tourism. There are huge overlaps between leisure and business tourism. There is a strong partnership that helps to promote From my experience in Harrogate, I know that visitors business tourism in my area. Called Destination Harrogate, who come for conferences often return to the county it is an association of the leading hotels, which work later for leisure breaks, too. However, that is a different with the conference centre, the local council and the market and, at the moment, it is a troublesome market media to bring business to Harrogate. I support its that has obviously been affected by current economic work, which has been excellent, but there is one example conditions. As I have said, I was on the board of the of partnership working that I want to draw to everyone’s Harrogate International Centre. That conference centre attention—the Harrogate hospitality and tourism awards. brings to the area 300,000 visitors and £150 million of Those awards are all about celebrating success and spend and supports more than 5,000 jobs, so business outstanding service. It is right to recognise and reward tourism is clearly a major player in my constituency. It what makes a difference to customers. The awards are has been a success story, irrespective of the current used by a variety of local players to showcase their offer trading difficulties. The drivers of success in that field to visitors and to build relationships. are, again, investment and partnership working. I am conscious that I am describing the factors I will share a couple of examples to make my point. involved in making a successful sector even more successful, Investment in new facilities is fundamental. People have but it is not without its problems. Other hon. Members to keep their offer up-to-date, relevant and attractive, have spoken about funding. I want to highlight a feature because many new entrants are challenging for business that the industry is talking about a lot at the moment—a in the marketplace. In Harrogate at the moment, there potential subsidy being paid by local councils to conference is a £13 million scheme to build new exhibition halls. I organisers to bring their conference to a venue. The look forward to that scheme coming online next year, as team at the Harrogate conference centre think that that it will be a significant addition to the offer. I have been is a major factor in the market and have questioned very involved in making that deal happen, which will be whether it is appropriate for local councils to use council a huge tonic for our conference industry. tax or Government grants in that way. I am not sure whether that is classed as state aid, so its legality might Mr Greg Knight (East Yorkshire) (Con): Does my be questionable. The issue needs to be explored. hon. Friend agree that sometimes local authorities could do more in encouraging business tourism, because one One factor that is a key challenge for the future of of the problems that most businesses face when organising our industry is the transport infrastructure. There are a conference is lack of parking spaces? If we are to 220 trains a day from London to Yorkshire, but we encourage more businesses and more business conferences certainly have room for improvement. As a region, we to come to Yorkshire, we need to ensure that there is have not enjoyed the same long-term investment in adequate car parking near any exhibition centre that transport as other regions, but I can say to the people of may be operating. Yorkshire that they have a new set of MPs, who are working together to address that issue. I have been working with the chamber of trade and commerce in Andrew Jones: I agree with my right hon. Friend. Harrogate to secure better rail connections. We have Ensuring that the offer is welcoming to visitors is critical. secured our first direct London-to-Harrogate service in All local authorities should have that in mind all the 20 years and are now working on a scheme of improvements time. Parking facilities are necessarily an important to the Leeds, Harrogate and York line. I applaud the part of that, but so are other means of transport, too. work done by the chamber of trade and commerce. Local authorities should be working together to secure better parking provision, and they should lobby Ministers A major problem is our lack of air links. Direct links and the Highways Agency for improvements in the road to Heathrow or Gatwick do not exist. We need connecting and rail networks. I strongly agree with my right hon. flights, but we do not have them. That is a factor in our Friend’s point. performance in the international business exhibition 199WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 200WH

[Andrew Jones] historic city. It is situated on the banks of the River Ouse and surrounded by quaint villages and spectacular market. Indeed, I think that transport is a reason why landscapes. From its Roman ruins and Viking remains the UK underperforms in the huge international business to the industrial legacy of the National Railway museum exhibition market. and the jewel in the crown that is York Minister, York is Overall, however, the tourism industry in Yorkshire is truly one of Europe’s most inspirational and eye-catching doing well. The reasons for that growth are quality destinations. products, new investment, excellent service, working More than 1 million people a year walk on the city’s together and good marketing. Those are sound ways in historic walls. For a Yorkshire man or woman, it is which to grow any industry for the future. The industry almost a ritual to be walked over the walls by their understands what drives it and is determined to make it father or grandfather as a young child. Originally designed even better. Indeed, there are lessons from Yorkshire to defend the city from attack, the walls now stand as a that the rest of the country could learn. I hope that as a proud symbol of York’s history and international standing. country we do learn them, because tourism could be at The challenge for York, as for so many areas, is to the heart of the economic recovery that we all need. compete in an increasingly tough tourism market during extremely difficult economic times. That is why regional 10.8 am partnership working, which my hon. Friend the Member Julian Sturdy (York Outer) (Con): It is a pleasure to for Harrogate and Knaresborough (Andrew Jones) has speak under your chairmanship again, Mr Hancock. It mentioned, is so important. York has already benefited is also a great pleasure to speak in this debate. I congratulate from such partnership working, which brought about my hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty the refurbishment of the Yorkshire museum, which now (Nigel Adams) on securing a debate that is so important receives record numbers of visitors. to our region. I echo the sentiments already expressed Yorkshire racing and the Ebor festival are other by fellow Yorkshire Members on both sides of the examples. The hon. Member for Bradford South touched Chamber. on Yorkshire racing, and Welcome to Yorkshire got Tourism is a key economic driver across the Yorkshire involved in promoting racing across the region two region as a whole and to the city of York directly, years ago. This year, the numbers at the Ebor festival creating 23,000 jobs in the city, generating £433 million were up 16% on the back of record attendance figures for the local economy and promoting the many visible last year. Some 360,000 people visited the race course and, indeed, hidden treasures of God’s own county to last year—the highest number since racing started on more than 7 million visitors a year. the Knavesmire in York in 1761. Members should think As my hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty of the impact those growth figures have on the economy has said, the Prime Minister made a key speech in of not only York but the wider region. Similarly, the August 2010 about the importance of tourism to the production of “The Railway Children” in London lifted UK economy. Tourism is worth at least £47 billion a visitor numbers at the National Railway museum by year to the UK economy, with more than 1.7 million 6%. people employed in the sector at present. Throughout I welcome the Government’s tourism strategy, which his speech, the Prime Minister admirably stressed the they published in March, and I agree with their three importance of a renewed focus on tourism and the need aims of launching a £100 million marketing campaign, for Britain to break into the top five in the World increasing the proportion of UK residents holidaying Economic Forum’s travel and tourism competitiveness in the UK and increasing the sector’s productivity—no ratings. one can argue against those—but we must make sure If Britain is to achieve that goal, a vibrant, growing that the money is channelled through the right areas to and resilient tourism sector across Yorkshire will be deliver the biggest impact. crucial. However, too many people still automatically think of London when they think of British tourism. I acknowledge the important role played by local The capital is indeed a remarkable and historic place, authorities in promoting local tourism, and I congratulate and it is undoubtedly one of the greatest cities in the the Minister on a policy that will incentivise local world—up there even with the great city of York. authorities to do more on that front. I hope reforming However, there is more to Britain than London, and if business rates revenue will ensure that local authorities we are to boost the tourism sector, we need to boost our reap the full rewards of their tourism strategies, rather support for local tourism in regions across the country. than simply picking up the costs. Such incentives should With that, I pay tribute to Welcome to Yorkshire’s drive City of York council to do even more to promote success in our region, from innovative advertising to the city’s tourism industry. I would, however, be interested key partnership working. to learn the Minister’s thoughts on the role played by local enterprise partnerships in local tourism. How My hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty much responsibility for tourism are those new bodies has mentioned King’s Cross station. Similarly, on the expected to pick up in the coming years? few times I fly into Manchester airport, I see the sign saying “Gateway to Yorkshire”, which always lifts the In his speech last August, the Prime Minister stated heart of any Yorkshire man. I am sorry that the hon. that Member for Bradford South (Mr Sutcliffe) has had to “tourism is one of the missing pieces in the UK’s economic leave, but he is a keen Manchester United supporter, strategy.” and he will have seen that sign many times. I agree wholeheartedly with those sentiments, and I As one of the two MPs for the city of York, I shall would be grateful if the Minister were to provide an focus particularly on tourism in York. As many Yorkshire update on the Government’s work internationally to colleagues present will testify, York is a beautiful and promote tourism in Britain and specifically in Yorkshire. 201WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 202WH

Likewise, the creation of business-friendly conditions is Tourism should feature strongly in our strategy for key to supporting the tourism sector in cities such as economic recovery. I know that Britain cannot afford to York. Such conditions encourage entrepreneurship and give the industry a specific VAT cut at this time, but support small local businesses, which are crucial to does the Minister accept that this is perhaps not the York’s vibrant atmosphere. I would therefore be grateful right time for the Chancellor to hike up VAT? for the Minister’s thoughts on whether the Government It is not hard to see why Yorkshire is popular with are doing enough on that front. tourists and so valuable to the economy. It has everything, I want briefly to mention the funding of Visit York. from the hidden gem of Selby abbey, in the constituency Visit York is having to apply for alternative funding, of the hon. Member for Selby and Ainsty, to Scarborough, and one of its bids is being made to the regional growth which was one of the first seaside resorts in Britain, to fund via VisitEngland. Given that it faces budget cuts, I great moors and coastlines. It also has cities such as would be grateful if the Minister could advise it on how York and Leeds and shopping complexes such as best to apply for funds elsewhere and if he could give us Meadowhall. The hon. Member for Selby and Ainsty is his thoughts on how partnership working across the rightly proud of the region. region might drive economies of scale. I have learned some new facts about Yorkshire from I appeal to the Government to retain their strong the hon. Member for Harrogate and Knaresborough focus on tourism. The sector needs encouragement and (Andrew Jones). We all know about the landscape and reassurance. Cities such as York have much to offer, as heritage, but I did not know that it was the happiest long as enough support is provided during economically place to live in. I have enjoyed tea and cake at Bettys, challenging times. As a result of the dynamic and and it is a fantastic part of Harrogate. innovative work of Welcome to Yorkshire and Visit York and the partnerships they have formed, the tourism Mr Knight: Can I add to that impressive list the industry in our region is in great heart. Those bodies enjoyment of fresh crab and lobster at Bridlington, have proved themselves great wealth creators in our Britain’s largest shellfish port? region, and that must always be remembered in any Gloria De Piero: I remember the odd school trip to funding formula. For that success to continue, however, Bridlington. I did not have any crab then, but perhaps I we need a level playing field. In that respect, I support will now, as a grown-up. my hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty in his As people have said, tourism is about more than drive for matched funding for the tourism industry. economics. It has the magical ability to conjure up As I have mentioned, the city of York and our region dreams and create special memories. I grew up in Bradford, have a magnificent story to tell visitors, but we, as and I remember vividly the opening of the National representatives of our region, also play a role, in proudly Media museum, where my dad used to take me when I talking about our beautiful, historic county and in was a little girl. That museum did so much to capture promoting its many delights and attractions. my imagination. It was there that I learned about how television was made, and its history. That broadened my 10.17 am horizons, and who knows whether it was responsible for my choosing a career in TV before I came to this place? Gloria De Piero (Ashfield) (Lab): It is a pleasure to There was a mat to sit on, which would transform, by serve under your chairmanship, Mr Hancock. It is also means of the television screen in front, into a flying a pleasure to respond on behalf of the Opposition. I carpet to transport visitors to far-flung places. I went congratulate the hon. Member for Selby and Ainsty back to the museum a couple of years ago and the (Nigel Adams) on securing this important debate. He flying carpet mat had gone, but the special effects meant spoke passionately about the issue and posed some that people could transport themselves to outside good questions, which I hope the Minister will address. 10 Downing street, to be a reporter. That offered a little I echo many of the things that have been said about less magic to me, as that was my job at the time. Yorkshire, because, as hon. Members may be able to tell Another pleasure when I was growing up was Haworth, from my accent, I am originally a Yorkshire girl. Everybody down the road. I am sure that it was the main reason I in the room has a responsibility to ensure that Yorkshire fell in love, as a teenager, with Emily Bronte’s book and its tourism industry stay on the agenda. As the hon. “Wuthering Heights”, and went walking the moors Member for York Outer (Julian Sturdy) said, the debate wondering when my Heathcliff would come. Those is an important part of that. moors brought the novel to life for me, and I am sure I am from Bradford, and it is good to see my hon. that they do for many tourists. That reminds us that Friend the Member for Bradford South (Mr Sutcliffe) tourism is not only about people from different counties here. He is my mum and dad’s MP, and I know how or countries, but can be for people from nearby in the proud he is of his constituency and how hard he works same county: it can expand people’s horizons. It can to promote Bradford. He has also done a fine job of expand the taste buds too. Much to the horror of my promoting Yorkshire today. Italian parents, spag bol was not my food of choice, Tourism is incredibly important for the survival and because, as everyone knows, Bradford has a reputation continuing regeneration of many regions such as Yorkshire; for fantastic curries, and I became a devoted convert. I it creates huge numbers of jobs for people directly wish Bradford and Sheffield well, as they have both employed in the industry and for many thousands more been nominated for the Curry Capital of Britain award. working in similar industries. Its importance to our It would not surprise me if Yorkshire were to add national economy is highlighted by the fact that it is our another award to its growing list. fifth largest industry. According to figures from Yorkshire With brilliant attractions on our doorstep, it is important Forward, tourism contributes billions of pounds to the to make sure that everyone knows about them, and that regional economy. people do not miss out. That is why hon. Members are 203WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 204WH

[Gloria De Piero] Everyone in the debate, across the party divide, seems to agree on the importance of tourism overall to Britain’s right to point out the importance of promotion. I am economy. I shall not repeat the various figures that have originally from Bradford, and am the shadow Minister been cited and points that have been made, but it is for Culture and Tourism, but I did not know until helpful and instructive to note that one of the Prime recently that my birthplace beat cities such as Los Minister’s main intentions in making his speech on Angeles, Cannes and Venice to achieve UNESCO city tourism within the first 100 days of the coalition of film status. If I did not know that, what are the Government was to raise the profile of tourism as a chances that someone from Japan, or even someone sector of the visitor economy overall. The reason why from Jarrow, will know? he did that, apart from the fact that I was cheeky Spending on promoting Britain and its wonderful enough to ask him to, was his feeling that it was regions should not be seen as an unnecessary cost; it important to nail down the point that although tourism brings valuable cash in to Britain too. I am sure that the and the visitor economy as a whole have been an Minister is all too aware of figures that show that important part of the economy for many years, they money spent on promoting tourism can be extremely have perhaps been slightly undervalued and under- cost-effective. For instance, Welcome to Yorkshire was appreciated. There was a need to raise their profile. launched in April 2009 with regional development agency That is also why the Prime Minister appointed, for the funding from Yorkshire Forward of £10 million a year first time in many years, a dedicated tourism Minister—in for three years. According to Welcome to Yorkshire, for the shape of myself—in an attempt to give the sector a every £1 invested, it has delivered £40 back into the fair crack of the whip. local economy. However, the Minister will know that it All that attention, focus and constructive and helpful is in the dark about its financial future, with the impending input, from all sorts of people around the industry and closure of the regional development agencies. When Members of Parliament on both sides of the divide, led regional funding ceases in April 2012, it will be interesting to the tourism strategy that was published in March, to see what effect the Government’s new enterprise which several hon. Members have mentioned. I hope partnerships will have on the tourism industry. If regions that the strategy will create—again, for the first time in such as Yorkshire are not protected and developed, and many years—a focus and sense of overall direction for if budgets to attract tourists to them are slashed, people our visitor economy and that it will give people something may simply go elsewhere. to get behind, a template to work to. However, it will be The Labour Government worked hard to ensure that a slightly different kind of template from those that the British isles were once again becoming an attractive people have been used to in the past. The intention is to place in which to live and work and enjoy simple say, “Tourism involves a very large number of small and pleasures such as the Yorkshire moors, Whitby bay, medium-sized businesses, and therefore it is wrong to Bradford and Selby—places where vast numbers of try to treat the industry as a single organisation.” In people show their support with their feet and their fact, it would be counter-productive and destructive of wallets. Yorkshire is a wonderful place and I hope that it value to do so. has a wonderful future. There will not be a grand, centrally planned Stalinist I have a few questions for the Minister. What does he master plan handed down from my office about how we believe will be the impact of the VAT hike on the shall pass investment between different parts of Britain Yorkshire tourist industry? What does the Government and different sectors of the visitor economy. Instead, we tourism strategy have to offer the Yorkshire tourist must have a much more bottom-up, organic approach, industry? Does the Minister appreciate that spending through which local destinations can say, “This is what on promoting Britain and Yorkshire should not be we need in our area.” What is right for Harrogate will be viewed just as a cost, since it brings in cash? Will he give different from what is right for York or Scarborough. an assurance that Welcome to Yorkshire will receive That is entirely correct, and the people best placed to some financial support from the Government, after understand the different responsibilities and priorities April 2012? Finally, to echo what the hon. Member for in each area are inevitably the businesses that operate in Selby and Ainsty said, will the Minister tell us about the those local markets, which are trying to make their funding anomaly in relation to Scotland? living in those local destinations.

Mr Sutcliffe: I understand the thrust of what the 10.25 am Minister says about small and medium-sized businesses, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture, but it is important that there should be an overarching Olympics, Media and Sport (John Penrose): It is a organisation. As I said in my speech, before the tourist pleasure to know that you are here this morning, board and Welcome to Yorkshire, areas competed against Mr Hancock, to provide a firm hand and make sure each other. There is a need for co-ordination. That is that we stay in order. I congratulate my hon. Friend the why we are concerned about the long-term future of Member for Selby and Ainsty (Nigel Adams) on getting Welcome to Yorkshire. the debate under way. It is tremendously helpful to be able to mark the contribution that Yorkshire makes to John Penrose: I completely agree; I am not talking tourism, because Yorkshire is one of our most important about an either-or option. We need the bottom-up, attack brands—I think that is the phrase that my hon. organic, business-led approach, because that is what Friend used—and a potential alternative to established will give our management and marketing efforts to tourism honey pots such as London. Providing us with grow the local visitor economy in each destination more a chance to consider how to pursue that potential is a commercial edge and nous. The hon. Gentleman is tremendously worth while and intelligent use of time. right to say that the approach must not be at the 205WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 206WH expense of other areas or trying to do down neighbouring of it. The organisation will be at the front and centre in destinations, particularly those that could themselves be the drive to establish Yorkshire as an alternative destination, a vital attack brand or an overall destination. If he will and an attack brand to attract people to other parts of hold his horses for a moment, I will come to the point the country rather than simply to London. It is important about Yorkshire’s overall position as a potential rival to that we make the effort. London, alongside the Peak district, Cornwall, the Lake London is a hugely valuable tourism asset to Britain. district and others. It is the single most visited area of the country. However, There is an important difference in the way that we we need to use London as a way not only of attracting are trying to approach things, in that local destination people to Britain but of making it their first stop before management organisations will increasingly become more they move out and visit all the other things that we have business-led and commercially savvy but still be supported to offer. As Minister with responsibility for tourism, I by local councils, local enterprise partnerships and all do not much mind if that means Cornwall, the Lake sorts of other public sector bodies, particularly where district or Yorkshire, but we must have credible alternatives. tourism is an important part of the local economy, such That is why I was pleased to hear my hon. Friend the as in large parts of Yorkshire. Member for Harrogate and Knaresborough talk about Tourism’s place in the pecking order will obviously the importance of investing in the product and ensuring vary from place to place, but there is no doubt, as we that the attractions and accommodation are kept up to heard this morning, that the visitor economy is an standard. He is right to say that it is impossible to drive extremely important part of the local economy right success in this industry without a product that is worth across Yorkshire, and local councils and other public promoting. bodies will naturally want to support tourism in whatever Once we have created a high quality and good value way they can. Again, however, we hope that they will be product—I mean good value at all price points, from supporting and backing up a business-led organisation— the cheapest to the poshest and most expensive—we one that has that extra commercial nous. In creating must ensure that people understand that going for a those organisations, I hope that we will have started to weekend to York is fine but that they can spend longer change the culture of the business and the way in which there, perhaps spending an entire week visiting the we approach the matter. whole of Yorkshire. That is the kind of challenge that Before speaking about how we might create rival we must get across; we must ensure that people understand attack brands or alternatives to London, I should make the richness, breadth and diversity of the various things clear that all the contributions made today show that that can be done in places such as Yorkshire. It should Yorkshire has a great sense of place and of a shared not matter if people go to Yorkshire for a particular culture and history. That is a huge advantage when purpose; there are always other things to tack on the creating an alternative to London and rival destinations. end. If one goes with the family, the children will not be There is a huge sense of pride in a shared Yorkshireness. bored. There will always be something new and different My hon. Friend the Member for Harrogate and to do. Knaresborough (Andrew Jones) said that in the past he It is important that organisations such as Welcome to and I have been prone to a little banter on the relative Yorkshire put across the message of a rich and diverse merits of Yorkshire and my county of Somerset. I shall tourism offer. Destination management organisations not intrude on private grief by alluding too often to the are not the same as destination marketing organisations, Yorkshire cricket team, but I was pleased to hear the and the difference is crucial. We need management selfless offer made by the hon. Member for Bradford organisations to act as the voice of the visitor when South (Mr Sutcliffe) to arrange a tour of the Yorkshire talking to local public bodies, be they local councils, breweries. I am sure that many Members here today LEPs or whatever. It is important that locally elected would be willing to assist him. councillors and other politicians have somebody to Having spoken about breweries, I mention in passing remind them what visitors want because, by definition, the contribution of my hon. Friend the Member for visitors come from elsewhere and do not have a local Leeds North West (Greg Mulholland), who was concerned vote. about pub closures. I remind the House that the We need somebody to stand up and speak up for the Government recently announced what I hope will be a local tourism industry on behalf of its customers; when valuable initiative, one that will help many more of councils are considering how, for example, to renew or those pubs that have been struggling to stay open. It is a regenerate a piece of public space—perhaps an old strong consultation on deregulation and reducing the market square—we must ensure that the needs of the red tape on entertainment licensing. That will clearly be tourists are considered at the same time as those of very important for a great many pubs that currently local people. Those needs can often be entirely congruent find it difficult, time-consuming and awkward to lay on and aligned, but occasionally the needs of the visitor music. I believe that that will make a huge difference to will be slightly different from or additional to what local the future success of many pubs, both rural ones and people want, so it is vital that we have organisations those in city centres. strong and vibrant enough to speak when the moment I speak next about establishing Yorkshire as an overall strikes. destination, as well as a place that contains many local My hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty tourism gems. As everyone else has done so, and because raised some important questions about funding. I wish they deserve it, I add my congratulations to the people to develop my argument in response to those questions, of Welcome to Yorkshire. It is a good example—I am possibly wrapping up the various queries raised by boring the rest of the country with it—of a high- others during the debate. My hon. Friend was entirely functioning, well run and effective local destination right to say that there are different levels of funding management organisation, and Yorkshire can be proud around the country, but we are in a transition period at 207WH Tourism in Yorkshire13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Tourism in Yorkshire 208WH

[John Penrose] (Julian Sturdy), mentioned the reform of business rates. Those rates are tremendously important as a source of the moment. The old regime of regional development public sector funding. By reforming them and giving agency funding is coming to an end, and new sources of councils an opportunity to share in the proceeds of funding are being found by destination management local economic growth by retaining some of the increased organisations around the country. business rates that are generated, we change the mindset My hon. Friend was right to point out that DMOs of councils about investing in local tourism. From take a different approach in Scotland. It is worth pointing being something that was not a statutory duty—it still out that domestic tourism in Scotland is a devolved is not a statutory duty—and was, in many cases, viewed matter; it is the responsibility of the Scottish Executive. as a cost and something for which local councils got Having taken the overall funding devolved under the very little return, it will hopefully be seen by local Barnett formula, they may make decisions about the councils as an opportunity to invest in a successful local relative priorities for spending in Scotland that are business. We expect them to say, “If we put some money different from those made in England. If they want a into local tourism, either into marketing a local destination different trade-off between the health service spending or into investing in infrastructure, we have an opportunity and tourism, they are entitled to make it. None the less, to drive economic growth very effectively.” and however those local priorities are assigned, we in The figures that have been quoted in this morning’s England have to ensure that we make the best of our debate show that tourism is an extremely rapid and overall funding allowance. financially efficient way of driving economic growth. It My hon. Friend mentioned the efforts that we are is also a way of driving economic growth that is not making to promote Britain abroad and to attract more centred on the south-east or on one or two of our foreign visitors. That is going pretty well. I suspect that traditional sectoral strengths such as financial services. few Members will have seen our advertisements or Tourism, therefore, ticks a great many boxes. It is marketing, because by definition they are being applied instructive to see what has already been done by successful in foreign markets. They are being targeted at the top 20 organisations such as Welcome to Yorkshire. The local or so most important markets for visitors to the UK. rates of economic growth in the sector far, far outstrip They include some of what I would call the near abroad, those of the economy as a whole. From the Treasury’s in western Europe, which may have been a little ignored point of view, that has to be good because it shows that in the past; it also includes some traditionally strong the tourism sector and the visitor economy as a whole markets for the UK, such as the USA and Canada. It has a huge potential and is already delivering on that also includes some of the high-potential, fast-growing potential to be a leader in the country’s economic but historically small contributors to our visitor base, recovery. The reform of business rates is crucial and will such as China, Russia and Brazil. Those are working provide important incentives for local councils and well, and we are seeing strong levels of interest. other public bodies to invest in local tourism organisations. As will be understood, we also have a series of amazing and wonderful events to add to our existing It is also true that local tourism businesses are increasingly attractions, not only in 2012 but in future years. Next willing to get involved. If they contribute to local destination year we have Her Majesty the Queen’s diamond jubilee. collective marketing campaigns, they will see positive We also have the Olympic and Paralympic games and returns to their businesses as well. It is important to the cultural Olympiad, and in 2012 and 2014 we will draw a distinction here. In the past, in some parts of the have the two flavours of rugby world cup. We have the country—there have been notable and honourable Commonwealth games, the Ryder cup and so on and so exceptions to this—local councils and local councillors forth. There is a whole stream of wonderful opportunities have gone round and effectively twisted the arms of that we can use to raise the profile around the world of local tourism firms to contribute to a local tourism Britain as a destination. marketing campaign, which has never been a terribly The point that I want make to hon. Members here effective system. It was driven more by the mayor’s and to the industry more broadly is that those events desire to wander into the local tourism and information are not the main course. They are not the moment when centre and see his picture and a foreword from him on we will see huge increases in the numbers of visitors, the front of a leaflet rather than to put heads on beds or although we expect and hope to see influxes of visitors bums on seats and drive top line revenue for local around the events themselves. The really big-value tourism businesses. opportunity here lies in the fact that events such as the If we move away from that and have business-led Olympics will probably attract the single biggest TV organisations, we will achieve our aims because those audience that this planet has ever seen, which gives us organisations will have an extra commercial edge. If we an unparalleled, historic opportunity to demonstrate start running campaigns that genuinely make a difference all the wonderful things that Yorkshire and other parts to local tourism businesses, and make more of a difference of Britain can offer to the rest of the world. We want to those that have contributed to a collective pot than the people who cannot come to the Olympics or the the ones that have decided to free-ride, we will have Paralympics next year to watch the events on TV and something that is not an exercise in corporate philanthropy think, “You know what, I may not have been able to get or council arm-twisting but makes good commercial there for the games themselves, but I fancy going to see sense because it justifies its own place in any local all those things that are available in Britain in 2013, tourism companies’ local marketing plans. Equally, it 2014 or 2015.” That is the big opportunity that the will make more sense to participate than not to participate. international marketing campaign is aiming to use. Firms that participate in the scheme will do better that There are also some domestic funding opportunities those that do not. Those are simple, clear incentives that and targets that we want to explore. Various Members, will transform the way in which local tourism bodies including my hon. Friend the Member for York Outer work. They will also transform the incentives for local 209WH Tourism in Yorkshire 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 210WH companies and local councils to get involved. What that Road Fuel Duties means—this is already happening in many parts of the country—is that we will get locally organised, locally 11 am run and locally focused shared marketing campaigns that are funded by contributions from local businesses, Mr Brian H. Donohoe (Central Ayrshire) (Lab): I and backed up by local tourism and marketing welcome you to your rightful place in the Chair, organisations, often with the support of local councils. Mr Hancock, and I also welcome the Economic Secretary It would be remiss of me to pass over the issue of to the Treasury and my hon. Friend on the Front ongoing central Government support. There is the regional Bench, the Member for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy), growth fund, into which a number of what I hope will to this extremely important debate. It is also good to see be highly successful tourism-related bids have gone for that all parties in the House are, I think, represented consideration. Those bids vary in size from the small to here, and I look forward to what they have to say. I the extremely large. We hope and expect that many of particularly want to hear what the Economic Secretary them will be compelling when they are being considered. has to say about the high levels of road fuel duties in this country. I also want to put on record my thanks to Yesterday’s announcement on the torch relay was the Speaker for allowing the debate to take place at this also mentioned. We are using £3 million of central time. Government money to leverage local tourism money from different parts of the country. There will be a This year, 2011, has been eventful in every sense of strong discount-led offer for anyone who wants to book the word. It has perhaps been the most financially a trip to a destination where the torch relay is happening. eventful year in the history of politics. It has been a The trip does not have to take place at the same time as rollercoaster. We have seen global financial turmoil, the torch relay, but it has to be booked while the relay is and the stock market has fluctuated at a rate that I have happening. We will use that unique event to highlight never seen before. We are seeing the beginnings of high the wonderful things that visitors can do in York or in unemployment levels, along with a rise in inflation, Harrogate or wherever the relay may be happening. It is increasing transport costs, and tax changes that I have a golden opportunity to leverage a lovely piece of never witnessed in my time in the House—I have been Olympics-related public relations in a way that will here some 20 years. The past eight months have delivered stimulate local tourism demand. Therefore, there will be a record-breaking run of price rises, those of petrol and a series of central Government initiatives designed to diesel being among the most alarming. drive Olympic-related tourism activity. Across the UK—there are, of course, highs and lows across the country—the average price of petrol reached I hope that I have responded to all the points that a high in May of 137.43p per litre, and an examination have been raised and that it is clear that there is a great of the relevant website just last night showed that the deal of commitment to tourism both in Yorkshire and average price just now is not far from that. There is a elsewhere in the country, a high degree of pride in the differential of some 24p per litre between the highest kind of tourism opportunities that counties such as and the lowest price across the country. I remember that Yorkshire provide, and a huge excitement in the potential when the Labour party was in government there was a that places such as Yorkshire have to put across the near revolution when the truckers blockaded the refineries breadth and depth of what they have to offer to potential as a consequence of high fuel prices. Interestingly, we visitors, thus enabling them to become rivals to London have not seen anything like that since, and I wonder and alternative centres for extended stays rather just why. short breaks. I am sure that hon. Members will agree that the Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) opportunities for Yorkshire tourism are bright. The (SNP): I am not certain from the tone of the hon. future looks very good indeed. We must understand Gentleman’s voice whether he wants a blockade of that landing those opportunities will require huge amounts refineries by truckers across the United Kingdom. of hard work, but with the cross-party commitment Mr Donohoe: The hon. Gentleman should know, as and local pride that has been on offer today, I am sure should all Members, that I would be the last person in that we will manage to do so. this place to call for a revolution and civil disobedience. There is absolutely no doubt, however, that the high 10.49 am fuel prices are at the point of driving people out of jobs, Sitting suspended. which is the most serious aspect of the matter. I shall give an example, which makes me angry, of the desperate situation of a nurse in my constituency. She has had to put up with a wage freeze for the next two years, her pension contributions have gone up, she has to pay double for parking at the hospital in Glasgow where she works, and she has to find £100 extra a month to get to and from work because of the high fuel prices. That proposition cannot feasibly be sustained for too long, but she cannot use public transport because of where she stays and where the hospital is. That problem must be looked at. Regarding what the Government take per litre, I always remember a case from some years ago of a retailer who was determined to show the breakdown of the price of petrol and diesel. He was told that that was 211WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 212WH

[Mr Donohoe] We must consider the problems with the Government’s approach. Although they have frozen fuel tax duty for not the form, and the petrol company said that it would the next couple of years, we must take into account the no longer supply him, for some obscure reason. When fact that the freeze will be more than offset by the rise in one considers that of the average 135p price of a litre of inflation. As petrol is always an easy revenue raiser, it is fuel, 81p is taken, one starts to understand the cost to widely expected that the Government will make up their the individual buying the petrol or the diesel. A good losses, leaving the consumer no better off in the long 60% goes on dealing with Government intervention in term. the form of fuel duty, and there is also VAT. Indeed, I will highlight three areas of concern. The first is 20% VAT increases the price of petrol by 2.5%, putting environmental, the second is economic and the third something like 2.5p on it. In addition, outside of involves the social impact of the road fuel duty. The Government intervention in the price, there are the oil removal of the duty differential will affect the green companies, and it is time to argue for a windfall tax on economy. The UK Sustainable Biodiesel Alliance has their profits. I know that there has already been a tax, raised concerns about the Government’s decision to which a lot of colleagues are very concerned about in remove the 20p duty differential for biodiesel produced relation to the oil companies’ continued investment, but from used cooking oil by April 2012. I ask the Economic I believe that the Government should look at the correlation Secretary to consider that loss more closely. It does not between profit and price. stack up against the Government’s views on the green I have already argued that a significant portion of the economy. Many see the impact of the removal of the price of petrol and diesel in this country is made up of duty differential for biodiesel as a disastrous blow for the Government take, and I argue that it is higher than the growth of the green economy. Just outside my in most other European countries as a consequence of constituency is the company Stagecoach, which runs the high level of tax. Is there any opportunity to make buses on biodiesel. It is highly successful, and particularly the price cheaper? I am sure that the Economic Secretary popular with youngsters, but it will come to an end if will argue that in the present climate there is no leeway—no the differential is not maintained. Will the Minister room for manoeuvre—but I suggest that there might be, clarify why on earth the Government, whom we have and I shall come on to that later. heard are the greenest Government ever, continue to The reason for this debate is obvious: the price of fuel consider it? is crippling a great number of the people whom I On the economic side, we risk the demise of the represent and, I am sure, a great many of those represented independent fuel sector. Retail Motor Industry Petrol by other Members here this morning. The Institute for told me that MRH, the UK’s largest independent forecourt Fiscal Studies has announced that the living standards operator, has highlighted the unfair pricing practices of UK families will decline by more than 10% over the used against it by both hypermarket chains and oil next three years, and it predicts that in real terms companies. That is a concern. In addition, the four big the typical household income will fall by 3.5% in the supermarket chains are struggling with their own retail year to April, which will be the steepest drop since 1981. this year due to the downturn, which in turn is placing We understand that there is little room for offsetting greater pressure on and compounding the problems of falling living standards by cutting taxes, but the matter independent retailers. must be looked at. The level of tax and duties on petrol and diesel is cutting off the prospects of many struggling Such relentless competition has been going on for families and small businesses, and since I secured this some years. It is responsible for the closure of around debate I have had dozens of e-mails from small businesses 400 independent forecourts, and it continues. It will with examples of just what it is doing to them. lead to a sparse population of fuel retailers, obliging The situation is also destroying job prospects, in motorists to drive great distances to top up their tanks, particular among young people. I have already had a which is not sustainable. More than 6,000 garages have summit in my constituency, attended by the Secretaries closed since 1998, which is a problem, as anybody of State for Work and Pensions and for Scotland. Youth knows who travels off motorways. Particularly in more unemployment is reaching levels that I never thought rural areas, as I have seen at first hand, running out of possible—it is as high as 70% in many areas. That fuel because there are no petrol or diesel stations is cannot be sustainable and it is not helped at all by the always a danger. cost of living today, particularly in more rural areas—I see that the hon. Members for Argyll and Bute (Mr Reid) Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): The hon. Gentleman and for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Mr MacNeil) are present. has outlined the issues relating to road fuel duty and mentioned garages running short. Does he share my Anne Marie Morris (Newton Abbot) (Con): I am concern—I suspect that he does—that it is not only delighted that the hon. Member for Central Ayrshire about garages running short but about elderly people in (Mr Donohoe) has brought this important topic for our community? This winter, they will be asking themselves, debate. Is he aware that the current Chief Secretary to “Should we use oil, electric, coal or gas?”, but they will the Treasury called in 2007 for a rural fuel discount be stuck with oil and the cost that that entails. Does he scheme, and so may have a favourable view? Like the not feel that the Government should consider what help hon. Gentleman, I am concerned, because the south-west they can give elderly people to ensure that this winter has a very rural community. Three quarters of the land will not be a hard one? is agricultural holdings, so a rural discount would be of great benefit. Mr Donohoe: The blasé slogan “Either eat or heat” is Mr Donohoe: We will have to wait for the Economic becoming a reality faced by many of my constituents, Secretary’s response on that point. As an Opposition particularly the elderly. The hon. Gentleman is right. It Member, I am not in a position to give any assurances. is a major concern, and it should concern the Government. 213WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 214WH

To return to the economic point, the industry should Mr Donohoe: That was one of my conclusions, so it is look into the fact that some oil providers supply their useful that the hon. Gentleman has made that point. own forecourts with fuel at one price while selling the This morning, the Fair Fuel UK campaign e-mailed me, same fuel to a second retailer down the road at a higher as I am sure it mailed everybody. Like everybody in this cost. Something must be done about that. Anyone who room, barring perhaps the Economic Secretary, I signed travels two miles along the road from Prestwick to Ayr the e-petition. As a consequence, only 17,000 signatures in my constituency can see it at first hand. Prices at are now required to reach 100,000. I urge everybody—not forecourts using the same supplier vary 6p from one end just those here but anybody listening to this debate who to the other, which should not be allowed. Two-tier is concerned about high fuel prices—to sign the petition pricing is becoming a joke. so that a full debate can be held. This is, after all, only an Adjournment debate. Important as it might be, we Mr MacNeil: I hear what the hon. Gentleman says need a full debate in the House with the Government about two-tier pricing, but I am sure that he will sympathise leading. I look forward to it. with areas of one-tier pricing, such as my constituency, In conclusion, we must consider the issues that I have where all prices are high and the closest cheaper fuel is a highlighted. The Government know that the Labour ferry ride away. Does he not feel that there has been too party opposes 20% VAT, which has helped to push up much inaction by successive Governments on tackling petrol prices to their current levels. I did not realise until the problem? I was preparing for this debate that VAT is put on top of the tax, so the duty is taxed with VAT. If the tax is 50p, 20% VAT is put on top of that fuel duty. The Government Mr Donohoe: I agree entirely. It is interesting to note should look at that. If, as is being argued, a reduction in that Shetland has some of the highest petrol prices in VAT is not an option because of the bureaucracy across Scotland, although half the United Kingdom’s total oil the water in Brussels, we could consider a reduction in supply flows through two pipelines there. Another instance fuel duty to lower the cost of taxation, which, as I have is Grangemouth, where the refinery for Scotland is said, is initially some 80p per litre. The Economic based. The price of fuel there is also among the highest Secretary and the Treasury should look at that. in Scotland. That does not stack up. Guto Bebb (Aberconwy) (Con): On VAT, I have been Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab): I was in discussions with a representative from a coach company interested by the intervention of the hon. Member for in my constituency, which has put on hold plans to Newton Abbot (Anne Marie Morris), because not far employ more staff because of the extent of fuel duty. from Newton Abbot is the Devonshire coast. I was One of the issues that he raised was VAT. He actually down there about 12 months ago or more, and it was argued in favour of a higher rate of VAT for diesel and amazing to see the number of tankers lined up that were petrol, because, as a business, he can reclaim the VAT not being unloaded. Does my hon. Friend not think but not the fuel duty. I wonder whether the Treasury has that there might be a case for an investigation into oil an opinion on that. companies and hoarding to force up prices? Price is as much an element of the problem as taxes. Mr Donohoe: That is a matter for the Economic Secretary, not me, to address, but I am grateful to the Mr Donohoe: I thank my hon. Friend for that hon. Gentleman for his intervention. A tax increase is intervention. I am sure that the Economic Secretary will being proposed for next January and August, but I address that issue when she sums up, along with the would like an assurance from the Economic Secretary points made by other hon. Members. that it will not be implemented. The best way to help My third point concerns the social and economic hard-pressed consumers would be for the Government consequences of the situation. Everybody can see that not to adjust the tax on families, who are already feeling many kinds of damage have been done to consumers the squeeze as a consequence of the Government’s and businesses, particularly small businesses. As I have policy on pay freezes and pension hikes. mentioned, the erosion in the number of forecourts is We also have to look at the big six energy providers, obvious, particularly in rural areas, and it will lead to which recently announced large price rises and bigger fuel deserts in many parts of the UK. A vital immunity profits. The Government must have scope to look at for low-income families, pensioners and the disabled that in order to redress, via a windfall tax, the whole has been lost. Journeys to fill fuel tanks are longer, problem of taxation. There is also the issue of the increasing carbon emissions needlessly. Consumer choice Government’s policy—if it is a policy—to move people has been reduced. There are fewer facilities for HGV from the road to public transport. The Government and van users, as supermarkets do not cater for them. have just increased the cost of rail travel by 10%, which The impact on the UK’s ability to cope with emergencies seems to go against everything that is being argued. Is has also been massive. Perhaps most importantly, jobs that policy supported and likely to continue to be and job opportunities are being lost. supported by the Treasury? A number of representatives from rural areas are Jim Shannon: As the hon. Gentleman will be aware, present. More emphasis needs to be put on trying to an e-petition is circulating that has some 62,000 signatures allay the problems associated with living in the countryside, at the moment. If it gets 100,000 signatures, we can which are an enormous burden on businesses and the debate the matter in the House of Commons. Does he consumer in those areas. I have already mentioned not feel that he should encourage people to sign it so the removal of the duty differential for biodiesel, but that the matter can be debated at length in the House, as the position of that industry needs to be addressed it needs to be? by the Government. It is a growing industry and one 215WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 216WH

[Mr Donohoe] Inner Hebrides and the Clyde. The Treasury is currently consulting filling station operators on the terms of the that is useful in addressing both public and private pilot scheme. Its original consultation proposals were transport in my constituency. I have already mentioned met with significant concern by filling station operators, the prices set by supermarkets and oil providers, which because they would have caused a cash-flow problem. I have to be addressed. was pleased when the Government responded quickly I have two final points. The Government must reduce to those concerns and revised their proposals in a way the tax on petrol. That would increase employment that removes the cash-flow problem. prospects, particularly those of the nurse whom I mentioned The revised consultation proposals envisage two possible earlier, as well as those of people who rely on public schemes—a distributor-based scheme and a retailer-based transport to get to work. Finally, I am old enough to scheme. Of the two, it looks like the distributor-based remember when fuel prices were fixed universally scheme would be easier to operate, because the distributor throughout the whole country. A lot of the commodities has the resources to carry out the administration, which that were deemed at that time to be essential, such as the small retailer would often find more difficult. I bread and milk, were all the same price. Given the appreciate, however, the Government’s concern that a disparity between the highest and lowest price in this distributor-based scheme may fall foul of EU state aid country, will the Government examine the issue so that rules and might not be approved by the European the disparity is overcome and the price of petrol is not a Commission. I hope that a distributor-based scheme commodity with which the supermarkets and some of can be devised that is acceptable to the Commission. If the country’s suppliers play? not, we would have to proceed with a retailer-based scheme. Mr Mike Hancock (in the Chair): Thank you, The cash-flow problem in the original proposals has Mr Donohoe. A lot of Members want to speak, but we been overcome, but filling station operators are still do not have a great deal of time. Will those Members concerned that it is not clear how they can prove to who speak be careful about the number of interventions the Treasury that they are passing on the discount to the they take? Perhaps that way everyone will get in. consumer. An essential principle of the scheme is that the 5p discount is passed on to the consumer. What 11.25 am retailers have asked me is whether the Government can provide clarity on how they should demonstrate that Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD): It is a pleasure they are passing on the discount. That clarity would be to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Hancock. I welcomed because, as I say, the retailers are still not congratulate the hon. Member for Central Ayrshire clear what they would have to do to comply with the (Mr Donohoe) on securing this debate and on bringing scheme—and, of course, they are all keen to participate. this important issue before the House. If the islands’ pilot scheme is successful, as I am sure it I represent a sparsely populated constituency, so I am will be, I would like it to be extended to remote areas of well aware of the impact of high fuel prices on people the mainland. and businesses. I represent many of the islands of the Inner Hebrides. The price of fuel on the larger islands, Anne Marie Morris: I absolutely endorse what my such as Mull and Islay, is typically 15p a litre higher hon. Friend says, but some of the rebates that have been than at a city centre supermarket, and on the smaller given in France, Portugal and so on are not limited just islands, such as Coll and Colonsay, the price is usually to the islands. The Government’s current view is that it about 30p a litre higher. That is not due to any profiteering is only in an island situation that such relief can be by local filling stations; Office of Fair Trading investigations made available, but that does not seem valid. have shown that there is no local profiteering. The main reason is the low turnover. The high fixed costs of Mr Reid: I wholeheartedly agree with my hon. Friend. running a filling station mean a high price. As she said, other EU countries are operating a similar scheme, so I am sure that it can be successful here. Mr MacNeil: On that point, Donald MacNeil of the Burnside filling station in Daliburgh, South Uist, has Mr MacNeil: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? told me that, if he paid somebody to sell fuel all day, Mr Reid: The Chairman asked for limited interventions they would not raise their own wage from the amount and I have already given way to the hon. Gentleman. they sold, which is a reflection of why the price of rural fuel is so high. There is no profiteering. Apart from the I have accepted the Government’s view that we must high prices, we also know that there are distribution have an islands pilot first, but after that I would certainly issues. press for it to be extended to remote areas of the mainland. Mr Reid: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his Jim Shannon: The hon. Gentleman refers to the intervention. He is correct that there is no profiteering mainland; obviously, I am very keen for the same at the local filling station, although the distribution opportunities to exist for the people of Northern Ireland. network, as he has indicated, might be another issue. Will he address that issue and does he agree that Northern The high price obviously has a great impact on Ireland also needs to have a similar pilot scheme, because people’s living standards and on anyone trying to run a the prices there are equal to those in the western islands business on an island or in a remote rural area. I was of Scotland? therefore delighted when the Government announced their intention to pursue a pilot scheme under which Mr Reid: I agree with the hon. Gentleman. From there will be a 5p a litre fuel duty discount on many of the perspective of a Scottish island, the mainland is the the country’s islands, including all the islands of the mainland of Great Britain, but I accept that there is 217WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 218WH another part of the United Kingdom. I am not sure I want only to make one or two points of emphasis whether calling it the mainland is the correct way to because I am conscious that all hon. Members present refer to it or not. represent constituencies that are under the cosh in certain ways regarding fuel prices. I congratulate my hon. Jim Shannon: As Margaret Thatcher said, we are Friend the Member for Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) more British than Finchley. on securing the debate. I know that there is high feeling in the country about fuel prices because I get regular Mr Reid: We are straying into another debate here. I letters about the subject. I also note one of the points think we will stick to fuel duty, which is probably a lot that he made earlier: so far, we have not seen the lorry less contentious. drivers demonstrating. I do not know and would not like to say whether that will happen, but I would not like Operating a rural filling station is clearly not a profitable it to. I would prefer to think that the Government will business these days, and we heard from the hon. Member take action, as they promised in the run-up to the for Central Ayrshire about how many have closed. In general election when they were condemning us for the my constituency, I can point to 10 that have closed since fuel price escalator. I became an MP in 2001, and that is fairly typical of the country as a whole. On the Kintyre peninsula, only It is worth noting and reminding the hon. Member three of the five filling stations that the area had at the for Argyll and Bute (Mr Reid) that the fuel price escalator beginning of the year are still open. Two have closed was introduced by a Conservative Government—in fact, this year, which is causing real concerns on the peninsular. it was the previous Conservative Government. I was As the hon. Gentleman who opened the debate pointed also interested to note that the hon. Gentleman mentioned out, people are therefore driving longer distances to fill that the Government had taken action to try to stabilise up their tanks and the choices available to rural motorists fuel prices. I think it was 1p or something that they have been reduced. Action to help rural motorists is knocked off so, frankly, they did not take very much certainly badly needed. action. There was a time when it could be argued that high Mr Reid: As well as knocking 1p off, the Government fuel taxation was needed to discourage people from did not go ahead with the increase that the previous polluting the environment, but market forces have already Chancellor’s fuel price escalator would have caused. achieved that. Nobody drives for the fun of it these days unless they literally have money to burn and, of course, anyone in such a position would not be deterred by high Mr Cunningham: I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s fuel duty anyway. High fuel duty has played its part in response because he is only apologising for the Government discouraging people from using their cars when public of whom he is part. When he was in opposition, he said transport alternatives were available but, of course, in a the opposite; but never mind, we shall carry on. rural area those alternatives are not often available. The Although we cannot broaden the debate, I would like price of fuel is already very high and the Government to mention that one of the major implications of the should not be considering putting duty up any further. fuel price increase is its impact on the wider economy. I was delighted when the Government abandoned We could talk about pensioners who are on fixed incomes, Labour’s fuel duty escalator in the Budget, introduced one-parent families or people who rely on transport— the fuel duty stabiliser instead and brought down the whether it is the motor car or the bus. I need to check fuel duty because the price was so high. The Government this out, but I think that, a couple of weeks ago, have scheduled a fuel duty increase for January as it was National Express announced that it may have to reconsider hoped at the time of the Budget that prices would have off-peak fares for pensioners because of the subsidy decreased by then, although they show no sign of doing situation. That is something that the Minister may want so. If prices are still at this level in January, I hope that to investigate. the Government will not press ahead with the increase. Anas Sarwar (Glasgow Central) (Lab): I join my hon. My final point, which was also touched on by the Friend in congratulating our hon. Friend the Member hon. Member for Central Ayrshire, is about what exactly for Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) on securing the is causing the high price of fuel. The hon. Member for debate. My hon. Friend the Member for Coventry South Coventry South (Mr Cunningham) referred to oil (Mr Cunningham) mentioned the impact on pensioners. companies storing fuel rather than putting it on to the In the city of Glasgow, 100,000 pensioners face cuts to market. I want to ask the Government whether any their winter fuel allowance this year as well as increases collective action can be taken internationally—for example, in the cost of fuel and of living. Sadly, too many through the G20—to bring the price of fuel down. The pensioners right across the country will have to choose price of fuel adds to the price of everything in a rural between putting food on the table, heating their homes area, so anything that the Government can do to bring and getting out and about around the country. Would the price down would be greatly appreciated by my he like there to be some real Government action to constituents and all hon. Members who represent a support pensioners? rural constituency. Mr Cunningham: The previous Government certainly 11.35 am went a long way to try to address some of those problems. Some Labour Members did not necessarily Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab): This is think that they went far enough, but that is another the first time I have taken part in a debate that you have argument. We now have the present Government. If chaired, Mr Hancock, and so far you have been handling they want to talk about the big society, they must get a the discussion very well. grip of the issue and try to do something more positive. 219WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 220WH

[Mr Jim Cunningham] Road fuel in my constituency is at ridiculous rates, and has remained at ridiculous rates in the lifetime of It is no good relying on a pilot scheme somewhere and a this Government and the previous one. Road fuel is double-tier price index for fuel. We must tackle the between £1.50 and £1.57 a litre. My constituency has problem in a proper way.Someone mentioned the European the highest fuel poverty in the UK. In Stornoway, at the scheme, which may well be something that the Government north end, fuel is £1.50 a litre. At a small fuel station in can consider. South Uist, where I stopped on Friday in a rush to the I return to the issues that affect the economy. Haulage ferry—I was almost late, as usual—I paid £1.57 a litre prices must be affecting businesses, particularly small for diesel for my car. businesses—for example, in relation to builders. We rely In the Faroe Islands, which are halfway between the on builders to generate much of the economy. There are Hebrides and Iceland, the price of fuel is usually 50p a one or two examples of that. In addition, small businesses litre less. That was confirmed to me this morning: it is cannot always get credit and have cash flow problems, £1.06 a litre in Torshavn in the Faroe Islands. The price which impacts on small and other businesses and therefore is not a function of geography; it is a function of on the economy. Treasury taxation. [Interruption.] The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) asked me whether I wanted It is also worth noting that this Government, like the to move. Given how we are taxed from London, as previous Conservative Government, changed the retail Scotland does not yet control fuel tax, we may have to prices index; we now have a new invention called the move to all sorts of strange, weird and wonderful places consumer prices index. Such an approach shows that to avoid the Sheriff of Nottingham tax behaviour from the Government are concealing the real impact of their the London Treasury, regardless of which sheriff is in policies, particularly in relation to inflation. I hope that charge. Be it the red sheriff or the blue sheriff, the prices the Minister will address that because the retail prices are much the same from London. index is a way in which the public can get a good Iceland has prices that follow the Faroese model. It is measure of what is happening in the economy in respect interesting to note, and probably no coincidence that, of inflation. If we consider current inflation levels, the despite its problems three years ago, Iceland has bounced public are not sure whether they are getting a true back better. Its unemployment is lower than that of the measure. The household budget is mucked around with, United Kingdom and its GDP per capita is higher—Iceland to use an expression, but the real cost cannot be measured. is moving on and putting the past behind it far better I hope the Government will look at that. than the UK. In my constituency, higher fuel costs are In relation to the islands, I know a lot more about bleeding the economy dry. Cornwall. Some years ago, I sat on the Trade and Unlike in Iceland, which is able to move on, we are Industry Committee. We discovered to our surprise that still being bled dry and left in a very weakened state. one of the poorest areas in the country was Cornwall. Higher fuel costs are pulling money from councils, Like the highlands and islands, Cornwall relies on the health boards, the police, the fire service, small businesses, tourist trade, as everybody knows; a lot of its jobs pensioners and families. The hon. Member for Coventry depend on the tourist trade and a lot of them depend on South made that point very well. He also mentioned public transport. That has an impact on public transport rural postal vans. My father used to drive one of those and bus fares. That is bound to affect the poorest areas postal vans. They were certainly a crucible of politics in Britain, whether we are talking about the islands, the when passengers came on from whichever part of the south or the south-west. island of Barra, where I lived when I was younger, and I remember one scheme where the post office used where I still live. postal vans as a method of public transport in order to When I spoke in the House of Commons on 7 February pick people up. There have been cuts in public transport —I went back over Hansard this morning—I said that in the south-west; the frequency of buses, that public Alec MacIntosh at Benbecula airport was haranguing mode of travel, has been reduced drastically. I wonder me about the price of fuel and telling me to sort them what has happened to what we used to call the transport out in London. He said the same thing yesterday morning subsidy. as I boarded the plane from Benbecula to Glasgow. I have covered some of the main points that I thought Fuel in Benbecula is about 10p a litre higher than it was needed emphasis. My hon. Friend the Member for when I spoke in the House of Commons on 7 February Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) has covered the major 2011; it is 19p a litre up on the price it was in Stornoway areas, so it was worth pointing one or two other things last year. Orkney, Shetland and the islands of Argyll are out. The seriousness of the situation has now developed, suffering the same, and Northern Ireland is probably whether we talk about inflation measurements or the suffering the same. impact on ordinary people who have been encouraged That is all the more galling when we think of the oil to take part in what is called the big society. around the islands of Scotland. Shetland, of course, is pumping oil at the moment, as is Orkney. West of the Hebrides, we apparently have 25% of the UK reserve of 11.41 am fossil fuels—$1 million for every man, woman and child in the Hebrides—but we are paying 50p a litre more Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) than the Faroese, who have no proven or found reserves (SNP): I congratulate the hon. Member for Central at all. Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) on securing this important When the Government came to power, they talked debate, a debate that is in my ears every week of the about a rural fuel derogation, and that was welcome. year. I think the hon. Member for Coventry South We are having problems, of course, because the Scottish (Mr Cunningham) used the words, “under the cosh”—and Government do not control this issue and we are left we are certainly under the cosh. with the red sheriff or the blue sheriff in London. The 221WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 222WH previous sheriff played Pontius Pilate to the issues of Mr MacNeil: Yes, I could not agree more. I had a rural fuel. They were not interested in the rural fuel feeling that that was going to be a helpful intervention derogation; spurious and ridiculous reasons came about and indeed it was. As I was saying, I spoke to the why they could not do anything. They sat on their Secretary of State for Scotland in the House and he has hands. There was no fair fuel stabiliser, absolutely no assured me that he will look into the matter of fuel rural fuel derogation, daft excuses and—still dafter—they distribution. I am not sure what progress there has been had no apologies. There is still no apology from the on that. previous Labour Government for their inaction. There is a difficulty between refineries and small This Government came in and their words were like a rural fuel stations, and the habits of the distribution fresh breeze. Being the fair and earnest fellow that I am, companies. They hold retailers very tightly and do not I welcomed their words and their stated intentions. allow them the freedom to shop around and buy their They blamed Europe for the slow progress of the rural fuel from different suppliers. A tanker in a certain area fuel derogation and, being the fair and earnest fellow of the west highlands can move to a port further down that I am, I was minded to believe them and accept and the fuel can be more expensive. It can go into them at their word. Then, of course, the green light another port and it can be cheaper. Batches of fuel, came from Europe. The Government are now in danger within a discharge at a small island port, can have of eclipsing the previous Government in their cynicism. different prices, depending on the amount that is bought. Treasury rules are now so cumbersome that they There is, in my view, predatory parasitical behaviour. I might actually cause small rural fuel stations to go out use those words with some thought. There is parasitical of business. The Government are looking for every behaviour from fuel distribution companies when it device to slow this down when we know that in rural comes to small rural and island areas. France, 10 km from a main population centre, people I am not sure what the Scotland Office is managing to enjoy rural fuel derogations. What is the difficulty? do, but I ask whether the Treasury might look into Please get it into place. I warned the Liberals in parasitical behaviour by fuel distribution companies, February—in the House of Commons, as recorded which are basically leeching off small, vulnerable island in Hansard—that if the rural fuel derogation was not in communities. That has to stop. At £1.50 to £1.57 a litre, place before May, they would suffer at the polls for the there is utter anger at the price people are having to pay, Scottish elections. They did suffer in rural areas and and that in an area where the cost of living is generally they are now known as the “not so famous five” in the higher—often thanks to the Co-op—where the wages Scottish Parliament. are lower and, as I said, where we have the highest fuel There is a good argument, as I think the hon. Member poverty in the United Kingdom. I am making a plea to for Central Ayrshire or the hon. Member for Coventry the Treasury. South said, for fixing fuel across the country, just as the The issue comes around every six months, but it is prices of newspapers are fixed. If we are to have any serious and affects people badly. If the powers were fairness, we will have people across the UK paying the held in Scotland, we would not be coming every six same amount of tax; my constituents, and probably months to talk to the Treasury or the Scotland Office in those in Argyll, Orkney and Shetland, are paying the London, to make a plea about how tough things were in highest tax per litre of any part of the United Kingdom. areas of Scotland. I am aware that other Members want to get in, and Mr Jim Cunningham: Does the hon. Gentleman agree some throats are being cleared around me, so I will leave that one of the best ways to try to sort the problem it at that—I have said my piece. I am more than annoyed, out—it is becoming like a ping pong game between the and I hope that I am not back here in six months political parties—is to have a proper public inquiry into repeating part of my speeches of February 2011 and the price of fuel and fuel hoarding? September 2011. We need the rural fuel derogation to Mr MacNeil: I have some sympathy for what the hon. come soon. Gentleman says, and I will come on to distribution in a second, but we have played the patient game long 11.50 am enough. I think it was Martin Luther King who said that it was not the time for the “tranquilising drug of Graeme Morrice (Livingston) (Lab): I thank my hon. gradualism”. This is a time for action. At £1.50 and Friend the Member for Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) £1.57 a litre, people are hurting and hurting badly. for securing the debate on what is clearly an important issue for all our constituents and the future of our I am aware that I have taken six or seven minutes, economy. All right hon. and hon. Members will have Mr Hancock, and that others want to speak. I would had constituents approaching us and expressing their finally like to mention fuel distribution. I have asked the concerns about the current high cost of fuel. Individual Secretary of State for Scotland, the right hon. Member constituents and local businesses have certainly raised it for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (Michael Moore), with me. about distribution from refineries to retailers, and he has assured me that he is looking into the issue. Fuel costs in West Lothian, where my constituency of Livingston is, are currently almost exactly in line with Jim Shannon: On distribution, I would like to underline the national average: about £1.35 or a little more for a how the issue affects Northern Ireland. The same oil litre of unleaded, and £1.38 a litre for diesel—[Interruption.] that comes into Belfast goes out all over the whole of The hon. Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Mr MacNeil) the province and the prices vary incredibly. Does the confirms that from a sedentary position. hon. Gentleman feel that there is a need to address how High fuel costs form an important element of the oil companies distribute fuel across the whole of Northern general increase in household outgoings currently Ireland and the United Kingdom? experienced by so many families, in many cases coupled 223WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 224WH

[Graeme Morrice] of the West Lothian chamber of commerce, highlighted that point and the importance of getting the cost of fuel with frozen or reduced household incomes. A constituent down for businesses in West Lothian. He said: recently contacted me to describe her own circumstances: “Fuel prices are crippling all types of business. West Lothian is she has not had a pay increase for two years, yet she is a location of choice for many companies because of its access to having to pay an extra £10 to fill up her car with petrol, all of central Scotland. But this means that the effects are even meaning that she must now prioritise her journeys to worse for our Chamber members.” remain within her budget. He urged the Chancellor to take action to reduce the Interestingly, recent AA research found that one in costs but, of course, we know that the 1p cut in fuel four of its members is now in the position of having to duty announced in the Budget was wiped out within restrict the amount spent when refuelling and to prioritise weeks by soaring world oil prices. car use. Alarmingly, that figure rises to 40% among Also speaking before the Budget, in March, the those on lower incomes. Edmund King, the AA’s president, Federation of Small Business’s Scottish policy convener, commented: Andy Willox, said: “Members tell us that driving to work represents the priority “Scotland is suffering disproportionately due to the spiralling use of their car and that other trips have to suffer to make cost at the pumps.” financial ends meet.” With the Institute for Fiscal Studies warning recently Mr MacNeil: The hon. Gentleman has just said that that household budgets are set to be squeezed for a Scotland is suffering disproportionately. Would he prefer decade, it is vital that we get a grip on the issue of fuel those powers to be held by the most democratic forum costs now, so that consumers do not continue to suffer representing Scotland, the Scottish Parliament, or to be misery year after year. controlled by the Tory and Liberal Government here in London? Other constituents have expressed their frustration at being told that they should use public transport when Graeme Morrice: I do not want to get bogged down they live in areas where public transport links are simply in a debate on the constitution or the whole question of inadequate, or the costs are as high as for using their more powers for the Scottish Parliament. I certainly own vehicle. We touched on that earlier in the debate, support the Scotland Bill, which we have been discussing, and I do not want to go into the detail. The impact of and fiscal autonomy for Scotland—but not independence, high fuel costs is also seriously hurting businesses, however, of course. and I want to focus the remainder of my remarks on that aspect of today’s debate. [JIM DOBBIN in the Chair] We have seen some welcome, if limited, respite for The impact has also been felt by retailers, with Asda consumers in the past few weeks, with pump prices in stating last month that its customers were cutting back supermarket forecourts falling in response to a reduction on trips to its stores because of high fuel prices. It in wholesale costs. Even if that is of some small assistance estimated that families have, on average, £9 less disposable to individual consumers, it does little to help businesses income each week compared with this time last year, and, in particular, haulage and transport companies. largely due to increased petrol costs. So there is absolute Speaking about that recent round of price cuts, the agreement about businesses needing more help with Road Haulage Association chief executive, Geoff Dunning, high and rising fuel costs. said: The all-important question is what can be done with “These price cuts can only ever be short term. What is desperately road fuel duties to reduce the pressure on businesses needed and would help everyone would be a reduction in the and individuals and to bring about a halt to spiralling actual rate of fuel duty.” price rises. Fuel duty accounts for more than 60% of the He went on: pump price of petrol and just less than 60% for diesel, “However, January’s planned duty rise, combined with the with VAT on top of that—the highest percentage of proposed August increase will drive up fuel duty by a massive duty in the European Union. While the anger and 10.4%. This will suck more money out of the economy and frustration of individuals at suffering such high duties further undermine efforts to regenerate growth.” are understandable, once again the major concerns that Only last week, the Freight Transport Association business has are also clear. How can we expect businesses revealed research showing that, on average, vehicle operating to compete on a level playing field with European costs for rigid, articulated and drawbar vehicles had competitors when they face such high taxes and duties? risen by 5.6% in the year to 1 July 2011 and that they When the Government increased VAT to 20% in have remained close to record, all-time highs since April January, they contributed to a further hike in fuel costs. this year. The largest contribution to the rise is the 12% It was the wrong tax at the wrong time, hitting families increase for diesel over the same period. The FTA said and businesses hard, just when they were least able to that, while hauliers could ride out the recession by absorb such an increase. I support the calls to look at reducing margins and delaying vehicle replacements, reversing the VAT increase for road fuel. We know it is they continue to feel the pinch and that it is likely that feasible to obtain approval at the EU level for such a some hauliers might not be able to sustain their businesses cut, but the Government refuse to entertain the idea in such circumstances. because it is politically inconvenient for them to do so. That is of particular concern in my Livingston In a debate on motoring fuel costs here in Westminster constituency because of its central position in Scotland, Hall back in June, the hon. Member for Harlow (Robert which makes it a popular location for businesses that Halfon) called for a commitment to no more petrol tax need to transport goods throughout Scotland and often rises in this Parliament. He urged the Government to to other parts of the United Kingdom. Before the consider abolishing even inflationary rises on fuel duty previous Budget, Dave McDougall, the chief executive during the Parliament. Such calls have largely come 225WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 226WH about as a result of the work of Fair Fuel UK, which is simply cannot afford it. I want to allow plenty of time a broadly representative body and is making a strong for the Economic Secretary to reply, so I will not case for reducing fuel costs for both motorists and elaborate further, but people are being hit across the businesses. board. Fuel duty rises and the cost of petrol are obviously How do such calls square with the Government’s a significant element in that. position? In opposition, the Conservatives made much Before the Budget in March, we called on the Chancellor of plans to “slash fuel duty”, as the headlines screamed to review the duty increase, and we welcomed his decision at the time, with their fair fuel stabiliser. The concept of following the example of previous Labour Governments, fuel duty falling when fuel prices go up and rising when who had cancelled or postponed rises in duty when prices fall, seems, on the surface at least, like a winningly circumstances suggested that would be a good idea simple and effective idea. Many of my constituents because fuel prices were putting too harsh a burden on certainly believed so and contacted me about supporting people. We welcomed the 1p cut in duty, but the savings it. However, the Office for Budget Responsibility, the lasted only a short time, and prices at the pump remained Institute for Fiscal Studies and others have raised problems high. According to figures published by the Department with that approach. It remains to be seen whether the of Energy and Climate Change this morning, the price fair fuel stabiliser will deliver what businesses and individual of one litre of petrol has increased over the past seven motorists want. days by 0.38p to 135p and diesel by 0.44p to 139.4p. That makes prices 20p and 22p respectively more expensive Mr Robin Walker (Worcester) (Con): When the Office than in the equivalent week last year. I am sure that for Budget Responsibility looked at the fair fuel stabiliser, some hon. Members in rural constituencies will say that it said that one of its fiscal problems was that the those average prices do not reflect the real prices in benefits to the Government of higher fuel prices were areas that are ill-served by petrol stations. wiped out over time by the harm to the economy. Is that Clearly, the 1p cut has not been sufficient for motorists not evidence for intervention, and for the Government feeling the squeeze. That is partly because the Government to set a lower fuel duty to stimulate the economy? added another 3p to the price of 1 litre of petrol by hiking up VAT in January 2011. Motorists are also Graeme Morrice: The hon. Gentleman makes an facing the prospect of a 3p increase in January 2012, interesting point. I am all for Government intervention and a further increase in August 2012. That comes at a in many walks of life, but I would have thought that time when the Institute for Fiscal Studies is warning reducing VAT would be a good start. My hon. Friend that the coalition’s tax rises and spending cuts will the Member for Central Ayrshire made the interesting squeeze household budgets for the next 10 years, with point that putting VAT on top of the total cost of fuel is families over the past year having suffered the largest a tax on a tax, and the Treasury should look at that. fall in living standards for 30 years. Median net household In summing up, I again thank my hon. Friend for this income is down 3.5%, the consumer prices index stands debate. It will not solve the problem, but I hope that it at 4.4%, and the retail prices index stands at 5%, which will at least provide further food for thought about what is more than double the rate at which earnings are we can do to find a solution to this most thorny of growing. The Office for National Statistics has highlighted problems in the longer term, and eventually to bring that fuel costs are one of the most significant contributors about a settlement that provides relief for hard-pressed to the CPI and are adding indirectly to the cost of our families and businesses. I look forward to the Economic weekly food shopping, because distribution costs rise Secretary’s response. with fuel prices. I need not remind hon. Members that fuel prices 12.1 pm affect not only affect households, but are having a Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab): I congratulate serious impact on businesses, which are already struggling my hon. Friend the Member for Central Ayrshire in a flatlining economy. Only this month, the Freight (Mr Donohoe) on securing this debate. I am aware that Transport Association reported that the high cost of the number of signatures on the e-petition that is doing fuel remains the biggest cause for concern among haulage the rounds calling for a debate on fuel duty is rapidly operators. A survey by the Federation of Small Businesses approaching 100,000. Since joining the shadow Treasury found that its members were most concerned about the team, I have spent much of my time debating fuel duty fuel tax rise in January. It warned that small and medium- with the Economic Secretary. It is indicative of just how sized enterprises would be severely affected. strongly Members of Parliament feel about the matter, I shall move on to what the Government have said and of how much their constituents are affected by high they will do about the problem. Before the election, fuel prices, that we have returned to the issue. It also great play was made of the fair fuel stabiliser. David suggests that the Government’s limited action so far—the Cameron said that he would introduce a mechanism to 1p cut in fuel duty—has not done enough to satisfy ensure that when oil prices went up, prices at the pump people’s concern and its impact on their lives. For would go down and vice versa. That was widely seen to example, my hon. Friend the Member for Central Ayrshire be unworkable, and has been proven by the fact that referred to the impact on a nurse in his constituency. since coming to power the Government have not acted The small increases in the cost of living and the small on it. The stabiliser in the form suggested by the Prime cuts add up. The cost of parking at a hospital may have Minister and the Chancellor has not materialised. Even doubled, and travel to work may cost an extra £100 a the Office for Budget Responsibility said that it would month. Such increases make the difference between make fuel prices less stable rather than more stable. people being able to get by on a modest income and The Treasury then moved to funding the 1p fuel duty being unable to make ends meet. Sometimes they must cut with the windfall tax on the oil companies, which make the tough decision to give up work, because they the Scottish First Minister described as cack-handed. It 227WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 228WH

[Kerry McCarthy] Mr Reid: The hon. Lady has referred to the original consultation proposals, which the Government quickly was introduced almost at the last minute, and the oil changed because of feedback from retailers and the companies that it affected were not consulted. The cash-flow problem that would have occurred. That feature reduced duty is funded by a rise in the supplementary is no longer in the revised proposals, so the issue has charge on oil companies from 20% to 32%. The been solved. Government were then hit by evidence that that would lead to fewer new fields being developed, and greater Kerry McCarthy: I thank the hon. Gentleman for reliance on foreign imports, which are, of course, more that clarification. It seems that the briefings from people expensive. Under pressure, the Treasury announced in lobbying on the issue are slightly out of date. the summer that it would allow companies to offset In conclusion, the Government’s efforts to reduce the some start-up costs against tax, but that only served to burden of high fuel bills on households and businesses show the Government’s muddle on the fuel duty regime. seem to have run out of steam, rather like a car running They float various ideas, but when those ideas are out of petrol. Ministers continually try to ignore the subject to any scrutiny they do not stand up to cross- fact that their VAT rise has had the greatest impact on examination, and the Government have to make policy petrol and diesel prices by adding almost 3p to the price on the hoof. of a litre of petrol and £450 to the average family’s That is partly why we tried to amend the Finance Bill annual bills. As we know, VAT has a disproportionate to require the Chancellor to assess the impact of tax on impact on those who can least afford it, and evidence ring-fenced profits. As I argued at the time, that seemed shows that that is harming the economy. The Treasury to be in line with the Government’s professed commitment is happy to ask the EU for a derogation on fuel duty for to more consultation and greater transparency in tax the remote Scottish islands but, as we have heard today, policy, instead of coming up with measures without people’s budgets all over Scotland and around the UK consulting industry and then having to make U-turns.. are being put under pressure by the cost of petrol and Another measure that the Chief Secretary announced diesel, and the Government refuse to listen. and which seems to be running out of steam is the pilot scheme for the rural fuel duty rebate, which he announced Mr Jim Cunningham: Does my hon. Friend recall last October. He was keen on that when he was in that after the 1997 election, the first thing the Labour opposition, but it seems to be more complicated than Government did was cut VAT on fuel? That helped fuel the Treasury expected. The rebate would allow a discount poverty. of up to 5p a litre on petrol in the inner and outer Hebrides— Kerry McCarthy: I recall that, and there are various Mr MacNeil: There is talk in London of the scheme other examples. Hon. Members are keen for the Minister being complicated, but it need not be. It is happening in to respond so I will not elaborate on that point, but the many places throughout Europe. The only complication fact is that the Government have not even tried to get a seems to be the length of time it is taking to put it in derogation from the EU on fuel prices. Opposition place. Members argue that the rise in VAT earlier this year is having a seriously damaging impact on the economy Kerry McCarthy: At the moment, it is suggested that and, at least in the short term until the economy recovers the scheme will apply to the inner and outer Hebrides, and economic growth returns, that it should be reversed. the northern isles and the Isles of Scilly. The Minister I have posed a number of questions to the Minister, will have to explain, but perhaps the delay is due to the and I look forward to hearing not only a recognition fact that there is considerable pressure from other areas that fuel prices are impacting on families and warm where fuel prices are very high. The hon. Member for words about how the Government appreciate that people Newton Abbot (Anne Marie Morris) is no longer in her are being hit by the cost of fuel, particularly in rural or place, but she made the case for her constituency in the remote areas, but something clear about what the south-west having a similar scheme. Government intend to do. The 1p cut in duty is incredibly People in the Scottish Highlands, where large distances insignificant in the grand scheme of things, and the need to be travelled and the scarcity of retail petrol Government must act because people and businesses stations adds to the cost of petrol, think that they, too, are suffering. It is time for action. should be included in the scheme. Do the Government think that the scheme should be restricted only to the islands, or should it be extended. If the islands are a 12.13 pm particular case, perhaps the Minister will clarify what The Economic Secretary to the Treasury (Justine that is. It is not clear whether the island populations Greening): It is a pleasure to see you in the Chair, would feel any benefit or how the discount could be Mr Dobbin, into which you seamlessly moved during delivered, and there have been warnings that such a the course of the debate. First, let me congratulate the scheme would risk putting petrol stations out of business. hon. Member for Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) on Under the original idea, upfront costs would fall on securing the debate. As the shadow Minister, the hon. retailers who might have to wait two months to be Member for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy) said, the reimbursed by the Treasury. For many small retailers House has had a number of opportunities to debate the that is simply not viable, and if petrol stations in remote pressures that the high cost of petrol puts on individuals, areas are forced to close, motorists will have to travel families and businesses. The Government continue to even further to fill up their tanks. I would appreciate a view the issue as incredibly important, and the hon. response from the Minister about how that could be Member for Central Ayrshire was right to raise it. In avoided if the pilot schemes for rural islands are introduced. the time that remains, I will do my best to respond to 229WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 230WH the points that he raised, and those raised by my hon. how high oil prices flow through to impact on the Friends. I also hope to provide an update on some of economy and try to understand that. As the hon. the questions raised about the rural fuel duty discount. Gentleman pointed out, we were concerned to understand Even though average pump prices fell slightly over the impact on businesses and jobs. That was part of our the summer, there is little doubt that the cost of fuel work in looking at how we could construct a fair fuel remains a difficult issue and concerns many families stabiliser, which I will come to in a moment. and businesses across the country. The Government As part of the Budget, we finally announced our plan have recognised that for some time, and as hon. Members to ease the burden on motorists with a £1.9 billion will know, in the Budget we announced a second rise in package. The Government listened to hard-pressed the personal tax allowance that aimed to take more motorists and businesses and acted. What did we do? people out of income tax altogether. In total, that We acted by cutting fuel duty. The hon. Member for benefited about 23 million or 24 million people who pay Central Ayrshire clearly wants us to go further in cutting the lower rate of tax on their household income. The fuel duty, but he should at least be able to welcome the Government have worked hard to recognise and tackle fact that we have already cut fuel duty by 1p a litre from the cost of living. 6 pm on Budget day. We acted by cancelling the previous There were extensive debates in the House and the Government’s plan for a fuel duty escalator for the rest Finance Bill Committee about the cost of fuel and the of the Parliament. We acted by introducing a fair fuel Government’s plans to support motorists. I welcome stabiliser that will better share the burden of high oil the opportunity to revisit those issues, but before I prices between motorists and oil companies, so fuel address some of the points raised today I want to duty will increase by inflation only when oil prices are explain why the Government acted as they did in the high. Budget, and set out why the approach proposed by the Labour party is not only illegal but unworkable. Perhaps Mr Donohoe: Does the Minister accept that there is a if I explain to the Chamber why I believe that to be the correlation between the duty and the increase in VAT? case, we can put the issue and the alternative proposals Indeed, the cost of the VAT increase to the motorist was to bed once and for all, and perhaps I can save Labour 2.8p a litre. If the Government are to do anything to Members from continuing with the hole they are digging redress the imbalance, it is that amount, not the 1p that in pressing for them, although that is obviously up to she talks of, that should be taken from the price, because them. the consequence of increasing VAT to 20% has been an increase in the price to the motorist of 2.8p. The coalition Government recognise that motoring is an essential part of everyday life for many households Justine Greening: I take the hon. Gentleman’s point. and businesses. The cost of fuel affects us all and the The issue was raised of VAT being applied to the total Government recognise that the rising price of petrol has price of fuel, including fuel duty. For clarification, that become an increasingly significant part of day-to-day is in line with EU rules. That is the reason why that spending. We know that high oil prices are causing real approach is taken. However, I will say two things to the difficulties in trying to ensure that motoring remains hon. Gentleman. First, we have introduced a £1.9 billion affordable, and it is important that when shocks such as package to support motorists. Secondly, I have heard a the steep rise in the price of oil occur, a responsible number of Opposition Members bemoan the increase Government are able to listen, consider and respond. in VAT, but they have had several chances in the Division The hon. Member for Bristol East mentioned the fuel Lobby to vote against that VAT rise and they have not duty escalator. That was introduced in the 2009 Budget taken them. I would be happy for any hon. Member by the previous Government and involved seven increases who voted against the VAT rise to intervene on me now, in fuel duty. The previous Government had planned for but having checked Hansard—[Interruption.] Let me an above-inflation increase at the start of April—that be clear that I am not referring to the Scottish National was the position we inherited, and we had to make a party contribution to this debate, because of course it decision about whether to go ahead with the pre-planned called the vote. I think that both I and the hon. Member rises left by the previous Government. Had we gone for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Mr MacNeil), who represents ahead with those rises, pump prices would, on average, the SNP, would recognise that the Labour party abstained have been 6p per litre higher than they are currently. I in that vote and did nothing, despite its words. It never take on board many of the points raised by the hon. followed them up with action. Those Members owe it to Member for Central Ayrshire about the impact of high their communities to be a little more frank about the petrol prices, but he must recognise that had we done fact that they waved through the VAT increase themselves. nothing, that extra 6p would only have created more pain for motorists and businesses. On top of that—let Graeme Morrice: Who put VAT up to 20% in the first us be clear—the plans that we inherited would have place? introduced further above-inflation increases in duty in 2012, 2013 and 2014. On taking office, we had to come Justine Greening: I did not hear the whole of that up with a plan to support motorists, because the previous intervention. I am sure that if the hon. Gentleman Government did not have one—it was the exact opposite. repeats it, I can respond. From the start, the coalition Government have been actively looking at how we can ease the burden on Graeme Morrice: Who put VAT up to 20% in the first motorists, although that is incredibly challenging given place? the constrained and difficult fiscal situation that we inherited. One of the first things we did, as the hon. Justine Greening: Well, of course, that is one of the Member for Coventry South (Mr Cunningham) mentioned, key measures that we had to put in place—[Interruption.] was ask the Office for Budget Responsibility to look at The hon. Gentleman laughs, but he is— 231WH Road Fuel Duties13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Road Fuel Duties 232WH

Graeme Morrice: You did it. a political issue. I would like to make it into an issue that involves people outside this place. Frankly, if those Justine Greening: I would rather be in my position, in the Labour party had spent less time arguing among voting for things that I believe in, being clear to my themselves, as we now know they were doing, and a constituents and accountable and being part of a little more time moving away from political stunts to Government who are tackling a huge fiscal deficit. I manage the economy responsibly, perhaps the public think it is the worst fiscal deficit handed to any incoming finances in this country would not have been in the mess Government. It is one of the deepest seen in a developed that they were in when they were handed over to us at country. the last election. [Interruption.] An Opposition Member says, “You are in government.” Yes, there’s a good Graeme Morrice: Caused by the banks. reason for that—because the British people had just about had enough of the Labour party being in control Justine Greening: It was not caused by the banks, of the purse strings. I think we all hope that it will be actually. Let me explain to the hon. Gentleman what a an awfully long time before it is given control of the structural deficit is. Even in the good times, the previous purse strings again. [Interruption.] I now want to make Government were spending more money than they were some progress on fuel duty and I particularly want to taking in taxation. That did not have to do with the —[Interruption.] banks. The banks simply dramatically exacerbated that problem. That was what we were talking about when we Jim Dobbin (in the Chair): Order. Could I ask hon. said that the previous Government did not fix the roof Members to behave themselves? when the sun was shining. My point is that there is no point in Opposition Members complaining about the Justine Greening: Thank you, Mr Dobbin. I want to VAT rise when they have not taken the opportunity to make some progress on fuel duty, because that is the key vote against it. I think that most people in Britain concern in our minds today. The issue of hauliers was would think that that was slightly disingenuous. raised. The package that we introduced has meant that hauliers have been able to benefit on average by about Graeme Morrice rose— £1,700 a year.

Justine Greening: I will give way again if the hon. Mr MacNeil: I know that time is getting on—we Gentleman wants to keep digging his hole. meandered down a funny road there. I want to pull the Minister back to two important points. First, when are Graeme Morrice: But we are not in government. we likely to see the rural fuel derogation in place? That When the sun was shining, we built schools and hospitals is very important. Secondly, does the Minister have any and improved public services. We spent the money on sympathy with my point of view that I am tired of the the people’s priorities. The current Government are red and the blue sheriff and I would like to see some of now cutting that. this controlled in Scotland?

Justine Greening: There are many people with schools Justine Greening: We will update the House very in their constituencies—I can certainly think of one in shortly on what is happening with the rural fuel duty mine—that saw none of that investment. Frankly, it is discount. We have made progress with the European easy to spend, spend, spend. That is the Labour party’s Union. That will be good news for the hon. Gentleman. legacy to Britain—a debt that is so high that it is costing It will mean that we can get on with our pilot. I am sure taxpayers £120 million of interest every day. It is always that he very much welcomes that. In terms of other the same. Let us not forget that the other legacy was issues raised by the hon. Member for Argyll and Bute unemployment that was 400,000 higher. (Mr Reid), he will be aware that of course his islands will be part of that pilot. As he pointed out, we have Anas Sarwar rose— within the Treasury met stakeholders—petrol retail associations and of course regional owners and Kerry McCarthy rose— operators—to talk about how we can ensure that any rural fuel duty discount scheme works effectively. I Justine Greening: I will give way to the hon. Gentleman, think that we are making good progress with that. but then I would like to make some progress and talk Clearly, whenever we bring in such a scheme, we must about fuel, because that is clearly the point of the debate. ensure that we understand that it will do what we want However, I am happy to have a debate on the economy, it to do and that it will work in the way that we want it because many people in Britain recognise exactly whose to work. We want it to be of help. We were therefore fault it is that the economy is in the state that it is in keen to sit down and work through some of the issues today—it is the fault of the Labour party. that came up, for example, in relation to cash flow. It is also important to ensure that the scheme is not Anas Sarwar: I give the Minister some credit for administratively over-burdensome. We are making good being able to rewrite history in the way that she has. progress with those discussions. We have made good Can she tell me why the Conservative party supported progress with the EU. Perhaps we will be able to give Labour’s spending plans before the financial crisis? further details of that in coming days. Finally, I want to point out once and for all why it is Justine Greening: You always know that you are simply not possible to go down the route of creating a making progress in an argument, Mr Dobbin, when separate VAT rate for petrol. I am surprised that I still people have to turn back to things that happened decades— hear the Labour party talking about that. We rejected [Interruption.] Opposition Members can make this into that proposal for a number of reasons. One was that it 233WH Road Fuel Duties 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 234WH would take six years—possibly more—to come into Radar Industry effect. The other was that it is illegal, because fuel is standard-rated in terms of VAT, as part of EU rules. If we want to reduce the rate of VAT on fuel, we need a 12.30 pm revision of the VAT directive. In fact, we would have to Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con): Before I have unanimous agreement from all member states, and begin, I thank you for calling me to speak, Mr Dobbin. the European Commission would have to approve. As I I also thank my hon. Friend the Minister for coming to said, it could take six years or more. I say that because discuss the future of radar. I have asked for the debate that is what the French found when they sought a because my attention has been brought to a situation in reduced VAT rate. Just in case that is not enough of my constituency involving BAE Systems and the a problem, the EU has also agreed a moratorium on procurement of radar systems by the Ministry of Defence. revising the VAT directive. That was agreed under the previous Chancellor of the Exchequer. That route is not Since 1940, Britain has been at the forefront of the route to help motorists, whereas the route that we international research and development when it comes took of a £1.9 billion package to support motorists was. to radar. That heritage, along with our experience, knowledge and unsurpassed expertise, is routinely admired by militaries and Governments across the world. BAE Systems has been in the vanguard of the highly specialised radar industry for more than half a century. As the most significant UK company in the field, it is almost singlehandedly responsible for having put us in our current enviable position. At the same time, it has worked tirelessly with the Government, and particularly the MOD, to ensure that the nation is secure from airborne and seaborne threats. Additionally, it has provided skilled employment to a multitude of people and an unsurpassed graduate scheme, and it has generated huge sums for the taxpayer. It is also one of the largest private employers on the Isle of Wight. Globally, the market for radar technology is £5 billion a year, with 20% coming from the US, and the majority of the balance coming from other markets. As a result of our highly regarded skill in the sector, UK radar products are now installed in approximately 100 countries, and the majority of those products are believed still to be in active service. BAE is the primary UK supplier of radar technology to global customers, but international competition is strong from the likes of Lockheed Martin, SELEX, Thales and Raytheon. If developed correctly, the UK has obvious political and economic advantages, which will allow BAE to remain a market leader. On the island, BAE employs 290 people. In its radar business, it employs 510 people across the UK, and it has additional sites in Chelmsford, Portsmouth and Dunfermline. In 2009, an Oxford Economics report on BAE assessed its financial contribution to the UK as being more than £78,000 per full-time employee, which is 85% higher than the national average and 34% higher than in manufacturing in general. In the same year, it was estimated that BAE spent £4.1 billion paying for equipment, components, raw materials, rent, energy and other services from UK suppliers. That meant that for every 10 BAE jobs in the UK, another 12 were created in the supply chain. One example is a company called Pascall Electronics, which is also on the Isle of Wight, and that is just one of many local Isle of Wight suppliers in BAE’s supply chain. Those figures cannot be ignored. The economy and defence of the UK, and the population of the Isle of Wight, simply cannot afford to lose the radar industry. Recently, however, events have conspired to threaten the current situation, and this incredibly specialized and niche manufacturing industry is in danger of being lost. The first reason for that is that a number of large long-running programmes have finally been finished. They have been delivered to the MOD after years of extensive planning, research, development, trials and 235WH Radar Industry13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Radar Industry 236WH

[Mr Andrew Turner] successfully with the last projects, and those before them, including the multi-function electronically scanned testing. The most notable are Sampson, which is in the adaptive radar and advanced radar technology integrated Type 45 destroyers, and the forthcoming Artisan RT997, system testbed programmes. I also fervently hope to which will be in the Type 23 frigates. Sampson has been protect the employment of my constituents, and those universally recognised as a world leader, and Artisan constituents of my colleagues who are also affected by has benefited greatly from the reuse of parts of the the issue. same technology. Consequently, it, too, has been designed I want to make a final point. Radar has defended our to be extremely competitive in the global market. That country definitively at least once, in 1940. It is likely has particular significance because both systems are that it has done so on many other occasions that are not designed and constructed on the Isle of Wight. in the public domain and it is more than likely that it As those contracts with the MOD come to an end, will do so again in the future. I pose this question: is it BAE’s work load in the UK has decreased. There is not essential that the radar technology our military are simply not enough work to sustain such high employment asked to use should be of British origin, in research, and the range of specialist skills required for further design and manufacture? It makes perfect sense to me development. BAE therefore recognises that it must that the company that we use to develop such sensitive focus on its international markets to avoid redundancies. technology should be British-based, like most of its Additionally, the MOD has chosen to take delivery of employees. What would happen if there were to be an an off-the-shelf system from the US company Lockheed incursion into our airspace by a foreign power and the Martin rather than a BAE system to cope with the UK Government did not have the control and flexibility modern problem of offshore wind farms. That was that we enjoy today, because the designs were not done instead of working with BAE to mature a wind British? Many might scoff at that suggestion, and say farm solution that could have been made available that surely it makes no difference which of our allies through its existing radars. makes our radar. It probably does not at the moment, Having made that observation, let me quickly stress when our airspace is not being challenged on a daily that the company appreciates the MOD’s logic in making basis, but none of us knows what will happen in the that particular decision at that particular time, but the future. Why should we take the chance when there is a side effect has been to create genuine concern. If the world-class company specializing in the area in question, MOD is planning further purchases of off-the-shelf native to our country? Why would we even think about products from the US or any other foreign supplier, and taking the risk? That would not only be imprudent, but BAE so much as appears to fall out of favour with the would smack of recklessness. MOD, its opportunities for export business will be No one is asking the Government to help one company adversely hit. The reason for that is that when potential over another, to provide subsidy or even to point fingers clients abroad look at BAE products, they judge their and lay blame about previous decisions that have affected worth by the standards of the UK. Has the MOD a company’s reputation. By continuing to ignore those bought these products? Does it endorse them? Should companies in the UK that add genuine value to the the MOD cease to work in partnership with BAE, it will economy, that are recognised world-class providers of indirectly, and probably irreparably, damage the company’s technological solutions, that carry the British brand credibility in foreign markets. globally, that employ large numbers of people and, in the case of BAE Systems, are integral to the very Should global sales in BAE start to diminish, it is defence of the United Kingdom, we will end up cutting likely to do what companies do when sales decrease—make off our nose to spite our face. employees redundant. Should it then go as far as deciding to cease work on radar, the MOD will simply lose the only technical experts in the field of radar in the UK. 12.43 pm The inevitable outcome will be a huge increase in the The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence costs of through-life care for the MOD’S current radar (Peter Luff): I begin in the customary way, but entirely fleet, because it will have to pay a foreign company to sincerely, by congratulating my hon. Friend the Member keep it running. for Isle of Wight (Mr Turner) on securing the debate. I The possibility that a company might lose international am always impressed by the diligent way my hon. Friend credibility and have to lay off staff is not a reason in represents his constituents’ interests, and I hope to itself for the MOD to purchase equipment from any encourage him by showing that there is a significant defence company, let alone BAE. Indeed, BAE is not amount of work for British radar companies both here asking for handouts, subsidies or guarantees of sales at and overseas. some point in the future—far from it. It recognises that I hope that my hon. Friend will forgive me for saying having just come to the end of some very long-term that he gave a rather half-empty view of the radar world programmes, the MOD has no need to buy further and the future of the British industry. I hope to persuade equipment. It accepts that there will be a competition him that the glass is comfortably more than half full. for the replacement of the rest of the air defence system The future of the British radar industry is an important in 2017, and it is confident that its entry into Project topic and I am pleased to be able to share with the Vigilance will be of the highest standard. However, it House all the good work in which the Government are feels a firm appreciation of the relevant issues by the involved, in support of that industry. My hon. Friend MOD is vital for the protection of the UK radar will understand that success has many fathers and failure industry’s future. The most cost-effective method of is an orphan, and in that spirit I offer the thought that, developing the next generation of radar defence for the as a Worcestershire Member, I look towards Malvern’s UK is by defining a cohesive and credible long-term proud role in the development of British radar systems; partnership with the MOD. That was demonstrated I take a close interest in the development of radar. 237WH Radar Industry13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Radar Industry 238WH

The defence and security of our nation and people is network will be made up of a foreign fleet in the future. the primary responsibility of Government, and defence I am assured that UK industry is developing a wind is, as will be appreciated, my primary interest. There is a farm-tolerant air defence radar, and I welcome that. vital requirement for the detection of airborne assets There are many radars in service with our armed entering and travelling through UK airspace, as my forces, Some examples are long-range air defence sensors, hon. Friend emphasised in his excellent speech. Radar medium-range air defence systems, Type 45 air defence is the primary tool used for such detection, whether for sensors—my hon. Friend referred to the Type 45 during the tracking of co-operating civil aircraft or the detection his speech—and air traffic control sensors, many provided and engagement of potentially hostile aircraft. UK by UK companies, including BAE Systems. In the long- companies such as BAE Systems, SELEX and Thales range sector, UK BAE Systems produces the Type 101 supply many of the radars that we rely on for that and 102 radars used in support of the defence of the critical role. I want to emphasise that: I regard SELEX UK. In air traffic control there is UK involvement in and Thales as British companies, and later this afternoon the Watchman radar—again with BAE. I will receive a delegation from colleagues in the House, making the case for SELEX, and will be visiting its However, it is in ensuring the future capability and excellent offices in Edinburgh on Monday to see its radar reach of the Royal Navy that UK companies stand out. work. However, my hon. Friend is right to recognise the I am happy to endorse what my hon. Friend said about proud record of BAE Systems as well. the Sampson multi-function radar fitted to our newest class of destroyers, the Type 45, which, incidentally, is Our armed forces operate across the world—not just supported by MBDA UK and BAE Mission Systems. I in Afghanistan and Libya, but also in our permanent want to make the point that support is extremely important. bases overseas such as the Falkland islands. Accordingly, My hon. Friend should not concentrate only on radar technologies sourced from British companies are manufacture, although I understand its importance for deployed by our armed forces around the world so we his constituency. The supporting of radars is also hugely recognise the importance of radars across a range of important, and it brings many important jobs. It is an military systems. They are a critical element of our air important skill for the UK. defence capability, supporting operations on land and Also in the Type 45 class of ship there is the Thales sea and in the air. Recent operations over Libya have long-range radar, which is supported by BAE Mission clearly demonstrated the effectiveness of commanding Systems, and the Royal Navy’s next generation of radar the air domain. Radars are required for combat systems capability, the UK company BAE Mission Systems working alongside our complex weapons from ships, radar—the RT997. The contribution to the Royal Navy’s submarines and aircraft as well as troops on the ground, current capabilities by UK companies is evidenced by so our ability to sustain and develop those systems, the BAE mission systems radar 909, fitted to Type 42 including our ability to respond rapidly to emerging destroyers and mainly supported by the same British and evolving threats, is essential to our operational companies. There is also the RT996, which is fitted to effectiveness. On that point, there is nothing between many ships throughout the fleet, including Type 23 my hon. Friend and me. frigates and destroyers, amphibious support ships and I am glad to reassure my hon. Friend that the UK’s Illustrious, for which in-service support is provided industrial capability is critical to meeting the vital defence through an award-winning long-term contract with a requirement that I have outlined. Indeed, we are currently UK company. There is no shortage of business here, working with BAE Systems and other UK industrial especially for UK companies. players, together with our scientists in the Defence Science and Technology Laboratory, better to understand Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con): I thank the issues and to share our thinking regarding the the Minister for giving way. Does he agree that, when evolving requirements—and they can evolve quite fast. deciding whether to buy in the UK or from overseas That is very much in the spirit set out in last year’s and where to invest in research and development, we Green Paper on technology, equipment and support. should be thinking about the export market, about how We enjoy a close and productive working relationship many can be built over a particular cycle, and about with our radar suppliers and look forward to maintaining whether the technology is genuinely innovative? The that in the years ahead, so I was slightly disappointed examples that he gives fit into all three categories. by the way my hon. Friend characterised our relationship. I hope that BAE Systems feels that it has a constructive Peter Luff: I agree with my hon. Friend. I hope to relationship with us. talk later about exports and our export ability, an On my hon. Friend’s points on air defence radars and important part of the future of the UK’s radar industry. wind farms, I must stress that the provision of up to One of the major changes that we seek to achieve three proven wind farm-tolerant radars by the wind through our acquisition strategy—not only in radar but farm developers, removing the objections of the Ministry across the board—is to ensure that the exportability of of Defence to those wind farms and releasing significant a product developed for UK purposes is considered renewable energy potential, is seen across Government early in the life-cycle and acquisition process. When as very encouraging. My ministerial colleagues have investing in capability for the British armed forces, we worked hard to achieve that. Indeed, the Secretary of should develop a capability that has a ready export State for Energy and Climate Change has acknowledged market. My hon. Friend is right to emphasise that that work, which has been achieved by co-operating point, and I shall return to it later. across Government, and with industry, to reach an I turn next to a future capability referred to by my outcome that is beneficial to our national security, hon. Friend the Member for Isle of Wight. Project energy security and decarbonisation goals. Furthermore, Vigilance will provide an upgrade to existing air defence it is not the case that the UK’s air defence radar radar systems, with the opportunity for industry to 239WH Radar Industry13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Radar Industry 240WH

[Peter Luff] There is more good news, this time on the naval side. I have already highlighted some of the support that the compete for those elements of the air defence radar Royal Navy receives for radars from UK companies. system that need replacement. The project is still in its Five types of primary and secondary navigation radars early days, and its exact scope and requirements are still are fitted to Royal Navy surface warships and submarines. being decided. I recognise the excellent support that a range of radar Project Vigilance is currently planned to sustain the contractors have provided over recent years in maintaining long-range surveillance and air defence capabilities the primary and secondary navigation systems used by currently provided by the T101 and T92 radars, which the Royal Navy. allow United Kingdom air surveillance and control As for the future, the navigation and situational system force command and chief of joint operations to awareness radar is planned to replace 1007, which is detect, track, identify, monitor and, if necessary, take fitted to most Royal Naval vessels; it is being designed action against objects flying within, approaching or to provide primary navigation and sustained situational adjacent to UK and Falkland Islands airspace. Work to awareness on surface warships. The project is in its develop the strategy is under way. assessment phase and, against current plans, the radar system is due to enter service in 2016. Given the current financial climate, taking an incremental approach to Project Vigilance will ensure that existing I turn next to the air sector. I bear in mind what my sensors are utilised to full effect, that the whole air hon. Friend the Member for Portsmouth North (Penny defence network is coherent and that each reaps maximum Mordaunt) said about export ability. Our highly capable benefit from other interlinked projects. That applies not Typhoon aircraft have long been served by the mechanically only to MOD projects, but to other Departments’initiatives scanned, or m-scan, Captor radar, which is produced by and requirements, including the need, whenever possible, the four partner nations on the Typhoon project. However, to enable the use of renewable energy; I say “whenever” as the defence environment evolves, no matter how to emphasise the great importance that we attach to good those mechanically scanned radars are, they are that. having to be replaced by electronically scanned, or e-scan, radars, which provide increased detection and Surveillance data is not limited to military air defence agility against a wider range of targets and a less easily radars; information comes from a multitude of sources countered capability. that includes military and civilian air traffic management radars, and links to NATO air defence sites and tactical In partnership with our Typhoon partners and industry, data link from air, surface and land platforms. Again, we are developing an e-scan solution that will further industry has been and will be invited to compete in enhance Typhoon’s capabilities well into the 21st century. these and other projects. Industry has played, and continues to play a full, active role in achieving the optimum solution on e-scan. Not Moreover, the utilisation of a plethora of data sources only will e-scan result in a capability leap for the UK provides not only resilience, but allows defence to optimise Typhoon fleet but it will further the chances of success the air defence radar footprint to ensure that an appropriate for Typhoon in the highly competitive fast-jet export level of redundancy is met. We must have the capacity market, where e-scan is a key discriminator for many to ensure that we can carry on doing what we need to do export customers. For example, the Indian Government in adverse circumstances. It is on this foundation that order depends on the development of the e-scan radar, the air command and control strategy is being developed, and we attach great importance to winning it, as it will but we recognise the need to ensure that value for represent a lot of business for UK industry—and not money is obtained from the Project Vigilance procurement only in radar but across the aerospace sector. strategy, as my hon. Friend would wish. We must not forget exports. There are significant There is also good news on another radar project. opportunities to supply civil radar, for airports and air Project Marshall is a large and wide-ranging project for traffic control services throughout the UK. There will the provision of terminal air traffic management, essentially be an increasing demand for solutions that can mitigate the provision of air traffic services to military and civil against interference from wind farms. There are also aircraft operating in and out of Government aerodromes. increasing opportunities overseas, driven by airport Air traffic control services are currently provided to expansion and upgrades in markets such as Brazil, 70 MOD-owned airfields and air weapons ranges through Russia, India, China and the middle east. UK strengths the use of a wide range of equipment located on more in civil radar and air traffic control solutions, which than 100 locations in the UK and overseas. my hon. Friend the Member for Isle of Wight rightly Project Marshall has four key objectives. The first is emphasised, mean that we are well placed to make the to ensure a safe and enduring terminal air traffic most of these prospects—but in a responsible manner, management capability; the second is to address current consistent with the UK’s export controls. UKTI can issues of equipment obsolescence through a programme help UK companies sell overseas through a range of of capital investment; the third is to address current support, including trade missions, overseas exhibitions regulation changes and make provision for emergent and inward buying missions. I encourage UK industry regulatory issues; the final one is to rationalise arrangements to make the most of these opportunities. Although I in order to benefit from associated efficiencies and suspect that BAE systems needs no such encouragement, savings. This transformation project will ensure that I encourage it none the less. military air traffic control services continue to be operated The defence and security equipment international in a safe manner, while complying with relevant legislation. exhibition takes place in docklands this week, and it The new services are planned to commence in 2014, and will showcase UK industry on the world stage. My several UK companies are involved in the ongoing ministerial colleagues and I will use that event to meet a competition. large number of overseas Government delegations; high 241WH Radar Industry 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 242WH on the agenda, if not at the top, will be defence exports Gaza (Aid) and the scope for the UK to engage in greater industrial partnerships across the globe. There are a number of attractive export prospects for UK radar systems, from 12.58 pm a range of British companies, including those companies that I mentioned at the outset. It is a diverse sector. For Michael Connarty (Linlithgow and East Falkirk) (Lab): example, UKTI DSO is already actively supporting I gave you a note, Mr Dobbin, to say that we may be BAE Systems with a campaign in Qatar. joined by others who have recently been on a trip to In summary, I assure my hon. Friend and the House Gaza. Should they make it here—they are currently in that we remain committed to supporting the future of other Committees—they would like to speak in this the radar industry. To me, the future of the industry debate, rather than just intervene. If the Minister agrees, looks exceptionally bright. My hon. Friend has every I should like to end my contribution early so that they reason to be confident about it, and about the future of can tell us about the recent events that they have seen his constituents. with their own eyes.

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for International Development (Mr Stephen O’Brien): Iam grateful that I have been given that notice. It is fine for those Members to speak, provided that we keep roughly to the same split of time.

Michael Connarty: Mr Dobbin, it is my intention to give the Minister adequate time to speak. Having been to Gaza on five occasions, I feel that I should say a word about the people there. I was lucky enough to be a monitor at the first democratic elections in Gaza city. At all times, the people were unbelievably welcoming, friendly and tremendously supportive and I was much buoyed up by my meetings with them. On my last visit, we went to Beach camp. I was very ill—an allergy that I suffer from kicked in while I was there—and I found the people to be unbelievably hospitable and caring. They looked after me very well. I have nothing but the highest regard for them; they were kindness incarnate. It is those people whom I want to talk about in this debate. First, though, I must talk about the context in which such recent visits have taken place. Deep concerns have been expressed, and continue to be expressed, about the impositions placed on the people of Gaza and the humanitarian effects of them. In the second democratic election, the people of Gaza chose to elect a Hamas majority Government. Since then, there have been tremendous controversies. I join others in condemning not only the inability of that Government to stop the firing of rockets into the Israeli territories and households, but the unbelievable excessive force used in retaliation by the Israeli Government, which has killed more than 1,000 people and destroyed many of the basic facilities required for humanitarian reasons. There has been strong condemnation from the Turkish Government over the killing of nine Turkish citizens on the aid flotillas. They have now said that they will defend the flotillas taking humanitarian aid to Gaza if they are carrying Turkish citizens. The problem has been caused by Israel’s appalling blockade of Gaza. Access to the Gaza strip remains severely restricted. Only the Kerem Shalom crossing is functioning, although it has recently been subject to Palestinian industrial action, which is in protest at the recent closure of the Kami crossing. The Gisha Legal Center for the Freedom of Movement notes that Kerem Shalom can accommodate 250 trucks per day in both directions, compared with 1,000 trucks in both directions at Kami, so that is clearly severely restricting the amount of aid going into Gaza. 243WH Gaza (Aid)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Gaza (Aid) 244WH

[Michael Connarty] If we look at what has happened on the west bank, and such things have been well recorded, we see that the In September 2009, the IMF directly attributed the people have to manage in very straitened circumstances, continuing restrictions on access to Gaza as a prime especially given the Israeli Government’s attitude to reason for the continued high unemployment rate, low land, roads and water. Even in the west bank, the growth and high inflation. Gaza could reach growth people live under a penal regime. In Gaza, there is an rates of 7 to 8% if the economic blockade were lifted. attempt to starve out and harm the ordinary people in As for the children of Gaza, one in three is anaemic and retaliation for what is the unacceptable use of rockets. one in 10 is malnourished. The Food and Agriculture Everyone recognises that Israel has used disproportionate Organisation of the UN classes 61% of Gazans as force. We cannot just blame Hamas. The circumstances “food insecure” and the United Nations Relief and are set by the occupying nation, which is Israel. That Works Agency reports that 80% of Gazans rely on may change shortly, because there will be an attempt in some form of aid. the UN to recognise the nation of Palestine as a state. A report published in January 2011 on the website of Hopefully, that will change the attitude of the people in the Norwegian newspaper Aftenposten, which has access the UN—perhaps not in the Security Council. It will to documents obtained by Wikileaks, makes it quite help Hamas and Fatah to try to create one non-violent clear that the Israeli Government are determined to approach to unity and to statehood. starve the economy of Gaza to bring it to the point of Let me turn now to the situation that our colleagues collapse. If people cannot sustain their own economy, found when they visited Gaza in July. The blockade the need for aid grows and grows, and that is a strategy clearly aims to cause great harm to the people’s ability that the Israeli Government are clearly using. That is to generate income and run their own economy. The wholly unacceptable. effects of denying them the supplies that they require to The report said that a shortage of Israeli shekels in function were quite stark. My hon. Friend the Member Gaza has continued to be an issue. Last July, Tony Blair, for Kilmarnock and Loudoun said that it took them speaking in his role as representative in the middle east, three hours to get into the occupied territories. Some of said that he welcomed the Palestinians who were waiting at the crossing to get through had been waiting for days. “Israel’s decision to allow the entry of 50 million shekels into Gaza as well as the exchange of 31.5 million shekels of spoiled The imposition was deliberately put in by the banknotes”. Government. On a positive note, my hon. Friend said The pressure is on Israel. This is about not just starving that when she spoke to women’s groups, voluntary people of basic materials that the international community organisations, small businesses and trade unions, she would give them or that people would be able to trade, found a tremendous sense of activity within the community but trying to break the economy in retaliation for to overcome the burden placed on them. The people are people exercising their democratic right, which we are not lying down with their hand out waiting for someone always espousing, to choose a different Government. to come to their aid; they are a very determined people who are attempting to live under these terrible conditions Let me put on the record the names of all those and to do their best. Members who went on the visit in July 2011. They are None the less, the reality is that the people cannot my hon. Friends the Members for Manchester Central generate much of their own wealth—50% of factories (Tony Lloyd), for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Sandra were destroyed in the Israeli war in 2008-09. The numbers Osborne), for Kilmarnock and Loudoun (Cathy Jamieson), of employed fell from 135,000 to 15,000; that is a and for Edinburgh South (Ian Murray), and Lord Warner. massive drop that impacts on their ability to generate Before I quote from their reports, I also want to put it income. As a result, inferior, illegally imported goods on the record that the right hon. Member for Rutland are coming through, which create safety problems. They and Melton (Mr Duncan) was the first Minister to visit are not of the right quality.Raw materials for manufacturing Gaza in the last decade. I hope that the Under-Secretary are difficult to source, so the Palestinian people’s ability of State will follow that example and go to Gaza to to save their own economic life is minimal. meet the people. Another problem that has always existed in Palestinian communities is the difficulty of sourcing adequate water. Guto Bebb (Aberconwy) (Con): The difference between The hon. Member for Aberconwy (Guto Bebb) compared Israel’s attitudes to the Gaza strip and the west bank Gaza with the west bank. There is a water problem in might be because it faces more of a threat from the the west bank, but the water problem in Gaza is probably Gaza strip. As for the recent visit to the west bank, my more extreme. Even when I was last in Gaza, before the understanding is that the economic growth in that part latest problem caused by the reaction to the election of of the Palestinian authority is about 12% per annum. Hamas, most of the main water sources had been Clearly, the message is that if the Palestinians can diverted to Israeli settlements outside Gaza. restrain the violence being shown by Hamas in Gaza, That has always been a problem, because the Israeli economic growth in Gaza might be much greater. wells are sunk much deeper than the Israelis allow the Palestinians to sink their wells, so the Israeli wells soak Michael Connarty: Even when I have visited some of up water from the aquifers. The Coastal Municipalities the worst regimes, I have always been impressed by the Water Utility organisation in Gaza has said that, because tremendous entrepreneurial ability of the people of the of the reduction in the flow of the water, the amount of Palestinian nation and their tremendous thirst for nitrates and the level of chlorine contamination are knowledge and high skills. We see them all around the now rising very fast in the water sources that the Palestinian world. We have quite a number in Scotland who contribute people have to use. Even when I was last in Gaza, which to our economy. is some time ago now, doctors told me that children 245WH Gaza (Aid)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Gaza (Aid) 246WH were beginning to show signs of diseases that had not settlement going to stop?” There is a widespread feeling been prevalent among the Palestinian people for quite that the Israeli Government do not want to have a some time, and children are the ones who are harmed negotiated settlement that would give the Palestinians by using contaminated water. an equal and adequate life, and it is quite clear that we Another thing that caused me great distress when I are condoning and colluding in the situation in Gaza. was last in Gaza was the fact that people were not being We did not like the result of a democratic election and allowed to dump their rubbish by taking it away to we have not done enough to try to move from that somewhere safe; often they had to dump it within the viewpoint, to a situation where that election result is not limits of their cities and communities. That meant that, seen as a threat but as something that should be absorbed when it rained, material from the rubbish leached down into the discussions about what happens in Palestine. into the aquifers and was then absorbed back into the In all the years since I last visited Gaza, and in the bodies of the people using water from the aquifers. time since the British delegation visited Gaza recently, Because of the inability to generate enough electricity, there seems to have been very little movement, except the people in Gaza now have problems keeping even the perhaps for a backward movement in the conditions of basic facilities running in their hospitals. One of the the people there. That is a great tragedy and, to be quite hospitals in Gaza city is mostly comprised of wards that frank, in the past it has been a cause of great shame for were built with donations from the families of returning my party when we were in government; we should have or deceased soldiers from the first world war. Many dealt with that situation if we were in any way humanitarian soldiers recuperated in Gaza city after the terrible Gallipoli and democratic socialists. campaign and many of the wards in that hospital have Now the challenge lies with this Government, without plaques on the walls to show that they were built by the regard to party. I hope that they make the choice to British. change their position so that they support UN recognition of the state of Palestine. But if they cannot do that, I To keep those wards running is very important. However, hope that they will do something to argue very strongly the recent British delegation visited Al Shifa hospital in for, and win through the UN, a situation whereby it is Gaza city and the members of the delegation were told accepted that it is wrong for Israel to do what it is doing that kidney dialysis machines have to be disconnected in preventing humanitarian aid and other basic aid from patients every time the power goes out, meaning from being taken to the people of Gaza by whichever that the blood has to be cleaned and the dialysis process route people choose to take it. has to be restarted every time the power goes out. Dialysis has to be done twice, which is a great imposition on kidney patients. 1.15 pm There is also a major problem in trying to source Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): Thank you legitimate building materials, because of the argument very much, Mr Dobbin, for calling me to speak. I will put forward by the Israeli Government that certain be very brief and I am grateful to my hon. Friend the things, including basic building materials, have dual use Member for Linlithgow and East Falkirk (Michael and therefore should be denied to the people of Palestine. Connarty) for giving me a few moments to say something. That argument does not make any sense. For example, I have visited Gaza on quite a number of occasions radiotherapy drugs for cancer patients are banned, because and every time I have come away even more depressed Israel says—for some reason—that they are a dual use than I was at the end of the previous visit. There was a product. I am not quite sure how to extract the small sort of high point post-Oslo in the late 1990s, when amount of radioactivity from radiotherapy drugs and there was an airport ready to function, there were water how it could be used for anything other than medical supply systems, drainage systems were in operation, purposes. forests were being planted, trees were growing, agriculture I know, Mr Dobbin, that you come from a medical was developing, and there was a high level of employment research background and so you will know that a small and a real sense of optimism and hope. amount of radioactive material, with a very low level of I then went to Gaza in 2005 as an election observer. I radioactivity, is generated by every hospital in the country. have vivid memories of Israeli border guards at the I do not see anyone saying that we need to rush around Rafah crossing deciding to shoot into the town of and put that material in a high security facility, so the Rafah on polling day. Why did they do that, other than Israeli attitude is nonsense and an imposition on patients. to intimidate those people who were trying to cast their Doctors who spoke to the British delegation that votes legitimately and democratically in that election? I visited Gaza recently estimated that in the past year was not particularly surprised at the result of that 500 Palestinians have died simply because of a lack of election. Along with many others, I confirmed that it medication; Gazans are simply not being allowed to was peacefully carried out and democratically conducted import medication in adequate quantities. Children and and that there was no intimidation of voters. So we cancer patients are most at risk, as they are denied the must recognise what has gone on in Gaza; the situation treatment they need. For example, we met a young boy there is very serious. with a sickle cell anaemia problem. In this country, we On a subsequent visit, I discovered the number of would regard any child who had that problem as being a people suffering from mental illnesses and from wholly priority, but that child in Gaza was denied drugs to deal preventable conditions, because of polluted water supplies with that terrible disease. Providing those drugs is what and everything else, which indicates that we are dealing humanitarian aid is about. not with a natural tragedy but a human tragedy, of We must ask the Minister, “When will the warm human proportions, created by the blockade, the words and the talking stop? When is all this nonsense bombardment, Operation Cast Lead and the constriction about it being all right when we have a negotiated of supplies. Under the Mubarak regime in Egypt, the 247WH Gaza (Aid)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Gaza (Aid) 248WH

[Jeremy Corbyn] Government to ensure that everything is done to avoid further civilian causalities. The announcement of the Rafah crossing was opened and closed at various times. current ceasefire is welcome, and it is vital that both Now it is open most of the time and it is the only way sides now show restraint and seek to reduce the tensions. that sufficient supplies can get into Gaza, because the Like the hon. Members for Linlithgow and East Falkirk Israeli blockade continues. and for Islington North, I have been to the region, In the short time left to me, I want to make a plea to although not to Gaza itself—that was the Under-Secretary the Minister. I plead with him to understand that the of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, my people of Gaza—1.5 million people—are in prison. I hon. Friend the Member for North East Bedfordshire plead with him to try to understand what it is like to be (Alistair Burt)—but in the southern Israel area the a young person growing up in Gaza, knowing that it is problems are real and continuing. only possible to watch the world through television and Israel retains obligations under international law as computers and that it is only possible to listen to the an occupying power. It controls the majority of Gaza’s world through radio, because the chances of travel are borders, and sea and air space and, as such, has primary limited, job opportunities are limited and aspirations responsibility for facilitating humanitarian access to are limited. Education in Gaza is often very good; there Gaza. We welcomed the changes to the Gaza access are very many graduates and people with other educational regime announced in June 2010, and the subsequent qualifications in Gaza. That is what breeds the anger package of measures agreed by Quartet representative and all the problems that I have just outlined. Blair and Prime Minister Netanyahu on 4 February this The pressure must be put on to lift the blockade of year. However, recent UN reports show that the measures Gaza, to recognise the legitimate rights of the people of have not brought any fundamental change to Gaza, Palestine, and, above all, to get aid to Gaza as quickly with food insecurity remaining high and economic as possible, to deal with what is a developing human opportunities scarce. tragedy of undernourishment and medical problems, Much more needs to be done to ease restrictions on including mental health problems, caused by the blockade. exports, construction material imports and the movement Anything that the Government can do in that respect of people. Israel’s commitments on exports that were would be very much appreciated and I appreciate the agreed with the Quartet representative in February 2011 short time that I have had today to contribute to this have not yet been met. Increases in imports since June debate. I also congratulate my hon. Friend on his mainly relate to consumer goods, with the number of contribution. trucks entering still being only one third of what it was pre-blockade. We understand Israel’s security concerns, 1.18 pm but the current access regime imposed by Israel has the The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for perverse effect of fostering radicalisation and empowering International Development (Mr Stephen O’Brien): Thank Hamas, while punishing the ordinary people of Gaza. you very much indeed, Mr Dobbin, for calling me to Economic restrictions have not brought political change speak. I congratulate the hon. Member for Linlithgow or degraded the military capability of Hamas. On the and East Falkirk (Michael Connarty) on securing this contrary, legitimate business is being strangled while very important debate and I thank him for doing so. Hamas allies are strengthened. Isolation and growing Let me begin by stating very clearly that the humanitarian frustration at the lack of economic opportunities make situation in Gaza is unacceptable and unsustainable. In extremism more attractive, a point ably highlighted by Gaza, 66% of the people are dependent on food aid; my hon. Friend the Member for Aberconwy (Guto 90% of mains water is unfit to drink, the consequences Bebb) in his intervention. An improved economy and a of which were particularly noted by the hon. Member for resurgence of Gaza’s business sector are not only essential Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn), who has just contributed for the people of Gaza, but firmly in Israel’s security to the debate; and, despite the fact that schools are interests. running on double or triple shifts, 40,000 children have The vast majority of goods entering Gaza come not no school place. Gaza’s economy is depressed and through the official crossings but through the vast network aid-dependent. There has been strong growth recently, of tunnels between Egypt and Gaza. Hamas controls but from a very low base. GDP per capita remains the tunnels and imposes taxes on goods passing through 40% below 1994 levels. At 37%, the unemployment level them, the money raised forming a large part of their is among the highest in the world, and 38% of Gazans revenue base. As a result of the blockade, UN and live in poverty. It is deeply troubling that Gaza, which non-governmental organisation projects confront constant should have a thriving economy, is currently one of the difficulties in gaining access and in importing construction highest per capita recipients of aid funding in the world. materials, which means that projects designed to help We believe that the actions of both Israel and Hamas the most vulnerable people are blocked, delayed or have contributed to the current situation in Gaza. Between made more expensive. Meanwhile, 30 times more cement 18 and 21 August this year, we witnessed, once again, an and 10 times more steel comes in through the Hamas- alarming escalation of violence: a terrorist attack in controlled tunnels than through the crossings. southern Israel, more than 100 rockets and mortars Jeremy Corbyn: I hope that the Minister has the launched from the Gaza strip at Israeli civilians, and opportunity to visit Gaza at some point. I welcome retaliatory strikes by the Israeli air force against targets what he says, but does he not acknowledge that the in Gaza. Nine Israelis were killed during the rocket tunnels are a product of the blockade? Without the attacks, and many more were injured. blockade there would be no point in the tunnels, and We strongly condemn the appalling violence. In Gaza, there certainly would be no economic advantage in at least 15 people have been reported killed, including having them. The blockade must be lifted; that is the three children, and 44 injured. We have urged the Israeli crucial issue. 249WH Gaza (Aid)13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Gaza (Aid) 250WH

Mr O’Brien: I certainly recognise that it is difficult to jobs for more than 1,800 unemployed Gazans. We also envisage how the tunnels might have come into being provide food vouchers to 5,750 poor households through but for there being a difficulty in getting goods to move, our support to the World Food Programme, enabling so I fully understand the hon. Gentleman’s point. them to purchase the basic food items, such as bread The United Nations Relief and Works Agency reports and milk, that they need to survive. We help 24 UN that at the current approval rate for reconstruction agencies and 132 international NGOs to get aid and projects, it will take 78 years to rebuild Gaza. Only goods into Gaza through our support to the UN Access 28% of its work programme for Gaza has been approved Coordination Unit and the Palestinian Authority’s crossing by Israel, and only half of the materials needed for co-ordination committee. approved projects have entered into Gaza. UNRWA We understand Israel’s security concerns, but for a wants to build 100 schools, but at the moment has peace settlement to work any future Palestinian state permission for only 42. The UNRWA schools are vital, must be economically viable. because they teach the lessons of the holocaust and of the universal declaration of human rights. If a child Michael Connarty: Will the Government take up with cannot get a place at an UNRWA school, he or she some priority the matter of much-needed medical drugs, might end up unable to go to school at all, or might particularly for the treatment of cancer? It is ridiculous attend a school with a curriculum approved by Hamas to deny people cancer-treatment drugs because of the or another extremist group. dual-use nonsense. What is the UK doing? We continue to press the Israeli Government bilaterally to ease the movement Mr O’Brien: I am happy to undertake that we will and access restrictions. We have consistently lobbied the look into that, to see what the situation is and what can Israeli Government at ministerial and official level, in be done, not least because of the commitments that I close co-ordination with the office of the Quartet have just listed, particularly our help in ensuring that representative and European Union partners. The there are supplies for assisting with medical needs—not Department for International Development supports just in emergencies, but for ongoing health requirements. the UN Access Coordination Unit to work with the In the last couple of minutes of the debate, I shall United Nations, Israel, the Palestinian Authority and touch on the broader process. We in the UK hope that aid agencies to facilitate the transfer of vital humanitarian the reconciliation agreement between Fatah and Hamas assistance, including medical equipment and supplies, announced in May this year will lead to the formation in and out of Gaza. DFID has also contributed to a of a Government who reject violence and pursue a greater international understanding of the situation in negotiated peace. We will judge any future Palestinian Gaza and the impact of the blockade. Earlier this year, Government by their actions and their readiness to DFID-funded reports by the World Food Programme work for peace. and the UN Office for the Co-ordination of Humanitarian It is clear that negotiations towards a two-state solution Affairs provided detailed and impartial analysis of the are the only way to meet the national aspirations of situation in Gaza, and that has provided a solid, analytical both Israelis and Palestinians and to achieve a sovereign, basis for our work with partners in identifying ways to viable and contiguous Palestinian state living alongside improve the situation. Israel in peace and security. We therefore call on both We are also providing support through our programmes. parties to resume talks on the basis of clear parameters, Immediately after Operation Cast Lead, we concentrated including borders based on 1967 lines with agreed land on humanitarian aid, working with the UN, the swaps, security for Israel that respects Palestinian International Committee of the Red Cross and NGOs sovereignty, a just and fair resolution of the refugee to provide drinking water, food, shelter, medical assistance problem, and Jerusalem as the future capital of both and support for those traumatised by the conflict. Our states. current work on Gaza addresses the key access constraints, We want the new generation of Palestinians to grow promotes economic growth and provides support to the up in hope, not despair, and to believe in a peaceful poorest and most vulnerable parts of society. settlement with Israel, rather than being impoverished The UK supports the Palestinian Authority and and susceptible to terrorist recruitment. We want the UNRWA to provide basic services, such as education next generation of Israelis to live free from the fear of and health, to the people of Gaza. About 50% of our rocket fire, and able to enjoy peaceful relations with support to the Palestinian Authority and 30% of our their Arab neighbours. We cannot deliver that for either support to UNRWA benefits the Gazans. We provide side, but as friends to both the Israelis and the Palestinians, 2,400 vulnerable families with work and an income we will work with our international partners to help through our support for UNRWA’s back-to-work deliver progress in the peace process. We remain a programme, and we help to develop the private sector strong supporter of those who are building the institutions by supporting 304 small companies in Gaza and generating of a future Palestinian state. 251WH 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 UK Environment Capital (City of 252WH Peterborough) UK Environment Capital (City of Given its accessibility, Peterborough’s economic growth Peterborough) is available to a wide geographic area. The city has taken a lead role in the development of the Greater Cambridge and Greater Peterborough local enterprise partnership and is assisting in the delivery of the enterprise 1.30 pm zone at Alconbury in Huntingdon, ensuring that the Mr Stewart Jackson (Peterborough) (Con): It is a zone’s benefits are more widely exploited. I must put on pleasure to serve under your chairmanship for the first record my disappointment that the local enterprise time, Mr Dobbin. I am also delighted to welcome the partnership did not push for the Peterborough railway Minister of State, Department for Business, Innovation corridor, which would have had greater resonance as a and Skills, my right hon. Friend the Member for Tunbridge catalyst for change, built on our regeneration, and Wells (Greg Clark), who is doing an excellent job in his would have had a bigger social and economic impact. ministerial capacity. I am somewhat surprised, as I was However, that was the LEP’s decision. While I am expecting the enterprise Minister, the hon. Member for making minor complaints to my ministerial colleagues, Hertford and Stortford (Mr Prisk), but my right hon. I must say that Peterborough’s exclusion from the national Friend is a more than adequate substitute. This is my insurance contributions holiday will have had a slight opportunity to showcase the city of Peterborough’s impact on people minded to set up businesses in positive and innovative growth agenda, particularly our Peterborough, at the border between the east midlands aspiration to be the home of the UK environment and the east of England, rather than in the east midlands, capital, and to put on record our belief that we have a Lincolnshire or Northamptonshire. However, those are good case for being the future home of the new green my only gripes. investment bank. As we know, the east of England contributes significantly From time to time, I have disagreed with Peterborough to the national economy, to the tune of £30 billion a city council about the quantity of housing development year. As a powerhouse for growth in the area, Peterborough in the city. I have also expressed concerns, as have many could have a positive impact on the UK economy, and Members over the years, about the correlation between its environmental credentials could make it an exemplar residential development and infrastructure. However, I city for sustainable growth. believe that we are resolving those issues. Peterborough Peterborough was designated as an environment city city council, the urban regeneration company Opportunity in 1993 and became the home of the environment Peterborough, neighbouring Members of Parliament capital in 2010. The city’s environment capital is a and I share ambitious plans for the future of Peterborough, collection of assets including, among many other things, which I will elucidate. a unique cluster of environmental businesses, innovative approaches to understanding environmental performance, Peterborough’s population of 170,000 is set to grow development of the UK’s largest zero-carbon homes to well over 200,000 by 2021, and there are plans to project, one of the highest amounts of green space per deliver more than 25,000 homes and 24,000 jobs by capita in the UK and a drive for sustainability at the 2026. A McKinsey report published this year predicted core of all its activities. More than 380 organisations that by 2025, Peterborough would have the highest and businesses constitute the environment cluster, including growth in GDP of any English city. Private sector job Government and voluntary organisations such as Natural growth is vital to the city’s economic prosperity and England, the Environment Agency, the Wildlife Trust growth. Peterborough’s location—just 46 minutes from and Froglife and international consultancies such as London by train, with direct links to the north of Halcrow, Royal Haskoning and the Rolton Group. It England, Birmingham, Cambridge and Stansted airport— also includes major businesses such as Dresser-Rand, makes it a nationally and internationally well-connected which is developing energy from wave technologies, city that attracts and retains businesses. Caterpillar Perkins, formerly Perkins Engines, which is The city’s economic growth is based on strong sectoral reducing engine CO2 emissions, and Anglian Water, foundations. I will mention its environmental and financial which is delivering leading-edge innovation in water businesses in a moment. Peterborough’s manufacturing management. companies have outperformed many competitors and Peterborough Environment City Trust is delivering include global giants such as Caterpillar Perkins, Dresser- nationally unique environmental programmes, attracting Rand and Applied Energy. In printing and media, funds for major retrofit projects, developing community Peterborough boasts Bauer Media, Europe’s largest skills through its Greeniversity programme and the privately owned publisher, and Ideal World, digital Green Apple resource kit and awards for local schools broadcaster to more than 22 million homes in the UK. and involving more than 400 local businesses in In food and drink, the full spectrum from processing environmental management improvements through its and packaging to innovation and cutting-edge technology Investors in the Environment scheme. With 295 code 6 is covered by companies such as Coca-Cola, New Covent homes on the south bank of the River Nene, Peterborough Garden Food Co., Masterfoods, British Sugar and AB Agri. will be the country’s biggest carbon challenge city. The Although nowhere has been wholly unaffected by the city is also developing innovative utility provision to recession, Peterborough has performed relatively well, support housing and economic growth through a council-led creating over 3,000 private sector jobs in the past year. energy services company installing photovoltaic and Investment has continued to head to the city. New other energy solutions for council property. high-profile operators such as TK Maxx, Nando’s, Patisserie As one of three Department for Transport sustainable Valerie, Van Hage, Andronicas, Pandora and Superdry transport demonstration towns—an initiative branded have all set up in Peterborough recently, and imminent as Travelchoice—the city has achieved a significant arrivals such as Kelway IT services and Stobart Group shift towards more sustainable travel modes, including are due to deliver more than 700 jobs. a 35% increase in the number of bus passengers 253WH UK Environment Capital (City of 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 UK Environment Capital (City of 254WH Peterborough) Peterborough) between 2004 and 2009, a 14% increase in walking and the city.Innovation in all areas of environmental, financial, a 12% increase in cycle journeys. The recent award of a economic and social capital is matched by understanding £5 million Department for Transport grant to Travelchoice infrastructure needs and opportunities. reflects the transformations already achieved and will I will finish with a quote from Diligenta, which is a enable the city to develop them further. subsidiary of the huge Tata group, is a leading player in The 2008 Government-commended integrated growth UK life and pensions business process outsourcing, and study produced by Arup on behalf of the city council has a headquarters in the city. It says: demonstrated how the city could meet its ambitious “Peterborough…has great infrastructure that supports a vibrant growth targets while achieving environmental, economic economy and a financial sector presence. We strongly recommend and social sustainability.Data sets from the study underpin it as an excellent location for any business looking to invest.” the pioneering Peterborough model, a web-based Peterborough is moving forward and grabbing the visualisation of city-wide environmental performance opportunities of the Government’s growth agenda. I developed through a public-private collaboration. The look forward to hearing the Minister’s response. model has received interest from as far afield as New York, Cape Cod and Bordeaux, as well as closer to 1.43 pm home from Her Majesty’s Treasury, to support the green infrastructure plan. The Minister of State, Department for Communities and Local Government (Greg Clark): It is a pleasure Skills development is key to the city’s future. The city to serve under your chairmanship for the first time, council has recently partnered with Cranfield university Mr Dobbin, and to be able to respond to the debate to establish the Centre for Renewable Energy and Bio-Fuels initiated by my hon. Friend the Member for Peterborough and is supporting the commercial research and development (Mr Jackson). He has referred to the Peterborough of algae biofuel energy. That brings me to the bid for model, and I think that he is the Peterborough model of the green investment bank. The pioneering work of the a Member of Parliament who is absolutely passionate coalition Government in establishing the green investment about his constituency and who represents it with the bank requires relevant expertise in the host city and a vigour for which that city is itself famous. similarly innovative attitude. As the home of the environment capital, Peterborough has unrivalled expertise As my hon. Friend has said, Peterborough is a growing in environmental sustainability, with its 380 businesses city. Even during the recession, it has performed well and organisations, its innovation networks, which reach with 3,000 new jobs announced last year. It has great across the globe, and its innovative mapping of strength in sectors such as the environment, manufacturing, environmental performance through the Peterborough finance and investment. It is a city with innovation at its model. heart, with its Eco-Innovation Centre and Water Innovation Network. Cranfield university is not far away and Peterborough also has more than 27,000 people working Peterborough is working with it to establish a commercial in the financial sector, proportionally more than the research and development base in algae biofuel technology. east of England and the United Kingdom. Major As my hon. Friend has indicated, Peterborough’s companies with main offices in Peterborough include leading role in the Greater Cambridge and Greater the insurance operators the BGL Group—famous for Peterborough local enterprise partnership, which was the meerkat adverts—Royal Sun Alliance and Diligenta, announced in October, is a major positive force for the which is part of the giant Tata Consultancy Services economy. There are great hopes for that local enterprise conglomerate. Other financial operators include BNP partnership, being, as it is, such a concentration of Paribas, Handelsbanken, the Lloyds Group, Aldermore, some of our most promising businesses and industries. Travelex and Clydesdale Bank. Many of these companies My hon. Friend has mentioned the new enterprise have announced significant growth and expansion, even zone in Alconbury. It is outside his constituency, and I during the recession. acknowledge his point about the Peterborough railway Innovation is key to the financial as well as environmental corridor. I say to him that that was the choice of the performance of the city. Local companies such as PinPlus, local enterprise partnership, and I know that his constituents for financial security, iGo4, for insurance, and indeed will benefit from the general uplift that it will give to the the city council, through its mortgage partnership with whole area. Moreover, many of the powers in a local Lloyds TSB, are all leaders in creative approaches to enterprise zone are in the gift of local authorities to finance. In these difficult times for first-time buyers, I bestow on other areas to create, as it were, enterprise commend in particular the collaboration between the areas. On simplified planning, for example, a new discretion city council and Lloyds TSB in providing much-needed will be available in the Localism Bill to give business finance for first-time buyers. I certainly commend it to rate discounts to particular types of businesses for other local authorities. start-ups. The proposed reforms to the local government finance system will allow authorities to retain the benefit In Peterborough, the green investment bank would of the uplift in business rates. I hope that, when he have access to unparalleled levels of financial and returns to Peterborough, my hon. Friend will encourage environmental expertise and innovation, as is already both the local enterprise partnership and the city council demonstrated by the Treasury’s interest in using the to think about how some of the benefits of the local Peterborough model to support the green infrastructure enterprise zone in Alconbury might be conferred on the plan. area in Peterborough that he has mentioned. In conclusion, Peterborough is ambitious and growing, The unique model of the Peterborough skills vision with a work force to match. The city is actively exploring of brokering direct links between local business and pioneering public-private partnerships to remove the schools and colleges is another area that other cities are burden from the taxpayer without slowing progress in looking to replicate. Peterborough has so much more to 255WH UK Environment Capital (City of 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 UK Environment Capital (City of 256WH Peterborough) Peterborough) [Greg Clark] in the energy sector alone. In the long term, the benefits to be gained from that action will be much greater than offer besides, such as a spectacular cathedral and excellent the costs of taking it. To ensure that a lack of sufficient rail links, which my hon. Friend has mentioned, as well finance is not a barrier to the scale and pace of the as being the home of the Posh and of one of my great transition, we need to go beyond existing policies. heroes, Peter Boizot. To that end, we have announced our intentions for The green economy is important to the whole country the green investment bank, which is the first of its kind and I am aware that that applies nowhere more than in in the world and one of the Government’s top priorities. Peterborough—350 eco-businesses are located there and The green investment bank will be dedicated to providing it has 29 conservation areas and an amazing commitment financial solutions to accelerate and increase private from its people to improve the city’s environment, as sector investment. A new institution rather than a series they have done over time. Peterborough’s long-standing of Government interventions is required, and the green association with the environment is clear. It was designated investment bank will build the necessary deep expertise an environment city 15 years ago—one of only four at in financial markets and green investments. It will be an the time—and it recently celebrated its 20th green festival. institution that complements our existing green policies In addition, I was pleased to hear about Peterborough’s and addresses the areas of under-investment that persist recent environmental business successes with a Queen’s in spite of the other measures I have mentioned. award for enterprise and the international interest generated Our green objectives are ambitious and to achieve by the Peterborough model, which my hon. Friend has them we need tailored and targeted financial intervention mentioned and which brings the city’s environmental to overcome under-investment in those key areas. The performance data to life through an online visualisation. green investment bank will work towards a double Peterborough is right to be so committed to the green bottom line of achieving a significant green impact and economy. The green economy in the UK was worth making financial returns. There has been a great deal of more than £116 billion in 2009-10. By 2015, the sector is interest in the green investment bank and I know that expected to employ more than 1 million people. We are my hon. Friend is keen to understand where we are with taking action now to put the whole economy on a setting it up and to ensure that Peterborough is well low-carbon, resource-efficient path. UK expertise and represented in those considerations. innovative low-carbon businesses can lead the way in We are at the early stages of establishing the green refocusing our economy to capture the global opportunities investment bank, and there is much to be done. Our that were worth £3.2 trillion in the past year alone and proposals need to be approved by the European are forecast to grow by about 4% a year over the next Commission before we can establish the bank as a fully five years. independent financial institution. However, we know A greener, low-carbon economy is one of the key that there is a need for early action, so my Department areas that we have focused on in our plan for growth. will start to make direct state-aid-compliant investments The Government recently published plans that map out in green infrastructure projects from April 2012. The the Government’s action to enable the transition to a advisory group, which was recently appointed and which green economy, including areas such as climate change, met for the first time last week, will provide us with resource efficiency, waste prevention and carbon capture advice on the establishment of the green investment and storage. These plans will form the basis for continuing bank, including what its strategic priorities should be. dialogue between Government, business, universities Those priorities will then be decided by the Secretary of and communities. State and will be regularly reviewed by Ministers and the institution’s corporate board. We understand that business needs to invest substantial We will also need to decide on the bank’s location. resources, but it needs to be confident that this is at the Although it will not be a large institution, we know that heart of the Government’s agenda. I hope that it can see people already see it as a valuable organisation and an that it clearly is. We are putting in place the policies that asset to wherever it will be located. We are currently will establish the long-term framework in which investment defining a process to decide the location that will build decisions can be made with confidence. Providing that on the criteria we published in our May update on the consistency creates an attractive environment for investment, green investment bank. We will, of course, make an which, by its very nature, will pay dividends over a long announcement in due course about the process and period. ensure that all those who have already expressed an We are committed to substantial reductions in carbon interest are kept informed. emissions. We have launched the world’s first incentive We believe that a green economy is a growing economy scheme for renewable heat, which should increase investment and welcome Peterborough’s commitment to green growth. in green heat technologies, and we are launching the Through our green policies, our work with businesses green deal, under which householders, businesses and and the green investment bank, we believe that we are landlords will be able to improve the energy efficiency firmly on our way to achieving that vision of a green of their homes and buildings at no up-front cost. We are economy. We will continue our work to establish the also introducing a carbon price floor, proposals on green investment bank, including the design of a process electricity market reform and a range of initiatives to to decide the location, and we hope to make an encourage the roll-out of green vehicles. announcement on progress as soon as it is sensible to High-quality economic infrastructure is important do so. for any competitive, growing economy. The transition I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for the consistent to a green economy will require unprecedented investment interest that he has taken in the green powerhouse that in green infrastructure in key areas. Hundreds of billions is the city of Peterborough’s potential in this area. No of pounds, mostly from the private sector, will be required one in his city should doubt the fact that they could not 257WH UK Environment Capital (City of 13 SEPTEMBER 2011 UK Environment Capital (City of 258WH Peterborough) Peterborough) wish for an advocate who has a stronger or more Question put and agreed to. respected voice in this House. It has been a privilege to respond to his debate and to serve under your chairmanship, 1.52 pm Mr Dobbin. Sitting adjourned.

39WS Written Ministerial Statements13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 40WS

and is expected to have a limited life span that many of Written Ministerial the obligations are expected to exceed. In such circumstances, and given that the obligations go beyond Statements the lifetime of the 2012 games, I have agreed to a ministerial guarantee of the ODA’s obligations. Such a guarantee is provided for under the London Olympic Tuesday 13 September 2011 Games and Paralympic Games Act 2006. All of the ODA’s obligations to QDD are within the TREASURY ODA’s existing scope and budget therefore no additional funding is required to meet these obligations. However Tax Policy Consultation and Draft Finance Bill 2012 if, due to unforeseen circumstances, additional funding is required there is access to ODA programme contingency, and if that was exhausted, to the public sector funding The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David package contingency for the Olympic programme as a Gauke): The Government’s approach to tax policy making whole. puts consultation on policy and scrutiny of legislation The obligations do not constitute additional contingent as the cornerstones. liabilities because the obligations covered by the guarantee Over the summer, HM Treasury and HM Revenue can be funded within the overall public sector funding and Customs have been seeking the views of interested package for which a contingent liability was announced parties on the tax policies announced at Budget 2011. to Parliament in March 2007. Responses to these consultations will be published on The coverage of this guarantee is very similar to that or by 6 December 2011. provided in 2009 in support of the agreements entered As part of the next stage of consultation draft legislation into by the ODA with Triathlon Homes LLP for the for these measures, to be included in Finance Bill 2012, purchase of 1,379 affordable homes on the Olympic will also be published on that date. This will be village development. Parliament was informed of the supplemented by draft explanatory notes and tax impact Triathlon guarantee by the then Minister for the Olympics and information notes. The draft clauses will be open to the right hon. Member for Dulwich and West Norwood consultation until 10 February 2012. (Tessa Jowell) on 22 June 2009, Official Report, columns 47-48WS). CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT At the point at which the ODA is wound up, any subsisting rights and obligations under the agreements Olympic Delivery Authority (Ministerial Guarantee) with QDD will be managed and considered as part of the Government’s decision at the time on the allocation of the ODA’s remaining assets, rights and liabilities. The Minister for Sport and the Olympics (Hugh Robertson): The Olympic Delivery Authority (ODA) has entered into an agreement for Qatari Diar Athletes Village UK Ltd (QDD) to purchase 1,439 homes and DEFENCE associated ground floor retail units in the Olympic village development, together with six adjacent future development plots having the potential for a further Service Voter Registration 2,000 new homes in the public realm, which benefits both the Olympic village and the development plots. As Minister for the Olympics and an authorised signatory The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence for the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media (Mr Andrew Robathan): I have today placed in the and Sport, I have signed a guarantee given in support of Library of the House a copy of the report of a survey this agreement. on service voter registration levels in 2010 conducted by QDD is a wholly owned subsidiary of QDD Ltd, a Defence Analytical Services and Advice in January joint venture between DV4 Ltd, a real estate investment 2011. As in previous years the survey was conducted to fund advised by Delancey (a specialist real estate investment provide an estimate of the numbers of armed forces company with a property portfolio across the UK) and personnel who are currently registered to vote, and to Qatari Diar Real Estate Investment Company (a real assess the success of our information campaign. estate investor and developer owned wholly by the I welcome the survey. It indicates that 75% of service Qatar Investment Authority). personnel are registered to vote, up from 69% in 2009 The agreement is between QDD and the Olympic and 60% in 2005. This represents the highest level of Delivery Authority (ODA) for the sale of SVDP Ltd, a service registration since I first raised the issue back in wholly owned subsidiary of the ODA which holds the 2005. Of those registered in 2010, the majority (77%) ODA’s interest in the village (and associated development chose to register as ordinary rather than service voters. plots and public realm) on its behalf. The level of voters registered as overseas voters has The ODA has provided various undertakings, indemnities remained at 1%. and warranties under the terms of the agreement with We recognise that there is still work to be done. QDD. In essence, these oblige the ODA to build and Alongside the challenges presented by service mobility convert the village units from athletes’ use at games time and the high proportion of young personnel in our to private housing and deliver wider Olympic park armed forces, the results of the survey will help to infrastructure. The ODA has no significant sources of inform how and where we should best concentrate our funding other than the public sector funding package efforts in the future. We continue to work closely with 41WS Written Ministerial Statements13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 42WS our colleagues in the Cabinet Office and the Electoral stabilised. With the approval of the SoSREP, Shell Commission to further improve the quality and timeliness partially stabilised the pipeline by laying concrete mattresses of information available to our service personnel and on it, and the second leak was then halted on 19 August. their families. It remains our firm commitment to improve The operations control unit remains in place and the arrangements for the service community to enable them SoSREP is continuing to work with Shell as they develop to play a full part in the electoral process. plans to remove the remaining inventory in the pipeline (estimated at 660 tonnes of oil). Although this incident is in no way comparable with ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE major pollution incidents such as the gulf of Mexico—in the case of Macondo it is estimated that 4,900,000 barrels of oil were released to sea, the Gannet release equates Oil Release (Gannet Field) to 1,300 barrels—this is nevertheless the largest oil release on the UKCS in over a decade. My Department and the Health and Safety Executive The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change have commenced investigations into the cause of the (Chris Huhne): An oil release from a pipeline in Shell’s incident, which are likely to take some months. A full Gannet F development, totalling approximately 218 report will be sent to the procurator fiscal to consider tonnes1 occurred during the period from 10 to 19 August whether a prosecution is appropriate. 2011. The oil dispersed naturally well away from the 1It is difficult and takes time to get an accurate assessment of the shore and the UK-Norway median line and there has size of a release and this is subject to ongoing revision. been no evidence of any significant environmental impact to date resulting from this release. An oil sheen on the sea surface was observed by Shell ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS personnel on Wednesday 10 August, and my Department was notified on the same day that a leak had occurred. Imports of Animal Products A DECC inspector was in regular communication with Shell from that point. On the evening of August 11, DECC was notified that the release had stopped. However, The Minister of State, Department for Environment, Shell provided DECC with further aerial surveillance Food and Rural Affairs (Mr James Paice): As required information late on the afternoon of Friday 12 and it under the Animal Health Act 1981 (as amended by the became clear that the release was continuing and that Animal Health Act 2002) the Government will publish there was potential for significant pollution. The Secretary today a review of controls on the import of animal of States representative for maritime salvage and products for the financial year 2010-11. intervention (SoSREP) was immediately notified and Following my first year as Minister of State responsible he mobilised to Shell’s headquarters on Saturday 13 August. for agriculture and food, I welcome the opportunity A team from DECC and Marine Scotland was assembled again to report on the actions made by the Department at Shell’s offices to attend an operations meeting that for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (DEFRA) afternoon, with the SoSREP formally establishing an and other Government Departments and agencies during operations control unit at Shell’s office at 9 am on the past year aimed at reducing the risk of disease Sunday 14 August. entering the country via imports of animal products. The role of the SoSREP is to represent the Secretaries The Government remain committed to strong action of State for the Department of Energy and Climate to prevent illegal imports of animal products from Change (in relation to offshore installations) and the outside the European Union (EU) that may bring the Department for Transport (in relation to ships) to ensure risk of diseases that can threaten animal and public the risk to safety, property and the UK environment health, for example foot and mouth disease (FMD) and arising from accidents involving ships, fixed or floating highly pathogenic avian influenza type H5N1 respectively. platforms or sub-sea infrastructure is eliminated or There is also the substantial risk to the economy as we effectively reduced. know from the outbreak of FMD in 2001 which is In the case of an offshore oil release, the SoSREP estimated to have cost £3 billion relating to agriculture monitors the operator’s response to a pollution incident and the food chain. and, if he deems necessary, has powers to give directions Following the spending review, DEFRA with the UK and to take such other actions as may be required where Border Agency (UKBA), the Foreign and Commonwealth there is or may be a risk of significant pollution. The Office (FCO) and the Food Standards Agency (FSA), SoSREP is empowered to make crucial and often time- albeit at low or no cost, have continued to undertake a critical decisions, without delay and without recourse to joined-up approach on the overall communications strategy higher authority, where such decision are in the overriding and seek opportunities to help raise travellers’ awareness public interest. The SoSREP has been in close contact of the rules on personal imports of animal products. with DECC and the Scottish Government Ministers It is also pleasing to report the existing intelligence throughout. framework between UKBA and the FSA has been On 14 August, a survey by a remotely operated strengthened to improve the flow of risk information vehicle confirmed that the initial leak had been stopped, available for border and inland enforcement activities to but a second, smaller, leak was continuing. The survey target illegal animal products. also discovered that the pipeline bundle, within which We can never have a zero risk but we continue to the oil flow-line was contained, had lifted from the monitor and assess the changing threats from around seabed in a number of places. Action to halt the continuing the world. We therefore continue to work closely with small leak had to be deferred until the pipeline could be the UK Border Agency (UKBA) to ensure that its 43WS Written Ministerial Statements13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 44WS anti-smuggling controls at the Great Britain (GB) border bring forward legislation which will allow for the possibility are responsive to new or changing animal health risks of elections in the national park authorities and the and to ensure it focuses on the most high-risk routings broads authority. Initially we propose to apply the new and goods. legislation in two NPAs on a pilot basis, namely the Copies of the review will be placed in the Libraries of New Forest and the Peak district NPAs which provide both Houses, on the DEFRA personal food imports different contexts on which to assess the impact of website (http://www.defra.gov.uk/foodfarm/food/personal- directly elected members. import/index.htm), and we will be writing to interested DEFRA will be talking to the New Forest and Peak groups and stakeholders providing them with the district NPAs in more detail about their pilots, covering opportunity to comment on or query anything in the in particular the number of members to be directly review and/or meet officials. elected and the way they can be accommodated without increasing the overall size of those authorities. English National Park Authorities and the Broads Other changes include: altering the composition of Authority (Governance) the Dartmoor, Lake District and Exmoor authorities; some changes to the procedure for selecting “national” members (within the requirements of the OCPA code); The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for removing the Secretary of State’s role in confirming Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Richard Benyon): parish appointments; in some NPAs (but not all) making The nine national parks in England, along with the non-councillors eligible for parish seats; applying a broads, represent some of our finest landscapes which maximum limit to the period which all members may have been a source of inspiration, challenge, and reassurance serve; requiring annual reports on how well the members to our citizens over many generations. Each now has an of each authority have collectively performed and endorsing independent authority, constructed along local authority a number of changes which NPAs can make under their lines, to maximise the benefits which we all derive from existing powers—for example, strengthening links between these special areas. In the coalition’s programme for members and particular areas of the park or improving government we said that meeting arrangements. I also propose further work in some areas. “We will review the governance arrangements of national parks in order to increase local accountability” A number of the actions I have outlined will require That commitment was honoured by a public consultation formal consultation and others require further development which ran from 9 November 2010 until 1 February in co-operation with relevant bodies such as the NPAs 2011. In the consultation document we made it clear and the Local Government Association. An implementation that the Government did not intend to remove or replace plan is being prepared which will present this information the authorities but was rather looking for ways in which in tabular form and will be available on DEFRA’s their governance arrangements could be improved. We website (www.defra.gov.uk). also made it clear that there could be variety between authorities—this would allow governance to better reflect their individual circumstances and histories and be NORTHERN IRELAND consistent with the coalition Government’s commitment to decentralisation and localism. I am today responding to the NPAs’ proposals by Northern Ireland Human Rights Commission (Annual placing on DEFRA’s website and in the Library of the Report 2010-11) House a list of the proposals made by the NPAs and my response to them. Central to this consultation was the question of The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr Owen accountability and the ultimate accountability is of Paterson): I have today laid before this House a copy of course through the ballot box. Ever since the original the Northern Ireland Human Rights Commission’s annual legislation was being enacted in 1995, there have been report and accounts 2010-11, in accordance with schedule calls for some members to be directly elected and that 7 paragraphs 5(2) and 7(3)(b) of the Northern Ireland already happens in the Scottish NPAs. I have concluded Act 1998. that the time has now come for us to explore that option This is the 12th annual report published by the more thoroughly in England. I therefore propose to Commission.

19P Petitions13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Petitions 20P

on each of these reviews were published on Thursday Petitions 28 July and where CQC has found that services are not meeting the essential safety and quality requirements, Tuesday 13 September 2011 CQC is taking appropriate action. CQC is also undertaking a focused inspection programme to review care for people with learning disabilities in OBSERVATIONS independent hospitals. The review will be in two phases: phase 1 will consist of the inspection of 150 services that provide care for people with learning disabilities; HEALTH phase 2 will use the learning from phase one to look at a Prevention of Abuse of Adults in Residential Care sample of other registered services covering alternative models of provision for people with learning disabilities. The petition of supporters of The National Autistic In undertaking these reviews, where inspections identify Society, care and treatment that does not comply with the safety Declares that the petitioners believe that the Secretary and quality requirements for example the requirement of State for Health should take urgent action to prevent on safeguarding service users from abuse, CQC has abuse in residential care settings and work with powers to take enforcement action. This includes the commissioners, providers, individuals receiving support power to issue the provider with a warning notice that and their families to ensure that vulnerable adults are requires improvement within a specified time, prosecution treated in a dignified, safe, enabling and respectful way. and the power to cancel a provider’s registration, removing its ability to provide regulated activities. The petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons urges the Department of Health to urgently In addition to the reviews CQC is undertaking into review the work of the Care Quality Commission and services for people with learning disabilities, CQC is the appropriateness of the inspection regime for protecting undertaking an internal review of its actions. This, vulnerable adults in out-of-area residential accommodation. along with reviews by other bodies involved as well as the independently chaired Serious Case Review will And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by John feed into an overall review by the Department of Health Pugh, Official Report, 19 July 2011; Vol. 531, c. 907 .] which will be draw together the key lessons. This work is [P000948] being led by Bruce Calderwood, Mental Health and Learning Disability Director for the Department. A Observations from the Secretary of State for Health: panel of experts including Professor Jim Mansell, Mark The issue referred to relates to the abuse uncovered Goldring and Anne Williams will advise the review. Its by a BBC Panorama programme at Winterbourne View, activities will be informed by the views of service user an independent hospital for people with learning disabilities. and carer representatives including the National Forum When the abuse at Winterbourne View became known, for People with Learning Difficulties, the Challenging the Care Quality Commission (CQC), commissioners Behaviour Foundation and the National Valuing Families and other agencies took prompt action to safeguard the Forum. Ministers will then report further to Parliament. patients there. Winterbourne View has now been closed The forthcoming Care and Support White Paper will permanently and Castlebeck Care is no longer registered look at the quality framework for social care as a whole, to provide services at this location. to make sure we have got the right arrangements in The Government are committed to learning the lessons place to ensure high standards for all people who receive from this tragic case and a number of actions are care. underway to ensure that this happens. The White Paper will be informed by an engagement CQC is undertaking a number of reviews of services process over the autumn on priorities for social care for people with learning disabilities starting with the reform and we will set out more detail about our plans review of all of Castlebeck’s facilities in England. Reports imminently.

1057W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1058W Written Answers to War Crimes Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what his policy is Questions on an independent commission of inquiry into war crimes in Somalia; and if he will make a statement. Tuesday 13 September 2011 [71377] Mr Bellingham: We are not aware of any current UN proposal for an Independent Commission of Inquiry FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE for Somalia. We believe it is right that international efforts at this European Union: Legislative Competence time remain focused on the Djibouti Peace Process, and on ending the transition in August 2012, in order to Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for secure longer-term stability in Somalia. In this context, Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs which powers he we welcome the adoption in Mogadishu on 6 September is seeking to repatriate from the European Union. of a roadmap for progress over the next year and are [70540] urging the Transitional Federal Institutions to keep to Mr Lidington: As set out in the coalition agreement, the commitments contained within that roadmap. Those the Government are committed to examining the balance commitments include the prevention of the presence of of the EU’s existing competences and working to limit children in the armed forces and efforts to improve the application of the working time directive in the protection of civilians from all armed violence. The United Kingdom. British Government are also exploring ways in which we can support the African Union Mission in Somalia Lockerbie: Bombings to minimise the risk to civilians when they defend themselves from insurgent attack. Gordon Banks: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what discussions his Department has had with (a) the First Minister of WALES Scotland and (b) other Ministers in the Scottish Government on the possible return to the UK of Abdel Departmental Written Questions Baset al-Megrahi since 1 February 2011. [70116] Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for Alistair Burt: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office Wales what proportion of written questions tabled to has had no contacts with the First Minister of Scotland her for answer on a named day did not receive a or other Minister of the Scottish Executive on the substantive answer on the day named for answer possible return to the UK of Abdul Baset al-Megrahi between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (b) since 1 February 2011. The decision to release Mr al- 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71134] Megrahi was one for the Scottish Executive alone to Mr David Jones: Between the dates of (a) 27 May take, as would be any decision to request his return. 2010 and 19 July 2011 the Wales Office received 48 written questions tabled for answer on a named day, of which Moussa Koussa two did not receive a substantive answer on the named Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for day. Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whose Between the dates of (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July authorisation was given for Moussa Koussa to leave 2011 the Wales Office received 12 written questions the United Kingdom. [70981] tabled for answer on a named day, all of which were answered on the named day. Alistair Burt: Moussa Koussa did not require The Government have committed to providing the authorisation to leave the UK. He was not in detention Procedure Committee with information relating to written in the UK but was here as a private individual. parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis and will provide full information to the Committee at Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether the Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary Government made arrangements with the authorities Session were previously provided to the committee and in Qatar for Moussa Koussa to go to Doha. [70983] are available on the Parliament website. Alistair Burt: No. Mr Koussa’s entry into Doha was a matter for him and the Qatari authorities. WOMEN AND EQUALITIES Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether Moussa Discrimination Koussa is expected to return to the United Kingdom. Sadiq Khan: To ask the Minister for Women and [70984] Equalities what steps she plans to take to raise awareness of discrimination against lesbian, gay, Alistair Burt: All foreign nationals are subject to bisexual and transgender people. [57645] compliance with the immigration rules but we cannot discuss the details of an individual’s case. Nor can we Lynne Featherstone: This Government are committed comment on Mr Moussa Koussa’s possible future to advancing equality for lesbian, gay, bisexual and movements. transgender (LGB&T) people, both in the UK and 1059W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1060W internationally. It is clear that too many LGB&T people The Government strongly believes the approach set still face discrimination and the Government are committed out in the policy review is the right approach, and that to addressing this. the draft regulations strike the right balance between That is why, in March 2011, the Government published prescription and flexibility. This approach will help “Working for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender public bodies comply with the Equality Duty and Equality: Moving Forward”, which outlines evidence of understand what constitutes good practice through discrimination and the targeted action that Government guidance, not regulation. will take in a number of areas of public policy including But we have listened to the concerns raised and will education, workplaces, hate crime, sport and our review the operation of the regulations in two years international work. time, to ensure they are delivering the transparency and The Government will continue to engage with a accountability we expect. range of employers, service providers, public sector bodies, voluntary and community sector groups and individuals to ensure that discrimination against LGB&T WORK AND PENSIONS people is tackled at all levels. ATOS Healthcare Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Driving: Age Discrimination and Pensions how many face-to-face assessments scheduled by ATOS Healthcare have been (a) Philip Davies: To ask the Minister for Women and cancelled by ATOS and (b) missed by benefit Equalities whether she plans to grant the car rental applicants in each of the last 12 months for which industry an opt-out clause from the age discrimination figures are available. [70796] provisions of the Equality Act 2010 similar to that provided to the financial services industry. [70644] Chris Grayling: Atos Healthcare arrange over 1 million medical appointments each year and appointments are Lynne Featherstone: We are currently considering the only cancelled by Atos Healthcare when necessary to issue and will announce our decision in the Government’s minimise any inconvenience or prolonged waiting time published response to the recent age discrimination for the claimant. Atos Healthcare always aims to provide consultation in due course. good notice to claimants of a cancellation. Atos Healthcare is also working with the DWP to Philip Davies: To ask the Minister for Women and improve the level of claimants who do not attend their Equalities what estimate she has made of the potential appointments, and the figures indicate improvements cost to the car rental industry of the provisions of the have been seen recently. Equality Act 2010 relating to age discrimination. [70646] Month Cancelled by Atos Claimant did not attend

September 2010 15,550 22,350 Lynne Featherstone: My officials have discussed estimates October 2010 14,850 22,600 with the car rental industry. Any costs would be dependent November 2010 18,350 24,400 on the Government’s decision which is under consideration December 2010 16,350 22,250 and will be announced in our response to the recent January 2011 15,900 24,650 consultation. February 2011 16,550 21,700 March 2011 16,250 21,300 Equality April 2011 11,700 14,950 May 2011 11,550 17,000 Mr David Hamilton: To ask the Minister for Women June 2011 17,800 17,650 and Equalities what proportion of respondents to the July 2011 21,400 16,350 Equality Act 2010: The public sector Equality Duty: August 2011 16,900 12,550 reducing bureaucracy consultation were in favour of Source: Atos Healthcare—(these figures are rounded to the nearest 50) the Government’s revised draft regulations. [64507] Carer’s Allowance Lynne Featherstone [holding answer 7 July 2011]: There were 189 responses to the policy review. A summary Chris Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for Work of the responses received is included in the Explanatory and Pensions whether he plans to amend the Memorandum published alongside the draft specific overlapping benefit rules which prevent simultaneous duties regulations on 27 June 2011. The discursive payment of carer’s allowance and retirement pension. nature of the responses means that giving exact proportions [71401] in favour or against is not possible. But in general Steve Webb: We have no plans to do so. terms: Carer’s allowance has always been subject to the virtually all respondents supported the stated aims of reducing overlapping benefits rules which ensure that only one unnecessary processes and bureaucracy, and promoting greater transparency and accountability; benefit at a time can be paid for the same purpose. there was also widespread agreement that the revised regulations Carer’s allowance and state pension overlap because would achieve the first of these aims; they both provide a replacement income. Carer’s allowance there was a more mixed response in regard to the latter aim. provides a measure of financial support for people who Around 40% of the public bodies supported the proposed approach, forgo the opportunity of full-time employment in order while around 80% of respondents overall raised concerns of one to care for a severely disabled person. State pension sort or another. replaces income in retirement. 1061W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1062W

Although an entitlement to both benefits will mean Cold Weather Payments that carer’s allowance is not payable, or not payable in full, an underlying entitlement to carer’s allowance Justin Tomlinson: To ask the Secretary of State for gives access to the carer premium, currently £31, in Work and Pensions what criteria trigger the payment of housing benefit and council tax benefit and an additional cold weather payments; which vulnerable groups amount at the same rate in pension credit. qualify for these payments; and whether the level of cold weather payments has increased since May 2010. Children: Maintenance [70782]

Mr Shepherd: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Steve Webb: Cold weather payments are made for and Pensions whether he has any plans to amend the each period of very cold weather between 1 November Child Support (Information, Evidence and Disclosure) and 31 March. A network of weather stations covering Regulations 1992 to enable the Child Maintenance and the whole of Great Britain gathers temperature information. Enforcement Commission to confirm a child’s A payment of £25 is made when the average temperature attendance with a school or college in order to verify at the weather station linked to the claimant’s postcode the parent with carer’s entitlement to child benefit. is, or is forecast to be, zero degrees Celsius or below over [70697] seven consecutive days. The qualifying benefits are: pension credit, income Maria Miller: The Child Maintenance and Enforcement support, income-based jobseeker’s allowance and income- Commission is responsible for the child maintenance related employment and support allowance. Those in system. I have asked the Child Maintenance Commissioner receipt of income-related employment and support to write to my hon. Friend with the information requested allowance in the assessment phase, income support, or and I have seen the response. income-based jobseeker’s allowance must have a pensioner or disability premium, a child who is disabled, or a child Letter from Noel Shanahan, dated 8 September 2011: under the age of five. In reply to your recent Parliamentary Question about the The rate of cold weather payments was permanently Child Support Agency, the Secretary of State promised a substantive reply from the Child Maintenance Commissioner as the Child increased to £25 per period of very cold weather from Support Agency is now the responsibility of the Child Maintenance 1 November 2010. and Enforcement Commission. Further information on cold weather payments is You asked the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, available on the direct.gov website: whether he has any plans to amend the Child Support (Information http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/ Evidence and Disclosure) Regulations 1992 to enable the Child BenefitsTaxCreditsAndOtherSupport/On_a_low_income/ Maintenance and Enforcement Commission to confirm a child’s DG_10018668 attendance with a school or college in order to verify the parent with care’s entitlement to child benefit. [70697] Statistics for the number of payments by Met Office weather station for winter 2010-11 are available in the The Child Support (Information Evidence and Disclosure) Regulations 1992 were replaced by the Child Support Information Secretary of State for Work and Pensions’ Annual Regulations 2008. The Child Maintenance and Enforcement Report on the Social Fund available through the Commission (the Commission) has no plans to amend these Department for Work and Pensions website: regulations as mentioned in the question. http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/2011-annual-report-social- Under child support legislation, children under the age of 16 fund.pdf are considered a child for child maintenance purposes regardless of their attendance at a school or college. However, for children Departmental Written Questions between the ages of 16 and 19, the criterion used for deciding whether they are considered a qualifying child for child maintenance Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for purposes is if child benefit is in payment for that child. Work and Pensions what proportion of written Whilst matters relating to child maintenance are the responsibility questions tabled to him for answer on a named day did of the Commission; matters relating to the entitlement and payment not receive a substantive answer on the day named for of child benefit are the responsibility of HM Revenue and Customs answer between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (HMRC). (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71141] The Child Maintenance and Other Payments Act 2008 (the 2008 Act) provided for a new child maintenance scheme. The Commission is developing plans for the new child maintenance Chris Grayling: The number of written questions scheme and the 2008 Act provides for the maximum age of a child tabled to the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions under the new scheme to be 20 years of age, which will align with for answer on a named day; (a) between 27 May 2010 the maximum age for the payment of Child Benefit and Child Tax and 19 July 2011 was 1,061 of which 41 (3.86%) did not Credits. Detailed rules about the new scheme will be contained in receive a substantive answer on the named day, and (b) regulations which will be subject to public consultation before the between 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011 was 360 of new scheme goes live. The consultation process will be publicly which 14 (3.89%) did not receive a substantive answer announced, although the date for this process to begin is still to on the named day. be confirmed. The Government have committed to providing the Where a child benefit claim is cancelled with retrospective effect, then the Commission, upon notification, can close the case Procedure Committee with information relating to written from the date that the child benefit claim ceased, and the Commission parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis can then consider, refunding, the non-resident parent or reducing and will provide full information to the Committee at any arrears balance as appropriate. Additionally, if the non-resident the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government parent believes that child benefit is not lawfully in payment, they Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary should contact HMRC who may investigate this claim. Session were previously provided to the committee and I hope you find this answer helpful. are available on the Parliament website. 1063W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1064W

Employment The number of flows onto old-style incapacity benefits in York unitary authority is around 60. This is calculated Mr Frank Field: To ask the Secretary of State for from further breakdowns available using the tabulation Work and Pensions in how many of the households tool. which have never included an adult in work he expects Information tracking people claiming old-style incapacity an adult to enter employment by 2015. [71676] benefits and what happened to them at the personal capability assessment (PCA) is held only from October Chris Grayling: The Department for Work and Pensions 2008 onwards. At this stage most assessments related to does not produce labour market forecasts. The independent existing longer-term incapacity benefit claims and not Office for Budget Responsibility has forecast a net new incapacity benefit claims, (i.e. repeat PCAs and not increase of around 1 million in total employment between the initial PCA). We have therefore presented information 2011 and 2015, but does not break down its forecasts by relating to both initial and repeat PCAs combined. household type The latest estimate published by the Office for National Table 1 shows information on the number and outcomes Statistics is that in April-June 2011, among UK households of PCAs carried out between March 2010 and February including at least one person aged 16 to 64 years, 2011 (the latest data available). Note that the information 370,000 households (1.8% of the total) contained no-one in Table 1 cannot be directly compared to data on new who had ever worked. A household is defined as having claims to IB as the data contain information on repeat never worked if all adult members are not currently in PCAs which make up the vast majority of PCAs carried employment and state that they have never had paid out in this time period. work (apart from casual or holiday work, or a job they Table 1: Personal capability assessments outcomes, March 2010 to February are waiting to begin). 2011 PCA Disallowed The number of households where no-one has ever exempt at PCA Pass PCA Total worked illustrates part of the wider problems of workless households and long-term unemployment that the UK Great Britain 37,700 47,500 184,400 269,600 currently faces. The Government are committed to tackling Yorkshire and 1,200 2,400 6,200 9,700 the Humber these urgent problems. This is why we launched the York unitary 0 100 100 200 Work programme this summer, which will give tailor authority made support to help people get off benefits and into Notes: work, and through universal credit we are overhauling 1. The information in the table is from benefit claims data held by the the benefits system to ensure that people are always Department for Work and Pensions and functional assessment data sourced from Atos Healthcare. better off in work. 2. Figures are rounded to the nearest 100 claims and totals may not sum due We have also begun to reassess 1.6 million of the to rounding. people who claim incapacity benefits to see if they are Table 2 shows information on appeals that have been fit for work. Around 10,000 people a week are being heard relating to PCAs carried out between March 2010 asked to take part in a process that will focus on what and February 2011 (as in Table 1). The Department they can do, not what they cannot. In return we will give holds information on appeals only once they have been them the specialist help they need to get back to work. heard by the Tribunals Service. Due to the time it takes Incapacity Benefits: Yorkshire and Humberside for appeals to be submitted to the Tribunals Service and heard, it is likely there are more appeals that have not Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Work yet been heard, so the number of appeals is likely to and Pensions how many people in (a) Great Britain, change as more up to date information becomes available. (b) Yorkshire and the Humber and (c) York (i) Table 2: Appeals heard for PCAs completed between March 2010 and February applied for incapacity benefit, (ii) were required to 2011 by decision made by the Tribunals Service Decision in attend a personal capability assessment, (iii) had their favour of incapacity benefit refused following an assessment and appellant Decision upheld Total (iv) had their incapacity benefit reinstated following a review or appeal in the latest 12-month period for Great Britain 5,200 6,100 11,300 [71456] Yorkshire and 100 200 300 which information is available. the Humber York unitary 000 Chris Grayling: Since October 2008, new claims to authority incapacity benefits have been made to employment and Notes: support allowance so the only flows to old-style incapacity 1. The data presented above come from benefit claims data held by the benefits—incapacity benefit (IB) and severe disablement Department for Work and Pensions, functional assessment data from Atos Healthcare and appeals data from the Tribunals Service. allowance (SDA)—have been from linked claims. 2. Figures are rounded to the nearest 100 claims and totals may not sum due Information on flows to incapacity benefits and other to rounding. benefits can be found on the Department’s tabulation tool at the following link: Jobseeker’s Allowance: Females http://83.244.183.180/flows/flows_on/tabtool.html For example, the following link shows flows onto Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State old-style incapacity benefits for people of working age for Work and Pensions how many women claimed by region. This shows the number of flows in the year to jobseeker’s allowance in Coventry in the latest period February 2011 was 26,500 in Great Britain, of which for which figures are available. [70702] 2,050 were in Yorkshire and the Humber. http://83.244.183.180/flows/flows_on/ibsda/cdquarter/ccgor/ Chris Grayling: The stock number of female jobseeker’s ccclient/a_carate_r_cdquarter_c_ccgor_p_ccclient_working allowance (JSA) claimants in Coventry, recorded in July _age.html 2011, is as follows: 1065W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1066W

Table 2: Annual per capita expenditure for all benefits recorded at local Number authority level paid to pensioners2 Per capita expenditure (£) Total female claimants receiving JSA 3,332 in Coventry 2009-10 2010-11 Notes: South Tyneside 8,400 8,600 1. Data taken from 100% count of unemployment-related benefits, Jobcentre Plus computer systems North-east 8,100 8,200 2. Figures include clerically held cases Great Britain 7,900 8,100 3. Caseload data is unrounded 4. Data are published at: https://www.nomisweb.co.uk Table 3: Annual per capita expenditure for all benefits recorded at parliamentary constituency level paid to pensioners3 Members: Correspondence Per capita expenditure (£) Ms Harman: To ask the Secretary of State for Work 2009-10 2010-11 and Pensions when he plans to reply to the letter from Jarrow 7,500 4— the right hon. Member for Camberwell and Peckham South Tyneside 7,600 7,700 of 27 July 2011 concerning the proposed closure of North East 7,300 7,500 Camberwell Jobcentre Plus. [71586] Great Britain 7,400 7,500 1 Includes all benefits paid to pensioners: attendance allowance, bereavement Chris Grayling: A reply was sent to the right hon. benefit/widow’s benefit, carer’s allowance, council tax benefit, housing benefit, Member on 5 August 2011. disability living allowance, pension credit, state pension, winter fuel payments, National Employment Savings Trust Scheme Christmas bonus, industrial injuries benefits, income support, over 75 TV licences, social fund, state second pension, and severe disablement allowance. 2 Includes all benefit paid to pensioners where data are available at local Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for authority level: attendance allowance, bereavement benefit/widow’s benefit, Work and Pensions whether he plans to allow transfers carer’s allowance, council tax benefit, housing benefit, disability living allowance, in to National Employment Savings Trust pensions pension credit, state pension and winter fuel payments. 3 Includes all benefit paid to pensioners where data are available at parliamentary before the 2017 review. [71151] constituency level: attendance allowance, bereavement benefit/widow’s benefit, carer’s allowance, disability living allowance, pension credit, state pension and Steve Webb: The independent ‘Making Automatic winter fuel payments. Enrolment Work’1 review, which reported last October, 4 Population data at parliamentary constituency level are not available for recognised that facilitating transfers is critical to success 2010-11 until October 2011. Notes: of reforms. The review concluded that these issues are 1. Figures are rounded to the nearest £100. not restricted to how transfer rules apply to NEST, but 2. Housing benefit and council tax benefit data are not available by parliamentary apply across the pensions market. The review also recognised constituency. 3. Expenditure data for 2010-11 are based on latest estimates of outturn. the importance of the transfer restrictions on NEST Source: during the roll-out of the reforms and recommended DWP statistical and accounting data and ONS population estimates. that the Government address the issue of transfers with a view to relaxing the restrictions on NEST once the Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for Work reforms were fully rolled out. and Pensions how many pensioners (a) in Jarrow The Government agree with the review’s conclusions constituency, (b) in South Tyneside, (c) in the and we are currently working with stakeholders to north-east and (d) nationwide were in receipt of consider the wider issues of facilitating transfers. We pension credit in each year since its inception. [70418] will publish proposals on how issues arising from short service refunds rules, small pots and transfers might be addressed in the autumn. Steve Webb: The information available is in the following 1 Making automatic enrolment work: a review for the Department table: of Work and Pensions. 2010. Department for Work and Pensions. Household recipients of pension credit in the Jarrow parliamentary constituency, Cm 7954 South Tyneside, the north-east and Great Britain Pensioners: Jarrow South As at Jarrow Tyneside Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for Work February parliamentary local Great and Pensions what information his Department holds each year constituency authority North-east Britain on how much per capita his Department has spent on 2004 4,980 9,660 135,940 2,282,040 pensioners in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) South 2005 5,760 11,150 155,420 2,654,210 Tyneside, (c) the north-east and (d) the UK in (i) 2006 5,870 11,380 157,420 2,708,970 2009-10 and (ii) 2010-11. [70097] 2007 5,880 11,350 157,600 2,730,480 Steve Webb: Parliamentary constituency, local authority 2008 5,890 11,200 156,460 2,722,780 and regional expenditure data are not available for all 2009 5,860 11,220 156,140 2,723,310 benefits. Details of benefits included in the per capita 2010 5,950 11,360 157,550 2,734,940 calculations in the following tables can be found in the 2011 5,970 11,070 154,630 2,693,720 footnotes. DWP is not responsible for Northern Ireland Notes: 1. Figures are rounded to the nearest 10. spending therefore we are unable to show expenditure 2. Pension credit was introduced on 6 October 2003. per capita for the UK. We have shown per capita 3. Pension credit household recipients are those people who claim pension expenditure for Great Britain. credit either for themselves or on behalf of themselves and a partner. 4. These data are available on the Department’s tabulation tool at: Table 1: Annual per capita expenditure for all benefits paid to pensioners (Great http://83.244.183.180/100pc/tabtool.html Britain)1 https://www.nomisweb.co.uk/Default.asp Per capita expenditure (£) 5. Northern Ireland data are the responsibility of the Department for Social Development in Northern Ireland. 2009-10 2010-11 Source: DWP Information Directorate: Work and Pensions Longitudinal Study 100% Great Britain 8,100 8,200 data 1067W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1068W

Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Table 2: Number and proportion of pensioners nationwide in low income and Pensions (1) how many pensioners were living in according to relative and absolute measures, After Housing Costs relative poverty in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) South Relative low income Absolute low income Number Number Tyneside, (c) the North East and (d) nationwide in (million) Percentage (million) Percentage each year since 1997; [70447] 1997-98 2.9 29 3.0 31 (2) how many and what proportion of pensioners 1998-99 2.9 29 2.9 29 were living in absolute poverty in (a) Jarrow 1999-2000 2.8 28 2.5 25 constituency, (b) South Tyneside, (c) the North East 2000-01 2.7 26 2.0 20 and (d) nationwide in each year since 1997. [70448] 2001-02 2.7 26 1.5 14 2002-03 2.5 24 1.2 12 2003-04 2.2 21 1.1 10 Steve Webb: The most commonly used measure of 2004-05 1.9 18 0.9 8 pensioner poverty relates to those with incomes below 2005-06 1.8 17 0.8 8 60% of contemporary median income, After Housing 2006-07 2.1 19 1.1 10 Costs. This is often referred to as relative poverty. 2007-08 2.0 18 1.0 9 2008-09 1.8 16 1.0 9 An alternative measure of poverty uses the 1998-99 2009-10 1.8 16 0.9 8 median income held constant in real terms, as opposed ‘—’ = Indicates less than 50,000 pensioners. Notes: to the contemporary median. This is often referred to as 1. These statistics are based on Households Below Average Income (HBAI) absolute poverty. data sourced from the Family Resources Survey (FRS). This uses disposable household income, adjusted using modified OECD equivalisation factors for Estimates of poverty, published in the Households household size and composition, as an income measure as a proxy for standard of living. Family Resources Survey figures are for Great Britain up to 1997-98, Below Average Income series, only allow a breakdown and for the United Kingdom from 1998-99 onwards. of the overall numbers in poverty at regional level. 2. Net disposable incomes have been used to answer the question. This includes Therefore, information is available for the North East earnings from employment and self-employment, state support, income from occupational and private pensions, investment income and other sources. Income region, but not available for Jarrow or South Tyneside. tax, payments, national insurance contributions, council tax/domestic rates and some other payments are deducted from incomes. Three-year averages are used to report regional statistics 3. Figures have been presented on an After Housing Cost basis. For After Housing Costs, housing costs are deducted from income. as single-year estimates are subject to volatility. 4. All estimates are based on survey data and are therefore subject to a degree of uncertainty. Small differences should be treated with caution as these will be The first table shows the number and percentage of affected by sampling error and variability in non-response. pensioners living in households in the North East of 5. The reference period for HBAI figures is the financial year. 6. Numbers of pensioners have been rounded to the nearest 100,000 pensioners. England with relative and absolute low incomes, After 7. Proportions of pensioners in low-income households have been rounded to Housing Costs, for three year periods spanning 1997-98 the nearest percentage point. to 2009-10, which is the latest year for which figures are available. Pensions The second table shows the number and percentage of pensioners in the UK in relative and absolute low Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for income, After Housing Costs in each year since 1997-98. Work and Pensions whether he plans to end short In 1997-98 the figures refer to Great Britain only.Thereafter, service refunds. [71152] the figures are for the United Kingdom. Table 1: Number and proportion of pensioners in the North East of England in Steve Webb: The Government ran a call for evidence low income according to relative and absolute measures, After Housing Costs on regulatory differences which included short service Relative low income Absolute low income refunds. The call closed on 18 April and the Government Three year Number Number published their initial response on 27 June. Short service period (million) Percentage (million) Percentage refund rules provide a valuable easement for employers 1997-98 to 0.1 31 0.1 30 and schemes to manage small pension pots. 1999-2000 But short service refunds in defined contribution 1998-99 to 0.1 31 0.1 26 schemes are inconsistent with automatic enrolment. 2000-01 With more people saving and higher job chum, the 1999-2000 0.1 28 0.1 20 to 01-02 Government do not want to see some individuals 2000-01 to 0.1 27 0.1 14 missing out on building their pension pot because of 2002-03 the rules. 2001-02 to 0.1 23 — 10 2003-04 The Department will publish a full set of proposals 2002-03 to 0.1 20 — 8 on how Government intend to address the short service 2004-05 refunds rules, small pots and transfers in the autumn. 2003-04 to 0.1 17 — 7 This will include a decision on short service refunds 2005-06 in DC occupational schemes and a consultation on 2004-05 to 0.1 17 — 6 2006-07 options to address small pension pots. 2005-06 to 0.1 19 — 7 2007-08 Mrs Main: To ask the Secretary of State for Work 2006-07 to 0.1 18 — 7 and Pensions what his most recent estimate is of the 2008-09 number of non-UK EU citizens who attempted to 2007-08 to 0.1 17 — 8 claim state pension in the UK without passing the 2009-10 habitual residence test. [71259] 1069W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1070W

Steve Webb: The UK state pension is a contributory Steve Webb: The provision that extends Social Fund benefit. It is payable worldwide to people who claim it budgeting loans to funeral and maternity expenses will after reaching state pension age and who satisfy the come into force two months after Royal Assent is granted national insurance contribution conditions. to the Welfare Reform Bill. People do not need to satisfy the habitual residence The criteria used to assess applications will be the test to get their state pension. existing budgeting loan criteria.

Pensions: City of York Social Security Benefits: EU Nationals

Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Work and Pensions what the cost of benefits paid to and Pensions how many people in (a) the City of York non-EU immigrants was in each of the last eight years. local authority area and (b) York Central constituency [71104] are in receipt of (i) the basic state pension and (ii) pension credit; and what the average weekly value of Chris Grayling: The information requested is not pension credit received is in each case. [71437] available. The UK’s benefit payment systems do not record the Steve Webb: The information available is in the following nationality of people receiving benefits and therefore it table: is not possible to determine the cost of benefits paid to State pension and pension credit recipients in the York local authority area and non-EU nationals. I have, however, commissioned work York Central parliamentary constituency to make information available on the nationality of Average weekly benefit claimants. Pension credit amount of State pension household pension credit Access to income-related benefits1 by non-European claimants recipients (£) economic area nationals is strictly limited. They are York local 37,690 6,480 48.97 excluded from such benefits because they are subject to authority immigration control, which prevents them from receiving York Central 15,350 3,810 49.99 public funds. Access to these benefits is therefore dependent parliamentary on the type of leave the Home Office grants the individual. constituency Notes: Those who have worked in the UK and paid national 1. Case loads are rounded to the nearest 10. insurance contributions may claim contributory benefits 2. The state pension figure provided is the total state pension case load. such as contribution-based jobseeker’s allowance if they Around 1% of state pension recipients are not in receipt of the basic state pension, but are receiving additional pension only or graduated retirement satisfy the contributions and other conditions for the benefit only. benefit. 3. Pension credit household recipients are those people who claim pension 1 credit either for themselves or on behalf of themselves and a partner. Income support, income-based jobseeker’s allowance, income-related 4. Information is published on our tabulation tool at employment and support allowance; pension credit, housing benefit http://83.244.183.180/100pc/tabtool.html and council tax benefit. Source: DWP Information Directorate: Work and Pensions Longitudinal Study. Social Security Benefits: Offenders Sick Leave: Musculoskeletal Disorders Julian Sturdy: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions whether he plans to review the benefits Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for Work paid to convicted criminals who reside in secure and Pensions how many people with musculoskeletal psychiatric hospitals. [71000] conditions living in each (a) region of England and (b) country in Great Britain were on long-term sick Chris Grayling: Currently those detained in secure leave in (i) 2008, (ii) 2009 and (iii) 2010. [70535] psychiatric hospitals who are sentenced and convicted criminals do not receive benefits. However, there are Maria Miller: There are few reliable sources of those who have not received a sentence who can, in sickness absence data in Great Britain. Employers pay certain circumstances, receive benefit. We are currently statutory sick pay (and in some cases occupational reviewing this policy. sick pay) but are not required to submit this information to the Government unless they are seeking Winter Fuel Payments: City of York reimbursement for monies paid under the percentage threshold scheme. Consequently there are no comprehensive Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Work centrally recorded administrative data. Sample sizes and Pensions how many households in York with at from survey data are also too small to address the least one person aged 75 years or over received the specific question raised. winter fuel allowance in 2010-11. [71439]

Social Fund: Funerals Steve Webb: Information for 2010-11 is not currently available. Ms Buck: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and The information is available in the document ″Winter Pensions when he expects Social Fund budgeting loans Fuel Payment recipients 2009-2010 by Parliamentary to be available to help relatives meet a family member’s Constituencies and Gender″. This is available in the funeral expenses; and what criteria he plans to use to Commons Library and on the internet at: assess applicants. [71680] http://research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/index.php?page=wfp 1071W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1072W

Working Tax Credit: Parents Mrs Villiers: I am able to confirm to the hon. Member that neither the British Transport Police nor the British Jonathan Reynolds: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport Police Authority used the Government Work and Pensions how many couples with children Procurement Card between 2008-09 and 2009-10. who claim working tax credit and who work between 16 and 24 hours a week include at least one partner who claims (a) carers allowance, (b) disability living ATTORNEY-GENERAL allowance, (c) incapacity benefit and (d) disability living allowance on behalf of a disabled child. [70470] Crown Prosecution Service: Mental Health Maria Miller: The information requested is not available. Catherine McKinnell: To ask the Attorney-General Neither the administrative data sets held by DWP, nor what training is provided to Crown Prosecution Service those held by HMRC, contain all the information needed staff on dealing with people who have mental health to link receipt of working tax credit by the specified disorders; and if he will make a statement. [71268] group with receipt of the benefits named in the question. The Attorney-General: The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) has recently developed an online (e-learning) TRANSPORT course on supporting victims and witnesses with mental health issues (as well as learning disabilities and autism). Bus Services: Concessions The course was launched in August 2011 and is mandatory for all prosecutors. In addition to this training, there is Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for detailed guidance that sets out the practice and procedure Transport if he will estimate the number of people aged to be followed when dealing with victims and witnesses 60 and over in the Leeds West constituency who are with mental health issues. There is separate guidance to eligible for the concessionary coach travel scheme. assist prosecutors when deciding whether to charge an [71690] offender who has a mental disorder. Norman Baker: Data relating to the number of people Catherine McKinnell: To ask the Attorney-General aged 60 years and older who are eligible for the what support is provided by the Crown Prosecution concessionary coach travel scheme are not available at a Service to suspected offenders with mental health constituency level. disorders; and if he will make a statement. [71269]

Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for The Attorney-General: The Crown Prosecution Service Transport if he will estimate the number of people (CPS) does not have direct contact with suspected offenders affected by the removal of the concessionary coach and is not responsible for providing support to defendants. travel scheme. [71691] There are ’Liaison and Diversion’ schemes in police Norman Baker: According to mid-2010 population stations and courts that screen defendants for mental estimates from the Office for National Statistics, there health problems. Defendants who consent will be assessed were 11,746,500 people aged 60 years and older who and may be referred to appropriate services for treatment were eligible for the concessionary coach travel scheme and support. in England. Catherine McKinnell: To ask the Attorney-General The Department does not hold information on the what assessment is made by the Crown Prosecution number of people with a disability who are eligible for Service of a person’s mental health before decisions on the concessionary coach travel scheme in England. whether to charge them are taken; and if he will make a Bus Services: Theft statement. [71270]

Rosie Cooper: To ask the Secretary of State for The Attorney-General: The Crown Prosecution Service Transport if he will take steps to improve co-ordination (CPS) does not carry out its own assessment of the and provision of information between National mental health of a suspect but may receive such information Express and other coach operators and police forces in from a mental health liaison and diversion schemes cases of theft from coaches. [70664] based at police stations or courts or from other sources such as the police, relatives or offenders’ solicitors. Norman Baker [holding answer 8 September 2011]: When there is sufficient reliable information about an Theft from coaches and the provision of information offender’s mental health, the CPS will take this into between coach operators and the police is a matter for account when making the decision whether to charge. the company involved and an operational matter for the Evidence that the defendant has a significant physical relevant police force concerned. or mental illness is a factor that the CPS will take into account when deciding if a prosecution is required in Government Procurement Card the public interest. However, the defendant’s health must always be balanced with the seriousness of the John Glen: To ask the Secretary of State for offence and the need to safeguard the public. Transport if he will publish the (a) purchase date, (b) transaction amount, (c) supplier and (d) level 3 or Departmental Written Questions enhanced transaction entry if held for each individual transaction undertaken by British Transport Police Thomas Docherty: To ask the Attorney-General what using the Government Procurement Card in (i) 2008-09 proportion of written questions tabled to him for and (ii) 2009-10. [71220] answer on a named day did not receive a substantive 1073W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1074W answer on the day named for answer between (a) and will provide full information to the Committee at 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (b) 9 March 2011 the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government and 19 July 2011. [71138] Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 Parliamentary Session were previously provided to the committee and The Attorney-General: The information requested is are available on the Parliament website. contained in the following table.

Number of Number Percentage not named day answered answered SCOTLAND questions substantially on substantially on tabled the named day the named day Departmental Public Expenditure (a) 27 May 66 60 9 2010-19 July 2011 Mr Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for (b) 9 March 18 17 6 Scotland what efficiency savings in his Department’s 2011-19 July 2011 administrative budget (a) were delivered in 2010-11 The Government have committed to providing the and (b) are targeted in 2011-12. [71114] Procedure Committee with information relating to written parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis David Mundell: The final administrative provision for and will provide full information to the Committee at the Scotland Office and Office of the Advocate General the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government for 2010-11 was £7.889 million. Our actual expenditure Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary was £7.66 million. For 2011-12, the administrative budget Session were previously provided to the committee and is £7.62 million. are available on the Parliament website. To spend less than our allocated budget in 2010-11 we reduced on costs wherever possible, utilised framework Government Procurement Card contracts between suppliers and other Government bodies to achieve maximum savings and cancelled the contract John Glen: To ask the Attorney-General if he will for the ministerial car in London. To ensure we deliver publish the (a) purchase date, (b) transaction amount, the required savings in 2011-12 we are aiming to reduce (c) supplier and (d) level 3 or enhanced transaction accommodation costs by sharing space with other entry if held for each individual transaction Government bodies, as well as investigating the possibility undertaken by the Crown Prosecution Service using the of sharing some back office functions with the other Government Procurement Card in (i) 2008-09 and (ii) offices. 2009-10. [71219] Departmental Written Questions The Solicitor-General: Reports detailing Government Procurement Card transactions undertaken by the Crown Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for Prosecution Service (CPS) will be placed in the Library Scotland what proportion of written questions tabled of the House. These reports cover the periods (i) 2008-09 to him for answer on a named day did not receive a and (ii) 2009-10 and show (a) purchase dates, (b) substantive answer on the day named for answer transaction amounts and (c) suppliers. between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (b) The Department does not hold level 3 or enhanced 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71133] transaction entry data centrally for individual transactions. Card holders do maintain manual records of the David Mundell: The information requested is as follows: transactions they make which will include some level 3 (a) Of the 177 questions received in this period, 167 (94%) equivalent data including item description. Providing were given a substantive answer on the day named. this information would however involve checking individual (b) Of the 54 questions received in this period, 51 (94%) were records across the CPS which would incur disproportionate given a substantive answer on the day named. cost. The Government have committed to providing the Procedure Committee with information relating to written parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis NORTHERN IRELAND and will provide full information to the Committee at the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government Departmental Written Questions Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary session were previously provided to the committee and Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for are available on the Parliament website. Northern Ireland what proportion of written questions tabled to him for answer on a named day did not Human Trafficking receive a substantive answer on the day named for answer between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71132] what discussions he has had with the First Minister on implementing the Government’s new strategy on Mr Paterson: The information requested is as follows: human trafficking. [71115] (a) Of the 34 questions received in this period, 31 (91%) were given a substantive answer on the day named. David Mundell: Policy responsibility for human trafficking (b) Of the 23 questions received in this period, 23 (100%) were rests with the Minister for Immigration. Combating given a substantive answer on the day named. human trafficking is a key priority for the Government The Government have committed to providing the and we are committed to tackling organised crime Procedure Committee with information relating to written groups who profit from this human misery, and to parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis protecting victims. There is an Inter-Departmental 1075W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1076W

Ministerial Group on Human Trafficking to co-ordinate Hugh Bayley: To ask the hon. Member for Caithness, work on trafficking across Government which includes Sutherland and Easter Ross, representing the House of Ministers from the devolved Administrations. The next Commons Commission, how many people employed meeting is scheduled for mid-autumn. by contractors to work for the House of Commons service were issued with parliamentary passes in (a) 2001-02, (b) 2005-06 and (c) 2010-11. [69744] HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION John Thurso: Our data retention policy means that we do not hold the data for 2001-02 and 2005-06, but Parliament: Security we have the data for 2010-11. The number of contractors or people employed by contractors who held parliamentary Mr Amess: To ask the hon. Member for Caithness, passes valid during some or all of the period from Sutherland and Easter Ross, representing the House of 1 January 2010 to 9 September 2011 was as follows: Commons Commission, which postholder is responsible for the setting of the criteria for the issuing Type of pass Count of security passes for access to the Parliamentary Estate for people who are not hon. Members, PED contractors 2,015 employees of hon. Members, or House of Commons PED contractor with escort status 363 staff; and to which areas such passes provide access. Metropolitan Police Service 826 [71027] Postal services 66 Contractors to the House (restricted 574 John Thurso: The Speaker sets the criteria for the access) issuing of security passes for access to the parliamentary Contractors to the House 92 estate for people who are not hon. Members, employees of hon. Members, or House of Commons staff. He receives advice on this from the House of Commons ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS Administration Committee. Passes that are issued allow Countryside: Access the pass holder access to the parliamentary estate. Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Amess: To ask the hon. Member for Caithness, Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many Sutherland and Easter Ross, representing the House of hectares of land in (a) England and (b) North Commons Commission, which postholder authorised Yorkshire and York have been opened to the public the opening of the Curtis Green entrance; who was under the Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000. consulted; what the cost to the public purse was of the [71490] opening; and what the purpose is of the opening. [71030] Richard Benyon: The areas of land opened to the public under the Countryside and Rights of Way (CROW) John Thurso: The vehicle entrance at Derby Gate is Act 2000 to date in England, North Yorkshire and York scheduled to close from November for a period of are shown in the following table. about six months while works are carried out to install the perimeter security measures. The Curtis Green entrance Hectares offers the most practical solution for vehicles access and North Yorkshire egress during the work. As the principal vehicle entry England county City of York point, improvements to the existing entrance were needed. Mapped open country 865,119 174,025 188 While upgrading the entrance, the opportunity was and registered common identified to improve traffic management in the long-term land1 when Derby Gate re-opens by establishing a one-way Dedicated land2 155,279 14,570 112 traffic flow system. This one-way system has been in Total 1,020,398 188,595 300 operation since the new facility was completed in August 1 This is open country (mountain, moor, heath or down) or registered common to resolve any problems in advance of Derby Gate’s land conclusively mapped under section 4 of the CROW, with the removal of some areas of excepted land (military byelaw, racecourse and aerodromes), temporary closure. Planning consent was required, which and of areas subject to military and national security restrictions, on the basis included an assurance that there would not be disruption that they are not subject to CROW access rights. Some of the land included in these figures will have been subject to pre-existing open access rights of the to the public road network. The business case for the type mentioned in CROW section 15, and as a result will not be subject to Curtis Green entrance improvement works was approved CROW access rights. in accordance with set procedures. Decisions on the 2 This is land voluntarily dedicated by its owner or long leaseholder for open authorisations of works and operations are made under access, under CROW section 16. delegations given by the House of Commons Commission, and in line with criteria set by Member committees Departmental Consultants where appropriate. It is not the Commission’s practice Austin Mitchell: To ask the Secretary of State for to publish names of individual staff who took particular Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many decisions. senior civil servants in her Department at each grade Subject to the agreement of the final account with had worked for PricewaterhouseCoopers, Ernst and the contractor, the total cost of the works to improve Young, Deloitte or KPMG immediately prior to taking the Curtis Green entrance is estimated currently to be up their appointment in each of the last four years; approximately £627,000. what consultancy agreements her Department had with As well as consultation among officials, letters were those firms in each such year; and how many sent to all Members in Norman Shaw and billboards consultants from those firms have advised her were posted in Portcullis House. Department in each such year. [68954] 1077W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1078W

Richard Benyon: The Rural Payments Agency (RPA), DEFRA (including executive agencies) had the which is an executive agency of my Department, recruited following contracts to provide services from these companies one senior civil servant from Deloitte, starting on 18 May over the last four years, some of which were not for 2011. No other senior civil servants were recruited by consultancy: my Department from these companies in the last four years.

Date of order Company Agreement

Core Department1 11 February 2010 Deloitte LLP Deloitte contractor work—security analysis of Oracle E-Business Suite 17 May 2010 Deloitte LLP RPA Control remediation Support 17 May 2010 Deloitte LLP RPA Operational support 17 May 2010 Deloitte LLP RPA debt and data project 5 July 2010 Deloitte LLP RPA SPS debt and data project 14 July 2010 Deloitte LLP RPA Operational Support (RMP 5811) 30 July 2010 Deloitte LLP RPA Ops support, post-July 2010 6 August 2010 Deloitte LLP External Training: Auditing Oracle 9 August 2010 Deloitte LLP Internal Audit Services 14 December 2010 Deloitte LLP Security analysis of Oracle E-Business Suite (EBS) and underlying database 25 January 2011 Deloitte LLP SPS Debt and Data project ph IV 7 February 2011 Deloitte LLP Expertise on winding up an NDPB—Sustainable Development Commission 7 March 2011 Deloitte LLP Finance support 28 October 2009 Deloitte MCS Ltd DEFRA RPA Review: Workstream 1—Finance and Data 14 December 2009 Ernst and Young LLP Provision of Carbon Accounting Specialist 10 May 2010 Ernst and Young LLP PPM Interim Team 12 April 2011 Ernst and Young LLP LEAN 16 December 2010 KPMG LLG Provision of Internal Audit Interim Resource 1 June 2011 KPMG LLG Science Agency Review Consultancy 15 August 2011 KPMG LLG Interserve Annual Reconciliation Audit 2011 27 November 2009 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Catalyst Consultant 18 December 2009 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Catalyst interim 21 December 2009 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP DERA RPA Review: Workstream 2—Operations 22 December 2009 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Provision of Forensic Investigation Support 19 January 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP DEFRA RPA Review: Workstream 3—Systems 15 February 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Provision of Interim Head of Internal Audit 9 April 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Seafish Financial Advisor 7 May 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Specialist Audit Work 13 May 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Infrastructure Adaptation Solutions to Climate Change 27 August 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP RPA technical due diligence 5 November 2010 PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP Waste PFI Credits

Rural Payments Agency 1 August 2008 Deloitte Review of RPA functions 13 January 2009 Deloitte Specialist accounting advice re introduction of IFRS 24 March 2009 KPMG Review and support of Internal Audit 21 October 2009 KPMG Work for chairman of Audit Committee 1 March 2010 KPMG Interim Head of Internal Audit 15 June 2010 Deloitte Review of Finance 11 September 2010 Deloitte Interim Head of Finance plus support 1 December 2010 PwC Interim Head of Internal Audit plus support 1 The core Department holds central records of contracts from November 2009 onwards, when new systems and processes were introduced. Collation of data in this format relating to periods prior to November 2009 would incur disproportionate cost.

The number of contractors from these companies In the core Department, the number of consultants who have worked in RPA in each of the last four years is used from these companies has not been kept centrally. as follows: To identify how many would incur disproportionate 2007-08: 36 cost. 2008-09: 8 2009-10: 40 Departmental Work Experience 2010-11: 13. Note that this shows the number of people who have Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for worked in each financial year and therefore the same Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the person will be counted against multiple years if their answer to the hon. Member for Liverpool, Wavertree of period of service crossed over from one year to the 19 October 2010, Official Report, columns 629-30W, on next.) departmental work experience, what guidelines her 1079W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1080W

Department issues on recruitment, selection, The valuation of ecosystem services was undertaken advertisement and operation of unpaid placements. with reference to the distribution and condition of [69472] ecosystems across the country, rather than with reference to administrative boundaries. Therefore the UK National Richard Benyon: The Department is currently reviewing Ecosystem Assessment did not separately value ecosystem and adding content to its work experience guidance. We services provided by the Chilterns area of outstanding will have this completed by mid September and the final natural beauty, although much of the valuation work version will be shared between DEFRA and the Agencies. will be relevant to that area due to the range of ecosystems The following documents are currently in use and contained within it. will be made available in the House Library: DEFRA Work Experience guidance; Fisheries: Western Sahara DEFRA Placements and Scheme guidance; Paul Flynn: To ask the Secretary of State for Centre for Environment, Fisheries and Aquaculture Science Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment (CEFAS) HR Policy Recruitment (pages 9 and 10 specifically); she has made of the effects of the EU-Morocco Veterinary Laboratories Agency (VLA) Work Experience leaflet. Fisheries Partnership Agreement on the indigenous Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for population of Western Sahara. [71425] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) Richard Benyon: I have made no assessment of the persons undertaking unpaid work experience, (b) impact of the EU Morocco Fisheries Partnership unpaid interns and (c) other persons in unpaid Agreement on the indigenous population of Western positions were working in her Department as of 1 July Sahara. However, my officials have asked the EU 2011. [69512] Commission to request such an assessment from the Richard Benyon: DEFRA and its Agencies had a Moroccan authorities. total of (a) 31 persons undertaking unpaid work experience Landfill (b) 0 unpaid interns (c) three in other unpaid positions. Mr Laurence Robertson: To ask the Secretary of Departmental Written Questions State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs which potentially dangerous particulates emanating from Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for landfill and hazardous waste sites (a) are and (b) are Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what proportion not tested for; and if she will make a statement. [70742] of written questions tabled to her for answer on a named day did not receive a substantive answer on the Richard Benyon: Environmental permits require operators day named for answer between (a) 27 May 2010 and to monitor any dust blowing off landfill sites. The 19 July 2011 and (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. results are normally expressed as the concentration of [71128] PM10s (all particles up to and including ten microns diameter). Richard Benyon: Between 27 May .2010 and 19 July Similar conditions may be imposed on sites treating 2011 638 questions for answer on a named day were hazardous waste where there is a risk of particulates tabled to DEFRA. Of these 343 or 53.8% were answered blowing off the site. The Environment Agency may on the named day. undertake monitoring in response to public concern Between 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011 203 questions about a specific site, and the parameters monitored will for answer on a named day were tabled to DEFRA. Of depend on the materials handled. these 94 or 46.3% were answered on the named day. The Government have committed to providing the Nature Conservation: Hydroelectric Power Procedure Committee with information relating to written parliamentary question performance, on a sessional Mr Charles Walker: To ask the Secretary of State for basis and will provide full information to the Committee Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what measures at the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government are in place to protect river habitats designated as Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary special areas of conservation or sites of special session were previously provided to the Committee and scientific interest from hydro-electric schemes; and if are available on the Parliament website. she will make a statement. [71051] Richard Benyon: Development in protected areas (special Environment Protection areas of conservation or sites of special scientific interest) is subject to specific legislation designed to ensure a Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for high level of environmental protection. This includes Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment hydro electric schemes. the National Ecosystem Assessment has made of the value of ecosystem services provided by the Chilterns The Environment Agency and Natural England have Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty. [69447] procedures in place to ensure that hydro electric schemes are only permitted where no adverse impact will take Richard Benyon: The National Ecosystem Assessment place on the features for which the site has been designated. has made assessments of the value of a range of ecosystem The Environment Agency is currently revising its services across the UK at a variety of spatial scales. This Hydropower Good Practice Guidelines with help from work is presented in the full technical report, which can Natural England, Countryside Council for Wales, be found on the UK National Ecosystems website, with developers and those with an interest in rivers. These the economic, health and well-being values of these will give further guidance on the conditions associated services examined in detail in chapters 22, 23 and 24. with hydropower schemes in protected areas. 1081W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1082W

Recycling: Coventry City Council Richard Benyon: The Government abolished the role of Rural Advocate in July 2010, and do not believe that Mr Robinson: To ask the Secretary of State for it is necessary or appropriate to have a publicly-funded Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much external rural campaigner when there are many respected funding her Department allocated to Coventry city rural organisations and commentators who already advocate council for the purposes of increasing recycling rates in strongly and effectively on behalf of rural people. (a) 2009-10 and (b) 2010-11. [70355] DEFRA Ministers are the Rural Champions within Government, and the Department remains keen to work Richard Benyon: DEFRA provided funding through closely with external stakeholders to ensure that the the Waste Infrastructure Capital Grant to upper tier needs and interests of rural communities and businesses local authorities outside London to support invest in are fully and fairly reflected in all policies and programmes. infrastructure, such as recycling and composting facilities, to boost recycling rates. Authorities in London receive In addition, the Government are exploring the scope support through the London Waste and Recycling Board. to encourage independent review of its approach to rural proofing, and will respond positively to any such DEFRA provided Coventry city council with the review. following amounts: Salmon: Conservation £

(a) 2009-10 546,799.84 Mr Charles Walker: To ask the Secretary of State for (b) 2010-11 200,572.29 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what statutory duties the Environment Agency has to protect salmon The Government provide funding more generally to spawning redds as part of its river management local authorities to support the delivery of their services obligations. [71052] through the Revenue Support Grant. This funding is not ring-fenced, giving councils the freedom to work Richard Benyon: The Environment Agency (EA) has with their residents to decide how best to prioritise their a general duty set out in The Environment Act 1995 to spending, including on the provision of recycling services. “maintain, improve and develop fisheries of salmon, trout, lampreys, smelt and freshwater fish”. Recycling: West Midlands The EA also has a duty to further the conservation of Mr Robinson: To ask the Secretary of State for salmon and their aquatic environment, which includes Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much salmon eggs and the gravels in which they are laid. revenue each local authority in the West Midlands has More specifically, under section 2(4) of the Salmon and raised from selling recyclable waste in each year since Freshwater Fisheries Act 1975 anyone who 2006. [70369] “wilfully disturbs any spawn or spawning fish, or any bed, bank or shallow on which any spawn or spawning fish may be, Richard Benyon: Data on revenue raised by local shall be guilty of an offence”. authorities from the sale of recyclable waste are not The maximum fine under section 2(4) is £2,500. held centrally. Sewers: Berkshire River Itchen: Hydroelectric Power Alok Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Charles Walker: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what the status estimate she has made of the number of privately- is of the Shears Mill mini-hydro scheme application on managed sewers in (a) Berkshire, (b) Reading and (c) the River Itchen; and what assessment her Department Reading West constituency. [70804] has conducted on the potential effects of this scheme on salmon spawning redds. [71050] Richard Benyon: DEFRA has no estimates of the number of privately-managed sewers located in (a) Richard Benyon: Eastleigh borough council has submitted Berkshire (b) Reading and (c) Reading West constituencies. an application for an impoundment licence in the River However, the impact assessment supporting The Water Itchen at Shears Mill to enable the restoration of turbines Industry (Schemes for Adoption of Private Sewers) for small-scale electricity generation. The River Itchen Regulations 2011, which came into force on 1 July 2011, is a designated site of special scientific interest and a estimated that in England and Wales approximately special area of conservation, placing duties on the 184,000 km of private sewers and 36,000 km of private Environment Agency to protect its chalk stream habitat lateral drains connect to and affect the public system, and species including salmon, bullhead and lamprey. but are not the responsibility of the water and sewerage Negotiations on the application continue in order to companies. ensure the proposed scheme is sensitive to the needs of habitat and species protection. Trade Unions Rural Advocate David Morris: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Simon Hart: To ask the Secretary of State for answer of 8 August 2011, Official Report, column Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what plans she 1179W, on trade unions, for what reasons it is expected has to provide an independent voice for rural that the level of spending by her Department and its communities after the expiry of the position of Rural executive agencies on trade union activities will fall Advocate. [71075] between 2010-11 and 2011-12. [70718] 1083W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1084W

Richard Benyon: It is expected that the level of Water Supply spending on trade union activities will fall because we have reduced the budget available for funding Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for facility time in 2011-12. This is in line with other cost Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) efficiencies we are making and reflects decreasing staff males and (b) females aged over 60 years had water numbers in the Department. It has resulted in a reduction supplies disconnected in each year since 1997; and if of full-time trade union representatives from 12 to six in she will make a statement. [R] [71235] core DEFRA. Further work is planned both in core DEFRA and the Executive Agencies to reduce further Richard Benyon: Disconnection from the water supply the number of full-time trade union representatives, has been banned since 30 June 1999 under the Water and the consequential cost. Industry Act 1999. Figures on disconnections between 1997 and 1999 are given as follows:

Number of water supply disconnections made by water undertakers for non-payment of a water bill (a) Total disconnections (b) Non- households (c) Households Percentage of households

1997-98 3,681 1,774 1,907 0.009 1998-99 2,877 1,748 1,129 0.005 1999-2000 3,582 3,455 127 0.001

The Government’s recent consultation on water Wildlife: Licensing affordability, “Affordable Water: a consultation on the Government’s proposals following the Walker Review Mr David: To ask the Secretary of State for of Charging”, which was published in April 2011 (and Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether she has closed July 2011) stated: considered removing cobras and other venomous “The Government will not reverse the ban on disconnection. snakes from the list of animals which require a licence Nor will we allow water companies to use reduced flow to be kept privately. [70269] devices (sometimes known as “trickle valves”) which, in the Government’s view, are tantamount to disconnection and could Mr Paice: DEFRA has not considered removing result in the same social and health problems that would arise cobras or other venomous snakes from the Schedule to from disconnection.” the Dangerous Wild Animals Act 1976, which lists the species requiring a licence to be kept privately. Wild Boar

Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what advice her Department has provided to the Forestry Commission Departmental Written Questions on policy on the culling of wild boar on land managed by the Commission in each of the last four years. Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for [70415] International Development what proportion of written questions tabled to him for answer on a named day did Mr Paice: The Forestry Commission England would not receive a substantive answer on the day named for have received the same advice as any other owner or answer between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and occupier requesting management advice for wild boar. (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71139] Natural England’s Wildlife Management and Licensing Team provides such advice on behalf of DEFRA. Its Mr Andrew Mitchell: Between 27 May 2010 and web page about wild boar has links to DEFRA’s wild 19 July 2011, 2% of written questions tabled to the boar action plan, which outlines the Government’s Department for International Development (DFID) for responsibilities in the management of feral wild boar in answer on a named day did not receive a substantive England, and to the wild boar best practice guides answer on the day named. Between 9 March 2011 and website. 19 July 2011 the proportion was 1%. This is clearly not good enough and will improve. Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for India: Internally Displaced People Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if she will estimate the number of wild boar culled in each local Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for authority area in each of the last four years. [70416] International Development what steps he has taken to help prevent the displacement of the Adivasi peoples of Richard Benyon: Primary responsibility for feral wild central India. [71154] boar management lies with local communities and individual landowners. Landowners, including local Mr Andrew Mitchell: The Department for International authorities, are free to control feral wild boar as they Development (DFID) works in two central Indian states see fit as long as it is carried out in a humane and legal with high populations of Adivasi (tribal) people: Madhya manner. Pradesh and Orissa. There is no requirement for landowners or local DFID programmes in these states help to promote authorities to report numbers of wild boar culled to the health, education and welfare of tribal people, DEFRA. This information is therefore not held centrally. especially women and girls. DFID also supports civil 1085W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1086W society groups, who help tribal communities to combat (5) what the cost to the public purse was of (a) cars discrimination and obtain public services and social leased by his Department to staff and (b) Ministerial entitlements. chauffeurs between June 2001 and May 2002; [68385] DFID is not currently supporting any programmes (6) what the cost to the public purse was of directly focused on preventing displacement. stationery purchased by his Department between June Overseas Aid 2001 and May 2002; [68389] (7) what late payments his Department has made to Chris Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for contractors between June 2001 and May 2002; and International Development what steps his Department what the cost to the public purse was of any (a) is taking to ensure that aid recently allocated by his penalty charges or (b) interest charges incurred in that Department to Ethiopia reaches its intended recipients. period. [68393] [71411] Mr Davey: Due to the age of the information requested Mr Andrew Mitchell: All DFID expenditure in Ethiopia an answer can be provided only at disproportionate is subject to stringent systems and safeguards to make cost. sure that every pound spent is used for the intended purpose. EU External Trade: Taiwan Our approach is well illustrated by the Protection of Basic Services (PBS) programme, which provides health Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, care, education and water to over 60 million people Innovation and Skills if he will make an assessment of across Ethiopia. DFID support to PBS is protected by a the likely impact on trade and business investment of range of systems and safeguards, including: quarterly an economic co-operation agreement between the EU audits; fairness tests that ensure that funds are distributed and Taiwan. [68153] fairly across the regions and districts of Ethiopia; and the posting of budgets at local levels—to promote Mr Davey: In 2008 the European Chamber of Commerce transparency and enable citizens to hold the authorities in Taipei asked Copenhagen Economics to examine the to account. We also provide funding to local civil society economic merits of trade enhancement measures between organisations to help citizens provide feedback on the the EU and the separate customs territory of Taiwan, quality and priorities of basic service delivery. And we Penghu, Kinmen and Matsu. The report estimated a are designing with other PBS contributors an independent boost of ¤2 billion per year to the EU GDP. grievance mechanism for citizens to report any wrongdoing. Insolvency

BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS Gordon Banks: To ask the Secretary of State for British Sky Broadcasting Business, Innovation and Skills whether he has made an estimate of the effect of amending the insolvency Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for rules to clearly define administration expenses on the Business, Innovation and Skills how much his number of businesses which would go into liquidation Department has spent on subscriptions to Sky TV instead of administration. [71344] since May 2010. [67555] Mr Davey [holding answer 12 September 2011]: Mr Davey: In the period May 2010 to present the Following a High Court decision in this area at the end Department has not held a subscription to Sky TV and of last year the Government invited views and evidence has made no payments to Sky TV. as to the impact of that decision from interested Departmental Expenditure stakeholders. One of the potential consequences raised was that some companies may now go into liquidation Gavin Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for rather than administration. We are considering all the Business, Innovation and Skills (1) what the cost to the representations made in deciding what legislative change public purse was for (a) first class and (b) all train might be required. travel by (i) Ministers, (ii) staff and (iii) special advisers Intellectual Property in his Department between June 2001 and May 2002; [68343] Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for (2) how many overseas visits were made by (a) Business, Innovation and Skills what plans he has to Ministers, (b) civil servants and (c) special advisers in bring forward legislative proposals to assist creative his Department between June 2001 and May 2002; and businesses in protecting their assets. [69666] what the cost to the public purse was of each such visit; [68347] Mr Davey: There are a range of Government measures (3) how many Government Procurement Cards were which will help creative businesses, including SMEs, to used by staff of his Department between June 2001 protect their innovative works. Those requiring or most and May 2002; and what the (a) name of the supplier, likely to require legislation include ongoing reform of (b) date and (c) value was of each transaction during the Patents County Court to enable easier access to the this period; [68355] courts, certain recommendations in the recent Hargreaves (4) what the cost to the public purse was of (a) four review of intellectual property (‘Digital Opportunity’), star, (b) five star and (c) other hotel accommodation and measures flowing from the Digital Economy Act to for (i) staff, (ii) Ministers and (iii) special advisers in his enable copyright owners to tackle online infringement Department between June 2001 and May 2002; [68369] of copyright. 1087W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1088W

Micro Firms of employees with long-term sickness as a result of musculoskeletal conditions; and if he will make a Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State statement. [70408] for Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has made of the case for exempting micro firms from Maria Miller: I have been asked to reply. (a) redundancy regulations and (b) other provisions The Department does not have an estimate of the of employment law. [71007] annual cost of businesses of employees with long-term sickness as a result of musculoskeletal conditions. Mr Davey [holding answer 12 September 2011]: A Employers pay statutory sick pay (and in some cases moratorium exempting micro businesses from new occupational sick pay) and are not required to submit regulation applies to new employment law, and the this information to the Government unless they are recent Modern Workplaces proposals take this into seeking reimbursement for monies paid under the account. However, no new regulations in relation to Percentage Threshold scheme. redundancy are currently planned, and no assessment has therefore been made in this specific area. Superconductors: Research More widely, the Employment Law Review is considering how to reduce the burden of existing regulation on Mr Wallace: To ask the Secretary of State for businesses of all sizes, to make it easier for them to take Business, Innovation and Skills pursuant to the answer on staff and grow. Any proposals for reform would of 19 July 2011, Official Report, column 990W, on need to assess the impact on the economy as a whole, superconductors: research, if he will provide details on including on all-sized firms, workers and Government. the 45 grants to academic institutions for research into Where relevant, proposals would also need to consider superconductors. [68803] whether an exemption for micro-businesses would be appropriate. Mr Willetts: The Engineering and Physical Sciences Research Council (EPSRC) has provided long-term support Post Offices for research into the study of superconductors. Currently the EPSRC portfolio for superconductivity represents Michael Connarty: To ask the Secretary of State for 45 grants into UK academic institutions for a total Business, Innovation and Skills what discussions he has value of £19 million. A full breakdown of the grants by had with the post office on (a) reduction of queuing in grant title, institution and value will be placed in the post offices and (b) improvements to customer Libraries of the House. services. [71358] Some of the grants in the table span a number of research areas with proportions devoted to superconductors. Mr Davey: I have regular discussions with Post Office These proportions add up to 45 whole grants, spread Limited’s management about a wide range of network over 67 projects. and customer service issues but operational responsibility for quality and standards of service in post offices rests with the company. I have therefore asked Paula Vennells, the managing director of Post Office Ltd, to respond COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT directly to the hon. Member and a copy of her reply will Civil Disorder: Birmingham be placed in the Libraries of the House. Post Offices: Bank Services Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what steps he is Michael Connarty: To ask the Secretary of State for taking to support businesses which incurred a loss of Business, Innovation and Skills what discussions he is earnings following the public disorder in Birmingham having with banks to encourage all banks to offer the in August 2011. [70453] full range of current account transactions at post Robert Neill: As part of a package of measures to offices; and what recent progress he has made. [71359] help local communities and businesses to recover from Mr Davey: This Government have been clear that we these disturbances, we have set up the £20 million High wish to see a situation where all UK current accounts Street Support Scheme. Working with local authorities, are accessible through the post office network. While the scheme provides business rate hardship relief, building this will ultimately be a commercial decision for each confidence and helping affected businesses get back up bank, Ministers and officials have had regular contact and running. with HSBC and Santander, who do not currently extend The scheme is specifically designed to help as many this access to all of their customers, on this subject. businesses as possible get back in business as quickly as Details of the arrangements between individual banks possible, rather than as a compensation fund for direct and Post Office Limited (POL) are a commercial matter, loss of earnings or business income. and therefore the responsibility of senior management This does not mean that the scheme will not help at POL. small and medium-size enterprises in other related ways. The grants will cover many other costs of re-starting the Sick Leave: Musculoskeletal Disorders business, including, for example, staff costs incurred while the business is affected by temporary closure, Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for many of the costs not covered fully by insurance and Business, Innovation and Skills what estimate his help with cash flow while insurance claims are being Department has made of the annual cost to businesses made. 1089W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1090W

It will also fully reimburse local authorities for their Departmental Ministerial Policy Advisers costs in providing hardship relief for businesses affected by the disturbances. I hope that local authorities would Gavin Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for take full account of this in taking the decision to offer Communities and Local Government how many (a) relief to affected businesses. I know that some local special advisers and (b) press officers were employed authorities have already decided to do this and as by his Department between June 2007 and May 2010; business rates are a significant aspect of a businesses and what the cost to the public purse was in (i) cash operating costs, this should make a real difference to and (ii) real terms of such appointments. [68330] businesses. Consumers Robert Neill: The Department’s special adviser and Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State press office full-time equivalent staff numbers are for Communities and Local Government what steps he summarised in the following table: has taken since his appointment to improve consumer Special advisers Press office staff protection in the private rented sector; and if he will make a statement. [71548] 2007-08 3 38 2008-09 3 43 Grant Shapps: This Government are committed to 2009-10 3 45.58 ensuring that consumers are treated fairly. At the same time, we do not want to swamp business in red tape The number of special advisers within the Department which would force up rents and reduced the choice of varies within the year (as appointments sometimes overlap). accommodation for tenants. The private rented sector is The numbers given in the above table represent the an excellent example of how our approach can secure number there were for the majority of each year. In improvements in consumer protection without excessive 2010, the Department employed three special advisers regulatory burdens. Recent initiatives include support up to the election in May 2010, and two special advisers for the industry led SAFEagent campaign; the publication subsequent to the election. of clear, accurate fact sheets on rights and responsibilities Salary costs for the Department’s special advisers are of landlords and tenants; and coupled with legislation, given in the following table: in the Localism Bill, to safeguard tenancy deposit protection. £ Departmental Flags 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10

Charlie Elphicke: To ask the Secretary of State for Cash terms 240,252 201,850 296,653 Communities and Local Government pursuant to the Real terms 250,920 205,137 296,653 answer to Lord Stoddart of Swindon of 26 July 2010, House of Lords, Official Report, column 272WA, on As part of the new Government’s transparency agenda, EU: flag, what steps his Department has taken to the individual salaries of special advisers in the current inform the European Commission that it has complied Administration are published on the Cabinet Office with Article 7(2) of EC Regulation 1828/2006 by flying website; the pension arrangements are as laid out in the the EU flag since 2007. [68900] Cabinet Office’s model contract for special advisers. Robert Neill: As a consequence of Article 7(2) EC Salary costs for the Department’s Press Office, which Regulation 1828/2006, my Department is obliged to fly includes staff working on marketing , news planning the flag of the European Union in front of its premises and speech-writing as well as press office duties, are for one week every year, after Europe Day. There is no given in the following table: formal requirement to inform the European Commission, but I am informed that visible failure to comply would £ result in the European Commission imposing fines 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 (described as ’financial corrections’). Cash terms 2,921,195 3,026,170 3,161,505 Ministers consider that European regulations should Real terms 3,050,902 3,075,443 3,161,505 focus on ensuring that European funds are used to best promote the economic development of the EU. I wish The source for real term calculations are the GDP to reassure hon. Members that the United Kingdom’s deflators as published 28 June 2011 by HM Treasury; Union flag always flies in superior position outside our 2009-10 is used as the base year. Department on its primary flagpole. On the second flagpole, in the 51 weeks of the year Departmental Written Questions that are not regulated by the European Commission, since May 2010 Ministers have undertaken to fly national, Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for county and military flags of United Kingdom. This has Communities and Local Government what proportion included formally recognising historic counties such as of written questions tabled to him for answer on a Middlesex. named day did not receive a substantive answer on the On 1 April 2011, the Department flew a flag to mark day named for answer between (a) 27 May 2010 and Britain’s maritime heritage. 19 July 2011 and (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. On 4 July 2011, we flew the flag of the United States [71124] of America to note the centenary of Ronald Reagan’s birth and to mark the enduring ties of friendship between Robert Neill: 17% (143 out of 853) of named day our two nations. We intend to fly a further range of parliamentary questions for answer between 27 May worthy flags in the months ahead. 2010 and 19 July 2011 were not answered on the due 1091W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1092W date. Within this, the proportion not answered on the Percentage of land area due date between 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011 was Local authority 1995-98 1999-2002 2003-06 2007-10 23% (58 out of 250). The Government have committed to providing the Stoke-on-Trent 95 59 55 90 Procedure Committee with information relating to written Source: Land Use Change Statistics, Department for Communities and Local Government parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis and will provide full information to the Committee at the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government Tristram Hunt: To ask the Secretary of State for Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary Communities and Local Government what the Session were previously provided to the committee and percentage change was in brownfield site development are available on the Parliament website. between (a) 1997 and 2007, (b) May 1997 and May 2010 and (c) May 2010 and the latest period for which Derelict Land figures are available. [71353]

Justin Tomlinson: To ask the Secretary of State for Robert Neill: The following table provides estimates Communities and Local Government what incentives for the proportion of land changing to developed use are in place to encourage developers to use brownfield that was previously-developed land in England over the sites in preference to greenfield sites. [70787] period 1997 to 2009. Such ’brownfield’ development including building on residential gardens. Robert Neill: The Government believe that local communities should determine their own vision for the Percentage of land area England future development of their area, setting out in their local plan which sites are most appropriate for development. 1997 51 The draft National Planning Policy Framework makes 1998 51 clear that councils should make effective use of land, 1999 52 allocating for development land with the least environmental 2000 53 and amenity value where practical. We are removing the 2001 57 national brownfield target, as this had a distorting 2002 59 effect in some areas, driving up land prices and resulting 2003 57 in high density, unpopular development. 2004 60 2005 61 Tristram Hunt: To ask the Secretary of State for 2006 52 Communities and Local Government what the 2007 55 percentage change was in brownfield site development 2008 53 in the city region of (a) Bristol, (b) Newcastle Upon 20091 51 Tyne, (c) Liverpool, (d) Cardiff, (e) Nottingham, (f) 1 Provisional estimate. Source: Southampton, (g) Leeds, (h) Bradford, (i) Land Use Change Statistics, Department for Communities and Local Government Birmingham, (j) Stoke-on-Trent, (k) Greater Manchester and (l) Belfast between May 1997 and May 2010. [71351] Derelict Land: Greater London

Robert Neill: The following table provides estimates of the proportion of land changing to developed use Tristram Hunt: To ask the Secretary of State for that was previously-developed land in Bristol, Newcastle Communities and Local Government what the Upon Tyne, Liverpool, Nottingham, Southampton, Leeds, percentage change in brownfield site development in Bradford, Birmingham, Stoke-on-Trent, Manchester Greater London was between 1997 and 2010. [71352] (defined as area of Manchester city council). Estimates for Cardiff and Belfast are not available in Robert Neill: The following table provides estimates this form but some information may be available from for the proportion of land changing to developed use the devolved Administrations. that was previously-developed land for London, for the Such ‘brownfield’ development included building on years 1997 to 2009 (the latest available estimate). Such residential gardens. The estimates are shown as averages ’brownfield’ development including building on residential for ‘four year periods’ because of volatility in estimates gardens. at local authority level for individual years. Percentage of land area London

Percentage of land area 1997 81 Local authority 1995-98 1999-2002 2003-06 2007-10 1998 88 Birmingham 86 62 66 87 1999 80 Bradford 53 68 86 62 2000 89 Bristol 60 77 84 70 2001 85 Leeds 61 61 69 67 2002 88 Liverpool 86 77 71 91 2003 91 Manchester 88 41 70 83 2004 91 Newcastle Upon 80 74 82 61 2005 91 Tyne 2006 78 Nottingham 88 46 41 75 2007 95 Southampton 82 52 61 86 2008 81 1093W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1094W

Housing: Energy Percentage of land area London

20091 92 Mr Laurence Robertson: To ask the Secretary of 1 Provisional estimate. State for Communities and Local Government what Source: Land Use Change Statistics, Department for Communities and Local Government steps he is taking to ensure that new houses meet targets for (a) the reduction of carbon emissions and (b) energy efficiency; and if he will make a statement. Employment Agencies: Public Finance [71024]

Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for Andrew Stunell [holding answer 9 September 2011]: Communities and Local Government (1) if he will The “Plan for Growth”: estimate the cost to the public purse of employment of http://cdn.hm-treasury.gov.uk/2011budget_growth.pdf external recruitment consultants by local authorities in set out our policy on zero carbon homes so that new the latest period for which figures are available; [70168] homes do not add additional carbon emissions to our (2) if he will issue guidance to local authorities on carbon footprint. the cost implications of employing external As part of our policy we want to ensure that zero recruitment consultants. [70169] carbon homes must be energy efficient homes. We have already made clear our intention to introduce the Fabric Robert Neill: It is for councils, as individual employers, Energy Efficiency Standard as recommended by the to ensure that they manage and recruit their work forces independent Zero Carbon Hub. This will ensure that in a way that delivers the best value for money for homes are warmer, and cheaper and easier to heat. taxpayers. While we have no plans to publish any such My Department is working on other aspects of the guidance, given the need to achieve savings, councils policy, including looking at the right level for carbon will wish to review their work force costs, including the reductions on the site of the homes itself; to build on use of consultants, to help preserve front-line services. the industry’s commitment to move to an approach All local authorities are asked to make public any based on real world carbon savings rather than modelled item of spend over £500. This means that any residents reductions in emissions; and, where emissions cannot can see for themselves how much their local authority is be mitigated cost effectively measures on the site of the spending on external recruitment consultants. The home, to ensure that mechanism is available that allows Government are clear that local authorities should be house builders to meet their obligations at a cost no held to account by the citizens that they serve, not higher than the Government’s long term value of carbon. central Government Departments. The Department of Energy and Climate Change has a range of fuel poverty policies to assist low income, vulnerable households irrespective of the age of the Government Procurement Card property. Inform Gavin Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many James Wharton: To ask the Secretary of State for Government Procurement Cards were used by staff of Communities and Local Government whether his his Department between June 2007 and May 2010; and Department has provided funding to the organisation what the (a) name of the supplier, (b) date and (c) Inform in the last five years. [71666] value was of each transaction during this period. [68353] Andrew Stunell: Inform, a centre for independent research on new religious movements, has received funding Robert Neill: I refer my hon. Friend to my answers to from the Department in each of the last five years. We my hon. Friend the Member for Bristol North West are considering whether further grant support is appropriate. (Charlotte Leslie), on 7 June 2011, Official Report, columns 33-34W, and 11 July, 2011, Official Report, Inventory Companies column 56W.Copies of Government Procurement Card transactions for financial years 2009-2010, 2008-2009, Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State 2007-2008 and 2006-2007 have been deposited in the for Communities and Local Government if he will Library of the House. bring forward proposals for the regulation of inventory The Department has also published full details of all companies instructed by the private rented sector; and transactions on the Government Procurement Card if he will make a statement. [71547] since 2006 (including financial year 2010-11) on its Freedom of Information disclosure log on the Department’s Grant Shapps: It is a general principle of this Government website: that we will not rush into regulation where voluntary approaches to ensuring safeguards for consumers have http://www.communities.gov.uk/corporate/foi/disclosure-log/ disclosurelog2011/jul2011/gpc20062011/ not been properly tested and where there is little evidence to suggest that such an approach is needed. Therefore, A total of 135 Government Procurement Cards were given the paucity of evidence to suggest any problems used in the period June 2007 to May 2010. with inventory companies that might be remedied by The Department has reviewed its policy on Government regulation, we have no plans to regulate this sector. Procurement Card usage and has reduced the number Excessive regulation would push up rents and reduce of cards on issue to 36. the choice of accommodation for tenants. 1095W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1096W

Local Government: Expenditure Total expenditure on employees as reported by authorities to Department for Communities and Local Government Chris Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for on Revenue Outturn (RO) forms. This includes all direct Communities and Local Government pursuant the oral and indirect employee expenses including pay, employers’ answer of 5 September 2011, Official Report, column 5, national insurance and pension contributions, location on local government expenditure, what the evidential allowances and other employee related costs such as basis is for the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of training and recruitment and retention premiums. State’s estimate that 20 per cent. savings could be made Figures are not necessarily comparable year-on-year by local authorities on expenditure. [71508] owing to changes in the funding, function and structure of local authorities during this time. Robert Neill: It is the Local Government Group’s own findings from its Local Productivity Programme, which has assessed the experience of councils of making Local Government: Standards savings through collaborative procurement, that has identified savings of up to 20% in some service areas. This is evidenced in the Procurement, Capital and Shared Andrew Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Assets Productivity Workstream’s published “Response Communities and Local Government what to Spending Review, Quick Wins Strategy, October performance statistics local authorities are under a 2010”. The document is available here: statutory requirement to collect; and what plans he has for any changes to such requirements in the next three http://www.niepbuiltenvironment.org.uk/documents/ years. [68975] PCSAWorkstream-QuickWinsStrategyOct2010.pdf Local Government: Manpower Robert Neill: Following the abolition in 2010-11 of local area agreements and the National Indicator Set Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for there is no longer any general centralised collection of Communities and Local Government how much (a) performance data from local authorities. The Single list local authorities in England and (b) City of York of central Government data requirements from local council spent on employing (i) educational and (ii) government (the ″Single Data List″) published by my other staff in (A) 2002-03 and (B) the latest year for Department on 14 July 2011 lists all data returns that which figures are available; and what change there has central Government expects from local government. been in the proportion of (1) local authority and (2) Central Government does not distinguish between data City of York council expenditure on staff since provided to it for performance or other purposes. 2002-03. [71486] The following extract from the Single Data List shows all those data collections which local authorities are Robert Neill: The information requested is in the under a specific statutory obligation to collect. This list following table: includes all statutory collections (including those which Employee expenditure are required to fulfil legal obligations under European/ £ million International law and directives), regardless of whether 2002-03 2010-111 or not they are collected for performance purposes.

City of York The length of this list illustrates the scale of the data Education service 67.5 99.5 reporting and bureaucratic burdens placed on local Other services 37.6 84.3 government by central Government. All services 105.1 183.7 Since May 2010, Departments across Whitehall have ended a wide range of unjustified data demands and Percentage of total net current expenditure— 63 72 bureaucratic burdens placed on local government; including all services Comprehensive Area Assessment, the National Indicator Set, the 4,700 Local Area Agreement targets, and over England 40 separate data collection requirements such as the Place Survey. This has already reduced the bureaucratic Education service 21,972.8 32,463.5 burden placed on local government, but there is more to Other services 22,372.0 33,083.3 do. All services 44,344.8 65,546.9 Reducing unnecessary burdens will free councils to Percentage of total net current expenditure— 68 64 protect frontline services and focus spending on local all services priorities. The coalition Government are committed to 1 Provisional outturn giving councils more freedoms and flexibilities.

Extract from the Single Data List showing all local authority data collections which are a statutory requirement Data collection Department Reference1

House Building Return (form P2) DCLG 002-00 Housing Revenue Account Subsidy Claim forms DCLG 015-00 to 017-00 Housing Revenue Account Subsidy base data forms DCLG 018-00 Housing Capital Receipts pooling DCLG 167-00 Housing Capital Receipts pooling—signed paper return DCLG 168-00 Annual Monitoring Reports DCLG 024-00 Revenue Summary DCLG 026-00 1097W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1098W

Extract from the Single Data List showing all local authority data collections which are a statutory requirement Data collection Department Reference1

Revenue Grants DCLG 027-00 Revenue Outturn DCLG 028-00 Trading Services Return DCLG 029-00 Subjective Analysis Return DCLG 030-00 Business Improvement Districts Outturn DCLG 031-00 Revenue Account budget DCLG 032-00 Revenue Account Specific and Special Grants DCLG 033-00 Business Improvement Districts Revenue Account DCLG 034-00 Capital Outturn Return DCLG 035-00 to 038-00 Capital Forecast Return DCLG 039-00 Capital Estimates Return DCLG 040-00 Capital Payments and Receipts (forms CPR 1 to 4) DCLG 041-00 Budget Requirement returns (forms BR1 to 3) DCLG 042-00 Quarterly Return of Council Taxes and Non-domestic rates DCLG 043-00 and 166-00 Quarterly Revenue Outturn DCLG 044-00 Council Tax Base DCLG 045-00 National Non-domestic Rates Return 1 DCLG 046-00 National Non-domestic Rates Return 2 downward calculation DCLG 047-00 National Non-domestic Rates Return 3 DCLG 048-00 Local Government Pension Scheme Funds (form SF3) DCLG 050-00 Monthly Borrowing and Lending Inquiry DCLG 051-00 Quarterly Borrowing and Lending Inquiry DCLG 052-00 Public Contracts Regulations 2006 DCLG 213-00 Quarterly Return of Wages and Salaries DCLG 053-00 Fire and rescue incident data DCLG 060-00 Fire and rescue service non-financial annual returns DCLG 061-00 Fire Fighters Pension Fund—Non-financial data DCLG 172-00 Fire Fighters Pension Fund—Financial data DCLG 173-00 Imports of products of animal origin from third countries DEFRA 068-00 Animal Welfare: during transport; on Farm DEFRA 069-00 Prosecutions under the Animal Health Act 1981 (and other animal health and welfare legislation) DEFRA 073-00 (Section 80 Report) Local Pollution Control Statistical Survey DEFRA 075-00 Incidents under the Environmental Damage Regulations 2009 DEFRA 078-00 Fly-tipping incidents (Flycapture) DEFRA 079-00 Flood and coastal erosion risk management and sustainable drainage systems DEFRA 080-00 Developments in flood risk areas DEFRA 243-00 WasteDataFlow—LA waste management statistics DEFRA 082-00 Local Authority Private Water Supplies Data submission DEFRA 083-00 Child Death Review Panels (form LSCB1) DfE 086-00 Children in Need Census DfE 087-00 Children Looked After (form SSDA903) DfE 088-00 Missing from Care and Home DfE 089-00 Private Fostering (form PF1) DfE 090-00 Secure Children’s Homes (form SA1) DfE 092-00 Early Years Census DfE 096-00 Early Years Foundation Stage Profile DfE 098-00 Admissions: Parental Preferences met DfE 100-00 Admissions: report to the School Adjudicator DIE 101-00 Key Stage assessment data DfE 161-00 School Census DfE 159-00 Alternative Provision Census DfE 102-00 Parental Responsibility (Attendance and Behaviour) DfE 104-00 Pupil Referral Unit Census DfE 105-00 School Admissions Appeals DfE 107-00 School Capacity DfE 108-00 School Exclusion Appeals DfE 109-00 School Workforce Census DfE 111-00 Section 251 financial return—budget DfE 113-00 Section 251 financial return—outturn DfE 182-00 Special Educational Needs Statement Completion DfE 115-00 Standards Fund monitoring (TO CEASE DURING 2011-12) DfE 116-00 Teacher Pension Contributions DfE 117-00 1099W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1100W

Extract from the Single Data List showing all local authority data collections which are a statutory requirement Data collection Department Reference1

Teacher Pension Service DfE 118-00 16-18 Year-olds not in employment education or training DfE 119-00 Chief Finance Officer Sign-Off Statements DfE 120-00 Consistent Financial Reporting DfE 171-00 Children with Statements of Special Educational Needs (form SEN2) DfE 189-00 Road Lengths Survey DfT 132-00 Personal Social Services Expenditure return (form PSSEX1) DH 133-00 Referrals, Assessments and Packages of Care DH 134-00 Adult Social Care Survey DH 135-00 Adult Social Care Combined Activity Return DH 136-00 Abuse of Vulnerable Adults return DH 137-00 Mental Health Guardianship return (form SSDA702) DH 138-00 Deprivation of Liberty Safeguards Return DH 139-00 Carers Survey DH 140-00 National Minimum Data Set—Social Care workforce data DH 142-00 Register of blind and partially sighted people (form SSDA902) DH 144-00 Register of deaf or hard of hearing people (form SSDA910) (PROPOSED FOR DELETION) DH 174-00 Grant Funded Services return (PROPOSED FOR DELETION) DH 175-00 Personal Social Services Staffing (form SSDSOOI) (PROPOSED FOR DELETION) DH 176-00 Housing Benefit and Council Tax Benefit subsidy estimates and claims DWP 150-00 Discretionary Housing Payment estimates and claims DWP 151-00 Whole of Government Accounts HMT(DCLG) 183-00 Alcohol and Late Night Refreshment Licensing HO 163-00 Weights and measures enforcement (section 70) BIS/NMO 001-00 Public rights of way BIS/OS 158-00 Parish council boundaries BIS/OS 177-00 National Fraud Initiative DCLG/AC 170-00 Fraud and Corruption Survey DCLG/AC 242-00 Gambling Licensing Authority Returns DCMS/GC 207-00 Small Society Lottery DCMS/GC 208-00 Gambling Temporary Use Notices DCMS/GC 209-00 Club Machine Permits and Club Gaming Permits DCMS/GC 210-00 Gambling Premises data DCMS/GC 211-00 Flood risk management capacity DEFRA/EA 244-00 Strategic Overview of Flood and Coastal Erosion risk DEFRA/EA 245-00 Reporting on EU flood risk regulations DEFRA/EA 246-00 Newly Qualified Teachers—Induction Returns Dfe/GTC 200-00 Fee Collection—Salary Deduction Process DfE/GTC 201-00 Childcare inspection data DfE/Ofsted 219-00 Local Authority Adult and Community Learning provision DfE/Ofsted 225-00 Standard bus permits DfT/TC 124-00 Health protection Part2A Order notifications DH/HPA 143-00 Notification of Infectious Diseases DH/HPA 233-00 Billing Authority Report HMRC/VOA 241-00 Youth Justice Management Information System MOJ/YJB 180-00 Food Hygiene (Local Authority Enforcement Monitoring System) FSA 190-00 Food Standards (Local Authority Enforcement Monitoring System) FSA 191-00 Imported Food (Local Authority Enforcement Monitoring System) FSA 192-00 Central Lists of Feed Business Establishments FSA 193-00 Approved Food Premises FSA 194-00 Imported Food Safeguard Measures FSA 195-00 Animal Feed Data returns FSA 196-00 Performance Standards for Electoral Registration Officers Electoral Commission2 227-00 Performance Standards for Returning Officers Electoral Commission2 228-00 Statement of Postal Ballot Papers Electoral Commission2 229-00 Annual Financial Information return Electoral Commission2 230-00 Electoral administration plans Electoral Commission2 231-00 1 Reference numbers relate to the collection reference in the main Single Data List. 2 Collections by the Electoral Commission are included on the Single Data List for completeness. The Commission is a body entirely independent from Government, and these returns are not subject to the normal arrangements for the single data list.

The full Single Data List is published on the Department The Government are committed to reducing the burden for Communities and Local Government website at: of data collection on local authorities, and the Single Data List provides a mechanism for ensuring this. However, http://www.communities.gov.uk/localgovernment/ decentralisation/tacklingburdens/singledatalist/ there will be situations where new reporting requirements 1101W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1102W are necessary. For example, from 2013-14 local authorities Robert Neill: It is our intention that the proposed will be reporting on public health outcomes and other local authority baselines, tariffs and top ups, and the issues following transfer of responsibilities and functions basis on which they are calculated, will be subject to in this area. These and any other changes will be captured consultation and that local authorities will be able to and reflected in the planned annual refresh of the Single make representations on those proposals. Data List. Smoking: Public Places

Non-domestic Rates Mr Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what legal requirements exist in respect of the erection and Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for display of signage where a local authority seeks to Communities and Local Government (1) what estimate introduce a smoking ban in a public place where his Department has made of the likely yield from smoking is not otherwise prohibited by law. [71449] national non-domestic rates in each local authority area in each of the next five years; [70549] Robert Neill: The Town and Country Planning (Control (2) what estimate his Department has made of the of Advertisements) (England) Regulations 2007 grants forecast change in national non-domestic rates yield in deemed consent to display advertisements which give a each local authority area in each of the next five years. direction or warning with respect to the land or buildings [70554] on which they are displayed. There are restrictions on the dimensions of such advertisements and their height Robert Neill: The Secretary of State for Communities above ground level. and Local Government, my right hon. Friend the Member Tenants: Leasehold for Brentwood and Ongar (Mr Pickles), set out proposals to allow local retention of business rates in his oral statement to the House on 18 July 2011, Official Report, Guto Bebb: To ask the Secretary of State for columns 662-64. The Government’s proposals will ensure Communities and Local Government what recent a stable starting point, so that no local authority will be assessment he has made of the rights of business worse off as a result of its business rates base at the leasehold tenants to acquire properties; and whether he outset of the new system. plans to bring forward legislative proposals in respect of such rights. [71742] The precise impact of the Government’s proposals upon individual local authorities will depend on a range Grant Shapps: We do not believe most business tenants of factors, including future business rates growth at the would benefit from a right to acquire the freehold and local level, the behavioural response to the changes, and have no plans to legislate. Business tenants normally the final design of the scheme following consultation. enjoy statutory rights of security of tenure, and there is The Government have sought views on their proposals generally a plentiful supply of commercial premises for and, on 19 August, published eight technical papers purchase on the open market for businesses that would which provide further details on the proposals, together prefer to occupy their property freehold. with an interactive calculator. The calculator enables users to explore the possible effects of certain scheme Travellers design options based upon their own assumptions about local circumstances. Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for The proposals incorporate a range of protections to Communities and Local Government what guidance ensure councils can meet local needs, including a safety his Department has issued to local authorities on the net for places in need of additional support, funded by provision of Traveller sites over the next five years. a levy recovering a share of disproportionate gain, [70553] while at the same time ensuring that councils always benefit from encouraging business growth in their area. Andrew Stunell: On 13 April the Government published Information is available at a local authority level for their draft planning policy for Traveller sites for consultation. 2011-12 forecast national non-domestic rates to be collected. The consultation on the Government’s draft planning This is as supplied by local authorities: policy for Traveller sites ended on 3 August. The Government are considering the responses and intend http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/statistics/xls/ 1910477.xls to publish their new policy as soon as possible. Out-turn information is also available for 2010-11 at Vandalism local authority level as supplied by local authorities: http://www.communities.gov.uk/localgovernment/ Gordon Henderson: To ask the Secretary of State for localregional/localgovernmentfinance/statistics/ Communities and Local Government whether he has nondomesticrates/outturn/outturndatalocallevel/ considered the merits of conducting an assessment of the effects on local environments of unauthorised Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for fly-posting; and if he will consider the merits of taking Communities and Local Government with reference to steps to control fly-posting. [70396] his Department’s consultation on business rates retention of July 2011, paragraphs 3.9 to 3.20, whether Robert Neill: The Government have not undertaken local authorities will be able to appeal against (a) the an assessment on the effects of fly-posting on the baseline and (b) tariff or top-up designated to them by environment. However the latest annual Local Government. [70555] Environmental Quality Survey of England 2009-10, 1103W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1104W undertaken by Keep Britain Tidy on behalf of the Museums: Yorkshire and Humberside Government, indicates that fly-posting was a concern at only 1% of sites surveyed. Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Local authorities have a wide range of powers to Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many people remove or obliterate illegal advertisements, prosecute visited each of the national museums in Yorkshire and offenders and recover their costs. They may also issue the Humber in each year since 1996-97. [71468] notices to require those responsible to remove fly-posters. Guidance on these can be found in paragraphs 129-144 Mr Vaizey: I refer the hon. Member to the answer of the Annex to DCLG Circular 03/2007 ″Town and given to him by the then Minister of State, Culture, Country Planning (Control of Advertisements) (England) Media and Sport, the right hon. Member for Barking Regulations 2007″ at: (Margaret Hodge) on 8 December 2009, Official Report, http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/ columns 194-6W. planningandbuilding/circulartown Additionally, the number of visitors in 2009-10 and The good practice guide “The Control of Fly-Posting” 2010-11 to the national museums which fall within the can be found at: Yorkshire and Humber region are in the following http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/ table: planningandbuilding/pdf/156909.pdf Further powers to remedy persistent problems with National unauthorised advertisements by requiring owners or Coal National Mining National Railway Royal occupiers of “relevant surfaces” to carry out specified Museum Media Museum, Armouries measures to prevent or reduce the frequency of fly-posting for England Museum York Leeds Total are being taken in the Localism Bill. 2009-10 118,417 606,837 709,166 269,591 1,704,011 2010-11 107,582 497,522 630,396 273,824 1,509,324

CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT National Lottery: Sports Government Procurement Card Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what financial John Glen: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, assistance (a) the Government and (b) the National Olympics, Media and Sport if he will publish the (a) Lottery has given to (i) amateur sports clubs, (ii) sport purchase date, (b) transaction amount, (c) supplier in schools and (iii) professional sports clubs in York and (d) level 3 or enhanced transaction entry if held since 1996-97. [71469] for each individual transaction undertaken by Arts Council England using the Government Procurement Hugh Robertson: Sport England invests national lottery Card in (i) 2008-09 and (ii) 2009-10. [71221] and Exchequer funding in community sport. Mr Vaizey: The Department does not hold information Sport England does not hold details of Exchequer relating to its arm’s length bodies’ Government Procurement funding prior to 2002-03, however since this date the Cards. City of York local authority has been awarded £281,800 Arts Council England does’ not hold this information of Exchequer funding, and since 1996-97 £2,795,987 of in the format requested centrally, and to collate it would lottery funding. exceed the disproportionate cost limit. Of this, £2,067,594 was awarded to amateur and professional sports clubs, and £1,010,193 to local authorities Internet: Broadband and statutory bodies. Sport England does not record funding by the categories you have requested, and to Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for identify the funds in this way could be provided only at Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport when he expects disproportionate cost. the 4G spectrum auction to be completed. [71540] Newspaper Press: Olympic Games 2012 Mr Vaizey: Ofcom is currently expecting to conduct the auction in the first half of 2012. Joseph Johnson: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (1) what Andrew Percy: To ask the Secretary of State for representations he has received from London-based Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what discussions local newspapers concerning media accreditation he has had with mobile telephone network operators during the London 2012 Olympics and Paralympics; on the minimum Sub-1GHz spectrum portfolio [71684] required by an operator in order for them to provide the coverage needed to support the universal (2) what advice he has received from (a) the British broadband commitment. [71678] Olympic Association and (b) the International Olympic Committee concerning media accreditation Mr Vaizey: No discussions have been held with network for London-based local newspapers during the London operators on the minimum spectrum portfolios, as the 2012 Olympics and Paralympics; [71685] design and timing of the auction is a matter for Ofcom. (3) what discussions he has had with (a) the British Ofcom consulted on competition issues in the mobile Olympic Association and (b) the International sector and the combined auction earlier this year and Olympic Committee on steps to ensure that London- received representations from the network operators based local newspapers are able to provide coverage of and others regarding the design of the auction. the London 2012 Olympics and Paralympics; [71686] 1105W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1106W

(4) whether he plans to provide support to London- Newspaper Society will be in touch with representatives based local newspapers to ensure that they are able to of regional newspaper groups in the next few months to provide coverage of London 2012 Olympics and set up a meeting to discuss practical arrangements over Paralympics; [71687] operation of the pool. (5) how many requests have been made by London- I will shortly be writing to the BOA on this matter based local newspapers for media accreditation during and I will ensure the outcome of this correspondence is the London 2012 Olympics and Paralympics; [71688] passed on to my hon. Friend. (6) if he will assess the merits of providing Sports: Yorkshire and Humberside London-based local newspapers with media accreditation during the London 2012 Olympics and Paralympics. [71689] Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how much his Hugh Robertson: The Secretary of State has received Department spent on sport in (a) Yorkshire and the two representations. The British Olympic Association Humber and (b) City of York local authority area in (BOA), as the National Olympic Committee for Great each year since 1996-97. [71470] Britain and Northern Ireland, is responsible for allocating accreditation for the Olympic Games for media based Hugh Robertson: Sport England invests national lottery in the United Kingdom. The British Paralympic Association and Exchequer funding in community sport. (BPA), as the National Paralympic Committee, is similarly A breakdown of Exchequer and lottery funding in responsible for UK media allocation to the Paralympic Yorkshire and the Humber and the City of York local Games. The process for the Paralympic Games has yet authority area can be found in the following tables. to be finalised. Sport England does not hold details of Exchequer I understand from the BOA that the International funding prior to 2002-03. Olympic Committee (IOC) has awarded the BOA far Exchequer more accreditations than in the past and more accreditations Region Total (£) than any other National Olympic Committee. Over 2002-03 Yorkshire and the Humber 2,558,804 3,000 applications have been received for the approximately 2003-04 Yorkshire and the Humber 3,349,205 400 accreditations available. 2004-05 Yorkshire and the Humber 4,983,347 To assist with the allocation process, the BOA established 2005-06 Yorkshire and the Humber 6,207,436 a Media Accreditation Committee composed of 2006-07 Yorkshire and the Humber 9,840,496 representatives from a broad spectrum of the written 2007-08 Yorkshire and the Humber 9,724,876 and photographic press respected for their knowledge 2008-09 Yorkshire and the Humber 10,333,111 and experience from Olympic Games or understanding 2009-10 Yorkshire and the Humber 9,353,093 of the UK media. 2010-11 Yorkshire and the Humber 9,202,472 For 2012 the IOC awarded BOA the following number 2011-12 Yorkshire and the Humber 5,513,364 of accreditations: Grand total 71,066,205

Number Lottery Journalist 270 Region Total (£) Photographer 80 1996-97 Yorkshire and the Humber 14,914,022 Sport specific journalist 20 1997-98 Yorkshire and the Humber 11,241,054 Sport specific photographer 20 1998-99 Yorkshire and the Humber 22,638,684 Support staff 8 1999-2000 Yorkshire and the Humber 9,718,667 Technician 12 2000-01 Yorkshire and the Humber 44,691,693 When determining the allocation of accreditations 2001-02 Yorkshire and the Humber 51,067,268 BOA has taken into account, among other things, 2002-03 Yorkshire and the Humber 15,827,220 continuous editorial commitment to Olympic sport 2003-04 Yorkshire and the Humber 18,408,969 throughout the four-year Olympic cycle; history of attending 2004-05 Yorkshire and the Humber 15,205,251 Olympic Games; circulation numbers; publication 2005-06 Yorkshire and the Humber 11,394,807 frequency. Throughout this process the BOA’s primary 2006-07 Yorkshire and the Humber 10,515,917 purpose has been to ensure that the allocations made 2007-08 Yorkshire and the Humber 7,673,690 are fair given the limited number of accreditations 2008-09 Yorkshire and the Humber 5,327,842 available. The Press Association has been appointed by 2009-10 Yorkshire and the Humber 30,853,738 the IOC as the National Host News Agency for the 2010-11 Yorkshire and the Humber 7,207,008 London 2012 Olympic Games (and has also been appointed 2011-12 Yorkshire and the Humber 12,538,140 by the International Paralympic Committee as the National Grand total 289,223,970 Host News Agency for the 2012 Paralympic Games) to service the local and regional press in the UK and they The regional figures include national awards to governing have committed to covering every British athlete at the bodies of sport situated in the region and funding to the games. The BOA has also agreed that regional written English institute of Sport in Sheffield. and photographic press who applied for accreditation Exchequer should benefit from a small number of passes to be Local authority Total (£) allocated on a pool basis. The distribution of these will 2007-08 York 131,000 be decided by the BOA with guidance from the Newspaper 2008-09 York 149,800 Society, in consultation with regional publishers. The 1107W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1108W

Exchequer Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Government will be publishing Local authority Total (£) their response to the recent Civil Justice consultation 2010-11 York 1,000 paper: “Solving Disputes in the County Court”, later Grand total 281,800 this year. In addition, the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill includes provisions to implement fundamental reform of civil litigation funding Lottery and costs, as recommended by Lord Justice Jackson. Local authority Total (£) We have also begun an extensive modernisation programme 1996-97 York 20,754 which will improve efficiency in the civil justice system. 1997-98 York 89,212 Public Disorder: Response of the Criminal Justice 1998-99 York 288,690 System 1999-2000 York 572,367 2000-01 York 166,969 23. Steve McCabe: To ask the Secretary of State for 2001-02 York 749,459 Justice what steps he is taking to assess the effectiveness 2003-04 York 146,882 of the response of the criminal justice system to the 2004-05 York 472,723 public disorder of August 2011. [71330] 2005-06 York 61,583 2008-09 York 120,000 Mr Blunt: The criminal justice system, with its dedicated 2009-10 York 14,824 work force, responded well to the challenges caused by 2010-11 York 84,480 the recent disturbances. It is too early to learn all the 2011-12 York 8,044 lessons, but my Department intends to review all aspects Grand total 2,795,987 of the CJS response, considering what it can learn both for future emergencies and for adopting as business as In addition, the Department allocated £30 million of usual. private finance initiative (PFI) credits in 2005 to Leeds city council to provide two New Leaf Leisure Centres. Civil Disorder Mr Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many defendants were (a) charged and (b) JUSTICE found guilty of riot following the public disorder in August. [71364] Probation Trusts Mr Blunt: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave 18. Meg Munn: To ask the Secretary of State for on 8 September 2011, Official Report, column 809W. Justice what plans he has for the future of probation trusts; and if he will make a statement. [71325] Courts: Televisions

21. Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Gale: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Justice what plans he has for the future of probation what estimate he has made of the likely cost to the trusts; and if he will make a statement. [71328] public purse of his proposals for further televising of Mr Blunt: The Ministry of Justice is taking forward aspects of the work of the judiciary; and from what work on the future shape of probation services in budget such funding will be drawn. [71414] England and Wales and considering different models Mr Kenneth Clarke: Full costs have yet to be determined for delivering offender services in the community. We and will depend on operational details which I am will set out our preferred approach later in the autumn. working with the judiciary and others to agree. However, Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill it is my intention to ensure that additional costs resulting from these proposals will not be met from the public 20. Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for purse. Justice what recent representations he has received on Curfew Orders: York the potential effects of implementation of the provisions of the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Punishment of Offenders Bill. [71327] Justice how many curfew orders have been issued by Mr Djanogly: Before the Bill was introduced on 21 June courts in York since the introduction of such orders; 2011 the Ministry of Justice conducted three wide-ranging and how many of those people have been proceeded public consultations, which received over 6,000 responses. against for breaching them. [71500] During the Commons Committee stage of the Bill there were four public evidence sessions where the Bill Mr Blunt: The following data submitted by the service Committee heard from various organisations such as provider G4S, shows the number of electronically- the Bar Council, Law Society, the Victims Commissioner monitored curfews ordered by York Crown, magistrates and prison and probation trade unions. and youth court, and Selby magistrates courts, in each financial year since 2005-06, and the number of breaches Civil Justice System reported by G4S to the authorities in each period: The data for breaches shows the number of individuals 22. George Eustice: To ask the Secretary of State for whom G4S reported to the appropriate authority for Justice what steps he is taking to improve the civil further action. In the case of Bail, this is the Police. For justice system. [71329] Community Orders or Suspended Sentences it is the 1109W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1110W

Youth Offending Team, Probation Offender Manager, of Probation Trusts, Youth Offending Teams and Police or directly to the Court if the curfew is a standalone Areas at disproportionate cost. Breach data for the sentence. The final outcome of breach notifications is periods 2005-06 and 2006-07 is not available, and could not routinely provided to the contractor, unless it is a only be retrieved with a manual trawl of records at standalone sentence. This information is not recorded disproportionate costs. centrally and would require a trawl of individual records

Bail Financial year 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11 2011-121

Orders 53 60 143 166 213 178 53 Breaches reported n/a n/a 86 105 129 108 11

Community Order/Suspended Sentence Financial year 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11 2011-121

Orders 77 118 225 318 403 345 123 Breaches reported n/a n/a 90 147 215 203 49 1 To end August 2011.

Housing: Sales Project report on (a) the Review of the Custodial Estate Provisions for Young Adult Offenders and (b) Mark Reckless: To ask the Secretary of State for the Review of Community Provisions for Young Adult Justice for what reason sale prices of houses sold before Offenders, completed in 2006; [71272] 2000 are not made available online. [71194] (2) on what dates the Young Adult Offenders Project Board has met; and if he will place a copy of the Mr Davey: I have been asked to reply. minutes of each of those meetings in the Library; Before 1976 the price paid or value stated was entered [71273] on the register of title maintained by HM Land Registry. (3) whether the National Offender Management A change to the land registration rules made in 1976 Service Young Adult Offenders Project commissioned removed the requirement to enter this information. a detailed cost/benefit analysis in support of its On 1 April 2000, following a public consultation and proposals to deal with young adults in the prison a further change to the land registration rules, the estate; and if he will place a copy of any such requirement was restored. All applications received by assessment in the Library. [71341] the Land Registry since that date have resulted in the price paid being entered on the register where it is Mr Blunt: The YoungAdult Offender Project informed practicable to do so. No information was entered Ministers’ policy on young adult offenders but did not retrospectively. give rise to a published report. I understand from officials that the reports and analysis you refer to remained The register has been available online to the public as work in progress when the project was closed. Since since January 2005 allowing customers to search the the project did not produce papers for publication it register and download title registers, plans and deeds. would not be appropriate to place those papers and minutes of meetings in the Library. Human Trafficking The project board met on 8 December 2005, 27 February, 27 March, 24 April, 5 June, 16 July, 4 September, Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice for 2 October, 5 November, 5 December 2006 and 20 March which countries his Department has prepared country 2007. business plans in relation to human trafficking; and if he will make a statement. [71116] Offenders: Ex-servicemen

Damian Green: I have been asked to reply. John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for The Home Office is currently developing a list of Justice (1) what information his Department holds on priority countries in relation to human trafficking. As the number of former armed service personnel who set out in the Government’s strategy on human trafficking, were subjects of a court report in (a) 2009-10 and (b) we will work with the Foreign and Commonwealth 2010-11; [71361] Office to ensure that the aims of the strategy are included (2) what information his Department holds on the in the Country Business Plans for each of these priority number of former armed service personnel remanded countries. in custody in (a) 2009-10 and (b) 2010-11. [71362]

National Offender Management Service Young Adult Mr Djanogly: In September 2010, the MOJ and Offender Project Ministry of Defence published the results of a joint study to estimate how many prisoners in England Karl Turner: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice and Wales had been in the regular armed forces. (1) if he will place in the Library a copy of the National The report, based on the prison population as at Offender Management Service Young Adult Offender 6 November 2009, showed that 3.5% (2,820) of prisoners 1111W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1112W had served in the regular armed forces, and of these, These figures have been drawn from administrative 11.3% were on remand. This report may be found in the IT systems, which, as with any large scale recording House of Commons Libraries and at the following web system, are subject to possible errors with data entry link: and processing. http://www.dasa.mod.uk/applications/newWeb/www/ index.php?page=66&pubType=3 Sentencing: York Information on the number of court reports prepared specifically for former armed service personnel is not held centrally by the Department. Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many people received a custodial sentence Probation at York (a) magistrates court and (b) Crown court in (i) 1997 and (ii) each subsequent year. [71498] Kelvin Hopkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what the size was of the probation caseload in Mr Blunt: The number of persons sentenced to immediate England and Wales on 31 March 2011. [71601] custody at York local justice area and Crown court, for Mr Blunt: The total number of offenders supervised all offences from 1997 to 2010 (latest available) can be by the probation service on 31 March 2001 was 236,543. viewed in the following table. This figure is published quarterly on the Ministry of Court proceedings data for 2011 are planned for Justice website. publication in the spring, 2012.

Number of persons sentenced to immediate custody at York local justice area and Crown court, for all offences from 1997 to 20101,2 Court type 1997 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010

York local justice 108 161 227 239 202 139 196 228 200 118 119 164 206 209 area3 York Crown court 282 359 376 397 448 407 360 415 448 417 387 351 440 372 1 The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with.Whena defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences it is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed fortwoor more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. 2 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. 3 May include more than one magistrates court. Source: Justice Statistics Analytical Services—Ministry of Justice

Travellers: Legal Aid Scheme Academies: Cumbria

Mr Baron: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice John Stevenson: To ask the Secretary of State for how much his Department has provided in legal aid to Education how many (a) primary and (b) secondary Travellers at the Dale Farm site in Essex in each of the schools in Cumbria had become academies by last three years. [71553] September 2011. [69696]

Mr Djanogly: The information is not readily available, Mr Gibb: To date, two primary schools and twelve I will write to my hon. Friend. secondary schools have opened as academies in Cumbria. These are Seaton Infant School (opened September 2010), Eaglesfield Paddle C of E VA Primary School EDUCATION (June 2011), Queen Elizabeth School, (January 2011), Kirkbie Kendal School (April 2011), The Queen Katherine Academies School (April 2011), Queen Elizabeth Grammar (May 2011), Appleby Grammar (August 2011), Kirkby Stephen John Stevenson: To ask the Secretary of State for Grammar (August 2011), Settlebeck High School (August Education how many (a) primary and (b) secondary 2011), William Howard School (August 2011), Caldew schools had converted to academies as at 31 July 2011; School (August 2011), Dallam School (August 2011), and how many applications for conversion to an Cartmel Priory (September 2011) and Trinity School academy are outstanding. [69697] (September 2011). There are four sponsored academies open in Cumbria: Mr Gibb: As at 31 July 2011 there were 529 schools Richard Rose Central Academy (September 2008), Richard that had converted to academies. This was made up of Rose Morton Academy (2008), West Lakes Academy (a) 124 primary schools and (b) 405 secondary schools (September 2008) and Furness Academy (September (including 12 middle deemed secondary schools). 2009). As at 1 September, 981 schools had converted to academies, leaving 502 applications to convert to an Children: Day Care academy outstanding. A full list of these schools and their progress towards conversion is available on the Mrs Hodgson: To ask the Secretary of State for Department for Education website: Education what steps he is taking to ensure that local http://www.education.gov.uk/schools/leadership/ authorities fulfil their duties under section 11 of the typesofschools/academies/a0069811/map-of-open-academies- Childcare Act 2006 in respect of the provision of and-schools-submitting-applications childcare for disabled children. [70253] 1113W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1114W

Sarah Teather: Local authorities have a duty (under Further Education Section 6 of the Childcare Act 2006) to ensure that there is sufficient childcare locally to meet the needs of Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for working parents and particularly families with disabled Education pursuant to the answer of 18 July 2011, children. We want to improve the way in which local Official Report, column 552W, on further education, if authorities keep parents informed about what they are he will publish a list of applications received by his doing to deliver this duty. The Government announced Department to open (a) free schools for 16 to 19 year in the “Families in the Foundation Years” statement, olds and (b) university technical colleges in September published in July 2011, 2012. [70657] http://www.education.gov.uk/childrenandyoungpeople/ earlylearningandchildcare/early Mr Gibb: The Department is still in the process of the intention to bring forward proposals that local assessing the applications it has received to establish authorities should report annually on their Section 6 Free Schools and University Technical Colleges in 2012. sufficiency duty, and in particular how they are supporting As stated on 18 July, these include proposals for four families of children with disabilities to access childcare. 16-19 Free Schools and 19 UTCs. An announcement will be made around the end of September about those Local authorities have told us that the requirement that are approved to move to the next stage of development. (under Section 11 of the Childcare Act 2006) to publish nationally prescribed sufficiency assessments every three Neil Wallis years is burdensome. The Government considers that a local annual report would be a more effective way of John Mann: To ask the Secretary of State for enabling parents to hold their local authority to account. Education what communications (a) he, (b) other The Government have therefore also decided to consult Ministers in his Department, (c) officials in his private on bringing forward legislation to repeal the Section 11 office and (d) (i) press officers, (ii) other officials and duty.This consultation will be published on the Department (iii) special advisers of his Department have had by (A) for Education’s website later in the autumn. e-mail, (B) meeting, (C) telephone call and (D) letter with Neil Wallis since his appointment; and on what dates. [68738] English Baccalaureate Tim Loughton: A check of communications showed no record of contact between the Secretary of State for Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Education, other Ministers in his Department, officials Education what recent representations he has received in his private office, press officers, and special advisors from religious groups on the English Baccalaureate. with Neil Wallis since his appointment. The Department [70792] publishes quarterly Ministers’ and Permanent Secretaries’ meetings with external organisations on the website at: Mr Gibb: The Department has received 2,809 pieces http://www.education.gov.uk/aboutdfe/ of correspondence about religious education and the departmentalinformation/transparency English Baccalaureate. Due to the high volume it is not A list of officials meetings is not maintained centrally practical to place copies in the House Libraries but the and to collect such information would incur key points made are covered in the records of the disproportionate cost. Westminster Hall Debate on 17 May and in evidence given by Religious Education organisations to the Education Physics: GCE A Level Select Committee. John Mann: To ask the Secretary of State for Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Education what steps he is taking to ensure that errors Education whether (a) Punjabi, (b) Urdu, (c) Arabic, contained in the OCR Physics A Level examination are (d) Bengali, (e) Gujarati and (f) Hindu will be taken into account by admissions tutors. [68102] included in the English Baccalaureate. [70793] Mr Gibb: On 4 August the independent exams regulator Ofqual published a statement to reassure students and Mr Gibb: The English Baccalaureate is designed to their parents about remedial work which has been recognise the success of those pupils who attain GCSEs undertaken by awarding organisations to address exam or established iGCSEs at grade A*-C across a core of errors. Ofqual are satisfied that awarding organisations academic subjects: English, maths, the sciences, a language have taken all possible steps to ensure that no student and either history or geography. The Department for has been unfairly disadvantaged or advantaged as a Education has published a detailed list of the GCSEs result of exam errors. that count towards English Baccalaureate. This can be University and other higher education institution viewed at: admissions tutors have been provided (via UCAS) with www.education.gov.uk/performancetables detailed information about the measures taken in cases The list includes qualifications in Panjabi, Urdu, involving AS and A2 papers (including those from Arabic, Bengali and Gujarati. It does not include OCR) to make sure they have been fully informed. qualifications in Hindi. This is because language Ofqual have additionally been in contact with UCAS qualifications which are counted towards the English and Universities UK to ensure that useful information Baccalaureate must have a speaking element and there about the nature of errors and steps to redress has been are currently no Hindi GCSE qualifications which meet shared, enabling these bodies to be prepared for enquiries this requirement. and to assist students where necessary. 1115W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1116W

Ofqual are now conducting an inquiry into these (6) whether the Special Educational Needs Code of exam errors, working in partnership with their fellow Practice will have enforceable lines of accountability regulators in Northern Ireland and Wales. The regulators between (a) schools, (b) local authorities and (c) intend to complete their inquiry and publish a report by other agencies involved in providing support; [69726] the end of the year, in time to inform actions to secure (7) whether the Special Educational Needs Code of the quality of exams being taken in 2012. Practice will specify a complaints and appeals process Schools: Pay for parents and young people with special educational needs; [69727] Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for Education what his policy is on the payment of a pay Sarah Teather: The current Special Educational Needs award of £250 in 2011-12 to all (a) classroom (SEN) Code of Practice sets out the duties, rights and assistants and (b) other school employees earning less entitlements associated with the SEN framework in than £21,000 per annum. [68650] England. When changes to that framework, following the SEN and disability Green Paper, are being made a Mr Gibb: Central Government does not have a role in revised SEN Code of Practice will consulted on and deciding the pay and conditions of school support staff. laid before the House for approval. Pay and conditions for this group, which includes teaching assistants, are decided by their employers. The revised Code will set out the timescales and processes which attach to the proposed single assessment The employer of support staff in foundation and process and Education, Health and Care Plan and the voluntary aided schools is the school’s governing body. more multi-agency approach which will be inherent in The employer of support staff in community and voluntary these new features of the framework. It will set out controlled schools is the local authority. The employer schools’ continuing duty to appoint a qualified teacher of support staff in academies and free schools is the as a Special Educational Needs Coordinator, to whom appropriate trust. children with SEN can have access. It will remind During the two-year pay freeze which for teachers in schools of their duty to do their best to make special maintained schools started on 1 September 2011, educational provision for all children with learning unqualified teachers who earn a full-time salary of difficulties, including those children identified with SEN £21,000 or less, will receive a £250 payment in each of but whose needs do not exceed what is normally available these years in line with the recommendation made by in schools and may not therefore have an Education, the independent School Teachers’ Review Body. Health and Care Plan. It will also give advice to schools Special Educational Needs on identifying children with SEN and the approaches they can use to set targets for children and review Graeme Morrice: To ask the Secretary of State for progress without increasing bureaucratic burdens. Education what steps his Department is taking to The revised Code will set out the expectations of all ensure that local authorities work with other parties to an Education, Health and Care Plan and the organisations, including voluntary organisations, to arrangements for accountability, with the local authority develop an independent special educational needs having a duty to make the special educational provision. assessment process. [69718] The new plans will provide the same statutory protection Sarah Teather: The reforms to the special educational to parents as SEN statements including the right to needs system in England will be tested in pathfinder appeal to the First-tier Tribunal (SEND) about local areas. It is a stated condition of the pathfinder ‘Invitation authority decisions in relation to SEN and provision to to Tender’ document that pathfinders should work with meet children’s SEN. This will be reflected in a revised voluntary organisations to test ways of improving the Code. The Green Paper gave a commitment that the system. Department will run pilots on giving children the right to appeal to the Tribunal. Graeme Morrice: To ask the Secretary of State for Education (1) whether the Special Educational Needs Graeme Morrice: To ask the Secretary of State for Code of Practice will include guidance on timescales Education what steps he is taking to ensure that his and processes, including communications between proposals for special educational needs assessments do different agencies; [69720] not exclude relevant professionals from the assessment (2) whether the Special Educational Needs (SEN) process. [69728] Code of Practice will require a named and trained senior person in each school to be responsible for SEN; Sarah Teather: The proposals for special educational [69721] needs assessments in England are being tested in pathfinder (3) whether the Special Educational Needs (SEN) areas. One of the things pathfinders have been asked to Code of Practice will include a child’s right to an test is which professionals should be involved in the identified teacher with relevant training in each school assessment process. Pathfinders will begin testing in who is responsible for coordinating SEN provision; September 2011. [69722] (4) whether the Special Educational Needs Code of Teachers: Manpower Practice will provide rights to children without education, health and care plans or statements but who Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for still have special educational needs; [69723] Education how many (a) primary and (b) secondary (5) whether the Special Educational Needs Code of school teachers were employed in (i) Jarrow Practice will include regular objective setting for constituency, (ii) South Tyneside, (iii) the north-east individual pupils; [69724] and (iv) nationwide in each year since 1997. [70421] 1117W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1118W

Mr Gibb: The following table gives the full-time Further school work force statistics are available from equivalent number of regular teachers employed in the November 2010 School Workforce Statistical First local authority maintained schools in Jarrow constituency, Release which is available at the following web link: South Tyneside local authority, the north-east and England http://www.education.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000997/ in each year from 1997 to 2010. index.shtml

Full-time equivalent teachers in local authority maintained nursery, primary and secondary schools. Years: 1997-2010. Coverage: Jarrow constituency, South Tyneside local authority, the north-east Government office region and England South Tyneside local North-east Government Jarrow constituency authority office region England Nursery Nursery Nursery Nursery and and and and primary Secondary primary Secondary primary Secondary primary Secondary schools schools schools schools schools schools schools schools

January 1997 360 300 700 590 10,400 10,790 191,670 189,430 1998 350 300 690 580 10,280 10,650 190,100 189.5B0 1999 350 310 690 610 10,310 10,640 191,120 191,780 2000 350 320 640 590 10,190 10,740 193,100 193,200 2001 360 340 680 650 10,350 11,070 194,960 196,680 2002 340 360 660 700 10,440 11,380 197,370 203,170 2003 330 350 630 690 10,210 11,340 197,430 206,670 2004 320 350 630 680 10,170 11,270 196,640 211,000 2005 310 350 610 670 10,050 11,430 196,270 215,060 2006 310 360 590 720 10,070 11,440 193,190 216,290 2007 300 360 580 680 10,020 11,450 197,100 216,850 2008 300 360 570 690 9,920 11,450 198,090 215,270 2009 300 340 590 670 9,840 11,150 198,540 212,580 2010 310 390 530 680 9,810 10,920 200,860 210,260

November 2010 340 340 550 640 9,790 9,910 195,740 192,980 Note: Figures are rounded to the nearest 10. Sources: School Census, (parliamentary constituency figures). Form 618g Survey and School Workforce Census , (November 2010)

Teaching Assistants: Warrington HEALTH

Helen Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Alzheimer’s Disease: Newham Education how many teaching assistants were employed in maintained schools in Warrington Lyn Brown: To ask the Secretary of State for Health borough (a) in May 2010 and (b) on the most recent how many people were diagnosed with Alzheimer’s date for which figures are available. [70757] disease in Newham in (a) 2008, (b) 2009 and (c) 2010. [71383] Mr Gibb: The information requested was collected in January and November 2010. The full-time equivalent Paul Burstow: The information requested is not number of teaching assistants employed in maintained centrally held. However, the Quality and Outcomes schools in Warrington local authority in January 2010 Framework (QOF) records the number of patients was 860. In November 2010 there were 780 teaching registered with practices in England who have had a assistants employed in Warrington local authority. diagnosis of dementia, including Alzheimer’s disease. The January 2010 figure was collected through the This information is available by financial year only and School Census. The School Workforce Census (SWF) is presented in the following table for Newham Primary was run, in its complete form, for the first time in Care Trust. autumn 2010 and is the source for the November figure. Although the SWF was designed to provide figures that Number of patients on QOF are comparable with those from the earlier survey data dementia register in Newham providers may not have categorised staff roles in the Financial year Primary Care Trust same way and therefore the two figures provided may 2007-08 690 not be equivalent. 2008-09 725 Further school work force statistics are available from 2009-10 808 the November 2010 School Workforce Statistical First Source: Release which is available at the following web link: Quality and Outcomes Framework http://www.education.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000997/ The hon. Member may wish to contact Newham index.shtml Primary Care Trust for more specific information. 1119W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1120W

Ambulance Services: Manpower Departmental Private Finance Initiative

Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Stella Creasy: To ask the Secretary of State for what information data his Department holds on the Health if he will publish the value of estimated tax number of ambulance staff in band (a) 4, (b) 5, (c) 6 receipts, calculated in accordance with the Green and (d) 7 employed in (i) 2007, (ii) 2009 and (iii) 2011. Book, in each public sector economic assessment of [71217] private finance initiative projects in procurement by his Department as of March 2011. [71225] Mr Simon Burns: The information requested is not collected centrally. Mr Simon Burns: Two NHS trusts—Royal Liverpool and Broadgreen University Hospitals NHS Trust and Bowel Cancer: Screening the Royal National Orthopaedic Hospitals NHS Trust— were in the procurement phase of the private finance Richard Fuller: To ask the Secretary of State for initiative (PFI) process in March 2011. Both schemes Health what estimate he has made of the number of followed the Green Book guidance and the percentage people who participated in the bowel cancer screening by which the public sector comparator was uplifted in programme (a) in Bolton and (b) nationally in the the economic analysis to reflect the additional tax take latest period for which figures are available. [71085] that accrues to the Government from the private finance option was 6% in both cases. Paul Burstow: Roll-out of the NHS bowel cancer This economic analysis was done for the Outline screening programme began in April 2006 and full Business Cases (OBCs) at the pre-market appraisal roll-out was completed in August 2010. The programme stage and therefore is not used to assess tax takes from currently invites men and women aged 60-69 to participate specific providers after contracts have been signed. in screening every two years and it is in the process of Two NHS foundation trusts—Papworth Hospitals being extended to invite men and women up to their NHS Foundation NHS Trust and Alder Hey Children’s 75th birthday. NHS Foundation Trust—exercised their powers as As of July this year 10,071,589 people had been foundation trusts to take forward PFI schemes which invited and 5,528,266 had been adequately screened were also in the procurement phase in March 2011. The (54.89%). Adequately screened means the return of a OBCs for these schemes were not reviewed for approval testing kit that produces a definitive test result. It should purposes by the Department prior to March 2011. The be noted that these figures include people who have information requested is therefore a matter for Papworth been invited by the programme for screening more than Hospitals NHS Foundation NHS Trust and Alder Hey once on separate screening rounds. Children’s NHS Foundation Trust. We have written to Figures for the Bolton screening centre over the same the respective chairs of these two trusts, Robert Burgin period show that 208,328 people had been invited and at Papworth and Sir David Henshaw at Alder Hey, 105,396 people had been adequately screened (50.59%). informing them of the hon. Member’s inquiry. They will reply shortly and a copy of the letter will be placed Cancer: Drugs in the Library. Departmental Written Questions Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many patients have accessed drugs through the Cancer Drugs Fund. [71167] Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what proportion of written questions tabled to Mr Simon Burns: The Cancer Drugs Fund was launched him for answer on a named day did not receive a on 1 April 2011. Over three years, the Fund is providing substantive answer on the day named for answer £200 million a year to help thousands of cancer patients between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (b) access the drugs their clinicians believe will help them. 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71142] As an interim measure, an additional £50 million was made available to strategic health authorities in 2010-11 Mr Simon Burns: The Department received 1,322 to support improved access to cancer drugs. The funding written questions due for answer on a named day between we have made available since October 2010 has so far 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011. Of those, nine questions, helped over 5,000 cancer patients in England to access or 1%, were not answered substantively on the day the cancer drugs their clinicians recommended. named for answer. Between 9 March and 19 July 2011, the Department Community Nurses received 523 written questions due for answer on a named day. Of those, one question, or 0.2%, was not Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for answered substantively on the day named for answer. Health what plans he has for the future of the district nurse service. [71093] Euthanasia

Anne Milton: District nurses deliver safe high quality Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Health care in the community both to patients currently receiving (1) what recent discussions (a) he, (b) Ministers of his care in hospitals and to the growing numbers of older Department and (c) officials in his Department have people with multiple health and care needs. It is for had with the Dementia Champion on assisted suicide; local commissioners and providers to ensure they have what his policy is on assisted suicide; and if he will work force to meet these changing health care needs. make a statement; [R] [71018] 1121W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1122W

(2) what recent representations he has received on Methadone: Wirral the recent statements by his Department’s Dementia Champion on assisted dying; what response he gave to Mr Frank Field: To ask the Secretary of State for the representations; and if he will make a statement. Health how many people living in the Wirral have been [R] [71080] using methadone for (a) up to one year, (b) up to two years, (c) up to five years and (d) 10 years or more. Paul Burstow: The comments attributed to Martin [71675] Green were made in his capacity as the chief executive Anne Milton: Information is not available in the of the English Community Care Association, and not format requested. in his role as the Dementia Champion for the independent Data on the number of people receiving a prescribing sector, and do not reflect the Government’s position. intervention for their opioid dependency in the Wirral The Government believe that any changes to the law, in 2009-10 and showing how long they have been in this emotive and contentious area is an issue of continuously receiving substitute prescribing is shown individual conscience and a matter for Parliament to in the following table. decide rather than Government policy. Assisted dying remains unlawful in the United Kingdom. This is the Length of stay in prescribing Number position that Ministers have set out in response to any Less than 12 months 454 inquiries on this matter. 1-2 years 256 Neither Ministers nor officials from the Department 2-3 years 170 have had any discussions with Mr Green about assisted 3-4 years 114 suicide. A departmental official spoke to Mr Green to 4 years + 967 confirm that his comments were made in his role as Total in prescribing 1,961 chief executive of the English Community Care Association Notes: and not in his capacity as Dementia Champion. Ministers 1. The National Drug Treatment Monitoring System (NDTMS) collects information on the number of people receiving substitute prescribing interventions for have not met with, or discussed this matter with, Mr Green. substance misuse in England, but does not distinguish between methadone and other drugs such as buprenorphine which are also recommended for the treatment of drug misuse by the National Institute for Health and Clinical General Practitioners: Pensions Excellence (NICE). 2. The National Treatment Agency took over full responsibility for managing NDTMS in 2004-05. Only the annual data from 2005-06 onwards are considered Julian Sturdy: To ask the Secretary of State for robust enough to provide detailed information about individual treatment Health what estimate he has made of the sums journeys. This means that 2009-10 was the first year that robust data for those in accruing to the Exchequer in respect of GP pensions in treatment for four years or more are available. the latest period for which figures are available; and if NICE recommends that substitute prescribing should he will reconsider the proposed reform of GP pensions. always be accompanied by psychosocial interventions. In addition “Drug Misuse and Dependence: UK Guidelines [71241] on Clinical Management” (2007), a copy of which has already been placed in the Library, states that any Mr Simon Burns: General practitioners (GPs) have decision to maintain a patient on long-term prescribing access to the NHS pension scheme. The following should be an active one agreed between the clinician table provided by the NHS Pensions Agency illustrates and patient, reviewed at regular intervals, and part of a the sum of contributions paid by GPs between 2009 broader programme of care-planned social and and 2011. psychological support. GP contributions to the NHS pension scheme Tomography: Waiting Lists £000 2009-10 2010-11 Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many people waited more than six weeks for (a) Employer 463,000 470,754 contributions MRI and (b) CT scans in (i) Bolton and (ii) England in Employee 365,858 317,225 the latest period for which figures are available. [71083] contributions Mr Simon Burns: Latest figures (31 July 2011) for the Total contributions 829,426 787,979 numbers of people waiting more than six weeks for Source: magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) and computed The NHS pension scheme and NHS compensation for retirement scheme resource accounts tomography (CT) scans in Bolton and England are provided as follows. Contributions made by and on behalf of GPs are to Waiting times for MRI and CT scans in Bolton primary care trust (PCT) pay for pension promises being built up and are assessed (Commissioner level data) on 31 July 2011 by the scheme actuary using SCAPE methodology Diagnostic test Number waiting (Superannuation Contributions Adjusted for Past Name name Total waiting list 6+ weeks Experience). Bolton PCT MRI 431 9 The amount paid out by the NHS Pensions Agency Bolton PCT CT 233 2 in respect of former GP members in receipt of pensions is not available separately. Waiting times for MRI and CT scans in England (Commissioner level data) on 31 July 2011 In March 2011, the Independent Public Service Pensions Number waiting 6+ Commission chaired by Lord Hutton concluded that Diagnostic test name Total waits list weeks given increased longevity and changes in working patterns, MRI 107,329 804 current arrangements for public sector pensions are CT 65,191 691 unfair and unsustainable and that reform is needed. 1123W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1124W

DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER The Cabinet Office provides a cross-Government centre of expertise through the Efficiency and Reform Abdelbaset al-Megrahi Group, which was setup to work across departmental boundaries where this is the best way to tackle waste, Gordon Banks: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister improve efficiency and reform the way services are whether he has had any discussions with (a) the First delivered. Minister of Scotland and (b) other Ministers in the A recent example is the £360 million saved across Scottish Government on the possible return to the UK departments by centralising spend on common goods of Abdelbaset al-Megrahi since 1 February 2011. and services. We have also established Crown Commercial [71343] Representatives, who saved over £800 million last year The Deputy Prime Minister: I have not had any such by renegotiating deals with some of our largest suppliers discussions with the First Minister of Scotland or any on a cross-Government basis. We are also promoting other Ministers in the Scottish Government. The possible centres of excellence in departments where others are return to the UK of Abdelbaset al-Megrahi is a matter best placed to lead for the Crown. This includes the for the Scottish Government, not the UK Government. Next Generation HR shared service which DWP are delivering, and the Government’s ICT strategy where Departmental Responsibilities elements of the implementation programme are being led by different departments. John Mann: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister on what dates he stood in for the Prime Minister between Drugs: Misuse 24 December 2010 and 6 January 2011. [67946]

The Deputy Prime Minister: The Prime Minister remains Nicola Blackwood: To ask the Minister for the the head of the Government including when he is on Cabinet Office how many deaths related to drug holiday or away from London, whether for Government poisoning or misuse there were in each year since 2000; business or not. When away from the office, he has and how many were incurred by offenders who had Downing street staff with him and he is in regular been released within two weeks from prison [71718] contact with staff and senior ministerial colleagues in London. Over the holiday periods, I and other senior Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the Ministers are on hand to deal with urgent issues arising responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have in London. asked the authority to reply. Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated September 2011: Departmental Written Questions As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question asking Thomas Docherty: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister how many deaths related to drug poisoning or misuse there were what proportion of written questions tabled to him for in each year since 2000; and how many were incurred by offenders answer on a named day did not receive a substantive who had been released within two weeks from prison. (71718) answer on the day named for answer between (a) The table provides the number of deaths where (i) the underlying 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (b) 9 March 2011 cause was drug poisoning and (ii) the underlying cause was drug and 19 July 2011. [71137] poisoning and any drug controlled under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 was mentioned on the death certificate, in England and The Deputy Prime Minister: The figures are shown in Wales, for 2000 to 2010 (the latest year available). the following table: It is not possible to determine from information collected at death registration whether the deceased was an offender who had Number of questions recently been released from prison, since this information is not Number of named day answered substantively routinely recorded. Dates questions tabled on the specified date The number of deaths related to drug poisoning registered in 9 March to 19 July 2011 30 24 England and Wales each year by sex, age, cause and the specific 27 May 2010 to 19 July 116 83 substance involved are published annually on the National Statistics 2011 website. The latest Statistical Bulletin on deaths from drug-related poisoning was published on 23 August 2011 at: www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/subnational-health3/deaths-related- to-drug-poisoning/2010/index.html CABINET OFFICE Table 1: Number of deaths from drug-related poisoning and drug misuse, 1, 2, 3 Cross-Departmental Working England and Wales, 2000-10 Deaths (persons) All drug poisonings Drug misuse Steve Rotheram: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office what recent steps he has taken to promote 2000 2,932 1,604 effective cross-departmental working. [70794] 2001 3,093 1,808 2002 2,830 1,613 Mr Maude: Departments are responsible for spending 2003 2,623 1,432 money wisely and for delivering excellent public services, 2004 2,787 1,497 and they are already delivering substantial reform 2005 2,762 1,608 programmes within their delivery chains. However, in 2006 2,570 1,560 many areas departments are unable to secure maximum 2007 2,640 1,727 value for money, and unable to reform services in the 2008 2,928 1,939 most effective manner by working in isolation. 2009 2,878 1,876 1125W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1126W

Table 1: Number of deaths from drug-related poisoning and drug misuse, James Brokenshire: The number of antisocial behaviour 1, 2, 3 England and Wales, 2000-10 incidents recorded by the police in each of the specified Deaths (persons) areas are provided in the table. These figures relate to All drug poisonings Drug misuse the police record of antisocial behaviour incidents; that 2010 2,747 1,784 is, the number of “calls to service” received by them. 1 Cause of death for was defined using the International Classification of Antisocial behaviour incidents recorded by the police (non-National Statistics)1 Diseases, Ninth revision (ICD-9) for the year 2000 and Tenth Revision (ICD 10) from 2001 onwards. The ICD-9 and ICD-10 codes for drug poisoning are Number shown in Box 1 as follows. Figures for drug misuse include all drug poisoning 2009-102 2010-113 deaths where a drug controlled under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 was mentioned on the death certificate. South Tyneside 12,222 11,886 2 Deaths in England and Wales include non-residents. North East Region 249,744 229,448 3 Figures are for deaths registered in each calendar year. England and Wales 3,532,297 3,235,977 Box 1. ICD-9 and ICD-10 codes for deaths related to drug poisoning 1 All police forces currently use the National Standard for Incident Recording ICD 10 (NSIR) to record incidents which are reported to them. While incidents are Description Codes ICD 9 Codes recorded under NSIR in accordance with the same ’victim focused’ approach that applies for recorded crime, these figures are not accredited National Mental and behavioural disorders due to F11-F16, 292, 304, Statistics and are not subject to the same level of quality assurance as the main drug use (excluding alcohol and tobacco) F18-F19 305.2-305.9 recorded crime collection. 2 Management information on ASB incidents were collected by the National Accidental poisoning by drugs, X40-X44 E850-E858 Policing Improvement Agency (NPIA) in 2007-08, 2008-09 and 2009-10. medicaments and biological substances 3 Management information on ASB incidents were collected by Her Majesty’s Intentional self-poisoning by drugs, X60-X64 E950.0- Inspectorate of Constabulary (HMIC) in 2010-11. medicaments and biological substances E950.5 Assault by drugs, medicaments and X85 E962.0 Asylum: York biological substances Poisoning by drugs, medicaments and Y10-Y14 E980.0- biological substances, undetermined intent E980.5 Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many asylum applicants she Ex-servicemen: Medals estimates are living in York. [71497]

Mrs Moon: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Damian Green: The number of asylum applicants Office when the Committee on the Grant of Honours, with a last known address with a ’YO’ postcode listed is Decorations and Medals held meetings to discuss the 62. This figure relates to main applicants with first time Pingat Jasa Malaysia medal; what the cost of each such asylum claims that have yet to be concluded. All applications meeting was; and if he will make a statement. [71148] were made on or after 21 June 2005. Mr Maude: The Committee on the Grant of Honours, As cases are decided or applicants inform UK Border Decorations and Medals discussed the Pingat Jasa Malaysia Agency of a change of address the number of applicants Medal at its meeting on 7 December 2005. There were in York will change. no direct costs associated with this meeting. All figures quoted are internal management information only and are subject to change. This information has not been quality assured under National Statistics protocols. HOME DEPARTMENT Animal Experiments: Scotland Burglary Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many regulated procedures Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for the conducted in Scotland under the Animals (Scientific Home Department how many cases of domestic Procedures) Act 1986 involved (a) cats, (b) dogs, (c) burglary were reported in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) rabbits, (d) horses and other equids, (e) new world South Tyneside, (c) the North East and (d) England primates and (f) old world primates in 2010; and how and Wales in each year since 1997. [70089] many such procedures involved (i) genetically-modified animals and (ii) animals with a harmful genetic defect. James Brokenshire: Data are not centrally available [67999] for Jarrow. Lynne Featherstone: During 2010, in Scotland, there The Home Office collects data on the numbers of were four procedures using cats, 720 procedures using offences recorded by the police. Data are provided in dogs, 3,826 procedures using rabbits, 2,380 procedures the following tables for cases of domestic burglary in using horses and other equids, 47 procedures using new South Tyneside, the North East and for England and world primates and 885 procedures using old world Wales. primates used in regulated procedures started under the Table 1: Burglary in a dwelling offences recorded by the police in 1997 1986 Act. None of these procedures involved (i) genetically Area 1997 modified animals and (ii) animals with a harmful genetic 1 defect. Jarrow Constituency — South Tyneside CDRP/CSP 1— Antisocial Behaviour North East Region 31,310 England and Wales 519,265 Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for the 1 Data not centrally available. Home Department how many incidents of anti-social Notes: behaviour were reported to the police in (a) South 1. These data are not comparable with those for later years due to the counting rules and offence coverage in use at the time. Tyneside, (b) the North East and (c) England and 2. Prior to 2009-10, Community Safety Partnerships {CSPs) were referred to as Wales in (i) 2009-10 and (ii) 2010-11. [70096] Crime and Disorder Reduction Partnerships (CDRPs). 1127W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1128W

Table 2: Burglary in a dwelling offences recorded by the police from 1998-99 to Table 2: Burglary in a dwelling offences recorded by the police from 1998-99 to 2001-02 2001-02 Area 1998-99 1999-2000 2000-01 2001-02 Area 1998-99 1999-2000 2000-01 2001-02

Jarrow 1— 1— 1— 1— England and 473,349 442,602 402,984 430,347 Constituency Wales 1 Data not centrally available. South 1— 1,351 1,337 1,115 Notes: Tyneside CDRP/CSP 1. These data are not comparable with those before or after this period due to the counting rules and extended offence coverage in use at the time. North East 28.806 24,300 21,720 23,614 2. Prior to 2009-10, Community Safety Partnerships (CSPs) were referred to as Region Crime and Disorder Reduction Partnerships (CDRPs).

Table 3: Burglary in a dwelling offences recorded by the police from 2002-03 to 2010-11 Area 2002-03 2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11

Jarrow Constituency 1— 1— 1— 1— 1— 1— 1— 1— 1— South Tyneside 1,169 1,036 792 647 606 489 424 306 235 CDRP/CSP North East Region 21,583 19,550 14,934 13,095 12,303 10,881 10,408 8,597 7,618 England and Wales 437,583 402,345 321,507 300,517 292,260 280.696 284,431 268,610 258,148 (inc. BTP) 1 Data not centrally available. Notes: 1. These data are not comparable with previous years data to the introduction of the National Crime Recording Standard (NCRS) across all forces in April 2002. 2. Prior to 2009-10, Community Safety Partnerships (CSPs) were referred to as Crime and Disorder Reduction Partnerships {CDRPs).

Cannabis: Crime Nick Herbert: Claims for compensation under the Riot (Damages) Act 1996 are made directly to the Alok Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for the police authorities, which take the final decision as to Home Department how many police raids on whether a payment is made, and the size of that payment. properties in (a) Berkshire, (b) Reading and (c) These data are not held centrally. Reading West constituency resulted in the discovery of cannabis farms in the last 12 months. [70805] Mr Slaughter: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many people were arrested in James Brokenshire: The information requested on the England and Wales in connection with public disorder number of cannabis farms discovered in the areas concerned in August 2011. [70126] is not held centrally. Figures are available by police area, which in this case John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for is Thames Valley Police. The most recent figures published the Home Department how many people were arrested in the UK National Problem Profile, Commercial in England and Wales following the public disorder in Cultivation of Cannabis, July 2010, the Association of August 2011. [71183] Chief Police Officers found there to be 172 cannabis farms in the Thames Valley Police area representing eight farms per 100,000 population. Nick Herbert: The Ministry of Justice is currently publishing frequent updates on people arrested who Civil Disorder were dealt with by the court system in relation to the disturbances on 6-9 August. These reports can be found Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for the on the Ministry of Justice website at: Home Department pursuant to the Prime Minister’s http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/ad- oral statement of 11 August 2011, on public disorder, hoc/index.htm Official Report, columns 1051-1105, what her latest As the publication notes the Ministry of Justice chief estimate is of the likely cost of insurance payments to statistician will review the quality of data and release policyholders who suffered losses in the August 2011 further breakdowns as reliable data become available. It disturbances; and if she will estimate the total cost to is intended to release further data on 13 September. A the public purse of the disturbances including a more detailed release will be published on 15 September breakdown of expenditure for each purpose. [69783] containing detailed information on age, gender, offence committed, sentence given, and previous criminal history. Nick Herbert: There is, as yet, no estimate for the total cost of insurance payments or cost to the public purse resulting from the disorder in August 2011. Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for the Discussions are ongoing between the Home Office, HM Home Department whether she plans to bring forward Treasury, police authorities and the Claims Bureau to proposals to amend or repeal the Riot (Damages) assess the financial impact of the recent disorder. Act 1886. [70133]

Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the Nick Herbert: We are in the process of reviewing the Home Department how much was paid to each Riot Damages Act and are considering all options for individual for claims submitted under the Riot reform. However, the legislation still remains in place (Damages Act) 1886 in each of the last three years for and claims for compensation following the recent disorder which figures are available; and if she will make a can still be made from businesses and households to statement. [69825] police authorities. 1129W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1130W

Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for reviewed but are not removable currently, nine are being the Home Department how many businesses (a) in monitored and if appropriate will be considered for Birmingham and (b) elsewhere in England have sought removal action. to claim damages under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886 since August 2011. [70488] Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what the monetary value was of Nick Herbert: It is not yet possible to provide information criminal assets recovered by the Serious Organised on the number of claims received for businesses as the Crime Agency through the use of (a) its taxation data are still being received and collated locally. Claims powers, (b) civil recovery, (c) criminal confiscation for compensation under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886 and (d) cash forfeiture in each year since 2006. [70445] are made to the local police authority, who assess claims made to them and take the final decision as to Nick Herbert: Since 2006 the Serious Organised Crime whether a payment is made, and the size of that payment. Agency (SOCA) has recovered criminal assets with the The Home Office is supporting police authorities to following monetary value: enable these claims to be processed quickly. £ million Confiscation Orders Civil recovery Confiscation and tax receipts1 orders enforced Cash forfeiture

Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for the 2006-07 n/a 4.3 2.3 Home Department how many people were removed at 2007-08 n/a 8.0 2.9 the request of the Serious Organised Crime Agency in 2008-09 16.7 7.0 4.5 each year since 2006. [70444] 2009-10 6.8 7.4 10.2 2010-11 8.0 7.6 4.7 Damian Green: The Serious Organised Crime Agency 1 SOCA did not have civil recovery and tax powers prior to April 2008. (SOCA) routinely monitors any case of interest to them Civil recovery and tax receipts are shown as a combined where a Judge recommends a deportation at end of figure because in a number of cases a single settlement sentence, or where an individual will automatically be figure is agreed. considered for deportation by the UK Border Agency (UKBA) by virtue of their length of sentence. Crime SOCA notifies the UKBA of convicted cases where they have an interest, but this does not signify a request Mr Robinson: To ask the Secretary of State for the to remove. Home Department how many offences of (a) crime related to vehicles, (b) burglary of a dwelling, (c) In addition to those cases where convictions have other burglary, (d) criminal damage, (e) theft, (f) been obtained SOCA has referred to UKBA 14 individuals violence and (g) other crimes were committed in (i) of interest to establish if an immigration solution can Coventry and (ii) Warwickshire in each of the last five be presented as a means of disrupting organised criminal years. [70344] activity. Principally through removal of the individual from James Brokenshire: The available information relates the United Kingdom. Of those 14 cases three individuals to offences recorded by the police and is given in the were identified as having left the UK; and two were following tables:

Table 1: Offences recorded by the police in Coventry Offence 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11

Offences against vehicles 5,828 3,862 3,887 3,458 3,929 Burglary in a dwelling 2,431 2,152 2,164 2,195 2,715 Burglary in other building 2,218 1,917 1,623 1,782 1,744 Criminal damage 8,120 6,600 5,976 5,723 5,221 Other theft offences1 6,562 5,758 5,467 5,446 5,860 Violence against the person 7,592 7,229 6,631 6,552 5,153 Other crimes 4,210 3,499 3,364 3,322 3,159 Total 36,961 31,017 29,112 28,478 27,781 1 Excluding offences against vehicles.

Table 2: Offences recorded by the police in Warwickshire Offence 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11

Offences against vehicles 7,649 5,790 5,769 4,740 4,268 Burglary in a dwelling 2,844 2,373 2,216 2,261 2,014 Burglary in other building 3,601 3,173 3,428 3,262 3,305 Criminal damage 10,267 9,234 8,006 6,458 6,016 Other theft offences1 8,686 7,818 8,251 7,860 8,075 Violence against the person 7,386 7,526 5,957 5,302 5,369 Other crimes 4,824 4,054 3,741 3,945 3,780 Total 45,257 39,968 37,368 33,828 32,827 1 Excluding offences against vehicles. 1131W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1132W

Crime Prevention Every detention decision is made on a case by case basis. The criminal history is considered in terms of the Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for the potential risk of harm to the public if a foreign criminal Home Department what progress has been made on is released. Those who are detained have always been the introduction of gang injunctions. [70150] able to apply to an independent immigration judge for bail. Where the UK Border Agency believe there is a James Brokenshire: The Government introduced gang risk to the public we will vigorously oppose bail applications injunctions for adults in January 2011. As we announced or ask the court to impose reporting and electronic last month we will make them available for 14 to 17 year tagging restrictions if bail is granted. olds by the end of the year. In terms of managing the risk of reoffending in the community foreign offenders are treated in the same Departmental Written Questions way as British offenders. Foreign offenders who are eligible for Multi-Agency Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for Public Protection Arrangements (MAPPA), by the nature the Home Department what proportion of written of the offence they have committed and sentence received, questions tabled to her for answer on a named day did are managed in the same way as British MAPPA eligible not receive a substantive answer on the day named for offenders. All MAPPA eligible offenders are identified answer between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and following sentence. Information is shared with relevant (b) 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71129] agencies and a risk assessment conducted to ensure an appropriate risk management plan is in place for the Damian Green: From 27 May 2010 until 19 July 2011, offenders management in the community. the Home Office gave a substantive answer to 425 out of 1,241 (34.2%) questions on the day named for answer. From 9 March 2011 until 19 July 2011, the Home Office Detention Centres: Death gave a substantive answer to 154 out of 449 (34.3%) questions on the day named for answer. The Government have committed to providing the Jeremy Corbyn: To ask the Secretary of State for the Procedure Committee with information relating to written Home Department (1) what investigations she has parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis undertaken into deaths in immigration detention which and will provide full information to the Committee at occurred during August 2011; and if she will publish the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government the findings of any such investigation; [70818] Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary (2) what deaths occurred in immigration detention in Session were previously provided to the committee and each month of each of the last five years. [70820] are available on the Parliament website. Deportation: Offenders Damian Green [holding answer 8 September 2011]: The Prisons and Probation Ombudsman (PPO) is currently Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for the investigating a death that occurred in immigration detention Home Department with reference to the judgment of in August 2011. Upon completion the findings of the the European Court of Human Rights in the case of investigation will be published on the PPO website. Sufi and Elmi v. the United Kingdom, what steps she The police are informed of any deaths that occur of plans to take to protect the public from foreign individuals detained in, or travelling to or from, an offenders living in the UK who cannot be deported. immigration removal centre in the care of UK Border [63853] Agency staff or its contractors. They take a decision independent of the UK Border Agency as to whether or Damian Green: During their custodial sentence foreign not a police investigation is appropriate. All deaths are national prisoners are managed in the same way as also referred to the independent Prisons and Probation other prisoners. They are referred to the UK Border Ombudsman who conduct a separate investigation in to Agency by the National Offender Management Service the circumstances of the death. to establish their immigration status near to the start of Following the conclusion of the investigation, the their sentence. office of the PPO publishes an anonymised report on its The UK Border Agency seeks to deport from the UK website. foreign national offenders who meet the following criteria: Five deaths have occurred in the last five years of A court recommendation. individuals detained in, or travelling to or from, an For non-EEA nationals—a custodial sentence of 12 months or immigration removal centre as follows: more either in one sentence or as an aggregate of two or three sentences over a period of five years, or a custodial sentence of April 2010 any length for a drug offence (other than possession). October 2010 For EEA nationals—a custodial sentence of 12 months or more for an offence involving drugs, violent or sexual crimes or July 2011—two unrelated incidents a custodial sentence of 24 months or more for other offences. August 2011. Deportation is pursued where possible. It would be inappropriate to comment on the details Where deportation is pursued, but delayed due to of these deaths whilst they are the subject of ongoing documentation and other issues, at the end of an individual’s investigations by the PPO. When concluded, the custodial sentence the UK Border Agency will decide if Ombudsman’s report of his investigation is published detention under immigration powers is appropriate. on the PPO website. 1133W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1134W

Domestic Violence colleges to have insurance in place in order to repay fees if necessary, and students should check the position Mr Brine: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home before accepting an offer. Department what assistance her Department provides Our reforms mean that in future only responsible to victims of domestic violence who flee their homes. colleges offering high quality education will be able to [70182] sponsor students to come to the UK.

Lynne Featherstone: For the next four years the Home Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Office has committed over £28 million of funding for the Home Department how many removals involving specialist services to tackle violence against women and individuals granted entry clearance to the UK via the girls. student visa route there have been in each of the last For domestic violence this includes: five years. [71192] national helplines including the National Domestic Violence helpline, Respect, the Men’s Advice Line and Broken Rainbow; Damian Green: The information requested is not held centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate support for Independent Domestic Violence Advisors (IDVAs) and Multi-Agency Risk Assessment Conferences (MARACs) cost. nationally; The UK Border Agency standard reports record investment in the training and quality assurance process for removals either on the basis of the immigration offence MARACs and IDVAs; and (i.e. illegal working, overstaying) or the removal category a contribution to the running costs of the joint Home Office/Foreign (i.e. enforced removal, voluntary departure). The entry Commonwealth Office Forced Marriage Unit. clearance route under which the applicant originally Decisions around the provision of accommodation entered the UK is not recorded within these removal and services for victims of domestic abuse are a local reports. matter and it is the responsibility of the individual local authority to identify any gaps in service provision and Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for put in place appropriate solutions to address this. We the Home Department what representations she has would expect local authorities to build services based received from colleges on proposed changes to the on the needs of their communities, taking account of student visa system. [71193] locally available data sources. In 2009-10—the most recent year for which data are available—local authorities Damian Green: The Government are making radical spent £70.9 million on housing related support for changes to the immigration system. The old student victims of domestic violence. visa regime was open to widespread abuse and failed to protect legitimate students from being exploited by poor quality colleges. The changes we are implementing Drugs: Crime will tighten up the system, tackle abuse and continue to attract the brightest and the best students from across Alok Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for the the world. We have had a significant amount of Home Department what estimate she has made of the correspondence from colleges, as they seek to understand street value of illegal drugs confiscated during police and adapt to the new system. raids in (a) Berkshire, (b) Reading and (c) Reading West constituency in each of the last five years. [70806] Forensic Science Service James Brokenshire: The information requested on drug seizures is not collected centrally by the Home Yvette Cooper: To ask the Secretary of State for the Office. Home Department what the Government’s plans are Drug seizures are not recorded by street value due to for the archive of the Forensic Science Service. [70660] the value of illegal drugs varying according to a number of factors including: purity, availability, demand and Mrs May [holding answer 8 September 2011]: The locality. Forensic Science Service archive will remain publicly-owned and historical data within the archive will continue to Seizures are therefore usually recorded by weight and be available to the criminal justice system. or units. Yvette Cooper: To ask the Secretary of State for the Entry Clearances: Overseas Students Home Department if she will provide a breakdown of the costs to date of closing down the Forensic Science Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Service. [70661] the Home Department what her policy is on support for individuals who have paid course fees and Mrs May [holding answer 8 September 2011]: The application fees to colleges subsequently disaccredited Forensic Science Service (FSS) has been making significant by the UK Border Agency. [71191] financial losses and we are determined to make the managed closure as cost-effective to the taxpayer as Damian Green: Where the UK Border Agency revokes possible. To date the Government have provided the the license of a Tier 4 sponsor their students have FSS with £20 million of funding to maintain operational 60 days to find another college that is willing to sponsor continuity during the transition as well as £8.7 million them or to leave the UK. The new sponsor must issue a to cover staff redundancy payments. Confirmation of Acceptance for Studies and the student The final cost of the managed closure is not yet must apply for new leave to remain. We would expect known. 1135W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1136W

Government Procurement Card Immigration

John Glen: To ask the Secretary of State for the Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what the (a) transaction date, (b) Home Department what estimate she has made of the transaction amount and (c) supplier was of each number of people who have been in the UK without transaction undertaken by the (i) UK Passport Agency valid leave to remain for longer than 10 years. [71073] and (ii) Parole Board using the Government Procurement Card in (A) 2008-09 and (B) 2009-10; and Damian Green: The UK Border Agency is not able to which of these transactions attracted level three or provide the information requested. It is not possible to enhanced transaction entry. [70836] accurately quantify the number of individuals currently in the UK without valid leave to remain, as some Damian Green [holding answer 12 September 2011]: deliberately evade immigration control in order to remain In the financial year 2008-09 the Identity and Passport in the country illegally. Service (formerly the UK Passport Agency) total Government Procurement Card (GPC) expenditure was The e-Borders system enables checks to be made on £711,586.15 and in 2009-10 it was £357,000. It is not individuals arriving or exiting the country at a majority possible to provide a breakdown of GPC transactions of the points of entry to the UK but is not yet fully for the financial years 2008-09 and 2009-10 without rolled out. The Government are committed to ensuring incurring disproportionate cost. that the number of UK ports undertaking exit checks is increased to ensure a complete travel history record on A schedule of corporate charge card transactions for all passengers. the Parole Board, an arm’s length body of the Ministry of Justice, will be placed in the House of Commons The UK Border Agency is currently in the process of Library. There were no GPC transactions in 2008-09 establishing local immigration teams across the UK to and 2009-10 which were level three or required enhanced gather intelligence, tackle illegal working, and track transaction entry. down and detain immigration offenders. The focus of these teams will include the prevention and Stella Creasy: To ask the Secretary of State for the disruption of illegal activity and the arrest and removal Home Department if she will publish the value of of offenders. estimated tax receipts, calculated in accordance with the Green Book, in each public sector economic Members: Correspondence assessment of private finance initiative projects in procurement by her Department as of March 2011. Mr Winnick: To ask the Secretary of State for the [71224] Home Department when she plans to reply to the letter from the hon. Member for Walsall North of 9 August Damian Green: The Home Office, its Executive agencies 2011 regarding the proposed reduction in the number and non-departmental public bodies (NDPBs) did not of police in the West Midlands. [70662] have any private finance initiative projects in procurement as of March 2011. Had it done so, the economic assessment of options would have been carried out in accordance Nick Herbert [holding answer 8 September 2011]: I with HM Treasury’s Value for Money model which wrote to the hon. Gentleman on 22 August 2011. accompanies the Green Book. Members: Correspondence Hillsborough Independent Panel

Dr Thérèse Coffey: To ask the Secretary of State for Sir Gerald Kaufman: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many times the the Home Department when she intends to answer the Hillsborough Independent Panel has met since it was letter sent to the Minister for Immigration by the right formed. [70045] hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton on 4 July 2011 with regard to Mrs S Rahman. [69815] Nick Herbert: The Hillsborough Independent Panel’s terms of reference indicate that it is expected to meet Damian Green: I wrote to the right hon. Member on monthly. In accordance with its terms of reference it 6 September 2011. has now met 19 times since its first meeting in February 2010. Newspaper Press: Telephone Tapping Dr Thérèse Coffey: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many documents the Ms Ritchie: To ask the Secretary of State for the Hillsborough Independent Panel has reviewed. [70063] Home Department whether she has had discussions with the Metropolitan police on allegations of Nick Herbert: The Hillsborough Independent Panel telephone hacking of (a) public figures and (b) is accessing and researching hundreds of thousands of victims of terrorism in Northern Ireland. [66158] documents and other materials relating to the context, circumstances and aftermath of the disaster. It will Nick Herbert [holding answer 14 July 2011]: The publish a comprehensive, independent and analytical Secretary of State for the Home Department, my right report and establish a public archive. I understand that hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May), it is the panel’s intention to publish all documents discussed the allegations of phone hacking generally simultaneously. with the Metropolitan Police. 1137W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1138W

North Yorkshire Police: Expenditure of action to deliver this commitment. That is why on 9 May 2011 I announced a new package of policies that Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for the will cut police bureaucracy, saving up to 2.5 million Home Department how much the North Yorkshire police hours per year. police authority has spent in (a) cash and (b) real In moving away from central control to local terms in each year since 1996-97. [71496] accountability it will be for chief constables to monitor how they use their resources to cut crime. Nick Herbert: While the Government provide core police funding, spending decisions are made locally by the chief constables and police authorities. Data on Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for the expenditure are not collected centrally. However, this Home Department (1) which foreign countries have information is published annually by the Chartered provided security training to police forces in the UK in Institute of Public Finance and Accountancy (CIPFA). the latest period for which figures are available; [69358] (2) which police forces purchased security training Nottinghamshire Police Authority from outside the UK in the latest period for which figures are available. [69359] John Mann: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many hours officers in Nottinghamshire police spent on front-line activities in Nick Herbert [holding answer 7 September 2011]: This information is not collected centrally. (a) 2009 and (b) 2010. [70505]

Nick Herbert [holding answer 7 September 2011]: John Mann: To ask the Secretary of State for the The requested information is not collected centrally. Home Department how many police officers there were (a) (b) Parliament Square: Demonstrations in Nottinghamshire on 5 May 2010 and the latest date for which figures are available. [70310] Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what guidance is issued to Nick Herbert [holding answer 7 September 2011]: Metropolitan Police officers in respect of the policing Police personnel data are not centrally collected for of permanent demonstrations in Parliament Square; May 2010. Published statistics from the Home Office and what factors police officers take into account in police personnel database show that as at 31 March determining whether to permit or deter any 2010 there were 2,409 and as at 31 March 2011, there demonstration at the point at which they commence. were 2,319 full-time equivalent (FTE) police officers in [71031] the Nottinghamshire police force area. The latest published police personnel statistics relate Nick Herbert: The Home Office does not issue any to 31 March 2011 and were published in July 2011. such guidance. Section 134 of the Serious Organised They are available online at: Crime and Police Act 2005 sets out the criteria that the http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/science-research- Metropolitan police would use to manage protest in statistics/research-statistics/police-research/hosb1311/ Parliament Square. The Government are bringing forward hosb1311?view=Binary reforms in the Police Reform and Social Responsibility Bill to ensure that Parliament Square can be enjoyed by all, and we have given a commitment to issue guidance Mr Robinson: To ask the Secretary of State for the to support effective enforcement of the new provisions. Home Department how many full-time equivalent (a) police officers, (b) police community support officers Police and (c) police civilian staff were employed by (i) West Midlands Police force and (ii) Warwickshire Police Clive Efford: To ask the Secretary of State for the force in (A) May 2010 and (B) the latest period for Home Department (1) what estimate she has made of which figures are available. [70353] the amount of police officer time spent on (a) administrative duties and (b) front line policing in each Nick Herbert: The available information shows the of the last five years; and what steps she plans to take number of (full-time equivalent) police officers, police to monitor the balance of such time in the future; community support officers and police civilian staff [66820] that were employed by West Midlands police force and (2) what proportion of police officer time on average Warwickshire police force as at 31 March 2010 and was spent on administration and internal organisation 31 March 2011 and appears within the following table. in each of the past five years; and if she will make a Figures are collected on a financial year basis and the statement. [66811] latest period for which figures are available are as at 31 March 2011. Nick Herbert [holding answer 18 July 2011]: According Number of police officers, police community support officers and police civilian to the Front Line Policing Measure commissioned by staff that were employed by West Midlands police force and Warwickshire police the last government, police officers spent 21.7% of their force, as at 31 March 2010 and 31 March 20111 time on paperwork and 13.8% on patrol in 2007-08, the West Midlands Warwickshire last year for which figures were available. 2010 2011 2010 2011

The Government are clear that the police should Police Officers 8,626 8,149 973 919 focus on police work not paperwork and the Home Police Community 811 758 138 136 Office is now engaged in a comprehensive programme Support Officers 1139W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1140W

Number of police officers, police community support officers and police civilian Police: Incentives staff that were employed by West Midlands police force and Warwickshire police force, as at 31 March 2010 and 31 March 20111 West Midlands Warwickshire Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for the 2010 2011 2010 2011 Home Department if she will ask the Winsor Review to Police Civilian 3,667 3,184 765 720 consider ending the payment of annual bonuses to Staff senior police officers. [70164] 1 This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. Source: Nick Herbert: Tom Winsor’s Part 1 report recommended Home Office using data received from police forces via the Annual Data that the Chief Officer Bonus Scheme be suspended for Requirement two years. The Secretary of State for the Home Department, Police Custody: Death my right hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May), referred recommendations about police Mr Meacher: To ask the Secretary of State for the officers’ pay and conditions to the police negotiating Home Department how many people have died in machinery and that process is ongoing. police custody where the inquest verdict was (a) Tom Winsor’s consultation for Part 2 of his review misadventure, (b) accidental death, (c) suicide, (d) indicates that he will consider contribution-related pay manslaughter, (e) an open verdict, (f) unlawful killing further in his second report, on longer-term reforms. and (g) natural causes since 1981; and in how many instances (i) no verdict was given and (ii) there was no inquest. [70378] Police: Manpower Nick Herbert [holding answer 8 September 2011]: The information requested is not held centrally or collated Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for the by the Home Office. The Independent Police Complaints Home Department what information she holds on the Commission (IPCC) compiles annual statistics on deaths proportion of police budgets spent on (a) frontline or serious injuries during or following police contact, police officers and (b) administrative staff in the most based on referrals from police forces. These statistics are recent period for which figures are available. [69900] published in its annual report. The most recent report can be found on the IPCC’s website at: Nick Herbert [holding answer 7 September 2011]: http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/en/Pages/deathscustodystudy.aspx This information is not collected centrally. Police: Bureaucracy Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for the Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department (1) how many police community Home Department pursuant to the answer of 18 July support officers there were in (a) South Tyneside area 2011, Official Report, column 663W, on police: command, (b) North Tyneside area command, (c) the bureaucracy, when the Reducing Bureaucracy North East and (d) England and Wales in each year Programme Board commenced its work; how many since their introduction; [70090] police forms have been standardised to date; and how (2) how many police officers there were in (a) South many such forms are in use in all police forces. [70482] Tyneside area command, (b) North Tyneside area command, (c) the north-east and (d) England and Nick Herbert: The Reducing Bureaucracy Programme Wales in each year since 1997. [70091] Board, chaired by Chief Constable Chris Sims, commenced its work in October 2010. The board is currently looking Nick Herbert: Available information on police community at the crime recording process, challenging forces to support officers is given in tables 1 and 2 and for police simplify their own practice. However, it is for individual officers in tables 2 and 3. forces to determine which recommendations to take forward. The board is currently evaluating the uptake The latest published police personnel statistics relate of a number of its recommendations at a local level. to 31 March 2011 and were published in July 2011. This will be completed in October 2011. They are available online at: http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/science-research- Police: Conditions of Employment statistics/research-statistics/police-research/hosb1311/ hosb1311?view=Binary Andrew Selous: To ask the Secretary of State for the Table 1: Police community support officer1 strength2 (FTE)3, South and North Home Department what police policy is on paying for Tyneside basic command unit, 31 March 2007 to 31 March 2011 private medical treatment for their officers and staff; 31 March whether her Department’s approval is required for such 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 [68302] payments; and if she will make a statement. South 25 24 27 37 45 Tyneside Nick Herbert [holding answer 5 September 2011]: It North 31 30 34 52 47 is for individual chief officers to decide whether to pay Tyneside for private medical treatment for their officers. Home 1 2006-07 was the first year that police community support officer strength information by basic command unit was been collected centrally. Office guidance says that this decision should be made 2 This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the on a case by case basis and should be justified by a strict nearest whole number. cost benefit analysis. However, no approval is required 3 Full-time equivalent includes those on career breaks or maternity/paternity from the Home Secretary. leave. 1141W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1142W

Table 2: Police community support officer strength1 (FTE)2, north-east region and England and Wales, 31 March 2003 to 31 March 2011 31 March 2003 2004 20053 20063 20073 20083 20093 20103 20113

North-east region4 47 155 270 296 504 585 628 806 785 England and Wales 1,176 3,418 6,214 6,769 13,497 15,805 16,507 16,918 15,820 1 This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. 2 Full-time equivalent includes those on career breaks or maternity/paternity leave. 3 Strength figures as at 31 March 2005 onwards include those staff on career breaks or maternity/paternity leave. Therefore these figures are not comparable with those provided for other years in the table. 4 The north-east region includes Cleveland, Durham and Northumbria police forces. Note: Police community support officers were introduced in statute in 2002, therefore data are not available prior to 2002-03

Table 3: Police officer strength1, South and North Tyneside basic command unit2, 31 March 2003 to 31 March 2011 31 March 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011

South Tyneside 291 303 346 352 362 341 357 326 319 North Tyneside34— 4— 390 375 376 372 391 367 353 1 This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. 2 Information on basic command units was not collected centrally prior to 2002-03. 3 North Tyneside BCU was formed after 2003-04. Data prior to this period are not available centrally. 4 Not available.

Table4:Policeofficer1 strength less those on career breaks or maternity/paternity leave (comparable with previously published figures)2 north-east region3 and England and Wales, 31 March 1997 to 31 March 2011 31 March 1997 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004

North East region3 6,597 6,767 6,823 6,749 6,859 7,004 7,177 7,413 England and Wales 125,051 124,756 123,841 121,956 123,476 127,267 131,426 137,105

31 March 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011

North East region3 7,442 7,365 7,313 7,196 7,350 7,290 7,052 England and Wales 139,491 139,631 140,032 139,728 141,647 141,631 136,994 1 This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. 2 Comparable strength (excludes those on career breaks, or maternity/paternity leave). The Police Numbers Task Force (2001) recommended that a clear presentation was made of the numbers of staff employed by police forces including those seconded into the force and those on any type of long or short-term absence. These new calculations were first used in 2003, and are not comparable with data prior to March 2003. The data from 2003 onwards used here are termed comparable because they have been calculated on the old basis to allow comparison. 3 The north-east region includes Cleveland, Durham and Northumbria police forces.

Police: Pay James Brokenshire: The Prevent strategy identifies three main areas of funding: Policing and Domestic Mr Laurence Robertson: To ask the Secretary of Prevent expenditure, both funded by the Home Office State for the Home Department what plans she has to and Overseas Prevent expenditure, funded by the Foreign ensure that police officers receive incremental pay and Commonwealth Office (FCO). In 2011-12, the increases comparable to employees in other public Home Office has allocated approximately £36 million services; and if she will make a statement. [70695] for policing and domestic Prevent activity, and the FCO has allocated approximately £10 million for overseas Nick Herbert: The Part 1 Report of the Independent activity. As delivery of the new Prevent strategy progresses, Review of Police Officer and Staff Remuneration and the balance of funding will be reviewed to ensure it Conditions recommended that police officers and all remains proportionate to the threats we face, is targeted members of police staff below the top of their pay scale to deliver Prevent objectives, reaches people who are should be suspended at that increment for a two-year most vulnerable to radicalisation and provides value for period commencing in September 2011. money. We will publish an annual report on our counter- The Secretary of State for the Home Department, my terrorism work, which will include delivery of the Prevent right hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May), strategy. referred recommendations (including this one) about police officers’ pay and conditions to the police negotiating Prisoners’ Release machinery. She will consider the outcome of that process carefully before any decisions are made as to the Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for the implementation of the review’s recommendations. Home Department how many times the Serious and Organised Crime Agency altered the licence conditions Prevent Funding of released prisoners in each year since 2006. [70062]

Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Nick Herbert: The Serious Organised Crime Agency the Home Department what steps she will be taking to (SOCA) does not, and cannot, unilaterally alter the review the balance between the three main areas of licence conditions of offenders released from prison as Prevent funding; and how she will communicate the this is a matter for the National Offender Management outcomes of such reviews to Parliament. [70490] Service (NOMS). However, SOCA works within a 1143W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1144W partnership agreement with NOMS to create additional The reports for 2009-10 may be found on the Ministry and bespoke licence conditions to prevent organised of Justice website at: criminals from reoffending upon release, in compliance http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/ with the European convention on human rights. mappa-reports/index.htm Under these arrangements, SOCA has, since 2006, The MAPPA area annual reports for 2010-11 will be requested the number of additional licence conditions published on 27 October 2011. set out as follows: West Midlands Police Authority: Warwickshire Police Authority Number Mr Robinson: To ask the Secretary of State for the 2006 0 Home Department what the budget out-turn was of 2007 8 the (a) West Midlands police authority and (b) 2008 16 Warwickshire police authority in (i) cash and (ii) real 2009 27 terms in each year since 2005-06. [70354] 2010 10 2011 16 Nick Herbert: Information about the budget out-turn 1 Including one on temporary release. of Warwickshire and West Midlands police authorities Terrorism is not collected centrally. However, these data are available on the respective police authorities’ websites. Dr Julian Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps she is taking to prevent TREASURY people from being drawn into terrorism. [70948] Equitable Life Assurance Society: Compensation Mrs May: The new Prevent strategy was published on Henry Smith: To ask the Chancellor of the 7 June 2011. It outlines three key objectives; responding Exchequer what progress his Department has made to the ideological challenge of terrorism, supporting against the Government’s timetable for compensation individuals at risk of radicalisation and working with payments to Equitable Life policyholders. [71453] sectors and institutions where there are risks of radicalisation. Mr Hoban: Payments began on the 30 June. Hundreds of payments have been made to date and volumes will Vetting continue to be ramped up over the coming months as the scheme’s complex payment processes are refined Jesse Norman: To ask the Secretary of State for the further. Home Department how many enhanced disclosures Payments will continue in accordance with the profile have been made by the Criminal Records Bureau in set out at the spending review settlement—with £1 billion each year since 2007. [71426] allocated to the scheme in the first three years of this spending review—and the Independent Commission on Lynne Featherstone: The Criminal Records Bureau Equitable Life Payments’ recommendations on the (CRB) has issued almost 17 million enhanced certificates prioritisation of payments. since January 2007, broken down as follows: Simon Kirby: To ask the Chancellor of the Certificates issued Exchequer what proportion of Equitable Life with- Number profits annuitants have been paid compensation to 2007 3,050,148 date. [71538] 2008 3,345,015 2009 3,848,836 Mr Hoban: Payments began on 30 June, and hundreds 2010 4,119,250 of payments have been made to date. Payment volumes 2011 (as at 31 August) 2,613,597 will continue to be ramped up over the coming months Total 16,976,846 as the schemes complex payment processes are refined further. Violent and Sex Offender Register Payments are being made in accordance with the payments criteria set out in the scheme rules available Mr Andrew Turner: To ask the Secretary of State for at: the Home Department what the rate per thousand http://www.equitablelifepaymentscheme.independent.gov.uk/ population is of registrations on the Violent and Sex docs/pdfs/elps_main_doc_final.pdf Offender Register in each English county. [70317]

James Brokenshire [holding answer 7 September 2011]: DEFENCE ViSOR (previously known as the violent and sex offenders Air Force register) is a UK-wide computer database system used to store and share information and intelligence on Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for individuals posing a risk of serious harm, including but Defence what the Order of Battle is of the Royal Air not limited to registered sex offenders. Force. [71101] Data on the total number of registered sexual offenders Nick Harvey: Order of Battle is not a term commonly per 100,000 head of population is published for each applied by the Royal Air Force. The information in the police force area within the Multi-Agency Public Protection following table is a current indication of the size and Arrangements (MAPPA) annual report for that area. shape of the RAF: 1145W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1146W

of the second, HMS Prince of Wales. On current plans, Main RAF Number of group we expect to take firm decisions on the optimum conversion squadrons Aircraft/Activity responsible solution for the operational carrier in late 2012. 6 Tornado GR4 1 Armed Forces 5 Typhoon 1 1 Sentinel/Shadow 2 Alex Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for 1 Sentry 2 Defence what the average length of time taken is 3 Search and Rescue Sea King 2 between the start of phase one training and deployable 3 C 130 Hercules 2 capability for an infantry soldier aged (a) 18 or over I Command Support Air Transport Fleet 2 and (b) 16; and what the average cost for this period is 1 Reaper 2 in respect of (i) training, (ii) salary and (iii) other costs. 1 C-17 Globemaster 2 [70674] 3 Hawk 22 and 1 1 VC-10 2 Nick Harvey: All infantry recruits undertake Phase 1 1 Tristar 2 and Phase 2 training, to provide them with the basic 3 Tutor 22 infantry skills required to enter the Field Army. To 1 King Air 22 reach the level required to deploy on operations, further 2 Sentry/Sentinel 2 mission specific training takes place prior to deployment. 2 Griffin 22 and 2 1 Tucano 22 The average length of time taken to complete Phase 1 1 Fast Jet and Weapons Operational 2 and Phase 2 training for Standard Entry (SE) Infantry Evaluation Unit (OEU) soldiers (those who are aged 17.5 years or over on 1 No Aircraft—AWC HQ trials and 2 enlistment) is between 28 to 30 weeks. tactics, office based air exercise planning unit The average length of time taken to complete Phase 1 1 Integrated Test and Evaluation 2 and Phase 2 training for Junior Entry (JE) Infantry Squadron soldiers (those aged between 16 and 17.5 years of age) is 3 Chinook 1— between 64 and 74 weeks. 2 Merlin 1— The following table shows the average cost of Phase 1 2 Puma 1— and Phase 2 training and the average salary paid to SE 1 Joint Helicopter Command and JE soldiers for the period of training. All other Air Force: Recruitment costs are included in the average training cost.

Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Per trainee 1 Defence what the cost is of his Department’s television Average training cost Average salary cost advertising campaign for Royal Air Force recruitment. Junior £50,000 to £65,000 £25,000 to £29,000 [71069] Entry Standard £21,000 to £40,000 £11,000 to £12,000 Mr Robathan [holding answer 9 September 2011]: Entry 1 Salary costs based on the 2010-11 capitation rate for a recruit. The cost of the recent television advertising campaign Note: for Royal Air Force recruitment was £1.6 million. This All figures are rounded to the nearest £1,000 based on costs for financial year is broadly comparable with the previous financial year, 2010-11. but reflects a saving of 47% on financial year 2008-09. Armed Forces: Discharges Aircraft Carriers: Equipment Alex Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence how many armed forces personnel were Penny Mordaunt: To ask the Secretary of State for discharged on the basis of services no longer required Defence what the estimated cost of fitting cats and in the last five years. [70677] traps to (a) one and (b) both Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carriers; whether he plans to fit cats and traps Mr Robathan: The number of Royal Navy, Royal to (i) HMS Queen Elizabeth and (ii) HMS Prince of Marines, and Royal Air Force personnel who were Wales; and if he will make a statement. [70321] discharged in the last five years on the basis that their service was no longer required is provided in the following Peter Luff [holding answer 12 September 2011]: The tables. Data for Army personnel are not held in the Strategic Defence and Security Review called for one format requested. Queen Elizabeth (QE) class aircraft carrier to be converted to operate the more capable and cost-effective carrier Number variant of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter. The National Audit Office’s report on Carrier Strike, published on Naval Service 7 July 2011, estimated the cost of converting a single 2006-07 50 carrier at £800 million to £1.2 billion, a reasonable 2007-08 20 estimate based on the maturity of information currently 2008-09 0 available. We are developing more detailed cost estimates 2009-10 0 as part of our ongoing work. 2010-11 0 A revised design is being developed to consider the cost differences between a post-build refit of the first in RAF class, HMS Queen Elizabeth and an in-build conversion 2006-07 50 1147W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1148W

Mr Robathan: We do not comment on the payment Number made to individual service personnel. However, the 2007-08 20 Armed Forces Compensation Scheme (AFCS) was reviewed 2008-09 10 by Admiral the Lord Boyce in 2010. He re-examined the 2009-10 20 increases made to the tariff levels in 2008 and concluded 2010-11 60 that the top level lump sum of £570,000 remained Note: appropriate. Figures are rounded to the nearest 10. Having a maximum lump sum payable recognises Armed Forces: Training that when considering individuals who are very profoundly injured, there comes a point where distinguishing between Alex Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for level of injury becomes impossible and the only equitable Defence how many recruits at the Army Foundation way to assess the amount payable is to treat individuals College Harrogate (a) started and (b) completed an in this category in the same way. apprenticeship or equivalent vocational training The guaranteed income payment element of an AFCS leading to recognised professional qualifications in (i) award, which is paid upon discharge to those who mechanics, (ii) plumbing, (iii) catering, (iv) electronics, sustain serious illness or injury, can be the most financially (v) carpentry and (vi) construction in each of the last beneficial part of the compensation package. This tax five years. [70676] free, index linked, monthly income stream is paid from the point of service discharge for life, to recognise the Mr Robathan: The Army Foundation College Harrogate effect of the injury on the future employment prospects (AFC(H)) is a non-academic college and students undertake of an individual and can be worth many hundreds of a vocational apprenticeship, designed to enable young thousands of pounds. recruits to prepare for military training and life. This includes the opportunity to work on key skills such as communication, application of numbers, working with Departmental Assets others and problem-solving. Students have the opportunity to attain qualifications in numeracy, literacy and information Mr Arbuthnot: To ask the Secretary of State for technology. Defence what estimate he has made of the (a) number Consequently no recruits at the AFC(H) have completed and (b) monetary value of his Department’s assets an apprenticeship or equivalent vocational training leading that cannot be located. [68526] to recognised professional qualifications in mechanics, plumbing, catering, electronics, carpentry and construction. Peter Luff: The Comptroller and Auditor General’s Nor is training in any of these specified categories (C&AG)’s report on the Ministry of Defence’s 2010-11 delivered in the AFC(H) syllabus. However, during the Annual Report and Accounts, which has been accepted course, recruits receive a range of educational development by the MOD, identified that the Department was unable including: qualifications in numeracy and English; Level to provide sufficient information to support the accounting 2 Diploma for IT Users. They also have the opportunity for certain inventory and capital spares, including Bowman to complete the European Computer Driving Licence radios, totalling £5.3 billion. (ECDL) and advanced ECDL; a critical thinking package, The difficulties in reconciling inventory system records bolstered by three weeks of personnel and team with the accounting systems does not mean that we development training, the aim of which is develop the have lost any of these items. Nevertheless, given that recruits’ ability to analyse and solve problems. equipment frequently moves between military units on Armoured Fighting Vehicles operations or between units and the repair loop the MOD is committed to doing more to improve the Mr Wallace: To ask the Secretary of State for underlying tracking processes and systems. Defence what the status is of the Warrior IFV turret On the issue of Bowman radios, the Bowman Asset upgrade; and if he will make a statement. [70172] Management Improvement Plan; which is addressing Peter Luff: The Secretary of State for Defence, my specific concerns raised by the NAO over the recording right hon. Friend the Member for North Somerset of additions and disposal, and delivery of replacements (Dr Fox), announced plans to upgrade the Army’s for legacy inventory systems will continue to deliver Warrior Infantry Fighting Vehicle in his statement to improvements in the quality of the accounting information. the House on Defence Transformation on 18 July 2011, On asset and stock management the Chief of Defence Official Report, columns 643-45. The Warrior Capability Materiel, as logistics process owner, has established the Sustainment Programme plans to deliver enhancements Materiel and Financial Accounting Programme Board in lethality, survivability, growth potential, and safe to review processes for all areas of asset management operation. The turret upgrade, incorporating a 40 mm and accounting. The Board is overseeing a number of cannon, is one of these elements. The programme has key areas of work including: reached its main investment decision point and a further The replacement of legacy inventory systems to improve the announcement is expected later in the autumn. logistics capability in support of the front line and to address Ben Parkinson the issues raised by NAO. A four year plan; to be completed in 2013, to improve stocktaking Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence and ensure balances are correctly recorded on the systems. what assessment he has made of the adequacy of the Improvements in skills and competencies training, which is personal injury compensation paid to Lance being introduced from 2011. Bombardier Ben Parkinson in respect of the injuries An action plan to dispose of obsolete stock which commenced sustained while on active service. [71520] in 2010-11. 1149W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1150W

C&AG has acknowledged that some progress has substantive answer on the day named for answer already been made in the way that the MOD controls between (a) 27 May 2010 and 19 July 2011 and (b) inventory and capital spares and welcomed the way in 9 March 2011 and 19 July 2011. [71130] which the MOD has responded to previous recommendations. However, C&AG also recognises that the MOD is only two years into a longer term programme Mr Robathan: The Ministry of Defence (MOD) received to resolve the underlying issues and that benefits arising 1,141 questions for written answer on a named day from approved new systems will only start to have an between 27 May 2010 and July 2011, of which 510 impact in 2014. (45%) did not receive a substantive answer on the day named for answer. For the period 9 March 2011 to A copy of the Ministry of Defence’s 2010-11 Annual 19 July 2011, the MOD received 361 questions for Report and Accounts is available in the Library of the written answer on a named day, of which 188 (52%) did House or via the following link: not receive a substantive answer on the day named for http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/AboutDefence/ answer. CorporatePublications/AnnualReports/ MODAnnualReports1011/ The Government are committed to providing the Procedure Committee with information relating to written Departmental Manpower parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis and will provide full information to the Committee at Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for the end of the session. Statistics relating to Government Defence what the staff level was of (a) Royal Navy Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary personnel, (b) Ministry of Defence (MOD) police, (c) session were previously provided to the Committee and MOD civil servants and (d) non-MOD personnel are available on the Parliament website. employed at MOD Caledonia as at 18 July 2011. [71614] Gurkhas Mr Robathan: The number of staff that were employed at Ministry of Defence Caledonia as at 18 July 2011 is shown in the following table: Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence what the Order of Battle is of the Brigade of Number Gurkhas. [71102]

Royal Navy 90 MOD police 35 Nick Harvey: The Order of Battle for the Brigade of MOD civil servants 68 Gurkhas is as follows: Non-MOD personnel 108 Unit Location

Departmental Taxis HQ Brigade of Gurkhas Upavon 1st Battalion Royal Gurkha Rifles Shorncliffe Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the Secretary of State for 2nd Battalion Royal Gurkha Rifles Brunei Defence how much his Department has spent on taxis for (a) Ministers, (b) officials and (c) special advisers Queen’s Gurkha Signals: since May 2010. [59560] 246 Gurkha Signal Squadron York Dr Fox [holding answer 14 June 2011]: Information 248 Gurkha Signal Squadron Stafford held on Ministry of Defence (MOD) expenditure on 250 Gurkha Signal Squadron Bramcote taxis is as follows. Band of the Brigade of Gurkhas Shorncliffe The Defence Ministers spent £163 on taxi fares between May 2010 and the end of June 2011. Defence Ministers make very few journeys by taxi as they use the MOD Queens Own Gurkha Logistic Regiment: car pool for most road travel. 28 Squadron Aldershot Taxi fares reimbursed to officials are not recorded 94 Squadron Hullavington separately from bus and underground fares and parking 1 Squadron Aldershot and road tolls. The MOD’s three special advisers spent £994 on taxi Queen’s Gurkha Engineers: fares between May 2010 and the end of June 2011. 69 Squadron Maidstone MOD staff may only use a taxi for official duty when 70 Squadron Maidstone there is a business benefit to the MOD or when it saves money. A taxi is typically used where no other suitable Gurkha Companies: form of public transport is available or where heavy baggage or equipment has to be carried. Royal Military Academy Sandhurst Sandhurst Infantry Battle School Brecon Departmental Written Questions Infantry Training Centre Catterick Infantry Training Centre Language Catterick Wing Thomas Docherty: To ask the Secretary of State for Staff and Personnel Support Glasgow Defence what proportion of written questions tabled to Gurkha Reinforcement Company Munster, Germany him for answer on a named day did not receive a 1151W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1152W

HMS Endurance (2) what plans his Department has to provide access to a training ground for tanks based at the proposed Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for new army base at Kirknewton; and what assessment he Defence what work was carried out on HMS has made of the likely costs to be incurred in such Endurance before it was taken over by the Navy; and provision; [70188] whether any work was subsequently undertaken by his (3) what new facilities will be required to Department that had not been anticipated. [70330] accommodate personnel who are moved to Glencorse Barracks upon the closure of Redford and Dreghorn Peter Luff: After HMS Polar Circle was leased by the barracks; and what assessment he has made of the Ministry of Defence in November 1991 and prior to likely costs of such facilities; [70190] the ship’s first deployment, modifications were made to (4) what estimate he has made of the cost of the Ship’s aviation, communications and hydrographic modernising the barracks at (a) Redford, (b) systems utilising equipment from the previous HMS Dreghorn and (c) Craigiehall. [70275] Endurance where feasible. This included putting non-slip surfaces on the Ship’s hangar deck, improved flight Nick Harvey: Comprehensive planning work is now aids, improved aviation fuelling systems, encrypted satellite under way to draw up plans for the timing and sequencing communication and a new echo sounder. of the Army moves. In January 1992, the decision was made to purchase This detailed planning work will involve the appropriate HMS Polar Circle and the ship was renamed as HMS and necessary engagement with partners such as the Endurance in October 1992. At this stage, a further Scottish Government, West Lothian Council and Other series of planned modifications were made to the vessel, Government Departments and agencies, including the including enlarging its hangar and the fitting of additional appropriate level of consultation which will be required communication and hydrographic equipment. Until its as we work through all options. It is therefore too early flooding in 2008, all other maintenance or refit work to confirm further details on the exact requirements conducted on HMS Endurance had been anticipated and their costs. and was conducted as part of the ship’s routine programme. Libya: Armed Conflict Navy

David Morris: To ask the Secretary of State for Mark Garnier: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence whether any UK ground forces have been Defence for what reasons Royal Fleet Auxiliary deployed in Libya; and what plans he has for such personnel are required to meet Merchant Navy and future deployment. [70650] Royal Navy fire fighting standards; and whether he has considered the merits of rationalising such Dr Fox: The UK has a small military mentoring team requirements. [70334] in Libya supporting the National Transitional Council. Nick Harvey: The Maritime and Coastguard Agency Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for (MCA) set statutory requirements for firefighting standards Defence if he will order a lessons learned paper on for those employed in the merchant navy. In addition to NATO operations in Libya. [71097] the mandatory training provided at the merchant navy training establishment the operational role of the Royal Dr Fox: The Ministry of Defence routinely conducts Fleet Auxiliary (RFA) is such that enhanced training is lessons learned exercises after the conclusion of a military provided by the Royal Navy firefighting training facility, operation. in order to deal with the situations they may encounter whilst deploying with our armed forces. Military Aircraft As part of the process of improving the training of its personnel, the RFA has begun the process of seeking Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for MCA accreditation for the advanced naval firefighting Defence how many Search and Rescue missions the course so that RFA personnel would be able to conduct E-3D Sentry aircraft has flown in the latest period for their firefighting training at the Royal Navy facilities. which figures are available; and what the duration was of each such mission. [70843] Royal Armoured Corps Nick Harvey: The E-3D has flown one search and rescue mission during the period 1 January 2011 to Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for 6 September 2011. The total flight time was three hours Defence what the future Force Structure of the Royal 37 minutes. Armoured Corps is to be. [71099] Military Bases Nick Harvey: Following on from the Secretary of State for Defence, my right hon. Friend the Member for Mike Crockart: To ask the Secretary of State for North Somerset (Dr Fox’s) announcement to the House Defence (1) what assessment his Department has made on 18 July 2011, Official Report, columns 643-645W, of the measures which will be required to adapt roads the chief of the general staff has directed that a study be around Kirknewton to allow heavy weaponry, undertaken, known as Army 2020, to look at the future including transporters carrying tanks, to reach the design of the Army. proposed new army base; and what estimate his The future force structure of the Royal Armoured Department has made of the likely cost of such work; Corps, both regular and reserve, will be considered as [70187] part of this. 1153W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1154W

It is anticipated that the study will conclude in summer adopt environmentally-friendly practices which are 2012 and, until then, it is too early to say what the rationed against the carbon footprint of a factory as future force structure of the Royal Armoured Corps well as the carbon footprint of the product. [71610] will be. Royal Fleet Auxiliary Gregory Barker: There is currently a wide range of incentives and regulations in place to encourage UK Mark Garnier: To ask the Secretary of State for manufacturers to be more energy and carbon efficient. Defence what recent discussions he has had on steps to These include the EU Emissions Trading System, which increase the profile of the Royal Fleet Auxiliary. is a market-based approach based on the emissions [70338] associated with historical production, Climate Change Agreements, which offer reduced levels of tax in return Nick Harvey: I and my colleagues fully recognise that for meeting energy efficiency targets related to product the Royal Fleet Auxiliary (RFA) continues to be widely output, and the CRC Energy Efficiency Scheme, which acknowledged as being among the leading naval logistic uses a range of measures to drive behaviour change support organisations in the world, integral to the Royal including robust reporting, a competitive league table Navy’s deployments and global presence and an important and attaching a price to the carbon that businesses emit. element of the wider naval service. The RFA continues In addition the Green Deal will enable businesses to to operate in the Gulf, in both the North and South carry out energy efficiency improvements to their buildings Atlantic, as well as in UK waters in vital support of the at no upfront cost, through a framework established by UK national interests. In addition they continue to play Government. This innovative financing mechanism will a role in support of disaster relief operations, such as in allow businesses to repay costs through a charge in February 2010 when RFA LARGS BAY was deployed instalments on their energy bill. to Haiti, delivering vital relief supplies and providing specialist capabilities to assist with the wider United I am always open to consider innovative policy ideas, Nations-led relief effort. but new measures would need to fit with our existing Unmanned Air Vehicles policy framework and demonstrate added benefit to both manufacturing and our climate and energy objectives. Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence pursuant to the answer of 11 July 2011, Carbon Trust Official Report, column 52W, on unmanned air vehicles, what the strict procedures are which are David Mowat: To ask the Secretary of State for intended to (a) minimise the risk of casualties Energy and Climate Change how much his occurring from the use of armed drones and (b) Department and its predecessor paid to the Carbon investigate incidents that do happen. [70238] Trust in each of the last five years; and for what Nick Harvey: Reaper is the UK’s only armed remotely purpose. [71407] piloted air system. It is not an autonomous system and does not have the capability to employ weapons unless Gregory Barker: The Carbon Trust has received the it is commanded to do so by the flight crew. following DECC and DEFRA funding in the last five years: The flight crew, along with all other UK personnel, are trained in and operate under the Law of Armed £ Conflict and strict Rules of Engagement which are designed to minimise the risk to civilians. I am withholding 2006-07 78,600,000 further information about our Rules of Engagement as 2007-08 90,700,000 disclosure would, or would be likely to prejudice the 2008-09 89,063,000 capability, effectiveness or security of our armed forces. 2009-10 216,465,000 In addition, we carefully select the type of weapon in 2010-11 127,880,000 every engagement to ensure the most appropriate munition is used to deliver the required effect, in a proportional Funding has been granted to support carbon abatement manner, so minimising the risk to civilians and their in the business and public sectors and to support elements property. of the trust’s work to develop low carbon technologies. Where suspected civilian casualty incidents involving In 2009-10 and 2010-11 the higher level of funding UK forces occur, they will be promptly reported to the reflects the introduction of interest free energy efficiency chain of command who will conduct an initial investigation. loans for SMEs and the public sector plus Marine If the circumstances of the incident merit it, a separate Renewables Proving, Offshore Wind Accelerator and investigation will be conducted by ISAF. If necessary, Venture Capital investment. the UK chain of command will report the incident to the service police for further national investigation. David Mowat: To ask the Secretary of State for Service police can also independently launch an investigation Energy and Climate Change what payments his in certain circumstances. Department plans to make to the Carbon Trust in (a) 2011-12 and (b) 2012-13. [71408]

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE Gregory Barker: The Carbon Trust is expecting to Carbon Emissions: Manufacturing Industries receive a grant of up to £39.1 million from DECC by the end of the financial year 2011-12. John Stevenson: To ask the Secretary of State for The DECC Delivery Review, published in May 2011, Energy and Climate Change if he will consider the announced that the Carbon Trust is to receive no further merits of introducing incentives for manufacturers to core grant funding beyond the end of this financial 1155W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1156W year. Ongoing DECC programme planning work will Green Deal Scheme determine whether the Carbon Trust is funded to deliver specific projects in 2012-13. Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what discussions he has David Mowat: To ask the Secretary of State for had with energy companies on the development of Energy and Climate Change what the title is of each billing systems to administer Green Deal payments and item of research commissioned from the Carbon Trust savings. [71587] by his Department. [71409] Charles Hendry: DECC officials meet regularly with energy companies and their trade associations to discuss Gregory Barker: In 2011-12, DECC has grant-funded all aspects of the Green Deal including the collection of the Carbon Trust (CT) to deliver outcomes through an the Green Deal charge. These discussions have included agreed business plan. We do not commission specific non-domestic and smaller energy suppliers. Discussions pieces of research from CT. CT may however choose, have explored the impacts associated with all options themselves, to conduct small pieces of research to inform for collecting the Green Deal charge via energy bills, their activities. including costs and technical issues arising from ensuring an efficient and secure system for collecting payments Energy: Prices from Green Deal customers and remitting these to Green Deal providers. Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has Energy and Climate Change what meetings he has had made of the effect on domestic fuel bills of National with energy companies on providing information to Grid’s request for an increase in allowed revenue. consumers on the levels of savings available from [70149] Green Deal packages for gas and electricity. [71588]

Charles Hendry: DECC’s assessment of the overall Gregory Barker: DECC officials meet regularly with impact of energy and climate change policies on energy energy companies and their trade associations to discuss prices and bills was published alongside the Annual all aspects of the Green Deal. These discussions have Energy Statement in July 2010: included non-domestic and smaller energy suppliers. The larger energy suppliers have voluntarily agreed to http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/about/ec_social_res/ analytic_projs/price_bill_imp/price_bill_imp.aspx provide factual and neutral information on the Green Deal to their customers at key trigger points, for example Although, the analysis included assumptions on increased when they change supplier or move into a new property. network costs into the future and increased costs for the This will increase the likelihood that consumers will necessary grid reinforcement associated with meeting explore the option of installing energy efficiency measures our renewables target, it did not explicitly refer to any via the Green Deal when they are making other request for an increase in allowed revenue from the improvements to their homes and businesses. Energy National Grid. suppliers will be required to reproduce the estimated An updated assessment of the impact of energy and energy savings, as printed on the customer’s Green Deal climate change policies on energy prices and bills will be assessment, on the annual energy statement. published alongside the Annual Energy Statement in the autumn reflecting policy developments over the last Nuclear Power Stations year. Assumptions on network costs will include agreed increases in allowed revenue set out in the latest distribution David Mowat: To ask the Secretary of State for price control settlements. Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has made of the effect of the abolition of levy exemption There are currently two price control arrangements certificates on the economic viability of combined heat going on at the moment: and power plants. [71157] An extension to the current arrangements (the ‘roll-over’) which lasts until 2013; and Gregory Barker: Following the Chancellor of the The RIIO (Revenue = Incentives + Innovation + Outputs) Exchequer, my right hon. Friend the Member for Tatton controls, which for gas and electricity transmission and gas (Mr Osborne)’s Budget announcement, the Government distribution run from 2013 to 2021. continue to work with the Combined Heat and Power The Ofgem website sets out the proposals for allowed Association and its members, including representatives revenue in the ‘roll-over’ year and estimates the initial from the oil refining industry, in order to develop a proposals would increase the average residential gas simpler, direct and more effective means of support for and electricity bills by approximately £2 (0.3%) and combined heat and power stations. From 2013, the new £1 (0.4%) respectively: relief from the carbon price floor will supersede the existing relief provided through levy exemption certificates, http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/Pages/ with the intention that CHP plants will continue to MoreInformation.aspx?docid=63&refer=Networks/Trans/ PriceControls/TPCR4Roll-over receive an appropriate level of support. The RIIO controls are currently been worked on, Nuclear Safety with Ofgem’s final proposals to be set around the end of 2012. National Grid has recently submitted its transmission Paul Flynn: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy business plan proposals, which are being assessed. National and Climate Change pursuant to the answer to the hon. Grid’s estimates of the consumer impact of these proposals Member for Cheltenham of 5 September 2011, Official are included on its website. Report, column 203, on nuclear safety, if he will place 1157W Written Answers13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Written Answers 1158W in the Library and publish on his departmental website electricity produced in the last year for which figures (a) the (i) progress and (ii) final reports of the nuclear are available. [70055] plant operators on the conduct of stress tests and (b) the (i) progress and (ii) final findings reports of the Charles Hendry: Onshore wind farms receive a subsidy national regulator to which reference is made in the of one renewable energy certificate (ROC) per MWh of answer. [71400] electricity generated. According to the figures published in Ofgem’s most Charles Hendry: The Office for Nuclear Regulation recent RO annual report: (ONR) will make available on its website the progress http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/Sustainability/Environment/ and final reports of the UK nuclear operators under the RenewablObl/Documents1/ EU nuclear stress testing initiative. ONR’s assessments RO%20Annual%20Report%202009-10.pdf of those reports for the European Commission will also the subsidy awarded to onshore wind power under the be published. Copies of all these documents will also be RO in 2009-10 was approximately £380 million. This placed in the Library of the House. Where necessary, figure uses the nominal value (equal to the buyout price information will be withheld in line with the exemptions + recycle value) of a renewable obligation certificate as set out under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (ROC) for 2009-10. The nominal value represents the and the Environmental Information Regulations 2004. maximum worth of a ROC to a generator but is not Her Majesty’s Chief Nuclear Inspector, Dr Mike necessarily the amount paid by a supplier, which is Weightman, will take account of the UK stress tests in dependent on bilateral negotiations between supplier his final report to the Secretary of State on the implications and generator for the UK nuclear industry from the Fukushima nuclear Ofgem will publish their next annual report, including incident. His report will be published and a copy placed the number of ROCs received by generation in 2010-11, in the Library of the House. by 1 April 2012. Renewables Obligation Windpower

Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State Robert Halfon: To ask the Secretary of State for for Energy and Climate Change (1) when he expects to Energy and Climate Change what recent estimate he announce the new banding proposals for the has made of the total generating capacity from (a) renewables obligation from 2013; [71450] onshore and (b) offshore wind in (i) 2012, (ii) 2013, (2) what the timetable is for the renewables (iii) 2014 and (iv) 2015. [71041] obligation banding review. [71451] Charles Hendry: The UK Renewable Energy Roadmap Charles Hendry: We intend to launch a public published in July 2011 set out central ranges for deployment consultation shortly on proposals for banded support of renewable technologies to 2020. The following table under the renewables obligation for the period 2013-17. shows the central ranges for onshore and offshore wind The Government will issue a formal response and lay between 2012 and 2015: draft legislation before Parliament as soon as possible Total generating capacity after the consultation ends. Subject to parliamentary GW and state aids approval, the new bands will come into Onshore wind Offshore wind effect on 1 April 2013 as planned (1 April 2014 for 2012 5.6-6.2 2.4-3.3 offshore wind). 2013 6.4-7.3 3.4-4.4 Wind Power: Finance 2014 6.9-8.3 4.0-5.2 2015 7.6-9.3 4.1-5.9 Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for The actual amount of future wind capacity will depend Energy and Climate Change what subsidy was on many factors including investment and planning received by onshore wind farms for each gigawatt of decisions.

7MC Ministerial Corrections13 SEPTEMBER 2011 Ministerial Corrections 8MC

Figures from the “Count of Gypsy and Traveller Ministerial Correction Caravans” for the past five years indicate a downward trend on unauthorised caravans. Tuesday 13 September 2011 Number January

2007 3,797 COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT 2008 3,680 2009 841 Travellers 2010 896 2011 695 Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what estimate his The correct answer should have been: Department has made of the number of unauthorised Traveller sites in (a) each local authority area and Andrew Stunell: The “Count of Gypsy and Traveller (b) England (i) in each of the last five years and (ii) since Caravans” undertaken bi-annually by local authorities May 2010. [70552] in England and collated by my Department collects [Official Report, 8 September 2011, Vol. 532, c. 752W.] data on the number of caravans on unauthorised sites in England. It does not provide data on the number of Letter of correction from Andrew Stunell: unauthorised sites. Information on the number of caravans An error has been identified in the written answer on unauthorised sites in England and by local authority given to the right hon. Member for Don Valley (Caroline area for 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011 is available in Flint) on 8 September 2011. The error occurred in the the Library of the House. figures given for January 2009, January 2010 and January Figures from the “Count of Gypsy and Traveller 2011. Caravans” for the past five years indicate a downward The full answer given was as follows: trend on unauthorised caravans.

Andrew Stunell: The “Count of Gypsy and Traveller Number Caravans” undertaken bi-annually by local authorities January in England and collated by my Department collects data on the number of caravans on unauthorised sites 2007 3,797 in England. It does not provide data on the number of 2008 3,680 unauthorised sites. Information on the number of caravans 2009 3,628 on unauthorised sites in England and by local authority 2010 3,619 area for 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011 is available in 2011 3,109 the Library of the House.

ORAL ANSWERS

Tuesday 13 September 2011

Col. No. Col. No. JUSTICE...... 871 JUSTICE—continued Bail Decisions (Right of Appeal) ...... 875 Prisoners (Work in Custody)...... 872 Corporate Harm (Overseas Victims) ...... 873 Public Disorder (Courts)...... 885 Criminal Justice System ...... 886 Referral Fees ...... 878 Gang Culture ...... 881 Reoffending Rates...... 883 Human Rights Act...... 879 Sentencing (Human Trafficking and Drugs Insolvency Litigation ...... 871 Offences)...... 887 Mesothelioma Sufferers (Access to Justice)...... 878 Special Immigration Appeals Commission...... 883 Office of the Chief Coroner ...... 876 Topical Questions ...... 887 Prison Population ...... 882 Victims of Overseas Terrorism ...... 884 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS

Tuesday 13 September 2011

Col. No. Col. No. CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 39WS ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS— Olympic Delivery Authority (Ministerial continued Guarantee)...... 39WS Imports of Animal Products ...... 42WS DEFENCE...... 40WS Service Voter Registration...... 40WS NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 44WS ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 41WS Northern Ireland Human Rights Commission Oil Release (Gannet Field)...... 41WS (Annual Report 2010-11) ...... 44WS ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS...... 42WS TREASURY ...... 39WS English National Park Authorities and the Broads Tax Policy Consultation and Draft Finance Bill Authority (Governance)...... 43WS 2012 ...... 39WS PETITIONS

Tuesday 13 September 2011

Col. No. Col. No. HEALTH...... 19P Prevention of Abuse of Adults in Residential Care ...... 19P WRITTEN ANSWERS

Tuesday 13 September 2011

Col. No. Col. No. ATTORNEY-GENERAL ...... 1072W CABINET OFFICE—continued Crown Prosecution Service: Mental Health...... 1072W Drugs: Misuse...... 1124W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1072W Ex-servicemen: Medals ...... 1125W Government Procurement Card ...... 1073W COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.. 1088W BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS ...... 1085W Civil Disorder: Birmingham...... 1088W British Sky Broadcasting...... 1085W Consumers...... 1089W Departmental Expenditure ...... 1085W Departmental Flags ...... 1089W EU External Trade: Taiwan ...... 1086W Departmental Ministerial Policy Advisers...... 1090W Insolvency...... 1086W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1090W Intellectual Property ...... 1086W Derelict Land...... 1091W Micro Firms...... 1087W Derelict Land: Greater London ...... 1092W Post Offices ...... 1087W Employment Agencies: Public Finance ...... 1093W Post Offices: Bank Services ...... 1087W Government Procurement Card ...... 1093W Sick Leave: Musculoskeletal Disorders ...... 1087W Housing: Energy ...... 1094W Superconductors: Research...... 1088W Inform...... 1094W CABINET OFFICE...... 1123W Inventory Companies...... 1094W Cross-Departmental Working ...... 1123W Local Government: Expenditure...... 1095W Col. No. Col. No. COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT— ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL continued AFFAIRS...... 1076W Local Government: Manpower...... 1095W Countryside: Access...... 1076W Local Government: Standards ...... 1096W Departmental Consultants...... 1076W Non-domestic Rates...... 1101W Departmental Work Experience...... 1078W Smoking: Public Places ...... 1102W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1079W Tenants: Leasehold ...... 1102W Environment Protection...... 1079W Travellers...... 1102W Fisheries: Western Sahara ...... 1080W Vandalism ...... 1102W Landfill ...... 1080W Nature Conservation: Hydroelectric Power...... 1080W Recycling: Coventry City Council ...... 1081W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 1103W Recycling: West Midlands ...... 1081W Government Procurement Card ...... 1103W River Itchen: Hydroelectric Power ...... 1081W Internet: Broadband ...... 1103W Rural Advocate ...... 1081W Museums: Yorkshire and Humberside ...... 1104W Salmon: Conservation...... 1082W National Lottery: Sports...... 1104W Sewers: Berkshire ...... 1082W Newspaper Press: Olympic Games 2012...... 1104W Trade Unions ...... 1082W Sports: Yorkshire and Humberside ...... 1106W Water Supply ...... 1084W Wild Boar ...... 1083W DEFENCE...... 1144W Wildlife: Licensing ...... 1084W Air Force...... 1144W Air Force: Recruitment ...... 1145W FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE .... 1057W Aircraft Carriers: Equipment ...... 1145W European Union: Legislative Competence...... 1057W Armed Forces ...... 1146W Lockerbie: Bombings ...... 1057W Armed Forces: Discharges ...... 1146W Moussa Koussa...... 1057W Armed Forces: Training ...... 1147W War Crimes...... 1058W Armoured Fighting Vehicles ...... 1147W Ben Parkinson...... 1147W HEALTH...... 1118W Departmental Assets...... 1148W Alzheimer’s Disease: Newham ...... 1118W Departmental Manpower...... 1149W Ambulance Services: Manpower ...... 1119W Departmental Taxis ...... 1149W Bowel Cancer: Screening...... 1119W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1149W Cancer: Drugs...... 1119W Gurkhas...... 1150W Community Nurses...... 1119W HMS Endurance...... 1151W Departmental Private Finance Initiative ...... 1120W Libya: Armed Conflict...... 1151W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1120W Military Aircraft ...... 1151W Euthanasia...... 1120W Military Bases...... 1151W General Practitioners: Pensions ...... 1121W Navy ...... 1152W Methadone: Wirral ...... 1122W Royal Armoured Corps...... 1152W Tomography: Waiting Lists ...... 1122W Royal Fleet Auxiliary ...... 1153W Unmanned Air Vehicles ...... 1153W HOME DEPARTMENT...... 1125W Animal Experiments: Scotland ...... 1125W DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER ...... 1123W Antisocial Behaviour...... 1125W Abdelbaset al-Megrahi...... 1123W Asylum: York...... 1126W Departmental Responsibilities ...... 1123W Burglary...... 1126W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1123W Cannabis: Crime ...... 1127W Civil Disorder ...... 1127W Confiscation Orders ...... 1129W EDUCATION...... 1111W Crime...... 1130W Academies...... 1111W Crime Prevention ...... 1131W Academies: Cumbria...... 1112W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1131W Children: Day Care ...... 1112W Deportation: Offenders...... 1131W English Baccalaureate ...... 1113W Detention Centres: Death ...... 1132W Further Education ...... 1114W Domestic Violence ...... 1133W Neil Wallis ...... 1114W Drugs: Crime ...... 1133W Physics: GCE A Level ...... 1114W Entry Clearances: Overseas Students ...... 1133W Schools: Pay...... 1115W Forensic Science Service...... 1134W Special Educational Needs...... 1115W Government Procurement Card ...... 1135W Teachers: Manpower...... 1116W Hillsborough Independent Panel...... 1135W Teaching Assistants: Warrington...... 1117W Immigration...... 1136W Members: Correspondence ...... 1136W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 1153W Members: Correspondence ...... 1136W Carbon Emissions: Manufacturing Industries...... 1153W Newspaper Press: Telephone Tapping ...... 1136W Carbon Trust ...... 1154W North Yorkshire Police: Expenditure ...... 1137W Energy: Prices ...... 1155W Nottinghamshire Police Authority ...... 1137W Green Deal Scheme...... 1156W Parliament Square: Demonstrations ...... 1137W Nuclear Power Stations...... 1156W Police ...... 1137W Nuclear Safety ...... 1156W Police: Bureaucracy...... 1139W Renewables Obligation...... 1157W Police: Conditions of Employment ...... 1139W Wind Power: Finance...... 1157W Police Custody: Death...... 1139W Windpower ...... 1158W Police: Incentives...... 1140W Col. No. Col. No. HOME DEPARTMENT—continued SCOTLAND...... 1074W Police: Manpower ...... 1140W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 1074W Police: Pay...... 1141W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1074W Prevent Funding ...... 1141W Human Trafficking ...... 1074W Prisoners’ Release...... 1142W Terrorism ...... 1143W TRANSPORT ...... 1071W Vetting ...... 1143W Bus Services: Concessions ...... 1071W Violent and Sex Offender Register ...... 1143W Bus Services: Theft...... 1071W West Midlands Police Authority: Warwickshire Government Procurement Card ...... 1071W Police Authority...... 1144W TREASURY ...... 1144W HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION...... 1075W Equitable Life Assurance Society: Compensation .. 1144W Parliament: Security...... 1075W WALES...... 1058W INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 1084W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1058W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1084W India: Internally Displaced People ...... 1084W WOMEN AND EQUALITIES...... 1058W Overseas Aid...... 1085W Discrimination ...... 1058W Driving: Age Discrimination...... 1059W Equality ...... 1059W JUSTICE...... 1107W Civil Disorder ...... 1108W WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 1060W Civil Justice System...... 1107W ATOS Healthcare...... 1060W Courts: Televisions...... 1108W Carer’s Allowance ...... 1060W Curfew Orders: York...... 1108W Children: Maintenance ...... 1061W Housing: Sales ...... 1109W Cold Weather Payments ...... 1062W Human Trafficking ...... 1109W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1062W Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Employment ...... 1063W Offenders Bill...... 1107W Incapacity Benefits: Yorkshire and Humberside..... 1063W National Offender Management Service Young Jobseeker’s Allowance: Females ...... 1064W Adult Offender Project...... 1109W Members: Correspondence ...... 1065W Offenders: Ex-servicemen...... 1110W National Employment Savings Trust Scheme...... 1065W Probation ...... 1111W Pensioners: Jarrow ...... 1065W Probation Trusts ...... 1107W Pensions...... 1068W Public Disorder: Response of the Criminal Justice Pensions: City of York ...... 1069W System ...... 1108W Sick Leave: Musculoskeletal Disorders ...... 1069W Sentencing: York...... 1112W Social Fund: Funerals...... 1069W Travellers: Legal Aid Scheme ...... 1111W Social Security Benefits: EU Nationals ...... 1070W Social Security Benefits: Offenders...... 1070W NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 1073W Winter Fuel Payments: City of York...... 1070W Departmental Written Questions ...... 1073W Working Tax Credit: Parents...... 1071W MINISTERIAL CORRECTION

Tuesday 13 September 2011

Col. No. COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT .7MC Travellers...... 7MC Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. The Bound Volumes will also be sent to Members who similarly express their desire to have them. No proofs of the Daily Reports can be supplied, nor can corrections be made in the Weekly Edition. Corrections which Members suggest for the Bound Volume should be clearly marked in the Daily Report, but not telephoned, and the copy containing the Corrections must be received at the Editor’s Room, House of Commons,

not later than Tuesday 20 September 2011

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CONTENTS

Tuesday 13 September 2011

Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 871] [see index inside back page] Secretary of State for Justice

Motor Insurance Regulation [Col. 896] Motion for leave to bring in Bill—(Mr Straw)—agreed to Bill presented, and read the First time

Opposition Day [20th allotted day] Opportunities for the Next Generation [Col. 899] Motion—(Mr Denham)—on a Division, negatived Careers Service (Young People) [Col. 958] Motion—(Andy Burnham)—on a Division, negatived

Petitions [Col. 1008]

Microgravity Research [Col. 1009] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Westminster Hall Tourism in Yorkshire [Col. 189WH] Road Fuel Duties [Col. 210WH] Radar Industry [Col. 234WH] Gaza (Aid) [Col. 242WH] UK Environment Capital (City of Peterborough) [Col. 251WH] Debates on motion for Adjournment

Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 39WS]

Petitions [Col. 19P] Observations

Written Answers to Questions [Col. 1057W] [see index inside back page]

Ministerial Correction [Col. 7MC]