Queensland
Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]
Legislative Assembly
TUESDAY, 29 SEPTEMBER 1942
Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy
346 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] AddreBB in Reply.
TUESDAY, 29 SEPTEMBER, 1942.
Mr. SPEAKER Hon·. E. .J. Hanson, Buranda) took the chair at 11 a. m.
ADDRESS IN REPLY. PRESENTATION AND ANSWER. Mr. SPEAKER: I have to report to the House that accompanied by hon. members of this Assembly, I, on Monday, 28 September, presented to His Excellency the Governor the Address of the Legislative Assembly, adopted by the House on 15 Septembar, and that His Excellency was pleased to make the following reply:- ' 'Government House, "Brisbane, 28 September, 1942. ''Mr. Speaker and Gentlemen,-As Rep resentative of His Majesty the King in the State of Queensland, I tender to you and the Members of the Legislative Assembly my sincere thanks for the Address in Reply to tl:!!a Speech which I delivered when I opened Parliament on 25 August. ' ' I shall, personally, and at the earliest moment, convey to His Majesty your expres sions of loyalty and affection to His Throne and Person. ''Both last year and the year bafore, when thanking Honourable Members for the Address in Reply,. I called attention to the ever-increasing demand for great national •endeavour. That demand is even more urgent to-day on all of us, and I am glad indeed to realise than this fact is so clearly recognised by Honourable Members. I feel very confident that ~very step possible will be taken by Parliament to help in every practical manner all who are fighting for us overseas, or who are on service in this State, I am convinced, from my personal knowledge of the great effort which is being shown in all our munition works, on Supply. [29 SEPTEMBER.) Supply. 347
our railways, and in every sphere of activity defence projects ordinary works, many of that the people of this State are very firmly which could and should have been done in determined to make all sacrifices in order past years from State development taxa to give •every help towards a victorious and tion. The plutocrat trying to conceal his lasting peace. income from the taxing authorities is '' Leslie vVilson, Goven10r. '' matched by the Treasurer trying to conceal his wealth from the Commonwealth Govern ment. Nor do the facts disclosed in the CIRCULATION AND COST OF Budget support the Treasurer's claim to be ''HANSARD.'' giving full support and co-operation in the .Mr. SPEAKER laid on the table the war effort. On the contrary, he has insisted report of the Chief Reporter,. State Reporting on his full pound of flesh from both the Bureau, on the circulation and cost of '' Han people and the Commonwealth Government. sard" for the financial year ended 30 June, The Treasurer managed to reduce his sur 1942. plus to £63,772, although he had the advan tage, because of overseas loan conversions, PAPERS. of a reduction of interest and exchange The following paper was laid on the table, payments of £447,000 per annum and the and ordered to be printed:- almost total elimination of unemployment as a result of the large amount of Common Report upon the operations of the Sub wealth expenditure that has taken place in Departments of Native Affairs, Jubilee Queensland. Hospital for Chronic Diseases (Dalby), Dunwich Benevolent Asylum, Institution The Treasurer: And State expenditure. for Inebriates (Dunwich), Eventide Home :ilir. NICKLIN: I shall deal with State (Charters Towers), Queensland Industrial expenditure, too. Undoubtedly-and the Institution for the Blind (South Bris Treasurer must admit it-the Commonwealth bane), and Westwood Sanatorium. expenditure in this State has had a very The following paper was laid on the table: considerable effect on his Budget. Indeed, Regulations (2) ,. dated 24 September, 1942, when we look at this fact it is absolutely under the Public Safety Act of 1940. astounding to the people of this State that the Treasurer has been unable to give them any reduction in the taxes and charges COAL AND OIL SHALE MINE WORKJ:<;RS imposed upon them. (PENSIONS) ACT AMENDMENT BILL. .Mr. Collins: Do you not know the Federal Government have taken over taxation~ THIRD READING. :ilir. NICKLIN: It is all very well for hon. Bill, on motion of Mr. Gair, read a third members opposite to endeavour to shelter time. behind the Commonwealth Government. The Commonwealth Government are collecting SUPPLY. from the taxpayers of this State taxation on COMMITTEE-FINANCIAL STATEMEl'\T income only. That is by no means the full RESUMPTION OF DEBA'l'E. amount of taxes and charges levied by the Government on the people of this State. Are (The Chairman of Committees, Mr. Brassing there not other avenues in which the Govern ton, Fortitude Valley, in the chair.) m'ent could have given some relief to the Debate resumed from 24 September (see taxpayers of Queensland to enable them to p. 346) on Mr. Cooper's m·otion- meet the extra calls made upon them by the Commonwealth Government to meet extra· '' That there be granted to His Majesty ordinary war expenditure 7 for the service of the year 1942-1943 a sum not exceeding £300 to defray the salary of The Secretary for Public Lands: What the aide-de-camp to His Excellency the particular taxation have you in mind~ Governor.'' .Mr. NICKLIN: I will tell the hon. gentle :ilir. NICKLIN (Mm·rumba) (11.8 a.m.) : man all about it before I have finished. The Treasurer has had the opportunity of One of the outstanding characteristics of presenting to this Parliament quite a number Labour finance is that the Government of Budgets during the time he has had the assume that they get better results from honour of occupying the high position of spending the people's money than would be Treasurer in this State. Having analysed obtained if the people spent it themselves. the latest Budget the Treasurer has presented On page 11 of the Budget the Treasurer to us, I think we can classify it in four or five makes this surprising statement- main parts. Its most astounding feature is that the hon. gentleman managed to show '' .... the State's expenditure on on paper a surplus of only £63,772. Its most development projects in the past is the disappointing feature is the omission of any source from which the Comm'onwealth reduction in taxes and charges upon the derives the whole of its income-taxation people to offset the additional war burdens revenue.'' that they have to carry. The Treasurer must That is a very surprising statement. have imposed a severe strain upon his imagination in his endeavours to classify as The Treasurer: I am surprised at you. 348 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.
Ii!r. NICKLIN: Does the Treasurer mean Let us look at the Treasurer's surplus of to say that the expenditure of money and £63,772 and compare it with the surpluses effort by those engaged in primary produc shown by some of the other States. In South tion and in the secondary industries in this Australia the surplus was £1,289,676. State are mere sidelines~ The statement he makes is that the Commonwealth Govern The Treasurer: You might tell us w11at ment's income-taxation revenue comes solely the Commonwealth grant was. from the expenditure of the State Govern llir. NICKLIN: The surplus in Victoria ment. Surely, Mr. Brassington, the efforts was £792,000. When discussing the Appro of the primary producers and those engaged priation Bill earlier this session the in secondary industries in this State deserve Treasurer ridiculed the statements made by some recognition~ Surely, they pay some the Opposition that there had been some taxation~ It is a very surprising statement, adjustments in the State accounts in order indeed, for the 'rreasurer to make-that the to bring about the low surplus that he State's expenditure on development projects showed, but in his own Budget figures he in the past is the source from which the demonstrates that our statements were amply Commonwealth derives the whole of its justified. income-taxation revenue. How much income taxation revenue does the Commonwealth The Treasurer: Where do I demonstrate Government derive from the millions of that? pounds that \Yere wasted in State enterprises, lUr. NICKLIN: For a start, the £130,000 for example, and all the other wasteful that was taken from the Unemployment Government expenditure that does not give Insurance Fund in 1938-39 for the purposes one penny piece of income taxation to the of consolidated revenue was repaid during Commonwealth Government~ I thought the last year. Treasurer would at least have given some credit to secondary industries and those The Treasurer: That is the repayment of engaged in primary production in this t:\tate a debt. Should not the State pay its debt~ for the efforts they made for the development of the State and the contributions they are l'tlr. NICKLIN: Then, £385,916 was paid making to income-taxation revenue that is into the debenture and inscribed stock profit being taken from them by the Commonwealth and loss account, reducing the debit balance at the present time. to nil at 30 June, 1942. The Treasurer: And why should not that The Secretary for Labour and Industry: be done? You have not attempted to analyse that state ment at all. lUr. NICKLIN: In addition to that, £245,000 was credited to other trust accounts. A total lUr. NICKLIN: The statement is so silly of £760,916 was placed to the credit of Trust that it requires very little analysis. The Funds and this would not have been done bald statement that the Commonwealth is but f~r the need to bring the Treasurer's deriving the whole of its income-taxation surplus down to the low level at which he revenue from the expenditure made by the showed it in 1941-42. Government on development projects in the The Treasurer: After all, our surplus was past is absolutely absurd. One would infer better than that of Victoria. You seem to from it that the whole of the development have slipped into a hole. that has taken place in this State has been the result of governmental expenditure. A .!Ur. NICKLIN: There is another feature great deal of the development that has taken of the Budget that does not reflect credit on place has been achieved not because of but the Government. On page 7 the Treasurer despite the efforts of the Government to refers very pointedly to the unfunded deficits hinder it in many ways, as, for example, by of the JI.Ioore Government, less the surpluses the high taxation and other impositions they of the present Government for the years placed on industry. If they had given some 1938-39 to 1941-42. He conveniently encouragement to industry in this State there ignores the six large consecutive would not have been the same need for expen deficits of the present Governm~mt diture by the Government on developmental in the years following the depresswn projects. They would have been undertaken years, which amounted to £4,49~,083,, or by the people, and, after all, money expended £857,694 in excess of the total deficits of th.e by private enterprise undoubtedly gives a Moore Government. The Treasurer conveni greater return than expenditure by Govern ently forgets to mention that fact although ments, because, unfortunately, in very many he lays emphasis on the deficits of the Moore instances governmental expenditure is waste Government during those depression yea.rs. ful. The figures show clearly that the return His statement indicates the extent to which from governmental expenditure is falling party-political considerations, and the desire year by year and placing an additional burden for party propaganda, will enter into even on the taxpayers of this State. the Budget presented to this Parl~ament. The net deficit of Labour, after allowmg for JUr. Jesson: Do you call money expended the surpluses during the last four years, wh~n on schools and hospitals wasteful expenditure W things vastlv improved, is still £735,685 m excess of the Moo re Government's deficits. Mr. NICKLIN: The interjection by the I do not wish to make too great a use of hon. member is far too silly to warrant a the statement the Treasurer has made, but reply. the emphasis he laid on this point was such Supply. [29 SHPTEMBER.] Supply. 349
that I felt it was only fair to reply to it, would have taken advantage of the oppor and to bring under the notice of hon. mem tunity to give the people some relief from bers the unfortunate fact that party-political the State development tax, but, of course, ~onsiderations cannot be left out of even the now they have not that opportunity because Government's Budget Speech. they have conceded their right to collect income taxation to the Commonwealth. As The Treasurer: But the deficits from 1932 a result, they are in the very fortunate posi onwards wore also mentioned. tion of being able to receive the same amount l1Ir. NICKLIN: If the Treasurer will read of revenue as they previously got from the that paragraph of his speech again he will State development tax except that now it notice that he was very careful not to lay any will be collected by the Commonwealth emphasis on any deficits that were incurred Government on their behalf. after 1931-32. During the years the Government have been The 'l'reasurer: But they are mentioned. in power, which they have often described as prosperous years, they have collected an Mr NICKLIN: The Treasurer merely average of £2,355,000 for the i·elief of unem refers to three surpluses that were recorded ployment and beyond one or two minor reduc from 1932 to 1942. tions in the tax, which did not affect the total The Treasurer: And I mentioned the tax collected from this source, no real relief deficits prior to that. They have all been whatever has been given to the taxpayers, and mentioned. so the taxpayers are perfectly justified in asking whether the Commonwealth is justified l1Ir. NICKLIN: I think the Treasurer will in collecting such an amount of money from find that I am correct when I say that empha the people under the uniform-tax scheme for sis was laid on the deficits in the depression payment to the State when the unemploy years, whilst mention was made only of sur ment position is as low as it is to-day. The pluses that were shown during the last four .June quarter disclosed the percentage of years, the deficits shown since the depression unemployment to be .8 per cent. That is the years being completely ignored. position that concerns the people of the State to-day, especially when they are called upon The Government are exceedingly fortunate to pay this l1eavy taxation and especially, in having the ·whole of the revenue from the too, when they realise that the Common State development tax, which was imposed wealth requires all the money it can get to after the abolition of the unemployment further the war effort of Australia. That relief tax, in addition to their ordinary bears out the point I made in my opening sources of revenue, because in computing the remarks that this State in continuing to sum of £5,821,000 that the Commonwealth receive that large amount of money from the will pay to the State on the State's under Commonwealth Government is not in any way taking to forgo its right to levy income tax co-operating with that Government, and is the amount imposed for State development not helping generally the Commonwealth war tax is taken into account. It means in effect effort. that the Commonwealth will continue to collect State development tax on behalf of the State. l\Ir. Jesson: That is a very nasty state The Treasurer: It is not doing anything ment to make, and a stupid one, too. of the kind. Mr. NICKLIN: It may be a nasty state l1Ir. Nimmo: Of course, it is, and you ment, but it, unfortunately, is true. If it is know it is. not, then I am sure I and other hon. members and the people of the State would like to be The Treasurer: It is not. enlightened about it. lUr. NICKLIN: The hon. gentleman will l1ave a hard job to convince the taxpayers l\Ir. CoUins: Even the Prime Minister him that this tax is not still being collected from self, Mr. Curtin, has made the statement that them. \Vhen we consider the unemployment the States are co-operating with the Com position to-day, we can see how fortunate the monwealth. Government are in having this large source ·of tax revenue available to them still. Mr. NICKLIN: Obviously, the Government would not have made any reduction in the Let us compare the unemployment position State development tax even if they had the in this State 10 years ago, just before the opportunity. I make this statem'ent because present Government were returned to power, it is obvious that the Government had ways with the position that exists to-day. In 1931-32 of giving relief in taxation to the taxpayers the percentage of unemployment was 20.3, had they so desired. They have not been but in 1941-42 it was only 2.2. Although able to expend even what they have collected there has been that progressive improvement in this direction, yet they are going to collect in the unemployment position in the State, every possible penny they can from the tax the Government have taken virtuallv no steps payers. This statement is borne out by the whatever to relieve the taxpayers "of any of fact tha.t at the August meeting of the Loan the burden of the unemployment relief tax Council the Treasurer announced that the vr the State development tax, as it was later Queensland Government had intended to called, and which was necessary for the State obtain additional revenue this financial year to have when it handled a large body of unem by means of the imposition of an entertain ployed people. One would have thought that ments tax. Notwithstanding that the Govern during the last financial year the Government ment were receiving in taxation mora money 350 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. than they needed they were thinking of drag very big burden to the people of this State. ging further money from the pockets of the In 1941-42 the Treasurer imposed an addi people! That is sufficient to justify any tional increase on rail fares and freights, reasonable person in assuming that even if and he used the argument that the railways the Government had had the opportunity wonld lose money during the year if those during this financial year they would have increases were not imposed. What happened~ afforded no relief to the taxpayer bv means of The railways had the best year in the whole a reduction in the State developmei{t tax. The of their existence, and the figures now point condition of the State finances for the financial to the fact that instead of an increase in year 1941-42 showed that they had an excel rail fares and freights the Government could lent opportunity to do so last year. Had the have made a decrease at that time, and it Government accepted the suggestions made would have helped industry. by the Opposition last year and given some relief to the taxpayers from this tax they The Treasurer interjected. would not in any way have financiallv embar Mr. NICKLIN: The Treasurer interjects rassed the State, the taxpayers woi1ld have that the results were not due to normal con had more m·oney to spend usefully, and the ditions. We know they are not due to normal Commonwealth would have benefited to a conditions. We also know that when the Budget considerable extent. was tabled last year and these increased fares The main difficulty the Treasurer has had and freights were imposed, conditions indi in framing his Estimates for 1942-43 must cated that our railways would be handling have been to find avenues for the expendi a considerable amount of traffic from which ture of the money which will be available to they would obtain additional revenue. That him and give him his estimated surplus of has been borne out by the experiences of the £39,146. The increases in taxes and charges last 12 months. imposed by the present Government are, Let that go for the moment and let us except for motor registration fees, producing look at things as they exist to-day. There more revenue than in normal years as we is going to be no falling-off in the traffic shall see if we look at the record' of the the railways are going to carry. I venture Governm·ent with respect to taxation increases to prophesy that they are going to carry since they came into power. 'rhey increased higher tonnages and run greater mileages the income tax immediately after their elec than they did last year. Under those circum tion; they imposed the super land tax· they increased rail fares and freights on ' three stances, and bearing in mind the fact that the Government have not given one iota of separate occasions; they imposed State trans concession, with the exception of the minor port fees immediately after their election; one on motor registration fees, was it not the State development tax was increased, the obvious thing to do to return at least which resulted in their obtaining in 1941-42 that increase made in rail fares and freights a greater revenue than in 1931-32, and m·otor last year 1 A concession of £500,000 given registration fees were increased. to the producers and users of the railways Tile Secretary for Public Lands: They of this State would have returned to the have also been reduced. Government that amount of money in other ways; the Government would have been bene Mr. NICKLIN: I shall deal with that fited because the help would have been poin~ also. Apparently the Secretary for valuable to many of our primary industries Publrc Lands has at last found an item of that are hard-up against it at the present taxation that the Government ha.ve reduced. time as far as costs are concerned. It is the only item they have reduced recently, but the reduction was a very minor There is another point that must be taken <)ne. into consideration-that the railways at the· present time are called upon to carry a great The Secretary for Public Lands: There deal of traffic that was previously carried has been no increase in the rate of income by other means, and so, instead of having tax since 1933. half-empty trains, every train is fully loaded, and consequently there is a greater return 1Ir. NICKLIN: Nor has there been any of revenue to the department for the expen reduction. The hon. gentleman must not diture of engine-power and man-power forget the increased financial burdens the required to work it. people of this State have had to bear in common with the rest of the people of Aus The position in regard to the railways can tralia for financing the war, and every effort lead us to only one conclusion-that is, that the Treasurer could have made to help the this Governnl'ent should have given some· people of this State to m·eet that increased relief, particularly to our big primary indus burden by the removal of some part of the tries, in railway freights and fares. At the heavy State taxation should have been made. present time many of our primary industries Surely, it is obvious from the figures avail are overburdened with costs and produce is able that the Treasurer could have given the being sold in many instances at less than the people some relief from the increases in rail cost of production. The Government would way fares and freights that have been imposed have shown by that gesture that they had since 1931-32f the interests of a very important section of the community at heart. A reduction in freights of £500,000 would have been a very great help to industry under A Government Member: They did it over present conditions. Transport costs are a a period of years. Supply. (29 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. 351
Mr. NICKLIN: The llon. member says the that the money has been used by the 'Government have done that over a period Government in the construction of roads. At of years. How have they shown a desire to the moment the construction of roads, except help the primary producers of this State in those for strategic purposes, has ceased, on regard to railway charges~ In 1937-38 they account of the shortage of man-power and increased railway fares and freights. In the non-availability of the necessary plant. 1938-39 they increased them again, and in Therefore, would it not be better and a good 1941-42 again. That is how they showed gesture on the part of the Government that their consideration for the primary producers when the Government are not in urgent 1Jf this State in the handling of railway need of finance they should leave the money charges. in the Main Roads Fund and allow it to accumulate during the war so that at the The Secretary for Public Lands interjected end of the war there would be a fund avail recently that the Government have made able to carry on road construction and other .some reduction in motor registration fees. works for the purpose of rehabilitating the Admittedly so, but at whose instigation, as boys returning from the war~ That v·ery the hon. member for Stanley reminds me"l obvious thing could have been done by the Ever since wartime conditions have operated Government at the present tim·e, but in this State, in season and out of season the apparently they are more concerned with -Opposition have been urging the need for grabbing all the revenue they can than hav the reduction, and have pointed out that the ing a long-range plan of building up s~r Government would obtain additional revenue plus funds for use at a time when they will 'by such a reduction. be urgently required for development and The Secretary for Public Lands: Your employment-giving purposes. argument was based on political expediency Now to make a comparison-an invidious rather than on actual needs. one-between the Victorian Budget and that presented by the Treasurer: the former dis Mr. NICKLIN: Our argument was based closes that three concessions amounting to -on common sense and logic, and this has been quite a considerable sum have been given proved by the fact that the Treasurer has to members of the fighting forces. seen fit to adopt our suggestion. We con tended that if fees were reduced more cars 'fhe Victorian Government are taking a long would be registered. That has been shown view and making plans for the period aft~r to be so. Immediately on the reduction of the war in the allocation and handling of their the registration fees there was an increase State finances. The State Water Supply Com in the number of cars registered in Queens mission has reduced the price of water to land. Instead of putting their cars up on consumers in the irrigation areas. They have blocks, people are renewing their rcgistra placed £1,500,000 in their railway renewals tions, and those who had already put their and replacement fund. They have put cars on blocks are re-registering them. This £250,000 to the credit of unemployment relief is to the advantage of the Governmental funds· making a total credit balance in that finances and the State generally. These fund ~f £1,358,000 at the end of this financial vehicles will be of greater use in an emergency year. if they are in running order than if they are The Victorian Government are wise in that kept idle on blocks. Any person who knows when the war is over and we return to normal .anything about motor vehicles kno1vs that if conditions they are going to have available they are on blocks for a considerable time at least two substantial funds for post-war they may just as well be written off as development and reconstruction, both pro effective transport units. The occasion may blems that will be confronting all State arise in Queensland when everything that Governments. On the other hand, the present travels on wheels will be required; is it not Queensland Government are making no better then, from the point of view of the provision whatsoever for. post-war reco~ .State, to endeavour to keep our motor struction. They are taking up the atti vehicles registered and have them· available tude they have always taken . up, a~ for use if the occasion demands~ attitude of ''Sufficient for the day IS the evil JUr. Power: They did not think so in thereof.'' They have never looked to the future. England when they put all private cars ott What better opportunity for building up the road. reserves could they have than the present, when they have great surpluses of revenue an.d Mr. NICKLIN: I suppose that the four not the same opportunities for spendi.ng It gallons a month allowed is not a great induce as they have had in the past~ Should It n~t ment for the owners to continue the pay have been possible for the Treasurer of this ment of the heavy taxation fees operating State to put money in Trust Funds in or~er at present, but the majority of people con to build up a reserve that could be used with tinue their registrations for two reasons, advantage at the end of this conflict for the firstly to protect their assets, and secondly reconstruction that must take place~ to have the vehicle available should it be required in an emergency. Let us consider for a moment the large sum of money that the TrPasurer will receive as And dealing with cars and car registra a result of the now defunct State develop tions, it is difficult for most people to under ment tax. Time and again the Government stand the need for the continued diversion have told us that money has been collected of £250,000 from the Main Roads l<'und to for the developing of this State and giving ·Consolidated Revenue. The excuse has been work to the unemployed. At the moment there 352 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. is not the same need as there was for large out by the State, whether there had been a expenditure on development, apart from war or not, and many of the roads now strategic and defence work, but there is a being termed strategic roads would have been very urgent need for provision for post-war made in any case. After all, what is a development and reconstruction. Of the strategic road~ A bush track of to-day may be £5,000,000 odd that the Treasurer will receive a strategic road of to-morrow, if military from the Commonwealth Government, would requirements demand it. Why should the it not have been good policy to have set aside Government take unto themselves all the credit some money for post-war reconstruction and for the construction of these roads when many planning, about which we have heard so much of them would have been made in any case·~ in this Chamber~ The Government are describing many of the roads as strategic roads simply because they The Attorney-General: What is the good are being built in war-time, but they would of setting money aside if you have no oppor have been built in any case. Are many of tunity of using it after the war~ Let us do the defence work now. them being built at the instigation of tho Commonwealth or at the request of the Mr. NICKLIN: Surely the hon. gentle Defence Department, or are they just being man is not adopting a defeatist attitude'! 1 made in accordance with the State Govern hope, as I am sure most other hon. members ment's ordinary programme~ do, that we shall have the opportunity of spending this money after the war. If we The Secretary for Public Lands: They are not going to have that opportunity, then are certainly not being made without consulta tion with tbe Commonwealth. why worry about it at all~ Mr. Jesson: He said to spend it on Itir. NICKLIN: If many of the roads now defence. being made had been made in normal times, the Commonwealth Government would have had Mr. NICKLIN: I shall deal with the more roads available for defence. If instead of question of spending it on defence later. Just spending 14s. 6d. in the £1 of revenue from now Iet us examine briefly the effect that the State development tax for ordinary revenue Commonwealth's financial policy will have on purposes and only 5s. 6d. in the £1 for con State finances. Of a total of £4,724,000 to struction and development purposes, the be spent on work in 1942-43, the amount to Government had reversed the policy and be spent on works of a direct defence value spent 14s. 6d. in the £1 or the whole £1 on is estimated at £1,404,000, or less than 25 construction and development purposes, much per cent. One hon. member interjected, good would haYe accrued to the State. After ''Why not spend it on defence~'' all, what was the object of the State develop Mr. Jesson: I did not ask that. I said ment tax but to provide work for the unem that the Minister said that. ployed and develop the State~ Many of the works for which the Government take a great Mr. NICKLIN: If the hon. member is not deal of credit now should have been done in satisfied with the amount of money the earlier days when unem:ployment was acute. Government haYe allocated for works of a defence nature in this State, then let him However, it is impossible to consider State speak to the Treasurer. At any rate, whose finances without regard to the monetary anJ responsibility is it to defend Australia~ economic policy being pursued by the Federal Government. There is no objection to the The Attorney-General: The people of magnitude of Commonwealth expenditure, Australia. provided there is no wa.ste or extravagance, but there certainly is objection to the methods ~Ir. NICKLIN: And who are the people of Australia~ What GoYernment are now adopted to obtain the money required. responsible to the people for the defence of The Commonwealth Budget for 1942 provides Australia but the Commonwealth Govern for the expenditure of £440,000,000 for war menU It is laudable, right, and proper that purposes, or approximately Ss. in the £1 of the the State should consider whether any of its total national income. Although this appears schemes are important from the view of to be a large amount of money to us, it is defence or of a strategic value, but the State still short of the expenditure in Britain and Government should not take unto itself the Canada, where it is more than 10s. in the £1. whole responsibility of defending Queens The important difference, however, is that in land. The defence of Queensland is vital to those places more than 50 per cent. is derived the defence of Australia, but the great bulk from taxation whereas the Commonwealth of the defence expenditure is the responsi Government propose to raise £140,000,000 or bility of the Commonwealth Govemment less than 32 per cent. from taxes, and the with the State wholeheartedly co-operating: balance of £300,000,000 from ''Loans, etc.,'' the et cetera including issue of bank credit. The Treasurer: And we have co-operated On examining the financial record of the largely. present Federal Government we :find that they have placed a great reliance on the use of Mr. NICKLIN: As the Treasurer inter jects, the State Government m·e co-operating bank credit. The greatly accelerated increase and should co-operate, but the question is in the note issue took place under the present whether they could co-operate even more than Ji'ederal Government, who raised £78,000,000· they are doing. Probably most of the pro by bank credit. jects regarded as important from the view In 1942-43, too, the Commonwealth Trea point of defence would have been carried surer expects to get £300,000,000 from loans, Supply. (29 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. 353 as against £120,000,000 last year. That is a but the maximum. There is a great gulf very big increase. I think it is goinu to be between the two great wealth-producing mighty hard to get, although perso~ally, I sections of this State, namely, the worker and hope it will be got. The Federal Treasurer the primary producer. 'L'he worker is given expects to get £60,000,000 from the sale of a minimum wage plus O\"CTtime by tlw war-savings certificates, as against a realisa industrial courts, but the primary producer is tion last year of £8,700,000-a very big given a. maximum price by the Commissioner increase and a very high objective to obtain. of Prices and is foTced to work longer hours JUr. Jesson: No-one will put a bob into for less payment than hitherto, foT patTioti
I do m·aintain that if the policy laid down Thir. COLI.INS (Cook) (12.23 p.m.): At in the Railway (Capital Indebtedness) the outset I wish to congratulate the Reduction Act of 1931 had been carried out Treasmer upon the Budget speech that he funds would have been available now for has delivered. In my opinion it is quite replacing the wasting railway assets. in keeping with the requirements of a war time policy. It shows careful preparation 'rhe Treasurer: But we have spent more than the amount. You cannot have your and consideration, as well as great attention to the need for conserYation of the funds cake and eat it, you know; nor can you dming the past year. I should sav that spend your replacements and rene\Yals money and have the money. · our Treasurer has been probably one "of the most successful Treasurers that this :State ftir. NICKLIN: Irrespective of whether has kno>rn, in that ever since he has occupied you can spend it or keep it, the cold stark that high and important office he has con~ fact staring us in the face at the moment tinned to show a surplus. is that t~ere is vital need for something to Of course, I am not saying that it ig essen be don: m the way of spending money on the mamtenance of our railwav rolling stock tial to produce a surplus, nor does it alwavs and permanent way. " ' denote, pe_rhaps, evidence of good governme1it, because Cll'Cumstanccs may arisa to make it lUr•• Jesson: What about the man-power impossible to do so. However, a surplus does P.roblem there, too? They are \Yorking oYer reflect careful consideration in the collection time in all the workshops. of revenue and its wise expenditm'a, and if we ad?P~ these two leading factors as guiding i\Ir. NICKLIN: The man-power problem pnnClplcs, a surplus can be considered as does enter into the question, but that is a eYidence of careful management and adminis problem that has to be faced anu overcome tration. Tha smplus for the last :financial if o.ur railways are to continue gi,·ing the year >vas not unduly large, but it is satisfac serv1ce they have been giving iu recent tory to know that the 'rreasurer has so months to Australia's war effort. managed the accounts of the various depart lUr. Jesson: They are doing a magnifi ments, whose ramifications are extensive in a cent job. State like Queensland, as to he able to show an acceptable surplus. His Budget reflects :'IIr. NICKLIN: They have been and still a very sound state of affairs. arc doing a magnificent job but they cannot continue to do it unless th~y get something Table C 5 of the tables relating to the Treasurer's Financial Statement probably to_ do it w~th. If a far-sighted policy of r~1lway m~mtenance is not put into opera gives as sound a review as one could get of tha tion there 1s no doubt that the railways will :finances of the State over a number of years. not be able to give the service that thev It shows the revenue and the ·expenditure per are required to give. " head of population over the years, and, after all, the revenue per head of population a11d At 12.21 p.ll1., not the total revenua is the main guide to MR. DUNSTAN (Gympie) relieve(! the prosperity. The table shows that there has Chairman in the chair. been a steady but gradual increase in the revenue per head of population, from 1\Ir. NICKLIN: As I have stated, the £16 Os. 10d. in 1922-23 to £22 16s. 4d. in Treasurer has seen :fit to include in his 1941-42. Those :figmes show the gradually Budget. provision for this very necessary increasing earning capacity per head of th'P expenditure, and all I can do is urge him to population. Although the amount of revenue ~pend it quick!!. on keeping our rolling stock received from the Commonwealth has steadilY m a :fit .cond1bo:r; ~o ~o~tinue giving the decr·eased, the revenue per head of the popula good serv1ce that It 1s g1vmg now. tion has steadily increased. Summing up ~he Budget, the main points I know it is one of the functions of th
1tuu. member should be paid for his butteT, more money into main roads than any pre the same as the butcher should be paid vious Governments, and I do not exclude \\·hen n man goes into a shop and gets a the Government of which the hon. gentleman i"J';td of meat. The Tailways are giving a was a member. The reason for that has been scnice and a great service at that, and the explained in this Chamber from time to time, MiniJter for Transport must be compli but it is a very hardy annual and although mented on ,the fact. I undexstand that meaningless it appears to be one of the very primary pToduceTs here get the cheapest few points that the Opposition bring freight rates operating in any country in the before us. world. One of the things operating to the The hon. gentleman compared the Victorian detriment of our railways is that motoT and Queensland Budgets. Has the Leader traffic can pick the eyes out of the railway of the Opposition been in the State of traffic. They take all the high-priced goods, Victoria and does he know the area and popu charging a little bit less than the railways, lation of that State~ lmt they leave the railways all the low-priced goods which they carry from one end of the lUr. Nicklin: What has that got to do :--ltate to the other. IYith the handling of the Budget~ .lUr. Dart: That is not true. .IIIr. COLLINS: It has a great deal to do with it. Victoria is a highly-developed and Mr. COLLINS: It is true if you know industrialised State. Queensland requires a :1nything about the freights on primary pro great deal more industrialisation and develop ducers' goods. Then there are instances in ment. There can be no comparison whatever which the railways have lowered freights, even between the two. As a matter of fact, some :1 ftcr the Minister was faced with a rise in of the electorlJctes in Queensland are larger wages for employees of the railways. I am than the State of Victoria, and each is only 110t ~aying there is anything wrong with that one of 62 electorates. I am not saying they hecanse we believe in arbitration and we are all that size-of course, they nre not :tgree with the :increases that have been but Victoria has a very small area when giYen. For instance, in North Queensland, compnred with the vast area of undeveloped where it is impossible to get shipping space, land in Queensland. In addition, Queensland the Railway Department gave relief to that has to contend with a multiplicity of seasonal g-reat primary industr~·, the sugar industry, conditions. Droughts and fires may ravage :md made a considerable reduction in freights some parts of the Stnte, whereas another from Cairns, Townsville, and Mackay and part of the State may have to contend with other northern sugar rentTC:R to Brisbane and floods nnd cvclone<:. The Treasurer has to thrmtgh to the New South \Vales railways. husband his ~·esources to protect the welfare I do not know what the Leader of the of the people of the State, nnd that is exactly Onposition meant when he first said that the wlwt he is doing. What may be wise for ~Hate is not co-operating with the Federal Victoria may be entirely unwise for this Cioyernment. Afterwards the hon. gentleman Statr. But is Victoria forgoing any taxa said that the State was co-operating with the tion? The hon. gentleman does not say. Pcderal GoYernment. Apparently he wants CeTl.ainly the Government there are not. to have it both ways. 'l'he Prime Minister 'rhey are continuing as they were doing of Australia has complimented the Govern before. In fart, Victoria has increased taxa ment of this State on the very able wav tion. ''Sufficient for the day is the evil they have co-operated with the Federrll thereof'' is the motto of this GoYernment, Government. the hon. gentleman says. Fortunately, they hm·e so manngecl their affairs that there is The Leader of the Opposition also men- sufficient for the clay, but, in addition, they 1ioned that it was the intention of the Stute are proyiding for the future. to levy an entertainment tax. That may have hc•.'n the intention of the Government-I am The hon. gentleman again referred to the not saying whether it iYas true or not-just iHlministration of the Moore Government. It :ts it may have been the intention of the is really a mntter of history now, but as it fiovernnwnt to reduce other forms of taxa as resurrcct0cl again by him I can scarcely tion, although the Leacler of the Opposition aYoic1 dealing with it and asking if there run his own business in his own way, and I However, in the pegging of prices, om· think he is mal:ing a mighty good job of the primary industries need a good deal of con govemmcnt of this country. IIe has given a sideration. The prices paid for some primary mw h better lead tlwn have any Prime commodities are satisfactoq. I dealt witl1 MinisteTs dming either times of peace or this matter when speaking to the motion 1var, and no Prime Jl.finister has ever had a moYecl on Private Members' Day by the more difficult row to hoe than he has. Leader of the Opposition. I agree with the Leader of the Opposition We need something more from the market that we must be very careful about inflation. ing point of view. I believe that the Federal K o sensible person disregards that point and GoYermnent should buy and distribute all there is no question that the present Federal primary products. I do not say that they Government take a verv serious view of it and should set up new channels of distribution. are doing what is n~cessary to prevent it. The present channels of distribution should If they continue as they are going there he ample. We have the Sugar Board, the need be no fear of inflation to an unnecessary Butter Board, ancl various other commodity degree. True, there is a measure of it, but boards controlling a number of our industries, probably there is a measme of it in m·ery and they should be able to clo what is neces country at war to-clay ani! in Australia the sarY satisfactorily. 'l'here is great room foy measure is inescnpa ble. It is inescapable imlJroYemeut,. howeYer, between the commodity because many industries were poorly paid. We boanl ancl the consumer, for there we have a haYe nn example in some of our primary host of agents who are largely parasites upon i1_1dnstries. The butter industry is unques the community. Not only are they fleecing ttona bly underpaid; but that is a form of the primary producer in many instances, but inflation of which the hon. gentleman is so thev are increasing unduly the price paid for fearful. goods by the consumer. In my opinion, mueh Let us do as has been done in manv indus sorting ont of these agents needs to be done tries-bring the employees up to a rate that br the Federal Government. A great deal of is probably higher than the basic wage when goocl could be done by this and the Federal necessary war loaclings are considered. This Government if they cast their eyes over the has all had an inflationary effect. It has had things these agents haYe been doing, or what the effect of putting into the pockets of the thay have not been doing, and transferred workers more money than thev would receive probably three-quarters of them into some und8r normal con'ditions, b·ut the Prime much more useful section of war work. In Minister is taking all necessary steps to see my opinion, many of them are unnecessar~ that that extra money, or as much of it as now. possible, is being put into war loans. His What I have said of the buying and dis method of doing that is the closing of avenues tributing of primary products applies equalJ,, of 11eedless ~Ur. COLLINS: It is a sign of progress ~Ir. S}}arkes: That is always the way. when people are not wholly satisfied but strive You want a fixed price when there is a big to eorrect anomali·es. Sir Earle Page sug demand, but in 1923, when beef was worth gc~te~ th.at a bounty should be paid to the only 5s. a lOO lb., you fixed nothing. darrymg mdustry to place it on a sound foot ~ng, :'nd although I am right behind the dairy lUr. COLLINS: I am dissatisfied with mg mdustry 's desire for a better price for the low price for cattle in North Queensland, butter, I am opposed to the principle of a and I want to get a proper price for the pro bounty, becaus•e I do not think that is the ducer. Apparently, the hon. member is right way to do it. That would make the satisfied to leave them to stew in their own industry a political football, just as the sugar juice and to become poorer and poorer. If mclustry was when a bounty was given to it. his ic1ea is that North Queensland should be a storehouse for cheap cattle,. then I am ~Ir. Dart: Why are vou down on the against it. I want the producers in the North farmer~ • to be just as prosperous as the hon. member lllr. COLLINS: I am not. If the hon. for Aubigny. They are entitled to all the member had been fanning as long as I have consideration they can get. There is nothing he would not be clown on the farmer, but he wrong with my proposal. The Conunonwealth ;1·oulcl be tryi~g intelligently to help him Government have called a conference of repre mstead of hanclmg out the stuff that is handed sentatives of all the States to fix targets -for out by many. hon. members opposite,. which is primary production. That is a very long JJO help to h1m and only gives him a wrong step towards doing something to control mar outlook. I believe the butter industry should keting, but you cannot ask men to produce be helped bJ: a fixed priee, in the same way as or to increase their production unless side by the sugar mclustry. What is wrong with side with that arrangement there is another fixing the price they are to receive for their th~t? What i~ wron.g with fixing a payable pnce for meat m the mterests of the procluc·ed produce. )Ir. Sparkes: How can you do that with At 2.15 p.m., '!Hatter what business we are in to-day, it chairman of this council, I feel that with the is very difficult to make a forecast or frame co-operation of the Government-and we must a. builget. have that-the council will go a loll£' way in developing secondary industry a.ncl, among Primary and secondary industries are in other things, help in utilising the wool and such a state that most Budgets can be only cotton produced in this St3te. We must surmise. I think that the Treasurer, when avoid sending it South to be processed, then budgeting for a surplus of £39,000 this year, thought that sum would be considerably having it returned to Queensland. _incn,ased if the Government do not spend JUr. Clayton: Why do we send it away? money on developmental work in con Jlection with the war. I forecast that at the JUr. PIE: Because we have no spinning end of the present financial year, with man mills or cotton mills. They have yet to be power problems as they are, the State will erected in this State, and that can only be have a surplus of approximately £1,:500,000, clone if >Ye get a way from all this defence but that can be only surmise in view of the of primary industry and give some considera tremendous work done by the Commonwealth tion to secondary industry, ·which is calling Government in Queensland at very little cost out for development. 'l'his Government must to the State. l know that much work is being giYe more thought to it. They should create iione bv the State for which the Common a Department of Seconclaq Industries. I IYealth · GoYernrnent rlo not pay. After all, have spoken previously on this matter and Jspccially if that >York is for the benefit not madCY a simila1· suggestion. The j olJ is big only of war but of peace, too, it should be enough for a special department. 'rhere are -eanied out. industries that must be developed in Queens land. They would employ a greater number I was interested in the criticism of the of people and consequently there \YOuld be a Budget by the Leader of the Opposition. He demand for the goods of primary industries. made comparisons with Victoria. I should I s11ggest that the Govemment giYC immediate like the hon. gentleman to answer this one consideration to the ere a tion of such a depart question: whether it is better to create trust ment and put in charge of it such a man as funds, as apparently is being done in Victoria the Secretary Ior Public Lands. They must and apparently is suggested by the hon. gentle see to it that the man in charge is big enough man should be done here, or to spend on to grapple with our problems and help in the developmental work that is good for both war deYelopment of our industries. and peace'? That is the question I asked the Treasurer when he brought this Budget before It has been stated in this Chamber by the the Committee, and he made it clear that hon. member for Nanango that in pushing the developmental work his Government Queensland interests I, in endeavouring to expected to do would be principally work good be a big Qucenslander, have become a little for '':ar and peace. I maintain that is far Australian. I judge him by his utterances in better tlum creating trust funds that may or this Assembly. To me he is the smallest man may not be used in the dim future. I think a in this House. trust fund should be created to be used purely An Opposition ~Iember interjected. for the putting of men who return from the fighting honts after the war into useful JUr. PIE: If he is not here, he can read it industry. in '' Hansarcl,'' but l should say it of him even if he were present. I know he is a It was disappointing to me that there was Victorian, and perhaps he still has the virtually no mention in the Financial State VictOTian idea that Queensland should not be ment of secondary industry. In fact, the deYeloped. He should be a Queenslander. Treasurer said that secondary industTy could Queensland is going to be developed. She has 11ot be considered at present. I feel that this to be developed if we are going to sit in Chamber, if I might say so, is all primary this Parliament and be representatives of this industry, and that is the basic reason why State. secondary industry is not being developed in Queensland. Virtually all the debates deal J\Ir. Sparkes: We might not be sitting with primary industry. Primary industry will in this Parliament before long. not give us development after the war, but Mr. PIE: If we did not sit in this Par if we had secondary industry the State would liament it might be better for Queensland, grow and grow, and attract people from other because then we might be sending more parts of the world and eventually create a efficient representatives to Canberra to greater demand for primary industries and represent us, not yes-men who agree to every give the primary producers the higher prices thing that is done in the Federal Parliament. that they want for their commodities. This State has to be put forcibly on the ma.p, Hon. members representing primary pro and must not take everything as it comes. ·ducers say they cannot live on the land, yet In speaking on secondary industries in this >Overy one of them looks as if he were getting Chamber. I made small reference to the fat on the land. munition factories in Queensland. It was 1Ir. Sparkes: We may look all right. suggested by J\fr. J\'Iakin, the Commonwealth Minister of Munitions, in a statement that :i}Ir. PIE: I appreciate the reference by was published with big headlines, that I was the Premier to the efforts of the Chamber criticising the Department of Munitions. I of Manufacturers War Orders Procurement should like now to analyse his statement. I Council. Without taking undue credit as do not agree with Mr. Makin, that everything 362 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. pt>'lsible has been done by the Commonwealth all-time Australian record-only 59,0CO ean Government to develop secondary industry in be found in this State. the State of queenslanu; rather do I make the statcmer.t, that loyal, efficient manufacturers The position is even more alarming and have been retarded at every turn in their serious as far as Government munitions, air efforts· to develop secondary industry in this craft and ship building yards are concerned, State. because of the 100,500 people now employed in these activities it is estimated that at most Mr. liiann: Tell us how. only 5,000 are to be found in this State. No-one, not even Mr. :i',lakin, will deny that lilr. PIE: I will tell the hon. member we have the skilled workers, the executives, shortly. I want the Queensland people, the in this State, and the ma.iority of troops people I represent, not the people in Victoria, urgently requiring sup plies of every descrip to realise the true position. Therefore, let me tion, yet we are not developing in comparison reply to Mr. Makin 's reported statements. My with other States. Mr. lvlakin denied the suggestion that 35,000 people were employed inter.iection by our former Premier, the Hon. in munition factories in Australia was baseu vV. Forgan Smith, that the Department ever on Mr. Makin 's own figure, as recorded in announced that 7,000 people would be engaged ''The Australasian .Manufacturers' Annual'' at the Rocklea J<'actory, and said that from of 3 June, 1942, wherein he stated- 2,500 to 3,000 were the most ever contemplateu. '' At the present time there are employed in Government munitions factories proper 'l'his statement cannot be reconciled with (and I exclude annexes, aircraft factories, his o'yn statement, certainly made some time and shipbuilding yards) 35,000 opemtives, ago and published in the ''Australian Manu as against 5,000 on the outbreak of war. facturer'' of 14 J<'ebruary, 1942, in which he To fully staff those shops or factories which clearly said that in the next six months, will come into production in the period I that is, Ldore Augm;t this year, 1,800 men have named, an additional 30,000 operatives am1 1,750 women, making a total of 3,550, will be required.'' would be required. I agree with the former Premier that when this factory at Rocklca I now refer the .:\iinister, and the Queensland is completeu and working at full pressure, people particularly, to the latest Common and with all the bottlenecks eliminated, it wealth monthly review of business statistics, will be capable of employing 7,000 people. which shows the following position in the Again Mr. :\'fakin is blmvn out on his own va-rious States up to May, 1942:- figures, because there are not 3,500 working Numbers employed in industry. there nmv. Increase f refm· the Minister to an editorial pub lished in the ''Telegraph'' of 23 April, since 1938-39 1942, which appears effectively to sum up· New South Wales 289,000 69,500 the position. I think we have all seen it. Victoria 246,000 52,100 It describes Queensland as still the Cinderella Queensland 59,300 7,800 State. The assertion was made at a mass South Australia 69,000 27,700 meeting of workers at a Brisbane munition factOTy that people are waiting to be employed Decrease. in munition production in Queensland and Western A nstralia 21,900 200 cannot be absorbed because of the shortage of raw material, tools, and machinery. If It will be seen that the two outlying States, that is true-and there is reason for believ Western Australia and Queensland, have shown little development. Surely Queensland needs ing that it has not been exaggerated-it implies the unwarranted neglect of Queens the development of industry to maintain her land. The apparent discrimination in favour defences in this war~ We have increased bv of the more populous and wealthy States is only 7,800, and Western Australia has consistent with the way in which Queens decreased by 200. land's just claim for consideration and Mr. Nicklin: To what do you attribute development of her war industries has been that~ whittled down. Mr. PIE: To the lack of Commonwealth I certainly made the statement in this co-operation in using the facilities that are Chamber that there was a shortage of machine available in Queensland if it will go looking tools at Rocklea. That was a mistake, and for them, and I shall prove that later. Can I admit it, but there is a shortage of any Queenslander be satisfied with that posi machines. I want to point out to the Chamber tion~ No matter what Mr. M akin may say and that no factory in the world can run on without forgetting my desire never to criticise bottlenecks. There must be an even flow the Commonwealth Government destructively through the factory. There is no use in in its present war effort, I think it is my duty having a big production in one section if the as a representative in the Queensland State articles produced cannot be finished in another. Parliament to bring these figures before this What is the use of having a number of Assembly. The latest figures disclose that machines in one section and none in another f since 19 39 employment in secondary industry That will not give a free flow through the throughout Australia has increased by factory, and that is where the trouble arises. 161,600 persons, of which Queensland's share Until these bottlenecks are overcome, so that has been 7,800. Of a grand total of 703,800 we have an even flow through the factory, people employed in secondary industry-an we cannot expect results. Supply. [29 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. 363 ::\Ir. Makin questioned my statement about ' ' Since "·e did not hope to find any 1!Je £4/iOO,OOO explosives factory and unfor demand for them in Austmlia at the time tunately in his Press statement he indicated we started to sell them abroad.'' to the public where this factory was situated. l did not know previously. I do not agree 'l'hey could not sell them in Australia!- with his statenlGnt on the man-power ques tion. .Everybody knows that until the labour "We sold many to New Zealand, corps was established in this State we had Palestine, etc., and in consequence of our more men available than in New South having to apply for export licences l\lel \Y ales. I have not sufficient technical know bourne apparently took some notice, and ledge to say whether because of climatic con about a year ago we receivecl an order ditions it should not be in this State, but I from the Munitions Department for a few This clearly proves to me that the statement orders, once the ability of the pl:.m~ \Ya" made by the Minister that Queensland can established.'' not make these tools or do precision-tool work is entirely wrong. It shows that my Let me rrad what another ''little chap'' statenYent yyas neYer analysed. has got to say, and the difficulties he had to put up with in trying to develop an indus· This is another letter, written to me by Mr. try in this State. It is enough to break any :B'. L. Hudson, engineer and manufactmer, man's heart. I do not kl1ow how ho has of Brisbane- carried on. This is Yvhat he says- ''Dcar Sir-I noticed in the press '' Memo. re :i'l·fanufacture of Steel Casting& recently a rcn{ark, attributed to Mr. ::\iakin, in Brisbane. that Queensland did not possess the workshops capable of making the precision ''The outstanding feature of Queensland tools and gauges so necessary to mass Electric Steel Limited relations with Muni production. tions Department has been the procrastina tion and passive resistance to all effort '' :B'or more than tYYO years I ha Ye been for improving output. Prom March, 1942, making precision gauges to the order of the company's electric furnace has had a the Director of Machine Tools and potential capacity of 60 tons of finished Gauges, and over that period I have manu castings per week working 21 hours per factmed about 5,000 articles, which is no day. Such an output, however, implies small achievement. The gauges have been handling gear and foundry equipment distributed to factories all oYer the -which, until nO\\', has not been avaiiable. Commonwealth. X 0 assistance tOl;ld be got from munitions ''I would be very happy to show you to hasten acquisition of equipment. It is the class of work I am doing, and I am: Teporterl that several Sydney foundries sure you would be interested.'' were u 1]ocnted Yery laTge sums to equip for That clearly proves that Mr. :i\Iakin was \rork that was ddinitely experimental and entirely wrong, and this Chamber should know from which results haYe been disappoint- ~g. - it. ''In December, 1941, negotiations opened The Secretary for Labour and Industry: fol' casting tl'ench-mortar bomb casings and Was that statement made before his trip company offerctl to m3ke on cost-plus basis. to Queensland~ This was declined by department and fol Mr. I'IE: It was not; it was made lowed then months of writing back and forth immediately after his trip to Queensland, until May, wben com1)any sent its metal and in reply to criticism that I made in this lm·gist to Melbomne at request of depart Chamber. ment to study methods used there. On 20 June company offered make on definite This statement was made by a Common price and stated equipment needed to· wealth officer, and I think they believe enable production to commence. Director him- of Pinance, Melboume, held up matter. '' Another limitation relating to the Melbomne foundry interests then visited steel industry, which until lately has been Brisbane armed 'with letters certifying almost non-existent.'' visit \Yas made with approval of Govern :iUr. lliann: You say you made a state ment. Efforts \Yere made to squeeze out nl'ent here and that Mr. Makin replied in a local organisation. Chairman of Board of Area Management even offered to convene statement that was untrue~ conference to facilitate a merger of Mr. I'IE : I say that he is either not interests. Brisbane company refused to getting the right information from his merge with anyone and has since been kept officers or that he made an untrue statement. in air as to intention of department regard, That is the point I want to make-he either ing making of bomb casings-9 months got wrong information supplied by someone, after inception of negotiations. Undoubt and I want to know who it is, or he made edly Southern steel-castings firms have too a definitely untme statement. much influence at Munitions Headquarters, where many key officers are steel industry The Secretary for Public Lands: He is men co-ontecl for war work. It is not an not the only Minister who has got untruth exaggeration to say these men carefully ful information from officials. sidetrack any proposal likely to assist Mr. I'IE: We want to get at the bottom Queensland firms. of it. Snch information is having a big ''Queensland Electric Steel Ltd. has retarding influence on our State's industries. been inspected nt least 20 times by about Either the Minister is not getting correct 50 individuals in the past four or five information from his officers in this State months. Tlwse visitors were an men or his statement is definitely untTUe, one intere3ted in tbe foundry business in the or the other. Routh, and they came sponsored by the Another statem'ent made by Mr. Makin was Queensland Board of Area Management. to the effect- Not one solitary item of equipment or any other benefit has ever resulted from such ''A steel production plant was now visits. Essington J~ewis inspected the making a modest beginning, and imme foundrY Rnd stated, 'We neec1 all the steel orders were diately it proved itself trial PR stin~s we ran get.' Tolrr that if he placed, to be followed by substantial ordered them the foundry would make them, Supply. (29 SEPTEMBER.] Su;pply. 363 nothing has yet resulted. Minister Makin separately, because they have entirely different visited the ·foundry 1n company with p1·oblems, and these cannot be trcatetl as a admini,;'-rati\·c officers who shepherded him whole. It is therefore suggested that when carefully and gave their answer to mana considering the responsibility there should be gerial protPsts on the spot usually glossed a committee of tlnee men in each territory oyer \Yith suggestions that 'the department \Yith, perhaps, the local member as chairman, is now ananging for this and that to be to work in conjunction YYith the Department done.' Explanation accepted. Result of, say, \Vor Organisation and Industry or nil.'' any other ll·cpartment. lt would be neces They wnnt to submerge the little business sary to-(a) analyse all imlnstry in each here and they would not give the man the tO\nt or territory; (b) register all tools and equipment to develop here. I could go on and machines available; (c) obtain complete quote the whole statement. It is here for uetails of all plant at present working and any hon. member to read so that he may see what they could make; details of capacity of what this State is putting up with and why present work an cl if worked the full capacity; we are not developing the industries that (d) numbers at present employed in each should be deYeloped in this State. town, giving full details of skilled aml 1mskilled, male and female labour; numbers It was very pleasing to know from ?.lr. that could be employed and raw materials J\Iakin 's statement that Mr. Essington Lewis, that would be immediately required to work of Broken Hill fame-and I do not think at full pressure. If every town was analysed anyone criticises him-visited this State. on this basis by the members they would I feel sure that as a result of his Yisit create interest in that town ancl further details particularly to the Northern towns-he will could be offered to any Government for fiml a tremendous quantity of unused power analysis. in this State, comprising machinrd and people waiting to be eo-opted, and I feel certain his I also feel that eYCryonc realises to-day report will be different from the report of the that the problem in fa dory production is man who came up here, stayed a few days, trainetl labour, and it is interesting to note aml went back and said that Queensland was ti1at in ewr; lOO employees in industry 24 no use in the munitions effort. 'l'hat is the lJer cent. are usually unskilled, 41 per cent. sort of thing YYe hnYe to put up with. I feel semi-skilled, and 35 per cont. skilled. These tlmt as a result of ::Yfr. Essington Lewis 's iigures pro,·iclc the reason \Yhy an analysis Yisit this State will have a chance of must be made of labour to ascertain how d<>veloping. much is skilled. It is all Yery well to criticise and say Another matter to be considered is train things are not right in this State, but we ing in industry. This must be done, and must tl·y to outline some plan showing where consequently each indiYidual territory would the inCl·easecl capacity can be deYeloped. I haYe to analyse the undertakings availablo wish to outline a plan I have roughed out, and see that sufficient skilled labour to work giving an idea of what I think should be them was utilised. The plan is sound. It has clone, particularly in the North. I haye been been t,horoughly investigated, and if any subjected to some criticism that I haYe been interested hon. member cares to discuss it, appointed by the Commonwealth Govern I think he will find that it can be worked ment to a job that somebody else should have. on a very satisfactory basis. Anybody can haYe that job; I do not care who gets the jobs as long as they are done. I YYisb to bring before the notice of hon. I feel the services of this Assembly should members several other manufactures in bP used to a greater extent than they are Queensland that are not being utilised to the rather than that civil servants should be fullest extent, and I quote from one letter I appointed to them all. I feel that every receiYecl. The writer begins with the infor member can take an active interest in the mation that he had a short talk with the State, and if he wants to do a job of work industrial chemist of a factory here, and in his area he should be able to do so. proceeds- My plan is this: in my opinion the problems ' This company is now only half engaged we are confronted with are not difficult and upon soap, and the remainder of its pro could be overcome by efficient organisation. duction is on furnaced cements and other Each main centre or zone could take into new products needed for war purposes. consideration the requirements in material and ''They approached the Supply Depart man-power to replace the present improvisa ment and had an unhappy experience. The tion. Zoning is essential. I suggest that department told them that they were closely delegates from each department-from the controlled from Melbourne, and only let Department of Labour and National such contracts in Queensland as they were Service, and the departments that haYe been instructed to let.'' developed by the Commonwealth Government -one from each-form a committee, a kind The industrial chemist I mention asked if of State board, so that immediate decision they would give him an opportunity to quote could be given to the problems that crop for any new products- up here. " The answer was that, unless a product It must be realised that Queensland is a was already being manufactured in vast State, with larger towns than any other Queensland, invitations to tender were not ~tate in Australia, and with varying condi published l1ere. There is more work here tions, therefore each district should be treated for our liaison officer.'' .366 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. He finally asked the throughout Australia. Only three months 100,000 bales of cotton (instead of 12,000 ago I acted on behalf of the makers of bales), all of which could he _,·caved and '::"rugget,' 'Kiwi,' and 'Suprecm' polishes consumed by the people. vVe cannot go on \n placing a deputation before the Tin Plate continually speaking of primary industries Board in :Melbourne. \V e received a very and primary industries, with no thought for favoural>lc hearing and our requests were secondary industries. There is no mention granted. Something Hut I cannot claim of secondary industries in the Budget. to have achieved at any time in my Given rn·op"er enc:ouragen1ent, secondar=, numerous applintions to the powers that industries in Queensland can compete suc· be in this State. I feel like one fettered, eessfully with secondary industries throagll not ]mowing where next to appeal, as out Australia. I know that secondary indus 1~ o body that I have yet met seems to care tries can be successfully established here. \Yhether industry of any description con I know all about the problem of taxation, tinues in this State at all. If all States because I have had to face up to it. l \YOre trented alike I would take it with know that it is a big difficulty for the little much better grace, but feel that misman man but 110t for the big man, because the Dgemcnt nnd bad jurisdiction and the line mte of taxation is assessed on the basis of of least resistance adopted by many of our percentage of profit to capital invested. The administrative officers are so utteTly unfair, little man has to put back e.-erything into when other States are still carrying on and his business and try to live on ancl builrl retaining their key men. '' and build. He is the man 'I ho finds it difficult to cope with the Queemland taxa I understand that that man has since made application to join the Air Force. tion, but not the big shows. The big shows, such as Broken Hin Proprietary Limited, will These are matters that certainly require never come hm·e. They clo not >vant to come thorough investigation by the Government. here. I do not care who does it, but I feel that there is something underneath the >Yhole I could give some more information about thing. Hon. members have no idea of the Queensland industries. Let me refer again obstacles that are put in the way of the to that little industry in Queensland, Queens dewlopment of secondary industries in this land Electric Steel Limited. It wants to be State, and something has to be done about it given a chance. It has made bogey >Yheels unless we are going to allow all these indus and Bren gun carriages and other things, triPs to g·o out al](l we are to become a Then there is the firm of Bonney and Clark, primary industry State, ns I think the Com leather goods manufaettuers, who know their monwealth \\·ants us to be. job particularly well. They are one of the best manufacturers in this State, ancl look I feel that the position is serious. The at the trouble they have been up against. hon. member for J'.ianango has called me a They undertook to make predictor covers, Little Australian, I feel that you have to be but a refugee imported fron! another part of a Big Queenslander before you can be a the world undercut them. What did he give Big Australian. To-day, whenever one of us to the Commonwealth Government? Some is trying to do his best, one of the worst things thing that was of no use, something that that a man can be called is a Little Austra rusted. This is something that has been lian. In these days I prefer to be called an brought before the Minister for Supply and illegitimate than a Little Australian, especi Development, as it should be. The people in ally by a man like the hon. member for Queensland should be given a fair oppor Nanango, and that simply because I bring tunity, and given that oppOTtunity they can Queensland's needs before this Assembly, compete with anyone in Australia. because I fight for this State in the interests of Australia. I have tried to make out a I feel that this is the time when this case for secondary industries, and I have Parliament should give consideration to tried to convince this Parliament that now secondary industries, and I suggest that the is the time to appoint someone. Secondary surplus of £63,000 that the Treasurer has industries are waiting to do things. The budgeted for should be used to create a owners want to protect their industries and department to inquire into the development to do the work, but there is not one authority of secondary industries. The hon. member ~hey can ~o to in the State and say, ''This for Bo>ven made out a good case why Bowen 1s hnppenmg and that is happening. Can should be developed. I know that to-day you do something about it~ Will you come they want tons and tons of coal, and they down to Melbourne and fight iH" In Mel should have the facilities to handle it. I am bourne they will take notice of a :Minister sure that the hon. member for Bowen will but they will not take much notice of ~ bear m·e out. We have hundreds of tons of member of Parliament. We must fight for iron ore that could be mined and smelted. these things. Therefore I urge again that as we are budgeting for a surplus the Cabinet should The first case I made in this Chamber was use it for the development of secondary on secondary industries, the next was on industries because upon this the future secondary industries, and I keep harping on d-evelopment of this State surely depends. thenr only because I realise that without them the State will never be successful. Primary lUr. RIORDAN (Bowen) (3.13 p.m.): At industries will never be succ.essful without the outset I desire to congratulate the secondary industries, so that we can weave Premier on his elevation to that high office the wool we grow into cloth. Queensland because I feel no-one is more capable of fill will not be successful until it can produce ing that position successfully in these 368 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. l'Crilous and troublesome times than the hon. in the party room and in this Chamber and gentleman. I also congratulate him on his ne1·er canie.d any disagreement in opinions Budget which has been framed ~with due outsrde of 01ther or showed his ,·indictiveness regard to the difficult times ahead. It has in any way. been criticised by hon. members opposite, and When. I speak of the building up of the one hon. member went so far as to say that sugar mdustry on Australian standards it was an attempt to conceal from the Federal and conditions I wish to refer particu Government the true wealth of the State or larly to another industry that to-day is the wealth under the control of the State looked upon as being a war-time industry. Government. Such a statement is unwar It is an industry that the Queensland Labour ranted. The 'freasurer has a difficult time Government have at all times endeavoured to ahead of him. He has to follow in the foot foster, and upon which a great deal of steps of the former Premier and Treasurer, money has been spent. I refer to the cotton the Hon. vV. :!<'organ Smith, who has done industry, v hich, at the present moment, is a g1·eat serdre to Queensland. The former ~o~ng, through a very troublesome period Premier was returned to office in 1932 when llllteeu. Recently an attempt has been made Queensland was in the doldrums, but he has to hansfcr sugar-growino· countrY in the been successful in raising the State from Burde.kin delta to cotto~-growing. I do a condition of stagnation to prosperity. not chsa,g-ree altogether with that. In time of \Yar cotton is one of our most essential His activities in ewry sphere of public life commodities ancl we should take every possible k1Ye been long and honourable. He has s~ep to ensure the growing of all that can lkcn courageous. To use an Australian he grown. The Queensland GoYernment set colloquialism, he has always had the guts to out to do that. What was more or less an llo what he thought 1·ight. 'l'his may be a ultimatum was given to the sugar-crrowers in n1lgar expression to use in this austere the Burclekin delta that they m~st grow Chamber, but it is Ycry fitting to emphasise cott?n under c~rtain conditions or they would ~his chief clunacteristic. The ex-Premier recelYC no assignment. This ultimatum was made enemies, but he made enemies only unwarranted ancl unnecessary. In the first amongst those who feared him. He made place, I contend that 95 per cent. of the enemies because of his courage, because of farmers growing cane would have gone over his energy, and because he always wanted to to cotton as a national emergency crop with- rlo those things he bclie,·oc1 to be right. But out such an ultimatum. · if he has made enemies he has also made There may be men in that country who are friem1s. I particularl~· remember the great reluctant to change from sugar to cotton and ~m·vice he has done to the majority of the wgar farmers in my electorate. My elec I do not want the Committee to think Mr. torate comprises many industries, and many Brassington, that I refer only to peopld who r·haracters, but in the main it is composed may be regarded as aliens. Thev are not all of sugar farmers. I wonder if there are aliens who want to get the hest out of this many sugar farmeTS in the whole of Queens war. There are people in the community who l:nHl who realise the great serYice, the national at all times want to make the most monev they can out of it. But I am of opinion that ~en-ice, that our ex-leader did for them at "the International Sugar Conference in London, 95 per cent. at least, and possibly 100 per 1;-hen :Mr. R. G. Casey was the direct repre cent., of the people in this area beirw so ,~,ntatiw of the Fec1eral Government. On ~lose to the front-line operations, re~lise tl~at it his return Mr. Casey, in applauding the 1s necessary to do something in order to win. actions and the activities of the ex-l'Temier, No people in the Commonwealth realise this said he was responsible for the favourable war is on more than the people in the North :JgTeement that was made for Australia. I of Queensland. They are the people who are should like to know also if the sugar farmers facing realities, and facing up to the sitmttion throughout Queensland realise what his that this war may at any moment be at our services mem1t at the conference that recently door. If we cast om minds back 12 or 15 took place at Canberra, when sugar-rationing ;nonths, we come to a time when they realised was discussed. If they knew the facts they 1t even more. About 12 months ago what was e.ould appreciate better the services that have ~here in the 1'\ orth that justified any civilian hccn lost to the sugar industry. The m staymg there? vVas there anything there ex-Premier has done yeoman service for the to defend it~ \Vas there anything tl~ere by sugaT industry and for the farmers engaged way of defence at all~ The consequence was in it, as well as the workers. I believe that that when the Japs first came into the war nnr sugar industry should be built upon the there was a movement away from Nmth srnmdf'st basic prin~iples, not in competition 9ueensland-a very slight movement, consist with the black-lAbour industry in other coun mg mostly of women and children· but the h'ies. bnt in accordance with the standards strange thing is that as the Japs got' nearer to set hy A nstralian standards of living and Australia, as the defence of Australia was eonc1ition,, developed by the introduction of Allied troops and the sending of Australian troops to the I regret that we have lost the services of the North, the people are going back there in ex-Premier. I hope that the nation has not droves, and the reason why all the people are lost his serYices. I am one of those who not back is that some who received Govern nl,;-ays found, although I was one of those ment assistance to leave that area when times 1Yho did not always agree with him in party were difficult are not in a financial position eiTcles, that the ex-Premier was alwavs man to go back there to-day. I say to the enough to realise one's point of Yie1v, both Government that the time has arrived when Supply. [29 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. 369 t h,y should again give considem tion to. the much talk to-day about equality of sacrifice. fatt-T know there are difficulties associated So far as I can see equality of sacrifice means wit':l the matter-that there are people who that certain areas of land in the Burdekin want to go back to their bread->Yinners, who delta should be set aside for the growing of wall\ to be back on the front line with their cotton, which in effect means that in other ltusbmds who may be in industry or near sugar-growing areas cane prices will soar. In their sons ·who may be at the battle-front. spite of the experts' figmes, I contend that They snould receive consideration. cotton-growing cannot be as financially suc cessful as sugar-growing. Nobody can tell Quemtsland is depending to a great degree me that it can be so. to-day on the cotton industry, but in my opinion it has been deYeloped on the wrong JUr. Nimmo: You cannot grow it without lines. The present price is an inadequate irrigation either. Teturn to the grower for the hire of his plant and the use of his land. The growers lUr. RIORDAN: That is so, but I am in the Burdekin delta, which is producing more pointing out that it cannot be grown success than its share of cotton, because of the failure fully to make an Australian industTy and of crops in other parts, have received very hn,·e Australian standaTds of living condi little or no assistance. 'rhey haYe transferred tions and wages, at the present price of 5}d. from sugar- to cotton-growing, and m·e receiv a lb. even under the most favouTable con ing 5!d. a lb. for cotton, which is less than ditions, those of the Durdekin delta. Jt it costs to land American cotton in Australia. is no use trying to build up an Australian We are told that one of the reasons why it industry under black-labour conditions. It ''"as important to grow cotton was the need cannot be done. Certainly people will grow to conserve spacG in ships that could be used cotton, because there is a war on, and it is for bringing munitions, aeropla11es, guns, and necessary that cotton shall be gro>Yn, but men from America. I agTee with that. But we are violating the very principle of the are there any other industries in Australia that White Australia policy when we attempt to are receiving bonuses to make up the great compete in Australia with black-labour difference between the production cost and the conditions. actual price on the overseas madwts ~ Recently 1 had a conversation with a man who had I agree with much that has been said by gone in extensively for cotton-growing in the Opposition hon. members. Australia is a vast Burdekin delta, and he told me that it was country, but we lack big m'en who would impossible, even under the irrigation system, see that primary industries in Australia were to build up a big Australian industTy. He told built up by conforming with Australian me it would never be a success and they could standards of living. In this respect I refer never build up a big Australian industry until to the hon. member for Fassifern, who made a national Government stabilised the price of out a case for the building up of the butteT cotton in this countTy. How would it be or dairying industry. Every industry i_n possible, he asked, to build up an industry in Australia, should be built up on the bas1s i:Otton -growing in competition with cotton of giving the Australian standard of living grown by black labour overseas~ "\V e can grow to the workers in it. eotton at 5:!;d., which is cheaper than they can land it in Australia from America. Cotton Another thing militating against the build is grown by irrigation in the Burdekin delta. ing up of the cotton-growing industry is the In the first place, the cotton-growing scheme lack of ginneries in the principal cotton would have achieved greater success had their growing districts. At present the ginneries been greater co-ordination between the civil are far removed from these areas. It has and military authorities. I have mentioned been stated that the necessary machinery this previously, but it is ·worth repeating. Just cannot be obtained. Every possible step should at the peak of planting the military be taken to see that the necessary authorities swooped clown and took almost machinery is moved to the required local~ ty cYery tractor required for ploughing and as quickly as possible. The only two gm vlanting in that clistTict. There appears to neTies in Queensland at present are in the be no co-ordination bet"lveen the civil and Southern and Central districts. military authorities. The hardships associated ·with cotton Then there is the farmer who tolcl me that growing in other districts do not apply to he wanted to grow cotton on a large scale. the Bmdekin area. There they are growing He devoted to this purpose 40 acres of his it as a sOTt of sideline, and consequently it land that was more or less lying idle, but is possible for it to be grown without the when he went to work the military sergeant arowers making any money out of the ven would catch up with him, and when his two ture. Possibly the result is even a loss to tractors were being taken from him he was the farmers. I know that is true, inas informed that it was too late to protest as much as they have suffered all the diffi his tractors were in Port Moresby at 10 culties of the shortage of man-power. I o'clock that m·orning. 'rhat was the day was amazed at the recent agitation to get after they took them from him. Hon. mem office clerks, bank clerks, school teac~ers, bers can thus see the nature of the dilh and school children to go out into the fields culties that have to be met. and help in the growing or picking of cotton. Cane farmers in these areas must be pro For months that has been done in North tected, not only in connection with their Queensland, particularly in the l0wer assignments, but in other things. There is Burdekin. 370 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. I am one of those who believe that unless Mr. Nimmo: If we could grow enough this Go,-crnment can influence t;1e Common cotton he would not be allowed to imrort wealth Co.-ernment to give consideration to any of it. the stabilisation of a priec fixed upon Aus tralian standards of living >Ye should desist lUr. RIORnXN: They would still hare to from going any further with the de.-elop sell their cotton at world parity prices. ment of the cotton indnstTy in Queensland, 1\Ir. J'iimmo: Who would pay the gliaran becaucc if we continuecl >Ye should only be teed price: building up another industry in which women and children >Yould be working like slaves, Mr. RIORDAN: It would be guaranteed just as hon. members opposite would have us because of the duty imposed by the Common believe they work in the dairying industry. wealth Government on imported cotton, but I realise that while the war is on and cotton the price itself would be determined by is a necessity we sl1onld do everything possible world parity prices. to get cotton, and if necessity drives us then Mr. Nimmo: If the manufacturer could even greater things will haye to be clone, but not buy locally-grown cotton you would allow it is no good trying to set up this industry him to import raw cotton 1 unless we are sure >ve can maintain it upon conditions that are laid dom1 for every other ::IIr. RIORDAN: Of course, and if he was industry in Australia to-day, the sugar and not entering into competition with the wheatgrowing industries in particular. Australian-grown article I should be willing One other thing I shoul 1 wo more shafts on the Collinsville field and should be provided by the Government, parti asketl the Government to consider the taking cularly at the State coalmine, for emergency o1·rr of the Scottville coalmine as a State purposes. I was recently in Bowen-I am not 1nine. giving away military secrets-and saw six or eight ships lying out in the harbour and three To-day the situation is becoming alarming, or four tied up at the wharves. Most of those and I am in a position to know from the ships called at the port for coal. Had L;•vn> men ·working there that unless something is been any foresight on the part of the Govern done quickly, at least within 12 months, most ment or the industry prior to the war, 50,000 of the working lllaces will peter out. Since tons of coal would have been stored in bins the outbreak of war the Collinsville coal somewhere handy to cope with an emergency [Jroduction has been increased by 25 to 30 per of this kind. "ent., and it is now producing 1,000 tons a da v. The Collinsville mine and the Scottville At 3.50 p.m., mii1e together are producing 30,000 tons Mr. DART (Wynnum) relieved the Chair· monthly, an increase of 50 per cent. compared m an in the chair. with the period just prior to the outbreak of war. I now ask the Premier and the Secretary :Jir. RIORDAN: These bins should be con for Mines to mark my words, that unless they structed now; there is no time like the take steps immediately to increase the coal present. The Allied Works Council should production there still further, the increase in take cognisance of this fact and build them production of 25 per cent. since the outbreak to enable these ships, doing vital work in the of war will disappear and the working places interests of democracy, to get their coal sup may peter out entirely. This is not the plies promptly. Ships, particularly vessels proper time to talk of taking over the Con· belonging to the navy, have a higher priority ,;olidated coalmine although I advocated such than our railways, or any other consumers of a step prior to the war and I advocate it coal. We should learn our lessons from the :tgain. What I wish to mention is that this experiences of the present period, and if we mine had a reputation before the war for cannot get the labour during the war period., strikes and hold-ups. They ·were a hardy then the work should be undertaken as quickly mmual. Hon. members sitting on the Oppo as possible thereafter. I realise there would Bition benches as well as on the Government be hardships in getting labour to-day; never· benches deplored the actions of the men in theless, something must be done immediately their fight for better conditions and wages. for the greater production of coal at Scott Since this war began not one hold-up has ville, Collinsville, and Mount Mulligan mines, taken place in this mine, and, as I said pre because these are the closest mines to the Yiously, there has been a 25 per cent. to Northern battle-front. There is no need for :10 per cent. increase in production. recriminations as to who was to blame for not constructing these coal bins. \\Then I took up the subject with various Secretaries I wish to stress the fact that three or four . of :Mines I was told no money was available months ago the managing director of Con for the work, but since war has occurred we ~olidated coalmine and his eo-directors, some of the people most interested in the uniform have seen the futility of such statements. If we had coal bins holding tons of coal, tax legislation and the abolition of State 50,000 what a beautiful storehouse it would be. Parliaments, gave instructions that the mine After all, as the Minister for Home Affairs was not to work on any double-time days. and Home Secretary in Great Britain told us, As a result, despite the National Security neither peace or victory can be bought. I "Regulations, this mine was closed down for hope the Government will take particular note one or two double-time holidays in order to of the two points I have mentioned. avoid the payment of these overtime rates. Tf the coalminers of New South ·wales had Much has been said by hon. members on :1 cted in a like manner big headlines would both sides as to the need for the winning of have appeared in all the New South Wales the war. I believe that everything depends and Victorian newspapers, but nothing was on the winning of the war. No-one can dis said of the hold-ups that took place on the agree with the statement that we must win part of the owners of the Consoliflatcd mine this war. If we do not, we lose everything in my electorate because the management everybody in the community loses everything; would not pay double-time rates. If the but we do not want to lose sight of the fact J>osition had been reversed and the miners that we must also plan for the peac·e. Just had caused the hold-ups we should not have as surely as the winning of the war may be heard the end of the squeal yet. great in consequences, so everything can be lost by losing the peace by unpreparedness. I commend to the Secretary for Mines the Governments must plan for post-war recon sinking of additional shafts in that area. I struction, for the absorption of men into nlso commend to him the provision of facili reproductive service. There are many pro ties for the storage of coal, particularly jects this Government can undertake to bring rhnin~:: depressed and slack periofls. such as under the notice of the Federal Government, ''""' had prior to the war. 'Ne then had prac and they can work conjointly with the Federal iica1ly no storage of coal throughout Queens Government for bringing about the absorption lanr1. The miners could not be blamed for of men into industry aft•Br the war by careful that. Onlv three or four weeks' coal was planning. stored, ngainst the possibility that the miners woulrl go out on strike for thnt period. I I will quote a few statement by various lww' ~!ways advocated that big storage bins people on the post-war period. The following 372 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. statement was made by Mr. Menzies in 1939, :CUr. RIORDAN: A couple of flying as reported in the 1mwspapers :- boats came over Townsville, but up to aatc much damage has not been done. Of course ''I believe that all the time you are that does not mean that much the war is over, because it appeals to the work local authorities. If there are other elec ing man and to the people generally who are torates with more local authorities, then it is producing the wealth of this country. in a pretty bad way. In my electorate there is the Bow en Town Council, \V angaratta iUr. Plunkett: They are essential. Shire Council, Ayr Shire Council, and Proser lUr. RIORDAN: They are absolutely piue Shire Council. 'l'he distance from the essential to the welfare of the country. Many Bowen Post Office to the furthest boundary men may be reluctant to marry before going of the Bowen Town Council is about one and to the war, but they will marry as soon as a-quarter miies. The W angaratta Shire they return and they ·will want homes. I am Council Off1ce is also situated in the town of not saying that they all will want homes cost BmYen, and the shire covers an area outside ing £800, but the cost of building will have the boundaries of the Bowen 'l'own Council. increased by that time because of the N o-onc can tell me that thm'e is any necessity increased cost of materials. Between the time for these two local authorities with their the war started and the National Security offices in the same town and the duplication Regulation was issued prohibiting the build of seryices. ing of homes in Townsville and Brisbane, the iUr. Macdonald: That is the price of cost of constmcting an £800 house had greatness. increased by 18 per cent. becaus·e of the increased price for material and labour. These Jir. RIO RH AN: It might be the price are things that will have to be faced. I could of greatness. Than, there are offices at Ayr go on for some time speaking of the things and Proserpine for the Ayr and Proserpine that will have to be considered by Govern Shire Councils respectively. Again, at Mackay ments for the good of the Commonwealth, there are two or three local authorities. I but I shall content myself with repeating am advocating the merger, because I believe what I said previously, that there can be no the present system leads to unnecessary dupli tinkering with the returned men when this cation and a great deal of unnecessary over war is over. They have gone to fight for an head expense. ideal. They have gone to fight against the I \Yill take the Committee to another sub oppression and aggression that have been ject that interests not only my own elec directed upon the workers and, indeed, upon torate, but the whole of (~ueenslanil, namely, the entire peoples in other parts of the world. the taking over of all harbour boards by 'rhey will not be content to return to such the Government. I do not know of more happenings in this country. They expect to unnecessary and unwarranted expense that is return to a world that will give them some incurred at the present time than the holding compensation for their fighting for the of harbour-board elections, or tho establish eountry. ment of committees by these boards, the purchase of plant, the appointment of JUr. Decker: And preference, too. engineers, and the overhead expenses that lUr. RIORDAN: And some preference if must be incurred. I have had some necessary, but after the last war there were experience as a m·ember of the Bowen Har som0 men \Yho could not get it into their bour Board. I know that the representatives breasts quick enough that they should take on that board are men eager to do everything advantage of the returned soldiers and not iu the interests of the board. I am not say stand for preference of any kind. vVhen the ing anything derogatory of the personnel soldiers return, they will •expect proper treat of the boards. I belieYe that they are com ment. I say emphatically that 98 per cent. posed of men with the ,-ery best of intentions, of them are workers. and men who are honourable and sincere, but the creation of these boards is an n bso Mr. Decker: They are all workers. lute waste of money. Before any harbour J.Ur. RIORDAN: Of course we are all boarcl can make any reduction in its charge workers. There may be a few drones in the for storage or for the shipment of any cargo hive, but we should take the opportunity now over its wharves, it must seek authority of planning for the post-war period, for a from the Government. If it desires to period of reconstruction, and for a period spend any money on improvements to its when Australia will be even a better country harbour or port, it must also seek the than she is to-day. authority of the Government. I know of a case in which the 'l'ownsville Harbour I also believe that the time has aniv•ad when Board wished to reduce the charge on storage the Government should set up a committee for of sugar by 3d. a ton, but the Government the purpose of considering the merging of would not allow it to do so. One of the city,. town, and shire councils. I beli:eve that reasons given by the Governm'ent was that quite a number of city, town, and shire they had to protect the interests of other councils are unnecessary and a costly burden harbour boards. upon the ratepayers. The Secretary for Public Lands: Why At 4.13 p.m., should sugar from the Inkerman area be THE CHAIRMAN resumed the chair. sent via 'l'ownsville ancl not Bowen ~ lUr. Plunkett: They say that about State lUr. RIORDAN: I suppose the Burdekin Parliaments, too. bridge is one of the stumbling blocks, and the Inkerman area is a little closer to Bowen lUr. RIORDAN: I know that. Let us than Townsville. The Government should consider my own •electorate as an example. set out what hinterland belongs to each :Mine is a big electorate and it embraces four board. ')upply. [29 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. 375 lUr. DECKER (Sandgate) ( 4.17 p.m.): The point I make is that it was not neces Nobody can have any doubt, on looking sary to pay that amount in a lump sum, through the :E'inancinl Statement, that last because there was provision foT it to be met year the people of Queensland were greatly in instalments over a period of 20 years. It overtaxed, and that the surplus as repre shows that the 'rreasurer has been hard put sented in it does not reflect the true result. to it to find a way of reducing the surplus. We obsene under the heading of Depart By lloing this the Treasurer has endeavoured ment of Health and Home Affairs that an to disguise the surplus and cloak it up in additional sum of £117,4 76 "\YUs re'qnired in the Financial Statement so that the public excess of the amonnt budgeted for for civil would have no real idea of the overcharge defence and air-raill precautions. :D'urther made on them by way of taxation during the on we rear1 that an amount of £74 685 was financial year. required above the Estimates for' endow ments for hospitals. That \ras duo to n \Vhen we look along a little further we reduced amount being available from fincl the Unemployment Insurance Fund, receipts from the Golden Casket. Those rebate, £130,000. The loan occurred threp two items alone have been provided out of years ago. I suppose in that case, too, it c?nsolidated reYenue, and under ordinary was not incumbent on the Trcanuer to pay cucumstances, had that unforeseen demand the whole am·ount in one instalment. not been made on the department, would The Secretary for nealth and Home haYe added to the ::;urplus. The buoyancy Affairs: It is incumbent as soon as you of the State's finances enabled the Treasurer have the money available to repay the debt. to pay these huge sums to be met and still show a surplus. )lr. DECKER: To pay your debts, but when these loans were made they were made Let us look still further at the Financial on the understanding that they would be Statement. 'vVe observe under the heading paid back as and when the State coulcl of the 'freasury that £7 44,303 more than the finance them. Budget appropriation was met. That was brought about by the proYision of £385 916 The Secretary for Health and Home for discount, flotation and conversion cha~·ges Affairs: Did not that money take the on loans. Then if we turn to page 10 and place of revenue we should haye to raise examine the position of the overseas debt by taxation. we find that last year con versions of over seas loans took place, and a great saving lir. UECI{ER: Yes. All these items are was effected. The reduction in the interest in aclclition to the amounts budgeted for payable on these COlWerted loans for the last last year, yet we are showing a surplus of ~nancial year Yl-as £371,263. At the same only £63,000. When we look further down time £227,039 was required to meet the dis the Statement we see an appropriation of ~ount on the new issue provided in the first £245,000 was made towards the adjustment mstance by the Commonwealth National of debt balances in certain Tmst Funds. Debt Commission. Apparently that was Taking the year by and large, it was a mag made on the understanding that the repay nificent one. The trouble was to know what ment would be made to that body by the to do with the surplus. Under the uniform State over the period of the new loan that taxation scheme the Commonwealth has is, 20 years. We had no need to 'make granted to the State £5,821,000. That is a that payment in full. If it were not for reduction in the year of which we are speak the. ~act that we wanted to disguise our ing of only about £437,000, in ccmparison pos1hon and reduce the surplns we could with the amount of income collected. I say have taken the 20 yea~s to mak~ that pay emphatically that our position must have ment. I am not saymg it is not a good been represented in its worst possible light move for the State to do it. to get such a wonderful return from the Commonwealth Government under uniform The Secretary for Uealth and Home taxation. There was no move on the part Affairs: !t is better to be paying a debt of the Government to help the Common than lookmg for some way of spending it. wealth Government, but every move to increase their own income. The main con . Mr. DECKER: The Government are look sideration of each of the States was to get mg for some way of spending it in order to as much as it could, whereas everything it show a reduced surplus. could have clone to help the Commonwealth and and the national Parliament in its war The Secretary for Health Home effort should have been done. I think in Affairs: If we did not economise we should not have the money. the interests of the war effort it was our duty not to misrepresent our position; on the 1Ur. DECKER: It is not only economy· contrary, it was our duty to Teveal the true there has been an unprecedented influx of position and curtail our expenditure as revenue. much as possible in order to help the Com monwealth Government to the maximum·. The Secretary for Health and Home Affairs: Governments can find a way of The Secretary :i'or Health and Home spending it if they like. Affairs: The Commonwealth should be pay ing, and it is bound to pay what we are Mr. DECKER: I am certain this Govern paying for civil defence. The obligation ment can spend whatever income they have for financing this war is on the Common without any trouble at all. wealth, not on us. 376 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. lUr. DECKER: I shall speak on that in the Statement? Why are the Government matter later on. On the evidence provided not frank enough to show in the .b'in:\ncial in the Financial Statement, this Government Statement the actual position~ If they think would have had its best year this year, and that an item of approximately £250,000 is a if we had not had uniform taxation we small item they are making a big mistake if should have been forced to reduce our State it is thought that we think the same. We are development tax. We could not justify it, not asking about an item of £20 or £50, but owing to the state of our finances. vVe of something running into thousands. As a are starting oti this year without any handi matter of fact, the Financial Statement cannot caps. We should be practising austerity be properly d·ebated without knowing these to the greatest possible extent, and if we figures. cannot use the money we should give it back to the people. Our Leader has already referred to the public debt, which is dealt >vith on page 7 The Secretary for Public Works: Read of the Financial Statement, lmt the facts the Budget. \Ye are spending all the money bear repetition. The Statement shows the on war work. unfunded balances for the years 1928 to 1929 Mr. DECii:ER: I shall come to that and from 1931 to 1932, but the six years shortly. I know all about this war --work. between 1932 and 1938 are elimin:'.te(. The 58 were deficit years for this Go\'Grnmcnt, and There has been a tremendous excess of this action on their part is abs·.Jlntdy nnfaH. revenue in the Railway Department, as well as It nmy be contended that these >Ycre funded excess expenditure. Expenditure shows an debts and the others were unrnmic In a further analysis we find that the Golden JUr. DECKER: I do not agree with that. Casket, which was included in our income returns for previous years, has been graciously The Txeasurer: Then you do not agree excluded by the Commonwealth Government. with the truth. I am telling you the truth. The C.,?ueensland Government, taking advantage Mr. IH:CKER: It may be the truth up of the position, are using that to show to a point. increased stamp duty revenue. vVhen we consider that the Government expect to The 'freasurer: It is the truth up to the receive £55,000 by way of stamp dr1ty on the limit, the whole truth. sale of Golden Casket tickets, we appreciate JUr. UECKER: I should like to know whv that here the Gon~nunent have still another the Stat·a Government Insurance Office an;l nice little windfall that will be very handy other Government institutions take up local to the Treasury. nuthority loans at a higher rate of interest. The Secretary for Health aml Home Is it to the advantage of the war effort that Affairs: Are you suggesting that we should they should be attracted by the higher int·cnTst remit it~ rates to augment their funds,. thereby losing sight of the one objective-the war effort'? JUr. DECIU:R: No. I am trying to point These maU2rs hnve to he watched closely. out that this Government are not going to The Secretary for Labour and Industry is han> tile lean time that one would expect sitting back comfortably with a smirk on his during a period of war. On the contrary, face, enjoying the arguments of debate. I they e~re going to have a glorious time. should like to know if his department is doing JUr. Power: It is the duty of the Govern the right thing. \Vas there any ncc· ''As the numbers eRred for exceeded the The Secretary for Labour and Industry: cRpRcity of the Emergency Host~l (the Why did you not come to me privately~ SundRy School) the overflow occup1ed the old Church and RdjRcent Boys' BrigRde ~Ir. DECI{ER: Why should I come to tell Hall where improvised beds were mRde up, the hon. gentleman how to do his job~ 'l'lw and willing helpers did everything possible thing should be apparent. If any unfit man for thP comfort of the old men. is unfit to work, then he should be receiving the pension, not the dole. ''The Minister for Labour and Industry, under whose jurisdiction these Emergency lUr. Power: Of course he should, but the Hostels come, expressed his thanks to Mrs. Commonwealth Government will not give it. Ramsay, her Committee Rnd helpers for this ~Ir. DECKER: An examination of a lot l'aady, cheerful Rnil efficient service. of these men would show that they are fit ''Earlier in the year the Welfare Organi enough to help either the cotton farmers or sation in Bundaberg was called on to dairymen. function as the result of a flood which The Secretary for Labour and Industry: devastated that city. We sent 300 of them into the cotton fields. '' Ther,a are upwards of five hundred and Mr. Theodore: You do not know what seventy such hostels throughout the State, the Government have done. and though not originally intended for such service they are ready and willing to meet J.Ur. DECKER: I know what they have any emergency that might arise.'' done when I see these men collecting their Government .filembers: Hear, hear! doles at the police stations. There are quite a number of them at Sandgate. Some of them lllr. DECKER: On the face of it, it may are not fit, but some of theni certainly are. be described as a very good little circular, When opportunities arc offering for the but I say emphatically that these poor unfor employment of these fit men it only needs tunates who \Vere so nicely housed by Mrs. the assistance and urge of the Minister for Ramsay and her Rssistants wm'a just used as many of them to get employment. a veiled means of propaganda. (Government dissent.) I ask hon. members to read the cir The Secretary for Labour and Industry: cular very carefully. They will see that it Have you had a, talk to them about iH contains seven pats on the back-one for Mrs. Ramsay and six for the Minister, who did lUr. DECKER: I have had a talk to one nothing. (Government dissent.) I challenge or two. One man was very upset when one hon. members opposite to read it otherwise. of his friends went to the Allied 'Works Council and had an examination, but his call The Secretary for Public Lands: You up was postponed, he told me, through the cannot read that into it. influence of the Secretarv for Labour and Industry. • Mr. DECKER: You cannot read any thing else into it. The Secretary for Labour and Industry: That is a contemptible lie. ~Ir. lUann: Where did you get it? Mr. DECKER: That is what he told me. The CHAIRJUAN: Order! I ask the hon. member to address the Chair. There is alto The Secretary for Labour and Industry: gether too much argument and cross-firing If the hon. member will state the name of across the Chamber. his informant, I will ask the Chamber to appoint a select committee to investigate it. Mr. DECKER: I have pointed out that ltlr. DECKER: If the Minister denies this is Circular No. 22. Where are the others~ It shows what is happening, that propaganda the truth of my statement, I will accept his is issuing from Government departments at denial. Government expense and in a time of emer The SECRETARY FOR LABOUR AND gency, when we are asked to save every IKDUSTRY: Mr. Brassington, I want some shilling. The preparation of these circulars thing more on a charge such as that. I say involves time, paper, and money. It is not it is a deliberate, a, contemptible lie. I have good enough. If the Secretary for Labour offered, if the hon. member gives the name and Industry desired to face real problems, of the person, to have a select committee he would tTy to eliminate the dole altogether. appointed and have the matter investigated. That would he worth while. Can you tell me I ask for an apology. any reason why at tha present time industry should be robbed of its key men, thus making The CHAIRlUAN: Order! I ask the hon. it hard for industry to carry on, while there member for Sanclgatc to 'vithdraw those nre instances of fit men still receiving the remarks. dole at police stations? These men could be easily placed on some emergency work. JUr. DECKER: What remarks do you wish me to withdraw~ The Secretary for Labour and Industry: 'fhe CHAIRJIAN: Order! The remarks ::'i" nme some of those fit men. the hon. member used about the Secretary for Labour and Industry. Th'Ir. DECKER: I am not going to name any person. 'rhe Minister is unfair in wanting ~Ir. DECKER: If you tell me what they '}n answer to a question of that sort. are, I will have an opportunity to do so. Supply. [29 SEPTEMBER.) Supply. 379 The SECRETARY FOR LABOUR AND 'rhe Secretary for Public Lands: Prove INDUS'l'RY: The hon. member made a your bona fides by stating the man's name. deliberate misrepresentation when he said I It is dirty politics. made representations on behalf of someone to be exempted from the Civil Construction Corps. Tile Secretary for Health and Home Affairs: It is a slander on the Government. 1\lr. MacdonaM: He was told that. The CHAIRMAN: Order! JUr. nECKER: I withdraw it, but I should like to point ont to the ;\linister- J1'Ir. WiHiams: You came up with the canier ? The SECRETARY FOR LABOUR ANn INUUSTRY: I ask for something more 1Ur. DECKER: Yes. than withdrawal on a charge like that. Jifr. Williams: Then you ought to know The CHAIRl\LtN: Order! I ask the hon. his name. memlJer to '' ithdraw those wonls. }Ir. ll.ECKER: I know his name and I can give it. )fr. IlECKER: I have withdrawn those ~ - ·-- - - . . \Vorcts. 1. \Vlll ;JUSt say rras, 1. KllO\V a earrrer ·.rne t:.~:LuliiviXi:~: uruer! in the 8andgato area,-- }lr. HECKER,: I do not wish to cause Tlle SECRETARY FOR LABOUR AND any stir in this Chamber, but I do think that INn US'l'RY: Has a l\Iinister in this we should all be fair. We hear a lot of talk Chamber-- about equality of sacrifice. If we are abso The ClLHRJfA::'I': Order! lutely fair in equality of sacrifice then we should view it in its proper perspective and The SECRETARY I<'OR LABOUR AND see that that sacrifice is equal so far as it is INDUSTRY: I had a charge levelled in our power to do so. against me by the hon. member I ask for an apology, not withdrawal. On the one hand, we have the army, navy, and air force-the men who have volunteereil_ The CHAIRlUAN: Order! I ask the hon. for all the services-and then we have the member for Sandgate to withdraw those words militia men who are in a different class, doing unreservedly. great work with the A.I.F. They are all on a clefinite fixed salary; they are not members l\Ir. UECKER: I withdraw them unre of a union in the army, and they receive army servedly. I thought I had done so before. pay and allmvance. On the other hand, we 1 am quoting a new case now. have members of the Civil Construction Cor·ps, The CHAIRlUAN: Order! The hon. mem and men in inctustry forced to join a union, ber must withdraw and resume his speech. and they enjoy union rates of pay and over time. Again,. >ve have the farmer and he gets lt'Ir. HECKER: I am resuming my speech. no benefit by extra price of his product. He TI1e SECRETARY FOR LABOUR AND has to make a sacrifice. Ho is not able to INDUSTRY: Mr. Brassington, with all due obtnin lalJour nnd he is getting only a low respect to you ana your ruling in this matter, price for his products, and we talk of equality I have had a very serious charge levelled of sncrifice. Have we no starting point~ against me by the lion. member for Sandgate }Ir. Jesson: We have not talked about and I a&k for an apology as well as a with the landlords. drawal. 1\Ir. DECKER: I am talking about the Jl'Ir. Nimmo: How can he apologise when \Vorkers. I think something should be do~e he said he only hoard it'l to bring all these classes onto the same basrs 1\Ir. Mann: He is like you; he said, "I of sacrifice, so that all will be equal in that only heard it.'' respect. I know a number of men who c''1listcc1 in the A.I.F., expecting to go into The CHAIRlUAN: Order! serYice units. They had reached the age of Mr. DECKER: I had occasion recently iJ;) or oYer, and instead of being sent to to travel up from Sandgate with a canier who hnitlc stntions thev were sent to a labour has been unable to continue with his business. eorps, nml "·hen they are sent there they He told me he had been called up by the have no chance of getting out. When they Civil Construetion Corps, but his wife was r·o into this labour corps they are paid army not in good health. He assured me that only rat<:'s 011 army time, whereas the men who a week ago he saw the Secretary for Labour enlisted through the Civil Construction Corps and Industry, who got him three months' gd fnll time and overtime rates. There is extension. vVill I withdraw that, or is it right sonwthing grossly unfair in that. vVe talk or wrong'~ nhout equality of sacrifice, but is there any~ Ts it nn:· wonder there is a lot of discontent TI1e Secretary for Labour and Industry: in our community~ Who is this person you are speaking of~ The Secretary for Public Works: You J1'1r. DECKER: A carrier at Sandgate. are not l1laming the State Government or the The Secretary for Labour and Industry: Bnclget for that? I say that is deliberately untrue. I have no Mr. DECKER: No. I blame the Common knowledge of making representations on wealth Government. Under these conditions behalf of any man. >W can never expect the J1eopie of Australia 380 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. to mnkr a full-time war effort. There can the fish lJy auction at the fish markets. If he no £nll-time war effort untn there is there is a scarcity, it will result in a high equality of sacrifice. When we have reached price to the fisherman a111l the consumer will that level, the effort becomes tremendous, have to pay a higher IJrice. If there be a because the efforts of the whole of the people glut, the price will be reduced correspond are behind it. ingly and the consumer will benefit cor respondingly. It is right that the consumer The Secretary for Health and Home should pay a high price for fish when there Affajrs: What do you think of the ceiling is a shortage, if by so doing he is ensuring tax'? That might bring more equality of a liYing for tha fisherman. 'fhe fisherman is sacrifice. not getting the high prices. It is a terrible :Jir. DECKER: Talking of the ceiling tax thing to dive down and tackk the poor fisher reminds me of the ceiling price that is being man, to get the Commissioner of Prices to ln id down at the present time. fix a selling price, particularly in the hard times the fishermen are now having when The Secretary l'or Health and Home they are not only beset by a scarcity of fish Affairs: What about the ceiling income? but have to pay an exorbitant price for nets, r t ought to appeal to you. when they can get them. They are also rationed veTy severely in petrol. ~Ir. DECKER: Mr. Brassington, I am not going· to be rlmwn off the track. I say The Secretary for Public Works: What that no :Federal Government, whether National percentage do the fishermen get of the con or Labour, are WDl'th their salt unless they sumer's price~ bring about equality of sacrifice by all the people. I maintnin that we should have com I!Ir. DECKER: There is a way in which pulsory savings so that each and every one it should be tackled. \Wuld be making an equal sacrifice. Until JUr. Pie: We tackled it here last year. 11·e adopt such a system we shall not be able to marshal our fullest effort. Nothing is JUr. DECKER: I think the auction price Pctnn l; it all goes by grace and favour-most for fish in the markets should be the price of thn things that are worth while, and that the fish mean to the fisherman and the con ,:lwnlr1 not be. We do not get a full-time sumer's price should be a small allo·wance over 1\'Dr effort. the price the fish bring when sold by auction In rcgnrd to ceilings, I wish to take advan- at the fish markets. 1age of that interjection to say how surprised 'l'he Sem·etary for Labour and Industry: I wns to see the prices fixed bv the Commis What percentnage woulcl you suggest~ sioner of Prices for n1ullet and "tailer. I think it. is a hsolutcly wrong to adopt that system lUr. DECKER: The Minister has had w1th the fisherman, becaus·e we know the exlwustive experiments made. They have cut fisherman does not get regular hauls of fish. off the heads and eleaned the fish and know H 0 takes them in season, and even if the the loss of weight incurred. They also know s0a son is good the conditions of the calling that a fair margin should be allowed to the :tre such that he is entitled, if any man is retailer of that fish. I leave it to the hon. 1o the basic wage. He should be 'in receipt gentleman to do it in that way, inasmuch as of the basic wage at least, but when there all the facts are available to him. is a shortage of fish and the demand exceeds 1 he snpply, the price to be paid by the con The Secretary :I' or Labour ami Industry: snmer is not Taisccl. It appears to be some Would you say a fair price to the fisherman Loih· 's hnsiness to intervene and force the ;youlcl be a price higher than that which he f'nn,missioner of Prires into a position of received for 1938, 1939, and, 1940 ~ That is what he is getting. He is getting a higher Axin~ the selling prices for two of the main price than he received in thos·a years. y~ri0ties of fish-mullet and tailer. Tlw Se~reta:ry for IA!.bou:r aud Industry: JUr. DECKER: You cannot fix it on years. Do you thmk the consumers should be payin()' In those three years he may have had a very 1s. 9c1. a lb. for mullet~ · "' lean time. l'ITr. IlECJCER: The hon. gentleman has The Secretary for Labour and Industry: lost sight of the angle of the fisherman's out He made a Jiying in those tln'Ce years. look in considering the high price to the con li'Ir. DECKER: There is a difference sumer. For instance, to reduce the argument between living and existing. Frequently, a rea 11? to nn absurdity: if only one case of fisherman only exists. Very few make a decent fish came into the markets to-dav and the living, and it is a shame that mor·e considera demand lnlS for 1,000 fish,. he WOUld expect tion cannot be given to them. It is the aim that 0110 case to bri11g a tremendously high of the department to control the prices of price. \Youlcl he not expect the fisheri:nan 'to foodstuffs aml mnkr them available to the get a hig price for thnt one case9 public cheaply. That is all right; but, if at I!Ir. nunstnn: WOlllc1 you justify 20s. a the same tima you are doing an injury to the ilsh or :my price at all, really' producers, there is something ;uong. By fix ing the ceiling for fish you are injuring the ~:rr. DECKER: I cannot see anything at fisherman, just as by fixing the price of milk :1ll in the interjection. The fisherman should you are penalising the dairy farmer, if it is he left entirel:;· alone. It is a case of supply below the cost of production-if it is so low ancl demand. The fairest system is selling that it does not give him sufficient out of his Supply. [29 SEPTEl'ilBER.] Supply. 381 produet to enjo;;· a decent standaTd of living. for I would see that it was stopped immedi crhe same applies to onions, potatoes, oT any ately. Your remarks are the best illustration thing else that goes to the market. It is my of a parliamentary Fifth G'olunl'nist that I firm belief that pric·a-fixiug, in an endeavour know. to satisfy the public, is doing an incalculable The CHAIRlUAN: Order! The hon. mem amount of harm to thu producer. It does ber sought information from the Treasurer not matter so much to the public, because at and it was given. I ask the hon. member to the present time they have the benefits of the continue with his speech. increased basic wage, overtime, and a multi plicity of jobs to go to. 'rhere is very little, Mr. DECKER: I have another question if any, poverty in the city, and they would to ask. \Vhy clid the price fixer give a pledge welcome the opportunity to pay for these to the milk producers that he would give an products at least a sufficient price to ensure increase and then fail to give it until three a decent living standanl to the producers or four months after the date of the promise~ whether fishermen or- primary producers. We Tile Treasurer: I am not so sure that a re taking the w1·ong means to the end. For an}' such promise was made, so how can I instance, the price of milk was fixed and an answer the question~ increase of 1d. a quart was granted to the warm-milk vendors. Does that compensat·e lUr. DECKER: I should like to refer now them when, at the present time, as we know, to level crossings. With all the surplus they are in the throes of a dry period->Yhen reYenue that the railways have, and in view a bag of lucerne chaff costs, roughly, 10s.! of their difficulty in finding avenues for dis Approximately 10 kerosene tins of chaff go to posing of it, I suggest that more attention the bag, which ·works out at approximately 1s. should he given to level crossings. I bring a feed for the cow that produces from 1 this matter up to-day because of the fatal g·allon to 1:'! gallons of milk. accident that happened at Sandgate last week. "Unfortunately, our second doctor, All these things are appreciated by the Dr. Rharpe, was struck by a train when cross ( 'ommissioner of Prices, who promised the ing Palm A venue level crossing and killed. dail'y farmers an increase some months ago. This is not the first fatal accident at that I should like to know who exercises influence crossing. Over the last 10 or 15 years there over the Commissioner of Prices, and who it have been five or more fatal accidents there, is that prevents him from giving the increased ;mcl perhaps a number of others in which the priees he lmmvs to he necessary and have people escaped either uninjured or with l >Pen proved by figures and investigation to slight injury. l>C' wnl'l'antecl. ·who withholds those increases 1t >~·onld not require much expenditure on fl'om the producers' Tt is not Mr. Lindsey the Government's part to make that level himself. crossing safe. 'rhere is a house with a The Secretary for Health and Home num!Jcr of mango trees there and those trees .\.ffairs: Are you suggesting he is grafting? obscure a good deal of the inward track . _\re you suggesting that somebody is paying No matter how carefully one approaches l>im not to r1o his job honestly~ that level crossing, and even if the train wJ,istks. there is always clanger in making 1\Ir. DECKER: No. I think that someone the crossing, because of poor visibility. I Hot appreciating the position of the primary suggest that the matter be taken up seriously, ]n·or1ncer, someone who is more interested in at least for this particular crossing, with a the price to the public than the cost to the view to seeing if we cannot prevent further Jn·orlucer, someone who is afraid in the loss of life or injmy by putting up some increlise in the cost of living, someone who wn1·ning sig'n, even if it is only the waving thinks that that increase might be detrimental arms with the hell. It may even be necessary to his political party, is influencing him, and to resume the house or some of the property T think it is time that some action was there to give clear vision. t;1 ken to do justice to the producers. The Secretary for Labour and Industry: The Treasurer: If you will make a Thnt iR the method. yon would prefer~ r1efinite charge about the price fixer we will JUr. DECKER: I am not particular as to h:m' it investigated. which it is so long as it is made safe. It 1\fr. DECKER: am not making a is in the interests of the travelling public <"iwr~'e; T am asking for enlightenment. All that it should be made safe. It was T ask is-and perhaps the Treasurer can .-cry sacl that we should lose Dr. Sharpe, ans>Yer it-who controls the price fixer in the because we had onlY two doctors in the fix in~,' of prices~ whole of Snndgate. 'vve are left now with one r1octor to cater for the »·hole town. We The Treasurer: Certainly not the State could not afford to lose Dr. Sharpe, and r:rF<>rnmrnt, if that is >Yhat vou are perhaps if we had. tnken p;culier action to insinuating·. The price fixer is a 'common haYc that le.-el erossing made safer for ,,.r, lth officnr ami he is governed by an A et ncon1e nsing it. his life might have been , , f 1'11 T 1iament. snYed. I an1 ln·ing·ing the matter forward in nH sprion,•wss. hoping· thRt the Railway J'\[r. DECKER: Is there any outside Depnrtnwnt >Yill be able to clo something. illfll'enec that hn~ a bearing on his actions~ Tlw Secretary for Health and Home TJHl Treasurer: Not that I know of, Affllh'S: There are signs at the approach ;llH1 1 ,:hall be glad to hear of it if there is, to the crossing. 3R2 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Questions. :iUr. DECKER: No, there is only a fixed lUr. DECKER: Yes, and the policeman ''stop'' sign. and his wife. The Secretary for Health and Home The Secretary for Health and Home Affairs: The law compels people to stop Affairs: The Government are doing the hefore entering where there is a ''stop'' "-ork as fast as they can. sign. J1Ir. DECKER: These policemen are Mr. J)ECKER.: I have been over the t1oing a gTeat job, antl I hope that the work crossing many times, and I know that one is of prO\'ic1ing shelters will be cxped:tccl ~R always afraid to stop, and that eYen when mnch as possible. one does stop to look ont for a train one's vision is obscured. Even when one decides l'rogre'.s reported. to go forward, one is in doubt whether the The House adjonmccl at 5.15 p.m. line is clear. JUr. Ha yes: But there are signs there. lUr. J>ECKER: There is the fixed " stop " sign, but the vision is obscured on both sides of the crossing. lUr. Hayes: If the people stopped, there would be plenty of time to avoid danger . .l\Ir. DECKER: It is a simple matter for us to argue here that the crossing is safe. The Secretary for Health and Home Affairs: 1'\o level crossing is safe. lUr. DECKER: Well, fairly safe. A cross ing like that is really a death trap, and one has to see it to realise what it mea11s. Dr. Sharpe ·was an intelligent man, a careful driver, and he was absolutely sober. He was crossing the line to attend a patient on the other side, and it was unfortunate that the train struck the extreme rear of his car. Had he travelled another foot he might have escaped death. If such an accident conltl happen to an intelligent man and a wreful driver such as Dr. Sharpc one can imagine the danger that lurks at such a crossing. If something can be done to eliminate or minimise the risk it should be done. I do not think the cost would be very heavy. There is only one other matter I desire to \'entilate, :mcl it is to n!"cntion that air-raid shelters or shelters of some kind should be provided at the Sandgate police station, and for that matter at all other police stations in the metropolitan area. I nndcrstand the matter is in the hands of the Secretary for Public Works, and I call attention to it in the hope that he will see that such shelters are provided at police stations. I know that they are provided at a number of them, but I am drawing pointed attention to the fact that no shelter has been provided at the Sandgate police station. These men are entit led to some measure of protection, the same as anv other section of the corn community. · The Secretary for Health and Home Affairs: We are doing the best we can, but labour is short. :rtir. DECKER: I hope that the pro gramme of work is progressing. Tlte Secretary for Health aml Home Affa.irs: It is. 'l'he Treasurer: Is there a residence there~