Youth in Dialogue Prevention is key November 2007
“Leading today” The Youth Community Dialogues were held in Soshanguve, Gauteng; Mhluzi, Mpumalanga; Lerome, North West; Giyani, Limpopo; Galeshewe, Northern Cape; KwaMakhutha, KwaZulu-Natal; Thaba Nchu, Free State; Mthatha, Eastern Cape; and Langa, Western Cape. Introduction
he Nelson Mandela The communities were: Foundation and 46664 ◊ Lerome, North West TCampaign together ◊ Mhluzi, Mpumalanga held nine Youth Communi- ◊ Thaba Nchu, Free State ty Dialogues around South ◊ KwaMakhutha, KwaZulu-Natal Africa between November ◊ Langa, Western Cape 11 and November 30, 2007. ◊ Galeshewe, Northern Cape The dialogues encouraged ◊ Mthatha, Eastern Cape youth communities to empower ◊ Giyani, Limpopo themselves in the fight against ◊ Soshanguve, Gauteng HIV/AIDS, by finding ways to deal with their problems through engagement and debate. Close to 5000 youth from around the country were engaged in discussions around factors that put them at a greater risk of HIV-infection, including youth pessimism, peer pressure, transactional sex, women abuse, stigma and discrimination, social marginalisation and poverty. The dialogue series targeted youth aged between 16 and 24 in townships and rural areas, a group often neglected by awareness campaigns. As a principle, the dialogues were not prescriptive and the communities set their own Community dialogue in Galeshewe, Northern Cape. agendas. Young people were encouraged to participate and own the process. Each community offered unique challenges and solutions to factors contributing to the spread of HIV/AIDS in their area. The dialogues would not have been possible without the help of numerous partners. The Nelson Mandela Foundation would particularly like to acknowledge the contribution of Cool Ideas and Ochre Media. In this booklet, the dialogues held at Mhluzi and Soshanguve are highlighted as case studies. Schoolchildren attending the dialogue in Mhluzi, Mpumalanga.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Contents
Foreword Page 5 About Community Dialogues Page 6 Key Observations and Learnings Page 8 Informing Future Dialogues Page 12 Dialogue Summaries: Lerome Village Page 15 Giyani Page 16 Mhluzi Page 17 Thaba Nchu Page 18 Galeshewe Page 19 KwaMakhutha Page 20 Mthatha Page 21 Langa Page 22 Soshanguve Page 23 Case Study: Mhluzi Mhluzi Youth Talk Page 24 Key Issues Raised Page 27 Interview with Themba Page 29 Interview with Maleke Page 31 Interview with Mlu Page 36 Voices from the Community Page 38 Case Study: Soshanguve Soshanguve Youth Talk Page 40 Key Issues Raised Page 42 Group Interviews Page 46 The Role of Media in Social Mobilisation Page 52 Using Arts to Mobilise Communities Page 55 Reflections: Looking Towards the Future Page 59 Ambassador Close-up Page 61 General Reflections Page 62 About the Nelson Mandela Foundation Page 63
The text in this booklet is an edited version of the Youth Community Dialogues, which took place throughout the country in each province during November 2007. Special thanks to our donor, Hasso Plattner, for making this project possible and to Cool Ideas for their key role in the dialogues.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Foreword Achmat Dangor CEO, Nelson Mandela Foundation
n a world character- That is why the Nelson ised by what has been Mandela Foundation, 46664 called “information and a number of partners I chose to support dialogue Achmat Dangor. overload”, the paradox is among young people, that those who are most facilitated by young people can be stimulated externally, vulnerable to HIV infec- for young people, within their but ultimately it comes from tion often do not have the community settings. within. knowledge they need to These dialogues are Of course knowledge protect themselves. summarised in this publication. by itself is not power; it It is our hope that it captures is though a crucial step the fear and anxiety about towards self-empowerment. Perhaps this is because of the the things that make youth There is no better strategy way information is conveyed vulnerable to AIDS, but also than having young people and mediated. Young people the dynamism and energy that themselves facilitate these especially are bombarded emerges when they engage vital conversations. We intend with messages; well meaning with each other around some ensuring that this first round and earnest as these are often very complex issues. Let us not of community dialogues will in their injunctions to youth forget that AIDS is rooted in be repeated in many more to protect themselves, they human sexuality and therefore communities and among do not always translate into in human behaviour. Changing many, many more young knowledge and awareness. this behaviour, where it is risky, people throughout the country. About 46664 6664 is Nelson Man- the HIV/AIDS pandemic and HIV/AIDS dela’s global HIV the underlying issues that and draws AIDS awareness impact on the disease such as upon an 4 poverty, the lack of education, extensive and prevention campaign. It is a South African- gender inequality, lack of global access to health facilities network of based independent, not- and the denial of economic ambassadors for-profit entity wholly opportunities. and owned by the Nelson 46664 achieves its objectives celebrities. The 46664 team. Mandela Foundation. through outreach campaigns Through in Africa and beyond, as well the Community Dialogues The 46664 campaign is as through the staging of initiative, led by the NMF’s a South African initiative multi-artist concerts, sports Centre for Dialogue, 46664 to inspire individual and and entertainment events and plays a vital role in challenging collective action towards an fundraisers. The campaign young people to review their AIDS-free world. At its core, uses the universal connecting knowledge about and attitudes the campaign is about bringing power of music, sport, towards HIV/AIDS, and to hope and inspiration to all entertainment and celebrity to work together to find effective affected by HIV/AIDS. Thus, educate, engage and empower local responses to deal with the 46664 raises awareness about those infected and affected by pandemic.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE About Community Dialogues Mothomang Diaho Head of the Dialogue Programme, Nelson Mandela Foundation
lot of responses to genuine reflection HIV and AIDS to of individual date have focused and community A concerns which on raising awareness must ultimately be using various messages. incorporated into Whilst there is value in local plans and this approach, efforts subsequent national must also focus on com- plans for action. The munities taking respon- involvement of local municipalities is sibility and owning their critical in ensuring own responses to the that these concerns epidemic. are eventually reflected and acted Our approach to involving upon. communities in this particular The community dialogue series centred around dialogues deliberately encouraging open discussion used arts and the and obtaining commitments media to engage to change that came from young people. The the communities themselves. facilitation teams Mothomang Diaho. The dialogues provided a worked hand-in-hand safe space for communities with Viva Hecate Productions, in communities and to ensure to engage without fear and to which staged an industrial wider engagement. tackle difficult issues head on, theatre production, Khululeka, This form of community thus preparing the way for before each interactive dialogue engagement has been them to decide on the actions session. The play focused on implemented in a number of required in their particular educating youth in a dynamic countries with very different circumstances. and entertaining way about social, economic and political The facilitated dialogues HIV/AIDS, and was a good situations – including those were guided by a clear way to introduce some of the with high and low prevalence implementation process that challenging issues around rates, mostly rural and highly included the identification HIV/AIDS in a non-threatening urban ones. Innovative ways of local partners within and interesting way. of engaging communities have communities (the model works In addition, as part of each to be encouraged to enhance best if it is facilitated by local dialogue event, youth within current responses to the partners), follow-up visits communities were encouraged epidemic. by the facilitation teams and to paint murals on walls with In summary, the inclusive documentation. messages that are relevant in approach we strove to achieve The implementation phase their lives. All the dialogue through the youth community was also followed by a series events were announced to dialogues aimed at stimulating of review and reflection the community through local and sustaining change from sessions with partners community radio stations. within, in order to help all involved with the process. The use of theatre, murals involved understand and The data gathered at and media together helped to adopt the message, “It’s in our these dialogue sessions is a facilitate meaningful exchange hands”.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE HANDY FACTS
Young South Africans want more information about HIV/AIDS, and they are open to receiving this information from a variety of sources, including the media. Most young South Africans are knowledgeable about HIV/AIDS prevention and treatment, although small but still significant minorities hold misconceptions about some aspects.
Large majorities say they would like to have even more information about various aspects of the Participants in the Langa dialogue. disease such as how to avoid getting HIV and how to talk more openly with parents and other adults about HIV/AIDS. The media (including radio and television), as well as national HIV/AIDS prevention and awareness campaigns which utilise media, are highly regarded as effective ways for young people to learn about HIV. When asked which sources they trust the most for information about HIV/AIDS, at the top of the list are experts like doctors and scientists (87%), national HIV/AIDS prevention and education campaigns (85%), HIV positive persons (80%), and parents (79%).
Overwhelmingly, young South Africans think that broadcast media has an important role to play in HIV prevention. Nine in ten say TV and radio can help reduce the spread of HIV/AIDS by focusing attention on the sexual behaviour, attitudes and traditions driving the spread of the epidemic.
An overwhelming majority think the media are doing a good job communicating with young people about HIV/AIDS, and many report personally taking action as a result of what they’ve learned from radio and TV programmes. Large majorities say that TV and radio are generally doing a good job communicating about HIV/AIDS (96%), and that TV or radio has had a positive impact on their own understanding of HIV/AIDS and related sexual behaviour (89%). Half say they talked with a partner about safer sex, and more than four in ten report that they decided to change their sexual behaviour as a result of what they learned about HIV/AIDS from the media. Nearly a third of sexually active youth say they got tested for HIV as a result of what they learned from a media programme.
Young people are in favour of more HIV/AIDS messaging in the media, including messages that are hopeful and inspirational, as well as those that contain straightforward HIV prevention information. Eight in ten agree that there should be more HIV/ AIDS messaging and programming on radio and TV, and large majorities agree that messaging should be hopeful and culturally relevant, tap into young people’s aspirations, and offer straightforward information about how to prevent HIV. More than six Participants in the KwaMakthutha dialogue. in ten (63%) say that messages about fear and death turn young people off. Source: “Young South African Broadcast Media and HIV/AIDS awareness: Results of a national survey”, The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation and SABC, March 2007
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Key Observations and Learnings From the Youth Community Dialogue Series Final Report from Cool Ideas
Group discussions in the Lerome Community Hall, Lerome, North West Province.
oung people the further spread of HIV by socio-cultural, political and living with HIV getting young people to use economic environment and existing resources at their the extent to which they are Yand AIDS-affected disposal. adopted by local leaders and communities are often The dialogues also provided community members. The overlooked. Projects tend a space for re-considering Youth Community Dialogues to focus on adults living the developmental needs of included the local communities with HIV. young people living with and central leaders in HIV and AIDS in resource- mobilising the interventions. poor communities, informed The social mobilisation Recognising this, the Nelson by their experiences and strategy encouraged local Mandela Foundation, through priorities. The partners learned responses with the purpose the Youth Community through the nine dialogues of ensuring that communities Dialogues, began an that it is essential to build on claim HIV and AIDS control ambitious project that directly and strengthen communication approaches as their own, addressed the impact of HIV at the grassroots level in order ultimately enhancing their and AIDS on youth between to link with wider advocacy implementation. the ages of 16 and 24 years of and social mobilisation and The Youth Community age. Instead of prescribing to tackle inequity and the drivers Dialogues were driven by local them what to do, the project of HIV and AIDS. participants as mobilisers and put the responsibility into It appears that the success advocates, ensuring that local young people’s hands by of HIV prevention approaches priorities are addressed and emphasising prevention. The is influenced by how they that the dialogues will have an approach is aimed at reducing are adapted to the local impact in the long term.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Social mobilisation strategy Target population Youth between the ages of 16 and 24 in townships and rural areas Areas covered Lerome (North West); Mhluzi (Mpumalanga); Thaba Nchu (Free State); KwaMakhutha (KwaZulu-Natal); Langa (Western Cape); Galeshewe (Northern Cape); Mthatha (Eastern Cape); Giyani (Limpopo); Soshan- guve (Gauteng) Communication channels Interpersonal, small group, media, arts and traditional methods of communication Purpose To persuade young men and women to participate in the Youth Com- munity Dialogues with a focus on preventing HIV/AIDS
Interpersonal Communication The Nelson Mandela Foundation employed implementing agency Cool Ideas to establish relationships with local non- governmental, political and governmental organisations in targeted areas. Local contacts were used to assist in organising the dialogues, including community development workers, people living with HIV and AIDS, ward councillors, youth leaders, church leaders and other community leaders. The local leaders View of Lerome, North West Province. also assisted in securing suitable venues. ◊ Non-profit organisations radio stations in all areas Face-to-face interventions ◊ Shops where events took place. were also used to persuade ◊ Shopping malls Interviews were broadcast on the target audience to attend ◊ Schools the following community radio and participate in the Youth ◊ Tertiary institutions stations: Community Dialogues. ◊ Soshanguve: Soshanguve Community Radio Community Radio and Radio Small Groups Stations TUT Small group interventions Community radio stations ◊ Lerome: Radio Mafisa and reached: were utilised through Radio Lethlabile ◊ Public libraries promotional spots, and ◊ Giyani: Radio Univen ◊ Community clinics e-mail lists were used to ◊ Mhluzi: Greater Middelburg ◊ Churches invite the target market to FM ◊ Ward committees attend the event. Continuous ◊ Galeshewe: Radio ◊ Workplaces announcements and pre- and Teemaneng ◊ Youth formations post-event interviews were ◊ Mthatha: Unitra Community ◊ Public events broadcast on community Radio
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Galeshewe participants came from the surrounding areas.
◊ KwaMakhutha: Imbokodo KwaMakhutha. Stories on all terminals, distributing the A5 Community Radio events were covered by all invitation leaflet and talking ◊ Langa: Radio Zibonele local newspapers. to locals about upcoming ◊ Thaba Nchu: Mosupatsela More than 10 000 A1 posters dialogues and the importance Community Radio were distributed. These posters of participation. Articles on the events were were placed in strategic areas, Word of mouth was published by community including schools, churches, also used as a strategy to newspapers in Mhluzi, junctions, taxi ranks, shops, persuade the youth to attend Galeshewe, Thaba Nchu and public phone booths, taxis and participate in the Youth and taverns. These were used Community Dialogues. One of the dancers at the KwaMakhutha dialogue. to capture attention. On the Loudhailers were used to morning of each event, tear- attract the participants to the drop banners were placed to dialogues. remind the target group that the event was scheduled for Partnerships and the day. Collaborations These were established with Traditional Methods the public and private sectors Invitations were sent to as well as civil society, using various stakeholders, their influence to attract an including: audience. In certain areas ◊ non-profit organisations the SA Police Service and ◊ churches municipal traffic officers were ◊ schools engaged. In Giyani, Mhluzi, ◊ tertiary institutions Galeshewe, Mthatha and ◊ youth organisations KwaMakhutha, the ANC ◊ ward councillors parliamentary constituency Cool Ideas teams “blitzed” offices assisted in mobilising taxi ranks and major bus communities.
10 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Province Area Number of Participants North West Lerome 380 Limpopo Giyani 550 Mpumalanga Mhluzi 371 Free State Thaba Nchu 289 Northern Cape Galeshwe 750 KwaZulu-Natal KwaMakhutha 463 Eastern Cape Mthatha 411 Gauteng Soshanguve 300 Total 3514+ Activity Coverage Participation and problems are; they also recommendations and/ Participants came from had an opportunity to make or declarations on public government departments, recommendations with regard murals after each dialogue. nonprofit organisations, to HIV and AIDS. The murals depict the 46664 schools, tertiary institutions In Mhluzi and Soshanguve, “It’s in your hands” emblem and youth groups. 20 young offenders and serve as a continuous The Youth Community participated in the dialogues. reminder to the local youth Dialogues offered young These offenders gave the about their commitments. The people and communities audience insight into the dialogues have provided the in the selected areas in all challenges and problems of Nelson Mandela Foundation nine provinces of South HIV and AIDS that they face in with experiences and insights Africa an opportunity to correctional centres and how from young people and raise their voices on what they tackle the issue. will be drawn on in future they think their challenges Participants wrote their initiatives. A view of Giyani, Limpopo Province.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 11 Informing Future Dialogues Paddy Nhlapo Sipho “Paddy” Nhlapo of Cool Ideas is the programme co-ordinator for the Youth Community Dialogues
he social mobili- to Soweto. In sation approach Mpumalanga, included going everyone would T go to either through databases of Nelspruit or people working in HIV Witbank, the and AIDS, community key areas that development and organ- people know. ised youth formations If you go to across the country. North West you would go We had to develop to Mafikeng or relationships, without Rustenburg. We promising any returns chose a place financially or otherwise, but that was 70km we had to cover the costs of away from local resources that assisted Rustenburg, our team and give a stipend of a village that some sort as 90% of the people no-one knows we work with as Cool Ideas about: Lerome. are unemployed youth and Where’s that? young adults. Right next to Paddy Nhlapo. The advantages of working Sun City. That with local people include community is We say “It’s in your understanding local dynamics highly affected, but there’s hands” as a community to and ensuring that you reach no movie house, there are no do something about HIV and the right target audience. Local sports grounds. For young AIDS in your area or with resources provide intelligence, people, the only external people you know, you grew up insights and advice in shaping activity is sex and getting with, people you are intimate a localised intervention. The drunk. with, people who are close to dialogue programme would There is only so much you. not have been a success had it that we can do on television The stories vary from one overlooked local people and and on radio, but our focus place to the next. In Lerome, organisations. is to engage communities they have a huge issue around directly. When we engage youth facilities and in Giyani, Choosing Small Towns them we don’t come to preach what comes out very clearly First we look at the number to them. We bring the play is training. Young people are of activities that go into an that highlights issues around saying, “Give us skills, then we area. We look at loveLife, the HIV and AIDS and then will do whatever we need to Department of Health, who communities engage and say do on our own.” does what in those areas. what their problems are locally We choose areas that are not and what they think is the Community Leadership saturated. best way of dealing with their It is important for local For example, everyone goes problems. leaders to be at events, so they
12 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE View of Mthatha, Eastern Cape. can take on these things. We Because they know how struggle, we didn’t have the facilitate, saying “You know to solve these problems, but technology that we use today. how to do these things, but we it’s only when you’re there I remember in my days in the are reminding you that this is that you get to know that United Democratic Front, we the way.” So, we are saying, people have solutions. Then would form street committees. “In African culture this is how you probe it. We’re not an Our townships were the safest things used to be, we used to implementing agency, we’re places, you never heard of sit around under the trees.” just the catalyst. house break-ins. There were That’s why in our dictionaries street committees, we were we have lekgotla and imbizo. Empowering so organised, but maybe it’s These words emanate from Communities because our enemy was easily our origins and this is where What we’re doing is identifiable. Today, this enemy community issues were dealt empowering communities to lives in the bloodstream of a with, community problems ensure that they deal with their person. But I’m sure that there were solved. So let’s go back to problems and they find ways, is a solution. It’s in people’s basics, “an African solution to resources, within or amongst hands. We don’t have the a global problem”. We are now themselves, to deal with the solution; it’s in people’s hands making that a practical thing. issues. to find that solution. If we could we would This is because people If only we could get extra conduct these dialogues and have a tendency to sit back funding so we could go to say, “Stop your television and and waiting for a funder or many other areas across the your big billboards and engage government or some corporate country and say, “Stop looking communities directly.” Know to do something when they do at someone else, look within, what the person in the street, not search within themselves say what is it that I’m capable what the neighbour, the person to find what they are capable of doing to ensure that I in the shack in the village, in of doing. prevent the spread of HIV, but the farmhouse is saying. If you look at the political also to ensure that I protect
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 13 myself and other people which addressed real HIV and my vision of the future? around me.” If every one of us AIDS issues. This awareness- ◊ How can you best build could take that responsibility, raising component was located upon the assets and strengths you’d begin to see change. in the mobilisation execution of your community? phase, which There is only one expert who helped the target can answer these questions: audiences to the individual to whom these evaluate the questions were addressed. consequences of This is what we learned as a different options. social mobilisation team, as it The Youth kept becoming clearer that we Community would never be in a position to Dialogue brought provide people with answers together divided to their problems. Only when groups of young they come together and discuss people in various issues affecting them will parts of the there be tangible and authentic country to talk responses. about how they We learned that people have could prevent started believing that to win the spread of against the HIV and AIDS HIV and also epidemic in South Africa, they contribute have to start talking amongst individually themselves, whether young or in their own old – and not just any talk but families and talk that involves: communities. ◊ Questioning ourselves The ◊ Listening to others accompanying ◊ Trying genuinely to see Top: Participants in the Langa dialogue. Above: A member of the community speaks in the questions that new angles on things. Thaba Nchu dialogue. young people Generally, we discovered had to ask during that there are distinct the dialogues contributed characteristics of a healthy Key Questions Posed greatly to the success of community. Once young ◊ Who are we as young this intervention. The social people had engaged and people and where do we stand mobilisation teams took no those characteristics were in shaping our own destiny? party-political position on identified and accepted by ◊ What are the challenges any issue but ensured that participants, they began to faced by young people in the dialogues were based see what they have to work preventing and dealing with on honesty and genuine towards in achieving a healthy HIV? situations. community that they could all ◊ How can each young At all the dialogue events be proud of. person participate to mitigate we continued to ask young The BIG QUESTION left the effect of the HIV epidemic? people to additionally address with the communities by the ◊ What is it that we can do these additional questions: facilitator was: as young people in our own ◊ What is it that really ◊ If you could improve one environments and with our matters to me in the social and thing in your community right available resources? political area? now, what would it be? The dialogue programme ◊ Why do these things Wherever we conducted the encouraged young people to matter to me? Youth Community Dialogues, become more aware of their ◊ Given that others disagree we started community deeper feelings about HIV and with me, what can I live with? activism and have truly AIDS through the theatrical ◊ Can those I disagree with embedded the message that performance called Khululeka, see a place for themselves in “It’s in your hands.”
14 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Dialogue Summaries The following section includes summaries of the nine dialogues that were held throughout the country. Lerome, North West Lerome Community Hall, Lerome Village, Rustenburg, North West: November 11, 2007
erome is a mining community situated at the foot of the Magaliesberg near the Sun City holiday resort. Its members are part of the LSetswana-speaking indigenous community, the Royal Bafokeng. dialogue Attendance summary: There were over 250 young people comprising community Lerome members, members of non-governmental organisations (NGOs), community-based organisations (CBOs), loveLife groundbreakers and community development workers in attendance. Summary The dialogue was facilitated by Phistos Molaole, a local HIV and AIDS activist who is openly living with HIV. The dialogue HANDY FACT was open, frank and informative. The young people in Lerome were excited to see the loveLife is a Khululeka play addressing issues they encounter every day. At South African HIV first they were wary of expressing issues that are close to home prevention programme for and opted to discuss more generic problems with HIV and young people; groundbreakers AIDS. The last half hour of the event saw a more comfortable are the organisation’s workers audience who were more willing to say “we” and “I” instead implementing HIV/AIDS of pointing fingers at each other. and lifestyle education The area experiences poverty but is located near a lucrative programmes. mining operation and Sun City. Hence female youth in the area have found themselves in a vulnerable position in which they trade unprotected sex. Commitments ◊ “We should go into the mines and re-instil a sense of moral code to the irresponsible mineworkers.” (Leonard, 21) ◊ “We need more youth facilities in the area. Soccer grounds, youth centres, cultural halls, etc.” (Julia, 32) ◊ “We need to have facilities where young people are encouraged to do some acting and drama classes, so they can establish careers and use the platform to carry out positive messages.” (Clement, 21) Dialogue participants in Lerome.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 15 dialogue summary: Giyani, Limpopo Giyani Giyani Community Hall, Giyani, Limpopo: November 13, 2007
iyani is a conserva- tive community Gthat subscribes to customary practices. For instance, a young person cannot talk to an older person unless instructed to do so. Stigma around HIV and AIDS is rife, talk- ing about sex is taboo and people with AIDS are still ostracised. The youth have not organised themselves to have platforms at which HIV and AIDS issues are discussed. Young people are insensitive to HIV and AIDS messaging for fear of being stereotyped.
Attendance There were over 550 young people and older community members, members of NGOs, CBOs, loveLife groundbreakers, community development workers, the ANC Youth League and youth clubs. Summary The dialogue was facilitated by Top: Discussions at the Giyani dialogue. Lesley Nkosi with assistance Above: A view of Giyani showing the poster that advertised the event. from an interpreter and advisor from the district Department of Health. A language advisor/translator was hired for the day to overcome some language challenges. Young people vowed to get talking about sex and HIV and AIDS. The older youth will talk to the younger youth about sex in order to protect them from its dangers and the younger youth will in turn look up to the older youth for exemplary behaviour. The youth identified poverty as the main cause of youth becoming vulnerable. The effects of dogmatic cultural norms are evident. The participants want to turn cultural weaknesses into strengths, becoming role models for each other. They will also encourage dialogue with their elders about such issues such as sexuality, sex and HIV.
16 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Mhluzi, Mpumalanga St Peter’s Lutheran Church, Mhluzi, Middelburg, Mpumalanga: November 15, 2007
dialogue he Mhluzi community adheres strongly to custom- summary: ary practices. The stigma around HIV and AIDS is Mhluzi Twidespread and people living with HIV and AIDS are detested. Young people are conscious about HIV and AIDS messaging, but would not dare tackle the subject openly for fear of being labelled.
Attendance About 380 young people comprising community members, members of NGOs, CBOs, loveLife groundbreakers, community development workers, local municipality representatives, Witbank Correctional Facility and Middelburg Correctional Facility offenders and warders attended the dialogue. Summary In the initial stages of the dialogue session, the youth were wary of expressing issues that were close to home, but the discussion soon got heated and they started arguing about problems in a forthright way.. Offenders from local correctional facilities talked about accountability and young people appreciating what they have and being responsible. A poem by one of the offenders touched the audience. The stage was used to seat the audience, giving a grandstand effect, which proved more intimate for the youth as they faced each other and seriously engaged on issues. Commitments ◊ Talk more to each other about HIV and AIDS. ◊ Encourage each other to be more ambitious and not lustful. ◊ Look after each other as brothers and sisters and abstain. ◊ Empower parents with information on how to be better role models. ◊ Maleke, 17, says: “Young people have the responsibility to live for a freedom for which those before us Top: Participants at the Mhluzi dialogue. have fought and died. It’s in our Above: Group discussions at the Mhluzi dialogue. hands!”
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 17 Thaba Nchu, Free State Moroka High School Hall, Thaba Nchu, Free State: November 17, 2007
waqwa and Botshabelo are small but densely populated areas, with low levels of employment. dialogue QPoverty leads youngsters to desperate acts of es- summary: capism and self-destruction. Young people are in such Thaba Nchu denial that when the 150 young people attending the dialogue session were asked if they knew any infected people in their community, fewer than a handful put up their hands.
Attendance 289 people were in attendance. Summary The community dialogue session was facilitated by Lesley Nkosi. In the initial stages of the dialogue session, it seemed as if people had been instructed not to talk. After a few ice- breakers, the floor was opened to comments and questions. The youth said that young girls deliberately fall pregnant in order to access the R400 A view of Thaba Nchu. a month child-care grants paid by the government. Young people do not support other young people’s initiatives to create HIV and AIDS awareness. As a result of this, there are no youth organisations in the area. Parents and other adults stigmatise infected people and curse their actions, saying they deserved it. Young people will not publicly admit they are infected. Young men don’t test their HIV status, but rather try to find out through their partners’ results. In the group interviews, a more intimate account of the youth’s challenges came out. Poverty was highlighted as the main cause of youth becoming vulnerable. Commitments ◊ Keneilwe, 17, says she will go out to the taverns with posters she will make and get the youth out of taverns and away from shop corners, and back into the community. She will get them to talk and act. ◊ Other young people have vowed to get tested and know their status. ◊ Others will support those infected and affected.
18 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Galeshewe, Northern Cape Kimberley Community Hall, Galeshewe, Northern Cape: November 20, 2007 dialogue summary: Galeshewe aleshewe suffers from rife alcoholism and a high rate of teenage pregnancy. The older generation Gdo not talk to their children. It is not uncommon to find 12-year-olds getting drunk and spending their evenings at taverns.
There is pressure to be seen in the latest trendy clothing, sporting the most expensive sneakers and carrying the latest mobile phone. Peers consider these assets as the greatest achievements in their young lives. Young girls exchange sexual favours with older men for money. Attendance Over 750 people attended, with some having to stand in the 600-capacity hall. The enthusiastic crowd comprised community members, members of NGOs, CBOs, loveLife groundbreakers, community development workers, educators, members of the ANC Youth league, etc. Summary This dialogue was considered the best of the series, not only because the youth were passionate and engaging, but also because of the pace at which the issues were exposed and the strong commitment the youth showed to stopping the spread of HIV themselves. The Youth Noted ◊ The culture of alcoholism is crippling the youth. Either the elders are too drunk to listen when their children reach out, or the youth are too drunk to heed the messaging, which they admit is everywhere. ◊ Dialogue among the youth should be encouraged. ◊ Youth need to shift their energies from trying to impress each other and work on their dreams. ◊ Homosexuals are part of the community, too. They are part of the problem and want to be accepted as part of the solution, too. ◊ The church should play a role in HIV/AIDS issues and stop pretending people are not dying. ◊ The elders should also stop pointing fingers at young people; they need to take their place and start guiding young people in life. They should stop considering sex talk taboo because whether or not they want to admit it, young people are having sex. Commitments ◊ Young people are tired of standing on the sidelines and waiting for someone to do something about AIDS, so they are all committed to changing behaviour. ◊ Young people need to be proactive and engage in community activities. The community of Galeshewe. ◊ Dialogue should be encouraged.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 19 KwaMakhutha, KwaZulu-Natal Phumelele Community Hall, KwaMakhutha, Isipingo, KwaZulu-Natal: November 22, 2007
buse of women and children is rife in this Aregion, where there is a myth that sex with a virgin cures HIV/AIDS. Alcoholism is common in this small com- munity and older people are not held accountable for their drinking habits.
Conservative and rigid cultural stereotypes limit dialogue and communication. It is one of the worst-affected areas in the country Participants in the Phumelele Community Hall, KwaMakhutha. and young people are keen to talk about solutions here. There is a gap in communication between young people dialogue and the elders in the community. Young girls exchange sexual summary: favours with older men who give them money. KwaMakhutha Attendance 850 people crammed into the 800-capacity hall. Summary The dialogue was facilitated by Lesley Nkosi. 46664 brand ambassador Thembi and her boyfriend, Melikhaya, were there to encourage those who are already infected to have hope for a whole future with HIV as young people. Three people stood up and disclosed their HIV-positive status. It was an advantage to have SA Police Services and NAPWA (National Association of People Living with HIV/AIDS) representatives at the dialogue, especially when a woman who had been raped was crying out for help and they offered to assist. The Youth Noted ◊ There is no peer pressure if you know who you want to be and you focus on your dreams. ◊ Alcoholism is a culture here, and it is the main cause of irresponsible behaviour that makes HIV spread quickly in KwaMakhutha. ◊ Government cannot expect young people to work for free to address HIV issues. If they are paid, they will give their all in the fight. Commitments ◊ Young people must create network support structures so they can discuss solutions to the problems they face. ◊ Young and older people’s values and attitudes are a concern and they must change. ◊ Encourage elders to start talking about HIV/AIDS.
20 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Mthatha, Eastern Cape St Paul’s Catholic Church, Ngangelizwe Township, Mthatha, Eastern Cape: November 24, 2007 dialogue summary: Mthatha his is one of the worst-affected areas in the country. Women and child abuse is rife in this region and the Tmyth that sex with a virgin cures AIDS is prevalent. Conservative and rigid cultural stereotypes limit dialogue and communication, and elders rarely talk to their children about sex.
Attendance A disappointing crowd of 90 attended. Attracting a young crowd on a weekend to a “clean” fun event proved challenging in Mthatha. Youth preferred going to parties and taverns than coming to the aggressively promoted Youth Community Dialogue. Summary The dialogue was facilitated by Lesley Nkosi. The audience received the messaging positively and embraced the idea of coming together and fighting together. The few youth who attended did not approve of the youth community’s behaviour and wanted to do something about it. The Youth Noted ◊ Youth in this township have sex at an early age, which creates a lot of social problems. ◊ Young people also indulge in heavy drugs at an early age. Ngangelizwe Township, Mthatha. ◊ They take cocaine and other drugs that put them at risk, like crack cocaine, which they take with shared syringes. During the group interviews, participants gave far more intimate details (these are paraphrased here) ◊ “Girls my age like to do things they are not ready for. They don’t listen when they are told to abstain and they carry on being promiscuous. This spreads HIV because they refuse to use condoms.” ◊ “Another problem in this community is that boys have no respect for girls at all. I was kidnapped by boys I knew a few years ago. These boys were supposed to protect me but they decided to take me to a house where a taxi driver lived and raped me repeatedly all night. They did not use condoms.” ◊ “From now on I want to start talking more, using organisations like loveLife.” ◊ “Young people give in to peer pressure, not realising that they have something more precious than just belonging in groups: their lives.” ◊ “Twelve-year-olds are sexually active these days because of pressure from their friends. This happens because young people have no sense of pride. They do not have dreams of their own.” ◊ “Teenage girls are the ones getting infected with HIV more and that terrified me.”
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 21 Langa, Western Cape Johnson Ngwevela Community Hall, Langa, Cape Town: dialogue November 27, 2007 summary: Langa onservative and inflexible cultural stereotypes limit dialogue and communication, peer pressure Cis a major problem in this area and there is a gap in communication between young people and the elders in the community.
Attendance There were over 400 young people. Summary The dialogue was facilitated by Lesley Nkosi. A number of issues came up around drug and alcohol abuse, peer pressure and early first sexual encounters, and the dialogue was open, frank and informative. The Youth Noted ◊ Peer pressure and drug abuse are serious problems, which help the spread of HIV and AIDS in this community. ◊ Youth have sex at an early age. “Most of the kids in my class have had sex and are not even ashamed to show off about it. It puts us at great risk.” (16-year-old) ◊ Drug and alcohol abuse puts young people in great danger of infection and spreads the virus in the community. When you are drugged and drunk, you are not aware of what happens to you, especially as a young woman. Young people are exposed to abuse at a very young age. ◊ HIV affects everyone. ◊ “I must not only start talking but also advise young people and adults around me about all the dangers of HIV and drugs.” (21-year-old) ◊ “Our behaviour has to change and it starts with me!” Participants in the Johnson Ngwevela Community Hall, Langa.
22 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Soshanguve, Gauteng Galala Community Hall, Soshanguve, Gauteng: November 30, 2007 dialogue summary: his community suffers from alcohol and drug abuse. Soshanguve Poverty makes youth desperate and vulnerable, and Tyouth recreational facilities are limited. There is also a prostitution problem in the area, where young girls are said to be prostituted by older women.
Attendance Over 300 young people comprising learners and educators, community members, members of NGOs, CBOs, loveLife groundbreakers, community development workers, criminal offenders and guards from the correctional services facility and other interested youth attended the dialogue. Summary The dialogue was facilitated by Lebo Ramafoko, the “agony aunt” on the 46664.org.za website. The youth noted that issues of peer pressure and drug abuse are serious problems which help spread HIV and AIDS in the community. They said that youth have sex at an early age and that it’s important that impressionable minds are fed positive influences. The Youth Noted ◊ “There is a brothel in one of the houses in Soshanguve, I have not personally seen it, but it is said to be run by women. They prey on young, impressionable girls of 12 years old and upwards and sell their bodies to dirty men looking for a little fun.” ◊ Youth today lack passion and drive. ◊ Poverty is the main cause of this behaviour. This is because young people do not have the confidence in themselves to avoid being influenced by petty things. ◊ “We must not bore young people with lectures about HIV and AIDS since they’ve heard it all before and still do not take heed. We need to adopt creative means to get through to them, like poetry. We can also reach out to them by going to schools and use these creative vehicles to send positive messages of self worth.” (Pulane, 21) ◊ During school holidays, young people mill around taverns because they’re bored. They find themselves indulging in dangerous substances like nyaope (a mixture of heroin and dagga) and alcohol. The Galala Community Hall, Soshanguve. This promotes irresponsible behaviour where they have sex without condoms and they don’t even remember. They lose control and end up raping each other. ◊ Parents don’t talk to their children and that crucial break in communication makes the youth swim in dangerous pools of irresponsible behaviour. ◊ “Government has to intervene in this community and work with young people. Perceptions have to be changed.” (Zack, 20)
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 23 case study: Mhluzi Case Study The following section is a Case Study on the dialogue that was held in Mhluzi, Middelburg, Mpumalanga.
‘It’s in our hands’ – Middelburg youth highlight HIV/AIDS issues
outh Commu- as fast as the car of that name Mokgoapkama hurries back nity Dialogue Pro- goes), or “three letters” when inside to capture his second gramme engages referring to the virus. HIV/AIDS-event story of Y “People just don’t want to the year. “These awareness youth in small towns talk about it,” says Martin campaigns are still considered across South Africa. Mokgoapkama, 26, a reporter soft news,” he notes. from the Middelburg Herald. It’s 1pm and about 30°C in “We still have a mentality that Engaging the wider Mhluzi, a township just outside ‘If I attend that awareness community the coal-mining town of [event], my neighbours will Facilitator Lesley Nkosi says Middelburg in Mpumalanga, think that I’m HIV-positive.’” every community has unique South Africa. People melt into Nevertheless, the event is issues that only it can solve. St Peter’s Lutheran Church, reasonably attended, with There are no celebrities, no ushered in by the loudhailers of most of the church’s pews VIPs at this dialogue event. the local police announcing the filled with the target age group The VIP area has been taken upcoming dialogue on HIV/ – 16 to 24-year-olds – as well as over by prisoners and wardens AIDS as well as by promotional a smattering of older folk. from the nearby Witbank inserts on the local radio Mokgoapkama says he correctional services facility. station, Greater Middelburg doesn’t know the infection rate Unshackled and dressed in FM (GMFM). The Middelburg in the town and event is the third event in a has never written series of community dialogues an article in funded by the Nelson Mandela which someone Foundation leading up to the has spoken 46664 concert on December 1, about their HIV World AIDS Day. status, despite Mpumalanga’s Youth tackling stigma estimated 15% and discrimination HIV prevalence These events don’t come rate. around often, and stigma Inside the around HIV/AIDS is rife: church hall, the locals often use terms such as music begins “Z3” (because it takes your life to blare and Youth facilitator in Mhluzi.
24 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE participants both ask the questions and answer them. The roving microphones filter up and down the rows of people, snapped up by outstretched arms. Nkosi does have a rule though. Before someone can make a point, they have to identify themselves and say “Togetherness”, to which the participants respond “ke ntho e monate (is a nice thing).” Some forget to stand Schoolchildren attending the Mhluzi dialogue. up, to which the participants respond: “Uzivese sikubone matching suits, they’ve been Which is Drink more liquor, Expel (show yourself so we see invited to share their stories her assertivity and Force yourself you).” He also encourages with the youth. There are into her ...” participants to use inclusive rumours that the premier may terms such as “we” and arrive, but there’s no waiting It Is in YOUR Hands “us”, instead of “they” and for dignitaries. The event A troupe of 46664 actors begins “them”, to emphasise their begins at 1pm, on time. their play, Khululeka, mixing togetherness. “When you go into it, you’ve humour with contemporary Issues around the future got to be really open-minded beats as they promote common aspirations of the youth come to whatever possibilities there prevention messages. up often, clearly a central can be,” Nkosi says. “All “Can you get HIV from concern for those living on the you’ve got to do is make sure touching someone’s hand?” an outskirts of a small town. that you encourage people to actor asks the audience. “No,” “Be sure of what you want talk about their issues to each comes the resounding call. to be,” says one participant. other and not to me. “Okay, this is a more “Be a first-class version of “We’re taking the difficult one. Can you get HIV yourself, not a second-class responsibility of HIV/AIDS from a mosquito bite?” Yeses version of someone else,” says back to the community and nos compete. “Ahh, so another. Everyone seems to through young people,” he we do have a lot to learn,” the have a catchphrase, a slogan continues. “We’re trying to actor replies. they’re holding onto. establish the unique problems The play ends with with regard to HIV and AIDS instructions on how to put on Sugar Daddies in the communities … and a male and a female condom. The issue of “sugar daddies” then see if we can come up The female condom draws – rich older men who reward with specific, unique solutions whoops of laughter from their young girlfriends with to these problems and then the audience. After the play, gifts and money in return for have the youth make unique Nkosi calls the audience to the sex – is raised. “What I see is commitments.” front of the church. Nobody that girls are easily influenced One of the prisoners, moves out of their chairs. He with a lot of things. Most “Senzo”, stands up and reads pleads again and then finally girls like nice things and like his poem, How could I have been instructs those sitting at the things they know they don’t so irresponsible?: back to take a position on have. They come from poor “I mean, constant, cautious the front steps leading to the backgrounds but they are reminders ran through my stage. A conversion is taking going to look for guys with ignorant skull … / They were place – audience members are cars,” says Tshepo. simple as ABC / Which was becoming participants. “It’s not that girls are abstain, be faithful or condomise / Nkosi doesn’t often ask forward; boys, you’ve got But no, I chose to jump to DEF / questions. In fact, he lets the sweet words so that we
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 25 girls can be pressured,” that we are going to get more Mlungisi, 15, agrees. “The says Hlengiwe. “A guy can information, or get some more first time I knew AIDS it pressurise a girl with anything, details on HIV/AIDS, but we was because of [the child sweet words, you can buy are going to go there because activist] Nkosi Johnson. Nkosi her a gift and if the girl is some stars are going there. Johnson was about to die, or stupid enough they will be “Say for example they was thin, that image is still in pressured.” say Zola is coming, Chomi my mind, that when I have Nkosi says Lerome’s youth is coming, we’re going AIDS obviously I’m going to is focused on issues around there for those celebrities, lose weight, all that pain and “aspiration”, specifically we’re not going there to get everything. youth who have transactional more information or to get “It was introduced as sex with men who work in enlightened.” this disease, as a killer, as a the mines. “The guy is going She says a public talk show murderer, that if I have HIV/ out with six other girls in the in the community would be AIDS, I’m already dead. It community, but because you better. “But I do not want would be better if I kill myself. can buy me nice shoes and them to come and point It was introduced as a killer, nice clothing, I don’t mind … fingers … rather than them not as TB [which is treatable].” But these guys also have the performing, they should The organisers have power to say, ‘why would you speak about their experiences, purposefully chosen small want me to wear a condom, and they shouldn’t make up towns and villages in South don’t you trust me?’ You could experiences,” she says. Africa for these dialogue imagine with older people, Themba, 16, says HIV/ sessions, in the hope of they don’t believe in using AIDS messaging creates fear making meaningful impacts in condoms.” in some minds. “Although often neglected places. they were “We wanted to choose areas trying to voice that are not saturated,” says out or they programme manager Sipho were trying to “Paddy“ Nhlapo. “Who funds sell the idea to projects here? If you find five, people [about you will be extremely lucky. the dangers of “There’s only so much you AIDS], it made can do on television and on them scared. radio, but our focus is to engage Instead of communities directly. When we making them engage them, we don’t come conscious of it, to preach to them. We bring they are more the play that highlights issues scared of it.” around HIV and AIDS, and Themba then communities engage and Youth facilitators in Mhluzi. and Maleke say what their problems locally host a show are and what they think is the on local radio best way of dealing with their Getting the messages (sponsored by the HIV/AIDS problems.” through non-governmental organisation In a smaller session after loveLife) that discusses issues the main dialogue, Nkosi that concern young people Youth Keeping the interviews a group of in the area, especially HIV/ Promise teenagers. Maleke, “17 AIDS. “I’m trying to make it A mural is painted on a public turning 18 next year”, tells appealing for them to accept wall after each event. As the him that celebrity-driven it, for them to be keen on it team leaves Mhluzi for their music “bashes” in their area because they are running next small-town destination, don’t work to drive behaviour away, because of the way we a local artist paints: “Put change. “People … we … will introduced it to them [as] a yourself first; practise self- go there not having an aim killer disease,” says Themba. control; be …”
26 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Key Issues Raised
done nothing wrong. It’s our HANDY FACT case forwardness, and yes, I admit, The South African we are forward. What I’m National HIV Prevalence, study: saying is that as girls going HIV Incidence, Behaviour and Mhluzi after a man who’s 38, what are Communication Survey, 2005, you expecting from that man? commissioned by the Nelson Secondly, a 38-year-old man Mandela Foundation with doesn’t love you, he just wants additional support from the US Bathabile to make you a trophy for the Centers for Disease Control and From everything you’ve learnt time being. And you want to Prevention, found that of all new HIV from the show, we understand say no to him when he wants to infections, 34% occurred in young that the people who are more sleep with you, when you were vulnerable to HIV are women. the one who went after him people in the 15-24 age group. The Maybe you can tell me or in the streets? We girls must HIV incidence among women in the explain to us why it’s like that, also use our brains and think age group 20-29 was 5.6%, six times why is it so? because you’re going after an higher than in males of the same old man, the next thing you’ll age (0.9%). Among young people in Veronica cry rape and you were the one the 15-24 year age group, women My answer is that amongst the who went after him. accounted for 90% of all recent HIV young people or the community, infections. it’s because poverty is there Tshepo In Sub-Saharan Africa, almost 61% and then it’s the pressure from What I see is that girls are easily of adults living with HIV in 2007 friends. Amongst friends, if my influenced. Most girls like nice were women. Source: UNAIDS friend is dating a guy with the things they don’t have. They 2007 AIDS Epidemic Update new Golf 5, and at home we come from poor backgrounds have no bread, and my friend but they are going to look for eats at KFC, I also adopt and do guys with cars; these guys HANDY FACT those things. are sugar daddies. And this Sugar Daddies puts them at risk of getting Sex in exchange for money Phindile HIV because they want things The thing is according to my they can’t achieve rather than or goods is often referred to as understanding and the way starting their lives afresh. “transactional sex”, suggesting a I was taught at loveLife, we short-term encounter for short- women are carriers of this thing Precious term financial or material gain. because it stays inside us. I You’ll find that a child 16 years Being unemployed results in mean, our body parts are inside old is dating a 25-year-old. I needs for basic items such as so this virus also lives inside; mean, come on, if you are 16 food or money. Sexual exchange it’s inside so that’s why you years old, what do you talk provides a means for survival. find that we also spread it. The about with a man who’s 25? Economic dependence on a sooner you know it the better. And most of the time we do sexual partner may also be that because we’ve got peer disempowering in relation to HIV Thuliswa pressure and that kind of prevention. Source: “Concurrent I would like to defend our stuff. We’ve also got this thing sexual partnerships among fathers [older men in the that someone with no car is a young adults in South Africa“, by community]. I’ve been hearing Yellow Pages [The Yellow Pages Parker W, Makhubele B, Ntlabati about fathers who are 48 business directory slogan is “let P and Connolly C, 2006 and 38. These fathers have your fingers do the walking”],
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 27 HANDY FACTS you get what I’m Why are women saying? Yes, we more vulnerable to want sugar daddies infection than men? because my friend is wearing Levi’s • Biological factors: The and I also want to vaginal lining is more wear Levi’s. susceptible to infection, so unprotected vaginal sex is Phindile more dangerous for a woman Sometimes you than for a man. don’t want to test • Social factors: Women have and then you go less say in when, how and ahead having sex An audience member participates in the Mhluzi dialogue. without knowing with whom they have sex, your status and in is trying to make a life for their and women in relationships that way you spread HIV/ kids, what if this happened to may not be able to negotiate AIDS. your parents, you wouldn’t like for monogamy or safer sex And then there is a point it, get me? practices. Women are also made about sometimes a victims of sexual violence and person likes bling-blings, these Hlengiwe domestic violence. Women nice cars and these expensive With most of us, there’s a lack are less likely to have a say in cellphones. Sometimes you do of communication between what kind of HIV prevention have a choice to say no, but parents and their children. And methods they use when they the problem is you are being then, when a 16-year-old child do have sex. There are few pressured to do these things. is sleeping with a 38-year-old safer sex methods that are Imagine someone like me, let’s person, how do you feel? And female controlled, and none say I’m 16 years old and then you are a young child getting that can be used without her the person, maybe the one who into a Golf 4 of a man with a partner’s knowledge. drives the Golf 5, is 48 years six-year-old child, how do you • Economic factors: Because old, I mean there’s nothing I feel? women in South Africa can tell him because firstly this And Tshepo, I just want to person is older. tell you that it’s not that girls and single mothers in are forward, boys have got particular are economically Richard sweet words so that we girls disadvantaged, their Okay you girls, let’s say you’re can get pressured. A boy can access to health care is dating someone with a car, pressurise a girl with anything, compromised. Women in you love this person because you can tell her sweet words, violent relationships are of the car. When he leaves the you can buy her gifts and if the also limited in their ability to car maybe and he takes off the girl is stupid, she will do it. leave because they have few jewellery, what do you then Girls are not forward, it’s economic resources. Poor see? Do you still see something that our backgrounds are women have less access to in him, something attracting not the same. One can be information and resources you to him? pressurised by a friend and one that will help them make You guys, most of the time thing for sure is that we come informed choices. HIV- there’s a lot we can do but what from different families. I have positive women who are poor we do is sit at the street corners. girlfriends, they pressurise me also cannot make healthy We smoke, a mother walks by to date a guy who’ll buy me lifestyle choices or access and you trip them and take Levi’s. If you’re going to laugh their money; when you think as a girl and make excuses, you drugs that may keep them about it, this person was just will pressurise yourself and healthy for longer. making a life for their kids, they be pressurised but when you Source: http://www. are a parent, isn’t it? So what is say “No I don’t want to,” your womensnet.org.za/hivaids/ good in that? Let’s stop this not “no” must be clear. Don’t mince aids.htm using our brains. This person your words.
28 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Interview with Themba, 16
Themba Les My mother is a caregiver; So people in Mhluzi are scared she works in home-based of HIV? case care; she usually takes care of those people infected with Themba study: HIV/AIDS and in my view, Yes they are scared, because of Mhluzi especially in Mhluzi, I feel the information that they got. like HIV-positive people are isolated. Les There is some sort of Who are they getting messaging that has been isolation of those people. information from? coming? Due to the fact that AIDS was communicated badly, it Themba Themba was not appealing to people. The media and everything. Yes, because it is not appealing, I still believe that the first Listen to me, the way they take it from me, it is not time AIDS was introduced to introduced it, it made people appealing. people it was, I don’t know, scared. it made people freak out. It They were trying to sell Les gave a misconception about the idea to people that AIDS What messaging can be HIV/AIDS, it changed their kills, but it made them scared. appealing to us young people perception. Instead of making them in Mhluzi? What can we hear? I so much believe that conscious of it, they are more perception determines the scared of it, that’s the problem. Themba reception. That is how most So people in Mhluzi, most of I mean in most cases you speak of the people receive people them are afraid because of the about HIV/AIDS and you give with HIV/AIDS, in a way that misconception they have. it to us as a problem. I believe isolates like that. It is because the youth have been influenced of the knowledge they have on Les by the information that they HIV/AIDS, it is not appealing. They freaked out from the got from the media and everything so I believe that you need to make it appealing, I don’t know how. You could organise some sessions to talk about HIV/ AIDS, organise some artists for a bash and make it funky, make it appealing for young people to be attracted. So the most vital thing that you should consider is to make the information appealing, that’s what we need. Les This is a lovely point but you keep saying “you should, you Community dialogue advertising in Mhluzi. should” – who’s “you”?
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 29 try to break it down need anything? to the level of young people and speak their Themba language. Media, publicity, that’s what we need. Currently radio, but Les the idea of loveLife, of radio, Whose problem is HIV? is not well sold to people so we need media because Themba most of the young people are It’s everybody’s fond of TV, the internet and problem, it is my everything and I’ve never problem because seen anything concerning even though I’m not HIV/AIDS on the internet. infected, I’m affected I mean I’ve got a cellphone, as well so it means with files and games and I’m also involved everything but there’s no Participants in the Mhluzi dialogue. whether I tested or I information about HIV/AIDS. didn’t test, whether I’m Themba positive or negative, but it is Les Okay, let me just generalise: us, also my problem and it is my So you’re saying technology or we, me. responsibility to stand up and could have more content? fight against HIV/AIDS at the Les same time. Themba That’s what I like to hear, I like Technology, thank you very to hear you saying that this is Les much, that’s what I was what I have to do as a young How can I make a difference looking for, technology. person in Mhluzi. at home? How can I make a difference in my home, my Les Themba community and my life to Did you hear what the guy That’s what we are doing, I make sure that HIV/AIDS from the municipality said? mean on radio, as they’ve said, does not end up dictating the He said the fact that he is there’s a loveLife programme, life and the death of young there means he’s showing a every Tuesday and Friday. We people in my community? commitment and that they do speak about such issues; are committed to making sure we discuss issues that concern Themba that they are helping youth in young people, especially It’s really a nice question, I this community to deal with on the side of HIV/AIDS. must say. I believe as a young HIV/AIDS issues, their door So that’s what I’m trying to person, there’s one thing is open. do, because I now see the that I believe in. I have to be So I’m just saying that as problem; it has not been at their level for me to get a matter of fact you must appealing to young people, so their attention. As a person always remember that the as a young person, I’m trying who’s well-informed about door is open. Go there, go to to make it appealing, for them HIV/AIDS, in most cases I the municipal office, go to to be keen on it. can speak to young people the mayor’s office, the mayor at school about that because of Middelburg, and say this Les that’s where we find young is what we need. We need to What else can you do to people and that’s where these have access to technology, we make it different, to make the things are emerging from. I need to have access to young messaging more receivable don’t need 1000 people, if I can people, we need to have to young people and in your change three lives I’ve made a access to more media. personal capacity, what do you big change. We have a community think you can do? radio station, we need more Les facilities and stuff like that, Themba What resources do you need maybe you can use those I can get information and to make those changes, do you platforms.
30 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Interview with Maleke, 17
case or these concerts is changed, Maleke study: then we’ll see a change in our Yes, exactly, now there’s a community. loveLife saying that I like Mhluzi Say now for example, using: “if you are not talking to rather than them saying that your child, who is?” So parents these people will come here have a huge influence on us Maleke and perform, they should because they are role models. I We are shying away from say that we’re going to have grew up under their influence, speaking about HIV/AIDS. a talk show and we’re going they speak to me, they are the You see, HIV/AIDS in our to have celebrities community is something or people who are which we never talk about, it is in the media or taboo. people who are in I’ll make a practical the public eye and example. When one goes to they are going to be shows, say at that show they involved in that talk are going to address the youth show. or they are going to address And the people the community or the society who are going to at large and they are going to organise those speak about HIV/AIDS. kinds of events People will go there, we will should make sure go there, not having an aim that the people who that we’re going to get more are going to talk information or we’re going to or are going to be Maleke. get some details about HIV/ hosted at that event AIDS, but we’re going to go should be the youth, because it ones who instil morals, values there because we know that is appealing for me if someone and principles within me, but some stars are coming. of my age comes to me and it is up to me whether I intend says that I’ve had this kind to keep those morals, values Les of experience, this and that and principles. What I’m hearing from you is happened. However, I do believe that that the messaging, some of And also I believe that in if we empower the youth, we the vehicles that are being used those kinds of talk shows we should also empower parents to grab our attention as young should include parents because because it doesn’t make sense people, like for instance having we cannot empower the youth to empower the youth and big concerts and stuff, they while at the same time we leave parents behind. They are not working the way that leave behind [parents], you get should accept that these kids they should. They are taking what I’m saying? are a different generation. attention from the messages We’ve got issues affecting us, and the attention is going to Les we’ve got teenage pregnancies. the entertainment. Yes, it’s difficult getting HIV/AIDS is one of the killers through to the parents. How do that kills the youth in South Maleke you handle the issue of respect, Africa and coming to think Yes, however I do believe that the level of communication about it, if we the youth are if the set-up of these shows with old people? dying of HIV/AIDS then who
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 31 will look after this country? it is time for me to … you HIV and AIDS doesn’t affect know there is this thing called only the government, HIV/ Les transactional sex, you know AIDS doesn’t affect only older Who are going to be the that? people, it doesn’t choose, it leaders? You provide me with doesn’t matter whether you’re things, materialistic things, young, it doesn’t matter Maleke then I sleep with you, just like whether you’re old, you’re Exactly, I like that saying that that. At that time it is simple rich or you’re famous, you’re there was a time when we because I’m enjoying the life, poor, HIV/AIDS is HIV/AIDS. had to die for our freedom but I’m living the life, I’m talking I do think that we do not take right now we need people who the life and everything is things seriously because we should live for the freedom bling-bling, it’s fine, it’s nice. engage in high-risk sexual that was gained by the people However in the long run I get behaviour. who died then. affected. Les Les I heard you say that you would Infected you mean. like to see, instead of having celebrities come and perform Maleke for you, you would like to Yes, infected, whoo, see a situation where these those words. So it affects celebrities are coming and me enormously and sitting down and talking at the it also pains me that same level as the youth. people, that we, are dying because of a lack Maleke of knowledge. I’d like to see that, however I Participants in the Mhluzi dialogue. do not want them to just come Les and point fingers and say “you Les Do you think there’s a general talk, you talk”. Let’s live for the freedom that attitude of not taking things We’ve got celebrities, say people died for. Now tell me seriously amongst us youth in now they attend, even if they how does HIV or AIDS affect Mhluzi? We don’t take things aren’t celebrities, just people you? seriously, we don’t think it’s who are in the public eye, 10 of our problem maybe? them, make sure that eight of Maleke them are the youth and two of It affects me enormously Maleke them are old people, because because I’ve got people I know Yes, I think that it is because we cannot empower the youth who are affected or infected most of the time when we while we leave behind adults, with HIV/AIDS and some speak about HIV/AIDS, you parents or elders. of them are my friends. They hear someone saying the Rather than them ended up being infected with government should do that, performing, they should HIV/AIDS because of the the government should do one, speak about their experiences decisions that they took. You two, three, older people should and they shouldn’t make know, taking uninformed do one, two, three, churches up experiences, they should decisions and basing your should do one, two, three, speak about things that future on your past. however we as the youth do they’ve experienced because For example, [a person may] not take responsibility for the I do believe that if you have say that because I live in a actions that we take. experienced something shack and my parents do not But if we started taking personally you’ll make a provide for me the way that I responsibility for the actions difference in someone else’s want them to, I want to wear that we are taking, then I life because the very same labels, I want to wear bling- believe that everything will problem or the very same blings, and now my parents change. And we should also situation that you are facing, cannot do that for me, then stop pointing fingers because the next person may be
32 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE facing and with your kind of they shouldn’t just get the stadium full of people. advice and with your kind of information and keep quiet By speaking to my friends, experience, that person may be and in their responding they I’m telling them facts, but also able to get out of that situation. should also let others know in my speaking I shouldn’t that this is what is happening just speak, I should get the Les because at this very moment necessary information, the What do you need to make there are many myths going information that appeals to your fight against HIV/AIDS around about HIV/AIDS, them, I should give them books as a young person? right? Like for example, if that will show them what I am you sleep with a virgin then saying is true because statistics Maleke you’ll no longer be infected change every day. There are Like Themba has said, with HIV/AIDS; it is a myth. new methods found every publicity, because now we However, we know that it is a day of how a person can live are involved in a talk show in myth but there are still people positively with HIV/AIDS. Greater Middelburg FM, they who are saying that it is a fact. are hosting us every Monday Les and Friday. Les They must be informed? I’m a loveLife debater. Yeah, Is it still happening here in I’ve been with the debate for Mhluzi? Maleke five years now, you can hear Yes, so I must be informed with the speaking. Maleke and have the necessary It’s still happening and the information, which is for Les thing that, okay, after having example booklets, then I can All right, so you need to have sex go and shower, then you let them know, then it’s fine. that publicity and maybe you won’t have HIV/AIDS; it is And say remember what will use some of the resources still happening. we wrote there, remember this that have been offered to you, is what we said, you know? like the municipality? Les And every time there’s a new How can you change that as a commitment in your mind, in Maleke young person? your discussion, you can go to Yes, if we do get that I believe that mural, it’s yours. that we’ll reach the youth more Maleke You write those easily and also if we are given As a young person I think I commitments down as young publicity that we deserve, the can change that, given the people but we are taking HIV youth will see that HIV/AIDS platform. However, like into our own hands, it’s in is not something that we Themba has said, I do not have our hands, let’s bring new should shy away from, it is to go around and organise a opportunities in our hands. not a death sentence. It is just a situation which needs to be dealt with. Like the youth of 1976, they fought against apartheid, right? Right now we are facing a new kind of situation, we cannot fight HIV/AIDS physically, however there are things that we can do to fight it. And for us to do them, we cannot do them alone, we need their help and their assistance because I believe in the saying that no man is an island. So for us to reach them, they should also respond, Mhluzi community.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 33 View of Lerome.
Group discussion in Thaba Nchu.
View of Giyani.
34 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Mural in Galeshewe.
St Peter’s Lutheran Church, Mhluzi.
Lerome, Rustenburg.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 35 Interview with Mlu, 15
Les as any other disease where Ja, tell me what’s going on my “I’m affected with TB, I’ll take man, what’s wrong, what’s up treatment and life goes on.” But case in Mhluzi? I’m sure you’ve heard some study: of the people in the dialogue, Mlu they were saying HIV kills. Mhluzi I think one of the problems that You heard the DJ, Solly, saying we are faced with concerning HIV kills, abstain, be faithful, the youth is ignorance. I condomise or you will die. We have AIDS, it’s a disgrace. I think we need to realise that have people living with HIV/ don’t want you as a friend, today’s youth, they don’t care AIDS who are healthy, who are I don’t want you near me. anymore about life, what they happy with their lives. Don’t That’s why, when you asked care about is the short-term take HIV/AIDS as a killer but the question, “can a mosquito time. I have friends, they say I take it as a friend. infect you?” some people must drink liquor, let me drink were saying yes, some were liquor. We don’t think about Les saying no. What I’m saying is the consequences, what that So it’s also a perception in how that we have the information, might bring tomorrow. do we address issues when the media is there, we have Why are we ignoring HIV/ we talk to each other as peers? television, we have radio, these AIDS? Themba mentioned the We must not try to kill each guys are doing a talk show but fact it might be how it was other when we talk, we must the youth are the ones lacking. introduced. The first time I build each other when we talk; They don’t listen to that talk knew AIDS it was because of constructive conversations. show, why, because they say Nkosi Johnson. Nkosi Johnson it’s boring. I know what I’m was about to die or was thin, Mlu doing and what I’m doing now that image is still in my mind And another thing is that HIV, is I must booze, I must go to that, okay, when I have AIDS it’s a stigma. Nowadays, you bashes, but they don’t think obviously I’m going to lose weight, all that pain and everything. So how it was introduced, it was introduced as this disease, as a killer, as a murderer, if I have HIV/AIDS, I’m already dead. It would be better if I kill myself. It was introduced as a killer, not as TB. Les How do we change this now and create a different perspective now that we know that it’s not a killer? Mlu First thing: HIV was introduced as a killer but not Interview with Mlu, Mhluzi.
36 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Participants in the Mhluzi dialogue. of the consequences that will who went and donated their everyone who passes here is follow. That’s why I mentioned services and their money after going to see that this is what a fact that I may booze, I may the tsunami and people were I committed myself to, you do everything but is what I’m able to bring their lives back in know? And then your duty is doing what I planned or what order. going to be made easier, that I wanted in my life or is it Wherever there’s a negative, when you go around talking contributing to what I want to there’s always a positive, but to people, you can always be in future? That’s what we it is how that message is sent refer them back to that mural. should ask ourselves. out. You guys have made now HIV/AIDS is a big problem a commitment to say that in South Africa but people are because you are aware you HANDY ignoring it. They know that can go out and make sure that FACTS HIV, it’s there but they are the message is calmed down a Mosquitoes ignoring it. little bit. cannot transmit HIV or That you can talk to people AIDS. Mosquitoes do not Les and say don’t scare me man, inject the blood of other But it’s easy to ignore don’t freak me out because people they have bitten something that is being one person out of seven into new people they bite. labelled a killer and something people is infected, 2500 people Mosquitoes can, however, that is very difficult to deal every day are getting new spread other serious with. I’d rather not imagine infections with HIV/AIDS. diseases such as malaria what a tsunami’s done to Asia, Don’t come and freak me out, and yellow fever. Humans you know? I’d rather ignore talk to me like someone, let’s thinking about it because I discuss it, let’s find solutions, cannot catch HIV/AIDS see what the tsunami does like we’re doing now, right? from any insects or animals but at the same time if I read You guys are making these such as monkeys, spiders or more articles that I find about commitments, we take these snakes. Only humans can the tsunami, I would find commitments, we put them carry the virus. that there were good people down on the mural over there, Source: JournAIDS
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 37 Voices From The Community
case debates, sports and recreation because later they are under study: and has a life orientation peer pressure. booklet. Near the mines, young girls Mhluzi wait in the veld to prostitute Department of Health themselves. She said this is Margaret Skosana, who works because they don’t have jobs or Social Worker in the municipal Department food. They sometimes do it “on Phindile Mahungela is a of Health, attended the account”, presenting clients loveLife volunteer who is dialogue because “it’s our with a bill at the end of the close to the end of a year-long children – we are listening to month. The men say that the contract with the organisation. them.” money they spend on this sex She said she had learnt a lot She said the department’s is not from their salaries but about “how to take care of HIV/AIDS message extra income from gambling or yourself” but it had been a emphasised abstinence and giving people lifts. challenge. morality more than condom She said the local clinics Some of the six high schools use. “We are trying to offer incentives such as gifts in the area don’t allow loveLife discourage them from being of cooler boxes to encourage to come and work with the involved in sex.” young people to come for learners and some parents It’s important to make sure counselling and testing. They don’t want their children to children have information offer condoms, STI treatment go to the loveLife centre. The about HIV/AIDS when they and information, and prepare organisation offers drama, are very young, she said, patients for ARVs if their CD4 Youth in the Mhluzi community.
38 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE count is below 200. There are also drop-in centres where children can get food for the day. Clinics have lay counsellors and can offer supplementary feeding when mothers don’t want to breastfeed. The Health Department also helps establish food gardens, with starter packs from the Agriculture Department. She said patients sometimes remove any reference to the St Peter’s Lutheran Church, Mhluzi. word “positive” from their clinic cards or health records, is motivation; it is the way to In prison “we talk about it. even if the word refers to show us how to set our minds We won’t be in there for our something other than HIV. to specific goals and to be edu- whole lives, we will go out. (This seems to refer to the wise. When I come out, I do commit stigma of HIV.) “The youth today don’t give myself to preaching about thought to these things,” he HIV/AIDS.” Participants added. Chairperson of the ANC Ida Xulu, an elder in the area, Given, 16, expected Youth League in Mhluzi Ward came to see the dialogue guidance from the dialogue. 4, Ditshego Seloane, says: “We despite the fact that it was “We’ll be getting guidance are not being recognised like aimed at 16 to 24-year-olds. from experienced people who other townships. We’ve been “I called the radio to enquire have gone past the adolescence going around the municipality why was the session only for stage and we want them to to tell them this is what we can the youth. What about the teach us to be like them.” do to develop ourselves but parents?” said Xulu. “I’m Marcus Masemola, 25, we get empty promises. 46664 representing the Mhluzi from the Youth Advisory must come back to develop parents,” said Xulu. Centre and Steve Tshwete us, we want to be a youth of Lindokuhle, 15, works at Municipality, said: “This winners in Mhluzi.” the loveLife centre in Mhluzi, event is to let young people Daphney Mngomezulu, situated at the St Peter’s talk about HIV/AIDS, share a teacher who voiced her Church. “Here in Mhluzi, their views and opinions and concerns at the event, agreed. teenage boys smoke and drink their commitment to fighting “They are defeated because a lot and teenage pregnancy HIV/AIDS. For example, if there are no follow-ups on is rife,” she said. “We’re going young people of before could activities that have been to talk about girls and how to fight apartheid, today’s young started and there’s no monitor prevent pregnancies and about people should be able to fight to see if their projects are unsafe abortions … I’ll talk HIV/AIDS.” sustainable, there are no on pregnancy issues and for “The youth are the future ongoing structures.” them to stop having abortions leaders of our country, I mean, Masemola said he was without their parents’ if they are dead, what are we grateful for the event. “It’s knowledge.” going to do?” very rare to see black young Shadrack, 15, said he After the event, Sandra, people discuss sexual issues; expected to get “education and 24, a prisoner, said she felt it’s good that it’s from within knowledge” from the dialogue. proud to express her feelings South Africa, the youth saying “I want to learn and know how about HIV/AIDS. “We need that.” professionals work and to get to continue preaching the “What’s important was to motivation and get guidance message, until people hear get their views and get them on how to reach our goals,” it. HIV/AIDS is not going talking and participating and I he said. “What’s important down.” think our objectives were met.”
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 39 Case Study The following section is a Case Study on the dialogue that was held in Soshanguve, Gauteng. Soshanguve Youth Talk ‘Togetherness – Ke ntho enice’
Metropolitan Municipality, and some of you parents can’t talk was the scene of riots related to us.” to poor service delivery in There was immediately January 2006. a condom demonstration The youth of Soshanguve by a participant from the case highlighted the problems and community to see if people study: challenges that they face in really did not know how to use Soshanguve their community regarding condoms. HIV/AIDS. One of the participants went The day started with a play as far as highlighting that from Lentswe Theatre and people didn’t know how a he 46664 Youth Heritage Organisation. Hecate, person can get HIV. Community Dia- a drama group, followed “We were on the door- Tlogue Programme with Khululeka, which they to-door campaign and the moves to Soshanguve. performed at all the was events. problem we encountered Lebogang Ramafoko, senior with the youth was that they The last dialogue in the executive at Soul City, was still don’t know how HIV is Youth Community Dialogue the facilitator for the day. contracted,” said Susan, one of Programme was held in a small She made sure that people the participants. Pretoria township, Soshanguve, engaged in discussion about on November 30, 2007. the problems they face around Commitments: The dialogue’s objective was HIV/AIDS and that they gave Tshepiso said, “I would like to encourage young people to solutions to these problems. to open my own youth group participate, own the process, The Soshanguve youth are and I would educate each and engage each other in facing varying challenges, and every girl that you’re discourse aimed at preventing among them stigma, lack of not beautiful because of your HIV infection as well as knowledge, myths and many beautiful thighs, you’re not addressing related social others relating to HIV/AIDS. yourself by wearing short issues. Shermaine, an HIV/ Soshanguve is a township AIDS campaigner, situated about 45km north said that “people are of Pretoria, Gauteng, South condomising but they Africa. It was established in don’t know how to use a 1974 on land scheduled to be condom, that’s a problem incorporated into a bantustan that we’re facing.” bordering on Mabopane in Bathabile said, “As Bophuthatswana. Sotho, young as I am, I like Shangaan, Nguni and Venda watching programmes people (hence the name) were (educational TV) because resettled from Atteridgeville my mom cannot talk to me and Mamelodi. It later became about such things, she’s part of the City of Tshwane still afraid and it’s true, Soshanguve dialogue session.
40 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE A view of Soshanguve. skirts, showing your cleavage, and then again in churches AIDS and what it does to a dating older guys, dating taxi because some of the churches person when you’ve got it and drivers and everything. You don’t talk much about it. I can how you can live with it. The are yourself because of you, commit to start telling some other thing is that what you your confidence, the way you of the youth in churches and can do also to avoid it and stop are, the way God made you. other youth in the community it from infecting the youth. “I am fully aware of the about what’s happening. This We were taught how to live, things that are happening to is reality, this is what we’re and what you need to apply in our youth of today and mostly facing and the solutions to say your life.” it’s the youth that dies. Because what can we do, that’s what I Gontse – “I saw that we are of my friends (I am at a stage can commit.” in the 16 Days of Activism where I am informed) I teach and we mustn’t just end here, them and they never listen,” Reflections: maybe they can call us to added Tshepiso. Tshepiso – “I think you should perform somewhere else. We Tlhologelo’s commitment do this every year to show develop groups and go around was to the ABC message. the youth that when you fall the community, even in crèches, “What I want to commit to pregnant or when you’re HIV and perform there for free. is those three letters of the positive, it shouldn’t be the “We won’t just stop here in alphabet, A, to abstain, B to be end of the world.” our community of Soshanguve, faithful and C, to condomise. Wendy – “For me this as soon as we’ve performed Definitely when I go around I event was a good one like this, wherever we get will tell my friends that there especially for the community money, we will try to go out are only three letters you can of Soshanguve, even if they and go to other provinces to be use in life that you can stick to, didn’t come in large numbers. able to provide the message we which is ABC, that’s the best Next time if you campaign in do with our productions about message, that’s in my heart. In time, and start on time and HIV/AIDS and other issues.” fact anyone that I meet, young change the time to a much Lebogang – “It’s not like or old, those are the words that earlier time, especially for us we’re going to just end it in I can say.” Correctional Services to be one place. We’re going to He added, “I will like to able to bring inmates.” spread the word and through be very much involved in Tlhologelo – “The message our actions, we are going to community projects that that I got today that’s nice, the try and show that HIV/AIDS basically are about AIDS way they explained it about is not right.”
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 41 Key Issues Raised
Lack of Knowledge Zachariah case I have two questions. The first is, do we have ladies’ study: Tebogo condoms? If yes, why are you Soshanguve I’m an offender in Pretoria always making examples with Female Prison. People think men’s condoms only? when someone is HIV or a person says let me not AIDS-infected they can see Susan wear a condom and I won’t them coughing or being skinny We were on the door-to-door ejaculate inside a woman. or having sores all over their campaign and the problem we I think that’s the cause of body, which is wrong. encountered with the youth the spread of HIV. A person You cannot determine that was that they still don’t know thinks that ejaculating causes somebody is HIV-infected by how HIV is contracted and the contracting of AIDS, that’s merely looking them in the they take it as a joke and some why it’s spreading. eye or looking at the physical of them say there’s no HIV features. You need to make until they have it. Beauty sure that person has been I have a suggestion for the tested, before you can make Koketso government. Would it be sure that person is HIV- I want to ask, if as you’re possible to stop distributing positive. saying, condoms are the men’s condoms and distribute solution? Why since there female condoms instead? Shermaine have been condoms until now, Because most men don’t want I’m from Pretoria Female is AIDS not decreasing but to use condoms and now they Prison. We have also been increasing? are infecting us women and we doing door-to-door campaigns women want to use condoms and as we were talking about Betty and they pressure us. At least ABC, we found that people There’s this issue that government should make don’t know how to use a people don’t know how sure there are more female condom. AIDS is contracted because condoms and men’s condoms are decreased. Lesiba I think that another way to make sure we have more knowledge is to have more advice centres. Our areas have been demarcated by wards; if every ward had an advice centre it would be easy to look for information on AIDS. It would be easier than having the government spending a lot of money on festivals.When top artists have been booked they don’t come for free, they want money. Take Participants in the Soshanguve dialogue. that money and invest it in
42 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Youth in Soshanguve, Gauteng. education so that we can have literacy practitioners, people times a day, that person turns more knowledge. who’ll stay in our clinics and it to two times a day. If you The other thing, we hospitals. Another challenge know that you take treatment, must watch out for public is our nurses, our doctors, travel with your pills. And representatives or public they don’t know about there’s this thing that people servants: do they have antiretroviral treatment. with HIV say that they get information? If you go to a money and when their CD4 hospital, it’s not all nurses that Khosi count rises they stop giving are knowledgeable on HIV My job is to do door-to-door, you the money so they don’t and AIDS. in other words we go around take treatment correctly and checking patients that have the money keeps coming. Denial HIV/AIDS and TB patients. They say they don’t get good Gloria Bhekisisa treatment from clinics. When I’ve worked in this community The other thing is that people, they get to clinics and the as a nurse, I did HIV/AIDS let’s stop being in denial nurses see their files and they campaigns in this very because HIV/AIDS is there are HIV-positive, they shout at community around 1988, and it’s killing. The other thing them and tell them that they 1990, 1991. I think some of is that let’s not take this thing didn’t send them to go and get the care workers know me. as a joke, because for 46664 to these diseases they have. You I want to comment because be here, it’s because they saw find that when they leave they this is coming up as I’ve been the role HIV/AIDS is playing don’t give them treatment. listening, the training on in South Africa, so this issue is information on HIV/AIDS very serious. Veronica for medical people. The It’s not that doctors don’t biggest challenge, I think, in Lack of Training know, there’s no doctor who the department of health is to can give someone the wrong speed up training that is going Bhekisisa treatment. People do their own on in terms of using ARV We need training for treatment things, when they say three drugs and updates in terms of
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 43 Participants in the Soshanguve dialogue.
HIV/AIDS because there are each other but if you tell Sugar Daddies/ Money so many changes happening. yourself that you will have self-esteem and that in life Marvelous Experimenting / this is what you want to be There’s this thing with youth, Carelessness by Youth and that myself as a man, I as in, it’s all about money. want to be a good father to Like as youth you have to be Veronica my children, they must grow funky, you have to be vibey, I won’t tell you to stop having up and not get infected with and stuff like that, so people sex, if you are at the stage, HIV and things like that. I now they engage in sex so you’re there, you can’t run want to tell the youth here that they can get something away from it but it’s up to that you must trust yourself out of it if they are black you what you tell yourself, and have an unbreakable sisters, that is. It may be that what you want in life. If you self-esteem. If you see that people are poor, so they have want to die, kill yourself and your temptations are growing, to resort to those things so we’ll bury you, but if you tell please condomise. that they can get what they yourself that HIV exists and do not get at home. you are going to overcome it, Stigma you’ll get over it. Shermaine HANDY FACTS Ephraim When a person is HIV-positive, A 2005 HSRC I’m from Baviaanspoort people shun them, they keep study found that Prison. The youth of today away from them, because 73% of boys aged 15-24 no longer have that African you think that now he’s HIV- and 56% of girls in the spirituality to be able to positive, if they see me around same age group reported abstain until you get married. that person, they’ll also think using a condom during I was incarcerated in 2003 but that I’m positive. South Africa their most recent sexual I haven’t even masturbated is affected with the disease encounter. or slept with another guy. I so let’s work together. We all Source: Department of know these things happen know that one hand helps the Health in jail where guys sodomise other, right?
44 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Parents’ Involvement Tshepiso I beg you, please, it hurts I would like to say to girls who out there, help your mothers, are at the age of 14 to 21, we Bathabile tell them the truth. should respect ourselves and My plea is to our parents. As If you’re young, ask your not date guys who are older young as I am, I like watching mother, it’s not about parents than us, sugar daddies or programmes because my taking responsibility for whoever. He’ll take you to five- mom cannot talk to me about everyone, you must also ask star hotels for a weekend and such things, she’s still afraid. her, face your mother and you’ll be a weekend special It’s still something that scares say “Here’s some tea mom,” and then on that same Sunday, parents to talk to us. and say, “Mom there’s you come back home, back to I would like to plead something I want to ask but square one, you’ll sleep in the with you to talk to us. Yes, I don’t know where to start” same bed, a twin bed, eat the sometimes we don’t listen and and then ask her. Then she’ll same meal, which is maotwana then you give up on us but as be open to you. (chicken feet) and morogo long as you try, there will be a (spinach). point in time where we’ll see Susan that we have to listen to you. As parents, I think we have Veronica You’re our parents, what else a big responsibility to talk You grew up at your home can we do? to our children so that they without couches but why do know that HIV exists, because you want to sell your body Veronica we parents are scared to today to get couches? Don’t I started campaigning from talk to our children because wish for things outside. 2001, door to door, every year. we also don’t use condoms Where you grew up sitting You’re killing your mothers, because we think we have on a bench, be like that. Stop you’re not telling them the steady boyfriends and we are envying, go to school, if you go truth, she bathes you and you married. Such things make us to school you won’t envy. keep saying, “No mom it’s TB.” scared to talk to our children. The community of Soshanguve.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 45 Group Interviews
and AIDS scourge. township] where they belong. case I’m not going to use that Because you get exhibitions word anymore, all right? Make in town and yet the artists are study: it short, I don’t want a long from the townships, but here Soshanguve story, even if you have one in the townships there are not problem that you’ve identified, exhibitions happening and it’s going to go a long way. then we think that the arts are In your community is there for white people. Les anything that you are involved I’ve gone around the country, with? Les I’ve interviewed young people So you’re saying that our between the ages of 16 and 24 Pulane, 21 fight against HIV should about social issues they are I’m organising poetry sessions be approached in the same having around HIV/AIDS in to keep young people away way that youth in 1976 were their communities. from the streets and because approaching the struggle Let’s not talk about AIDS poetry is a form of expression, against apartheid? in the context of South Africa; so they can express their what’s happening here? Tell problems through poetry. Pulane me what you’ve identified as During apartheid, the youth Kind of. I mean we’re going to problems, tell me what you had one challenge and they bore people if we’re going to think the solutions are and tell managed to face it and win. So sit here and say “Do not have me what your commitment is basically I’m all about bringing sex, do not do that.” We can in terms of fighting the HIV the arts back to kasi [the do it through poetry. I mean Lesley in a group interview with Pulane in Soshanguve.
46 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE someone will listen. Stars, can’t wear this and can’t national day it is. I will send If we’re going to sit and wear that. the message across and I do talk about “HIV is this, HIV And then, when someone motivational speaking, in is that,” they’re not going to says have a smoke, they are every programme, in every listen, they are just going to going to smoke because they event, there’s motivational walk in and out. have no confidence, they speaking. So that’s what we But if we do it through don’t see themselves as worth need, we need motivation. dance, poetry and such things, more than that. If we tackle they’re going to stay and listen the mind and show them that Les and the message is going to they are worth it, we are done What is your community come across. with them. involvement? The problem that I have identified is that poverty is the basis of everything. People are not confident, confidence is what we lack and that’s why people can date a grown man and sleep with them without a condom and then contract the disease. That’s our problem, lack of confidence. Les So what you’re saying is poverty is the main thing and as a result of poverty young people don’t have the confidence to look into Zachariah in the Soshanguve group interview. themselves?
Pulane At a young age, at 11, start. Zachariah, 20 Exactly, and now what That child must know “I can I’m involved in a lot of ways; happens is that, I’m thinking always say I don’t want to sports; I teach chess and coach that the solution is to start talk to you.” She must be netball and that way I keep them from a young age, target confident like that. When we them from the streets. them and teach them about are finished with girls, then A challenge that we get is confidence, especially. it’s easy. Guys know that that they play and they play We must start with the when they go to the girls they and then there are no groups girls because they are will get this response and then to play against so these people more vulnerable, because we start with the guys. get bored. they become pregnant and If I see kids playing biologically we contract HIV Les something, I make sure that I faster than men, it’s just a fact. What is your personal encourage them. Sometimes If we can have a programme commitment from here on, I try to find sponsors for at school that deals with in terms of what you’ve them, which is very hard to confidence and teach these identified? do. We lack funds here in kids to be proud even if they Soshanguve. have nothing. The thing is for Pulane confidence to be lost, a child In my poetry sessions that Les grows up not being able to get I organise around here in They lack encouragement, All Stars [shoes] or whatever, the township, I identify the facilities and direction, so they now that child automatically national days, like Heritage find that when they are bored looks down on themselves Day and all that and I theme during holidays, they have because they can’t wear All it in the style of whatever sex?
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 47 Performance at the Soshanguve dialogue.
Zachariah Les Les Ja. Where do they indulge in So once they are taking alcohol alcohol, what kind of places? and drugs, you know, these Les substances, then they are not How old are these kids we’re Zachariah in control of their behaviour. talking about? Most of the time you find them Then they are at risk of getting in passages drinking at night infected. Zachariah and they do like drugs and Because we’re talking about Some are between 16 and 17 things that are bad. how young people get infected and then there are some in my easily. What is the solution to age group. I talk to them and Les this thing? as we speak most of them are Drugs, what kind of drugs? drinking alcohol, so it’s like Zachariah something normal. Zachariah If maybe the government Nyaope. would try to communicate HANDY with the people, I know that Les it’s all over the television, FACT Nyaope, what’s nyaope? but it’s not enough. If they CHILD CARE GRANT would bring people to talk to The child support grant of R200 Pulane the youth regularly, to have a month is payable to a primary You don’t know nyaope? It’s the involvement between us and care giver in respect of a child drug. the government. aged 0-14 years. Eligibility depends mainly on parental Les Les household income, which should What is it? Why do we always have to be be less than R1 100 a month. looking at government? What Pulane is it that you as young people Source: Department of Social It’s a powder, it’s a pill. are doing in the meantime? Development The number of beneficiaries Les Zachariah of child support grants was Mandrax? In the meantime, it is very projected to be 7 879 558 in difficult for people like us to 2007. Source: National Treasury, Pulane go out there, especially in my Budget Review 2007 Yes, it’s Mandrax, it’s so big. community, because most
48 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE of the people in the area are more than it has? What are you Challenges? involved in dating. I talk to going to do from now on? them and as we speak most of Veronica them are drinking alcohol, so Zachariah The first challenge is the fact it’s like something normal. I can try to talk to people that that people know what’s I meet. I make sure that I tell going on but the minute you Les him or her about how bad come and start talking about They tell you that they won’t HIV/AIDS is. Every time you HIV, people pretend that they listen to you. meet someone, before you leave don’t know anything and then So it’s difficult to face a them, make sure that you just make you a fool. They will ask person and tell them that say “Do you know?” Just give you about the myths. When whatever they are doing is him advice on how HIV kills. you go to some of the people’s wrong and they will talk to houses, they will tell you that you the way they want to as Les you’re infecting their house we have freedom of speech And you’re going to focus on with AIDS. and it’s their right, that’s the people that are younger than Women are mostly infected way we live. you because they are easier to with HIV because they are I usually tell the kids I handle? taking care of their kids and coach that you choose for their kids are not telling them yourself whether you live a Zachariah the truth about what’s wrong good life or live an abnormal I’m going to focus on with them, they tell them they life, and by doing that you everybody that I talk to. When have TB. have to ask yourself: how I talk to somebody I’ll make do you benefit from whatever sure that I must talk about Les you’re doing? And if it doesn’t HIV/AIDS because if we’re You are saying the women are benefit you, just leave it and not going to talk about it, it’s HIV-positive? do something that will something that will increase. benefit you. We just ignore it, we don’t talk Veronica about it but if we can talk more Yes, because most of them have Les about it then it will stop. been infected by their children, What is your personal because they take care of commitment now to make sure Les them, bathe them, and the kid the HIV doesn’t spread any Tell me about you, your is not telling them the truth background, what about what they really have. would you like to tell The challenge we get is that me about? most of the young people like experimenting with things that Veronica they don’t know, especially Right now we are when it comes to sex. doing a door-to-door campaign for World Les AIDS Day, I’m a You said experimenting, how volunteer from the do they experiment? Institute of Primary Health (IPH). I work Veronica for Luvuyo, it’s an When a friend tells them “Hey orphanage, and IPH is my friend, sex is good” and an organisation. another one comes and they have a baby and say “Hey my Les friend, getting a child support What are the things grant is nice, I get paid every that you see that month and I’m still a student” put people in your and so the girl would want to Veronica in the Soshanguve group interview. community at risk? also get the R200.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 49 Les and you have weak So it’s like R200 for HIV? What points and don’t is the solution to that problem? know where you’re going, but if you Veronica know your goal, The solution is all about you won’t have any communication and what you problem. Even if a want in life. You must have a person comes to you dream and tell yourself that and says let’s go when you have five dreams, at there, there’s a party, least you must achieve three of if you don’t want to them. go, don’t go. Les Les And then another solution? So they won’t get peer pressure if they Veronica know their dreams? Another solution? Veronica Les Yes. Let’s talk about the problem that young people don’t Les disclose to their parents and And then your they put their parents at risk. solution or personal Youth facilitator next to a poster advertising the You found that the mothers commitment? event in Soshanguve. get infected from looking after their children, giving Veronica HANDY FACT palliative care to children that The issue of poverty, a lot DRUG USE are infected. How can you sort of people complain about “Young South Africans that out? poverty. We grew up with are keenly aware of HIV/AIDS poverty around a lot of as a problem facing their Veronica houses and I don’t see why, generation. Six in ten (61%) It’s all about communication when you eat dry bread you name the disease as the most and you must be free with must complain. It’s not about important issue or problem your children and talk to them poverty, it’s just that there facing people their age in about sex and they must also are people that don’t have South Africa. be free to ask and not say anything and there those who This is about twice as many “My mom is older, when I ask do it intentionally. as the second and third her she’ll beat me up,” you A person knows that at most frequently mentioned understand? So they must talk home we’ve never had sofas and ask their mother what’s but they want to get sofas in a responses (drug and alcohol going on. wrong way. Get them properly, abuse – 31%, and teen go to school and then you can pregnancy – 30%). Lower on Les get that sofa. Point at it and the list of problems are crime What about the young people say “You know what, I have (20%) and unemployment who are experimenting and a certificate for that sofa.” But (19%), followed by poverty trading their lives for child don’t say “I have a certificate (10%), poor quality education support grants, how can you for that man.” (6%), and peer pressure (5%).” sort that out? Source: Young South Africans, Les Broadcast Media, and HIV/ Veronica You, Veronica, what do you AIDS Awareness, Kaiser Family There’s no-one who doesn’t plan to do to make sure that Foundation and South African know about HIV/AIDS. It’s AIDS doesn’t spread in your Broadcasting Corporation, just that listening to friends community? 2006
50 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Veronica what kind of people I’m talking that don’t look to someone else I’ll talk and talk. Every year about. Kids in high school who comes from outside, look I campaign for World AIDS admire them, it’s like a child to yourself. admiring their teacher more Day, just because I know that than their mother, that’s how Pulane every year there’s a change it works, end of story. Now We have to start there and then that they make. From 2001, I’ve because we want the problem we’ll move forward. been campaigning for HIV/ to end we need to use that way. AIDS and every year getting Veronica different information from Veronica I don’t want that always when people. Most of the time I like to there’s a talk on HIV/AIDS tell people that it’s they must expect celebrities. not about a celebrity, You are damaging that someone on TV. person’s mind. I want that always we must try and do Pulane things ourselves and stand on Yes but they don’t get it. our own without these people. Veronica Pulane Let me tell you about We will be involved. me, there are people that like calling me Les or coming to me, Yes, be involved in your especially children. own community, use these Right now there’s a girl celebrities for your own Veronica in the group interview. who got lobola paid out initiatives, don’t wait for to her family, she called someone else. That’s a good me and said, you know solution. You’re right, don’t Les what, you’re my role model, wait for someone from outside Would you like to have the way you live and the way to come and say come and platforms where you can carry you do things. That’s why then you talk. out these exercises for much when you live as a person, longer? you must know yourself, HANDY FACT where you’re from and where “Home Based Care (HBC) Veronica you’re going. is the provision of basic Yes, especially when it comes nursing care needs by formal or to people like you, so that Les informal caregivers to people people can hear our problems. It sounds to me like you’re in their own homes. This service saying that we all have the is available to people who have Pulane answers in our reach, maybe mental, physical, emotional and Can we have influential we should use that as an social needs. people coming because you advantage, let’s not look to There may be situations where you know what, a celebrity can other people to come and be need to clean up body fluids or make someone change. We celebrities or to push. need influential people like Pulane, you have a good blood from someone infected with Lebo. point. Young people are HIV. It is important to use rubber fashionable, and they want to or plastic gloves or other barriers Veronica see celebrities come through such as plastic bags or thick cloth But then still you are a before they can come through. to prevent direct contact. Make celebrity, are you still a But if you can do that, get sure that you have easily available celebrity? those young people in and get at all times.” Source: Department those celebrities, what we have of Health brochure: Caring for Pulane to start saying now is that let’s People with HIV/AIDS Yes, but you must understand start pushing the mentality
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 51 The Role of Media in Social Mobilisation Heather Farquarson Krisen Pather
aking change or no media equity. Globalisation The famous Italian film- transformation may well have extended the maker Bernardo Bertolucci Mpossible often reach of media channels, once alluded to the problem means interrogating a media formats and message with revolutionary films: sense that “we live in a competition, but we still they never quite get to the live in an era in which audiences that they were global media culture”. the development of many intended for but they do get communities is hamstrung by to film festivals. His comment It is this generalisation limited access to appropriate raises issues related to which drives inappropriate media. distribution, content, as well strategies and solutions, which It is in these “media poor” as the sense that not enough in turn lead to organisations communities that limited is being done to reach out to using only mass-market media distribution, coupled those who need information communication models to with poor socio-economic the most. achieve complex behaviour conditions, creates a dire need A cursory glance at our change results. The outcomes for strategic communication African media landscape will are often disappointing. models. Traditional forms of on occasion reveal that mass The solution lies in communication rarely achieve media campaigns do not make understanding that we have the impacts desired. it to “at-risk” communities in
A member of the Lerome community.
52 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE of community and appropriate communication resources (select community radio stations in the areas of the dialogue, community print, murals, posters) contributed to amplifying and extending the reach of the programme. Social mobilisation contributed to giving the campaign a physical presence in different communities and within different constituencies. Through adopting local community spokespeople at the dialogue sessions it further contributed to creating a cadre Kimberley Community Hall, Galeshewe. of enthusiastic carriers of some of the messages arrived at as far-flung areas as intended. able to reach people in areas part of the dialogue process. When the media does where mass media seldom Stigma, discrimination and make it through there are goes: communities with no access to information and sometimes complex social running water, halls without support pose some of the barriers that genuinely electricity and spaces where greatest barriers to the fight obstruct the message uptake. the only media for hundreds against HIV/AIDS – with the This is evident in the HIV and of miles around promoted world’s future generations AIDS landscape where issues washing powder. most at risk. Young people are of stigma, denial, fear and a Social mobilisation is often struggling to find their way in lack of open dialogue cannot used to complement more life, in the context of a global be mediated through media conventional communication epidemic that forces them to on its own. Government’s tools. In the case of the strongly consider each and mass media AIDS campaign Youth Community Dialogue every decision with regard to Khomanani “Caring Together Programme, media was sex, lifestyle and relationships for Life” demonstrated that used to complement and as potentially life-threatening. social mobilisation coupled where possible amplify A lack of dialogue at the with media interventions was the mobilisation. The latter community level is restricting the most likely method to approach was interesting in positive behaviour change. increase message impact as that the content and issues The Youth Community well as contribute to changing emanating from the dialogue Dialogues endeavoured to behaviour. could dynamically inform the increase awareness and engage Social mobilisation can go editorial and participants for youth at the community level. where no medium reaches. the media. Offering young people a voice Face-to-face communication The success of HIV within their own community can reach beyond social and prevention and control in while providing essential environmental barriers, thus Uganda between 1991 and information on the impact of assisting in influencing both 1998, where prevalence HIV and AIDS is in keeping individual and inter-personal dropped from 21% to 9.8%, with the following goals: dynamics. points to the positive impact ◊ Break the cycle of new HIV Consistent with the objective of being able to mobilise a infections and help youth of inspiring change, social community at a grassroots infected and affected by the mobilisation is an effective tool level. epidemic to reach communities and talk In the case of the Youth ◊ Promote ABC (international to individuals in a direct way. Community Dialogue best practice) The dialogue campaign was Programme, the mobilisation ◊ Promote VCCT (voluntary
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 53 confidential counselling and This link between direct social leveraging that WOM. testing) mobilisation and mass media This extension of social ◊ Expand face-to-face – primarily on community mobilisation initiatives into communication and outreach radio – serves to leverage the media focused on the programme support at a the potential for word of engagement of community community level mouth with regard to positive leaders and member ◊ Support an effective behaviour change amongst individuals, civil society integration of mass media youth, in terms of adopting groups and NGOs in order and outreach, to capture the health-seeking behaviours to achieve social mobilisation imagination of youth around and consistent prevention toward the prevention of HIV the world techniques. infection and the support of ◊ Rally and empower South Word of Mouth (WOM) those infected and affected by African youth to break the is a powerful form of HIV and AIDS. silence, encouraging them communication. Studies The challenge remains to do something about HIV have shown that WOM has one of ensuring that mass- and AIDS in order to build a a bigger impact on actual media campaigns cascade positive future behaviour than any other to community involvement Linking community source of communication. through authority and respect dialogue or “community Word of Mouth Media in order to extend and leverage action” to media interventions (WOMM) is communication exposure to the young voices of the campaign served using mass media platforms present. to extend the reach of the that is specifically focused on Social mobilisation amplified awareness campaign and the increasing and affecting WOM. through media will remain engagement of thousands Community mobilisation is an integral part of the overall of young people outside the WOM in action: thousands of communication strategy for the dialogue session catchments people talking to other people dialogue campaign and other but within the appropriate in their own communities. related African HIV and AIDS geographical and cultural area. WOMM is media focused on initiatives.
The 46664 mural in KwaMakhutha.
54 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Using Arts to Mobilise Communities Interview with Hecate Productions
hululeka (Be Free) is based on the Kreal-life stories of people who have lived with HIV/AIDS. The play is hard-hitting yet humorous, weav- ing in the contemporary rhythms of life in South Africa while attacking common myths and mis- conceptions about the pandemic. It is produced by theatre company Viva Hecate Productions performing in the Youth Community Dialogues. Hecate, and was staged at all nine of the provin- Yvonne say, “no, no, but”, because then cial dialogues, kicking They’re based on stories of it defeats the purpose, and also off the discussion people living in South Africa it breaks the stigma, so if people at each. who are HIV-positive. think that, then it’s okay. Richard Frank spoke to Richard Daniel actors Daniel de Lange, Batha- Bathabile, is this your first What we say to them is, we’re bile Mashego and Ronny HIV/AIDS play? not HIV-positive, but if we Maputa, and producer Yvonne were, we would look exactly Kershaw, one of several Hecate Bathabile like this. If we’re managing teams performing around the This was the second time play- the disease we could still look country. ing an HIV-positive person. The healthy and handsome! first time was on a soap opera. Richard Richard Where does this play come Richard And Daniel, what have you from? Do you ever get looked at dif- been involved with? ferently because you play in an Daniel HIV-positive role? Daniel It was written by an actor I’ve done a lot of directing for called David James. He inter- Bathabile educational theatre and for viewed people who are HIV- I hear that it happens, but it industrial and corporate positive and created these hasn’t happened to me. There theatre, and have been work- sketches, and then wove it all was just this one time in Dur- ing for this company Viva together. ban where after the show Hecate for three years now, so people came to us and gave us I’ve been with this play from Richard hugs, [saying], “Oh, you’re so when it started. So they’re true stories? brave.” And you can’t exactly This play has been
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 55 have been able to iron it out. But most of the pupils get the satire about that situation because they know that Jacob Zuma said he was quoted out of context and all of that. Richard You have different versions of the play for different audiences? Bathabile Not exactly, but when we have an older audience, we make the characters older. The two The cultural performance at the KwaMakhutha dialogue. school girls don’t wear blazers, we’ll wear overalls, then we’re workshopped; it was different ging and you don’t want to factory workers or domestic to what it is now. We saw what force the message down their workers or things like that. works and what doesn’t and throats, you want it to sink then we reshaped it and I think into them and get them to Daniel we’re quite happy with the start asking questions in We’ve done it for primary product as it is now. And it their own heads and start schools, high schools, might still change, it might still speaking to each other in corporates, grassroots level, evolve. their community. high society... Richard Richard Richard It looks like it evolves. From Do you ever worry that some Who are the people you talk to Middelburg to here, two weeks of the satire goes over their the most? later, you threw in a few differ- heads and you’re actually ent things. propagating a myth? When Bathabile people do not laugh and High school kids. And it’s just Daniel they’re supposed to laugh. shocking what these kids get And you’ll see something else up to, so it’s needed. the next time you come. Bathabile It’s a very simple and Daniel Bathabile straightforward play. I think This year is the first year that And also we feed off the audi- that they get it. The only time we’re working with 46664. ence. Five minutes into it you we worry is when we are It’s been very inspiring that already know what kind of working with high school kids Madiba is supporting us in this people you have in the audi- and we hope that we keep cause and that we’re working ence and you work around that. their attention. But we’ve had on the project together. good responses. And of course having his Richard Foundation associated with How would you describe this Daniel this gives us status, whereas type of acting? What has happened before, my before sometimes people character says, “Look, I’ve got would view it sceptically, now Daniel it on very good authority that it’s as if it is a good brand, now It’s theatre with a purpose. a shower after sex definitely they believe in it. You’re entertaining but at works.” Some high school the same time you’re leaving kids have said, “But listen, Richard people with a message. You the shower after sex thing, Do you ever get bored with the don’t want to be finger-wag- what’s up with that?” So we same play?
56 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Bathabile like we were doing the show we’re doing this for school kids No you don’t. Because it’s for them, and that’s our target and talking about sex, we’re different people every day and market, so that felt really good. promoting sexual behaviour. they have different ideas, so it And we’re saying, no, look, keeps us fresh. Bathabile this is what your kids say to Actually, the local artists could us after the show. These kids Daniel relate, they understand the are having sex, they’re having Sometimes everyone will depth of the problem, whereas unprotected sex and they’re laugh at the same point, but international stars get it, but learning it from each other other times you get different they get the figures. so it’s best for us to go there reactions. What’s great about and tell them the truth; we theatre is it’s a live medium Daniel speak their language and they so the reaction is immediate, There was one guy who understand. it’s not like you have to wait stood up and asked Ludacris And you see that someone is for your TV episode to be a brilliant question. He thinking and you’ve changed screened. said, you’re here and you’re someone’s mindset. For me, connected to this project and when you know that someone Richard now you’re promoting safe sex is going to go home and sit Do you still get nervous? but the lyrics in your songs are their kids down, you’ve done about promiscuity, so what’s your job. Daniel that about? So Ludacris said, Especially when you perform “Well, I practise safe sex.” But Richard in front of Madiba or artists I think he needed to elaborate Do reactions change that we performed in front on that. depending on where you of yesterday [when 46664 perform? ambassadors watched the Richard play], you feel pressure. What Highlights? Daniel was interesting was we found What is amazing is that that the artists, even though Daniel whether you do it in Cape they were listening, they Meeting Madiba was very Town, Johannesburg or were quite inhibited, whereas special. It was overwhelming. in a small farm school in the community gave us an I was very moved. Especially Mpumalanga, it has the same immediate response and it felt now, like in our history scene effect. They might laugh at we speak about his different places but they get release, and acting touched in the same way. that moment, and having him sit Bathabile right there, was There isn’t much. They might awesome. be having sex for different reasons, but they have Bathabile common problems. It would have We went to a school in to be when we Soweto and the teacher was did this show saying to us that these are for a company Grade 9s and 10s, that more and there were than half of our audience are two men in the parents, and some of them audience, one have more than one child. It’s Christian and the shocking. You go to another other Muslim, town where kids are having who came to us sex because they need to, after the show. because they need the money They were talking for the government [child Above: Hecate about how, if care] grant.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 57 Richard In some of those schools, is HIV closer to some than others? Do you ever have people crying in your shows? Bathabile All the time, there is always one person in the audience who’s crying. We had a young woman coming to us afterwards saying that she Hecate Productions performs Khululeka. doesn’t know where to go, her mother passed away it makes our job very difficult, of Education. We go to a from HIV/AIDS-related illness because you’re giving them school and discuss amongst about a year ago. one message but now there’s ourselves, will we do the She’s got no one. No one has all this subtext with this condom demonstration? We ever come to her and said look, message. don’t want to offend people, maybe we should take you and we ask permission from for counselling. She lives with Richard the school. If we’re going to relatives, but they don’t talk to Are we changing people’s say, practise safe sex, but these her about it. behaviour? kids don’t know how to use a condom, [then what?]… Daniel Bathabile And then Bathabile plays With these community Daniel Miriam, who gets raped. Often dialogues, we have had a So we’re saying use condoms, there are girls in the audiences lot of kids saying “Well, I’m but they don’t know to use who have been through the going to go out there and them properly. Because if same ordeal. Often we have spread the gospel”. The truth you’re not storing or using a people laughing, but it’s from is, when we leave here, we can condom properly there is no sheer shock. only hope that the message point. stays in and they will go tell Daniel their friends and families, but Richard What has been quite tricky we don’t know. What’s your view on the for us this year is that we do a community dialogues? condom demonstration after Daniel the show and we tell them that And we can’t actually tell Daniel government condoms are 100% people how to live their lives. I hope there’s more of a rollout safe, but now you know there One thing that worries me with this. have been batches of condoms though is that often 14-year- that have been rejected. olds, 15-year-olds will stand Ronny So now we have to travel up and say, but how can I I think it’s excellent. This way with these newspaper go to the clinic and get free you break the community’s clippings and we say, condoms; they’re not going silence. Then we can break the “Government condoms are to give it to me. And then stigma. 100% safe, except, and the secondly, if you don’t have People don’t believe there is serial code is…” so that is money for bread, how the hell this illness, they only believe very confusing. So we really are you going to go and buy it when they see it. So rather hope that the SA Bureau of Durex condoms? don’t get sick now, find out Standards and the government about your status, that’s the are going to work more closely Bathabile message we’re trying to push together and get this thing We maybe need more to the community, and it’s sorted out. Because otherwise support from the Department working.
58 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Reflections The following section is made up of a few of the key reflections on the Youth Community Dialogues. Looking Towards the Future Lesley Nkosi Facilitator, Cool Ideas
s we are taking a platform for people to step the responsibility out and look at each other as Aof HIV and AIDS friends and peers and let’s back to the community talk about our problems and let’s talk about our solutions. reflections through young people, So you never know what the future of tomorrow, comes out. You’re always we’re trying to estab- surprised as to how much lish what are the unique there is out there that hasn’t problems with regard to been done or that can be HIV and AIDS within done and how easy it is when it turns out. So it’s always the communities. exciting when it comes out.
And then see if we can What are some of the come up with specific unique things you have found solutions to these problems at these community and then have the youth make unique commitments. dialogues? In the North West, Lerome, When you go into one I found that it is a mining of these dialogues do community and I found that you know what’s going the aspect of aspiration for young people makes them Lesley Nkosi. to happen? susceptible to exploitation No. When you go into it, by those who are working you’ve got to be really open- in the mines. Those guys are minded to whatever possibility earning in the region of R7000 there can be. All I’ve got to do a month and they carry the is make sure that I encourage power. It’s also culture, in a young people to talk about way, working against them, in their issues to each other and the sense that the roles within not to me. relationships are males being The one thing that I always superior beings and females try to avoid is to create a taking all sorts of crap because teacher-student environment, they are the weaker sex in the where you’re going to teach relationship. That makes them them how to behave, you’re very vulnerable. going to tell them what to do; So you find that these girls it’s already been done. This is know that the guy is going Participant in the Galeshewe dialogue.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 59 46664 ambassadors. out with six other girls in the culture. You find that with What was emphasised there community, but because you HIV messaging it’s easier for was that people have to start can buy me Carvelas and nice young people to be oblivious planning around that whole shoes and nice clothing I don’t because they are afraid of effect of culture and respect. mind as long as I’m one of them expressing to their parents Let’s turn it around and make because I still enjoy the benefits. that they are aware of HIV it work for us instead of But these guys also have the and AIDS because that is against us. power to say why would you going to expose the fact that Because I can’t talk to an want me to wear a condom, they are sexually active or older person, [firstly] I have to you know, don’t you trust me. that they’re aware of sex, so try to make an effort to open I’m the man with the money, there’s the taboo, you don’t up a platform of dialogue I’m giving you gold. That is talk about sex because that’s with older people, but second, the prime problem. something that’s not supposed because now I know as a And you also find that in to be done. young person that being older taverns, at night, around 3 And they cannot makes me wiser than the o’clock in the morning, there communicate with their younger person then I should are young people. Sixteen-year- parents at any level when it serve as an example to the old girls hang out with 64- comes to that sort of stuff. So younger people and guide year-old men, just for the sake they cannot show that they’re them and tell them. So we have of getting the entertainment aware and they cannot teach created an environment of because those guys pay. So each other. So respect has brotherhood. children are at risk and they worked against them. Now they have made a don’t have facilities where The principle of respect commitment to be brothers they can focus on being young with black people is working and sisters to each other and and be creative and find their against them, because it’s to tell each other truths and to talents and stuff like that. respect to the level where guide each other towards the In Giyani it was the most it’s crippling. You cannot right direction when it comes saddening story, because communicate to someone who to HIV and AIDS and sexual these guys are victims of is older than you. behavioural patterns.
60 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE Ambassador Close-Up Thembi Ngubane Ambassador, 46664
hembi Ngubane schools and do HIV/AIDS reflections comes from Khay- awareness in schools and speak as a positive speaker Telitsha township with people that have lost outside Cape Town. She hope. I also go to parliaments has toured South Africa and speak to people who have the power to influence speaking about what it is the community. So I’m a like to live with HIV and motivational speaker and I’m AIDS. involved in a lot of work.
This all started with an audio How has motherhood diary that she began to keep been so far, especially in 2004 to be broadcast on as HIV-positive parents National Public Radio in the to an HIV-negative United States. At first she wanted to keep her identity baby? anonymous. But when she Well it’s been great; I’ve been went on a speaking tour in the enjoying being a mother. She’s US she saw people’s positive three now, she just turned response and decided to tell three yesterday and it was Above: Thembi Ngubane, 46664 ambassador. her story to people in South difficult at first to be HIV- Africa. Her blog is at http:// positive and also to come to thembisaidsdiarytour.vox. terms with understanding com/ that you might have an HIV- positive or a negative baby. How did you get So it was a very difficult involved with 46664 as choice for both me and my an ambassador? partner, Melikhaya. It was I got to know the Foundation a very difficult experience and its work this year when for both of us, but we have they first heard my diary. a belief that people should see that this is not a death What is your sentence, this is something Langa, Western Cape. involvement in your that can be manageable, and community? we managed to the point In Khayelitsha I used to be where we had a baby who in a support group, then is negative and now we are the group got divided. living healthy lives. I’m involved in many things that include HIV, How’s your health at for instance I work with the moment? different companies. I’m an My CD4 count has gone up, ambassador for UNICEF; I go I’ve been on ARVs for three out in countries like India and I speak to mothers-to-be about years. I started on ARVs in how to be an HIV-positive 2005 and my CD4 count was mother. So I work with a lot 147 and now my CD4 count is of companies where I go to around 600, so it’s going great. Langa, Western Cape.
YOUTH IN DIALOGUE 61 General Reflections Lebo Ramafoko Facilitator, Soul City
oul City executive put them at risk of getting Lebo Ramafoko HIV. is also the “agony I also had to give factual S information; if there were reflections aunt” of the 46664.org.za any myths I had to make website. She facilitated sure that people have the the Soshanguve dialogue. right information about those myths. What were your I had to know what to say I think that they are so and I also had to be informed much more important (not objectives/expectations about the issues. saying the 46664 concerts are going in to the not important) as an initiative dialogue? What have you learnt than just messages to raise It was mainly to make awareness. sure that people are in from the dialogue? Perhaps we need to look I learnt that communities are conversation with each other at stakeholders. If people grappling with HIV, also that and to facilitate a safe space have issues with the clinics, dialogue is important, it’s an for discussion. it doesn’t make sense if the opportunity for people to It was kind of like playing clinics are not there. devil’s advocate, by probing talk to each other and help We need to structure it and getting people to realise each other with issues better. Had the relevant people that, as they were divulging surrounding HIV. been there, they would have their personal lives, they were said, hold on I can answer also at risk. Making them Do you think that that question for you. It is a realise that the lives that they dialogues like this are good idea though, I think the lead and their behaviour can of any importance? dialogues are very important. Soshanguve, Gauteng.
62 YOUTH IN DIALOGUE About Nelson Mandela Foundation
vision and leadership of its provides a unique facility Founder to provide a non- which: partisan platform for public ◊ Locates, documents and discourse on critical social ensures the preservation of issues. Achieving community these scattered resources participation in decision- ◊ Collects and curates Mr making, even at policy levels, Mandela’s personal archive is prioritised. ◊ Promotes public access Nelson Mandela The Centre aims to to these resources and fosters perpetuate and re-invigorate dialogue around them Centre Of Memory And the culture of engagement ◊ Ensures that all initiatives Dialogue using the examples set by Mr in the name of Nelson Mandela The Nelson Mandela Mandela of inclusive and open are true to his legacy. Foundation is a not-for-profit dialogue that South Africa is Memory is not an end in organisation established in famous for. itself. Its significance lies in its 1999 to support its Founder’s Drawing on the rich use. The Centre of Memory and ongoing engagement traditions of transformative Dialogue seeks to reach both in worthy causes on his dialogue, problem-solving global audiences and those retirement as President of and social renewal that systemically disadvantaged South Africa. The Foundation made possible South Africa’s within South Africa by: is registered as a trust, with its remarkable transition, the ◊ Undertaking outreach board of trustees comprising Centre: programmes, including prominent South Africans ◊ Aims to facilitate greater travelling exhibitions, books, selected by the Founder. understanding and awareness comic series, and internships The Nelson Mandela Centre about the problems faced by ◊ Ensuring web-based access of Memory and Dialogue people, particularly in South to information through its web was inaugurated by Nelson Africa and Africa, and the portal Mandela on 21 September possible solutions available to ◊ Supporting digitisation 2004, and endorsed as the them initiatives designed to broaden core work of the Foundation ◊ Utilises comprehensive access to resources in 2006. The Nelson Mandela methodologies to promote ◊ Facilitating research by Foundation, through its Nelson dialogue between stakeholders individuals and institutions. Mandela Centre of Memory ◊ Convenes result-oriented We believe that the vehicle and Dialogue, contributes to stakeholder dialogue on key for sharing memory effectively, the making of a just society by social issues identified through for growing it, and for promoting the vision and work continuous engagement with engaging it in the promotion of its Founder and convening partners. of justice, is dialogue. We dialogue around critical social actively open our memory issues. Memory For Justice work – on the life and times Memory resources of Nelson Mandela, the events Dialogue For Justice documenting the life and times and the people he influenced The Centre of Memory and of Nelson Mandela are to be or was influenced by – to Dialogue aims to develop found in an extraordinary debate and discussion, and we and sustain dialogue around range of locations, both draw on this memory work in Mr Mandela’s legacy. It is within South Africa and convening dialogue on critical committed to utilising the internationally. The Centre social issues that present a history, experience, values, of Memory and Dialogue threat to justice in society. Nelson Mandela Foundation tel: +27 11 728 1000 fax: +27 11 728 1111 email: [email protected] website: www. nelsonmandela.org
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