Joel Buchanan Archive of African American History: http://ufdc.ufl.edu/ohfb
Samuel Proctor Oral History Program
College of Liberal Arts and Sciences Program Director: Dr. Paul Ortiz 241 Pugh Hall PO Box 115215 Gainesville, FL 32611 (352) 392-7168 https://oral.history.ufl.edu
AAHP 151B Charles Moore African American History Project (AAHP) Interview conducted by Irene Cardozo on March 21, 2011 54 minutes | 27 pages
Abstract: Charles Moore attended A.L. Mebane High School in Alachua, Florida and then went to Florida A&M University. While there, hehad a roommate in college whose father, Eugene White, played baseball in the Negro League. He relates some of the stories that he heard from Mr. White, and some of the other aspects of Negro League history that he learned over the years. He also talks about baseball in the general north/north-central Florida area, and the significance the game had in communities there. Mixed in, he also talks about how he experienced baseball growing up, both as a player and as a fan keeping up with the Major Leagues. He also describes his high school teaching and coaching career of thirty-three years in Florida.
[Keywords: African American History; Alachua County, Florida; Baseball; Negro League]
For information on terms of use of this interview, please see the SPOHP Creative Commons license at http://ufdc.ufl.edu/AfricanAmericanOralHistory. AAHP 151B Interviewee: Charles Moore Interviewer: Irene Cardozo Date: March 21, 2011
C: This is Irene Cardozo and I’m interviewing Mr. Charles Moore today on March
21, 2011. We’re here at the Samuel Proctor Oral History Program. Hi Mr. Moore.
M: How you doing?
C: Good. So let’s start off. Will you tell me some stories or whatever about you
growing up and going to Mebane High School.
M: Well, I went to Mebane from K through 12—no I’m sorry. Not K. I didn’t start out
in the kindergarten. I started out in first grade. Back then kindergarten hadn’t
gotten started then and it was first grade through twelfth grade at Mebane. And it
was a very, very enjoyable time there. Very enjoyable time there, yes.
C: You mentioned to us that your best friend from college’s dad played for the Old
Negro Leagues and you got to play under him?
M: Yes.
C: So could you tell us a little about him, and how it was, the experience?
M: He was a great man, and when I started when I was in college my roommate,
college roommate, I met his dad. His dad was telling me the history about himself
and he played in the Old Negro League back with Jackie Robinson and Satchel
Paige, and all those guys. And he was telling me a lot of interesting things about
how they would have to ride the bus into a town, and by them being Black during
that time, they may not get fed. They were going to check into a motel, hotel and
they may tell them, “Well, we don’t accept Blacks.” And they would have to
sometimes sleep on the bus when they was going to play baseball. But he was
telling me about it; it was such an enjoyable time. His name is Eugene White. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 2
They call him Stank White, Eugene Stank White. His son is Doug White, Douglas
White, he’s the Athletic Director, Head Basketball Coach at Raines High School.
He’s retired this year. He’s joining me ‘cause I’m retired. [Coughs] Excuse me.
Just talking me with Mr. White, Mr. White was telling me about some of the ball
players and he said that they had some great baseball players back in the Old
Negro Leagues that never got a chance to go into the Major Leagues. And I can’t
call off the names of these guys now, but one of the guys, Josh Gibson, they say
that in his career he hit over eight hundred and something-plus home runs.
C: Wow.
M: And they were saying that he hit what they call nowadays tape measure shots.
Well they say he hit some that was longer than tape measure shots, home runs.
Great baseball player, he was a catcher. And he was telling us about guys like
Cool Papa Bell, who they say probably was the fastest guy to ever play baseball.
And guys like Cool Papa Bell and Satchel Paige and there’s others, right now for
some reason I can’t reel them off the top of my head. But it was just—to me it
was interesting. I got a chance to play on—he had like a summer baseball team
over in Jacksonville called The Jacksonville Majors and I got a chance to play for
him and play with him because he was still playing at the time. When he was fifty,
in the middle of the late fifties and still playing baseball, and could hit. He could
really hit the baseball.
C: Very nice. So you mention in the previous interview that growing up you guys
used to play pick-up baseball games. Can you tell me about that? AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 3
M: I was born and raised right outside of Gainesville in an area that’s known as the
Monteocha area. And as a little boy they always had baseball teams. And when I
grew up—well as a little boy I always said, “When I grow up, I’m gonna play on
that baseball team.” And lo and behold, when I grew up, I think I was like maybe
thirteen, fourteen years old, I started playing baseball out in the country. And
every little community had a baseball team. Every little community. We had one
in Monteocha area, they had one in Alachua, they had one in High Springs, they
had one in Hawthorne, they had one in Waldo, they had one in Newberry. Archer
had a baseball team. Jonesville had a baseball team. And these were all in
Alachua County. Then the surrounding areas had baseball teams. Starke had
one, Lawtey had one, Lake Butler had a baseball team, Macclenny. Lake City
had a baseball team. Live Oak had a baseball team. Cross City had one,
Chiefland, Williston, they had one down in what they call—little settlement
outside between Williston and Ocala called Blichton. They had one in Ocala.
They had two in Reddick. In the Reddick area they had two, and all of these
communities—Putnam Hall—all of these communities had baseball teams. And
back during those days it was mainly all Black. Every now and then you would
have a White or Hispanic that lived in that area that would play. But it was
basically all Black. And let me tell me something, it would be crowded. I mean it
would be crowded at one of those baseball games. People would come out and
they would support it and they would cheer it on and it was just people down
there, they were enjoying themselves and just watching a good baseball game.
And we had some good baseball players too. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 4
C: About how far would these fans drive to get there?
M: They would drive far. I can give you an example. I can’t tell you the exact year
but we, the Monteocha team, went down to in Volusia County, De Leon Springs
in Volusia County, that’s right outside of DeLand. We had a convoy of about fifty
automobiles going down there.
C: Wow.
M: And they would travel to support you, and they would support you when you
played at home. And when we played at home, the other teams always brought a
lot of fans also. Just think about it now, fifty automobiles in a convoy going to a
baseball game on a Sunday evening. And that was a lot. The automobile just
didn’t have one person. The automobiles were loaded with people, and that’s just
how they supported it.
C: And growing up, what sports were you involved in?
M: Oh, played baseball, football, and basketball. In high school. I went to Santa Fe
Community College. I played baseball and basketball at Santa Fe Community
College. In fact, I was the first Black athlete at Santa Fe Community College.
That was the first—I played on their first baseball team, the first baseball team at
Santa Fe, and I was the first one there. But then another guy came in named
Robert Kelsey, he came in but he came in after I did. So I guess I got the
distinction of being their first Black athlete at Santa Fe Community College. Then
the following year Santa Fe formed a basketball team. I was on that also.
C: Very nice. You’re athletic. When you went to FAMU you also played sports
there? AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 5
M: I went on a baseball scholarship to FAMU, and I was there, I played two years.
[19]71, actually, I went there in [19]71, the fall of [19]71, and I played the spring
of [19]72 and the spring of [19]73. Because I had two years at Santa Fe
Community College, I only had two years at FAMU, out of my four years of my
eligibility. But I got a chance at FAMU to play with Hall of Famer Andre Dawson.
C: Oh nice.
M: The hulk. I got a chance to play with him, yes.
C: So, going into the actual Negro Leagues, what were some of the Leagues that
were established? I notice you have the names on the back of your shirt.
M: Some of the teams that was established, you had the Chicago American Giants,
you had the Kansas City Monarchs, you had the New York Black Yankees. Oh
gosh, I wish I could just reel off to you, but the names are on the back of the shirt.
What you can do is I can like turn around and let you write the names off of ‘em
so you can add it to your report. But they had a lot of baseball teams. I think it
was the Pittsburgh—I can’t recall the name of it.
C: I know you had the Miami Giants, ‘cause I looked up Miami history.
M: Yes, and they had a team out of Jacksonville, and the Homestead Giants, the
Homestead Giants was from Miami. Then they had a team out of Jacksonville. I
think they had a team out of Tampa, and Daytona.
C: How would one go about joining the League?
M: As far as the Old Negro League, you had to—to be honest with you, I really
couldn’t tell you they went ‘bout joining the League. But when we were playing,
every year during the spring of the year when it started getting warmer, not when AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 6
it was cold, we would set up practices, different practices, and guys that wanted
to play would come out and try out for the team. Now, I don’t know how we did
the cuts by elimination because I wasn’t involved with that. I was just a player.
But as far as telling you how the Old Negro League did theirs, I couldn’t tell you
that because I’m not aware of that. Because what Mr. White—he did not tell us
about that. He did tell me that someone recommended him to the League, and a
team contacted him while he was in Jacksonville, and that’s how he got a chance
to play in the Old Negro League.
C: Okay.
M: So maybe it’s just a recommendation from someone, then you go to practice or
they bring you in for a try out, and if they feel like you can play, they’ll bring you
in. But I don’t think there was nothing like they do now with a draft or something
like that.
C: And were there any like big rivalries between certain teams?
M: Uh yeah, the Chicago American Giants and the Kansas City Monarchs, from
what I understand, had a very big rivalry. I guess because the proximity, they are
kinda close. I was told that they want the team in New York—if I’m not mistaken
there was two teams in New York and they had a big rivalry also.
C: Like the Mets and the Yankees.
M: Exactly. You know how they are. [Laughter]
C: How about their equipment? Where’d the get equipment from?
M: Now they had owners. They had team owners back in that time. The team owner
was Black, but you had some affluent Black folks back during that time that had AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 7
some money and they purchased all the equipment, from what I understood. And
as far as the trips and stuff like that, they had, for an example they had the team
owner, the team president, generally like it is in Major League Baseball now, but
it wasn’t full scale like it is now, where you got all these different executives. They
had like the team owner, the team President, and they had someone to take care
of the traveling, and then they had the manager and the coaches for the team.
They had owners, team owners, and the team owners would purchase the
equipment.
C: And with these owners, they lived in the city where the team was from?
M: I think so, I think so.
C: And how bout the venues? What kind of stadiums were they able to play in?
M: They had stadiums but it was not like the stadiums they have now. For an
example, the Jacksonville team played at Merle Avenue Ball Park, over there on-
in Jacksonville. That’s where Edward Waters College play their baseball games
now. They played over there. I went to the stadium that they played in in Tampa,
but I can’t remember the name of it. But they had stadiums, but it wasn’t no big
elaborate stadiums like they have now. But they had stadiums to play in.
C: And how was it set up? Did they have concessions?
M: Yes, they had the works. Back then, the food might’ve been a little different in the
concessions. They had no popcorn and stuff like that. They probably sold ribs
and chicken and stuff like that.
C: Yeah, probably. Sounds pretty good though.
M: Good food, you know. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 8
C: And as far as like the score keepers and stuff like that, it had to be manually
somebody doing that.
M: Yes, yes
C: Or they all like hired by the team or the younger kids or yeah. Did they have any
special traditions? You know how we have like the seventh inning stretch thing?
Did they have anything like that, just for the Negro Leagues?
M: I’m not aware of that. He talked to me a lot but as far as getting into the small
details like what you’re talking about, I don’t know.
C: Alright. You already mentioned Dawson, but were there any other popular
players that stand out to you right now?
M: You mean---
C: Besides like Andre Dawson, the big guys that made it.
M: Like in baseball now?
C: Mmhm.
M: Well back during the days when I was growing up, I was always a Dodger fan,
am still a Dodger fan, and I used to always admire Tommy Davis. The way he
played. As far as pitchers are concerned, Sammy Koufax and Don Drysdale. But
I followed Major League Baseball back then, and back then I could probably tell
you, if you were to ask me back when I was a pre-teenager and teenager, I
probably could have told you the starting players for every Major League
Baseball team there was back during that time. But now I can’t do it because I’m
old and I don’t follow it like I used to. But I used to follow John Roseboro, Elston
Howard, who was a Yankee. I grew up as a catcher, and the guy who taught me AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 9
to catch, I never met him. Never met him in my life. I just watched him catch. And
that was Johnny Bench, with the Cincinnati Reds. Every time Cincinnati came on
TV, I was there watching. And I would always watch Johnny Bench, the way he
operated as a catcher. And I tried to mimic what he was doing to make myself
better. So Johnny Bench taught me how to catch, but I never met him.
C: As an athlete growing up, how did the Negro Leagues influence you? Well,
besides that, you were playing.
M: Well, by the way now Johnny Bench was not a—
C: Yeah, I know that’s pro.
M: With me, I was always a fan of baseball. And seeing people of color, even back
then, excited me as far as in athletics. For an example, football-wise, I was
always fascinated with John Mackey. I was a tight end in high school and he was
a tight end with the Baltimore Colts. I was always fascinated with John Mackey. I
was always fascinated with people like Wilt Chamberlain, Bill Russell, Moses
Malone [16:58] in basketball. In baseball, like I was saying about Johnny Bench,
John Roseboro, Elston Howard, Tommy Davis, Willy Davis, Willie Mays, Hank
Aaron. I was one to say, well you know what, if they could do it than so could I.
And that is what I will say drove me to try to be the best that I could be. And
seeing them in the Old Negro League, because we didn’t have much to—there
was not much that we could read about them. Only thing we heard about them
was through other people talking about them, the Old Negro League, but it still
fascinated me and I had an interest in it. Because I was saying well, “if they’re
still around when I come up”—because we had to remember now I was a pre- AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 10
teenager and teenager in the [19]60s. Well back then the opportunity for Blacks
was still not that great. As a pre-teenager I was thinking, “Boy if this is still around
when I come through, I can play in the Old Negro League.” And that kind of drove
me and kept my interest in trying to be the best that I could be so one day maybe
I could, boom, make it in there, make it in the pros.
C: And all the guys you got to play with at Santa Fe, in high school, and at FAMU,
did any of them make it pro?
M: No. Nobody but Andre Dawson.
C: Okay.
M: Nobody but Andre Dawson.
C: So it was a rare thing?
M: Yes. Even when I was teaching and coaching I used to tell kids, “you don’t set
your”—especially young boys say, “I want to be a professional football player or I
want to be in the NBA, professional baseball player.” You have to get that
education first. So if you don’t make it, then you have something to fall back on.
Because in football, you only have about five percent of college athletes that
make it each year. Basketball there are less than that. Off the top of my head it’s
probably 1.5% of seniors coming out of— or guys that going into the NBA draft,
that make it. So even though my ambition was to be a professional athlete, I also
had an ambition of getting my education.
C: Definitely. When and where was the first baseball game you attended? Not
professionally or anything, just a baseball game. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 11
M: High school. I wasn’t in high school, I was in elementary school. And our high
school had a baseball game and I went to it. And before I had to get on the bus
to go home, they would let you out of school a little early to go see the baseball
game. That’s when I saw my first baseball game, in person, besides on TV.
C: And how often were they televised, shown on TV?
M: Well back when I was growing up, it was every weekend and it was on CBS and
it was the Yankees. Whoever the Yankees were playing, that’s who they had on
TV. I think that’s one of the reasons I don’t like the Yankees today, cause I saw
too much of them. [Laughter]
C: And how involved was the media in the Negro Leagues?
M: Probably, you may have had—back during those days you had a couple of all-
Black newspapers. The Pittsburgh Courier was one, and if I’m not mistaken they
may have printed that once a week. And they would have articles in there about
the Old Negro League. Other than that, I don’t know of any other media or
publication that would have anything about it. I don’t even remember seeing an
Ebony magazine back during the day that had stuff in there about the Old Negro
League. Now the word got out now, but it got out by word of mouth, people
talking about it. That’s why I was able to know about it as a young kid.
C: And were Whites involved at all?
M: I don’t think so. I’m not sure, but I don’t think so. Not at the beginning, maybe at
the latter stages there were some involvement. But at the beginning, I couldn’t
tell you for sure, but I don’t think so. I never heard Mr. White saying anything
about Whites was involved. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 12
C: And in your opinion what do you think the Negro Leagues meant for the Black
community?
M: Meant a lot. Because it was something of their own that was entertaining to them.
Now from what I understand, in the old tapes that I’ve seen on TV, for example,
some years ago they ran a clip on Channel 5 here at the university. It showed the
stands, and the stands would be packed with people, I mean literally packed with
people. And just like I was telling you, in the country, where I was raised up on
that baseball team, we didn’t have a stadium. But around the field it would be
packed with people watching a baseball game. And it was just for our community
that was very big, and it was entertaining.
C: And how long was the season for the Negro Leagues? Was it normal like
baseball now?
M: Yes. I don’t think they played as many games now, that they do now, because
you know back in the [19]50s they didn’t play as many games back in the [19]50s
as they do now. But it was like a regular baseball season. I know they played a
hundred something games, yes.
C: And were there any… When Mr. White talked to you did he tell you of any
controversies or any big stories going on?
M: In reference to?
C: The Negro Leagues, like within the League.
M: Within the League?
C: Like any problems or anything like there is today.
M: Nah. He didn’t tell me any. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 13
C: I actually have a book here on the Negro Leagues. There are a couple pictures
and whatnot. They divided into the [19]20s and the [19]40s. From the [19]20s to
the [19]40s there was a dynamic within the Leagues and then after the [19]40s
on, you know. So they have a couple of like actual media stuff, and so many—
here’s a hall of fame.
M: These are the hall of famers, right, right. So these guys Hank Aaron all those
guys start out in the Old Negro League. Ernie Banks, Roy Campanella, Willie
Mays, Jackie Robinson. And I wanted to show you another—
C: Just a little bunch of pictures.
M: What page was you on then?
C: Right here.
M: You see this is the guy I was talking about, Josh Gibson. Monte Irvin lived in the
Crystal River area if I’m not mistaken. There was another one, Buck Leonard
lived in the Tampa area I believe. But all these guys, Mr. White told me about all
these guys, and what he was telling me about Josh Gibson and Cool Papa Bear,
they say he probably the fastest guy that ever played pro baseball. I’m talking
about back during then and now. Satchel Paige was almost sixty and he pitched
in the major leagues, so those are some of the names.
C: Well this guy was super-fast, did they steal a lot of bases back then?
M: Yes they did. He did.
C: That’s awesome. And what were some of the stories that Mr. White told you?
M: He would tell me some stories especially about Hank Aaron and Willie Mays. He
said they were destined for the major leagues because they were just that good. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 14
C: These are some of the…
M: Some of the teams. Oh, the Homestead Grays. I thought it was the Homestead
Giants. It was the Homestead Grays and the New York Eagles. Remember I told
you there was two teams in New York? The New York Eagles.
C: Yeah, there’re definitely lots and lots of pictures here.
M: I think that’s Josh Gibson there… Wow. Where did you get that book from?
C: The library right here, actually, there are a couple. And I got them just kinda to
orient myself with the time period.
M: Right. So there had some media back then, because you had to have media in
order to have pictures and stuff like that taken. They got some history there.
C: And when you were going to school, high school and college, you mentioned that
there were some Hispanics, and how often did you come across Hispanics
playing sports in school with you?
M: They didn’t play with me in high school. I didn’t play against them in high school.
This was like the pick-up that they did, the teams out in the country. Like I was
talking about every little settlement or town had a baseball team, and we would
run across some there. Not many, but it was a few of them then that we ran
across.
C: So interesting seeing these preserved.
M: Yeah. So the manager Joe Williams. So they had managers, they had team
owners, etc.
C: Yep.
M: Look at that. World Colored Championship. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 15
C: And what did Mr. White talk to you about as far as the Whites’ reaction to the
success of the League?
M: Well he was telling me about there was one time when they invited the all-stars
from the Old Negro League to play against, I want to say it was the New York
Yankees who was the champions of the Major Leagues. And they stopped the
game because the all-stars from the Old Negro League was beating the Yankees
so bad. He did tell me about that.
C: Were any people opposed to it, show any reaction to while the games were being
played, during the games or whatever?
M: I don’t know.
C: There’s the [19]20s and then, this is like a time period of it, and then it goes off to
later. So this is like later on.
M: So there was some of the buses that they had. Let me see this. See they had
their own team buses. Pittsburg Crawfords. I knew there was a team in Pittsburg.
C: And how do you think baseball has changed from when you played it, before you
played it, and now?
M: Before I played baseball, every Major League Baseball team in Major League
Baseball had a Black baseball player. American Black baseball player. Then
once I started playing it, back in the [19]60s, it was still the same. Now Blacks
have gotten away from baseball. You still have some Blacks out there that play
baseball, but Blacks has gotten away from baseball. And I think the reason is
Blacks have been priced out of baseball. When you go to see a high school
baseball game now, you very seldom see a Black kid. You have some places like AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 16 down in Williston which is—they usually have Black baseball players. Now when
I say priced out of baseball, you have all this AAU and traveling teams for baseball, and most Black athletes are going to play more than one sport. It’s gotten to the point where as these high schools now have their baseball players practicing in the fall, most of the Black athletes are playing football in the fall. So that means the coaches have a chance to do what? Pick their teams during the fall. And the schools don’t buy the equipment anymore. The kids buy their own equipment. Most Blacks just don’t have that kind of money. You go buy a brand new bat, it may cost you three or four hundred dollars. Blacks don’t have that kind of money. Not all Blacks. Now some of them do, but most of them don’t. And
I firmly believe we have been priced out of the game of baseball because of the cost. And the other thing is most of high school baseball teams, those teams are chosen during the fall, and most of the Black kids, they’re playing football. And then when basketball season come around, that same kid that played football is on the basketball team. And so when basketball season is going on, the baseball team is practicing. And the baseball season starts the first week of February.
Basketball is still going on. It’s not the same as going from the football field to the basketball court, then from the basketball court to the baseball field. There’s an adjustment period. From basketball to baseball, there’s an adjustment period. So
I don’t think that Black athletes are given the opportunity to play baseball because of the fact that they’re involved with so many other sports. That’s why most of them in order to stay active they go right into track. And you don’t see that many Black baseball players because they’ve been priced out. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 17
C: Yeah I ran track in high school and most of the guys who were on the track team
were in football. So you know they had their break in between then they got to,
usually had the runners.
M: Right. And another thing too is it happens before you get to high school. Because
you have these Babe Ruth leagues and these city leagues and they cost a lot of
money. And most of these Black kids don’t have the resources to play at a young
age. Now you have down in Tampa, I think it’s Belmont Heights in Tampa, if I’m
not mistaken I believe they have sponsors that sponsor those kids. We don’t
have that up here. And it’s not in a lot of places in the state of Florida. So we’ve
just been priced out. And it’s not only in the state of Florida. It’s everywhere, it’s
everywhere. You have a few, and the few that play, quite a few of them end up
making it because they are dedicated to it and they are able to practice and
practice and practice and practice.
C: And how was it playing all these sports while you were in school?
M: I enjoyed it. Now I couldn’t play if I didn’t get my classwork cause my mom was
not gonna let me play. So I had to get my classwork out. But I thoroughly enjoyed
myself playing sports, I did. Hadn’t it been for sports, in fact, that probably was
the driving factor in me getting my education because I wanted to play sports,
and I knew I had to get my education in order to play sports. I had to go to class,
I had to do my work, I had to bring home good grades, and I think that was the
driving force in me. Having the opportunity to play gave me the opportunity to do
my class work, because I had to do my class work, or else I wouldn’t have
played. Mom was not going to stand for that. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 18
C: And when you went to FAMU, how were FAMU and UF’s relations? Like did they
ever play each other?
M: We never played ‘em. We never played ‘em. When I was at FAMU, I’m trying to
think of the only White or integrated team we played. I really can’t think of one.
We was in the SIAC conference, and we went we played Tuskegee, Alabama
A&M, Alabama State, Clark, Morehouse, Morris Brown, Bethune Cookman,
those. The only time I played—now I played against Whites when I was at Santa
Fe Community College because I was on the team then. And I played against
Whites one summer when I was in Tallahassee in summer school, like again, a
community team, and we played against some Whites that played ball at Florida
State. They had a team and we played against them. That was called
Commonwealth. We played against them. And then when I played for Mr. White
over in Jacksonville we played against Whites. In the latter years out in the
Monteocha area we played against Whites and we also had a couple of White
guys that came and played with us.
C: I mean, going to UF, I mean I see this all the time, but every sport has like
dancers or cheerleaders, you know like the girl counterpart? Did you guys have
that?
M: No.
C: No? Didn’t get to see girls?
M: No, no, you mean like up at FAMU?
C: Yeah. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 19
M: No. Our coach wouldn’t stand for no girls to be coming out there talking about
dancing while we was trying to play baseball, because see that would have threw
our minds. We’d have forgot about baseball and started watching the girls, so we
didn’t have that. We didn’t have it. I mean, when I was at Santa Fe Community
College playing basketball I don’t remember having cheerleaders at the
basketball game. I really don’t.
C: Whether it be Santa Fe or FAMU, let’s say like a regular day of practice, what
would it entail?
M: Say that again?
C: Like a regular day of practice, what would it entail?
M: Woooo. Hard work. My coach—Coach Coster Killus—was a great man. I mean
a great man. And everybody on the team just loved him to death until we got to
practice. He worked us. In fact I can say I was in the best shape of my life during
then. From the time we hit the practice field to the time we left the practice field, it
was all about sprinting everywhere you went, and you gave 100% at everything
you did while you was on that practice field. It was work. I mean it was work. Let
me tell you what he would do to us sometime. We would be practicing and the
cafeteria would close at six-thirty. We were in practice about a quarter till six.
Then he would have us run out to Gaither Park. And Gaither Park was probably
two to three miles from campus, up and down hills. We had to run out to Gaither
Park and run back, then run up to the dormitory to change clothes, and then run
up to the cafeteria before it closed so we could eat. And this was all—when we
got back to the field and run up to the dormitory, it was all uphill. All of the AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 20
baseball players was on fourth floor in Sampson Hall. No elevator, so that mean
we had to run up the hill from the practice field, up four flights of stairs, change
clothes, down four flights of steps, and up another hill to the cafeteria before they
close. But we loved him because we knew that he was there for us. He worked
us. I mean we worked. I was in the best shape of my life back then. I didn’t have
no fat on me nowhere. I probably had 1% body fat, back then, because I couldn’t
get fat because I was working it off all the time. And we worked just like that from
the fall practice all the way through to baseball season.
C: That brings back memories of back in the day when I was in shape.
M: Well you know that.
C: Did any of you guys fall behind, while you guys were doing all these drills?
M: Yeah we had quite a few fall behind. We had quite a few that didn’t make it to the
cafeteria. But I was gonna make sure I made it because I wasn’t gonna go
hungry.
C: Any memorable experiences, any other thing you want to mention?
M: At FAMU or?
C: Any.
M: Memorable experience was—I was playing baseball for Mr. White over in
Jacksonville, and we were in a tournament in Lawtey. And it was the
championship game, and at bat before my last at bat, I took a third strike. And I
think we had two runners in scoring position. And I vowed to myself that if I come
up to the bat the next time, I was gonna hit a home run. Well, the next time I
came up to the bat, bases loaded, I hit a grand slam. That was memorable. And AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 21
there were some others too, but that’s the one that really pop into my mind,
because he got all over and he would get on ya. And he’d say now, “How in the
world can you take a third strike and you got runners in scoring position?” He
said, “You supposed to swing the bat.” Now I didn’t say anything to him but I
vowed to myself the next time I come up to the bat, I was gonna hit a home run.
And I did, hit a grand slam.
C: That’s awesome. You also mentioned, and I read from your previous interview,
that you coached for quite a few years. Could you tell me about that?
M: Yes, thirty-three years in the State of Florida as a teacher and a coach. I coached
baseball. My first year of teaching down in Hernando High School in Brooksville,
Florida, I was an assistant football coach and I was the head JV baseball coach.
Then I moved to Springstead High School and I was the head middle school
football coach, head middle school girls track coach, and JV basketball coach.
And then the following year I was the head JV football coach, I was the varsity
girls track coach, and I was still JV basketball. And I coached three sports for
about, gosh, eight years. Back to back to back to back, eight years in a row.
Then I left Hernando County and I came to Alachua County and I was coaching
basketball. Assistant basketball coach and assistant JV football coach at Santa
Fe High School. Then I left there and went over to Gainesville Eastside. I was the
head baseball coach at Gainesville Eastside, assistant basketball coach at
Gainesville Eastside, and assistant football coach at Gainesville Eastside. And
then I was at Gainesville Eastside and then I left Eastside, after so many years,
and then I went to Fort White. I ended up my career at Fort White High School. AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 22
My first year at Fort White I was assistant football and head track. Then my
second year at Fort White I became the head basketball coach at Fort White.
Then I was assistant football. That’s how I ended up. Assistant football and—well
actually I had given up the basketball job a couple years before I retired, but I
was still doing football. Cause it was working me pretty hard.
C: Since you got plenty of experience with boys and girls, what would you say were
like the biggest differences between from school to school program, athletic
program, from sport to sport, and differences between coaching boys over girls?
M: Well, I could say that when I was coaching over at Eastside, there was some
talent. There was talent over there. Their record speaks for itself, up until here
lately they had a couple of down years in football, but they’re always at the top,
around the top in football, basketball, and the baseball program has bounced
back pretty good also. And the track team has always been outstanding. The
most enjoyable time I’ve had coaching was—I was at Springstead High School
and I had girls track. Those young ladies kept me on my p’s and q’s. They were
great. They were super. I mean, we’d go to practice, I would lay out the practice
schedule, they look at the practice schedule, and boom, they went to work. When
I first became the track coach there, those young ladies had never won a trophy.
When I left, they had won eighteen, nineteen, maybe twenty trophies. We would
go to an invitational track meet, and people would see us coming, and they say,
“Well we know who’s gonna win this track meet, so everybody else got to fight for
second.” People started mimicking my girls’ track team. We would get out on the
track for warm-ups and all the girls would get in a line, and they would jog around AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 23
that track clapping their hands and singing a song, clapping their hands and
singing a song, all the way around that track as a warm-up lap. And they’d get in
a big circle on the field, cause I had thirty-nine big girls on my track team. Thirty-
nine. And they would stretch and sing a song and stretch and sing a song and
then before I left from down there, almost every track team in that area was doing
what we was doing. But that was my most enjoyable time, I think my most
enjoyable time coaching was when I had that girls track team down at
Springstead High School.
C: What year was that?
M: Whoo, gosh, now that’s throws me off. [19]79 through [19]83 I believe. Yes. Had
some fast girls though. Had some fast girls. And they would get out there and
they would compete. We never won the state but we was like second or third in
the state a number of times.
C: What was the best event, was it like a relay was the four-by-four or?
M: Well actually all of ‘em. All the events. I had a top-notch runner in almost every
event and I had a couple young ladies that was in the field events—the discus,
the shot put. Had a couple young ladies in the long jump and the high jump and
they were, I mean, we were represented. They were represented in every event
there was a possibility that a Springstead High School girl would win one of those
events.
C: That’s amazing.
M: Yes. Now when I first took over the program, they only had a total of five girls in
their track program before I took over. The school was like three years old. They AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 24
only had a total of five girls. My first year there I had thirteen girls. After that, I
averaged thirty to thirty-nine girls on that track team. It grew.
C: And how was it different coaching girls over guys?
M: Uh, with girls you have to pull it out of them. Guys it comes natural. You know,
girls they like to come up to ya and pout. “I don’t feel like doing this. I don’t feel
like doing that.” But they would go out and do it. Where with guys, it basically
comes natural, you know. It comes natural. So I enjoyed coaching girls, but there
was a lot of headaches with coaching girls [Laughter] You know.
C: Yep. And when you were coaching the boys did you ever see them in scenarios
that you were in when you were a player?
M: Yes, oh yeah, oh yes. Now I can’t go back to tell you what it was, but yes, and I
always used myself as an example to them. When that situation arose or came
up I would always use myself as an example to them and let them know what I
would do if I was in that situation. But yes, a lot of the times. A lot of the times.
C: And when you talked to Mr. White about the Negro Leagues when was this?
While you were playing under him or after that?
M: When I first met him through my roommate and he told me about it now I used to
just sit down and just let him talk. And it was before I started—I played for him
one year, actually, one and a piece, ‘bout one-and-a-half years. But before I even
played for him, I would always just sit down with him and talk to him and let him
tell me about the Old Negro Leagues. Cause I was fascinated. I was fascinated
with the Old Negro Leagues, I really was. That’s why I have this shirt on. And I’ve
had another shirt that’s worn out and I’ve had a cap. I had a book. In fact I bought AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 25
this book and the title of the book was Only the Ball Was White and I gave it to
Mr. White.
C: Did he ever mentioned getting rough experiences he had while he was in the
League?
M: Between the players themselves?
C: Whether it be between the players or race relations?
M: Well it was a lot of race relation problems, like, they come into a certain town with
the bus, you know their names is on the bus and people didn’t want to serve
them because they were Black. They didn’t want to let them stay at their hotels
because they were Black and that’s why I said earlier about sometimes they
would have to sleep on the bus. Pull outside of the town and sleep on the bus.
And then going to certain restaurants and they tell em, “You don’t get served out
of the front door, you gotta go round through the back door.” Excuse me just a
sec [Phone buzzing]. Okay and he was telling me about they would go into some
restaurants and the people would tell them they had to get out and go around to
the back to be served. And the policemen stopping them and questioning them
about certain things, etcetera, like that. But I guess it was basically all of the
racial things that was going on back during that time. Going in and you can’t use
the bathroom because it says White Only, but they have no other bathroom. So
stuff like that.
C: And did he tell you about like you know how the owners got them equipment,
were the owners like—did they ever have problems with getting equipment? AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 26
M: No. He didn’t mention anything like that. They probably didn’t because all those
teams had their own equipment so, it probably didn’t have a problem getting it.
Even though there was a lot of racial stuff going on back then, that money was
still green [Laughter] You had the money to buy—for an example like those
buses, they had to have money to rent their own buses, so their money was still
green.
C: Alright, if you don’t have anything else to say one last question would be, what’s
a piece of advice that you’ve given youngsters throughout the years that you feel
is a good piece of advice to pass on?
M: Get your education, because, and I tell ‘em, “What you put up here belongs to
you.” The only way someone can get the knowledge that you have gained is if
you share it. And I tell all the young kids, your teachers are willing to share that
education that they have with you. Take advantage of it. Be a thief. Steal all the
knowledge you can from your teachers, because it’s important. What you put up
there belong to you. Somebody can take your life, but they still don’t have the
education that you have. They can come and take your car. They can steal your
car. They can burn your house down, and they’ve taken that away from you,
that’s material stuff. But if you get the very best education you can get, nobody
on God’s earth can take it away from you. It belongs to you. And the only way
someone can get it is if you share it. That’s what I try to tell them.
C: It’s good. Well, thank you for taking your time to meet with me and if you don’t
have anything else to say that is all.
[End of interview] AAHP 151B; Moore; Page 27
Audit-edited by: Anupa Kotipoyina, December 4th, 2017
Final edit by: Ryan Morini, February 19, 2019