The Outcome of the Comprehensive Spending Review
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House of Commons Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee The Outcome of the Comprehensive Spending Review Oral and written evidence 16 November 2010 and 30 March 2011 Ordered by The House of Commons to be printed 16 November 2010 HC 611-i–ii Published on 10 July 2012 by authority of the House of Commons London: The Stationery Office Limited £11.50 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee The Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee is appointed by the House of Commons to examine the expenditure, administration, and policy of the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and its associated bodies. Current membership Miss Anne McIntosh (Conservative, Thirsk and Malton) (Chair) Thomas Docherty (Labour, Dunfermline and West Fife) Richard Drax, (Conservative, South Dorset) George Eustice (Conservative, Camborne and Redruth) Barry Gardiner (Labour, Brent North) Mrs Mary Glindon (Labour, North Tyneside) Iain McKenzie (Labour, Inverclyde) Neil Parish (Conservative, Tiverton and Honiton) Ms Margaret Ritchie (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down) Dan Rogerson (Liberal Democrat, North Cornwall) Amber Rudd (Conservative, Hastings and Rye) Tom Blenkinsop (Labour, Middlesborough South and East Cleveland) and Cathy Jamieson (Labour/Co-operative, Kilmarnock and Loudoun) were also members of the Committee during this Parliament Powers The Committee is one of the departmental select committees, the powers of which are set out in House of Commons Standing Orders, principally in SO No. 152. These are available on the Internet via www.parliament.uk. Publications The reports and evidence of the Committee are published by The Stationery Office by Order of the House. All publications of the Committee (including press notices) are on the Internet at www.parliament.uk/efracom Committee staff The current staff of the Committee are Richard Cooke (Clerk), Lucy Petrie (Second Clerk), Sarah Coe (Committee Specialist—Environment), Phil Jones (Committee Specialist—Agriculture), Clare Genis (Senior Committee Assistant), Gabrielle Hill (Committee Assistant), Julie Evans (Committee Support Assistant), and Hannah Pearce (Media Officer). Contacts All correspondence should be addressed to the Clerk of the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee, House of Commons, 7 Millbank, London SW1P 3JA. The telephone number for general enquiries is 020 7219 5774; the Committee’s e-mail address is: [email protected]. Media inquiries should be addressed to Hannah Pearce on 020 7219 8430. List of witnesses Tuesday 16 November 2010 Page Rt Hon Caroline Spelman MP, Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, Dame Helen Ghosh DCB, Permanent Secretary, Defra and Peter Unwin, Director General, Environment and Rural Group, Defra Ev 1 Wednesday 30 March 2010 Rt Hon Caroline Spelman MP, Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, Bronwyn Hill, Permanent Secretary, Defra and Peter Unwin, Director General, Environmental and Rural Group, Defra Ev 44 List of written evidence 1 Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) Ev 24 2 Supplementary Defra Ev 25 3 Defra answers to written questions posed by EFRA Committee Ev 62 cobber Pack: U PL: COE1 [SO] Processed: [20-05-2011 11:28] Job: 009356 Unit: PG01 Source: /MILES/PKU/INPUT/009356/009356_o001_kathy_EFRA 16 11 10 (Corrected transcript).xml Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee: Evidence Ev 1 Oral evidence Taken before the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee on Tuesday 16 November 2010 Members present: Miss Anne McIntosh (Chair) Thomas Docherty Neil Parish Richard Drax Dan Rogerson George Eustice Amber Rudd ________________ Examination of Witnesses Witnesses: Rt Hon. Mrs Caroline Spelman MP, Secretary of State, Dame Helen Ghosh DCB, Permanent Secretary, and Peter Unwin, Director General, Environment and Rural Group, Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, gave evidence. Q1 Chair: Secretary of State good morning. Thank Departments, there are six of us that are within 6% of you very much for joining us, you’re most welcome. settlement, and we are very similar in many ways. This is the evidence session on the outcome of the There were other things we sought to secure as part Comprehensive Spending Review (CSR). For the of our early settlement—a reward for good behaviour record, would you like to introduce those you’ve if you like. Unusually, perhaps, the Treasury agreed brought with you this morning? to our request that we might be able to keep the Mrs Spelman: Yes, could I start by just apologising proceeds from sales of our assets, and perhaps even for being a few minutes late. more beneficially, 120% of the sales of those assets, Chair: I absolutely understand. which can be used by Defra for other capital projects. Mrs Spelman: Cabinet overran and I’ve come as The Treasury also agreed to help us with some of our quickly as I could. I think the Committee’s already redundancy costs. These additional things were part met the Permanent Secretary Helen Ghosh, but of what we regard as a reasonable settlement. perhaps not or perhaps previously, and Peter Unwin is one of our Director Generals. Q3 Chair: We know much more now about the Chair: Thank you. We quite understand, and we’re nature of the Comprehensive Spending Review results most grateful to you for coming. We understand that for the Department. What we don’t know at this stage the Cabinet ran on, so we kept your place warm for is what the impact will be in terms of local authority you. resources. Of course the two main risks for which Mrs Spelman: Thank you. your Department is responsible, that of flood risk, to which you’ve referred, and that of animal health, both Q2 Chair: Could I just start off with a couple of rely heavily on substantial local authority general questions? The settlement with your involvement. How concerned are you that, when it Department, Secretary of State, was one of the earliest comes to the local authority Comprehensive Spending and as a result, obviously you were first off the Review, they will actually have the resources both to ground. Do you regret, in a way, settling so early and commit to the flood risk management schemes, to the perhaps taking a bigger reduction than other maintenance of flood defences, and also to the front Departments or than you might have done if there had line if there ever was another animal health outbreak been a longer, more protracted negotiating process? such as BSE or foot and mouth? Mrs Spelman: No, not at all. We set out to try and Mrs Spelman: Well, we all work very closely with settle early because we took the view that, as a the Department for Communities and Local relatively small Department, to have been dragged Government. I work and have a good working before the Star Chamber for a reduction of between relationship with the Secretary of State in that 25% and 40% might have placed us in a very Department. In fact, both our Departments were vulnerable position. We felt there were a number of amongst the early settlers, which point will not be lost things we wanted to obtain as part of our settlement on the Select Committee, so the Select Committee with the Treasury, which we were more likely to might imagine that we spoke a great deal about the achieve if we were in the vanguard of early settlers. interrelationship that we have. We certainly strongly Specifically, we set out to try to protect capital recognise the importance of not placing unfunded expenditure, and I think I’ve mentioned to the Select burdens upon local government and we have allocated Committee before that it’s apparent that we have a to local government within our own budget, better than average settlement for capital. That was financially, recognition that it isn’t reasonable to ask particularly important to us in order to protect flood local authorities to do things without resourcing them defence capital. As part of the give and take it meant correctly. Specifically in relation to floods, we we had to take quite a tough settlement on resources, maintain our contribution to them. This is important but I think when Select Committee members actually in respect of the Flood and Water Management Act of look at where we’re placed amongst the unprotected course, because it’s recognised that there are lead local cobber Pack: U PL: COE1 [E] Processed: [20-05-2011 11:28] Job: 009356 Unit: PG01 Source: /MILES/PKU/INPUT/009356/009356_o001_kathy_EFRA 16 11 10 (Corrected transcript).xml Ev 2 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee: Evidence 16 November 2010 Rt Hon Mrs Caroline Spelman MP, Dame Helen Ghosh DCB and Peter Unwin authorities with responsibilities under that legislation. Q5 Dan Rogerson: To pick up on the Chair’s point In respect of animal health, again we work closely about maintenance, I am wondering about big society with local government. I’m sure we’ll come on to a issues. Obviously there are limits, and in some more extensive discussion about animal health departments it’s easier than in others to engage with budgets in general, but the risk based management voluntary organisations Looking at people such as the approach gives us that assurance that, working British Trust for Conservation Volunteers, who do together with local government, we can be resilient in maintenance work, there seems to be a body of people the face of any outbreak of animal or plant disease. I there who are quite keen to get out—I’ve seen them don’t know whether either of you would like to add doing some habitat work—but maybe that’s the sort something about local government? of stuff they could look at doing as well. Is that Dame Helen Ghosh: We will be able to test the something the Department would consider through the response of all sorts of local partners through the Environment Agency? various emergency exercises we carry out.