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House of Lords Official Report Vol. 724 Thursday No. 97 20 January 2011 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) HOUSE OF LORDS OFFICIAL REPORT ORDER OF BUSINESS (Continuation of Proceedings) Wednesday, 19 January 2011 (continued) Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Bill Committee (11th Day)(continued) Thurday, 20 January 2011 Introductions: Lord Fink, Lord Stoneham of Droxford, Baroness Berridge Questions Gaza Disabled People: Transport St Lucia: Hurricane Tomas Health: Influenza Vaccination Business of the House Timing of Debates Coalition Government Debate Counterterrorism Statement Coalition Government Debate (Continued) Terrorism Act 2000 (Proscribed Organisations) (Amendment) Order 2011 Motion to Approve Written Statements Written Answers For column numbers see back page £3·50 Lords wishing to be supplied with these Daily Reports should give notice to this effect to the Printed Paper Office. The bound volumes also will be sent to those Peers who similarly notify their wish to receive them. No proofs of Daily Reports are provided. Corrections for the bound volume which Lords wish to suggest to the report of their speeches should be clearly indicated in a copy of the Daily Report, which, with the column numbers concerned shown on the front cover, should be sent to the Editor of Debates, House of Lords, within 14 days of the date of the Daily Report. This issue of the Official Report is also available on the Internet at www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201011/ldhansrd/index/110120.html PRICES AND SUBSCRIPTION RATES DAILY PARTS Single copies: Commons, £5; Lords £3·50 Annual subscriptions: Commons, £865; Lords £525 WEEKLY HANSARD Single copies: Commons, £12; Lords £6 Annual subscriptions: Commons, £440; Lords £255 Index: Annual subscriptions: Commons, £125; Lords, £65. LORDS VOLUME INDEX obtainable on standing order only. Details available on request. BOUND VOLUMES OF DEBATES are issued periodically during the session. Single copies: Commons, £105; Lords, £40. Standing orders will be accepted. THE INDEX to each Bound Volume of House of Commons Debates is published separately at £9·00 and can be supplied to standing order. WEEKLY INFORMATION BULLETIN, compiled by the House of Commons, gives details of past and forthcoming business, the work of Committees and general information on legislation, etc. Single copies: £1·50. Annual subscription: £53·50. All prices are inclusive of postage. © Parliamentary Copyright House of Lords 2011, this publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Parliamentary Click-Use Licence, available online through the Office of Public Sector Information website at www.opsi.gov.uk/click-use/ 487 Parliamentary Voting System[] Parliamentary Voting System 488 [Continuation of Official Report from col. 486, of Wednesday, and Bristol also have great centres of excellence and 19 January 2011.] skill in financial services, but above all else that exists in the City of London and the square mile. I urge the Minister to recognise in this amendment that the City Parliamentary Voting System and is a very special place. Frankly, it will not be understood Constituencies Bill (continued) in the City or elsewhere if the City is just parcelled out among other constituencies. Committee (11th Day)(continued) Lord Martin of Springburn: I wish to speak to Wednesday, 19 January 2011 Amendment 81, on Argyll and Bute. I make no criticism of the other House when it debated this matter—far 12.23 am from it, as I served in that House for 30 years—but the Lord Myners: My Lords, I rise to speak in support different practices that exist in the other House are of the amendment proposed by my noble friend Lady such that perhaps constituencies and the problems of Hayter—Amendment 85C—and I endorse the very them in legislation like this are not always highlighted wise observations made from the opposition Benches in the way that can happen in this Chamber. Please be by the noble Lord, Lord Jenkin of Roding. assured that bringing up Argyll is not a reason to delay. I just want to explain that Argyll should have the special consideration that the Minister’s former Lord Jenkin of Roding: These are now the government constituency is to be given because of its vastness. Benches. Perhaps the noble Lord has forgotten. I asked the Library to look at the size of other constituencies along with Argyll and Bute. Penrith Lord Myners: I think that we regard you as at best and The Border was represented by David Maclean— temporary occupants of the Spiritual and Temporal Lord Maclean as he will now be, as he is about to Benches on the opposite side. come here—whom I considered a good friend regardless As I look to the opposite side, I see many people of the fact that we belong to different political traditions. who, like me, have enjoyed a career as a result of the Penrith and The Border covers 113 square miles. Anyone great focus of skill that we have in the City of London. who has been in that part of the world will acknowledge I look to those who have represented the City of that Penrith and The Border is a very big constituency, London, such as the noble Lord, Lord Brooke, who but in comparison Argyll and Bute is 2,751 square was for many years my Member of Parliament—I may miles. Westmorland is 61 square miles compared with not have agreed with his politics, but he was an extremely the 2,751 of Argyll and Bute. good constituency MP—and to the noble Baroness, My noble friend Lord Robertson—an Argyllshire Lady Wheatcroft, who was a City editor. boy, born and bred—tells me that, if you were to Without wishing to inflame the views of those measure every inch of the Argyll coastline, the distance behind me, I would say that the City is the City of would be such that it would take you from Glasgow to London. We do not use the term “the City”as shorthand New York. The islands are not small by any means. for Birmingham, Manchester or Truro, where I come There is Mull, Jura, Islay, Colonsay, Tiree, Gigha, Coll from. The City is the City of London—the square and the beautiful and ancient Iona, where Columba mile—which is a source of great excellence and a brought Christianity to Scotland. centre of economic prosperity. Of course, some firms based in the City have experienced recent difficulties, 12.30 pm but we must not forget that many sectors of activity For the local Member of Parliament to travel in conducted within the City of London, under the Argyll, from Oban he would need to travel by car 68 supervision of the Corporation and the guidance and miles to get to Campbeltown, not by motorway but by framework that the City of London provides, have old-fashioned, traditional roads. To get to some of the continued to prosper. I think here particularly of fund islands, the Member of Parliament would have to take management and of insurance. a ferry to one island and, if he wished to go to another The City is the square mile, and we cannot see this island, he would have to take another ferry. As my great centre of excellence divided as part of a rounding noble friend Lord Foulkes will know, when you get to error to make weight for adjacent constituencies with Campbeltown and the famous Mull of Kintyre, you wholly different profiles. To ensure continuing effective are to the south of Ayr and the constituency that he liaison among Guildhall, the City Corporation and represented—although you are separated by a vast Parliament, it is important that the City resides within amount of water. a single parliamentary constituency. That is why I support the amendment of my noble friend Lady Lord Foulkes of Cumnock: In between there is the Hayter. island of Arran, which, on the basis of the arguments I was fortunate to be offered a ministerial position put forward by the noble Lord, Lord Fowler, ought to in the previous Government. My formal title was be a constituency of its own. Financial Services Secretary to the Treasury, but the office was commonly referred to in the press and Lord Martin of Springburn: I will take the noble elsewhere as “the City Minister”. I endeavoured at all Lord’s word for that. times to recognise that I had a particular responsibility If the boundary commissioner was to look only at to speak for the activities that took place in the City. numbers and close proximity, there could be some Other centres such as Edinburgh, Manchester, Norwich strange notions because places such as Campbeltown 489 Parliamentary Voting System[LORDS] Parliamentary Voting System 490 [LORD MARTIN OF SPRINGBURN] to say to the officials of the House of Commons when are geographically closer to Ballycastle in Northern they annoyed me on a Thursday, “Leave me alone. Ireland than to Glasgow and other parts of neighbouring The call of the north is coming upon me. I don’t want constituencies. to be bothered”; the only Thursday that I did not leave I have been neutral for 10 years. When I took the London was in preparation for the Cenotaph. My great office of Speaker of the House of Commons, I duty in that travel was to attend to my constituency in gave up my membership of a political party, as other Glasgow North East. I was conscious that, when I Speakers did. Being in a political party is an enjoyable would meet Alan at the airport—we took the same experience. It is not only about political belief, but plane—within half an hour of my arriving at Glasgow friendship and kindredship, going to conferences and airport I could be at a constituency meeting, yet he meeting friends, who are like family.
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