Conversations with Charles Dodsley Walker, Part II Neal Campbell
Part 1 of this interview was published in the March 2010 issue of THE DIAPA- SON. Charles Dodsley Walker celebrated his 90th birthday on March 16. He is a Fellow of the American Guild of Organ- ists and is the founding director of the Canterbury Choral Society, which he began in 1952 at the Church of Heavenly Rest—a position he still holds, preparing and conducting three concerts per sea- son. Part I ended with Mr. Walker about to leave for France to serve as organist at the American Cathedral in Paris. NC: So, you’re in Paris. CDW: Yes, I’d longed to go to France; this was my fi rst time there. I’d been to a French-speaking country during the war—Algeria, on the way to Sicily. At Trinity College, I had immersed myself in the study of the French language and cul- ture, and this was a dream come true. Charles Dodsley Walker teaching air- I lived in the deanery—a lovely three- craft recognition while in the Navy, 1944 story stone building separated from the (Offi cial U.S. Navy photograph) cathedral by a garden. The church sexton was a man named Lucien; he was also a cathedral, as director of the American master chef, and he did a lot of things Students’ and Artists’ Center on the Left beside dust the church pews off, I’ll tell Bank—a beautiful building on what had you that! I lived there on the top fl oor of Brahms Requiem at the American Cathedral, Paris, 1949 been Chateaubriand’s estate. The place the deanery, and he would come up and had been closed up because the Ger- wake me up in the morning with a plate One of the things I tried to do was to concert I want to conduct your orches- mans had taken it over during the war. of what he called paingrillé, which was get more Americans in the choir. I had tra and do a concert with my chorus and a word I hadn’t learned in my study in a lot of French opera singers already in your orchestra.” All my life I’d wanted to NC: So this was an umbrella of the French, but it turns out it was actually there. They’d sing [mimicking the French do works for chorus and orchestra. Many cathedral or part of its ministry? two words, pain and grillé—toast. pronunciation of English] oly, oly, oly, of the orchestra players were members CDW: Yes, exactly, to students in Par- looord Gott uf osts, aven ant urse are fuel of Lamoreux Orchestra, which was an is. On the fi rst fl oor it had a theater with NC: Quite a few well-known Ameri- of zei gloory, so I was trying to get more important orchestra in Paris. So we did a balcony. It didn’t have a very big stage, can organists have held that post, Americans, and Janet [Hayes, later Mrs. the Palestrina Missa Brevis unaccompa- more of a lecturers’ stage than a theater haven’t they? CDW] was part of that campaign after nied, of course, and then his orchestra stage. And there was a big lounge, and a CDW: Yes, Robert Owen preceded we married. joined us for the Bach Magnifi cat. It was billiard room. On the second fl oor they me and Donald Wilkins followed me. One day after service, a little man recorded on acetate discs, which I still had a library and on the opposite wing They were great years over there, espe- came up to talk to me and said, “I am have, and it was broadcast over the Ra- was the director’s apartment. I had ad- cially if you were a Francophile. Pierre Duvauchelle and I am the con- diodiffusion Française. ministrative charge of the operations of ductor of the Paris Chamber Orchestra. I must have met Langlais by then, the center. NC: What were services like at the You have a beautiful acoustic here in the because I remember that he came to American Cathedral? They were in cathedral.” Well, he wanted to do a series that concert and complimented me on NC: And that’s where you lived? English, I assume? of three or four concerts at the cathedral. the Palestrina. He also brought along a CDW: That’s where we lived—I was CDW: Yes, they were just as if you And I thought quickly and said, “I will friend, a pupil I think, named Pierre Co- married by then. The apartment provid- were here in the States. Everything was see to it that you may have the use of the chereau, whom I met for the fi rst time. ed for the director was very comfortable. in English, we chanted the canticles and cathedral, heated and lighted, for the fi rst Not too long after I arrived, the dean The building was designed by prize-win- so forth. three concerts, and then for the fourth gave me a new job, in addition to the ning architect Welles Bosworth, who
Organ recital series, American Cathedral, Paris, 1949 Janet Hayes and Ned Rorem, American Embassy, Paris, 1950
24 THE DIAPASON
June 2010 pp. 24-29 .indd 24 5/12/10 9:18:59 AM Church of the Heavenly Rest, Fifth Avenue and 90th Street, New York City Bach, St. Matthew Passion, Canterbury Choral Society, Good Friday, 1957
had been J. D. Rockefeller’s architect him at the American Embassy; he ac- and they had been sent to Ernest Skin- and put the phone down. Then I called in charge of restoring Reims Cathedral. companied her. One of the things Bou- ner in America in order to learn from André Marchal, and repeated my story, He also designed all those buildings for langer did was to act as a resource to the him. The result was that it was a rather saying that Dupré had agreed to play, MIT along the Charles River that have American ambassador in Paris in pro- typical E. M. Skinner Solo division. It and would you do it, and he said yes. Of those rotundas. And several former Har- viding Franco-American musicians for had nice strings, a French Horn, one of course, if Dupré hadn’t agreed to do it, it vard students were over there—Robert concerts of the Cultural Relations of the the few in France, a Tuba Mirabilis, and might have been a different story. I didn’t Middleton, Noel Lee, Douglas Allan- American Embassy. And on this concert a Philomela which was huge! No chorus know Marchal from a hole in the ground! brook. Leon Fleisher was there at the Janet sang some of Ned’s songs. reeds, but, of course, there were 16, 8, It was the same with Langlais, Messiaen, time, also. Janet had gone to the New England and 4 reeds on the Great. and Durufl é. These names were legend, Conservatory on the recommendation of Anyway, I saw this organ and thought even back then. NC: Those were pretty heady years Eleanor Steber, and she won the Frank it would be nice to have a recital se- Then I called up Mlle. Boulanger, tell- to be in Paris; you must have met Huntington Beebe award for study ries. So I told the dean I’d like to invite ing her that I had asked each of these many well-known persons? abroad, which is what brought her to a bunch of famous French organists to eminent organists to conclude with an CDW: Yes, including Poulenc, and Paris. She knew Ned at the New Eng- play on this organ, and he said “Fine, improvisation, and asked her to submit notably Nadia Boulanger, whom I had land Conservatory and he dedicated a go ahead.” I wish I could remember the the themes for each of these players. I known from her time in Cambridge piece to her—A Sermon on Miracles, fee we paid them, but it was ridiculously must have caught her at a weak moment while I was at Harvard. A lot of people which we performed in his presence at small. I think it was 10,000 francs, which and she agreed. As it turns out, I had to were studying with her in Paris in those the Church of the Heavenly Rest many was about $30. chase her up each week to get the themes days. Janet studied with her. She was years later, in 1973. So, I picked up the phone—believe in time for the recital. It wasn’t that she Nadia’s favorite singer, and everyone We also toured throughout Germany it or not—and called Marcel Dupré, gave me all fi ve at once in advance. said she sang French songs better than during the summers of 1950, ’51, and ’52 whom I had met through Clarence Wat- the French did. under the auspices of the United States ters in this country. He was the only one NC: Was that part of the promotion- Department of State as part of a cultural I knew, and I didn’t call him Marcel, ei- al packaging of the series, that she NC: Boulanger didn’t teach voice, exchange program established after the ther! It was “Maître, would you be will- would be supplying the themes? did she? war. The state department wanted to ing to play on a series on this organ? I CDW: It wasn’t on the advertising, but CDW: No, she had been a very close present our musicians so the German want to help raise the reputation of the on the program I inserted a little slip sheet friend of Fauré, and coached singers people wouldn’t think we were all bar- American Cathedral as an artistic center stating that the themes for each of the im- working on his songs. She didn’t ex- barians. That was the whole point. There in Paris.” He agreed and I thanked him, provisations had been kindly submitted actly teach vocal technique. She said were American artists, poets, authors, some things I don’t agree with. For in- and musicians presenting their work all stance, she would say—I forget exactly over Germany. We performed in forty how she put it, but something like “Oh, different cities in West Germany during you don’t have to sing those songs in a those summers, playing a lot of Ameri- sexy way.” Well, many of Fauré’s songs can music, including works by Sowerby, are incredibly sexy and you do need to Piston, Bingham, Pinkham, Lukas Foss, bring that across. Her forte was teach- and Rorem—that was part of the propa- ing composition. ganda to show the Germans that we had One thing that Nadia did that was in- composers and performers, and that we fl uential was that every Wednesday she cared about these things. had a salon—a sort of open house—and While we were there we crossed paths young people who liked to trail on the with Daniel Pinkham and a young violin- footsteps of the stars would pop in on ist named Robert Brink, who were tour- Wednesday afternoons. ing doing the same thing. Actually, you were supposed to know her to show up at these. Well, one of the NC: There must have been many times I was there, Robert Shaw, who I Americans with whom you rendez- guess had heard of these, showed up, voused in Paris? and apparently he didn’t know her. I was CDW: Yes. Clarence Dickinson and sitting there with several others, and the Seth Bingham paid courtesy calls at the doorbell rang, and Nadia asked if I would cathedral. Thornton Wilder was a mem- answer the door, and when I did, it was ber of the bridal party for a wedding I Robert Shaw. I brought him in, intro- was playing, and I was introduced to him duced him, and Nadia was sitting there as if I were being introduced to the next- like a grand dame, which she was! door neighbor. A lot of people found So, he sat down and the rest of that their way to the American Cathedral. afternoon the conversation was all about how diffi cult it was to fi nd a garage to NC: Edouard Nies-Berger? park your car in Paris. There wasn’t a CDW: Yes, he visited at the cathedral word about Fauré and his use of modal- and at the Students’ and Artists’ Center. ity or anything musical like that! This He was a very friendly man. I also met is what was going on, and she was just Hugh Giles over there. I’d only spent a being friendly, and I don’t recall her ad- year in New York before coming to Paris, dressing a word to Bob Shaw. Nothing! so I hadn’t met many of the big name or- It was funny. ganists until they came through Paris. NC: Poulenc? NC: Tell me about the organ recital CDW: For some reason, I remember series you organized at the Ameri- having dinner with him at an outdoor res- can Cathedral. taurant on one of those avenues that lead CDW: When I got there I found out up to the Opéra. He hadn’t even written what a wonderful organ it was. It had his now-famous Gloria at this time. He been a big three-manual Cavaillé-Coll. gave quite a few small concerts with sing- In 1930 it was enlarged, and a fourth ers. There was this singer named Pierre manual added. It was one of the very Bernac, and Poulenc would accompany few organs in France at that time with him. I’d run into them a couple of times capture combination action. Leaving all and we were just friendly. that aside, it was a real Cavaillé-Coll, with wonderful reeds and an abundance NC: Ned Rorem must have been of everything you wanted. The Solo divi- around in those days. sion was not so big. It was built by Mai- CDW: Yes, Janet did a concert with son Pleyel, successors to Cavaillé-Coll,
JUNE, 2010 25
June 2010 pp. 24-29 .indd 25 5/12/10 9:19:24 AM At an event with AGO president Harold Heeremans, 1960
by Nadia Boulanger. The recitals were a to hear what it sounded like out in the week apart in Lent, and there were big church). And before he came to practice crowds and wide newspaper coverage. he said, “you know, I want to have some time there pour choisir mes couleurs, to NC: How did the organ in the Ameri- choose my colors.” And he went way up can Cathedral stack up in compari- in my estimation. But he was the most son with the famous Paris organs? concerned that it be a good recital. CDW: Well, for one thing, it was in The main thing I remember about better tune than any of the others, and Durufl é was that he arrived at the ap- At a rehearsal of Haydn’s Creation, with Ara Berberian, Blake Stern, and Louise that was because of the Germans. They pointed time outside the cathedral rid- Natalie, 1960 had taken over the cathedral and used it ing a bicycle. as their army church. Say what you will Jr.], Eddie West at the Cathedral [Canon things, including several television per- about their politics, but by golly if they NC: How did you happen to go back Edward N. West, later Sub-Dean of the formances: one with Victor Borge, on were going to have a Wehrmachtskirche, to New York? Cathedral of St. John the Divine in New a program at Christmas time—just be- it was going to have an organ that was CDW: One of the real reasons I want- York]—I mean personal friends who cause it was Christmas time and I had a in tune. So the organ was in great shape ed to come back was, as you can imagine, were in a position to be helpful and who boys’ choir. when I got there. It was amazing. that I was so busy being the director of knew my work. Talk about TV—I did later do a pro- the Center—I think we had fi ve or six gram with CCS with Robert Merrill on NC: Did you have an opportunity to hundred members. It wasn’t a musical NC: What was the musical tradition “I’ve Got a Secret,” and the secret was hear any of these organists in their job at all, but it was my full-time job, and at Heavenly Rest as you found it? the star, it was his birthday. So, in the own churches? the cathedral position was secondary. CDW: For one thing, there was an as- course of the show, they had a barber- CDW: Very little. Durufl é, for exam- So when I found out that Heavenly sistant organist I inherited, so that made shop quartet sing “Happy Birthday” to ple, at St.-Etienne-du-Mont didn’t have Rest had an opening, I made every ef- a smooth transition. I had never heard a him. Then they laughed and scratched the organ; it was down. I don’t think he fort to look into it. It was the Rev. Rich- service there previously, but my impres- for a while, then a larger group came in had any organ to play. With all my duties, ard R. P. Coombs, who had been a tenor sion was that it was pretty run of the mill. and they sang “Happy Birthday” to him. I didn’t get to other churches very often. in my choir in Cambridge and who had They did have a men and boys choir, but And they laughed and scratched and did In retrospect, I certainly wish I could gone to seminary during the war, and with some female ringers in it. One of some more things. Meanwhile, there have heard more. I did go to Ste. Clo- who had told me of the opening at the my so-called claims to being a candidate was a stage at the other end of the studio tilde from time to time, because I was Paris Cathedral—he was now the curate was that I was considered experienced with the curtains closed, and at the giv- very close to Langlais. at Heavenly Rest and told me of the va- at dealing with boys. And I built up that en point, the curtains were opened and One thing that might be of interest cancy there. choir a lot, until, one fi ne day when ev- there were one hundred members of the is my impressions of these great men as ery one of the best boys I had, every one Canterbury Choral Society and Robert they came to the cathedral to practice. NC: So he had a hand in your going of them—let’s say there were thirty kids, Merrill in the middle of them to put the For one thing, I was . . . skeptical is too to Paris and in your coming back to and the eight best ones either went off fi nishing touches of “Happy Birthday” in strong a word, but I was not convinced New York? to prep school or their voices changed. a paraphrase of a Mozart opera chorus, that every note that Messiaen wrote CDW: He did! And with what I had left, I felt I really as I recall. That was a lot of fun. down was for real, or whether he was couldn’t do the repertoire, so I wrote trying for effect in one way or the other. NC: What sort of process did you the vestry saying I thought we needed NC: What was the organ like at But of all those organists, Messiaen was have to go through when you ap- to strengthen the women’s sections, and Heavenly Rest as you found it? the one who practiced the longest; he ac- plied for the job? from that time you really couldn’t say it CDW: It was a 1929 Austin, and it tually got me in there and asked me to CDW: I simply wrote to anybody who was a boy choir. had either three or four 8-foot diapasons play some passages (and I’d never even was anybody who knew my work—Frank Still, we continued to have a boy choir on the Great and they were all leather played any of his music, but he wanted Sayre [the Very Rev. Francis B. Sayre, as a separate choir, and we did lots of lipped. It was a big four-manual organ, with a typical complement of stops on each division, except it only had about four ranks in the Pedal! It did have a drawknob console. Anyway, it was like a /44/ (%533 /2'!. 0!243 whole set of foghorns. NC: It must have been quite a dif- 4RADITION AND 0ROGRESS ference from the Cavaillé-Coll at the Paris Cathedral? CDW: It sure was! I had correspon- &OR