Ansteorran College of Heralds
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ANSTEORRAN COLLEGE OF HERALDS Collated Commentary on IloI 0300 Herewith please find the decisions made on ILoI0300 at Elfsea Springfaire on May 20, AS XXXV, being 2000 in the common era. Kathri, Asterisk Unto the Ansteorran College of Heralds does Estrill Swet, Retiarius Pursuivant, make greetings. For information on commentary submission formats or to receive a copy of the collated commentary, you can contact me at: Deborah Sweet 824 E 8th, Stillwater, OK 74074 405/624-9344 (before 10pm) [email protected] Commenters for this issue: Gawain of Miskbridge – Green Anchor Herald, Calontir Maridonna Benvenuti - Names only. Sources: Withycombe 3rd ed.; Reaney and Wilson 3rd ed.; Ekwall 4th ed.; OED Compact, 1971; Black, 1996. Colm Dubh's Inn and Tavern Names (KWHS, 1998) Da'ud ibn Auda - al-Jamal Herald Magnus von Lübeck – Raven's Fort Bryn Gwlad – I have screwed up one name yet again: our new commenter's name is "Salvador", as in El or San. Also present: Gwenllian ferch Maredudd, Mari nic Bryan, Andri de Chartres, Johann Kiefer Hayden, Daniel de Lincoln (y'r humble scribe and first-person comments). Unless noted, we checked all armory against the 8th edition Ordinary and we found no conflicts. No conflicts found on names except as noted. 1. Ariane Lancaster (Namron) New name. New device. Per pale sable and purpure, a sun argent. Maridonna Benvenuti [Name]- Withycombe says of Ariadne: "…The name was borne by an obscure Phrygian martyr, and in the forms 'Arianna' and 'Ariane' has been used in Italy and France respectively. It has been used occasionally in England of late years, probably with no reference to the saint." I can't find any documentation in my sources that 'Ariane' was used as an English name in period. Lancaster - OK Magnus von Lübeck [Name] Withycombe page 31 under Ariadne gives it as the name of an obscure Phrygian martyr and the form Ariane is used in France but no date is given. Most of the name's use in England appears to be modern. Morlet in Volume 2 Names from the Latin dates Arianus from 878. The Book of Saints by Benedictine monks of St. Augustine Abbey, Ramsgate, 6th ed., A. & C. Black Ltd. London, 1989, gives St. Arian from 311 AD as the governor of Thebes in Egypt. The female form of the name may have survived in France until the Norman Conquest to be brought to England but this is speculation. Reaney & Wilson page 270 under Lanchester gives Heruis de Langecestre from 1150 and Walter de Lancestre from 1344. Bryn Gwlad [Device] Conflict with the Ansteorran Chronicler's badge, "(Tinctureless) A mullet of five greater and five lesser points distilling gouttes.". 1 CD for fieldless / tinctureless, no CD for the maintained gouttes (as stated in many previous Laurel returns). A previous Crown and chronicler said they were willing to release the badge entirely. I've heard that a more recent set said they wanted to make it monotinctured. 1. COLLEGE ACTION: Name: Forwarded to Laurel. Device: Returned for conflict with the Ansteorran Chronicler's badge (see Bryn Gwlad). 2. Armando de la Cabanna (Steppes) New device. Name submitted in IloI08899, LoI1099 [and registered 2/2000]. Sable, a double-bitted ax and on a chief Or, a mullet of five greater and five lesser points sable. Da'ud ibn Auda [Device] Ah, a capo d'Ansteorra. (Not unlike the capo dell'Impero or capo d'Angiò used by the Guelphs and the Ghibellines, respectively.) Bryn Gwlad [Device] Hard to tell from the mini-emblazon: if the mullet on the chief is touching both edges, it's "throughout"; if neither, it's not; if one edge but not the other, it's not really period style and someone should take a bit of white-out to it. Bordure should probably touch up the mini before it goes on the LoI. This is a fine period-style example of a chief of alliegance. That was a practice especially done in Italy, where a Guelf or Ghibbeline would use a chief of France (azure with fleurs-de-lys Or) or of the Empire (Or, an eagle sable) to show alliegance. Daniel commends him. In an early Ansteorran Gazette, Tadhg Liath, then Star, grumped that Ansteorra would consider the Ansteorran mullet to be reserved for Ansteorra augmentations. Daniel disagrees strongly. Laurel doesn't reserve such kingdom charges, be it our star, the four crescents conjoined of Caid, the Calontiri cross of Calatrava, et cetera. That means that a kingdom return would be immediately appealed to Laurel, and it would be registered (barring other problems). In such a case, the Ansteorran CoH would just be say "nyah nyah, gotta say the magic word 'appeal'", delaying the submission a few months, and possibly losing him the chance to register due to another registration in the interim. For this reason, Daniel believes that each kingdom CoH should just enforce Laurel's rules and not make new ones. (There's an Bruce prec. anyway that arguably forbids it anyway.) Further, we should encourage a nice period practice that's rarely done. Close but clear of Neil Greenstone, "Sable, a double-bitted axe and a bordure Or". 1 CD for the type of secondary and 1 CD for the addition of the tertiary. 2. COLLEGE ACTION: Device: Forwarded to Laurel. 3. Caitlin ferch Gwynora (Dragonsfire Tor) New device. Name registered 11/93. Per chevron wavy argent and azure, a rabbit courant to sinister sable. Magnus von Lübeck [Device] The rabbit obscures the wavy field division and causes problems with identifiability. Perhaps a little smaller hare. Bryn Gwlad [Device] A part-metal / part-color field is neutral per X.2.a.ii, "as long as identifiability is maintained". There was some question about the amound of sable bunny over the blue part of the field. 3. COLLEGE ACTION: Device: Returned because the rabbit obscures the wavy field division, and the combination of azure and sable creates further problems with identifying both the rabbit and the field division. The primary suggestions from the meeting were: (1) Make the chevron steeper – period chevrons often looked like "a pile reversed." (2) Use gules instead of azure, or instead of sable. The blue-red or black-red combination creates much more contrast than blue-black. 4. Catalina Ana de Salamanca (Bryn Gwlad) New name. New device. Argent, a wagon wheel azure, a bordure vert. Magnus von Lübeck [Name] Donald Mathew, Atlas of Medieval Europe, Facts On File Inc., New York, page 70 gives Salamanca on a map from 1031 and page 114 on a map from 1300. Melcon, Apellidos Castellano- Leoneses, page 235 has Salamanca as a province with people dated from 1086, 1186, 1198 1206 and 1286. Page 244 also lists it as a province with people dated to 1142, 1229, 1245, and 1299. Bryn Gwlad [Name] http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/juliana/isabella/locative.html, "Spanish Names from the Late 15th Century" by Juliana de Luna (Julia Smith, [email protected]), is drawn from "the account books of Isabel of Castilla". She dates "de Salamanca" to the late 15th C, apparently in that spelling. [Device] Close but clear of Eldred {AE}lfwald, "Argent, a wheel, a bordure embattled azure", for the tincture and complex line of the bordure. 4. COLLEGE ACTION: Name: Forwarded to Laurel. Device: Forwarded to Laurel. 5. Dominique Michelle le Vasseur (Steppes) Resubmitted device. Name registered 2/99. Argent, a peacock contourney and a bordure invected purpure. Magnus von Lübeck [Device] Close but clear this time of Mahala de Sorbonne December 1987: "Argent, a peacock in its pride proper, a bordure invected purpure." One CD for turning the peacock contourny and a CD for pavonated vs. in its pride. The blazon could use pavonated to base added. Bryn Gwlad [Device] Consider Helena of Heathcote, "Argent, a heathcock passant to sinister within a bordure purpure". 1 CD for the complex line of the bordure. Is there a CD for they type of bird? A moorcock / heathcock is shown on Fox-Davies Complete Guide to Heraldry, p. 249. He says some depictions show an uplifted tuft of feathers in the tail, but some just have a broad tail. "Send it up when you're in doubt / Write to Laurel to work it out", doggerals Johann Kiefer Hayden. Close but clear of Mahala de Sorbonne, "Argent, a peacock in its pride proper, a bordure invected purpure". 1 CD for posture. 1 CD for tincture: a peacock proper is blue or green. 5. COLLEGE ACTION: Device: Forwarded to Laurel reblazoned as "..a peacock pavonated contourny.." with a request for a visual check against Helena of Heathcote. 6. Donald MacDonald (Lindenwood) New name. New device. Vert, three sheep statant argent. Maridonna Benvenuti [Name]- Donald - as stated; MacDonald - Black also shows the late spellings of McDonyll in 1521 and MakDonald in 1571. Bryn Gwlad [Device] To Donald, Daniel bequeaths all the Norman sheep jokes. 6. COLLEGE ACTION: Name: Forwarded to Laurel. Device: Forwarded to Laurel. 7. Elizabeth Curry (Brad Leah) New household name Greymoore Pack. New badge. Name registered 8/88 from Meridies. (Fieldless) A tawny greyhound courant contourny winged azure and carrying in his mouth a hunting horn vert. [Asterisk: the greyhound is Crayola Classic Marker brown.] Gawain of Miskbridge [Name] I don't see how this name fits into the allowable categories of prototypes for household names; it looks like neither a guild, a family, a military unit, nor an inn name. [Badge] The blazon says we have "a tawny greyhound. azure." Perhaps what's intended is "a tawny greyhound proper. winged azure"? Maridonna Benvenuti [Name] - Greymoore - Ekwall shows 'Graythwaite' [Graythwayt 1336]"…the first element may be ON gra(r) or OE graeg 'grey'".