• Abstract and Figures
• Public Full-text

NORTHWEST TERRITORIES LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY

5th Session Day 32 17th Assembly

HANSARD

Friday, May 30, 2014

Pages 4511 – 4544

The Honourable Jackie Jacobson, Speaker Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories Members of the Legislative Assembly

Speaker Hon. Jackie Jacobson (Nunakput)

______

Hon. Glen Abernethy Mrs. Jane Groenewegen Mr. Kevin Menicoche (Great Slave) (Hay River South) (Nahendeh) Minister of Health and Social Services Minister responsible for Mr. Robert Hawkins Hon. J. Michael Persons with Disabilities (Yellowknife Centre) Miltenberger Minister responsible for Seniors (Thebacha) Hon. Jackson Lafferty Government House Leader Hon. Tom Beaulieu Minister of Finance (Monfwi) Minister of Environment and Natural (Tu Nedhe) Deputy Premier Minister of Human Resources Resources Minister of Education, Culture and Minister responsible for the Minister of Transportation Employment NWT Power Corporation Minister of Public Works and Minister responsible for the Workers’ Services Safety and Compensation Commission Mr. Alfred Moses Ms. Wendy Bisaro (Inuvik Boot Lake) (Frame Lake) Hon. Bob McLeod (Yellowknife South) Mr. Michael Nadli Mr. Frederick Blake Premier (Deh Cho) (Mackenzie Delta) Minister of Executive Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and Hon. David Ramsay Mr. Robert Bouchard Intergovernmental Relations (Kam Lake) Minister responsible for Women (Hay River North) Minister of Justice Minister of Industry, Tourism Mr. Bob Bromley Hon. Robert C. McLeod and Investment (Inuvik Twin Lakes) Minister responsible for the (Weledeh) Minister of Municipal and Public Utilities Board Community Affairs Mr. Daryl Dolynny Minister of Lands Mr. Norman Yakeleya (Range Lake) Minister responsible for the (Sahtu) NWT Housing Corporation Minister responsible for Youth

______Officers Clerk of the Legislative Assembly Ms. Colette Langlois

Deputy Clerk Principal Clerk, Principal Clerk, Law Clerks Committees and Corporate and Public Affairs Interparliamentary Affairs Mr. Doug Schauerte Mr. Michael Ball Ms. Gail Bennett Ms. Sheila MacPherson Ms. Malinda Kellett Mr. Glen Rutland ______Box 1320 Yellowknife, Northwest Territories Tel: (867) 669-2200 Fax: (867) 920-4735 Toll-Free: 1-800-661-0784 http://www.assembly.gov.nt.ca

Published under the authority of the Speaker of the Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories 4

1) TABLE OF CONTENTS

PRAYER...... 4511

MINISTERS' STATEMENTS...... 4511

69-17(5) – Inuvik-Tuktoyaktuk Highway (Beaulieu)...... 4511

70-17(5) – Building Community Policing Partnerships (Ramsay)...... 4512

71-17(5) – National Cancer Survivors Day (Abernethy)...... 4512

MEMBERS' STATEMENTS...... 4513

Acknowledgement of Sahtu Aurora College Graduates (Yakeleya)...... 4513

Acknowledgement of Nahendeh High School Graduates (Menicoche)...... 4514

Support for Grandparents Caring for Grandchildren (Groenewegen)...... 4514

Implementation of Junior Kindergarten (Bisaro)...... 4515

Temporary Foreign Worker Program (Dolynny)...... 4515

Provision of BiliBlankets for Babies Affected by Jaundice (Moses)...... 4516

New Hay River Health Centre (Bouchard)...... 4516

Preparing Tomorrow’s Leaders Today (Nadli)...... 4517

Giant Mine Remediation Plans (Bromley)...... 4517

Consumer Affairs Protection Division (Hawkins)...... 4518

RETURNS TO ORAL QUESTIONS...... 4518

RECOGNITION OF VISITORS IN THE GALLERY...... 4519

ORAL QUESTIONS...... 4519, 4529

WRITTEN QUESTIONS...... 4537

NOTICES OF MOTION...... 4537 Motion 19-17(5) – Financial Compensation for Medical and Non-Medical Travel Escorts (Yakeleya)...... 4537

NOTICES OF MOTION FOR FIRST READING OF BILLS...... 4537

Bill 28 – Supplementary Appropriation Act (Infrastructure Expenditures), No. 3, 2014- 2015...... 4537

FIRST READING OF BILLS...... 4538

Bill 27 – Miscellaneous Statute Law Amendment Act, 2014...... 4538

Bill 26 – Act Act to Amend the Elections and Plebiscites Act...... 4538

CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE OF BILLS AND OTHER MATTERS 4538

REPORT OF COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE...... 4544

ORDERS OF THE DAY...... 4544 May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 6

YELLOWKNIFE, NORTHWEST TERRITORIES Friday, May 30, 2014 Members Present Hon. Glen Abernethy, Hon. Tom Beaulieu, Ms. Bisaro, Mr. Bouchard, Mr. Bromley, Mr. Dolynny, Mrs. Groenewegen, Mr. Hawkins, Hon. Jackie Jacobson, Hon. Jackson Lafferty, Hon. Bob McLeod, Hon. Robert McLeod, Mr. Menicoche, Hon. Michael Miltenberger, Mr. Moses, Mr. Nadli, Hon. David Ramsay, Mr. Yakeleya

Valley Highway that will continue south The House met at 10:01 a.m. to Wrigley to connect the entire NWT. Mr. Speaker, the project is progressing 2) Prayer according to the Department of Transportation’s estimates. Operations ---Prayer ran smoothly and efficiently this winter SPEAKER (Hon. Jackie Jacobson): to make the most of the construction Good morning, colleagues. Item 2, season. Ministers’ statements. The honourable Work began this winter following the Minister of Transportation, Mr. Beaulieu. procurement and delivery of new 3) Ministers’ Statements equipment. Seventy-five percent of the major equipment on site is either new or MINISTER'S STATEMENT 69-17(5): near new. This allowed work to continue INUVIK-TUKTOYAKTUK without delay as breakdowns were HIGHWAY minimized, safety was increased and HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Mr. Speaker, the carbon footprint of operations was the Government of the Northwest reduced. Territories has committed to building a Seventy-two days of construction took strong, prosperous territory and place on the north end of the project ensuring its benefits are shared in all near Tuktoyaktuk, lasting from mid- communities and regions. Strategic February to the end of April. During this investments in transportation time, crews made progress on the infrastructure will help support the long- construction of 16 kilometres of term growth of our economy and provide embankment, one bridge and six large jobs and opportunities to our people. diameter culverts. On the south end by The Inuvik-Tuktoyaktuk highway is one Inuvik, there were 58 days of of these projects, and I am pleased to construction from report on the success of the first winter of construction. The highway is one of the largest March 3 to the end of April, resulting in construction projects ever undertaken progress on the construction of 13 by the GNWT and is significant as the kilometres of embankment, two bridges first leg of the proposed Mackenzie and seven large diameter culverts. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 7

Over one million cubic metres of developed to protect the permafrost embankment material was moved underneath the highway. during this time. Finally, Mr. Speaker, I’d like to Mr. Speaker, this success should be encourage residents spending time in attributed to the effort of crew members the Inuvik region this summer to learn who worked days and nights during more about this spectacular project by some of the coldest and darkest part of attending the Inuvik Petroleum Show. winter. The resiliency and determination The department will be featuring a booth of these men and women is essential to where photos and additional information the project’s success. At the peak of regarding the construction of the construction, 425 individuals were highway can be found. Residents may employed by EGT Northwind, of which also find information on the project’s approximately 10 percent were female dedicated website located at employees who were involved in all inuviktotuk.gov.nt.ca. Thank you, Mr. aspects of the construction project from Speaker. environmental monitoring to operating MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. 40-tonne rock trucks. Beaulieu. The honourable Minister of Mr. Speaker, Northerners are already Justice, Mr. Ramsay. benefitting from this highway construction project. Over 18,000 MINISTER'S STATEMENT 70-17(5): person days of employment were BUILDING COMMUNITY created during winter construction, POLICING PARTNERSHIPS including almost 15,000 person days for HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Mr. Speaker, the RCMP NWT and Inuvik region residents. This enjoys a long and important history in the NWT, going all the way back to its original creation as a force does not include employees working for established to police what was then a much larger the 41 subcontractors hired by EGT Northwest Territories. Today the RCMP continues to Northwind to provide a range of services be valued for the policing services they provide and the contributions individual members make in our from wildlife monitoring to medical communities. services. In addition, 83 percent of these Within our government and throughout the North, we subcontracts were awarded to northern are working collaboratively to address social issues companies. more effectively. The local policing plans we have developed in partnership with the RCMP and The project company used simulators to communities demonstrate how effective this approach train more than 70 individuals on can be. different types of rock truck and This process started two years ago, when the Minister's policing priorities focused on objectives excavator equipment during the first such as building public trust and confidence in RCMP construction season. Training activity is services. From this came a series of conversations expected to increase during the next that were held between community members and the RCMP with the goal to develop plans setting out construction season that is anticipated policing priorities for every community. As a result, to last up to six months. each of our 33 communities has had the opportunity to work closely with the RCMP to determine what While most construction activities occur matters to them most. during the winter, shaping, grading and In keeping with these priorities, community leadership compacting activities will resume at the and the Department of Justice receive a monthly end of June until fall. During this time no report from the RCMP detailing progress on the agreed issues. This process is building trust as well movement of material from the borrow as accountability and contributes to an increased pits will take place. This plan is satisfaction with policing services. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 8

Communities are now better informed about the work MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. The of the RCMP, and the Department of Justice can honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, identify common issues and priorities Northerners Mr. Abernethy. share. The valuable community-based information collected in reports will be used by the department MINISTER'S STATEMENT 71-17(5): and our partners to guide policies, programs and services. The ultimate result will be an increasingly NATIONAL CANCER effective and efficient use of limited financial and SURVIVORS DAY human resources. HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Mr. As part of the evolution of this work, I have asked the st RCMP to go further in working with the communities Speaker, June 1 is National Cancer by developing joint policing action plans. These are Survivors Day. This day is an annual intended to complement and work hand in hand with celebration of life and loved ones. Each the priorities set by each community. The community and the RCMP will work together to decide how to year it reminds us of the importance of address the priority issues within existing resources. speaking openly about cancer and While many of these will be coming directly from the supporting one another in the face of RCMP, this process also gives communities the opportunity to contribute their own strengths and such a serious disease. resources. These action plans will help to On average, 111 new cases of cancer demonstrate progress and outline timelines for results. Again, we are finding ways to be accountable are diagnosed in the NWT every year. to those we serve. There is life after diagnosis. The NWT Mr. Ron Smith, the new commanding officer of the residents I know who have cancer have RCMP at "G" Division, is known to many of us. He is shown courage and strength in their here with us today and I will be acknowledging him at the appropriate time. Prior to assuming the individual cancer journeys. commanding officer position in May, Chief Too often we think that the diagnosis of Superintendent Ron Smith was the officer in charge of criminal operations here in the Northwest Territories. cancer is a reason for despair, but more He has served in other northern jurisdictions, people are surviving and going on to live including Nunavut and Labrador. We are all looking full lives during and after treatment. forward to working with him. These people are survivors. I would also like to take this opportunity to thank Mr. Wade Blake for his contribution to policing services as I encourage everyone to look at every chief superintendent of “G” Division. Mr. Blake was cancer patient as a survivor, not a instrumental in rolling out our new approach to the policing priorities from the beginning. It is his good victim. NWT residents who have work that we are now able to build upon, and we are experienced cancer may choose to self- very pleased that he will continue to work with us in identify in different ways, but there is no his new position as director of community justice and community policing. reason to view someone living with Mr. Speaker, we have heard the concerns of cancer as a victim. Members about the 12 communities that do not have In March the department launched a detachments. In consultation with Chief Superintendent Smith, we will be recommending that project funded by the Canadian these communities be the first to benefit from this Partnership Against Cancer to improve enhanced policing plan process. the cancer journeys of NWT residents. Achieving sustainable, vibrant and safe communities The Continuity of Care Project focuses is one of the goals of this Assembly, and we are committed to making it a reality in partnership with on supporting cancer patients and communities. The RCMP and the GNWT recognize survivors along the full continuum of the importance of collaboration to ensure we are care, particularly in the post-treatment properly targeting and allocating resources to meet the needs and priorities of the people we serve. We phase. This project will help us to believe in the people of the NWT, the history, the enhance after-care and services by strength and the abilities we have to make our reinforcing community-level capacity communities safer together. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 9 and improving coordination and this quote because I want to talk about communication. the graduates from Aurora College We must continue to raise awareness of 2014, students that have undergone cancer so that people get screened extreme conditions of hardship, earlier. I encourage everyone to join the sacrifice, but with the passion and fight against cancer. Residents can talk enthusiasm to get an education for to the NWT Canadian Cancer Society to themselves and for their families; find out what awareness-raising events students who made the sacrifice to be are taking place in their communities, away from home, away from family for a like the Relay for Life. In past years as year, two years, three years, four years; many as 30 NWT residents who openly students who know what it means to identify themselves as cancer survivors pack up their house, move it to a new have participated. This government is in location and having housing issues, full support of this event and all others having housing for their family; students which raise awareness and funding for who know that there is funding, but cancer prevention, and I encourage there is limited funding, not enough; others across the NWT to do the same. students who take on extra jobs; students who ask the land corps, the Mr. Speaker, we understand our band, the Metis organizations for communities’ concerns about cancer. funding; families who have been This demands that we talk frankly, work separated because the father or mother collaboratively and continue to support has to stay home and work to support one another. On National Cancer their family going to school. Survivors Day, please join me in taking a moment to celebrate the resilience I know a student in Fort Smith. The and strength of all NWT residents who father is working in Colville Lake and the have bravely faced this disease. Thank mother is raising five children and taking you, Mr. Speaker. a bachelor of education degree. Students who yet make these sacrifices, MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. knowing that something good will come Abernethy. Item 3, Members’ out of these sacrifices. Those are the statements. Member for Sahtu, Mr. words that the elders have taught us. Yakeleya. You make a sacrifice into something 4) Members’ Statements good. Education is our tool that will keep us MEMBER'S STATEMENT ON alive today, just as the ones we once ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF used on the land to survive. We are SAHTU changing over time and adapting so that AURORA COLLEGE we can use the value of learning that GRADUATES remains the core of who we are. MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Mr. Today I want to acknowledge our Aurora Speaker. This morning I read in a College graduates, Aurora College itself newspaper ad, “To be proud of your and the staff, to say how proud we are history, you must know it. Education to see our students in colleges and to builds roots to the past that will open see the completion of their studies. pathways to the future.” I thought about May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 10

I want to name the 10 students. From when the days are getting longer, the the Sahtu at the North Slave campus: weather is getting warmer and proud Cheryl Kelly from Deline, Helen Menaco parents and families are celebrating with from Deline, Helen Batelle from Deline, their offspring one of the most important and our own Miss Lovely, Cheryl milestones in the life of a child or young Yakeleya from Tulita. At Thebacha adult: high school graduation day. Campus: Violet Edgi from Fort Good I want to congratulate each and every Hope, Janelle Perriot from Fort Good graduate in the Northwest Territories for Hope, Martha Stewart from Fort Good the achievement they are celebrating Hope, Sylvia Clement from Norman this year, and I also commend the Wells, Robin Tagisou from Deline, and parents, families, teachers and my niece Laura Krutko from Deline. communities for the support that has These graduates have made a helped their students succeed. contribution to the people in the communities and for themselves. As indicated, I especially want to acknowledge the graduates of the Lastly, I want to acknowledge, Mr. communities of Fort Simpson and Fort Speaker, and I seek unanimous consent Liard that I represent in Nahendeh. It to conclude my statement. can be especially hard for students from ---Unanimous consent granted small communities to get a good MR. YAKELEYA: I want to education. I’m so proud that our small acknowledge the families, their communities and small schools can do communities and the students this for our students. I offer my thanks themselves for a job well done. and greatest compliments to our Graduates are role models. We need to teachers and the teaching support staff look at how we can continue to support for their dedication to our children’s them. success. They all get a pat on the back from me. Lastly, I want to thank the campuses of the communities of Fort Smith, To those of you who are hoping to Yellowknife and Inuvik and all the graduate, take a look at your older Aurora College centres in the Northwest brothers, sisters, cousins and friends. Territories that support these students. Just like them, you also have what it Mahsi cho from the MLA for Sahtu. takes to succeed and you can be a graduate too one day. Just keep MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. working hard and dreaming big. Yakeleya. Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Menicoche. To all our graduates, I want to give a special message: Enjoy your graduation MEMBER'S STATEMENT ON ceremony. It is an appreciation and ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF recognition of your hard work and NAHENDEH achievement. You each have a great HIGH SCHOOL GRADUATES deal to be proud of. You have shown us that you’ve got what it takes to be MR. MENICOCHE: Thank you very successful. Keep working towards your much, Mr. Speaker. I, too, want to dreams. With continued dedication we commend our high school graduates in know you’ll be successful in your Nahendeh. It’s that happy time of year education and career goals. The doors May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 11 of opportunity open to welcome you. As informally, they don’t qualify for you step through those doors, be bold remuneration, and this is because it’s and fearless. Just keep calm and move happening outside of the formal child on. The whole world is waiting for you. and family services system. In these MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. cases, the Minister stated that income Menicoche. The Member for Hay River support is an appropriate avenue for South, Mrs. Groenewegen. help. But what if the grandparents caring for these grandchildren aren’t eligible for MEMBER’S STATEMENT ON income support? Then what is their SUPPORT FOR recourse? GRANDPARENTS I have reviewed the department’s CARING FOR GRANDCHILDREN pamphlet on voluntary support service MRS. GROENEWEGEN: Thank you, agreements. These agreements come Mr. Speaker. Today I’d like to talk about into play when parents can’t take proper support for grandparents who are caring care of their children and when “there’s for their grandchildren. I’m a no other available help from family, grandmother and I know that if I had to friends or other community services.” go to sleep at night or for one minute What does no other help available had to wonder whether my mean? Does it mean grandparents have grandchildren were being properly cared already stepped in with their own for, I would necessarily have to resources? Some grandparents are rearrange my life and make sure that I penalized because they have had the stepped in and became involved in that. compassion and the sense of duty to Thankfully, I’ve been blessed with step in before their grandchildren are daughters-in-law and sons that are formally apprehended by the system. probably better parents than their Then they are expected to go to income parents were, but I understand the heart support, and if they don’t qualify they’re of grandparents who do step in and expected to provide for their raise their grandchildren. grandchildren from their own resources. This issue has been raised to me by It seems that there may be a way to constituents recently and also by improve the system here and there may aunties and uncles that step in, also be a break in the system here. I would thinking of the couple that went to the rather that we could come up with a way media that are from Ndilo that were of recognizing those situations and work raising four of their grandchildren and collaboratively with the social services to without financial support from our determine… government. When asked about this May I seek unanimous consent to recently, the Minister of Health and conclude my statement, please? Social Services confirmed that in cases ---Unanimous consent granted where children are apprehended through the system and placed with MRS. GROENEWEGEN: We all know grandparents, grandparents are eligible that for children who are apprehended for remuneration at the exact same rate by the system it is a very big upheaval in as regular foster parents, but when their life, and ultimately, they may end grandparents foster their grandkids up with family members or May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 12 grandparents, but if there was a way to mails and letters received is that new avert that apprehension process, and if programs should not be put in place it were possible for family members to without accompanying new money to work collaboratively with a social worker fund the new program. I cannot disagree to ensure the best course and plan of with that view. care for the children in question, I think it The current funding levels provided by would be a better system. No doubt, ECE to school boards and councils homes do need to have to be qualified allow for a certain excellent quality of regardless of whether they’re relatives education. Introducing a new cohort, a or not, because we’ve heard the stories whole new grade level into the school from southern Canada where system without any new dollars grandparents have sometimes been effectively forces the boards to provide looking after children and weren’t really more schooling for less money. It’s the qualified to be doing so. old do more with less mantra. I’d just like to further ask the Minister of I asked the Minister yesterday, how can Health and Social Services questions that let the boards continue to provide about this later today in question period quality education that they do now. to find out if there’s a missing piece here Although the Minister didn’t answer the that we need to think about and question, I can. It can’t do that. The only address. choice left for the boards if they want to MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mrs. preserve the excellent system that they Groenewegen. The Member for Frame now have is to use their contingency Lake, Ms. Bisaro. funds – the Minister would say their surplus – to make up the shortfall. If MEMBER’S STATEMENT ON there is no surplus, well, it means staff IMPLEMENTATION OF reductions and a corresponding JUNIOR KINDERGARTEN increase in the number of students in MS. BISARO: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. each class. The end result: a reduction Yesterday I voiced the concern of in the quality of education. Yellowknife residents who have Yellowknife school districts have had expressed their views to their MLAs their budgets reduced so Junior about the implementation of Junior Kindergarten can be instituted, but Kindergarten. Today I want to delve they’ve also had their requests for deeper into the dollars and cents adequate funding for teachers’ pensions aspects of their concerns. denied by the department. The Minister The Education Renewal and Innovation contends it’s not a matter for the GNWT, Project is an ambitious one. It’s looking leaving the YK boards twisting in the at a renewal or restructuring of our wind. If the pension expense for any whole NWT education system. To date, other board, one with GNWT the Minister and the department have employees, was to increase, what would announced, or is it decreed, that Junior the Minister’s response to a request for Kindergarten will start in September additional funding be? The same? I 2014 in 29, or 22 now of our 33 doubt it. communities, but with no new money. A It is a matter of fairness, and the very strongly expressed view in the e- Minister and the department are not May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 13 treating all NWT school boards fairly. If available to fill the job. Admittedly, Education, Culture and Employment opponents of the Temporary Foreign funds YK boards at approximately 80 Worker Program argue it takes jobs percent of their budget, why will ECE away and drives down wages. not fund 80 percent of the increased Proponents argue that not enough pension costs? Canadians are willing to work in certain Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent jobs or relocate to certain communities. to conclude my statement. To be honest, both sides have valid claims. ---Unanimous consent granted I myself, as a past owner in the service MS. BISARO: Why are we seeing the industry for over 20 years, employed outright denial of any assistance to over 15,000 employees, yet I did not cover the extra pension costs? Don’t all use one foreign worker. However, I have NWT teachers deserve the same many business colleagues who have standard of pension benefits? and I definitely understand their Apparently not, according to the positions. Minister. Some say the recent federal freeze on Yellowknife school boards are being the TFWP was a mere over-reaction unfairly targeted by Education, Culture and that select responsible employers and Employment through funding cuts are being targeted. Given the state of and denials of applications for NWT of having never received a report extraordinary funding. Just because of abuse, according to the GNWT they have taxation capability is no employment standards office, tends to reason not to treat them equitably with lend argument that responsible NWT all other NWT school authorities. Thank employers who hire temporary foreign you, Mr. Speaker. workers are being unfairly punished. I MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Ms. tend to agree. Bisaro. Member for Range Lake, Mr. The TFWP may be the right model in Dolynny. some instances in the NWT, but our real target should be permanent immigration MEMBER’S STATEMENT ON solutions. In essence, what we really TEMPORARY FOREIGN need in the NWT is more foreign WORKER PROGRAM workers to become citizens. We know MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. that the Canadian government is Speaker. The Temporary Foreign catching on to this opportunity as it Worker Program has been a hot button recently announced a new express entry topic for Northerners and Canadians for program for 2015. Let’s hope the GNWT the past month. This program is through its skilled worker and critical delivered in the NWT by the Department impact worker programs and our of ECE and ITI as the NWT Nominee entrepreneur and self-employed Program. business programs we’ll be able to This program of last and limited resort is harness our government’s aggressive designed to be accessed by employers 2,000 population increase during the life facing genuine acute labour shortages of the 17th Assembly. and only after Canadians are not May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 14

Let’s face it, adding more taxpayers is a health authority. It also brings concerns much better solution than a mere about what are we doing for the small temporary band-aid. I will have communities and regional centres. If we questions later today for the Minister don’t have this type of equipment responsible. Thank you. available, what happens when we have MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. weather situations where we can’t get a Dolynny. Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, medevac out to get medevaced either to Mr. Moses. Yellowknife or down to Edmonton? I can only understand the stress that this MEMBER'S STATEMENT ON causes the parents of the baby that PROVISION OF BILIBLANKETS might have jaundice, or the stress that it FOR has on the family and community, BABIES AFFECTED BY especially in a really small community. JAUNDICE I want to get an update to questions that MR. MOSES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. were asked on February 25, 2013. What On February 25, 2013, I asked kind of updates are we getting on this questions to the then Minister of Health and if any action has been done to get and Social Services regarding the proper equipment that we need in BiliBlankets for babies and the lack and our health centres and our hospitals to shortage of BiliBlankets that we have help these families out that do have throughout the Northwest Territories. these kinds of issues and are facing The questions came because we had a these kinds of challenges? medevac in Inuvik at the time, and the I will have questions later on for the family was concerned that if another Minister of Health and Social Services to baby had come while they were using get an update. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. the BiliBlanket, what would have MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. happened to the other baby. Moses. Member for Hay River North, BiliBlankets are used when a baby is Mr. Bouchard. born and has yellow jaundice. For those of you who don’t know what jaundice is, MEMBER'S STATEMENT ON jaundice occurs when there’s a buildup NEW HAY RIVER HEALTH of naturally occurring substance in the CENTRE blood, called bilirubin. Bilirubin is MR. BOUCHARD: Thank you, Mr. produced by the breakdown of red blood Speaker. As you as well as most of the cells, and red blood cells are very Members here know, there’s an exciting important because they carry oxygen to project going on in Hay River right now: all tissues within the body. As bilirubin the building of the new health centre begins to build up, it causes the baby’s there. This exciting new facility will be skin and the whites of the baby’s eyes to up and running next fall. They indicate turn yellow. they’re on budget and on schedule, and Just recently we had another medevac the community is abuzz with some of in Inuvik with a baby that had jaundice the activity of that construction. There and there was another serious concern. are many people in the community and When we did our initial research, there some specialized workers coming into was one blanket in the Inuvik regional town. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 15

Obviously, some of these big projects I will have questions for the Department cause other issues and bring concerns. of Public Works and Services to see Some of our local businesses would like what is going to happen in the future more activity and more opportunity to about the office space for the new bid on some of these projects. These health centre. big projects, sometimes with big dollars, MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. sometimes have demands from other Bouchard. The Member for Deh Cho, people. Mr. Nadli. The other issue that has come forward, and as Members know, when this facility MEMBER’S STATEMENT ON was scheduled to be built, it didn’t have PREPARING TOMORROW’S 10 long-term beds. After last year’s LEADERS TODAY capital budget, along with the support of MR. NADLI: Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. all the Members here, we got those Children have been described as the long-term beds placed and they will be ultimate resource for a society’s long- on the capital budget here coming term development and well-being. forward. Nowhere is this more true than in the This new facility has also brought up NWT where the proportion of our other issues. One of the rumours is that population under 24 years of age is Public Works and Services would like to almost 8 percent greater than for take over the maintenance of the facility, Canada as a whole. Last week I had the where we already have a maintenance opportunity to participate with an crew at our current facility that we’re esteemed group of northern leaders in basically pleased with. They are, hosting a youth forum in Fort obviously, part of our community. They Providence. I was joined by Mr. Joachim have families that we need to keep in Bonnetrouge, chief of the Deh Gah our community and keep them Got’ie First Nation; Mr. Sam Gargan, employed. former grand chief of the Dehcho First The other question that has been Nations and MLA; Mr. Steven Vandell, brought up is: What happens to the old deputy mayor of Fort Providence; and hospital? We’ve been asking the Dene councillor Xavier Canadien, along departments of Health and Public Works with a group of dedicated teachers, to get together, find out what the plan is community health and social service going forward with the old facility. Is workers, recreational workers and the there a possibility? Mr. Yakeleya has RCMP. mentioned a diabetes centre. What are We met with a group of bright, ambitious the opportunities that we can use this young people to talk about their fears old facility? and concerns, their goals and hopes for The final issue that I wanted to talk to their future, and their suggestions for you about today is the current facility community improvement. I’d like to doesn’t have enough office space in it. thank Chris Carson and Lois Phillip for We basically have questions of what’s helping us out. going to happen to the office space for Our discussion was the beginning of a social services and health services in dialogue which highlighted the the community of Hay River. importance of involving our youth in May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 16 decision-making at the earliest possible MEMBER’S STATEMENT ON opportunity. After all, everything that we GIANT MINE REMEDIATION do is ultimately for the benefit of our PLANS young people. Youth today are growing MR. BROMLEY: Thank you, Mr. up in a fast-paced, technological world. Speaker. Since the new bypass around They have big problems such as Giant Mine has opened, there are now addictions, suicide, teen pregnancy and barriers and gates across the old violence which can derail young lives highway that passes through the and steal bright futures. How do we contaminated mine site. The public no prepare young people to be competitive longer has access to the site but they in society while still embracing the still have questions. culture and traditions of their ancestors that will ground them and give them When the City of Yellowknife referred strength and perspective? the stabilization plan for an environmental assessment, the federal The high school graduation rate for non- proponents complained that this would Aboriginal students in the NWT in 2011- result in long delays. They said that any 12 was 78 percent, which is consistent delay would be dangerous. Yet their with the national average. However, the recommendations were released almost graduation rate for Aboriginal students a year ago and we are still waiting for was only 44 percent. We are failing our the responsible Ministers to complete Aboriginal youth. They cannot get jobs the process. Six months ago, in or be qualified for future employment if December, the Minister stated that they they are only educated to a Grade 9 accept the recommendations, but we level. Our kids need to know how the have heard little since. doors of the world will open to them with the right education. They need to know What is the plan for operations at Giant what it takes to succeed and to believe Mine this summer? Are they following that they can do it. the old plan that was largely rejected or the new one based on the Our young people need a variety of environmental assessment that is sitting educational opportunities. They need on the responsible Ministers’ desks? youth workers, parent volunteers and Both Minister Valcourt, Aboriginal Affairs interagency committees to help them set and Northern Development, and our up access resources. They need jobs in own Minister Miltenberger are their home communities. Most of all, responsible for approving the they need the love, support and environmental assessment. While encouragement of healthy families and Ministers delay responsible oversight, communities to give them the best work is proceeding without a clear and possible chance in order to become transparent plan. Also, it’s proceeding productive adults. We must remember without any inspectors in Yellowknife to the youth that we raise today are monitor what is going on. tomorrow’s northern leaders. Now that devolution is in place, all the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Nadli. former government inspectors work for The Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley. the GNWT. The nearest federal inspector is based in Whitehorse. We’ve just come through another spring thaw May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 17 and are getting reports of arsenic- loans continue to hold people at risk, at contaminated dust from the tailings and prey and vulnerable. spills of arsenic-contaminated water on I’ve gone on relentlessly about the high site blowing into town at off-the-chart cost of gasoline and how they affect the levels of contamination. Meanwhile, and cost of living. There are so many other despite an offer of GNWT inspectors, issues when it comes to collection there have been no inspections for agencies and certainly home renovation months now. repairs. The Giant site is closed off from the Municipal and Community Affairs seems public, and that is probably good for to not be interested in this issue. While I public safety. It doesn’t mean that we sit and watch, it certainly pales in should relax our vigilance. We need to comparison to the action taken across keep a closer eye than ever on activity Canada by other governments. Why at Giant, particularly because the work won’t this government budge? It team regulators and inspectors are all appears this Minister is either not working for the federal government. The interested in these issues or, as environmental assessment clearly lays constituents ask me, does he just not out a plan for stabilizing Giant Mine and care about consumer protection or does providing independent oversight. We he not understand consumer protection? need to get the plan off the Ministers’ People want to know, does he just desks and implemented. What will it believe everything’s fine or is he take? Mahsi. stubborn? We just don’t know. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. The constituents ask me how do we Bromley. The honourable Member for know he even appreciates the issue. I Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Hawkins. just don’t have an answer for them. I’ve been asking for years. When you pay MEMBER’S STATEMENT ON some of the highest gas prices in the CONSUMER AFFAIRS land in our remote, northern PROTECTION DIVISION communities, you often wonder if you MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Mr. are being taken advantage of and you Speaker. I’m going to use today’s don’t know where to go. When our opportunity to return to one of my phone bills hold you over a barrel, favorite subjects, which happens to be people want to know how to access the consumer affairs protection division, services to find out if they are being or lack thereof, Mr. Speaker. treated fairly. Many Northerners continue to wait for Many services go on and on and on, but any action from this division and people don’t know what their full rights certainly by the Minister and for years and disclosure and protections are. have been continuing to raise issues That’s why we need a consumer affairs about the restrictiveness and confusing division that is public and not concerns around cell phone contracts, anonymous. problems around homeownership Speaking of that, many months ago, if purchasing, protection, the fact that not a good year and a half ago, I asked homes don’t require full disclosure the Minister of MACA to make this under protection rules, and payday May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 18 public, not anonymous. This office administration. This data is released continues to hide behind I don’t know annually to the public in the public what, some web page. accounts as the tobacco tax revenue for I went to the web page because I the year. actually know where to go. There is very The tax audit and investigations section little information on how to contact this has standing procedures to perform particular office, so when the Minister compliance audits on tobacco says it’s a very busy office, perhaps not wholesalers and retailers. Retailers are from complaints. I’m not sure what they also inspected on a regular basis. All do. complaints of non-compliance with The bottom line is we need a public tobacco tax legislation and possible office that helps citizens know their non-compliance issues are fully rights, understand their rights and so investigated. The section keeps detailed they know where to go. Thank you, Mr. statistics on its activities, which are not Speaker. publically available. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Item 4, returns to oral MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. questions. Mr. Miltenberger. Miltenberger. Item 5, recognitions of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Ramsay. 5) Returns to Oral Questions 6) Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery RETURN TO ORAL QUESTION 213- 17(5): HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Thank you, TOBACCO TAX Mr. Speaker. I mentioned in my COLLECTION AND REPORTING Minister’s statement earlier, but I want to recognize two individuals with us today. HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: Mr. First if all, Mr. Wade Blake. I’d like to Speaker, I have a return to oral question welcome him today and thank him very asked by Mr. Dolynny on March 4, 2014, much for his work here in the Northwest regarding tobacco tax collection and Territories. I wish him well in his new reporting. capacity as director of community justice Statistics Canada conducts the and policing with the Department of Canadian Community Health Survey on Justice. an annual basis in the Northwest Also, Mr. Speaker, I want to recognize Territories. This survey collects self- Mr. Ron Smith, the new commanding reported cigarette consumption and is officer with “G” Division here in the publically available from a variety of Northwest Territories. Ron is from my sources, including the Statistics Canada hometown, St. John, New Brunswick. website. It’s nice to see another fellow from St. In the Department of Finance, the tax John making it to the top. administration section collects tobacco Congratulations, and I look forward to product data as part of the tax collection working with Ron in his new capacity as process. Wholesalers of tobacco commanding officer. Thank you. products sold to retailers in the NWT MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. report their sales and remit the taxes on Ramsay. Mr. Dolynny. these sales monthly to tax May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 19

MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. appreciate the dedication and service Speaker. I would like to introduce to you both gentlemen have offered and through you, again we’ve heard Northerners. They continue, as in Mr. from the Minister of Justice, but I, too, Blake’s case, serving Northerners would like to thank the new working for the Department of Justice commanding officer of “G” Division, Mr. and Mr. Smith works now serving Ron Smith, for being here. I’m looking Northerners in his new role. I want to forward to working with you. say thank you to both of them for their Of course, without due cause, Mr. Wade fine service and certainly service with Blake, the retiring chief superintendent distinction to all Northerners. That’s an of “G” Division, it was a pleasure important difference, distinction, it’s a working with you over the years. You high quality in their area. Thank you for are well deserved in your retirement. I that. hope your golf game goes very well. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. We also have a number of Pages with Hawkins. Ms. Bisaro. us who have been working very hard all MS. BISARO: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. week. We’ve had Pages from all over On behalf of the residents of Frame the Northwest Territories, but more Lake, I too would like to thank Mr. Blake importantly we have one Page from for his service. It has been great service Range Lake. I’d like to thank Sommer and we appreciate that. I would also like Snow for working very hard this week. to welcome the incoming commander, Thank you. Mr. Smith. I have some Pages as well. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Frame Lake is extremely well Dolynny. Mr. Lafferty. represented with Pages in the Assembly this week. Today I would like to HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, welcome three Pages from Frame Lake: Mr. Speaker. [English translation not Sebastian Ransom, Isaac Macpherson provided.] and Dakota Earle. Thanks to those three I would just like to recognize and I in particular for your service, but thanks appreciate all the Pages working with to all the Pages for the work they do for us. I appreciate their work ethics and us. Thanks, Mr. Speaker. just for being here with us. One of them MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. will be Sahara Sadeh Lafferty. Sadeh Item 6, acknowledgements. Item 6, stands for my sunshine. She’s also my acknowledgements. Item 7, oral girl, Sahara Sadeh Lafferty. Mahsi. questions. The honourable Member for MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen. Lafferty. Mr. Hawkins. MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Mr. 7) Oral Questions Speaker. I want to join in and thank QUESTION 314-17(5): retired Chief Superintendent Wade SUPPORT FOR Blake for his many years of northern GRANDPARENTS service. He has dedicated himself in an CARING FOR GRANDCHILDREN excellent manner. At the same time, I’d also like to recognize our incoming chief MRS. GROENEWEGEN: Thank you, superintendent, Ron Smith. I really Mr. Speaker. In follow-up to my May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 20

Member’s statement today, I have a enter the system and access the Child couple of questions for the Minister of and Family Services Act. When that Health and Social Services. occurs, whether it’s voluntary or through The issue of child and family services is identification, we do try to keep children something that has been much with families as much as possible. When discussed in this House. The previous a child needs to be placed, we obviously Assembly did a very in-depth like to approach families to see if they’d consultation in this topic and now the be willing to foster. If they’re willing to Auditor General’s report has been foster, we’ll put them through the reported on. There is one area that I process. If that happens, they will particularly wanted to zero in on today. receive remuneration that is consistent We know that families do, from time to with all other foster families. Thank you, time, suffer from extreme challenges Mr. Speaker. and from crisis, and where there are MRS. GROENEWEGEN: My children involved, sometimes it requires experience has been that sometimes an intervention or outside support. when family members step in, there is a It would be the natural thing for close sense in the department or with the child family members to be aware of these welfare worker that the problem has situations and to step up to the plate. now been alleviated, it has been solved However, in reality this may put stress and the inclination is to step away from on that family that’s helping, those the situation and say, okay, the children grandparents, aunts and uncles, may are no longer at risk and therefore they put financial stress on them. are safe. I’d like to ask the Minister if the I would like to know if there is a process department has ever contemplated that allows family to be involved in that support for direct family members than transition for those children. Quite often, is less invasive than having to child protection workers are seen as the apprehend children, putting children enemy coming in to apprehend children through the trauma of that, but finding a and take them out of their home. I know way to support those related family there are very many variables on what members who could, at a time of crises can happen in terms of why those or challenge, step in and help family interventions are required, and I have members. Has the department always been very reluctant to ever contemplated that being done on a criticize child protection workers who collaborative basis and seeing some have to do a very difficult job. But, is remuneration available to those family there a piece missing here? members? Thank you. Is there a collaborative way that family MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mrs. members could approach social Groenewegen. Minister of Health and services and realize the same end Social Services, Mr. Abernethy. without having to intervene with an apprehension? Thank you. HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Department of Health HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Mr. and Social Services does become Speaker, just for clarity, raising children involved with children at risk when they is, first and foremost, a responsibility of the family. Parents have the right to May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 21 make decisions about where their MRS. GROENEWEGEN: I’ll keep this children live, but the GNWT is not really short. Here’s a scenario: The necessarily responsible for paying for grandparents already have the child in those decisions. The only time the their care. The child is not apprehended. GNWT would actually become involved The grandparents intervened. They is if a family has some financial already have the child in their care. Who challenges, is living in poverty, and we can they go to to talk about getting would provide income support. Families support for caring for that child, other can make the decision to have children than income support? Thank you. stay with one group and then apply for HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: It depends income support. on the timing. If the family has made a When health and social services choice to put their children with becomes involved, the only time we can grandparents or another family member actually engage with families and do the and the system is unaware and hasn’t types of things the Member is talking been involved, we don’t have the ability about is when they actually become part to engage. If the family had indicated of the system and we have a file on that they’re having problems and they’re them. When they come in, whether it’s struggling and they weren’t meeting the voluntary, which I think is part of what needs and they engage the system the Member is talking about, or whether through a voluntary mechanism and it’s through an intervention, we will work then through a plan of care it was with families and we will try to find ways decided that the children would benefit to keep the children with the families. If from spending time with the that requires a foster placement, we grandparents while the parents work on have a process that is expedited or their challenges, in that scenario we modified for family placements, which is would be able to provide support. But if less thorough – thorough is not the right they do it without engaging the system, word – less intense than the normal the system doesn’t know, doesn’t have foster process. When they are placed a plan of care, doesn’t have a plan, with those people, whether it’s a shorter hasn’t worked with the parents to see term placement or a longer term what the parents’ long-term plans are placement, they do get the same and how we can help those parents get funding or financial support. to the point they need, in that scenario But as we move forward with child and the family made decisions we weren’t family services, we’re talking about aware of, we weren’t engaged. I would changing our philosophy. We’re talking encourage them strongly to go to about helping support and build stronger income support. If families are having families, which means we want to work problems, I would encourage them to with families when they are struggling, engage the system. Thank you, Mr. so that they can continue to provide the Speaker. loving care that they want to to their MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. families, which will include the types of Abernethy. Final, short supplementary, things that the Member is talking about. Mrs. Groenewegen. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MRS. GROENEWEGEN: So, Health and Social Services has not been May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 22 involved from the outset. I am a contact with the federal Minister Jason grandmother. I’m looking after my Kenney on a regular basis? Thank you. grandchildren. Can I go to social MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. services and explain the situation to Dolynny. Minister of Education, Culture them and work collaboratively with them and Employment, Mr. Lafferty. to ensure that I can afford to financially care for my grandchildren? Thank you. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. We are fully aware of the HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: I would temporary foreign workers moratorium encourage the grandparents, obviously, that is laid out across our country. to talk to social services to see how they GNWT has no Temporary Foreign can engage with the system, but it does Workers Program. It is a federal come back to the parents who have the program but we do share concerns. I did legal responsibility for those children. speak with Minister Jason Kenney just They would have to be involved as well. the other day, Wednesday evening, May History would have to be determined; a 28th, about this particular program and file would have to be created. Thank share our concerns, how to move you, Mr. Speaker. forward on this and what his plans were. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. My department senior officials are Abernethy. The honourable Member for working very closely with other Range Lake, Mr. Dolynny. counterparts as well, territorial/provincial and also the federal Minister’s office on QUESTION 315-17(5): this particular subject. Thank you, Mr. TEMPORARY FOREIGN Speaker. WORKER PROGRAM MR. DOLYNNY: It’s good to hear that MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. we have some communication here with Speaker. Earlier today I discussed some our federal Minister, but I would like to of the concerns surrounding a get a little bit more information in terms Temporary Foreign Worker Program. of where we are at with our NWT Admittedly, the Alberta Labour Minister Nominee Program. This is where we earlier this week indicated that Ottawa is administer from our end. I am led to over-reacting with the foreign worker believe that we have only two out of four moratorium and that responsible employees actually working in this employers are being unfairly punished. department, so I’m a bit concerned Ultimately what we are hearing from whether or not we have the capacity to many of the big western provinces is work with it. that they want to have more control over For example, what has been our quota the program. It’s about a month since for this program? How many the temporary freeze on the program. I unprocessed applications do we have? thought it would be important to see How long have these applications been what our Minister of Education, Culture in stasis and how many have actually and Employment has to say on this been processed during this fiscal year? subject. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister indicate to the House HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mr. where does NWT sit on the temporary Speaker, the Temporary Worker foreign worker file? Is the Minister in May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 23

Program, again, is a federal funding, but which includes raising awareness of the also federal programming. The Nominee Nominee Program and provide supports Program, we also administer that with for new Canadians. Any new the federal government. Part of the enhancements to the Nominee Program process is to monitor and evaluate the will be met with the existing resources. program itself. With the actual numbers Those are the discussions that I had which I don’t have with me, the detail, with Jason Kenney, and he is also but I can share with the Member all the supportive, and we will be pushing transactions that have taken place since forward with the federal government. we took over the program with the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. federal government until today and how Lafferty. Final, short supplementary, Mr. we are planning to integrate that with Dolynny. the federal Temporary Foreign Worker Program as well. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We heard that there are MR. DOLYNNY: Mr. Speaker, I will internal funds being used for that, but I entertain those numbers when the didn’t quite hear a timeline, so I’ll Minister has them for me. That would be encourage the Minister to get back to great. the Member and the House. We know that this Temporary Foreign We know that competition with the local Worker Program is, as I said, delivered job market requires a strong policy with here through the NWT Nominee such an NWT Nominee Program. Can Program. We know that a recent ITI the Minister reassure the public, with Economic Opportunity Strategy pending reform, will GNWT policy, implementation plan proposed including mining industry socio- strengthening this NWT Nominee economic agreements, still recognize Program. However, there has been little Aboriginal people at a higher priority information on the proposed timeline of than foreign workers? action. There hasn’t been any mention of any anticipated resources required. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Yes. Of course, the people of the North are our Can the Minister share with the House most important resources, and first and what is this action plan and how much is foremost, we want to ensure that this going to cost taxpayers? Northerners in the Northwest Territories HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: During have the skills and knowledge for their my discussions with Jason Kenney, employment success. That’s our priority. these were some of the discussions that We also recognize that there are we’ve raised. We’ve raised some growing pressures on the government, concerns, as well, just to elaborate and not just our government but the federal also enhance our nominee government, industries, business, to programming. The Northwest Territories respond to the increase in the labour Nominee Program is employer driven. market demands due to changing The program is administered by our demographics. Those are some of the department and supports a permanent important discussions that we have had residency. The department is with Jason Kenney just the other day as investigating ways, as I stated, to well. It’s important that my department is enhance the immigration program, also working with all partners to ensure May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 24 skills training and also the post- MR. BOUCHARD: The Minister secondary education system responds indicated the refurbishing of the current to these needs. I will carry this forward medical clinic. I guess my concerns and with the federal Minister as part of a questions are: Do we have an estimated priority for this government. cost of what that refurbishing is to an MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. older building, and would those dollars Lafferty. The Member for Hay River be better spent adding to the new facility North, Mr. Bouchard. so that we have office space right in the location as opposed to renovating an old QUESTION 316-17(5): building? NEW HAY RIVER HEALTH HON. TOM BEAULIEU: It would be CENTRE around $785,000 to get that clinic tenant MR. BOUCHARD: Thank you, Mr. improvements to accommodate the staff Speaker. As I indicated, the new health at this time. We will be doing a cost centre definitely has some issues and comparative analysis to determine some questions. My questions today will whether or not leased space purchased be for the Minister of Public Works and from the private industry would be more Services. feasible. Hay River has very good rates, so that is something that when we go in The question is: What is the department to needing office space in Hay River we doing to address the office space that is do do a comparison to actually going not currently planned for the new into the market and getting leased facility? space as opposed to producing our own MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. space through capital because the rates Bouchard. The Minister of Public Works, are very good in Hay River. Mr. Beaulieu. MR. BOUCHARD: Obviously, the fall of HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Thank you, Mr. 2015 is when the new facility is going to Speaker. We are evaluating the needs be established. I guess the question is: of the staff for office space at this time When will the general plan for this office when the people from the old centre go space be released and the report to the new health centre. We recognize completed so that we actually have a that there are approximately…well, at plan in place before the close of the fall this time exactly 57 people that would of 2015? have to be housed outside of the new HON. TOM BEAULIEU: We’re going to health centre, so we are looking at all of complete the move into the new health the possibilities including refurbishing centre. The individuals that are currently the clinic, which will be moving to the housed in the H.H. Williams will remain health centre, to accommodate some of there until the spring of 2016. Prior to the staff in there and maintaining the that date, we will be placing them current lease that we do have that outside of H.H. Williams and then the accommodates 11 staff members. We’re Department of Health and Social looking at a location for another 23 staff Services would then have an and probably also some contingency opportunity to determine whether or not space. We haven’t made a final the H.H. Williams is surplus to the determination on how we’re going to do government. that at this time. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 25

MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. HON. ROBERT MCLEOD: Thank you, Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Speaker. Through MACA we deliver Mr. Bouchard. a large number of programs and we MR. BOUCHARD: Thank you, Mr. have funding for many youth initiatives. Speaker. I guess the question is about We went through the numbers during that renovation and the $785,000. the debate on the budget back in Would that not be better spent to be February or March. The youth centre invested into a newer building, into a funding program is one of them. We do newer facility, along with some of the support some youth centres. We have a costs associated that we currently have lot of youth initiatives. There is a long in leasing? Is the department looking at list. I could compile a list and provide it that as an option as well? or even table it in this House as to the number of programs we have for the HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Certainly, we youth and the amount of money that we are looking at that. The clinic itself is a allocate to these programs. good building. Whether or not it will be used for health, it most likely would be MR. NADLI: I’d like to thank the feasible for the government to retain as Minister. I’d be very interested in having office space, but for this purpose and at a list of the programs that are available this moment we are looking at the for youth initiatives in the community. possibility of housing the individuals that One primary finding of the discussions are moving from H.H. Williams outside that were held recently in Fort of the refurbished clinic as well. Providence was the need to follow up with the meeting to try and identify the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. next steps. The other thing that was Beaulieu. The Member for Deh Cho, Mr. recognized and acknowledged by the Nadli. leaders is that we need to work with our youth in terms of leadership QUESTION 317-17(5): development, showing them how we YOUTH-ORIENTED PROGRAMS make decisions, role modeling and that AND SERVICES kind of stuff. MR. NADLI: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I How is the Minister ensuring that youth was very excited with the recent youth leadership development is a priority of forum that we had in Fort Providence. It local communities? Mahsi. brought together the leaders and youth of Fort Providence. My question is to the HON. ROBERT MCLEOD: Thank you. Minister for the Homelessness and This government takes the future of the Youth. youth quite seriously. With the Youth Parliament they have every second Could the Minister explain the kinds of year, it gives them an opportunity to see programs, funding and resources for how we work here. As well, through youth that his department could deliver Municipal and Community Affairs we and that’s available for communities that have the Youth Ambassador Program, may want to work with the youth. which is actually an excellent program MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Nadli. and every opportunity I have to speak The Minister of Municipal and on it is most welcome, but we just had a Community Affairs, Mr. McLeod. recent intake. So we’re in the process of May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 26 having intake now. We get applications they’re all over the place, all parts of the from youth, I believe, from 17 to 24 Northwest Territories working with the across the Northwest Territories, and youth. So we welcome any opportunity, they have an excellent opportunity to and if there’s an opportunity for me to broaden their horizon. I believe this next meet with the youth in Fort Providence group that’s coming in may have an in the future, the MLA can let me know opportunity to be part of the Pan and I will be sure that I’m there. Thank American Games that are taking part in you. Toronto next year, as well as the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Aboriginal Games. This past group took McLeod. Final, short supplementary, Mr. part, they were actually volunteers in the Nadli. Arctic Winter Games in Fairbanks; they were part of the volunteer team. So MR. NADLI: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I there’s a lot of opportunities there to think what the community has done is help youth build their leadership taken the initiative of trying to bring the abilities. Thank you. leadership and the youth together at the local level, and there’s a need for MR. NADLI: Thank you. When we did resources and program-wise and have the forum, I think everybody was funding and trying to work with the there, the local leadership, the youth, youth. the agencies, and the only missing th element at the time was a The last Assembly, the 16 Assembly representative perhaps from MACA, had a Youth Forum. Would the Minister ensure that we do have a pan-territorial maybe even the Minister was absent. th So I’ll give him an opportunity to make youth forum for the end of the 17 up for his absence and ask him how will Assembly? Mahsi. his department be prepared to assist the HON. ROBERT MCLEOD: Thank you. leaders and the youth of Fort The one in the 16th Assembly was the Providence in trying to follow up on this initiative of the then Premier, but it was meeting and identify the next steps in a very valuable tool, because I took part trying to advance the working in that and I think one of the other relationship between the leadership and Members in his former life had taken the youth? Mahsi. part in that too. It was an excellent HON. ROBERT MCLEOD: Thank you. opportunity to gather with the youth from We welcome any opportunity that we across the Northwest Territories and get have to interact with the youth and hear their views on a lot of different issues their opinions. I don’t know if I was that are facing the Northwest Territories. aware of the event that was taking place So I will commit to the Member that this in Fort Providence. Perhaps if the MLA is an initiative that I’ll work with the had invited me I would have gone. department to have a look at and I’ll work with my colleagues to see if there’s ---Laughter a possibility we could pull something like So I'll put some of the blame back on this together, especially in event of the the Member. We welcome any Youth Parliament not going ahead this opportunity we have to work with the year because of the Elders Parliament. youth. We have an excellent team over This might be a good opportunity to at MACA that works with youth and gather the youth and have their input on May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 27 issues facing the Northwest Territories. this House, or even the general public, I Thank you. raise that with the profile for the Board MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. of Governors. Mahsi. McLeod. The Member for Yellowknife MR. HAWKINS: It has been three Centre, Mr. Hawkins. months and I’m glad to hear that the Minister has met with the board and met QUESTION 318-17(6): with the president, but he hasn’t STUDENT DIALOGUE WITH informed me or anyone else that I’m AURORA COLLEGE BOARD OF aware of that he has met with any of GOVERNORS them. So what topic did he actually meet MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Mr. with them about, what did he direct them Speaker. On February 5, 2014, I’d to do, has he had the courage to use asked the Minister of Education to use Section 7 of the Aurora College Act some of his authority under Section 7 of where the Minister can direct the board the Aurora College Act. I asked him to to do things such as provide e-mail tell the Aurora College Board of addresses so students can contact their Governors to meet the students and Board of Governors with concerns and certainly provide some e-mail addresses complaints so they can get direct so people can contact them, but rather, action? There is zero accountability. they still appear to be anonymous. What can the Minister say about that Perhaps they like it that way in a sense problem? of governance of the board and the HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi. college for the students. When I met with the Board of I want to hear what updates the Minister Governors, I addressed all of those can provide the House immediately to issues. Any issues that come to my find out has he actually done anything. attention, I address with them. We work Thank you. out solutions. When it comes to the contacts of certain individuals, private e- MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. mails of private individuals’ contacts, Hawkins. The Minister of Education, Mr. those are at the discretion of the board if Lafferty. they want to release that information. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, But they do have a website. All the Mr. Speaker. Yes, that information was contact information, phone numbers, e- brought to my attention even in this mails, it’s all on the website. They even House. I did meet with the chair and have a student representative as well. also the president and addressed that We are going to a June meeting in concern to their attention. There has Inuvik and I believe the Member will be been work done in that area where their there as well. meeting is open and they have a So, we’re looking forward to those student representative. We nominated a exchanges of information as we move student just recently. forward. Mahsi. So we’ll continue to make that important MR. HAWKINS: Thank you. So, go to to the Board of Governors of Aurora the website; interesting answer. As I College. I’ve always stressed whatever brought up before, the website says has been brought to my attention from send all correspondence through the May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 28 president’s office. So the president gets gets batted around regularly and I see to handle, control who knows what with zero meaning behind it. the information. So the direct contact HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi. and accountability, what is the Minister Aurora College Board of Governors afraid of to tell them to provide them does work with the students. We deliver with an Aurora College e-mail address the best program we possibly can in the because if they’re on the Board of Northwest Territories, along with our Governors, they’re there as an advisory partners further down south at various board, they’re there as an administrative institutions. We’ll continue to make that board, or are they there for whatever a success. Mahsi. reason? I don’t know. Maybe the Minister will take that initiative on and MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. demonstrate some true accountability Lafferty. The Member for Frame Lake, for the students. Thank you. Ms. Bisaro. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi. QUESTION 319-17(5): Obviously, we’re not afraid of anything. EDUCATION RENEWAL AND Every time an issue comes up, I do INNOVATION INITIATIVES address those issues with the Board of MS. BISARO: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Governors. What’s being said here will I want to follow up from my statement again be shared with the Board of and ask some questions of the Governors. Mahsi. Education, Culture and Employment MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Minister about the Education Renewal Lafferty. Final, short supplementary, Mr. and Innovation Project and how it’s Hawkins. going to be funded. MR. HAWKINS: I’m not sure this is I recently received a letter from the getting through to the Minister. I brought Minister responding to questions that I a complaint to a particular member of raised in March of this year about the the Board of Governors the other day Education Renewal and Innovation and they just go, well, it’s part of the Project. In that letter it indicates 10 policy, that’s the way it goes. Then he initiatives from the ERI plan, well, sent me to the president’s office with the actually 11 if you consider Junior complaint. What is the point of having a Kindergarten, but the 10 initiatives are Board of Governors if they don’t do set to start in the 2014-15 school year. anything? This is frustrating. They don’t However, in the letter there was represent the students, they don’t absolutely no reference to how these represent MLAs when we bring initiatives will be funded. complaints on behalf of the students, I would like to ask the Minister to explain and now the only option for us to do is how these 10 initiatives planned for the bring complaints to the president’s 2014-15 school year will be funded. office, who controls them, whether they Thank you. meet the Board of Governors or not. So, frankly, I want to know what this Minister MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Ms. will finally do to demonstrate Bisaro. Minister of Education, Culture accountability because, frankly, it’s a and Employment, Mr. Lafferty. hollow word around this Assembly, it May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 29

HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, this fall – that’s the target date – and Mr. Speaker. This whole education deliver that in the House potentially I am renewal and innovation, as you know, I hoping by February session or sooner. It did a statement on that. We are going all depends on the engagement that through the various stages of we’re conducting. engagement with the general public. We When the Member is talking about using have delivered the overall framework. existing resources or new funding, those Now we have to develop an action plan are a mixture of information that we based on the feedback from the need to discuss. If there is going to be stakeholders, the educators, the school an ask for new funding, by all means I boards, the superintendents and MLAs will be there demanding that within my and others. Other individuals are portfolio. Mahsi. interested to providing their input. Based on that, we are going to have a cost MS. BISARO: I’m very glad to hear that factor where the new money is going to new funding may be on the horizon, but be approached. Those are some of the if these initiatives are being discussions we are going to have with implemented in the ‘14-15 school year, the stakeholders. the budget for that school year is already over and done, and I am not MS. BISARO: The Minister mentions convinced that we are going to get new an action plan. I know that that has been money. out there for quite some time. We have been waiting for that. It was originally I spoke a bit about contingencies for scheduled for January and I know school boards in my statement. committee suggested that it be pushed Yesterday the Minister, when he was back. Another question would be: When talking about contingencies, stated that, are we going to see that action plan? “those monies should be expended into educational programming, so we The letter indicates that some of these support that as well.” I am very pleased initiatives will be funded from existing to hear that the Minister supports budgets but that others will require spending contingency money on funding to be put in place. I need a little educational programming. He said it I bit further elaboration from the Minister. think three times yesterday – I would Will there be new funding for these have to check Hansard to be sure – but initiatives, or will he continue with the my concern is with the fairness of the current funding from within policy that support that is being provided. we happen to see right now? Thank I would like to know from the Minister, in you. terms of support, does he support HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mr. forcing the boards to use their Speaker, when I talk about the action contingency dollars to make up for the plan, yes, it’s been directed to us that reduced budgets that he’s we need to have more time to engage implementing? Thank you. the general public because it will be HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mr. their document, their solutions, their Speaker, I am not forcing the school ideas and their suggestions. So I have boards to use their surplus on various allowed more time for that to happen. projects. It is at their discretion to use. We want to deliver a draft action plan by May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 30

We’re hoping and encouraging them to enrolment, if the enrolment goes up, use it towards their educational then obviously the financial aspect of programming within their district. We will the school boards, their contribution continue as a department working increases as well. Those are areas that closely with them. My department, as I we continue to closely monitor and stated yesterday, is meeting with them provide additional funds if that’s the now and yesterday and continues to case. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. discuss part of the opportunities that we MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. have before us. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Lafferty. Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Mr. Moses. Lafferty. Final, short supplementary, Ms. Bisaro. QUESTION 320-17(5): MS. BISARO: Thanks, Mr. Speaker. PROVISION OF BILIBLANKETS The Minister and I have to respectfully FOR agree to disagree. He is forcing the BABIES AFFECTED BY boards to make one of two bad options. JAUNDICE They either use their contingency to MR. MOSES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. fund the shortfall or they have to cut I am following up to my statement today. staff and increase their class sizes and I have questions for the Minister of reduce the quality of education. Health and Social Services. As I stated The boards use this contingency money in my Member’s statement, the last time to fund extra staff, so they may get a I brought this issue up with jaundice and special needs student who needs an the lack of a BiliBlanket being available assistant. They may get an extra 20 or having an extra one on hand at the students in September that they need to Inuvik Regional Hospital was brought up find a staff person for. in February 2013. I was wondering what kind of updates have been happening I would like to know from the Minister, since then in terms of looking at without a surplus, if my board has no securing extra equipment such that surplus, in such a situation where I have somebody who does come in that needs an extra 20 or 25 students come a BiliBlanket that we have one extra one September, can a school expect funding on hand. Can I ask the Minister for an assistance from Education, Culture and update? Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Employment? Thank you. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mr. Moses. Minister of Health and Social Speaker, I just want to make it clear. If I Services, Mr. Abernethy. was forcing the school boards to use their surplus, I would take all the surplus HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Thank you, back, which I am not doing. It is at the Mr. Speaker. In most cases the neonatal discretion of the school boards to use jaundice is treated with light therapy and the funding towards educational the BiliBlanket is one of the tools that programming, and we highly encourage may be used to support individuals that them to do that. Some of the boards are suffering from jaundice. It’s a clinical have, as I stated in this House, choice by the physician providing the substantial surpluses. When it comes to service, providing the treatment, whether they use the BiliBlanket or May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 31 another source. We don’t direct the has gone up a little bit, so that for 2011- physicians to use any particular tool. 12 it is about 13 percent of babies. However, I have talked to the I acknowledge that there is certainly an department and I have asked for some opportunity here. I am certainly willing to specific information on the number of have additional conversation with the BiliBlankets that are available to Member. If there are opportunities for residents of the Northwest Territories. cost savings for those babies who the As soon as I get that information, I will BiliBlanket will work for, I’m certainly happily share it with the Member. Thank willing to explore that with the you, Mr. Speaker. authorities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. MOSES: Mr. Speaker, the photo MR. MOSES: Just in terms of the therapy from the BiliBlankets actually information the Minister is seeking and helps reduce the bilirubin that is built up mentioning that he’s going to commit to, when the decrease in red blood cells I just want to confirm commitment that happen. If there is no immediate action he will get a full inventory of BiliBlankets taken, that build-up of the bilirubin can that we have in the Northwest Territories become very harmful to the infant. and for the regions and whether he will Hence, we have the medevacs. look at doing something in the smaller The cost of the BiliBlanket is about communities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. $4,000. If you put the costs associated HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: I commit to with a medevac, which is thousands of getting that information for the Member. dollars, why wouldn’t the Minister look at As far as providing BiliBlankets in the purchasing more BiliBlankets through additional communities, we need to the Northwest Territories rather than figure out what the rate of prevalence of continue to possibly send more this particular condition is and figure out medevacs out? Thank you, Mr. the cost balance analysis. Thank you. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Mr. Abernethy. Mr. Bromley. Speaker, I’m certainly going to have to follow up with the department to ask QUESTION 321-17(5): some additional questions and get some FETAL ALCOHOL SPECTRUM more information for the Member. The DISORDER SERVICES BiliBlankets offer the possibility to treat MR. BROMLEY: Thank you, Mr. some degrees of jaundice at home for Speaker. Fetal Alcohol Spectrum otherwise healthy babies. I acknowledge Disorder, also known as FASD, affects that there are some advantages here, many people in the North. It impacts but there are other methods of treatment every aspect of their daily lives in the as well. way they interact and participate in In the Northwest Territories, unlike the society. It often causes them to act in rest of the country where the statistical ways considered harmful to the prevalence of this particular condition is community or themselves. about 50 percent in babies, in the My first question to the Minister of Northwest Territories, fortunately our Health and Social Services is: Does the statistics are significantly lower. In 2007- department consider FASD a treatable 08 it was about 7 percent of babies. It May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 32 condition, or is it considered to be a rehabilitation supports to help people lifelong chronic condition requiring transition through activities of daily continuous support? Mahsi. living. We’ve got case management MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. that’s available, as well, supported living Bromley. Mr. Abernethy. as well as respite services. HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Thank you, Adults with FASD who cannot live on Mr. Speaker. There is no cure for FASD their own may qualify for income that I am aware of. Thank you, Mr. support, for shelter, food, clothing, Speaker. utilities and other things. We do have out-of-territory placement for individuals MR. BROMLEY: That was my whose needs are beyond our capacity. understanding as well. Today diagnosis of children with FASD is routine, but There are a number of things that we diagnosis of adults who were not do, Mr. Speaker. We certainly aren’t assessed at young ages is a problem stacking the system against these and many adults remain undiagnosed. individuals. Thank you. They find themselves abandoned by the MR. BROMLEY: Thanks to the system, in trouble, in hospital or Minister. This is the impression adults homeless and unaware of programs that with FASD often have. I didn’t accuse might help. They don’t have the ability to the department of that. Thanks for that function in a society that seems thorough description of the services uncaring and stacked against them. available. What treatment options and support Families put a tremendous amount of services are in place to identify and help time, resources and love into caring for adults who have FASD? Mahsi. children with FASD who are now adults. HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Cognitive When these children grow up, they often behavioral assessments for adults are remain in the care of their families. completed by psychologists, Caring for someone with FASD can be psychiatrists, neurologists upon referral difficult, as the Minister knows, and the from a physician, community health families become highly stressed and the nurse or a community social worker. In person confused. They do not know if the Northwest Territories, we use the there is help or how to find it or access Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder it. So perhaps it’s a communications Canadian guidelines for diagnosis, issue. which were developed in 2005. There What measures are in place to reach are a significant number of supports that out to the families who have children, individuals with FASD can access within especially adult children, with FASD and the Government of the Northwest help them access the services they Territories. So I would say we are far need? from not caring for these individuals. We HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: There are are not stacking against them. We have a number of services, and I hear the social workers who can deal one on Member, we may have a communication one. We have mental health and gap in getting this information to the addictions counsellors who can meet right people at the right time. I know our with them as well. We have professionals certainly share the May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 33 information when they come in contact, In the meantime, if there are individual but if they don’t come in contact, the cases that Members are aware of, Member is right, the individuals who Justice and Health and Social Services may need the information may not have are always willing to work together to try it. I will have a conversation with the to find solutions in the interim. Thank deputy of Health and Social Services to you, Mr. Speaker. find out and get more concrete MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. information around the types of Abernethy. The honourable Member for communication we are using to help get Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya. the right information to the right people at the right time. I will share that with the QUESTION 322-17(5): Member and Members on both sides of SUPPORTS FOR the House. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. AURORA COLLEGE STUDENTS MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. Short, final supplementary, Speaker. My question is to the Minister Mr. Bromley. of Education, Culture and Employment. I MR. BROMLEY: Thank you, Mr. talked about the celebration of students Speaker. Our judicial system treats who have graduated from universities, adults with FASD as though they are colleges and other post-secondary responsible for their decisions and have institutions. I want to specifically focus a full capacity for that responsibility on the Northwest Territories Aurora punishing them instead of offering College graduates. These students have treatment or alternative ways of dealing made some huge sacrifices to take their with it, and thus, our jails are full of studies in the North, to leave their adults with FASD who circulate through communities, and they have made this costly system without resolution. A sacrifices to the families. They have also wellness court announced for this fall done things that I just don’t know how that partnership between Health and they did it. They take on extra jobs, one Social Services and Justice is a positive or two jobs, study late at night to get a step and is needed as soon as possible. degree or diploma or certificate. Is there any capacity within Health and I want to ask the Minister, with our Social Services and the courts to continuous support of services to these expedite this for adults with FASD? students through these hard times, what Thank you. is the department doing to look at ways HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: We are that we can help the students with large making progress with the wellness court families away from home living in and we are hopeful and actually cramped conditions to help them anticipate that anticipation of the through their educational studies as they wellness courts later this year will help attend either Inuvik, Yellowknife or Fort the courts better address these exact Smith institutions? Thank you. situations by providing supports. As far MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. as expediting, we have a plan in place Yakeleya. The honourable Minister of to start rolling out the wellness court in Education, Culture and Employment, the fall and we would be ready to start Mr. Lafferty. providing those services then. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 34

HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Thank communities at our learning centres? Is you, Mr. Speaker. First and foremost is that a possibility? congratulating all the college grads HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Yes. It’s throughout the Northwest Territories. a great possibility. In fact, I’ll be We are very, very proud of them. addressing that with the Board of Obviously, we want them to further their Governors when we’re meeting in June. education success, as well, then, upon We’ve already addressed with the Board completion, return back to the Northwest of Governors a while ago, and they are Territories so we can offer them a developing their corporate plan for a northern attractiveness when it comes to long-term strategy. This will obviously workforce development. be part of their strategy, community Part of the Student Financial Assistance learning centres in all communities. program is, again, one of the best They should be producing highly skilled, across our nation and also international qualified people. That’s my view, that’s world renowned as well. We continue to my push, and I fully support that. The provide those subsidies, those services Members support that, as well, so we’ll to our students, whether it be in the continue to push that forward. certification of the diploma programming MR. YAKELEYA: In my research degree or master’s program or even specifically in the Sahtu communities, I Ph.D. Our students are now pursuing have noted that the high school students Ph.Ds. We have increased our SFA, so with greater or higher grades needing we can increase the disability area, diplomas or certificates in the Sahtu. professional areas. So, those are areas Norman Wells has 89 percent of we can continue to monitor and we’ll students. Colville Lake is 78; Fort Good make changes that reflect our northern Hope, 68; Deline, 62; and Tulita, 58. students. Mahsi. These are good start points for MR. YAKELEYA: I want to let the measurements to say at some period of Minister know that I would like to time that we want to get 100 percent of continue tracking the types of support these students that have a higher than services that are going to be looked at Grade 12 diploma. This leads me to my for continued support for our Aurora third question. College students and in our institutions. I understand from the last session, and I also want to say to the Minister, I I’ve been pressing the Minister very would like, one day, to see our learning hard on a Sahtu needs assessment, centres in our small communities take because we have opportunities that are part in the celebration like we have done knocking on our doors. I need to know, in Fort Smith, Yellowknife and the Inuvik is this needs assessment going to be campuses. We have had a good released? What are the next steps? We celebration in our own communities in need to get these students who are our learning centres. willing to work, who want to work, and Is the Minister looking at ways that we get them trained now in the Sahtu. can improve our community learning HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: First, I’d centres so that one day we can also like to commend the Sahtu region and have a celebration in one of our small the communities for their academic success. Congratulations to them. The May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 35 needs assessment that the Member is comes to program development and referring to is before our department also a training centre area, how is that now compiling all that information. I going to look. Based on the package know the Member has addressed that that we received, those are options that issue in the House on numerous we’re going to create and then deliver occasions. Now it’s before us within the that to the Sahtu region. department. Now we’re compiling all the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. information from other jurisdictions, as Lafferty. The Member for Nahendeh, Mr. well, because we are looking at a Menicoche. territorial-wide training initiative and how it’s going to look in the Sahtu region. QUESTION 323-17(5): The Member alluded to earlier about the TROUT LAKE AIRPORT program development institution PROJECT potentially and a May tour and so forth. MR. MENICOCHE: Thank you very Those are the discussions that we are much, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to ask the going to have, and I will update the Minister of Transportation to provide a Members once that is available by the brief update on the Trout Lake Airport end of this summer and the fall time. project that has been going on for some MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. time. I’d just like to know how it has Lafferty. Final, short supplementary, Mr. progressed. Yakeleya. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. The Minister of Speaker. I look forward to having this Transportation, Mr. Beaulieu. needs assessment discussed within the HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Thank you, Mr. Sahtu, the leadership and the Speaker. There have been many communities. I want to ask the Minister challenges in the construction of the as I’ve also been pressing with the help airport, being weather, quality and of my colleagues on a feasibility study quantity of material. However, we have with the Sahtu technical institution, and recently completed a change order with that’s going to be greatly needed in the the organizations that we’re working Sahtu. I want to ask the Minister if he with to complete the airport this can provide the House and the people in summer. the Sahtu, where is that specific project at, at this moment now? MR. MENICOCHE: Exactly what type of work will be done in Trout Lake this HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Again, it summer and fall? was brought up in this House about the Sahtu and will there be a training HON. TOM BEAULIEU: As I indicated, institution. We were waiting on the there was an issue with the material and training needs assessment and the the quality of the material and the assessment of the communities, which quantity, so what we are doing is we are involves the stakeholders, the industry, bringing in some crush material and the community leaders and community we’re going to blend the material to educators. Now we have that package complete the airport. It would be all of and now we need to identify what’s the work that would be required to have needed in the Sahtu region when it the airport at a finished stage. As I May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 36 indicated, we have completed the the project. The project has gone on for change order and the work should have a significant time and we’ll be working started four days ago, actually. That’s with the community closely to ensure what the change order indicates. that the completion is done this summer. MR. MENICOCHE: For a small MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. community and a large project like that, Beaulieu. The time for oral questions that’s good for the economic has expired. Mr. Dolynny. sustainability and jobs for the MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. community. Just for clarification, did the Speaker. I seek unanimous consent to Minister say potentially we’ll be landing return to item 7 on the Order Paper. at the airport this fall? ---Unanimous consent granted HON. TOM BEAULIEU: The department and the community of Trout 8) Oral Questions Lake along with the development (Reversion) Corporation and Rowe’s Construction have full intentions of completing the QUESTION 324-17(5): airport this summer, so for sure we’ll be DEH CHO BRIDGE landing at that airport in the fall. MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. Today Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, I want to talk about one of the Mr. Menicoche. mismanagement projects that we’ve had in our history of the Northwest MR. MENICOCHE: Thank you very Territories. In fact, this project has even much, Mr. Speaker. Like the Minister been earmarked by the Auditor General had indicated, given a lot of the of Canada as having definite issues with challenges, I’m really pleased to see the accountability and transparency, and work towards the completion this fall. even more recently, the taxpayers are Just one more question is the question still dealing with cost overruns with this of an airport terminal. Is that on site in project. I’m talking about the Deh Cho Trout Lake this year or will it be there Bridge. soon? This project is still not done. I’m led to HON. TOM BEAULIEU: This has been believe that we are still dealing with a very likely project. As the Member structural issues and even as of this knows, it was back in 2009 that we got summer that we’ve just recently sole the money from the federal government sourced a southern contractor for a for the Building Canada Plan so that we substantial amount of money to fix the are able to complete this project. With pillar that is in dire need of repair, which all of the issues that were pertaining to has failed engineering specifications the airport itself, we have been and it is really an issue of safety. So I’m concentrating on that. The information now going to ask the questions to the on the actual terminal itself, I don’t have department, represented by the Minister with me, but I would be pleased to of Transportation, or maybe give us a provide that information to the Member. little bit of an update here. But I can assure the Member that the department is serious about completing May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 37

What exactly is happening this summer repair work. Unfortunately, we only with this new contract that’s being sole obtained two photos of the three areas. sourced to a southern firm? Thank you. We’re going back down when the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. season is right to look at that pier. That’s Dolynny. Minister of Transportation, Mr. my understanding of the pier and the Beaulieu. rock that is around the pier. There is some work that needs to be done. HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Thank you, Mr. There’s some holdback on it. Speaker. My understanding is that the bridge was shut down temporarily a I’m not aware that we are requesting $4 couple of weeks ago to complete the million to complete work. If there is $4 work that had to be completed. I know million worth of work, it would be work that that did not create a tremendous that would be done in the budget that amount of issues. We had some issue was approved here in the House. Thank with the traffic and people wanting to you. haul larger loads across. We’re able to MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you. This is accommodate everything at this time. I exactly the problem with why the Auditor don’t have the specifics of that contract General of Canada was brought in to that the Member refers to, but my evaluate this project. We continue to understanding is that that’s not an issue. have mismanagement of these cost Thank you. overruns, we continue to have a MR. DOLYNNY: Contrary to what we clandestine approach to how this project just heard from the Minister, I don’t is being managed in the department, believe this is indeed what’s transpiring. Members on this side of the House have What we’re hearing from the industry is no idea where this money is being that there is indeed a large contract that spent. We go to the website, there’s is coming from the South, sole sourced, nothing mentioned. We go to the Deh to do major repairs on the cement pillar Cho Bridge info website, what does it to bring it up to safety code. We’re also say, account suspended – no hearing that this organization is coming information. back to fix the railings that were not Can the Minister indicate as to when repaired last year and to fix the electrical we’re going to get updated information system that was not done properly last so we can follow this so-called phantom year. Again, we’re hearing to the tune of spending that may happen this up to $4 million. Can the Minister summer? Thank you. confirm or deny whether or not we’re HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Thank you. I going to be doing this large-scale project know that each time the Members had to bring this bridge really to safety code? asked for an update on the Deh Cho Thank you. Bridge, the department has been more HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Thank you. than accommodating. We are prepared One of the piers that was repaired on to do that and we can provide an the Deh Cho Bridge, we have confirmed update, full disclosure of costs, anything that there were three issues with the that needs to happen that we need to pier underneath the water. What had communicate to the Members. happened was that after the repair work was done, we had taken photos of the May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 38

The issue here is not as simple as the QUESTION 325-17(5): Member makes it out to be. We had an GIANT MINE ENVIRONMENTAL issue with a contractor, the contractor ASSESSMENT that had to be removed from the site or MR. BROMLEY: Thank you, Mr. had been taken off the site. The Speaker. My questions are for the contractor changed. There were some Minister of Environment. I’d like to follow issues with that. Anytime you do a large- up from my Member’s statement of scale project of this size and you have earlier today on Giant Mine. As both a to change contractors in midstream proponent and a regulator, I’m asking there’s a potential for issues. So, there the Minister if he could ask himself and is some of that and that had happened. tell us when you will sign the agreed The bridge is substantially complete. upon environmental assessment for There is some work that has to be done, Giant Mine and allow its implementation. some is seasonal and some are minor Thank you. deficiencies, but nothing to the scale MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. that the Member speaks of. Thank you. Bromley. Minister of Environment and MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Natural Resources, Mr. Miltenberger. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: Mr. Dolynny. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We, along with MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. the rest of the responsible Ministers, are Speaker. Again I ask, the Department of waiting for the lead responsible Minister Transportation website last from AANDC to publicly announce the correspondence was 2010. That is it. agreement and agreed upon Your current Deh Cho Bridge website is recommendations and modifications. suspended. I appreciate the Minister Thank you. wanting to provide Members MR. BROMLEY: We often hear information, but I think the public complaints about delays in process and deserves to know where their dollars are so on, but really fundamentally most of being spent, not just the Members. the delays are because things end up Will the Minister commit to do a full on Ministers’ desks without resolution. disclosure update, update these Could I ask why the delay? We’ve websites, talk about all the money, talk agreed upon it. Everybody has agreed about the reserve and put a final closure upon it. Work is going ahead without to this project so we know indeed what being done under the conditions of the taxpayers are on the hook for? Thank environmental assessment that you. everybody has agreed on. Why the HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Yes, I will delay? commit to that. HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: Mr. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, this is a project on a site that is Beaulieu. Member for Weledeh, Mr. under federal responsibility. The federal Bromley. Minister of AANDC has hold of the pen and is investing his department. We, like everybody else, are awaiting his public May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 39 release and approval of the report and QUESTION 326-17(5): the agreed to modifications. Thank you. DEH CHO BRIDGE ELECTRICAL MR. BROMLEY: Thanks to the CONTRACT Minister. Will the Minister ask his federal MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Mr. colleague why the delay and report back Speaker. I just want to pick up a little bit to the House? Mahsi. on one of the subjects Member Dolynny HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: raised with the Deh Cho Bridge. Of Yes, Mr. Speaker. course, I’ll be directing them, obviously, to the Minister of Transportation. MR. SPEAKER: Final, short supplementary, Mr. Bromley. More than a year ago, I was raising with the former Minister of Transportation a MR. BROMLEY: Thank you, Mr. concern about the electrical contractor, Speaker. We’ll probably be delayed on how he was quite proud about the fact the answer, but if it could be done that the southern contractor met the during this session so the public is expectations of the contract, and of informed, that would be appreciated. course, we had to award it to the Thanks for that commitment. southern contractor because they were Work is needed, definitely needed. It’s a cheaper. Of course, they met the situation that we want to get resolved, standards of everything that they had and work is underway, but there is also asked for in the contract. But my the need for oversight to make sure it’s understanding is they never met those being done in the way that everybody expectations on safety and installation has agreed upon. process. Of course, their community Is the delay being done on purpose to commitment, from my understanding, delay public oversight? Thank you. was nothing and I think that proved itself out by itself. HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: Mr. Speaker, the attribution of motive is not I would like to get some details on how a something I want to engage in. We southern contractor fulfilled their know what is before us. We’re waiting obligations when they won the electrical for the federal Minister to give a public contract on the Deh Cho Bridge. My response. In the meantime, some work questions are to the Minister of is carrying on. It has been taken out of Transportation to explain how that rolled the EA that has been deemed to be out and how they met every obligation critical with the roaster and underground that they won that contract under. Thank stabilization and such, but other than you. that, the project remains under care and MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. maintenance until the federal Minister Hawkins. Minister of Transportation, Mr. releases the final decision following the Beaulieu. response from Ministers. Thank you. HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Thank you, Mr. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As a commitment to the Miltenberger. Mr. Hawkins. House, the department did a retrospective analysis of the bridge and also accepted all of the recommendations of the Auditor May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 40

General. The specific work that was Quite frankly, a northern company that done in detail, the contract that the has investments here, that has Member speaks of, I don’t have that employees hired here that wanted to do detail here with me and I am not able to this particular work lost the job because speak on that at this time. Thank you. the southern business lowballed them MR. HAWKINS: Mr. Speaker, the and it seems like we are going back to former Minister proclaimed quite fix the work that they lowballed a adamantly and passionately about how northern company. much money they were saving, but it Are we at a financial risk or a legal risk seems like we may be just redoing all in this situation because we accepted a that work that that southern contractor low tender but we allowed a change lowballed the bid so that they can get order to sneak well beyond the original the job. Now I want to know, is this expectations? electrical work that they did last year HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Mr. Speaker, I under the conditions that we thought we don’t have the details of that specific were being led down the garden path contract. I don’t have the details of the that they would be obliged to meet and change order to that contract, but there would meet and promised to meet are regulations in place, there are haven’t been met. holdbacks on all contracts to Can the Minister explain, has the accommodate any potential issues on electrical work fully been signed off as the contracts, so those are our standard. lawful and safe for Northerners and are They are laid out in the contract. a fulfilled their contract in the eyes of the Depending on what the price of the Department of Transportation? overall contract was, then the holdback HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Mr. Speaker, would be there. The appropriate amount as I indicated, I don’t have the details of would be held back to ensure that the the contract that the Member speaks of. work is completed to a standard that’s It would be difficult for me to determine acceptable. Thank you. or indicate whether or not all the work MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. has been signed off as good work by the Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, department. My understanding is that Mr. Hawkins. these individuals that were doing the MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Mr. work are professionals. I know that the Speaker. I think we need to boil it down staff that are inspecting the work are to who is responsible for this professionals. My assumption is that if mismanagement of this electrical the staff is signing off on work on the contract. Frankly, it seems as if they Deh Cho Bridge, then the work is done were all too excited to save all this to proper standard. Thank you. money, but it turns out that it has turned MR. HAWKINS: Mr. Speaker, I would into an interesting boondoggle all over like to know what the Department of because oh, my goodness, we are going Transportation is going to do when it to save money from a southern comes to finding out if we have any company, but it turns out if we have to holdbacks on this particular work at this redo the work, it’s going to cost us more. time and what are we going to do when I, quite frankly, think we are in a we need to address these in the future. situation of liability here that we may May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 41 rightfully, if not morally, owe money or Hansard doesn’t really clarify it for me. some type of responsible action towards From Hansard, the Minister stated, “I’m the original northern company that bid hoping to have that Cabinet policy to on the work, could have done the work Cabinet and then to Standing or we wouldn’t be talking about it today. Committee on Social Programs in July.” I would like to hear what type of That’s a little confusing to me, plus the accountability this Minister is going to reference to the RFP. So I would like to hold somebody to account. Thank you. ask the Minister if he could please HON. TOM BEAULIEU: Mr. Speaker, elaborate a bit and clarify it for me. the department doesn’t mismanage Thank you. projects. I don’t believe that this is one MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Ms. that was mismanaged. I will check into Bisaro. Minister of Health and Social the allegations made here by the Services, Mr. Abernethy. Member. I’m sure that everything is HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Thank you, done according to the regulations, Mr. Speaker. I apologize for the according to the standards. There are confusion. Several months ago, I briefed certainly a lot of regulations surrounding committee and provided them with some any sort of electrical work. We will information on the review of the Medical ensure that is done within that. I don’t Travel Policy. We had hoped to actually believe there is mismanagement. have what would be the base policy, the I can advise the Members if there are Cabinet policy ready for some any issues out there, but I don’t believe discussion in March. Unfortunately, I there are. It’s difficult for me to respond had an opportunity to be briefed on that to a question when the Member is and I didn’t feel it was consistent with assuming that things are mismanaged. the types of questions and concerns the Thank you. Members had been raising, so I asked MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. the department to do a little bit of work. Beaulieu. Member for Frame Lake, Ms. As a result, we are delayed on that. I Bisaro. hope to have that base Cabinet policy around medical travel done in July so QUESTION 327-17(5): that I can share it with Cabinet and GNWT MEDICAL TRAVEL Regular Members. POLICY As part of the medical travel review, we ESCORT PROVISIONS were going to work on the base Cabinet MS. BISARO: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. policy but then we were also to do some I would like to take this opportunity to try work on some specific aspects of it, and get some clarification from the things such as escorts, non-medical Minister of Health and Social Services escorts as well as fees as well as an with regards to some answers he gave appeal process. That was going to occur to MLA Blake two days ago in regards to based on the timeline that I provided the Medical Travel Policy and escorts. In after we had done the base policy. his answer to Mr. Blake, the Minister Frankly, given the delay that is now in stated that there was going to be an place, I don’t want to wait to do the work RFP put out to deal with an escort on the escort portion because clearly we policy. I believe that’s what I heard. are hearing from people that that needs May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 42 to be done. I have directed the help us do this in a timely manner, so department to prepare and go out with this isn’t unusual, but given the an RFP to seek somebody who can timelines, we want to make sure that we actually help us through that process to get this done. I feel it’s important to facilitate meeting with stakeholders, expedite the section around escorts. bring individuals who have some input Thank you, Mr. Speaker. that they want to provide onto this, build MS. BISARO: I totally agree. This upon all the statistical work that we policy has been revised for a very long pulled together and all the research that period of time, so I’m glad that we are we’ve done to do that public moving forward on the whole policy but consultation process to make specifically on this one section. recommendations on how to move forward with this escort portion. I’m still a bit confused when the Minister references a Cabinet policy. I’m not sure We’ve heard a lot of opinion; we’ve if that is a policy that stays just within heard a lot of ideas; we’ve heard a lot of Cabinet. When policies are developed, solutions. Some of the solutions they are generally made public. So contradict each other. I’ve had one when he talks about a Cabinet policy, is community say we want to do this and this a policy that will be public other communities say please don’t do afterwards and he is simply calling it a that. There is a lot of information there. Cabinet policy because it’s not We are seeking a consultant to help us approved? I’m a little confused there. go through that process and give us Thanks. some concrete recommendations on the escort portion. That is what the RFP is HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: What I’m for. referring to is the overarching policy with respect to medical travel and how it I apologize for any confusion. Thank operates and functions. It will be you, Mr. Speaker. available to the authorities, it will be MS. BISARO: Thanks to the Minister available to all individuals. We will make for the explanation. Generally, policy is sure that people understand the Medical developed internally. Why is it that we Travel Policy. Thank you. need to go to an RFP and hire a MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. contractor to develop this part of the Abernethy. Mrs. Groenewegen. policy? Thank you. HON. GLEN ABERNETHY: Mr. QUESTION 328-17(5): Speaker, we have a certain number of IMPLEMENTATION OF staff in the department who are doing a JUNIOR KINDERGARTEN large amount of work, and more and MRS. GROENEWEGEN: Thank you, more priorities are coming at them on a Mr. Speaker. I’m probably the regular basis. We have seen clearly that umpteenth person who has stood up in we are capped with resources, and I this House to talk about Junior want this work to be done and I want it Kindergarten, but I have to weigh in on to be done as quickly as possible, but this topic. My questions are for the we often go out and seek additional Minister of Education, Culture and resources to help with the reviews and Employment. analysis and there are people who can May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 43

Right from the start, who can argue with part of it. Head Start program is another early childhood development and one. We have eight Head Start expanding that within our government? programs across the territory through Where the problem lies is how this federal funding. Obviously, yes, we have department tried to take, yet again, a approached the federal government on cookie cutter, one-size-fits-all approach numerous programs such as Head Start to early childhood development in the and other early childhood delivery into communities without taking into the communities. We’ve been told over consideration what impacts that would and over, it’s your own jurisdictional have and what ripple effect that would deliverance. We have to work with that, have. In a community like Hay River but every opportunity, yes, we have met where we have play school, Growing with the federal government not only on Together, Tree House, Aboriginal Head the education part but other labour Start where age four children attend all market development agreements and of these programs, sure, parents are other sources of funding that could be going to put their kids into an optional potentially available to us, so we have Junior Kindergarten Program, but we embarked on that and we will continue have added this. We’ve asked our to do so. educational councils to do more with MRS. GROENEWEGEN: Did the less. So I don’t think you could find a department consider that rolling out parent who wouldn’t agree with the Junior Kindergarten in all communities principle, but if you ask the same without any consideration for what was parents if they want to have the whole already there in the area of early school system diluted by adding another childhood development, did the grade, essentially, into our schools department consider how that was going without any funding to go with it, I’m to affect those existing programs that sure you would get some mixed had been on the ground for a very long responses. time? When you take all of the four- So I would like to ask the Minister – and year-olds out of all the ones I just maybe he’s been asked this before, but named, what is the result for those and let me ask again – did you consider, in the daycares? Are we basically gutting the small communities where the need all that stuff that we’ve already was the most dire where you didn’t established in favour of Junior already have long established ECE Kindergarten? Thank you. programming, did you approach the HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Yes. federal government and think about The answer would be yes. We have things like Aboriginal Head Start? Thank considered all those mitigations and you. working with the early childhood MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mrs. deliverers in the communities, the child Groenewegen. The honourable Minister care workers, as well, and the program of Education, Culture and Employment, deliverers. We thought about all the Mr. Lafferty. implications, as well, but at the same HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, time, creating more opportunities where Mr. Speaker. This particular if we draw out the four-year-olds, they programming, Junior Kindergarten is have more opportunity to focus on zero May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 44 to three years of age. How can we attention as part of the action plan. Now assist in those areas? we’re currently working on those on At the same time, the Head Start what we can do immediately, the short- program, some of those have been in term/long-term plans. place for a number of years. This is an So, yes, we’ve considered all those option for enhancing. Working with the areas. It came from the parents, Head Start program, it’s an optional grandparents and educators. Based on program for them, for the parents. So that, we are rolling out those specific we’ve reached out to the workers, programs. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. reached out to program developers and MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. provide them as much support as we Lafferty. Final, short supplementary, possibly can and provide options as Mrs. Groenewegen. well. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. MRS. GROENEWEGEN: Thank you, MRS. GROENEWEGEN: Did the Mr. Speaker. We have such a diversity department consider that in the small of communities and such a diversity of communities where there was nothing needs in the Northwest Territories. I just established formally for early childhood think that something that was not across development, that perhaps a made-in- the board and more responsive to each the-North, not in association with the community in terms of what was already school, kind of approach could have there and what was needed would have been better where we could have been a better approach. Would the involved parents and families and Minister agree? Thank you. incorporated some other kind of parenting support and training and life HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: I agree skills and different things? I am not we have to have all those programs in trying to be mean to the smaller our communities that do not have communities, but obviously there is a licenced early childhood programming. higher unemployment rate in those Based on the stats we have delivered in communities and it might have been an the House, there are 10 communities opportunity to get parents and children, without the program. So, yes, I agree if not a program, fashioned particularly with that. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. for those communities in consultation MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. with those communities rather than Lafferty. The honourable Member for trying to add a grade into schools. Was Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya. that considered? Thank you. QUESTION 329-17(5): HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: I agree HYDRAULIC FRACTURING that that is part of the process with early IMPACT STUDIES childhood development, the overall framework. When we talk about early MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Mr. childhood development, it is a mega Speaker. My question is to the Minister piece of work across the Northwest of Environment. Several weeks ago an Territories. Junior Kindergarten is just academic panel of experts put out a 295 one piece of it. We have all these page report on the hydraulic fracking in different initiatives on the go. Canada. I want to ask the Minister if his Recommendations are brought to our department has taken a look at the May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 45 report and compared it to what we there’s development and there’s no already have in the Northwest development. I mean, our elders put this Territories, what we have with the Sahtu Land Use Plan together over 15 National Energy Board and what we years. have within our own land claims/water I want to ask the Minister of board provisions on this issue. Are we Environment, because the environment doing most of what the experts believe is very close to us. The elders know we need to be looking at or are we what they’re talking about. I want to ask, above and beyond what the report is in regard to this report, is there any type stating? Has an analysis been done like of evidence that we’re doing right now that? that says we’re doing more than what MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. the report is stating? Yakeleya. The honourable Minister of HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: Environment and Natural Resources, We, as a government, are aware of the Mr. Miltenberger. need to do, within the Sahtu, some HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: regional groundwater mapping. The Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We are aware baseline work on wildlife, that work is of the report. We have done extensive underway. There is work being done work, a couple of years at least, of our through the Environmental Studies own work looking at best practices and Research Fund, which is a fund and a looking at other jurisdictions. There has program that involves the federal been a lot of on-the-ground research government and the territorial done. Mr. Ramsay has taken a number government as well as assistance from of groups to different sites to take a look industry. We’ve got money invested first-hand. We now have regulatory there, nearly a million dollars as well. authority, we have a development The industry representatives have been assessment process. We are looking at very forthcoming in terms of offering to that report along with all the other work share the site-specific work that they that’s out there in terms of the best have to do in regard to groundwater and practices. As we look at the issue of wildlife impacts that we could add to that hydraulic fracking, how do we do it in knowledge base. We are clearly now the best way possible that will honour embarked upon that project over the our obligation and commitment to long term to conclude that much needed people and look after the land, water baseline information. and animals at the same time and have MR. YAKELEYA: The technique that I balanced sustainable development? So, understood from Husky and Conoco’s that report will add some information personnel, and of course our own and value to those processes. Thank research in our communities, is that the you. hydraulic fracking would go down about MR. YAKELEYA: In the report that I two kilometres underground. Some of briefly read, the summary, are there the other fears that people have is that studies that we are already there are only shallow wells that will be undertaking? We have the Sahtu Land hydraulically fracked. That’s not the Use Plan put together by primarily the case in the case in the Sahtu. elders in the Sahtu where they’re saying May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 46

Is there any type of method that can academic experts, I’m not too sure if reassure the people that when we do they looked at our authorities in the hydraulic fracking underground two Sahtu to have this issue being looked at. kilometres, that if there are any type of I want to ask the Minister, other than the tracers that you can put in the fluid that Sahtu region getting the attention on this shows that the actual chemicals are hydraulic fracking, are there other coming up out of that type of operation? fracking operations in the Northwest Is there any type of information that you Territories? have that could reassure our people that HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: from other locations that they’re doing We’ve been in the oil business for hydraulic fracking that this is probably literally decades. There has been a something that we could use in tremendous amount of traditional determining our decision as to the vertical drilling and fracking. The issue methods being used in the Sahtu? of horizontal is something that is, from HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: As my understanding, new to the Northwest the individual projects are permitted, Territories and is being looked at there are going to be the requirements carefully through the process we’ve just to look at those types of issues. What been talking about here in this House. we are committing to, of course, is a I’m not aware that there was any other thorough monitoring on an ongoing horizontal fracking that I’m aware of. basis. We’ll be able to track to very, very MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. close range the need to go below Miltenberger. Mr. Hawkins. groundwater tables and then there will be ongoing monitoring on site. We’ve QUESTION 330-17(5): also developed a process across the IMPLEMENTATION OF Northwest Territories with community- JUNIOR KINDERGARTEN based groundwater monitoring that we’ll MR. HAWKINS: Mr. Speaker, I’m going be looking and testing water on a to have questions for the Minister of regular basis, so we are going to have Education, Culture and Employment all the steps and best practices in place regarding some of this Junior that we need to provide those Kindergarten stuff, just to follow up with assurances. some of the problems that we’ve talked MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. about to date and certainly issues I’ve Miltenberger. Final, short raised before. supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya. I was speaking to two parents yesterday MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Mr. with grave concerns about this, because Speaker. The Sahtu has provisions they had gone to an invitation at, I within the land claims and the Sahtu believe, our museum to talk about the Land Use Plan and, of course, our own impacts on day home operators, and the co-management decision-making senior official said that, yes, you might authority with our Sahtu Land and Water lose a third of your income, but if you Board, so we’re in the driver’s seat on were better budgeters you would notice this issue here. very little change. I want to ask the Minister, in the analysis Is that the advice our senior officials are of the report that came out by the giving the families that take care of our May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 47 most precious people, which is our could budget and manage your money children? Is that sanctioned and better this wouldn’t be a problem? condoned and directed by the These are parents telling me this. Does Department of Education? the Minister stand by those words? MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: With any Hawkins. The Minister of Education, Mr. organization there is a budgeting Lafferty. process. We have to work with that. As HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, the Department of Education, Culture Mr. Speaker. When we talked about and Employment, we provide public rolling out the Junior Kindergarten, we money to these organizations. There is wanted to work closely with the daycare the accountability issue and providers and also the child care transparency issues, so we’ll continue to workers. We provided as much support support that. as we possibly could to hear their MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. perspective, and we took all that into Lafferty. Final, short supplementary, Mr. consideration as well. Hawkins. MR. HAWKINS: That’s not an answer. MR. HAWKINS: Mr. Speaker the When the senior official says day homes government official continues on by need to accept that things are going to saying if you can’t manage your own change and you’re going to lose money money, give us your budgets and we’ll and you need to accept that, when two do it for you, and by the way, you parents are telling me this yesterday, probably won’t notice any change. What directed from our government, which in facts support that when the government essence is the Minister’s words if you takes a third of the revenue stream and put it this way, because they’re head of moves them over to Junior the department, is this sanctioned, Kindergarten, and the government condoned and stood by, by this seems to be telling everybody, don’t Minister? worry, go to the schools for free child HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Again, care, but don’t worry, lots of people still when we are rolling out the program this want to pay $1,000 a month, so you’ve fall, we talk about the implications into got no problems. What does the the daycare providers, and the government think about that and does contributions they get from ECE is the Minister stand by that, that they’re based on enrolment, the enrolment of offering to say if you cannot manage the child in the daycare system. We’ll your own budgets we’ll do them for you? continue to support those areas. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: As I MR. HAWKINS: That’s okay. I’m two stated in this House, I did meet with for two. Two questions, no answers. I’ll both YK 1 and the Catholic School keep going. Board just a couple days ago, and we’re compiling all the numbers now. We want Is it sanctioned and condoned and to have the true facts and the true supported by this particular Minister that numbers. That will be before us early when a government official tells these next week and we will be releasing that people in a roomful of parents and to the public. daycare operators, et cetera, that if you May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 48

MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. the Northwest Territories. Can the Lafferty. Mr. Yakeleya. Minister do that? HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Mr. Speaker, QUESTION 331-17(5): we would be happy to try and get that IMPACTS OF PREVIOUS information together for the Member. HYDRAULIC FRACTURING Back in the ‘70s near the Northwest INITIATIVES Territories/British Columbia border, MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Mr. there was some fracking that took place Speaker. I want to continue on with my and, again, at Beaver River. I would be question on the issue of hydraulic happy to get that information for the fracking. I want to ask the Minister of ITI Member. Thank you. in his capacity with this information. MR. YAKELEYA: Mr. Speaker, also I I spoke to one of the leaders from Fort would ask the Minister, given in the time Liard. The leader had said that they did of the ‘70s, what type of authority, what have some fracking in his region. Have type of working relationship and if it’s there been any other types of fracking in possible that when that fracking the Northwest Territories in the last 15 operation happened at Beaver River. I’m or 20 years? not too sure where exactly it is and what MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. type of impacts we are seeing today in Yakeleya. Minister of Industry, Tourism 2014 from that operation even though it and Investment, Mr. Ramsay. is a vertical frack. A frack is a frack is a frack. I want to ask the Minister if that is HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Thank you, possible. Mr. Speaker. I believe there has been some, but it was not horizontally drilled HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Mr. Speaker, and fractured but vertically drilled and all those operations would have been fractured. I believe there has been some under COGOA back in the ‘70s with the in the Northwest Territories over the federal government. We will do our best past few decades. Thank you. to try to get that information for the Member. Of course, now we are MR. YAKELEYA: Mr. Speaker, the responsible for onshore regulation of oil commonality that we have is there have and gas here in the Northwest been fracking operations in the Territories. I will make a commitment to Northwest Territories. Vertical, or the the Member that we will try our best to new one now we are using is called get that information to the Member. horizontal, so there has been fracking in Thank you. the Northwest Territories. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. I would like the Minister to provide me Ramsay. Final, short supplementary, with more detailed information as to Mr. Yakeleya. what type of impacts it had in those regions. MR. YAKELEYA: Mr. Speaker, I certainly look for that information. I want Have there been environmental studies? to ask my last question to the Minister Is water being studied after that, or the and to his colleague, that the Sahtu air, the animals? That is so we have people have a land claim, a some baseline information as to where constitutionally protected document that those actual fracking operations went in May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 49 was negotiated by the guidance of our eight district education authorities in the elders in the Sahtu to take control of our NWT according to a predetermined destiny. formula. Elementary and secondary What type of approach is set by this school contributions are provided to department and this government on education authorities based on another protected area that is protected government priorities and education by the Constitution and jurisdiction as needs. This funding framework plays a how do we work in relationship with land pivotal role in directing and supporting claim organizations that have these education councils to achieve education types of protection in regards to objectives. School contributions are decision-making authorities on types of calculated based on enrolment and to economic opportunities that are in that cover annual operating and region? maintenance costs. HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Mr. Speaker, 1. Provide a breakdown showing the the land claim is a very powerful tool for comparison of GNWT funding for the people of the Sahtu and a valuable divisional education councils to the tool in that I do understand there are Yellowknife education authorities. subsurface rights included in that land 2. In this comparison, include the total claim. As far as our government is student enrolments per divisional concerned, we need to continue to work education council and district with the leadership in the Sahtu, and education authority and any special decisions are going to have to be made funding that they receive; for together with the people of the Sahtu so example, small school allocations, that they can get their way forward by inclusion funding, et cetera. working together with us. That is the MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Ms. way things are going to continue to Bisaro. Item 9, returns to written happen. We have a track record of questions. Item 10, replies to opening continuing to work with the Member, the address. Item 11, petitions. Item 12, leadership in the Sahtu, and we are reports of standing and special going to continue down that path. Thank committees. Item 13, reports of you. committees on the review of bills. Item MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. 14, tabling of documents. Item 15, Ramsay. Item 8, written questions. Ms. notices of motion. Mr. Yakeleya. Bisaro. 10) Notices of Motion 9) Written Questions MOTION 19-17(5): WRITTEN QUESTION 17-17(5): FINANCIAL COMPENSATION GNWT FUNDING PROVIDED TO FOR MEDICAL EDUCATION COUNCILS AND AND NON-MEDICAL TRAVEL AUTHORITIES ESCORTS MS. BISARO: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. YAKELEYA: Mr. Speaker, I give I have a question for the Minister of notice that on Monday, June 2, 2014, I Education, Culture and Employment. will move the following motion: Now The department provides funding to therefore I move, seconded by the May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 50 honourable Member for Mackenzie 12) First Reading of Bills Delta, that the Legislative Assembly strongly recommends that the BILL 27: Department of Health and Social MISCELLANEOUS STATUTE Services devise a system of LAW compensating medical and non-medical AMENDMENT ACT, 2014 travel escorts for their time, with the goal HON. DAVID RAMSAY: Thank you, of implementing the system in the fiscal Mr. Speaker. I move, seconded by the year 2015-16; and further, that the honourable Member for Monfwi, that Bill government provide a comprehensive 27, Miscellaneous Statute Law response to this motion within 120 days. Amendment Act, 2014, be read for the Thank you, Mr. Speaker. first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. MR. SPEAKER: Bill 27 has had first Yakeleya. Item 16, notices of motion for reading. first reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger. ---Carried 11) Notices of Motion for Mr. Bouchard. First Reading of Bills BILL 26: BILL 28 AN ACT TO AMEND THE SUPPLEMENTARY ELECTIONS AND PLEBISCITES APPROPRIATION ACT ACT (INFRASTRUCTURE MR. BOUCHARD: Thank you, Mr. EXPENDITURES), Speaker. I move, seconded by the NO. 3, 2014-2015 honourable Member for Kam Lake, that HON. MICHAEL MILTENBERGER: Bill 26, An Act to Amend the Elections Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I give notice and Plebiscites Act, be read for the first that on Monday, June 2, 2014, I will time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. move that Bill 28, Supplementary MR. SPEAKER: Bill 26 has had first Appropriation Act (Infrastructure reading. Expenditures), No. 3, 2014-2015, be read for the first time. Thank you. ---Carried MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Item 19, second reading of bills. Item Miltenberger. Item 17, motions. 20, consideration in Committee of the Colleagues, we will call a 15-minute Whole of bills and other matters, with break. Mrs. Groenewegen in the chair. ---SHORT RECESS 13) Consideration in Committee of the Whole MR. SPEAKER: Item 18, first reading of Bills and Other Matters of bills. Mr. Ramsay. CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): I call Committee of the Whole to order. We have one item before us today on our agenda, Bill 24, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act. What is the wish of the committee? Ms. Bisaro. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 51

MS. BISARO: Thank you, Madam HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Yes, I Chair. We would like to deal with Bill 24 would. today. CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): Does committee agree? Does committee agree? SOME HON. MEMBERS: Agreed. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Agreed. CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): Agreed, thank you. I’ll ask the Sergeant- Thank you. I’d like to ask the Minister at-Arms to please escort the witnesses responsible for Education, Culture and to the table. Employment if he would like to read his Minister Lafferty, could you please opening remarks. Minister Lafferty. introduce your witnesses for the record? HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, Madam Speaker. I am pleased to Madam Chair. To my left is Jolene introduce Bill 24, An Act to Amend the Saturnino. She’s the director of income Student Financial Assistance Act. The security within the ECE department. purpose of this legislation is to raise the Also, to my right is Ken Chutskoff, maximum aggregate of the principal legislative counsel within Justice. Mahsi. amounts of all student loans that may be made by the Government of the CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): Northwest Territories. Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Before we proceed with general comments, I’d like The maximum aggregate principal to ask the chair of the Standing amount of student loans that the Committee on Social Programs, Mr. government may lend under the Student Moses, if he would like to bring the Financial Assistance Act is currently set committee’s remarks. Mr. Moses. at $40 million. The amendment proposes to increase this amount to $45 MR. MOSES: Thank you, Madam million for the fiscal year 2014-2015 and Chair. The Standing Committee on thereafter. This change is required to Social Programs conducted its public allow the Department of Education, review of Bill 24, An Act to Amend the Culture and Employment to continue Student Financial Assistance Act, on providing student financial assistance at May 27, 2014. A clause-by-clause current benefit levels. review was held the same day. The committee thanks the Minister and his I trust that Members will agree that this staff for presenting the bill. amendment is appropriate and necessary. The purpose of the legislation is to ensure ongoing financial aid to students. I would be pleased to answer any The bill increases the maximum questions the Members may have. aggregate for principal amounts Mahsi, Madam Chair. outstanding for all loans to $45 million CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): for 2014-2015 and subsequent years. Thank you, Minister Lafferty. I’d like to Following the committee’s review, a ask the Minister if he’d like to bring motion was carried to report Bill 24, An witnesses into the Chamber. Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act, to the Assembly as May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 52 ready for consideration in Committee of CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): the Whole. Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Minister This concludes the committee’s opening Lafferty. comments on Bill 24. Individual HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, Members may have additional questions Madam Chair. We’re fully aware of the or comments as we proceed. Thank collection that’s before us. It’s a you, Madam Chair. challenge that we’ve been faced with, CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): and the office of the Auditor General Thank you, Mr. Moses. General gave specific instructions on this comments. Mr. Dolynny. particular area. The Member alluded to 60 percent fail. Those are areas that we MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Madam are continuously and aggressively going Chair. Some of the discussions that we after for collection. This is not pertaining had with this bill in camera I want to to this particular change. The bring to the floor of the House to make amendment is coming with the $5 them public. One of the areas of million increase. So it is a separate concern that I know I had as a Member, topic, and I’ll get Ms. Saturnino to just this is the second time during the life of elaborate a bit more on the process this Assembly that we’ve come back to itself. Mahsi. add a component, or a financial component to this SFA total. I just want CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): to make sure that we’re doing things in Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Ms. the right mannerism. Saturnino. One of the concerns we had, and it was MS. SATURNINO: Thank you, Madam also brought up and echoed by the Chair. The department, in its action plan Auditor General of Canada, is that there related to the response to the office of has been some concern on the the Auditor General’s audit on the collection of student financial loans. In Income Security Program, made a fact, some of the numbers that the number of commitments with regard to Auditor General realized in their audit automating the system, the reporting was that we failed to collect on roughly system for student loans, so to identify around 60 percent of our student when a loan becomes due. financial loans that are out there, which Previous to this there was a very is putting a burden on our system. manual process that was used. The So my opening question here in a request for the increase for the $5 general sense is because of the fact, not million is not in relation to the collection just me, not just committee, but the or default of collection files. It is in fact Auditor General of Canada clearly related to the fact that we have recently articulating that we’ve got a collection increased our remissible loan rates, problem. Is this collection problem, or is which means that we have more funds the repatriation of getting our money that are being disbursed to our post- back to taxpayers causing the impetus secondary students while they are here for seeing an increase of $5 million attending studies. As a result, we being asked here today? Thank you. requested an increase in the amount of funds that are available under the revolving loan limit. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 53

CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): are collecting loans back in payment, to Thank you, Ms. Saturnino. Mr. Dolynny. me this is a revolving pot of money. If MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Madam we are, by virtue, having trouble, as Chair. Just so I’m completely indicated by the Auditor General, and I understanding the situation, this am hearing promising words that we are increase has to do with more remissible working towards mitigating collection, loans being involved; however, what we which is good to hear, that sounds like have heard also here is that this is a by default that we are actually revolving amount of money, so money increasing this revolving pot limit. For going out and coming back in. With the life of me, I can’t understand how respect to as we are now talking about these are two separate issues if we are the challenges we have had in collecting dealing with one pot of revolving money. that money to come back into this so- I’m going to ask the department if they called pot of revolving money, so you’re can provide some type of accounting saying that this increase of $5 million framework to clearly articulate that these has no way, shape or form involved with are indeed two separate issues, the fact that we are struggling to collect because I can’t for the life of me see those monies back that are in debt or how this are two separate issues. Thank default. Are these two separate issues? you. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Ms. Saturnino. Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Minister MS. SATURNINO: Thank you, Madam Lafferty. Chair. When a student receives funding HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Madam to attend post-secondary studies Chair, that is correct; they are two through the remissible loan, part of the separate issues. We have been talking agreement is that they would return to about the collection, how we can collect the Northwest Territories and live here or be aggressive in that area. I’ve been in order to pay back that loan. They are dealing with my department on how to not in fact required to make financial address those matters at hand because payments towards that loan. At current we have to take the Auditor General’s rates, for every year that a student recommendations seriously into attends post-secondary studies, it takes consideration, so that’s what we are them approximately two years, in fact doing. Those are two separate issues 1.7 years to come back to the Northwest with requests of the $5 million to Territories and remiss that same amount increase. Mahsi. of money. CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): The rate that we are currently providing Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Mr. our remission rates compared to the Dolynny. amount that we provide has resulted in MR. DOLYNNY: Madam Chair, for the the rate of which students are receiving life of me I can’t understand. If we have the remission to take longer. As a result, a revolving amount of money, which is a we have more funds that are being total wholesome amount, a pot, if you disbursed than are being written off or will, and we are giving out loans and we forgiven at the same time. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 54

MR. DOLYNNY: Madam Chair, I think since we are opening this up for the we’re getting a bit more clarity here. So, second time during the life of the 17th we are hearing that the remission rate, Assembly and if it’s not going to be the rate that we are writing off, or opened up now, when can we expect to basically return of work services, if I can see the appeals process being use that terminology, is increasing. The revamped, relooked, retooled in order to question that I have here is: How much meet the needs of our students? Thank of that is real cash that is being in you. default? Really, is this real cash that’s CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): not coming back in as a result of a fairly Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Minister high default rate of possibly 60 percent? Lafferty. How much of that revolving fund or how much of that of the potential $5 million HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, increase here is due to actual cash not Madam Chair. We recall that two years coming back into the coffers of this ago that was addressed to our revolving fund? Thank you. department. I was just trying to get clarification of the status on that. The MS. SATURNINO: Unfortunately, I appeals part will be introducing that don’t know the answer to that question; potentially this coming fall. I will get Ms. however, I can commit that we will look Saturnino to just maybe elaborate more into it and we can provide that in detail. Mahsi. information. CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): MR. DOLYNNY: Madam Chair, I am Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Ms. encouraged to get that type of Saturnino. information, and I think committee would also be interested in receiving that. MS. SATURNINO: The section relating to appeals that is currently under the Lastly, this is a question I brought up SFA Act is in relation to the SFA two years ago when we had the Appeals Board. With regards to the first opportunity to look at this bill. Last time level of appeal, that’s in the Student we increased it to $40 million. It was the Financial Assistance Regulations. We fact that if we are going to do the work have made a commitment to return to of opening up a bill to do a standing committee with consequential amendment to the act, recommendations for changing the the fact that the appeals program was current process with regards to the first also noted as being an opportunity in level of appeal, specifically in regards to this area and, again, I ask once again. Section 40 of the Student Financial The student financial assistance Assistance Regulations. appeals process is in dire need of a CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): review. When can we expect to see this Thank you, Ms. Saturnino. Next under happening, and why didn’t we include it general comments I have Ms. Bisaro. now? We know how much time, work and energy it takes to get a bill to the MS. BISARO: Thanks, Madam Chair. I House, to the floor. I know this has been have similar concerns to my colleague asked not by this Member; other Mr. Dolynny. I also wondered about why Members have come forward. I am we needed the increase, and I asking why didn’t we include it now appreciate the answer. I do have May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 55 questions around the amounts, similar CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): to Mr. Dolynny. Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty. We’ve talked about a default rate, I think HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: We just defaulting on loans rate, and we’ve know that over a five-year period it’s talked about a remission rate. My around 70 percent, but we can provide question is not so much the dollar the detailed information to the Members. amount but a trend. MS. BISARO: My next question is Has the percentage of remission and similar to Mr. Dolynny’s in looking at the defaulting on loans gone up or gone cash amount, but I guess if you can’t tell down over the last number of years? me the percentage, you probably can’t Thank you. tell me the amount of dollars. I’m looking CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): to know whether or not the dollar Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Ms. Saturnino. amount that we are forgiving and/or that we are losing through defaulted loans is MS. SATURNINO: Thank you, Madam going up or down over time. Chair. I don’t have the exact figures with regards to defaults on student loans at HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: That is this time, but what I can inform you of is detailed information that we don’t have that we’ve recently worked with the at the tips of our fingers here, but at the Department of Finance and have same time, we can provide that substantiated, through income tax information to the Members. returns and filing of income tax returns, MS. BISARO: Thanks to the Minister. that approximately 70 percent of our My last question is a general question non-Aboriginal students who received with regard to this particular process, the remissible loan do return to the and I think we all know that developing a Northwest Territories upon completion bill requires a great deal of time and of studies. In comparison, approximately effort on the part of both Regular 80 of our Aboriginal students return and Members, the Minister’s office and staff. file income tax returns the following It’s quite a process to put legislation in year. place and to go through the whole CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): process of providing it to committee, Thank you, Ms. Saturnino. Ms. Bisaro. committee does the review, it then comes here. There is a great deal of MS. BISARO: Thank you, Madam time and effort involved on many Chair. That’s great. Can I get a sense of people’s parts, and it seems to me that whether or not…and this is not so much there might be a better way to do this relative to the students coming back without having to make a change to but… Well, I guess it is, because if more legislation, whether it’s every year or students are coming back then we are every two or three years. remissing more money. I’d like to know whether that’s something I’m looking for a trend. Can you give me that the Minister and the department any indication of over, say, the last five have considered, and if they have, did or 10 years whether or not this number they find that there’s an easier way to do has been going up or whether it has it without having to go through a bill stayed steady or if it has gone down? Thank you. May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 56 every time we want to increase the necessarily have to work in the North, amount in this fund? but they have to be living in the North. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: These CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): are the areas that we are currently Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Rather exploring. As I stated, two years ago it than getting into great detail on the was introduced to the standing program itself, if we could limit our committee, and we want to have a comments today to the issue of the better and also a faster process of increase on the cap for the Student dealing with it in light of this time- Financial Assistance. That might serve consuming…(inaudible)…. We hear the us well. Thank you. Mr. Yakeleya. Members clearly, so we’ll find ways of MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Madam expediting this process in a timely Chair. I will certainly take your advice on manner. this one here and I will make comments CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): on his opening comments. I will follow Thank you, Minister Lafferty. General that procedure. comments. Next I have Mr. Yakeleya. Since these are opening comments, I do MR. YAKELEYA: Thank you, Madam want to say that it is good to have Chair. My questions would hopefully students who are going out from the stay within the confines of this bill here. North or in the Northwest Territories, I’m very interested in hearing what the especially from outside the Territories. It issues are and the increase to the encourages them to come back and student financial assistance. Certainly, I bring these skills back with educational spoke earlier in my Member’s statement knowledge and be positive role models of the struggles students have attending in our communities. I know that post-secondary education in colleges or Aboriginal students are taking universities. I want to ask the Minister, in advantage of it through the grants. I regard to this increase, is the Minister, I know a grant is only limited and they’re guess… I’m glad to hear that the only allowed a certain number of students are returning to the Northwest semesters before the grant runs out. Territories, so is it to say that if a student SFA has that in the policy, and has a loan and they come back to the sometimes the Aboriginal students feel Northwest Territories, do they have to that they’re treated differently from the work within a government department, rest of the population. If the semesters agency or NGO, then that will help them are taken up or the funding is being with the remission of their loan? Is that used to the maximum, they no longer the agreement? are eligible for it and they want to CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): continue on with another type of career, Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Minister because it takes them awhile to get into Lafferty. that requirement for this type of education. Say if they want to become a HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, lawyer or study, they have used up their Madam Chair. Part of the process is that semester, I call it points, then I guess the loan to be remissed are those that’s when they’ll have to look at the individuals need to come back to the loan system and see if they’re eligible, North and live in the North. They don’t and according to the Minister, as long as May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 57 they come back and live in the North, I wanted to just let the Minister know that shows true repatriation of our that we need to look at this issue students. seriously and stronger, the issue that I’m a little concerned when students students who come to us with good who come to the North, raised in the intentions and they get support, but they North, and take advantage of our do not return, for whatever reasons, and generosity because they don’t have to only they know those reasons. However, go to the banks. One thing I always according to the statement, there is a found curious when I met with the lot, a high percentage of them coming students down south, they said they’re back and living in the North, so that’s a paying off their loan. I didn’t understand good sign. We’re seeing a small that, that they had, to the banks or some fragment or segment of our loans, and I other institution, to pay off their loans. certainly, again, support this bill with the We see a lot of those students in our request, and I support the students who schools right now or in our health are taking post-secondary institution centres. People who are young who say training for the betterment of their they’re paying off their loans working up families. Those are my comments. here. I never understood that. I thought CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): everybody has a similar situation like I Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. I didn’t really do, and I didn’t realize that. That’s part hear any questions there. Did you want of my ignorance was, I didn’t know there to respond to that, Mr. Lafferty? were different levels of education in the HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, Northwest Territories. You know, I’m Madam Chair. Yes, this particular saying, paying off your loan? remissible loan, $40 million to $45 Anyhow, I do want to say that the more I million, is certainly an incentive for the look at this that the students who are individuals to come back to the North taking advantage of this through the and also to live in the North, and also to loan system and go down south, and for welcome them back to work in the North whatever reasons they continue to live as well. Yes, they are 30 percent, or down south after they finish their less than 30 percent out there we’re still education, that’s where we’re seeing working with individuals that may not this issue here. I’m not too sure if the come back or there are some Minister and his department is challenges. We have to continue continuing to work on that, because he working with that, but it is creating said aggressively seeking policies that incentive for them to come back to work. would make sure students, to the best of Mahsi. their knowledge, said they’ll come back CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): and work and live in the Northwest Thank you, Minister Lafferty. General Territories. It feels like sometimes that comments. Next I have Mr. Hawkins. we’re being taken advantage of and our system has some form of a degree of MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Madam abuse, and that’s not the whole intention Chair. I’m just going to follow up and it’s of these support systems we have in very specific to the issue before us at place for students. this second, but I’m going to follow up on a matter that I raised in committee some time ago. Still, to my knowledge, I May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 58 have yet to receive either a letter or any MR. HAWKINS: He just said Ms. type of correspondence to that. It Saturnino. directly relates to the SFA and the loan CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): system, and now we plan to expand it. I’m sorry. Ms. Saturnino. The issue I brought to the attention of MS. SATURNINO: Thank you, Madam the Minister is when we provide loan Chair. We’ve recently done some bursary programs and we only charge, if research, and that recent research memory serves me correctly, at 1 shows that the Northwest Territories percent above the regular rate, it is very, does not offer the lowest interest rate in very low. Here, we’re asking for more Canada. There are a number of money to increase the loan system, jurisdictions that offer loans with zero which I’m not necessarily against by any percent interest rates, or just offer means, but the fact is how do you grants straight across the board, such encourage people to come back when as the Government of Newfoundland. we have the lowest interest rate on loan systems. Shouldn’t we have a multi- CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): Thank you, tiered system to encourage people to Ms. Saturnino. Mr. Hawkins. come back? It doesn’t cost any MR. HAWKINS: Thank you, Mr. Chair. additional money by increasing the rate, That still doesn’t change the principle of and actually it helps keep the balance of the question, which is if somebody takes this fund lower if people are paying the a loan through the loan program, goes higher rate if they choose not to come and gets an education and they say to back to the Northwest Territories. It’s a themselves if I’m only going to pay 2 choice, because right now it’s almost as percent interest to come back to the if we’re giving money away and I’d like Northwest Territories regardless if its 2 to see education pursued, and if we percent, zero percent, 1 percent, I don’t need to expand the loan system, I’m in really care, to be frank, low, low, and favour of that, but we need to do it in a that’s the point. They say, well, I can get way that’s strategic. a job elsewhere. Well, it’s almost like it’s CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): free money. So they choose to go Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Minister elsewhere. That’s the issue. Lafferty. The whole idea of the loan program is HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, get people to come back and invest Madam Chair. First of all, we’re not the here in the Northwest Territories. So we lowest in Canada, and even the interest invest in them and they come back and paid, it does go back to the general invest in us by working here. I’m asking fund. But I will get Ms. Saturnino to about what type of evaluation and how elaborate, and she’s been actively do we crunch the numbers to encourage involved in this, as well, with the that if people choose not to come back remissible loans. Mahsi. to the Northwest Territories, which is their choice under mobility reasons, CHAIRPERSON (Mrs. Groenewegen): they’re certainly welcome to do that, we Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Mr. cannot make them do that. So should Hawkins. we re-evaluate our loan system to say if you want to go stay somewhere, May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 59 whether you took your school in Toronto Northwest Territories who have spent or who knows, Houston, Texas, most of their life or all their life here, wherever, and you want to stay there, going out, getting education and coming that’s fine, but now you kick into the back to the Northwest Territories and secondary loan interest rate program. continuing on to the next chapter of their The whole idea is we send people out to life. I like us to find every reason to do get technical skills, training, well- that and I think maybe looking at a educated people and bring that strength tiered loan system can do this. here back to the Northwest Territories. If We need to put pressure on people to we almost give it away, we’re really say this really is your best choice, not giving it away and what benefit has it your only choice, but your best choice. been to the people of the Northwest Can I get that information and perhaps Territories? maybe he could give me an idea when? CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): Thank you, This question is at least three months Mr. Hawkins. Minister Lafferty. outstanding. HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: Mahsi, HON. JACKSON LAFFERTY: I just did Mr. Chair. Obviously, this whole commit to that. Sometimes when it remissible loan within the SFA area, we comes to a review, it does take time, but want to attract those individuals to come we will provide that information to the back to the North. As Mr. Hawkins Members. Mahsi. alluded to reviewing, we are doing that MR. HAWKINS: I don’t know what else as we speak. We want to evaluate our to say. I’ve already said it. I’ve already current system in place to make it more waited three months. The Minister says attractive, to make more incentives for he’s going to come back to me, so I those individuals who are going south. guess that’s it. Thank you. We want them to come back. If not, CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): Any further what other options can we provide to questions, Mr. Hawkins? Thank you, Mr. them? Mr. Chair, those are the areas we Hawkins. General comments. are currently reviewing. Mahsi. Committee, are you prepared to go MR. HAWKINS: Mr. Chairman, I asked clause by clause? this question well over three months ago SOME HON. MEMBERS: Agreed. and I’m still waiting for an answer. I’ve asked it in committee. The Minister said CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): Thank you, that they would get back to me. If it’s my committee. I’d like to turn your attention error that I’ve received your response, to Bill 24, clause 1. which I’m pretty sure I haven’t, please ---Clauses 1 and 2 inclusive approved resend. CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): To the bill The fact is my understanding is that no as a whole. one has responded to me after three SOME HON. MEMBERS: Agreed. months on this issue. I, frankly, want us CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): Does to find ways to ensure that we attract committee agree that Bill 24, An Act to well-educated people back to the Amend the Student Financial Act, is Northwest Territories. I think it’s of great ready for third reading? value that we have people from the ---Bill 24 approved for third reading May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 60

CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): Bill 24 is 3. Members’ Statements now ready for third reading. I would like 4. Returns to Oral Questions to thank Minister Lafferty for coming here today. I would like to thank Mr. 5. Recognition of Visitors in the Chutskoff and Ms. Saturnino for joining Gallery us today. If I could get the Sergeant-at- 6. Acknowledgements Arms to please escort the witnesses out 7. Oral Questions of the Chamber. Thank you. 8. Written Questions Ms. Bisaro, what’s the wish of 9. Returns to Written Questions committee? 10.Replies to Opening Address MS. BISARO: Thank you, Mr. Chair. I move we report progress. 11.Petitions ---Carried 12.Reports of Standing and Special Committees CHAIRMAN (Mr. Dolynny): I will now rise and report progress. 13.Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills 14) Report of Committee of the Whole 14.Tabling of Documents MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Dolynny, can I 15.Notices of Motion have the report of Committee of the 16.Notices of Motion for First Whole, please. Reading of Bills MR. DOLYNNY: Thank you, Mr. 17.Motions Speaker. Your committee has been - Motion 19, Financial considering Bill 24, An Act to Amend the Compensation for Medical and Student Financial Assistance Act, and I Non-Medical Travel Escorts would like to report that Bill 24 is ready for third reading. Mr. Speaker, I move 18.First Reading of Bills that the report of Committee of the - Bill 28, Supplementary Whole be concurred with. Thank you. Appropriation Act (Infrastructure MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr. Expenditures), No. 3, 2014-2015 Dolynny. Do I have a seconder to the 19.Second Reading of Bills motion? Ms. Bisaro. - Bill 26, An Act to Amend the ---Carried Elections and Plebiscites Act Item 22, third reading of bills. Madam - Bill 27, Miscellaneous Statute Clerk, orders of the day. Law Amendment Act, 2014 20.Consideration in Committee of 15) Orders of the Day the Whole of Bills and Other Matters CLERK OF THE HOUSE (Ms. - Committee Report 6-17(5), Langlois): Orders of the day for Report on the Review of the 2014 Monday, June 2, 2014, at 1:30 p.m.: Report of the Auditor General of 1. Prayer Canada on Northwest Territories Child and Family Services 2. Ministers’ Statements May 30, 2014 NORTHWEST TERRITORIES HANSARD Page 61

- Bill 8, Write-off of Debts Act, 23.Orders of the Day 2013-2014 MR. SPEAKER: Thank you, Madam - Bill 9, Forgiveness of Debts Act, Clerk. Accordingly, this House stands 2013-2014 adjourned until Monday, June 2nd, at 21.Report of Committee of the 1:30 p.m. Whole ---ADJOURNMENT 22.Third Reading of Bills The House adjourned at 1:53 p.m. - Bill 24, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act

Load more

  61

Copy Link