BBC Annual Report 2012-13 Oral and Written Evidence 22 October 2013 Rt Hon Lord Patten of Barnes, Chairman, BBC Trust, Lord Hall of Birkenhead, Director
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House of Commons Culture, Media and Sport Committee BBC Annual Report 2012-13 Oral and written evidence 22 October 2013 Rt Hon Lord Patten of Barnes, Chairman, BBC Trust, Lord Hall of Birkenhead, Director- General, BBC and Anne Bulford, Managing Director, Operations and Finance, BBC Ordered by The House of Commons to be printed on 22 October 2013 HC 730-i Published on 9 May 2014 by authority of the House of Commons London: The Stationery Office Limited £9.50 The Culture, Media and Sport Committee The Culture, Media and Sport Committee is appointed by the House of Commons to examine the expenditure, administration and policy of the Department for Culture, Media and Sport and its associated public bodies. Current membership Mr John Whittingdale OBE MP (Conservative, Maldon)(Chair) Rt Hon. Ben Bradshaw MP (Labour, Exeter) Angie Bray MP (Conservative, Ealing Central and Acton) Conor BurnsMP (Conservative, Bournemouth West) Tracey Crouch MP (Conservative,Chatham and Aylesford) Philip Davies MP (Conservative, Shipley) Paul Farrelly MP (Labour, Newcastle-under-Lyme) Mr John Leech MP (Liberal Democrat, Manchester, Withington) Steve Rotheram MP (Labour, Liverpool, Walton) Jim Sheridan MP (Labour, Paisley and Renfrewshire North) Mr Gerry Sutcliffe MP (Labour, Bradford South) The following members were also a member of the committee during the parliament: David Cairns MP (Labour, Inverclyde) Dr Thérèse Coffey MP (Conservative, Suffolk Coastal) Damian Collins MP (Conservative,Folkestone and Hythe) Alan Keen MP (Labour Co-operative, Feltham and Heston) Louise Mensch MP (Conservative, Corby) Mr Adrian Sanders MP (Liberal Democrat, Torbay) Mr Tom Watson MP (Labour, West Bromwich East) Powers The committee is one of the departmental select committees, the powers of which are set out in House of Commons Standing Orders, principally in SO No 152. These are available on the internet via www.parliament.uk. Publication The Reports and evidence of the Committee are published by The Stationery Office by Order of the House. All publications of the Committee (including press notices) are on the internet at www.parliament.uk/cmscom. A list of Reports of the Committee in the present Parliament is at the back of this volume. The Reports of the Committee, the formal minutes relating to that report, oral evidence taken and some of the written evidence are available in a printed volume. Additional written evidence is published on the internet only. Committee staff The current staff of the Committee are Elizabeth Flood (Clerk), Grahame Danby (Second Clerk), Kevin Candy (Inquiry Manager), Hannah Wentworth (Senior Committee Assistant), Keely Bishop (Committee Assistant) and Jessica Bridges-Palmer (Media Officer). Contacts All correspondence should be addressed to the Clerk of the Culture, Media and Sport Committee, House of Commons, 7 Millbank, London SW1P 3JA. The telephone number for general enquiries is 020 7219 6188; the Committee’s email address is [email protected] List of witnesses Tuesday, 22 October 2013 Page Rt Hon Lord Patten of Barnes, Chairman, BBC Trust, Lord Hall of Birkenhead, Director-General, and Anne Bulford, Managing Director, Operations and Finance, BBC Ev 1 cobber Pack: U PL: COE1 [SO] Processed: [09-05-2014 10:35] Job: 039780 Unit: PG01 Source: /MILES/PKU/INPUT/039780/039780_o001_Mark_CMSC 22.10.13.xml Culture, Media and Sport Committee: Evidence Ev 1 Oral evidence Taken before the Culture, Media and Sport Committee on Tuesday 22 October 2013 Members present: Mr John Whittingdale (Chair) Mr Ben Bradshaw Mr John Leech Conor Burns Steve Rotheram Tracey Crouch Jim Sheridan Philip Davies Mr Gerry Sutcliffe Paul Farrelly ________________ Examination of Witnesses Witnesses: Rt Hon Lord Patten of Barnes, Chairman of the BBC Trust, Lord Hall of Birkenhead, Director- General, BBC, and Anne Bulford, Managing Director, Operations and Finance, BBC, gave evidence. Q1 Chair: Good morning everyone and welcome to I hope—you would expect me to say this—that we the annual session of the Select Committee at which can spend the next year focusing on the quality of we examine the BBC’s annual report and accounts. I what the BBC produces in terms of television would like to welcome the Chairman of the BBC programmes and radio programmes and online Trust, Lord Patten, and the Director-General, Lord services, and that we can ensure that the trust in the Hall, as well as the Managing Director for Operations BBC, which still exists in pretty substantial quantities, and Finance, Anne Bulford. Lord Patten, since we had continues to be rebuilt and that the BBC, as an our last session on the annual report and accounts, it institution, enjoys the trust of people around the is fair to say that the BBC has not had a good year. country. You, yourself, have said in the annual report that the If that happens I suspect that arguments about BBC has seriously let down itself and the licence fee governance will seem less important over the next payers. That has led to some questions about the way year or two, or that is my hope. It has been a bad year in which the BBC is governed, but yesterday, as you but, at the same time, some good things have may have seen, we had a debate in Parliament on the happened, in terms of programming—the Olympics BBC and Tessa Jowell said, “It is not the present just over a year ago, being the most notable of those. model of governance that is flawed but the failure of Speaking for myself and for my colleagues in the individuals within that to make the right decisions and Trust—you will not get always the sort of mutual to intervene sufficiently early.” Do you think she is admiration stuff from me—I think we are very pleased right? that we have in Tony Hall an outstanding Director- Lord Patten of Barnes: Yes. I think it is a bit of a General and that he has been appointing some very snare and a delusion that is part of the BBC DNA, good members of a team in which we have to say whenever anything goes wrong that it is the considerable confidence. We are aware of how much governance that has gone wrong. The governance is is expected of the BBC and we have to deliver. debated and reorganised with some regularity. I think four issues have really concerned us over the last year; I think tomorrow is the anniversary of George Q2 Chair: I think Tessa Jowell yesterday, who did Entwistle’s appearance in front of this Select create the Trust model of governance, was defending Committee, which had consequences. First of all, the model by saying that it was individuals within the there have been the difficulties over Savile and the Trust who had failed. You, as Chairman of the Trust, report by Nick Pollard, which, while demonstrating are ultimately responsible. Do you accept that that the main charge made against the BBC was not criticism? correct, did point to some pretty shambolic handling Lord Patten of Barnes: I have been criticised quite a of the whole imbroglio. Nobody in their right mind bit for things that happened before I became Chairman could regard Nick Pollard’s report as a whitewash. of the Trust. I found myself in the PAC in a long Secondly, there was the very bad—related to that— discussion about the payoff that Mark Byford received editorial judgment on Newsnight about Lord when he left the BBC, which was before my time. I McAlpine. Thirdly, there has been the uncovering of have not— the way in which severance payments were managed Chair: But you have been Chairman of the Trust this going way back to the time when there was a Board last year. of Governors. I am very pleased that the Director- Lord Patten of Barnes: Sorry, yes, I would defend General has acted on that so quickly. Finally, there has the record over the last year. I do think that people been—which is still to be examined with a report by would say that we made the wrong choice of Director- PwC coming out shortly—the pulling of the DMI General, but I have to say it was unanimous when we initiative, which I hope we can come to later, at made it. I don’t seem to recall anybody saying we had considerable cost to the licence fee payers in the BBC. made the wrong choice. Unfortunately, George was cobber Pack: U PL: COE1 [E] Processed: [09-05-2014 10:35] Job: 039780 Unit: PG01 Source: /MILES/PKU/INPUT/039780/039780_o001_Mark_CMSC 22.10.13.xml Ev 2 Culture, Media and Sport Committee: Evidence 22 October 2013 Rt Hon Lord Patten of Barnes, Lord Hall of Birkenhead and Anne Bulford overwhelmed by events but he was a very decent Q4 Jim Sheridan: I think Susanna Reid is doing a broadcaster and programme maker. good job for the BBC on Strictly and, hopefully, she Can I just add one point? When I became Chairman will continue to do that. But can I ask you seriously of the Trust, having read the Charter and looked at the about morale within the BBC? In terms of Select role of the Trust, I certainly didn’t expect that people Committees, at the last one—the Public Accounts would think I was running the personnel department Committee—the BBC did not come out of it very well in the BBC. The description of the Trust in the Charter at all. couldn’t be clearer. One of the things that the Lord Patten of Barnes: No. Since I was present at Director-General and I want to do—and I hope we the car crash, perhaps I can say something about that.