NATIONAL LIFE STORIES ARTISTS’ LIVES Terry Frost Interviewed by Tamsyn Woollcombe C466/22 This transcript is copyright of the British Library Board. Please refer to the Oral History curators at the British Library prior to any publication or broadcast from this document. Oral History The British Library 96 Euston Road London NW1 2DB 020 7412 7404 [email protected] This transcript is accessible via the British Library’s Archival Sound Recordings website. Visit http://sounds.bl.uk for further information about the interview. © The British Library Board http://sounds.bl.uk IMPORTANT Access to this interview and transcript is for private research only. Please refer to the Oral History curators at the British Library prior to any publication or broadcast from this document. 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Should you find any errors please inform the Oral History curators ( [email protected] ) © The British Library Board http://sounds.bl.uk The British Library National Life Stories Interview Summary Sheet Title Page Ref no: C466/22 Digitised from cassette originals Collection title: Artists’ Lives Interviewee’s surname: Frost Title: Sir Interviewee’s forename: Terry Sex: Male Occupation: Artist Dates: 1915 - 2003 Dates of recording: 1994.11.19, 1994.11.20, 1994.11.21, 1994.11.22, 1994.12.18 Location of interview: Interviewee’s studio and home Name of interviewer: Tamsyn Woollcombe Type of recorder: Marantz CP430 Recording format: D60 Cassette F numbers of playback cassettes: F4312- F4622 Total no. of digitised tracks: 11 Mono or stereo: Stereo Additional material: Copyright/Clearance: Full clearance. © The British Library Interviewer’s comments: © The British Library Board http://sounds.bl.uk Terry Frost Page 1 C466/22 Tape 1 [F4312] Side A F4312 Side A [Terry Frost talking to Tamsyn Woollcombe at his house in Newlyn on the 19th of November 1994. Tape One.] So today I just wonder whether we could go right back to the time you were born, so, where were you born? Leamington Spa. And when? October the 13th 1915. Right. And can you remember, do you know whether you were born at home, or were you born in a hospital? Never heard anything about that. I think I was just a one-night stand in fact, in the wartime. (laughs) So, can you remember your grandparents at all? Oh yes, I lived with my grandparents. Which set, the maternal or the paternal? Mother's mother and father, yes. And what was their household like, what can you remember? Well I was in a small house in the Rugby Road of Leamington Spa, opposite the school, which became quite useful. Oh that was handy, mm. And, two down and three up, with the attic being the third one. And so, it was your grandmother and your grandfather? © The British Library Board http://sounds.bl.uk Terry Frost Page 2 C466/22 Tape 1 [F4312] Side A Grandmother and my grandfather, yes. And were you the only child in that household, or did you have brothers and sisters, or...? No, I didn't have any brothers and sisters. I had...[TF SNEEZES] Oh dear, this is a blessed pest, I'm sorry. [BREAK IN RECORDING] So, sorry, you were an only child as it were? That's right, I was an only child, but I didn't realise that because my grandmother had three sons, and so I had three brothers as it were, although they were actually my uncles. Yes, yes, right. And I was brought up with them. Yes, so it was, there was a sort of family unit as it were. A total family unit. My mother had married again, having divorced my father immediately after the war when he came back. And so did your mother live in the same town, in Leamington Spa? She lived in the same town, but she, it was a simple story, that she met my father during the wartime, and then, after the war she met her original sweetheart again when he came back from the war, and my father never had a chance, because he had only been a temporary wartime affair. And so she divorced my father to marry her original sweetheart. Right. And did they have issue, did they have children? Yes, I've got a half-brother, and I've got a stepbrother, because he had already married someone else too who had died when they had the baby. I see, right, right. © The British Library Board http://sounds.bl.uk Terry Frost Page 3 C466/22 Tape 1 [F4312] Side A And that's when my mother and he got back together again. Very nice chap. So we had a lovely household, because my uncles were all sporting guys, played football and cricket and all the rest of it, and that was a great thing for me. And, your grandmother, what sort of age was she? Was she quite a young grandmother? You probably don't know. Well actually, I mean I never thought about that in those days; she lived to be about 90 I think. She was a marvellous, kind lady, and she always had to work because in those days ordinary families didn't have any income of any kind except from working, and so she was a night nurse and things, she used to go and look after people who were older than herself, sitting up with them all night kind of thing. And my grandfather had been a groom and steeplechase jockey and athlete, but he had had a stroke from running I think, he was a good athlete. And he had a stroke when he was quite young, so he was handicapped in a way, and so my gran had always had to work. And he was a toff really, he had had a...he was the last but one Bath chair proprietor of Leamington Spa; I mean there was a lovely notice above the door `Charles Lines, Bath chair proprietor', and they were beautiful chairs, we had two beautiful...with the glass door at the front and then the hood comes up when it's wet, and... And his job used to be to take people shopping down The Parade at Leamington Spa, and I used to have to do it when he wasn't able to do...sometimes he couldn't because of his handicap, his rheumatism and things would be so bad, so as soon as I was old enough to pull the chair I used to have to do it. Which meant you had to go in and try bits of cheese and bits of bacon and bring it out and show the lady to see whether she would order it or not, from Home & Colonial. So, it used to be quite interesting. What, Home & Colonial was the store? That was the store, yes, yes. And did you get tipped when you were doing it, or paid properly? No you would get about threepence for that, yes. Take them out for about an hour you see. And so he did manage to bring in some sort of income into the household? Yes, and we also had, when the Bath chairs stopped, because Mr Hearnshaw took over with the last Bath chair, we kept one, took the wheels off and put them round a truck, because the way to earn money then was to go down to the railway station and meet people with their © The British Library Board http://sounds.bl.uk Terry Frost Page 4 C466/22 Tape 1 [F4312] Side A luggage and put it on the truck, and we used to deliver it to their houses for them, because that was the way it was done, there were no cars to that extent in those days. So, we earned our living in that method you see. And had he been in the war, had he been injured before, in the Great War? No, he had a stroke when he was about 27 I think, something like that. I see. And did he ever talk about his life as a jockey? No, I had his black velvet cap above my bed, and his whip. But they never discussed their life really, but I heard all kinds of rumours that he had been a bit of a lad when they were in service, as, I think they were in service at one stage. Is that where you think they met? Yes I think they met in service. And, he was a great gambler on the horses - well not a great gambler, but I mean put a shilling or two on, and that was part of his life was doing that. And you don't know where they were in service? Was it in a sort of country house around there, or was it in a...? No I can't remember, no, I can't remember enough about it. I met my great-grandmother, who was a Sowden I think, and she was a great old lady, very strict, she used to sit in a beautiful chair with antimacassars behind her, and the cap, you know, on. A sort of white... Yes, and used to be absolutely strict. I used to have to sit very tight on my chair and wait for my slice of bread and butter on Sunday, whatever it was, or cake.