NATIONAL LIFE STORIES AN ORAL HISTORY OF BRITISH SCIENCE Ralph Denning Interviewed by Thomas Lean C1379/68 IMPORTANT The interviewee has used the verbatim transcript of the interview as the basis for the text below. This edited text can be read as a stand-alone document, but it should be considered as an additional resource to the oral history interview. Users are also encouraged to listen to the original recording, for which the verbatim transcript is a guide to navigate through the recording. Every effort is made to ensure the accuracy of this transcript, however no transcript is an exact translation of the spoken word, and this document is intended to be a guide to the original recording, not replace it. Should you find any errors please inform the Oral History curators. Oral History The British Library 96 Euston Road London NW1 2DB 020 7412 7404 [email protected] The British Library National Life Stories Interview Summary Sheet Title Page Ref no: C1379/68 Collection title: An Oral History of British Science Interviewee’s Denning Title: Mr surname: Interviewee’s Ralph Sex: Male forename: Occupation: Aeronautical engineer Date and place of birth: Cardiff, Wales. 17 (jet engines) December 1925, Mother’s occupation: Teacher Father’s occupation: Patent Fuel works manager Dates of recording, Compact flash cards used, tracks (from – to): Location of interview: Interviewee's home, Alveston, Bristol. Name of interviewer: Thomas Lean Type of recorder: Marantz PMD661 on secure digital Recording format : WAV 24 bit 48 kHz Total no. of tracks 15 Mono or stereo: Stereo Total Duration: 10:19:25 (HH:MM:SS) Additional material: Copyright/Clearance: Interviewer’s comments: Ralph Denning Page 4 C1379/68 Track 1 Track 1 Ralph, I was wondering if we could start this interview with you just briefly introducing yourself and what you’ve done. Well, I was born in Cardiff on 17 th December 1925. I was christened Ralph Murch and that was after my uncle, who was James Murch, but I think it was also after my great grandmother, who was Ann Murch. That was her surname, Murch. My grandparents all came from England and they went to the Port of Cardiff in the 1800s, probably around about 1870, 1880, and – during what I call the coal rush. And in my youth Cardiff was the biggest coal exporting port in the world. I mean, my father worked in the patent fuel industry and he wanted me to go and do it but I didn’t. What’s patent fuel? Patent fuel is compressed coal dust and pitch and it’s done in steam presses. And it was used by Scott in the Antarctic to take energy out there for his camps. And he used to build walls with the huge blocks of patent fuel and then burn the walls gradually. Anyway, and I’m second generation Welsh born. My – both my parents were born in Cardiff and I was born in Cardiff. I went to Canton High School and I always wondered about the name Canton. It’s not – it’s not the Far East, it’s in Cardiff and it’s a canton of Cardiff, if you like. I think it was probably the multicultural town in Wales or city in Wales in those days. The Dennings are a tribe and they come from the Frome-Radstock area and in the 1880s most of them lived in that area. They’re now spread out all over the world ‘cause I’ve been examining the history of the family. And the – it’s the – the famous Judge Denning, Judge Denning who was the – what was he? The – he was the Master of the Rolls. And he says in his book that Denning he’s sure is a corruption of Dane-ing, which means son of the Dane. And I think it’s definitely a tribal name. And my mother was a Palmer and she came – her family came from Bristol. They seem to have had a lot of artists in the family as well. [0:03:16] 4 Ralph Denning Page 5 C1379/68 Track 1 Erm. I was wondering if you describe what each of your parents was like in turn, please. What my parents were like? What were your parents like? What were my parents like? Ah, they were – my mother was a painter and she was very kind and never hit me very hard [laughs]. My father was a great sportsman and he used to captain various rugby teams in Cardiff and he played tennis and various other games. He was also a bit of a gambler and my mother didn’t appreciate that very much. But anyway, he was a decent chap. Gambling at what? Erm? Gambling at what? Oh, gambling on horses and dogs and football pools, you name it. And he would also gamble on playing cards at Christmas with all my uncles. I’ve got quite a big family. My mother’s family, there were six by my grandfather’s second marriage and six by his first marriage. She was one of the – from the second marriage. What were your parents’ names? Parents’ names? My mother’s name was Rowena, because I think my grandfather was reading Ivanhoe at the time. My father’s name – he had two names, Herbert William, and – Herbert William Denning. And that’s – yeah, that’s it. I wonder if you could actually describe what each of their personalities was like. Their personalities? 5 Ralph Denning Page 6 C1379/68 Track 1 Erm. My mother was a fairly gentle soul and she – as I said, she painted and she did a lot of needlework and all that sort of thing. And she was a teacher before she married. And of course in those days, if you were teaching and you got married, you had to leave the profession. So she was bringing us up and trying to teach us a few things. And we lived in Cardiff, on the outskirts of Cardiff, and we were there during the war. We were bombed a bit. And I lived near Llandaff Cathedral and Llandaff Cathedral had the spire nearly knocked off. They had to remove it ‘cause it had been damaged by a landmine. And we had another landmine near us, and a couple of other bombs as well. But anyway … What was the area like where you grew up? It was on the outskirts of Cardiff, really almost in the country. They’d built a funny road out in the country but it gradually has become engulfed by the increasing size of Cardiff. And – but we – effectively I spent my youth birds nesting and catching tadpoles and lizards and the like and doing all sorts of other things like scrumping apples and cutting down trees [laughs]. In those days you could get away with that. You might get a thump from the policeman but it was all forgotten then [laughs]. Today I’d have probably been trounced as a bit of a tearaway, I should think [laughs]. [0:07:12] What were you like as a child, do you think? What was I like? Ah, I was – I think I was a reasonable sort of chap. I worked hard at school, I played hard. I ran and played – I didn’t play much cricket, although I played rugby. And then when I – later on I played squash. But I ran for the school and played rugby for the school, long distance running and short distance running. [interruption by third party – break in recording] [0:07:45] 6 Ralph Denning Page 7 C1379/68 Track 1 You mentioned that you enjoyed running and outdoor activities. Yes. Could you give me an idea of any other hobbies you had? Did I say I played squash, up until I was sixty-two. And I used to do a bit of running. I played for local rugby clubs here as well. I never aspired to the same level as my father. My father was quite a good rugby player. He had a trial for Cardiff, which was quite something in those days. But that was around about 1910, 1912. He was – he was in the First World War, a gunner. He was a gunner in the First World War, yes. Did he ever talk about it? Not an awful lot, no, no. I’ve never yet met a World War II guy who wanted to talk about World War II. [Interviewee correction: “I’ve never met a World War I guy who wanted to talk about World War I”] It must have been such a grim dismal dangerous business, fighting in the trenches, that they just wanted to forget it, I think. Whereas in World War II, I think it was a lot different. There were some dark periods but – you know, fighting in the Air Force was something – it was something to talk about, although it was a bit grim at times. But no, I get the feeling that World War I was an absolute disaster from the point of view of the soldiers in the trenches. What sort of chap was your father? Oh, he was a sportsman, as I say, a bit of a gambler. He was a manager of a patent fuel works in South Wales for Powell Duffryn and Gueret, Llewellyn and Merrett, and then the Coal Board finally. Not particularly well paid, as far as I know. But, you know, what they paid you in the 1930s just seemed silly to us, the price of a round of drinks for a week’s wages.