Kay (Katherine Murphy) Halle Oral History Interview – JFK#1, 02/07/1967 Administrative Information Creator: Kay (Katherine Murphy) Halle Interviewer: William M. McHugh Date of Interview: February 7, 1967 Place of Interview: Washington, D.C. Length: 25 pages Biographical Note (1904 - 1997) Journalist, author, socialite, and Kennedy family friend, discusses relationship with the Kennedy family and contact with JFK during his presidency, among other issues. Access Open. Usage Restrictions According to the deed of gift signed June 16, 1969, copyright of these materials has been assigned to the United States Government. Users of these materials are advised to determine the copyright status of any document from which they wish to publish. Copyright The copyright law of the United States (Title 17, United States Code) governs the making of photocopies or other reproductions of copyrighted material. 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The transcripts were scanned using optical character recognition and the resulting text files were proofread against the original transcripts. Some formatting changes were made. Page numbers are noted where they would have occurred at the bottoms of the pages of the original transcripts. If researchers have any concerns about accuracy, they are encouraged to visit the Library and consult the transcripts and the interview recordings. Suggested Citation Kay (Katherine Murphy) Halle, recorded interview by William M. McHugh, February 7, 1967, (page number), John F. Kennedy Library Oral History Program. Kay (Katherine Murphy) Halle – JFK#1 Table of Contents Page Topic 1 Initial contact with the Kennedy family during Franklin D. Roosevelt’s presidential campaign 3 Comments on the Kennedy sons’ relationship with Joseph P. Kennedy, Sr. 4 John F. Kennedy [JFK] and the social scene during his time as a Congressman 5, 12 Comments on JFK’s personality and his “sense of destiny” 6, 18 JFK dealing with physical pain and ailments 7 JFK’s interest in the history of furniture and the White House redecoration 8 Involvement in the inaugural committee 9 Presenting JFK with a scrapbook of messages from prominent figures in the arts, sciences and humanities 10 Discussing making Winston Churchill an honorary citizen 13 JFK meeting with Eleanor R. Roosevelt during the 1960 campaign 14 Working with Citizens for Kennedy in Cleveland, OH 16 JFK’s feelings on the religious issue 17 Attending the Pablo Casals event at the White House 18 JFK meeting with Randolph S. Churchill regarding M. Harold Macmillan’s illness 20 Last contact with JFK 21 Psychic Jeane Dixon predicting JFK’s death 23 Anecdotes about JFK from those who worked for him Oral History Interview With Kay (Katherine Murphy) Halle February 7, 1967 Washington, D.C. By William M. McHugh For the John F. Kennedy Library McHUGH: This is an interview at the home of Kay Halle. Miss Halle’s book, Irrepressible Churchill, A Treasury of Winston Churchill’s Wit, was recently published. Miss Halle is also a long time friend of the Kennedy family. Miss Halle, when did you first meet President Kennedy [John F. Kennedy]? HALLE: I think I should go back and tell you, first… McHUGH: Surely, would you please. HALLE: …how I came to know the whole family. It was through father Joseph P. Kennedy [Joseph P. Kennedy, Sr.]. Some of us—Jimmie [James Roosevelt] and Betsey Roosevelt [Betsey Cushing Roosevelt Whitney], and other members of the family and Mr. Roosevelt’s [Franklin D. Roosevelt] staff were sitting in Mr. Roosevelt’s suite at the Ritz Carlton Hotel, in Boston. It was the day of the night that Mr. Roosevelt was to speak in the Boston Garden during his first campaign for the Presidency. Mr. Hoover [Herbert Hoover], (it was the last day of the campaign) was speaking in New York in Madison Square Garden. We were all sitting together in Mr. Roosevelt’s suite, Tugwell [Rexford G. Tugwell], Moley [Raymond Moley], Bob Sherwood [Robert E. Sherwood], and all of the group. Suddenly Felix Frankfurter came in—he then was a professor of law at Harvard. With him came a very attractive Irishman. He was unmistakably Irish, with [-1-] his copper colored hair, and a beaming smile that exposed his shining teeth. He sat in the corner while a political argument was in progress and suggestions were under discussion for the upcoming speech. There was much coming and going in the room. I suddenly turned to Felix and asked, ―Who is it that you brought with you? You haven’t introduced him.‖ Then Felix said, ―Joe, tell them who you are.‖ ―I’m Joe Kennedy,‖ he said, ―Mr. Frankfurter brought me with him because, though I’ve been interested in all sorts of businesses in Boston and California—in films and banking and though ―Honey‖ Fitzgerald [John Francis Fitzgerald], Mayor of Boston, is my father-in-law I’ve never had the thrill of being a part of a presidential campaign. So I’ve put some money into Mr. Roosevelt’s campaign, and I’d like to go along with you all and take part in the fun.‖ From then on he attached himself to us in a charming way. Mr. Roosevelt’s eldest son, Jimmy, was then married to Betsey Cushing (now Mrs. John Hay Whitney), the daughter of the eminent brain surgeon, Dr. Harvey Cushing [Harvey Williams Cushing]. Dr. Cushing was then in Peter Bent Brigham Hospital, Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston, with, I think an ulcer. His daughters, Mary [Mary Benedict Cushing] and Betsey and I were going over to see him. Joe Kennedy asked me if he could come along and wait for me because he wanted me to go with him to see one of his sons who was in the same hospital. After visiting Dr. Cushing, Joe took me to his son Jack’s room. He couldn’t have been more than twelve or thirteen. He’d had some football accident, and had developed what they thought was a sort of an anemia and Joe was a bit worried about it. Jack was lying in bed, very pale which highlighted the freckles across his nose. He was so surrounded by books I could hardly see him. I was very impressed, because at that point this very young child was reading The World Crisis, by Sir Winston Churchill. McHUGH: Was he in the hospital long at that time? HALLE: No, I don’t think so. I think he was out very soon. But they were concerned about him because he had had some football injury, and I’m not sure exactly what it was. McHUGH: And then when did you see him, or his family again? HALLE: Well, of course, dating from that period, I saw a great deal of the family— at the first New Year’s Party at the White House and then soon after Mr. [-2-] Roosevelt’s victory. I can remember crossing the ocean with Mary Cushing, Jimmy and Betsey Roosevelt, Joe and Rose [Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy] Kennedy, and young Joe Kennedy [Joseph P. Kennedy, Jr.] whom big Joe was taking to the London School of Economics to study under Harold Laski. Father Joe Kennedy said that he felt that as the boys were going into a period where they ought to know just as much about the left as the right in politics, he wanted them to study under a man that he thought would teach the left philosophy to them better than anybody, which was Harold Laski. And then I didn’t see much of Jack, except intermittently, until he came to Washington as a Congressman. He was just a young boy, before that, to me. When he came here as a Congressman I was very impressed with the way he had developed and his independence of thought. I remember one very vivid instance of it when we were all at a cocktail party in the garden of Drew [Drew Pearson] and Luvie Pearson [Luvie Moore Pearson]. Jack was there, with his father Joe, and I think Bobby [Robert F. Kennedy], as I remember it. In one corner of the garden father Joe, Jack and I were talking together. Suddenly Joe said, ―Kay, I wish you would tell Jack that he’s going to vote the wrong way.‖ I can’t even remember what bill it was, but Joe said, ―I think Jack is making a terrible mistake.‖ And then I remember Jack turning to his father and saying, ―Now, look here Dad, you have your political views and I have mine. I’m going to vote exactly the way I feel I must vote on this. I’ve great respect for you, but when it comes to voting, I’m voting my way.‖ Then Joe looked at me with that big Irish smile, and said, ―Well, Kay, that’s why I settled a million dollars on each one of them, so they could spit in my eye if they wished.‖ McHUGH: Did you have any other occasions to notice his independence, particularly, of his father? HALLE: Well, I think both Jack and Bobby at various times talked to me about how much they owed to their father, and how much he’d done for them.