CANADA House of Commons Debates VOLUME 140 Ï NUMBER 111 Ï 1st SESSION Ï 38th PARLIAMENT OFFICIAL REPORT (HANSARD) Wednesday, June 8, 2005 Speaker: The Honourable Peter Milliken CONTENTS (Table of Contents appears at back of this issue.) All parliamentary publications are available on the ``Parliamentary Internet Parlementaire´´ at the following address: http://www.parl.gc.ca 6807 HOUSE OF COMMONS Wednesday, June 8, 2005 The House met at 1 p.m. Regulations very seriously. The committee feels that greater clarity and certainty are needed on matters of legislative authority with respect to certain Ontario Fishery Regulations. Specifically, its concern lies with the requirement for compliance with fishing Prayers licence terms and conditions. The government is of the opinion that the provision in question is legally sound and within the authority of Ï (1300) the Fisheries Act. [English] [Translation] The Speaker: As is our practice on Wednesday we will now sing O Canada and we will be led by the pages. Fishing licences are, in many regards, the key fisheries manage- ment tools in Canada. They regulate fishing activities by setting the [Members sang the national anthem] following terms and conditions: total allowable catch, authorized fishing gear, timeframe and areas where fishing can occur. [English] ORDERS OF THE DAY Ï (1305) These conditions are crucial for conservation and orderly management of not only Ontario's fisheries but of fisheries [English] throughout the country. DELEGATED LEGISLATION The fishery is a highly regulated industry. This high level of ONTARIO FISHERY REGULATIONS, 1989 regulation is necessary. A valuable natural resource like fish needs to Hon. Geoff Regan (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, Lib.) be managed carefully, with an eye to the future. Mechanisms must be moved: in place to ensure conservation and that rules of the fishery are being That, given the importance of the fisheries in Ontario and the introduction of Bill followed. Fishing licences provide this mechanism. The conditions C-52, An Act to amend the Fisheries Act (terms and conditions of permissions, leases that they provide are key elements in proper management and and licenses) by the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans which addresses the concerns control of the fishery, as well as for the conservation and protection of the Standing Joint Committee on the Scrutiny of Regulations, and pursuant to of fish on behalf of all Canadians. Standing Order 124 and subsection 19.1(5) of the Statutory Instruments Act, the resolution of the Standing Joint Committee providing that subsection 36(2) of the Ontario Fishery Regulations, 1989 be revoked, presented to this House on May 9, The Government of Canada has a clear legislative power to ensure 2005 in its Second Report (Report No. 75 – Disallowance), not be adopted, and that conservation and protection of fish stocks, and the issuance of this matter be referred back to the Standing Joint Committee for further study. fishing licences is a demonstration of this power. The Ontario He said: Mr. Speaker, may I say at the outset that while the House Fishery Regulations require that the holder of a commercial licence has many strong and mellifluous voices, I do not think we have ever comply with licence terms and conditions. The government heard O Canada sung quite so well. continues to maintain that this provision is in fact legally sound. Some hon. members: Hear, hear! Having said that, I agree that greater certainty and clarity could be provided for the requirement to comply with the terms and Hon. Geoff Regan: I see that members on all sides appear to conditions of fishing licences, and that is why I introduced Bill agree with me on that. C-52 in the House last week. I appreciate the opportunity to rise in the House today to respond to this disallowance motion tabled by the Standing Joint Committee The bill includes an amendment that would add a new section to for the Scrutiny of Regulations. I would like to thank members of the the Fisheries Act dealing with compliance with terms and conditions committee for the important role they play in closely examining of fishing licences. Specifically, the amendment would clarify that it Canada's legislation and regulations. is a requirement of the act to comply with fishing licence terms and conditions. We believe the amendment would provide a measure of The government places a high value on what they have to say and certainty and clarity, the kind of measure sought by the Standing that is why I take their concerns about the Ontario Fishery Joint Committee for the Scrutiny of Regulations. 6808 COMMONS DEBATES June 8, 2005 Orders of the Day As members know, Bill C-52 was debated at second reading on On May 17, I met with the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Monday. Regrettably, the Conservatives and the Bloc indicated they Oceans to reiterate that I am very serious about updating the act. This do not support a bill that addresses the concerns identified by their 137-year-old legislation needs to be modernized. Canada's fisheries own colleagues on the standing joint committee. After two days to have changed and evolved over the years and I have asked the consider the bill, I hope they have reconsidered because enacting Bill Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans a number of times for C-52 would certainly be a preferred approach to dealing with the its input on how they should be reformed. I look forward to receiving committee's concerns rather than adopting the disallowance resolu- it, I hope, before too long. I look forward to it taking an interest and tion. my colleagues across the way showing an interest in reforming of the act. If the disallowance resolution is adopted, subsection 36(2) of the Ontario Fishery Regulations would be revoked. This would create a In particular, I requested input in four areas: allocation, co- serious legal gap in Ontario's ability to enforce licence conditions management, compliance and sanctions. Sanctions, of course, is an and to manage the fishery on behalf of all Ontarians. Ontario's area of particular interest in the Standing Joint Committee on the fishery would be put in considerable risk. It would send a dangerous Scrutiny of Regulations and really what we are talking about here signal that Parliament is not supportive of requiring licence holders today. to abide by their licence conditions. Imagine what a terrible signal that would be. I plan to move forward with a broad reform as quickly as possible This is a great concern to many groups in Ontario, including the and I hope to have support from members across the way for that. In Ontario Federation of Anglers & Hunters, who have written several the meantime, Bill C-52 would address the standing joint members in this House over the past two days urging them in the committee's concerns and make disallowance unnecessary. It would strongest possible way to support this issue. ensure that the Province of Ontario has the certainty it needs as it manages and conserves its fisheries on behalf of its citizens and it Each year the province issues some 500 commercial licences and will provide an effective transitional measure as we examine more 1,400 commercial bait fishery licences. Ontario's commercial comprehensive changes to the Fisheries Act. fisheries represent an annual landed value of over $40 million. They contribute anywhere between $250 million and $500 million to That is why I filed a motion that the committee's resolution not be the economies of both Ontario and Canada. Economics aside, adopted but referred back to it for further consideration. disallowing the provision in question would also jeopardize Ï (1315) conservation. Ï (1310) Mr. Loyola Hearn (St. John's South—Mount Pearl, CPC): Mr. Speaker, the one thing I can agree with the minister on is his remarks [Translation] in relation to the tremendous job done by the pages on O Canada. It As we can see, compliance with licence terms and conditions is was a rendition of O Canada, the likes of which we certainly have essential to ensure that fishing practices are coordinated and not heard in this place. I do not want to run down the singing focussed on conservation. All the provinces—that is, Ontario and abilities of my colleagues but today's version certainly was the best I the others—rely on compliance with the rules and need an efficient have ever heard. I congratulate the pages. That would be my final regime to deal with instances of non-compliance. point of agreement with the minister. [English] When we debated Bill C-52 a few days ago I thought the minister I should add that Ontario's minister of natural resources has had received such a trouncing on it from all parties, not just from the written to me asking that the Government of Canada do everything Bloc and ourselves, but also from the NDP. What happened of in its power to protect the provision in question. In his letter he course is that they pulled it right off the legislative agenda. I do not stated: know why we are even debating the motion today. Without this provision, Ontario would literally have its hands tied with respect to enforcement of commercial fishery. It is entirely likely that the revocation of However, having said that, instead of my wandering way of subsection 36(2) would result in chaos in this sector and threaten the sustainability of dealing with this, I will read some stuff into the record that might our fishery resources. educate the minister as to exactly what is happening here.