Regional Oral History Office University of California The Bancroft Library Berkeley, California Johan Hagemeyer PHOTOGRAPHER An Interview Conducted by Corinne L. Gilb in 1955 copyright @ 1957 by the Regents of the University of California A11 uses of this nanuacrtpt are covered by an agreement 1 between the Regents of the University of California and I I I Johan Hagemeyer, dated January 23, 1956. The manuscript i is thereby made available for research purposes. All . 1 literary rights in the manuscript, including the exclusive right to publish, are reserved to the General I Library of the University of California at Eerkeley. I No part of the maxluscript may be quoted for publication i I except by mitten permission of the Librarian of the . j University. of California st Berkeley. -. 1 I. j.1. - j. .. i i t.i~ i- : ! , .. = . - . '. " . '..A .j. - .. .... - -..".-,:,-",.- :&.A. ZG.2 2.&* 2.&* ..- : :z . .. ... , L. ::: . IITRODUCTION Joilan Hagemeyer s photographic studio was ' a gathering place for the great, the talented, end t? born vivents of legendary Carmel. Broodix Robins- Jeffers and wild George Sterling were eqzlallyhis friends. Interpreting swiftly and intuitively, following the Stieglitz tradition of using only . L,. natural light, Hagemeyer made portraits which were more than merely photographs. Physicist -4lbert Einstein, philosopher Constan Zarin, astronomer Edwin Hubble, artist Salvadore Dali, singer . Roland Hayes and others cane to him ta be 2.. photographed. - . Repelled by its postwar atmosphere of tearoamss .. and gift shoppes, Hagemeyer left Camnel and eventually set u-p his studio south .or the ca~puslk L. Berkeley in what had been, at the turn of the century, a farmhouse. The following interview was tape-recoA-ded - there, in Play and again in Julg, 1955, in Ms parlor-studio--a lwge well-lit, sparsely but elegantly furnished room with Oriental 'scatter rqs on the bare floors and n grand piano mich was sold not long after to -help pay nedGal 5111s- . _I . -. 8 . ;j $5 [ 1 . - . .. - White haired now, Hagemeyer was frail and ill, I somewhat lonely, still with a fierce pride in t i his art. I There is something about Hagemeyer that reminds one of Rembrandt--something beyond their :.: I I comon national origin and certain parallels in L their life stories. Perhaps it is bscause i Hagemeyer has certain qualities which are universal mong artists. At any rate, this interview was recorded as part of a series documenting, through a study of individual lives, the cultural history of '. this region. 1: -. 1:.v- ti:-, Corinne L. Gilb I. f -" Regional Cultural History Project University of California Library at Berkeley 23 Januarg 1956 1,: . i f t. INTRODUCTION EARLY LIFE IN 'ilOLLAh3, 188.4-1911 TO TFd VNITEII STA%S PAXI CALIFORNIA, 1911; WORK IN EOIITICL?TiJRE CHANGE TO PHOT3GXiPZ, 1917; ALF-%El STIEGLITZ ANARCE1SI.I ATXI T3XAR !53i39S; ?JITH DWAFD WESTON IN LOS mG.laXs. SAN FRILYCISCO AX3 CLR-, TIi6 192088 A SiIORT STAY II? FASAiXSA AN3 HOLLYlr'OOD , 1929 ABOCT LOVE ANi) 1-33~~&3 HOW WG3jEYEFI 3XLSES A PORTXAIT INFLUENCES . Psychology and Philosophy Music Art MKIBITING EARLY LIFE IN HOLUND, 1884-1911 Gilb: I've noticed In-your press clippings and in all the infornation about you, you never mention your birthdate. Are you retioent about that? Wo, not I personally. I feel the same way about &thg xy pictures, People go by dates, I don't, I don't think Soozates was born in B, C, or otheyise. He waa born for me tom. BsfI va$ born on the first of June on Ehitsuadpy $n 1884, That's, a religious holiday, the e-tk -day after Easter, Perhaps it is celebrated more conacioualy fa Europe, but I Inward It nientioned the o&er day here, khen you say you were born on a religious hoPi&no, does that iniply that you were aware of re~ous.., I am relfgiously hol1ns.d ad I have occasionally tbt%%htthat that have something to do ui&hit, but I am not an astrologer, I was In June, &Ich id a vei9y bad mcnth, the bnlni month, a dusality nature, so-called. Gilb: Iis th& a key to your personaUtyt ~~~:Xt aam-9 to be, decidedly. Perhaps bhe word 'txxb~valesnt" describes it betiter. Gilb: What was your father's occupatlonf in i Hageaeyer: He was engaged some work In a sugar refiqery 1. in Amsterdam, Gilb: How would you describe your family? Middle- Hagemeyer: Middle-class, decidedly, Oilb : Were there other brothers and aiatera? Hagerneyer: I was one of four brothers and I had one sister. i Xy sister was the oldeat and then came a boy, 1. and then there was another boy rho drowned; I 1! was born before he drowned. i- Gilb: Were you a olose-bit family2 i Hagemsyert I think the family ma, but I never waa very k' cloae . Qilb: When you eagle to the Cnlted Statee, did yau t t ooma alone? I. I was very close when I became mature I Hagemeyer: No, no, i I to another brother, who was the youngest, We i ! were more than congenial and did a @?eat many i i things together later on in our more mature t ;'. Gilb r You describe youraelf am am htelleotual and I wondered if you got i;hose leanings from your C fasily. %re there book8 md mt at bomb? I Ihqeneyert No, I dontt fhhk I got it firm anyone, It was just er natuxal, ins';;insf;ive tlainq with ma. ! ! 3 I i i I Gilb: You wepe regarded so by your family? I- Bagemeyer: Yes, kind of, The3 always thought me kind of I queep, going after things they weren't used to and sometimes I was really criticized for it. b I Ulb: What were the values for a middle-class Dutch I family of that tlme, specifically your famlilyt I Did they believe in hard work? Were they I Proteatantsf t Bagemeyer: Yen, they were Proteetanta. Gilb : Was thrift one of their valueaf Bagemeyer: Hard working, very thrifty, It is not easy for me to find a reaeon for oertain thingr. Uke a sport in plata, I was jaet different from C-I -1 any of +&em, except m7be I was much oloser to 1- my mother, She was alao a religious person, I i very undoptio, very intelligent, very sensitive. j I had always trouble in sohool. I was never well; I was very aickly and always hove i' i- I been, 1 Gilb t Did you do well in your atudiea? r 1I 1- 1 Hagemeyer: In some etudiee, decideuy well, t Gilb : Wch st~dlgr~f i i I 4 I ! bgepreyer: I anppoae literature, reading, and drawing. t i 1 2 Ugalike that. Not arithrastic. Not mything 1 1 1 ? I that ier in the Pine,...I nirve~stueigd mtke- I i 3 =tics, buf; I never was very good at those I f I , thiaga. - I 1. i1 t i - ! 6i I -.!' I I i Wbat do you call it when you are not t i promoted from one grade to enother..,ilunked. Gilb : You flunked, Hagemeyer: Flunked, oh yes. I was almost proud of it, That was grammar schocl, And of course, in my later years at school I waa quite a revo1utio~- ar;r already. For that I was punished nmny times. Gilb: What would you be revolutionam against? Eagemeyer : @bet anything that is accepted, the coniorPlity of my own family perhopa. Hence, I left funne, How f~ did 80 b 80h001 fafteen or so, ashich fn EoUand almost Included. - . ]high achool. , It #as =ore Intensive. We were more literate, rey, tW acme ot tltbe yourrge-Fa I f2nd hare Ssl high achool. When you were a boy, did yau bavs ayideas about what you wanted to becme -hea you pew UP? No, I bwd nothag to slay about it, md, of oowse, thaw ~rsssnted. too. I was jut pushed hto bushears. Tha"Ua nor% lxcauss OF my - mother, xho bad ea+~t;ai~raup*ationa md tXdntt wmf;my or" her 5oya to 203.0~~YT fra%zsrla ar&er.: She fantad $0 have *ago sa, 23. !?a . associate with a different kind of people, to j get Into really another class.. Tfiere ia leas I now, but of course there was, like anywhere else, a great deal of class distinction. There was a time in my bualneaa career life when I would almost rather not mention what my father was doing, because it mI@ be bld more or lesa against me. Not today ud lesa when X left . Naturally I believe in evolution. Somethbg ~rustevolve and not stand still, so I al-ya fiotion, bther it ma tht'I was already Interested in ph3.loeo?ky, maia, art... BaLgemeyer: Rlgh!. I sought always people Pho knew more and who were older than I ma. Hot coaeciously, but inatfnctively, nancPally. f do that yet, sxcept now I go back to grcstath. &so, I waa rather a regular boy and not a nice boy, Qilb: Are you speaklrg of wine, '%men md song2 Ekgmeyes: Xo, =to; I ra%har neglecZed was8 in n$r emly goufh Sscsuse I e?xdia&. I b~dicleali and idrics sad I had to studS '*sa ~gimgss. Be . baa no the. .- .;(.- ... Gilb: Were you a juvenile delinquent? Hagemeyer : No, I was not, I was a street urchin.. I wae a 1 ! rebel and a fighter. I oould tak~a certain I! side md I would fight for it, I Was 7-0 I Hot strong but very quick, and a g~odtalker. i i Then, when you say you were not a nice boy, you ! I.E aaan your badnee8 ma linked wlth your idealism2 !' Bagemeyer t In a way, 1.