18003 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY Wednesday 23 September 2009 __________ The Speaker (The Hon. George Richard Torbay) took the chair at 10.00 a.m. The Speaker read the Prayer and acknowledgement of country. AUDITOR-GENERAL'S REPORT Mr Speaker tabled, pursuant to the section 38E of the Public Finance and Audit Act 1983, the Performance Audit Report of the Auditor-General entitled, "Administering Domestic Waterfront Tenancies: Land and Property Management Authority, and Marine Authority of New South Wales", dated September 2009. Ordered to be printed. NOTICES OF MOTIONS The SPEAKER: Order! A trend has developed for members to give notices of motions that are lengthy, contain argument, unbecoming expressions, and which at times are given in the spirit of mockery. I remind members that such notices are out of order. In accordance with Standing Order 137 the Clerks are able to amend such notices under my authority to ensure they conform to the standing orders. However, if members persist in giving notices that are out of order I will rule them to be out of order and not published in the Business Paper. I remind members that a notice of motion should be a self-contained proposal and be drafted in such a way that the House is able to express a decision when the motion is moved. Members should avail themselves of the advice of the Clerks if they are unsure whether a notice is in an acceptable form prior to giving it. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE Notices of Motions General Business Notices of Motions (General Notices) given. REAL PROPERTY AMENDMENT (LAND TRANSACTIONS) BILL 2009 Agreement in Principle Debate resumed from 22 September 2009. Mr JOHN TURNER (Myall Lakes) [10.10 a.m.]: It is 21 years since I did any conveyancing and I was surprised when this legislation was introduced because I thought we would have moved past the point of requiring a legislative mechanism to allow the electronic lodgement of notices of land sales. I presume that the current system is that which applied when I was involved in conveyancing. We would finish the conveyancing and complete the blue forms, complete with carbon paper, and send them off. Certain practitioners were tardy in their completion of the forms, which detailed the procedures undertaken. It created problems further down the line for people who purchased and disposed of properties when the information had not been properly and promptly lodged. Therefore, this legislation is a welcome measure. I have a few queries that the Parliamentary Secretary might address in reply. Notices of sale detail transactions such as the settlement date and sale price and provide the updated address for service of notices on the new owners. The information is used by agencies such as the Valuer General, the Office of State Revenue, councils, water suppliers, and the like. As I said, in the past the lodgement has been done manually. This legislation specifies that the registrar general may require a notice of sale to be certified for accuracy regardless of the method of lodgement. It appears that the notice of sale can be lodged prior to or in conjunction with the lodgement of details of a land dealing. I query the reference to "prior to" and am concerned about the legal implications. 18004 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY 23 September 2009 The legislation also changes the emphasis in relation to liability for information not properly recorded in the notice of sale and exempts the registrar general from any liability under the Torrens Assurance Fund. I do not see any problem with that, but the responsibility for the practical aspects of lodging prior to or in conjunction with the lodgement and lodging electronically will be fleshed out further down the track. That is an untested area. This legislation is a step forward. As I said, I am very surprised that, 21 years after I did my last conveyance, we are only now dealing with legislation to provide for the electronic lodgement of notices of sale. Mr GEOFF PROVEST (Tweed) [10.13 a.m.]: The Real Property Amendment (Land Transaction) Bill 2009 will enable notices of sale of land to be lodged electronically prior to or in conjunction with the lodgement of land dealings such as transfers and other dealings that change the ownership of land and facilitate the Land and Property Information division's implementation of a new electronic system for the lodging of notice of sale forms. The legislation also specifies when the registrar general may require a notice of sale to be certified for correctness regardless of whether the notice is electronically lodged and clarifies when compensation may be payable from the Torrens Assurance Fund in relation to information provided in the notice of sale. We in the Tweed deal with a large number of transactions because we are one of the fastest growing regional areas in New South Wales. Even as late as yesterday I have had in-depth discussions with leading real estate and legal professionals in the Tweed. They informed me that the real property database has been in use for a number of years, but that often the information on that system is up to three months old; that is, it is not updated until three months after a sale. That is causing a large amount of confusion, particularly for local investors and Queensland investors, who are investing in fabulous real estate in the Tweed. This legislation is a significant step forward. Notices of sale are still lodged manually and that involves significant manual data entry with the associated potential for error and delay. That problem was demonstrated in my discussions with local leading real estate operators. The Land and Property Information division has developed a new product that will enable electronic presentation and lodgement of notices of sale. The new system has enhancements to assist with the accuracy of the data and will ultimately obviate the need for manual data entry. That is a positive step. I take on board the member for Myall Lakes' statement that it has taken some time for the Government to get to this point. However, this legislation is a considerable advance, particularly in terms of real estate sales and in providing clarity in the legal system. Confusion and delays have caused angst for purchasers and vendors in the past. I will not oppose this legislation because it is a significant step forward. However, it is a shame it has taken so long to get to this point. Mr BARRY COLLIER (Miranda—Parliamentary Secretary) [10.16 a.m.], in reply: I thank the members for Manly, Kiama, Port Stephens, Smithfield, Baulkham Hills, Davidson, Myall Lakes and Tweed for their contributions to the debate. The Real Property Amendment (Land Transactions) Bill 2009 amends the Real Property Act to enable the Land and Property Information division to accept electronic notice of sale forms through the department's website and via its existing network of authorised information brokers. A number of key features of the bill warrant repeating. The bill will enable the Real Property Act to provide that the notice of sale form may be lodged either manually or electronically, the information to be provided on the notice of sale form is to be certified as correct by the person completing the form, and the Torrens Assurance Fund will not pay compensation for losses resulting from information supplied on the notice of sale form except where the loss arises from transcription errors made by the registrar general. I note that the Opposition supports the bill. In fact, the member for Tweed was most enthusiastic about it and noted the large number of sales in his electorate. The member for Port Stephens made a number of comments about the register. I note that he alluded to a particular case, although he did not mentioned it specifically by name. That case has been drawn to the attention of the Land and Property Management Authority. I will not go into the details of the case because it has been canvassed already in the other place. I remind the House that the Torrens Register is primarily a register of information relating to land. People interested in dealing with land can search the register to discover a variety of interests and attributes applicable to the land itself. The register is not to be used to discover personal information about another person. Accordingly, the amount of personal data on the face of the register is kept to a minimum so that privacy is not infringed. To register a writ on a title, the creditor must present the writ for lodgement at the Land and Property Information division accompanied by an application listing the titles owned by the creditor. The application must include a statutory declaration sworn by a creditor declaring that to the best of his or her knowledge the debtor named on the writ is identical to the owner of the title on which the writ is to be recorded. Any person 23 September 2009 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY 18005 involved in litigation should use the procedures available through the courts to obtain details of a debtor's property. I note that it is the responsibility of the creditor and his or her legal practitioners—and their responsibility to their profession as well as to their client—to identify property assets owned by a debtor that may be used to satisfy a judgement debt through court proceedings. The member for Port Stephens gave an example of how to beat the system. I suggest that if he knows anybody engaged in such conduct or has examples in his particular area, he should refer those to the Minister for Lands, and in fact I will draw the Minister's attention to that part of Hansard where the member for Port Stephens outlined a way in which the system could be beaten.