LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 6491 OFFICIAL RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS Thursday, 13 February 2014 The Council continued to meet at Nine o'clock MEMBERS PRESENT: THE PRESIDENT THE HONOURABLE JASPER TSANG YOK-SING, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ALBERT HO CHUN-YAN THE HONOURABLE LEE CHEUK-YAN THE HONOURABLE CHAN KAM-LAM, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG YIU-CHUNG DR THE HONOURABLE LAU WONG-FAT, G.B.M., G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE EMILY LAU WAI-HING, J.P. THE HONOURABLE TAM YIU-CHUNG, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ABRAHAM SHEK LAI-HIM, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE FREDERICK FUNG KIN-KEE, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE VINCENT FANG KANG, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG KWOK-HING, B.B.S., M.H. PROF THE HONOURABLE JOSEPH LEE KOK-LONG, S.B.S., J.P., Ph.D., R.N. 6492 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 THE HONOURABLE JEFFREY LAM KIN-FUNG, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ANDREW LEUNG KWAN-YUEN, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG TING-KWONG, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE RONNY TONG KA-WAH, S.C. THE HONOURABLE CYD HO SAU-LAN THE HONOURABLE STARRY LEE WAI-KING, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE LAM TAI-FAI, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN HAK-KAN, J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN KIN-POR, B.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE PRISCILLA LEUNG MEI-FUN, S.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE LEUNG KA-LAU THE HONOURABLE CHEUNG KWOK-CHE THE HONOURABLE WONG KWOK-KIN, B.B.S. THE HONOURABLE IP KWOK-HIM, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MRS REGINA IP LAU SUK-YEE, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE PAUL TSE WAI-CHUN, J.P. THE HONOURABLE ALAN LEONG KAH-KIT, S.C. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG KWOK-HUNG THE HONOURABLE ALBERT CHAN WAI-YIP THE HONOURABLE CLAUDIA MO LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 6493 THE HONOURABLE JAMES TIEN PEI-CHUN, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE NG LEUNG-SING, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE STEVEN HO CHUN-YIN THE HONOURABLE WU CHI-WAI, M.H. THE HONOURABLE YIU SI-WING THE HONOURABLE GARY FAN KWOK-WAI THE HONOURABLE MA FUNG-KWOK, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHARLES PETER MOK THE HONOURABLE CHAN CHI-CHUEN THE HONOURABLE CHAN HAN-PAN DR THE HONOURABLE KENNETH CHAN KA-LOK THE HONOURABLE CHAN YUEN-HAN, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG CHE-CHEUNG, B.B.S., M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE KENNETH LEUNG THE HONOURABLE ALICE MAK MEI-KUEN, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE KWOK KA-KI THE HONOURABLE KWOK WAI-KEUNG THE HONOURABLE DENNIS KWOK THE HONOURABLE CHRISTOPHER CHEUNG WAH-FUNG, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE FERNANDO CHEUNG CHIU-HUNG 6494 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 THE HONOURABLE SIN CHUNG-KAI, S.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE HELENA WONG PIK-WAN THE HONOURABLE IP KIN-YUEN DR THE HONOURABLE ELIZABETH QUAT, J.P. THE HONOURABLE MARTIN LIAO CHEUNG-KONG, J.P. THE HONOURABLE POON SIU-PING, B.B.S., M.H. THE HONOURABLE TANG KA-PIU DR THE HONOURABLE CHIANG LAI-WAN, J.P. IR DR THE HONOURABLE LO WAI-KWOK, B.B.S., M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHUNG KWOK-PAN THE HONOURABLE CHRISTOPHER CHUNG SHU-KUN, B.B.S., M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE TONY TSE WAI-CHUEN MEMBERS ABSENT: THE HONOURABLE JAMES TO KUN-SUN THE HONOURABLE TOMMY CHEUNG YU-YAN, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG YUK-MAN THE HONOURABLE MICHAEL TIEN PUK-SUN, B.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE FRANKIE YICK CHI-MING LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 6495 PUBLIC OFFICERS ATTENDING: THE HONOURABLE MRS CARRIE LAM CHENG YUET-NGOR, G.B.S., J.P. THE CHIEF SECRETARY FOR ADMINISTRATION PROF THE HONOURABLE ANTHONY CHEUNG BING-LEUNG, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT AND HOUSING THE HONOURABLE MATTHEW CHEUNG KIN-CHUNG, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR LABOUR AND WELFARE DR THE HONOURABLE KO WING-MAN, B.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR FOOD AND HEALTH THE HONOURABLE WONG KAM-SING, J.P. SECRETARY FOR THE ENVIRONMENT THE HONOURABLE PAUL CHAN MO-PO, M.H., J.P. SECRETARY FOR DEVELOPMENT MR YAU SHING-MU, J.P. UNDER SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT AND HOUSING PROF SOPHIA CHAN SIU-CHEE, J.P. UNDER SECRETARY FOR FOOD AND HEALTH MR ERIC MA SIU-CHEUNG, J.P. UNDER SECRETARY FOR DEVELOPMENT CLERKS IN ATTENDANCE: MR KENNETH CHEN WEI-ON, S.B.S., SECRETARY GENERAL MR ANDY LAU KWOK-CHEONG, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL 6496 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 MISS FLORA TAI YIN-PING, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL MISS ODELIA LEUNG HING-YEE, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL MRS PERCY MA, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 6497 MEMBERS' MOTIONS PRESIDENT (in Cantonese): Good morning, everyone. The meeting now resumes. We now proceed to the second debate session on the theme of "Land, Housing, Transportation, Environment and Conservation". MOTION OF THANKS Continuation of debate on motion which was moved on 12 February 2014 MS CYD HO (in Cantonese): President, in this session, I will speak on issues about housing, especially rent control, and the environment. First of all, I will speak on the housing issue. After the delivery of the Policy Address, the middle class were greatly dissatisfied. While the increasing rents are eating more and more into their household income, they cannot benefit from the poverty alleviation measures and there is no mention of any alleviation measures such as tax refund in the Budget. They of course have great grievances. The housing expenses in Hong Kong today are sky-high. The property prices are beyond the means of ordinary folks and the escalating rents have made life very difficult for the sandwich class who are ineligible for public rental housing (PRH) and cannot afford to purchase HOS flats. They have come under great financial pressure. The household income of this group of people exceeds the Waiting List Income Limit but below $40,000. The amount of $40,000 was set by the incumbent Secretary for Transport and Housing, Prof Anthony CHEUNG after some adjustments and he also raised the income limit for HOS applicants to $40,000. Nevertheless, households in Hong Kong with a monthly income of less than $40,000 make up 80% of all households. In other words, 80% households in Hong Kong are in need of housing allowances from the Government because the rents of private housing are beyond their affordability. People of the sandwich class represent 35% of the total population of Hong Kong. When the Government ceased the production of HOS flats, hoping to drive the sandwich class to the private rental market, they suffer the most. Donald TSANG of the last term Government wished to lower the housing expenses of the household income to 40% or below, but this ratio is on the high side when compared to that in overseas countries. The housing expenses in overseas countries account for about 25% to 30% of the household income. 6498 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 13 February 2014 However, as the tax rates are higher in those countries, the people's household disposable income is about 50% of their total income. It is true that the tax rate in Hong Kong is lower, but taking into account the high rate of indirect tax, rates and premium, the living expenses in Hong Kong are among the highest in the whole world. For a family with a monthly income of $40,000, 40% of the income, that is, $16,000, is not enough to pay for home mortgage. Take for example Riva, a newly developed housing estate in Yuen Long, New Territories North. A flat on the lowest floor is sold at $4.4 million. Unless a family can borrow money to pay 50% of the property price as down payment, $16,000 is definitely not enough to pay the monthly mortgage payment for 70% of the property price. Households with a monthly income of $40,000 are among the highest-income groups in the sandwich class. If even these households cannot afford the mortgage payment, households with an income of $20,000 or $30,000 have greater difficulties. Besides, when the river rises the boat goes up. When property prices are sky-high, rents will not be low. Take Hong Kong Island as an example. For $16,000 a month, one can only rent a flat in a middle-class housing estate with a gross floor area of about 500-odd sq ft. As for the lower sandwich class, that is, households with a monthly income about $20,000, they can hardly rent a flat at $8,000, that is 40% of their income. President, you are also an elected Member of Hong Kong Island, you should have heard of Kwan Yick Building in the Central and Western District. For a flat of that building with a gross floor area of over 320 sq ft, the saleable area is only about 200-odd sq ft and one can touch both sides of the sitting room when he stretches his hands, the rent of such a flat is $10,000 a month. That housing estate is well over 40 years old. If a sufficient proportion of ownership shares can be obtained, I am afraid it can be subject to compulsory sale. As a matter of fact, the middle class are not afraid to fend for themselves, neither are they worried about not being able to enjoy many welfare services.