3741 Oral Answers [ 2 AUG. 1967 ] to Questions 1742 SHRI K. C. PANT: May I say to the hon. RAJYA SABHA Member that the loans have been given at different periods. There are different loans on Wednesday, the 2nd August, 1967ythc Hth different terms and we calculate the Sravana, 1889 (Saka) repayment due during a particular year. But if I go into all the loans that have been given to The House met at eleven of the clock, MR. the West Bengal Government, it will be a CHAIRMAN in the Chair. very wrong way. The particular point here is, what is the repayment amount due? The ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS repayment due is, principal Rs. 22 crores •and interest Rs. 11.50 crores. WEST BENGAL GOVERNMENT'S REQUEST TOR A MORATORIUM ON CENTRAL LOANS SHRI A. D. MANI; May I ask the Minister whether any attempt has been made by the *210. SHRI A. D. MANI: Will the Union Government to find out whether the Minister of FINANCE be pleased to state: financial resources at the disposal of the West Bengal Government permit it to repay the (a) whether the Government of West loan at some stage or other including interest Bengal has requested the Government of and whether it is solvent. That is the question India for a moratorium on loans given to it by I want to put. the Union Government and interest due on SHRI MORARJI R. DESAI: In the matter them; and of these loans and interests, if my hon. friend (b) what are the details thereof? thinks that these loans and interests ought to be-written off everywhere, then he must THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE provide certain resources at the disposal of the MINISTRY OF FINANCE (SHRI K. C. Central Government to write them off. The PANT): (a) and (b) The Government of West Central Government has borrowed and has Bengal had asked for the postponement of the given the loans to the State Government and payment of at least 50 per cent, of the princi- they have taken them. If they are not to be pal and interest aggregating Rs. 33.50 crores returned by the State Government, then how due to the Centre during the current year. This can the Central Government give them loans was said to be necessary in order to balance in future? And now also how are the Central their budget. Government to return them? They have got to give them back. Interests have been taken into The Government of India have regretted account by every Finance Commission when they cannot agree to this postponement. it takes into account all the conditions, and SHRI A. D. MANI: May I ask the Minister they provide for this purpose. Therefore, it is n'ot a correct thing to say that it is not what is th total of the loan taken so far by the e possible for them to pay back. Moreover, West Bengal Government from the Union those Governments also receive interest from Government? other people. SHRI K. C. PANT: Well I can tell him that SHRI CHITTA BASU: Will the hon. the payment liability for the year . Minister be pleased to state whether the West SHRI A. D. MANI: On a point of order, Bengal Government has written to the Government of India with regard to the if. When a question is tabled, the Minister must be ready with all the facts. He has not consolidation got the facts at his disposal. 921 RS—1. 1743 Oral Answers [ RAJYA SABHA ] to Questions 1744 and rationalisation of the debts and also SHRI A. G. KULKARNI: May I know for the renxing of the rate of Interest? whether the Government is aware that the That is my first question. Secondly, Sir, move to request the Centre for you know that out of the total amount of moratorium on different loans by State the Central aid to the States, 70 per cent Governments has »got something to do is allocated on the basis of population and with social measures and schemes 30 per cent on the basis of special relief. announced by State Governments and May I know whether the West Bengal measures enunciated to carry the popular Government has written in this context to vote in the name of a request for the Government of India for allocation of moratorium on loans. a greater amount under the head of ■ i i special needs for this 30 per cent is in SHRI K. C. PANT: This is a ques consideration of the special problems in tion that should be directed to the West Bengal, namely, the influx of the States. ,, i refugees thereafter partition. And there are, also problems arising due to its being SHRI A. P. CHATTERJEE: Will the a border.S^tate. Finally, there is the hon. Minister say when'this loan, in consideration of the special needs of respect of which the repayment is due, Calcutta. It is not only a city of West was taken, whether during the period of Bengal, it is an all-India city, rather'it is this Government or during the period of an international city today. May I know the Congress. Government and whether whether the Government of West Bengal the Congress, Government also asked for has written about all Itiese things to the any. .temporary moratorium on these Government of India and, if so, what is repayments due to the Central the reaction ,o£ the Government of India Government? thereto? SHRI K. C. PANT: Sir, the Gov- SHRI K. C. PANT: 'So far as the ernment of West Bengal have been in question of consolidation of the loans existence since independence and it is and the rationalisation of the terms is that Government which took the loans. concerned, that matter is under exa- mination. So far as the criterion of SHRI ARJUN ARORA: May I know allocation of Central assistance is con- if the policy being followed in respect of cerned, the considerations which, the return of. loan by the West Bengal weighed with the Finance Commission Government is the same as is being are different from those of the Planning followed by the Union Government in Commission and the Centre in respect of other Governments? determining the assistance for the Plans. So, the two cannot be equated. So far as SHRI MORARJI R. DESAI: Abso- the particular heeds of West Bengal are lutely the same. concerned, many of the particular needs SHRI D. THENGARI: Has the Gov- have been taken into account, for ernment adopted any criteria' i for instance, the extra assistance required for granting, or not granting moratorium on relief measures, etc. loans given to State Governments? SHRI CHITTA BASU: Sir, . SHRI MORARJI R. DESAI: The MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Kulkarni. criterion is that it is not possible to give it. .. SHRI CHITTA BASU: So many questions have been allowed. This is an SHRI RAM NIWAS MIRDHA: May I important question. know whether the so-called loans that ,are given to the,,State Governs ments are MR. CHAIRMAN: T will give you realised? The whole prp-blem of loans to an occasion later. the States is really 1745 Oral Answers [ 2 AUG. 1967 ] to Questions 1746 in a very fantastic (position because vast sums (b) by when the statues of have been advanced to the States. They have Britishers are likely to be removed almost always been defaulted upon. And the from their present sites in Delhi; and whole pattern of assistance by way of loans (c) whether there have been any and grants to the States has to be rationalised cases of misuse of the present statue in a way that loans become repayable or are pedestals? repaid regularly in a realistic manner. Will the Finance; Minister please say if they have any THE DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE idea under consideration by which these loans MINISTRY OF WORKS, HOUSING AND .could be turned into grants and that the future SUPPLY (SARDAR IQBAL SINGH): (a) loans should be such as would be repaid in No, Sir. time? (b) In pursuance of the policy of SHRI MORARJI R. DESAI: These loans gradual removal of statues of are not going to be turned into grants. That Britishers in Delhi, 10 out of 12 statues must be understood by all the States. have already been removed and only Otherwise, it will not be possible to give any two statues, viz., of King George V at loan in future. Moreover, no loans have been India Gate and King Edward VII in forced on any State Governments. When they Edward Park, still remain to be re want loans, they persist in asking for loans moved. Their shifting is likely to and after they are given, now they say that it is take some time. a fantastic position. My hon. friend has just (c) No such case has come to notice. come from that State. Therefore, he thinks like that. But he does not think of the Centre. There SHRI M. P. BHARGAVA: May I know, is no quarrel, there cann'ot be any quarrel, Sir, from the hon. Minister what are the between the Centre and the State. The difficulties in fixing the sites for the statues; interests of both are the same. If the Centre of our national leaders like Mahatma Gandhi, becomes bankrupt, the States will become Jawaharlal Nehru and Lal Bahadur Shastri? bankrupt before that, and if the States become bankrupt, the Centre will also go bankrupt. SARDAR IQBAL SINGH: Regarding sites Therefore, both have got to work in co- we have constituted a committee.