Page 1 U.S. COPYRIGHT OFFICE + + + + + MUSIC LICENSING STUDY PUBLIC ROUNDTABLE + + + + + TUESDAY JUNE 17, 2014 + + + + + The Music Licensing Study Public Roundtable was held at the UCLA School of Law, Conference Room 1314, 385 Charles E. Young East, Los Angeles, California, at 9:00 a.m., Jacqueline C. Charlesworth, Sy Damle, and Steve Ruwe, Moderators, presiding. U.S. COPYRIGHT OFFICE STAFF PRESENT: JACQUELINE C. CHARLESWORTH, General Counsel and Associate Register of Copyrights SARANG "SY" DAMLE, Special Advisor, Office of the General Counsel STEVE RUWE, Attorney-Advisor, Office of the General Counsel SESSION SIX: PAUL ANTHONY, Rumblefish JOHN CATE, American Music Partners TIMOTHY COHAN, PeerMusic DEBORAH GREAVES, Label Law, Inc. GARY R. GREENSTEIN, Wilson Sonsini Goodrich & Rosati RUSSELL HAUTH, National Religious Broadcasters Music License Committee ASHLEY IRWIN, The Society of Composers & Lyricists DAVID KOKAKIS, Universal Music Publishing DINA LaPOLT, Dina LaPolt P.C. SHAWN LEMONE, ASCAP Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 2 DENNIS LORD, SESAC JENNIFER MILLER, Audio Socket JASON RYS, Wixen Music Publishing GARRY SCHYMAN, The Society of Composers & Lyricists LES WATKINS, Music Reports SESSION SEVEN: PAUL ANTHONY, Rumblefish JOHN BARKER, IPAC ERIC D. BULL, Create Law DEBORAH GREAVES, Label Law, Inc. GARY R. GREENSTEIN, Wilson Sonsini Goodrich & Rosati TEGAN KOSSOWICZ, Universal Music Group DENNIS LORD, SESAC STEVEN MARKS, RIAA PETER MENELL, UC Berkeley School of Law JENNIFER MILLER, Audio Socket HÉL NE MUDDIMAN, Composer/CEO Hollywood Elite Composers VICKIE NAUMAN, CrossBorderWorks JOHN RUDOLPH, Music Analytics GARRY SCHYMAN, The Society of Composers & Lyricists LES WATKINS, Music Reports SESSION EIGHT: LAWRENCE J. BLAKE, Concord Music ILENE GOLDBERG, Attorney DEBORAH GREAVES, Label Law, Inc. GARY R. GREENSTEIN, Wilson Sonsini Goodrich & Rosati ERIC HARBESON, Music Library Association RUSSELL HAUTH, National Religious Broadcasters Music License Committee TEGAN KOSSOWICZ, Universal Music Group DINA LaPOLT, Dina LaPolt P.C. STEVEN MARKS, RIAA HÉL NE MUDDIMAN, Composer/CEO Hollywood Elite Composers BRAD PRENDERGAST, SoundExchange, Inc. LES WATKINS, Music Reports Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 3 SESSION NINE: PAUL ANTHONY, Rumblefish JOHN BARKER, IPAC KEITH BERNSTEIN, Crunch Digital ILENE GOLDBERG, Attorney GARY R. GREENSTEIN, Wilson Sonsini Goodrich & Rosati ERIC HARBESON, Music Library Association ASHLEY IRWIN, The Society of Composers & Lyricists DINA LaPOLT, Dina LaPolt P.C. LEONARDO LIPSZTEIN, YouTube/Google DENNIS LORD, SESAC STEVEN MARKS, RIAA PETER MENELL, UC Berkeley School of Law JENNIFER MILLER, Audio Socket HÉL NE MUDDIMAN, Composer/CEO Hollywood Elite Composers VICKIE NAUMAN, CrossBorderWorks CHARLES J. SANDERS, SGA Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 4 TABLE OF CONTENTS Introductions. 5 Session 6: Musical Works - Public Performance. .10 Session 7: Industry Incentives and Investment . .92 Session 8: Pre-1972 Sound Recordings . 158 Session 9: Potential Future Developments . 233 Day Two Wrap-Up/Closing Remarks. 300 Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 5 1 P-R-O-C-E-E-D-I-N-G-S 2 (9:12 a.m.) 3 MS. CHARLESWORTH: Welcome back to 4 day two of the Los Angeles Music Licensing 5 Roundtable. Once again, we really appreciate 6 your interest and participation in these 7 discussions. We are very hopeful that they are 8 going to lead to some positive changes in our 9 music licensing structures. 10 I think because we have some new 11 people in the audience and just to -- and as 12 well as some new people at the table, I'm 13 going to ask everyone sitting around the 14 roundtable to introduce themselves, even if 15 you did so yesterday, and briefly state your 16 affiliation for the record, and then we will 17 proceed with the first session. 18 We'll start with you, Mr. 19 Greenstein. 20 MR. GREENSTEIN: So I'm Gary 21 Greenstein, a partner with Wilson Sonsini 22 Goodrich & Rosati, and I currently represent Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 6 1 a wide range of online service providers, 2 whether they're interactive or non-interactive 3 streaming services, user-generated content 4 services, app developers, and many others. 5 Prior to joining Wilson Sonsini, I was the 6 first General Counsel of SoundExchange and 7 also a Vice President of Business and Legal 8 Affairs for Recording Industry Association of 9 America. 10 MS. LaPOLT: I'm Dina LaPolt. I'm 11 the President of LaPolt Law, P.C. We are a 12 boutique entertainment law firm. We represent 13 all music creators. 14 MS. MILLER: I'm Jen Miller, COO 15 and Co-Founder of Audio Socket. We're a music 16 licensing and technology company that has 17 built one technology called Music as a Service 18 to streamline music licensing for digital 19 integration, and then a technology called 20 License ID, which is -- it was launched about 21 six months ago internally, and it actually 22 embeds into the audio signal user and Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 7 1 copyright data, as well as the downloader's 2 data. 3 MS. CHARLESWORTH: If you could 4 speak into the mike, even -- that would -- 5 yes, we have to share, but -- 6 MR. KOKAKIS: Not a problem. My 7 name is David Kokakis. I'm the head of 8 Business and Legal Affairs and Business 9 Development for Universal Publishing. I also 10 oversee all of the digital deals for Universal 11 Publishing. 12 MR. WATKINS: I'm Les Watkins. I'm 13 with Music Reports. We're a music rights 14 management organization and technology 15 platform. We manage music licenses and pay 16 royalties for a number of digital music 17 services, broadcasters, and increasingly 18 content owners, record companies, and music 19 publishers. 20 MR. SCHYMAN: I'm Garry Schyman. 21 I'm a composer. I've been a composer all my 22 life. I've written music for films, Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 8 1 television. I've written songs that have 2 actually had some success. I'm not a 3 songwriter primarily, though. And a lot of 4 video game music. I'm also chair of the Music 5 Rights Committee of the Society of Composers 6 and Lyricists. 7 MR. IRWIN: Ashley Irwin. I'm 8 President of the Society of Composers and 9 Lyricists. We represent -- we don't really 10 represent. We have members, over 1,000 11 members, who work primarily in audio-visual, 12 film, television, video games, and most 13 recently theater. 14 MS. GREAVES: Deborah Greaves. I'm 15 CEO of Label Law, and I'm here on behalf of 16 the IP Section of the California State Bar. 17 MR. RYS: Jason Rys. I'm Vice 18 President at Wixen Music Publishing. We are an 19 independent music publishing administrator 20 representing probably several thousand 21 songwriters. 22 MR. LORD: I'm Dennis Lord, Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 9 1 Executive Vice President of SESAC. 2 MR. LEMONE: Shawn LeMone, VP at 3 ASCAP. I run the film area for ASCAP, and I 4 was on the board of the California Copyright 5 Conference for 12 years. 6 MR. HAUTH: Good morning. Russell 7 Hauth, Salem Communications Corporation. We're 8 a media company with approximately 100 radio 9 stations and several publishing imprints and 10 quite a lot of activity on the web. As a 11 sideline, as an industry diversion, I am the 12 Executive Director of the National Religious 13 Broadcasters Music License Committee, 14 representing approximately a thousand radio 15 stations with specialty formats, such as 16 religious, classical music, news talk, and 17 mixed format, other types of stations. 18 MR. COHAN: I'm Tim Cohan. I'm the 19 head of Legal and Business Affairs for 20 PeerMusic, a large independent music 21 publishing company. I handle all of the U.S. 22 transactional matters and also oversee and Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 10 1 coordinate the international digital 2 licensing. 3 MR. ANTHONY: I'm Paul Anthony, the 4 Founder and CEO of Rumblefish. We're a music 5 microlicensing business. We represent about 6 five million copyrights. And I'm glad to be 7 here. 8 MS. CHARLESWORTH: Okay. Well, 9 thank you all. 10 So the first panel addresses the 11 public performance right in musical works. And 12 as I'm sure perhaps everyone in this room is 13 aware, there have been some recent 14 developments in the PRO world. We have seen a 15 couple of decisions from federal courts ruling 16 or holding that major music publishers who 17 wish to withdraw partial rights, meaning in 18 this case digital rights, from their 19 representation by the PROs, were not permitted 20 to do that under the consent decrees, which I 21 think has raised some questions about what the 22 future might look like for ASCAP, BMI, and of Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc. 202-234-4433 Washington DC www.nealrgross.com Page 11 1 course we have one significant additional PRO, 2 SESAC, that is not under a consent decree. And 3 so the Copyright Office is very interested in 4 hearing from the various parts and sectors of 5 the music industry about, you know, what -- 6 let's assume that the major music publishers 7 chose to withdraw entirely from the PROs, 8 which is something that some people feel could 9 happen.