Public Hearing November 13, 2007 1 NEW YORK STATE COMMISSION ON SENTENCING REFORM ------------------------------------------- Transcript of Public Hearing Tuesday, November 13, 2007 9:30 a.m. New York City Bar Association 42 West 44th Street New York, New York ------------------------------------------- Public Hearing November 13, 2007 2 1 IN ATTENDANCE: 2 3 Chair: 4 5 Denise E. O'Donnell, Esq. 6 Division of Criminal Justice Services 7 8 Commissioners: 9 10 Anthony Bergamo, Esq. 11 Chairman, 12 Federal Law Enforcement Foundation, Inc. 13 14 Brian Fischer 15 Commissioner, 16 New York State Department of Correctional 17 Services 18 Michael C. Green, Esq. 19 Monroe County District Attorney 20 21 Joseph R. Lentol, Esq. 22 Member, 23 New York State Assembly 24 25 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 3 1 Michael P. McDermott, Esq. 2 O'Connell and Aronowitz 3 4 Hon. Juanita Bing Newton 5 Deputy Chief Administrative Judge for Justice 6 Initiatives 7 New York State Office of Court Administration 8 9 Eric T. Schneiderman, Esq. 10 Member, 11 New York State Senate 12 13 Cyrus R. Vance, Jr., Esq. 14 Morvillo, Abramowitz, Grand, Jason, Anello & 15 Bohrer 16 17 Also Present: 18 Anthony Annucci, Esq. 19 Department of Correctional Services 20 21 Arleigh Green 22 Court Reporter 23 24 25 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 4 1 T E S T I M O N Y 2 3 Marsha Weissman 4 Center for Community Alternatives. .7 5 Richard M. Greenberg, Esq. 6 Office of the Appellate Defender . 14 7 Gabriel Sayegh 8 Drug Policy Alliance . 24 9 Daniel R. Alonso, Esq. 10 New York City Bar Association. 32 11 Robert M. Morgenthau, Esq. 12 New York County District Attorney. 41 13 Shreya Mandal 14 The Legal Aid Society. 51 15 Anne J. Swern, Esq. 16 1st Assistant District Attorney 17 Kings County District Attorney's Office. 62 18 Norma Fernandes 19 President, DTAP Alumni Association . 72 20 Bridget G. Brennan, Esq. 21 Office of the Special Narcotics Prosecutor 22 for the City of New York . 78 23 Robert Gangi 24 Executive Director 25 Correctional Association of New York . 87 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 5 1 TESTIMONY (cont'd) 2 3 Glenn Martin 4 Associate Vice-President, The Fortune Society. 98 5 Elizabeth A. Gaynes, Esq. 6 Executive Director. 7 The Osborne Association. .103 8 Richard A. Brown, Esq. 9 Queens County District Attorney. .112 10 Nancy Grosselfinger 11 International League for Human Rights. .118 12 Robert J. Dennison 13 Retired Chairman 14 New York State Board of Parole . .127 15 Phillip M. Genty, Esq. 16 Columbia University School of Law. .137 17 Donna E. Lieberman, Esq. 18 Executive Director 19 New York Civil Liberties Union . .148 20 Alfred R. Siegel, Esq., Deputy Director 21 Michael Rempel, Director of Research 22 Center for Court Innovation. .156 23 Anita R. Marton, Esq. 24 Vice-President, Legal Action Center. .172 25 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 6 1 TESTIMONY (cont'd) 2 3 Seep Varma 4 Executive Vice-President 5 New York Therapeutic Communities, Inc. .182 6 Amy Oliveras 7 Co-President, CURE-NY. .189 8 Sarah From 9 Director of Public Policy and Communications 10 Women's Prison Association . .197 11 Alissa C. Kampner Rudin, Esq. 12 General Counsel, Family Justice, Inc.. .205 13 Erika L. Wood, Esq. 14 Deputy Director, Democracy Program 15 Brennan Center for Justice at NYU Law School . .215 16 Rhonda Ferdinand, Esq. 17 Assistant District Attorney 18 Office of the Special Narcotics Prosecutor for the 19 City of New York . .224 20 Cheri O'Donoghue 21 FREE . .234 22 Kirk James 23 Associate Director 24 The College Initiative . .243 25 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 7 1 TESTIMONY (cont'd) 2 3 Michelle Fine 4 Distinguished Professor of Psychology 5 The Graduate Center, City University of New York . .254 6 Hon. Laura Safer Espinoza 7 New York City Criminal Court, Bronx County . .266 8 Emani Davis 9 Co-Chair, Youth Advisory Board 10 New York City Initiative for Children of 11 Incarcerated Parents . .276 12 Rev. Vivian Nixon 13 Executive Director 14 College & Community Fellowship . .288 15 Lisa M. Rappa. .295 16 Felipe Vargas 17 Director of Criminal Justice Programs 18 The Doe Fund . .300 19 Beatrice Lozada 20 Prison Families Anonymous. .312 21 Andrew Conn. .318 22 Edie Beaujoin. .329 23 Alberto Oliva. .334 24 25 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 8 1 TESTIMONY (cont'd) 2 3 Mentoring a Prisoner 4 William E. Waters 5 Program Director 6 The Osborne Association. .338 7 Eric Marsh 8 New Spirit II, Inc.. .348 9 Judith Greene 10 Justice Strategies . .357 11 John Culpepper, Executive Director 12 Lower Washington Heights 13 Neighborhood Association . .366 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Public Hearing November 13, 2007 9 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 [Time noted: 9:30 a.m.] 3 COMMISSIONER O'DONNELL: We are 4 officially opening the Hearing on Sentencing Reform 5 for the State of New York. 6 We were created, as many of you know, by 7 Executive Order of Governor Spitzer, to look at 8 virtually all aspects of New York sentencing laws, 9 alternatives to incarceration, re-entry, victims' 10 issues. And, we have been working very, very hard at 11 our mission, many times -- in fact, all summer 12 meeting one full day a week. 13 We've heard from many experts throughout 14 the country on sentencing issues. We issued our 15 preliminary report on October 15th, 2007. And, we 16 are hard at work, again, on working on many of the 17 sentencing issues before us. 18 I hope you had an opportunity to look at 19 our preliminary report. We're hoping to get feedback 20 from the public. This is our effort to reach out and 21 hear from advocates in the community, experts on 22 sentencing issues, because we know that we are only 23 11 people and there are many, many opinions out 24 there, and information out there that we think is 25 important for us to consider. Public Hearing November 13, 2007 10 1 So, I'd like to begin. This morning, our 2 first speaker is Marsha Weissman, of the Center for 3 Community Alternatives. 4 And Marsha, as you know, each of our 5 speakers have 10 minutes. We have a timekeeper here, 6 who will keep you on track. And, welcome to the 7 Commission. 8 TESTIMONY OF MARSHA WEISSMAN, CENTER FOR COMMUNITY 9 ALTERNATIVES 10 MS. WEISSMAN: Good morning. I don't 11 know if I need this, but maybe it's getting taped or 12 something. 13 Good morning. Thank you for the 14 opportunity to speak here. And, I'm a little shocked 15 that I'm number one. I don't think that's ever 16 happened before. 17 And, I want to start by not only thanking 18 you for holding these hearings, but also the obvious 19 hard work and thought that went into the preliminary 20 report. 21 I am the Executive Director of the Center 22 for Community Alternatives. For over 25 years, we 23 have worked to promote reduced reliance on 24 incarceration in ways that promote public safety. We 25 work virtually at every point in the continuum of the Public Hearing November 13, 2007 11 1 criminal justice system, from alternatives to 2 detention, ATI programs, working with people in 3 prison, preparing them for release and re-entry 4 programs. 5 It's an opportune time -- a moment to 6 reform New York's sentencing laws. We have the 7 obvious energy and creativity of a new 8 administration. New York has incredible resources 9 here, scholars, the Vera Institute of Justice, ATI 10 programs -- not only CCA's but others. And, we have 11 the work -- I don't know if you looked at this in 12 your report -- Eric Cadora and Justice Mapping, that 13 looks at the community impact of the over-reliance on 14 incarceration. 15 And last year, New York really became a 16 pioneer in amending its penal law to include a fifth 17 goal of sentencing; and that is explicitly to promote 18 reintegration and re-entry. 19 My comments today are going to be a little 20 bit bold, and may seem a bit critical; and, I do this 21 with respect and not because I don't see real 22 opportunities in the report. But, I was raised by a 23 mother who, if I brought home a report card that said 24 B+, she would say "How come not an A?" All right? 25 And, I think that there's opportunities Public Hearing November 13, 2007 12 1 that still exist, as you continue your work, to take 2 the recommendations another step forward. And, I 3 think that in the interim time that you're looking at 4 your final recommendations, I would really urge that 5 some work be devoted to the larger framework of what 6 is the purpose of sentencing in New York. 7 And, I think that we know so much in this 8 state and nationally about the impact of 9 incarceration on not only the individuals who are 10 incarcerated, but their communities and families, 11 that part of, I think, what we need to look at is the 12 real explicit question of length of sentence and how 13 many people are going to prison. 14 And, I know you heard from Jeremy Travis 15 and Michael Jacobson, and they both indicated that 16 they thought we are incarcerating too many people for 17 too long.