Printed (by Authority) by CORRIE Ltd., 48, Bucks Road, Douglas, Isle of Man. REPORT OF PROCEEDINGS OF TYNWALD COURT DOUGLAS, Wednesday, 19th, February, 1986 at 10.30 a.m. Present: The Lieutenant-Governor (His Excellency Major General Laurence New, C.B., C.B.E.). In the Council: The Lord Bishop (the Rt. Rev. Arthur Henry Attwell), the Attorney-General (Mr. T.W. Cain), Messrs. R.J.G. Anderson, A.A. Callin, Mrs. B.Q. Hanson, Mr. E.G. Lowey, Dr. E.J. Mann, Messrs. J.N. Radcliffe and E.M. Ward, B.E.M., with Mr. T.A. Bawden, Clerk of the Council. In the Keys: The Speaker (the Hon. Sir Charles Kerruish, O.B.E.), Messrs. W.K. Quirk, W.A. Gilbey, J.D.Q. Cannan, Mrs. C.M. Christian, Messrs. S.L. Morrey, J.H. Kneale, D.G. Maddrell, R.A. Payne, P. Karran, M.R. Walker, N.Q. Cringle, Dr. D.L. Moore, Messrs. C.A. Cain, A.R. Bell, B. May, G.V.H. Kneale, E.C. Irving, C.B.E., A.C. Duggan, D.C. Cretney, D.F.K. Delaney, D. Martin, J.A. Brown, with Mr. R.B.M. Quayle, Clerk of Tynwald. The Lord Bishop took the prayers. PUBLIC TELECOMMUNICATIONS SYSTEM — QUESTION OF PRIVILEGE — STATEMENT BY MR. DELANEY The Governor: Hon. members, the hon. member for East Douglas has asked me for leave to make a statement and I call upon Mr. Delaney. Mr. Delaney: Prior to that, Your Excellency, I require the services of this hon. Court if they would call to the Bar of the Court later on this morning the editor of the Isle of Man Gazette, Mr. William Dale. I beg to move: That Mr. William Dale be summoned to the Bar o f Tynwald as a witness. The Governor: Is it hon. members’ wish that Mr. William Dale should be called to the Bar of this Court? Will those in favour say aye; those against say no. Mrs. Christian: Your Excellency, before that happens could we have some reasons why this should be so? The Governor: Yes. Public Telecommunications System — Question of Privilege — Statement by Mr. Delaney T 1112 TYNWALD COURT, WEDNESDAY, 19th FEBRUARY, 1986 Mr. Delaney: Your Excellency, in order to make the statement which will need confirmation of certain parts, they have to be confirmed by Mr. William Dale, the editor of the said Isle o f Man Gazette. Mr. Gilbey: Your Excellency, can we be told about this, we are just being told mysteries. I think we need a clearer reason why this gentleman should be summoned here at, no doubt, some inconvenience to himself. The Governor: I think the case which has been put by Mr. Delaney is that in order for his statement to be complete he needs the opportunity for this person to be questioned by the Court. If subsequently, when the statement has been made, it appears unnecessary it may not then be our wish to proceed with his questioning. I ask again, will hon. members in favour of this preliminary action being taken so that he is here and available, say aye; those against no. The ayes have it. The ayes have it. 1 call on Mr. Delaney. Mr. Delaney: Thank you, Your Excellency. I wish to take the Court through a chain of events which commenced with the meeting of the members a week on Monday in the rooms of Executive Council where we were informed, as members outside of the committee and Executive Council, of what the nomination would be for the telecommunications service of the Isle of Man. At that time most members, after being been told about the SLIVi million which would be offered, were euphoric; the feeling was it was Utopia and I, with all the members, felt the same way. At that time I think I was the first to congratulate the chairman on getting such a deal. I also handed in, because I thought they were unnecessary, the documents which we had been handed, four documents been handed to members, as I thought they were non-necessary. I then on the Tuesday morning, having heard Manx Radio where the Chairman of Executive Council made a statement and, with permission, I would like to quote from that statement: ‘And there was always the danger of having a public debate, but on the other hand I think it would have been very wrong for Government to have made the decision without publishing the documents and without the public having an opportunity to express their view. I think this has always been a danger and that the whole thing could have been wrapped up and finalised before the public even knew what we were talking about.’ The statement also contains certain other references to the documents, to which I will refer later. Having heard that I then came to the conclusion that the documents were going to be made public because at the end of the debate on the Monday night there was some confusion of what was private and what was not private. I was quite clear in my own mind that certainly Mr. William Dawson’s, the Government Treasurer’s document was private. But on the assumption that the documents were to be made public and in the knowledge that the Isle o f Man Gazette was to carry the story of what was in the documents I then had second thoughts about leaving the documents with the Clerk of Tynwald, as I had previously done, and I removed them. I actually removed them from his ownership into mine and the Speaker was there when I actually drew them out. I was asked by the other gentlemen who was called to the Bar of this Court would I give him the documents. I said ‘Well, I cannot give you the docu­ ment being put forward by the Government Treasurer as I still believe that is private and confidential but certainly from the statements being made this morning — that Public Telecommunications System — Question of Privilege — Statement by Mr. Delaney TYNWALD COURT, WEDNESDAY, 19th FEBRUARY, 1986 T il 13 was on the Tuesday morning — by the Chairman of Executive Council, you can have the expert’s report’. So I passed it on. That is my total involvement in that situation and my conscious is clear because one officer of this Court can confirm that he was of the same opinion as me that the expert’s report was not private and confidential, an officer, and I am sure that he will make this known to the members if they so desire. Your Excellency, from that situation we then come to the Wednesday morning. On leaving a meeting in Ramsey in the Board of Social Security and travelling back to Douglas, I was amazed, somewhat amazed to find that a member of Executive Council, Mr. Anderson, was actually quoting parts of the report, but it confirmed in my mind that in actual fact it was a public document; there was no doubt about that. On the Thursday the Gazette carried the whole story on the middle pages, what had been recommended by the expert. Now I never passed it to the Gazette, and I am aware which member did. I did not pass it to Manx Radio. They had a copy of the document. I never did. There are other members of this Court that I am aware of passed on these documents. But if they are looking for a political head to have, and that seems to be the object of a political trial at the Bar of that Court, because one of the people who have been called to the Bar of that Court has already declared he is a candidate in the forthcoming general election and to have a situation where the members of this Court are holding trial over a potential candidate or opposition, in my opinion, is totally wrong. (Interruption) I am aware the same party, of which I am not a member, intends putting a candidate in my . The hon. member for Ramsey, Your Excellency, is making his own statement over there. The situation is I am aware that this party is putting a candidate in my constituency and I feel totally wrong that I should sit here in judgement on them or try to destroy that political group, even though I disagree with them and I think that is totally wrong, sir, and I think this Court is being used for the wrong purpose. If they want a head to say who passed on one of the documents, they can have mine but I am aware that several other members of this Court passed the documents to the media and to other persons and if those members are not prepared to stand up and be counted I certainly am, but I am not prepared to see this Court send someone to gaol because they have had information passed between them as a political grouping and it is obvious from what Mr. Leventh&rpe said yesterday, or did not say, that the information was given to him in his position in a political party and we are asking him to denounce his own party at the Bar at that Court or misinformation which he had, because that is what it is, misinformation. Your Excellency, I hope that this hon. Court, because my conscious is clear, will clear its own conscious by letting those two gentlemen leave the Bar of this Court. But if we want to find out who gave out the documents I would be interested in knowing who gave it to Manx Radio and I would be interested in who gave it to the Gazette because that is the media.