32 October 1984 Marxism Today Pat Phoenix left Coronation Street last Tony No, you have to be working in year after appearing as Elsie -Tanner television and the mass media, that's from the very first episode of the series. where the people are. Tony Booth is best known as Alf Gar- nett's son-in-law in Till Death Us Do How much do you worry about what parts Part. Both are now appearing in The you're playing, what kinds of play you're in? Man, a stage thriller. Richard Dyer and Rosalind Brunt went to interview them Pat I reckon in my long career I have done backstage at the Devonshire Park just about every kind of play. Those with a Theatre, Eastbourne. political message. Those with no message at all. Just plain bloody awful. I have done What you think is the most important thing marvellous plays. I've done it all one way you've done in your careers? or another. And so I have now reached the stage where if I can make them laugh, or Pat Phoenix Well, we haven't done it yet! make them cry, or make them go out feeling better or just entertained, that's my Does that mean you have something in mind? job. That's my purpose. I haven't any other purpose. That's it. Pat There are lots of things you would like to do. There are things you would like to But would you draw a line about playing a do and things you have to do, but you don't particular part or a particular play, on politic­ know what will come up till it does. al grounds? Is it likely to be in the theatre . .? Pat No. If it was an entertaining part and a good play I'd play it. They say that because Pat I should think it would be with me. of what they believe you wouldn't play, All say, a Tory MP with sympathy - but of Tony Booth As an actor, from a selfish course I would. If I was a man and they Should Be point of view, theatre is best because that's asked me to play Hitler, I'd do it. where the actor is still in control. There's no director manipulating you. We make Tony But not if it was a play that advo­ Interview with Pa our own performance, we set our own pace cated fascism, where the message was a - it's that immediate thing that happens song of praise to fascism. from 8.15 until 10 . that moment, that's When people come to see you in a play do you great. That's purely from an actor's selfish Pat Oh, no. think they are expecting a working class point of view. character? Tony So you would draw the line some­ So is theatre the most important thing to do where! Pat Oh no. Since I've been in the Street both socially and personally? I've gone out many times and I've played a You're both well known for playing working myriad of characters. class parts. Are you conscious of that? Tony An actor is a person who should be Pat All actors should be working class. able to play almost any part. You have to That's where we came from in the begin­ find out what the limit of your range is. ning. We were all rogues and vagabonds, You are the one who is conscious of it, not we used to play fools in churches and me. You're bringing up class. I'm for the village greens . abolition of class. But you are stars. You do public appearances Which brings us to politics. as stars rather than as working class people, don't you? Pat Watch it! Pat I don't know what you mean. I am a Would you put a label to either of your working actress. I work bloody hard. I politics? really don't know what you mean by a star. I am in public demand at the moment and Tony I wouldn't because I won't accept it's a case of demand and supply. There any dogma that tells you to do such and will come a time when I'm not in demand such. Not Christianity, not socialism. and I won't be doing these things. I'm a Anyway, Marx wasn't saying 'Don't do leading lady because I've worked myself to this, don't do that' - he was about freedom the top of my profession. and human expression. '"..'rn^manonas Ebw ^"^"^c^eet? Street .• PRODUCED BY UNZ.ORG ^.t^'^"^"''^"^"" ELECTRONIC REPRODUCTION PROHIBITED October 1984 Marxism Today 33 only party that I can see is going to do that think they have contributed to the problems is the Labour Party. There are certain you're taking about? people in the Labour Party who you can believe in. Pat Well, yes, the name makes you think of the main problem. If you are going to be Does it worry you what the public will think of a workers' party, first understand the such support? workers and know that half of them are not workers because they haven't got a job. Tony It's interesting that no one ever asks Tory actors whether it offends their pub­ Tony I feel sorry for them, they're just so lic. Only people like us get asked - only out of touch. people on the Left. Nobody ever addres­ sed that question to Kenny Everett. Another area of politics I'd like to ask you about, Pat, is feminism. Would you call Pat You should have seen my hate letters yourself a feminist? especially when I didn't stand up for the 'Land of Hope and Glory' on one occasion. Pat No I don't. Actresses have always But you can't let that bother you. Why earned their own money, probably more should we? As you say we are noted for our than men. We have had to do the same jobs working class performances. What else as men. We have had to stand up in the would Elsie Tanner be? A Tory supporter? cold, get up just as early, face the elements, do stunts if necessary. What about the politics in Equity? Does that involve you at all? But when you were not so well known, desperate for work, were you ever required to Tony Equity is too weak, it's more like an do things that were compromising to you as a ors actors' club. If Equity combined with the woman, like stripping? unions within what could loosely be called king Class entertainment, and had a combined voice, Pat I was told to strip twice before I was then it might have some effect. We might well known and I sent for my agent and ix and Tony Booth be able to get a deal for actors and people in screamed and carried on and said 'No, I the theatre and so on if we were combined won't, why should I?' I didn't think it was with technicians in telelvision. If we had a necessary to the part I was playing. I Pat No, I can't either. I am involved with strike and they pulled out the plugs, that threatened everything and I got away with people, I care about people and I care what would really have some effect - no theatre, it. Most actors and actresses are liberated happens to the world, but I wouldn't say I no radio, and no TV . today. was anything in particular. And the Workers' Revolutionary Party, since So you did have to stand up against the way And yet you both went to Chesterfield to they are quite famous within Equity. Do you you were being treated. Can we ask you now support Tony Benn recently? about writing, because you both write? Had you got anything in mind when you decided to Tony Oh yes, within the structure of write your autobiography? society as it stands, our sympathy lies with Labour, of course. Were you at Chesterfield mainly as Labour supporters or were you specifically supporting Benn? Pat Because he's a man you can respect, who speaks the truth - he's a good man, and he'll follow through. Tony And his form of socialism is some­ thing you can believe in. Pat I would not have gone out on that bitter cold day if I had not believed in the 'onyB. man, it's as simple as that. I beheve in what '^"hU, he's trying to do and I want better things ""Slubb: for this country and, at the moment, the "'"•^^O.Pa. PRODUCED BY UNZ.ORG ELECTRONIC REPRODUCTION PROHIBITED 34 October 1984 Marxism Today Pat Well, there was the demand. The first Pat We haven't got one at all. Any actor remember one tabloid newspaper carrying book had sold well and I enjoyed doing it. who goes into the business must be pre­ a so-called interview with me on its middle And then the second one, I didn't enjoy it pared to give a certain amount of their life page entitled 'Why I'll need sex at 60'. too much, but I wrote it simply because of to public selling. With us it's gone way Entirely fictitious. You have no control a lot of the rubbish that was being written over the top but you must accept it and I've over this kind of reporting.