LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 1071 OFFICIAL RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS Thursday, 5 November 2020 The Council continued to meet at Nine o'clock MEMBERS PRESENT: THE PRESIDENT THE HONOURABLE ANDREW LEUNG KWAN-YUEN, G.B.M., G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG YIU-CHUNG THE HONOURABLE ABRAHAM SHEK LAI-HIM, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE TOMMY CHEUNG YU-YAN, G.B.S., J.P. PROF THE HONOURABLE JOSEPH LEE KOK-LONG, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE JEFFREY LAM KIN-FUNG, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG TING-KWONG, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE STARRY LEE WAI-KING, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN HAK-KAN, B.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN KIN-POR, G.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE PRISCILLA LEUNG MEI-FUN, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG KWOK-KIN, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE PAUL TSE WAI-CHUN, J.P. 1072 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 THE HONOURABLE CLAUDIA MO THE HONOURABLE MICHAEL TIEN PUK-SUN, B.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE STEVEN HO CHUN-YIN, B.B.S. THE HONOURABLE FRANKIE YICK CHI-MING, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WU CHI-WAI, M.H. THE HONOURABLE YIU SI-WING, B.B.S. THE HONOURABLE MA FUNG-KWOK, G.B.S., J.P THE HONOURABLE CHARLES PETER MOK, J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN HAN-PAN, B.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG CHE-CHEUNG, S.B.S., M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE KENNETH LEUNG* THE HONOURABLE ALICE MAK MEI-KUEN, B.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE KWOK KA-KI* THE HONOURABLE KWOK WAI-KEUNG, J.P. THE HONOURABLE DENNIS KWOK WING-HANG* THE HONOURABLE CHRISTOPHER CHEUNG WAH-FUNG, S.B.S., J.P. * According to the announcement made by the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region Government on 11 November 2020 pursuant to the Decision of the Standing Committee of the National People's Congress on Issues Relating to the Qualification of the Members of the Legislative Council of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region, Kenneth LEUNG, KWOK Ka-ki, Dennis KWOK Wing-hang and Alvin YEUNG were disqualified from being members of the Legislative Council on 30 July 2020. LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 1073 DR THE HONOURABLE FERNANDO CHEUNG CHIU-HUNG DR THE HONOURABLE HELENA WONG PIK-WAN THE HONOURABLE IP KIN-YUEN THE HONOURABLE MARTIN LIAO CHEUNG-KONG, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE POON SIU-PING, B.B.S., M.H. DR THE HONOURABLE CHIANG LAI-WAN, S.B.S., J.P. IR DR THE HONOURABLE LO WAI-KWOK, S.B.S., M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHUNG KWOK-PAN THE HONOURABLE ALVIN YEUNG* THE HONOURABLE ANDREW WAN SIU-KIN THE HONOURABLE JIMMY NG WING-KA, B.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE JUNIUS HO KWAN-YIU, J.P. THE HONOURABLE LAM CHEUK-TING THE HONOURABLE HOLDEN CHOW HO-DING THE HONOURABLE SHIU KA-FAI, J.P. THE HONOURABLE SHIU KA-CHUN THE HONOURABLE WILSON OR CHONG-SHING, M.H. * According to the announcement made by the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region Government on 11 November 2020 pursuant to the Decision of the Standing Committee of the National People's Congress on Issues Relating to the Qualification of the Members of the Legislative Council of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region, Kenneth LEUNG, KWOK Ka-ki, Dennis KWOK Wing-hang and Alvin YEUNG were disqualified from being members of the Legislative Council on 30 July 2020. 1074 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 THE HONOURABLE YUNG HOI-YAN, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE PIERRE CHAN THE HONOURABLE CHAN CHUN-YING, J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHEUNG KWOK-KWAN, J.P. THE HONOURABLE HUI CHI-FUNG THE HONOURABLE LUK CHUNG-HUNG, J.P. THE HONOURABLE LAU KWOK-FAN, M.H. THE HONOURABLE KENNETH LAU IP-KEUNG, B.B.S., M.H., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE CHENG CHUNG-TAI THE HONOURABLE KWONG CHUN-YU THE HONOURABLE JEREMY TAM MAN-HO THE HONOURABLE VINCENT CHENG WING-SHUN, M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE TONY TSE WAI-CHUEN, B.B.S., J.P. MEMBERS ABSENT: THE HONOURABLE JAMES TO KUN-SUN THE HONOURABLE MRS REGINA IP LAU SUK-YEE, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ELIZABETH QUAT, B.B.S., J.P. LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 1075 PUBLIC OFFICER ATTENDING: DR RAYMOND SO WAI-MAN, B.B.S., J.P. UNDER SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT AND HOUSING, AND SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT AND HOUSING CLERKS IN ATTENDANCE: MS ANITA SIT, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL MISS FLORA TAI YIN-PING, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL MR MATTHEW LOO, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL 1076 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 GOVERNMENT BILLS Second Reading of Government Bills Resumption of Second Reading Debate on Government Bill PRESIDENT (in Cantonese): We now resume the Second Reading debate on the Freight Containers (Safety) (Amendment) Bill 2019. Mr WU Chi-wai, please speak. FREIGHT CONTAINERS (SAFETY) (AMENDMENT) BILL 2019 Resumption of debate on Second Reading which was moved on 23 October 2019 (Mr LEUNG Yiu-chung indicated his wish to raise a point of order) PRESIDENT (in Cantonese): Mr LEUNG Yiu-chung, what is your point of order? MR LEUNG YIU-CHUNG (in Cantonese): I request a headcount. PRESIDENT (in Cantonese): Mr LEUNG Yiu-chung has requested a headcount. Will the Clerk please ring the bell to summon Members back to the Chamber. (After the summoning bell had been rung, a number of Members returned to the Chamber, but some Members did not return to their seats) PRESIDENT (in Cantonese): Will Members please return to their seats. Mr WU Chi-wai, please speak. LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 1077 MR WU CHI-WAI (in Cantonese): President, actually, the ultimate logic underlying the Freight Containers (Safety) (Amendment) Bill 2019 ("the Bill") is to standardize the requirements for testing and inspecting containers, as well as to prescribe the procedures of their maintenance, examination and control for safe transportation, in accordance with the ratified International Convention for Safe Containers ("the Convention"). All countries should, in truth, fulfil their joint responsibilities under the Convention to ensure consistency of all safety standards for international transport, thereby also ensuring that the basic requirements for maritime safety are met as a whole. However, as we see that it has taken so long for the Administration to get to today's legislative process since the adoption of the resolutions on the Convention in 2010 and 2012, it is certainly worth exploring the underlying causes. As Mr Frankie YICK also mentioned yesterday, this situation reflects that the Government often finds itself behind the curve when dealing with some provisions of international conventions that require our implementation and even in dealing with many issues of the transport industry. I do not feel necessary to describe in detail the crux of this phenomenon here, but objectively, the actual performance seems to reflect that the Government has neither done its best in managing the issues concerned, nor properly met the due diligence requirements, rendering it impossible for international agreements to be implemented in Hong Kong as soon as possible. I notice the Administration's indication in its paper that the delay in legislative amendment is not a problem, and the presented reasons actually rely very much on the fact that Hong Kong is an international city. Shipping activities often involve international interactions, but since other countries and regions have already implemented the Convention and international shipping companies have already fulfilled the new requirements, there will not be a big problem even if Hong Kong delays the legislative amendment. This logic is highly problematic indeed, because if we are to implement an international convention, of course the sooner the better, otherwise why should we be one of the signatory cities? This aside, let us take a look at Hong Kong's neighbours. Macao, for instance, incorporated the resolutions concerned into its legislation back in 2014. From this perspective, can we say that the Macao Government works more efficiently and effectively than the Hong Kong Government? This argument is untenable. We should not forget either that the Transport and Housing Bureau ("THB") set up a task force to deal with marine legislation back in 2014 and one supernumerary post of Deputy Principal Government Counsel 1078 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ― 5 November 2020 was created to steer the work from 2014 to 2019. However, the problem of backlog in maritime legislation remains unresolved. I very much hope that the Secretary, while listening to Members' views here, contemplates what has really happened. Would the fundamental problem be that THB already has an enormous workload itself, so much so that even though this is its duty, it still accords a lower priority to dealing with the problem, thus allowing the problem to drag on for 8 or even 10 years and still remain unresolved? In fact, we still have the Merchant Shipping (Limitation of Liability for Carriage of Passengers and Luggage by Sea) Bill in the pipeline. The relevant convention was amended back in 2002 but it will not be dealt with until next year. Does this clearly reflect a default in obligations and a lack of diligence on the part of the authorities in dealing with the relevant issues? The Government should seriously review whether it is best to place all maritime legislation under the purview of THB. Should it re-examine the relevant work arrangements, considering that they involve one of the quite important pillars of Hong Kong, namely logistics, as well as issues relating to international freight and passenger transport? If all these issues are left to THB and the Bureau takes them half-heartedly, it will have an impact on the future and economy of the whole society of Hong Kong, and for that matter, the advancement of shipping policy.