Interview What David did next After seven years as the UK government’s chief scientific adviser, chemist David King is still fighting to keep climate change at the top of the political agenda. Richard Van Noorden meets him Ask scientists who has been ‘We’re now centre of Oxford,’ he explains, influence in getting the subject so most responsible for making UK referring to the Foresight high on the UK government agenda. politicians pay attention to the seeing an programmes he established while ‘Coming into government from science of climate change, and enormous advising government, where the university sector was certainly many would nominate Sir David ministers were encouraged to leave a very steep learning curve,’ he says. King – from 2000–2007, the widely effort into aside short-term political interests ‘Nobody should ever underestimate respected chief scientific adviser of the biggest and scan a longer-term horizon to the problem of keeping science, and Tony Blair’s Labour government. tackle societal issues from flooding an understanding of what science can After seven years ensuring that challenge of our to obesity. deliver, on the government’s agenda’. policy-makers had access to the best time’ ‘And instead of being marginalised Among King’s successes were the science, the South African-born in a single department, we will agreement that each government chemist has time to reflect on his get climate change mainstreamed department has its own scientific experiences now he has returned to … there will be lecturers in adviser, and he also played a large the relative freedom of academia. But environmental politics, philosophy, part in influencing the current he is also transferring his political economics, engineering and so on strategy of encouraging innovation. skills to a new project. around the university,’ King says. ‘I Still spending one day a week want to see climate issues become Climate vision working with his surface science part of the DNA of every cell of King is very clear on what has to research group at the University of Oxford University.’ be done to tackle climate change. Cambridge, King is heading up the It’s an ambitious project, and Atmospheric levels of carbon dioxide Smith School of Enterprise and the King will have to be cautious of not (and equivalent greenhouse gases) Environment, in Oxford: a newly- encroaching on other environmental have to stabilise at 450 parts per formed institute hoping to raise about work going on in the university. But million by the end of the century, he £80 million to become a worldwide he is used to diplomatically corralling says. ‘This is a very radical agenda. hub attracting academics and diverse groups of people together We must emit no more than the private investors to work on climate – as his success as chief scientific average Indian is emitting today problems. adviser shows. Now it is unthinkable – two tonnes of carbon dioxide per ‘I’m trying to bring a kind of for policy-makers not to care about person per annum; at the moment Foresight-like operation into the climate change, but King was a major Europe is at 11 or 12.’ 58 | Chemistry World | July 2008 www.chemistryworld.org Whether governments and because it forces manufacturers and ‘I want to see opportunities which haven’t been investors will agree to what’s investors to prioritise climate issues. grasped: the UK seams of coal, such required to meet this objective The EU scheme of trading permits climate change as those in North Wales, which are no depends strongly on the UN climate to emit greenhouse gases similarly become part longer capable of being mined but can summit in Copenhagen, in December provides a financial incentive to limit use underground coal gasification, 2009, where a new treaty to replace carbon emissions. of the DNA are potentially quite large and it Kyoto will be hammered out. King But despite King’s – and other of every cell would be marvellous to have that as is on the Copenhagen climate scientists’ – advocacy to politicians a demonstration project with carbon committee. of what technology can contribute, of Oxford capture back into the underground How’s it going to be done? King governments don’t always pursue University’ caverns.’ supports a wide and sensible range the policies that scientists advise. Nor is he short of advice on of options, including a shift in King says there have been ‘a number the much-criticised US drive to personal attitudes to energy saving, of disappointments’ in the UK’s encourage ethanol production from and of remembering to adapt to a development of carbon capture corn. ‘The provenance of bioethanol changing world. What marks him – the cancellation of BP’s proposed is the issue. Europe could change its out from other climate campaigners project in Peterhead, Scotland, and policy by saying that fuel from maize is his particularly strong support for the slowness with which the country [corn] doesn’t meet our definition new technologies: he advocates the moved to choose a test project. ‘And Sir David King of low carbon, and I think that’s the development of GM crops, nuclear there are other only real way forward – beyond effort power, and capturing and storing in converting cellulosic products CO2, for example. into fuel, though that is not in the For chemists looking to contribute, marketplace yet.’ King says the most important need is to improve the energy efficiency Now that I’m gone of the chemical industry. But at Still, surveying the state of UK the research level, he hopes science after his departure, King alternatives can be found thinks it’s in pretty good order. to construction materials ‘There’s more money in the science such as cement and steel base and a massive investment in that wouldn’t need high laboratories. We have seen a rebirth temperatures or produce of science in the UK on a very big large amounts of CO2. ‘And scale and other countries look at us what would the world look with some envy,’ he says. like if we had plastic and Despite a commitment to ceramic photovoltaics – if listening to scientific advice, every architect made sure that however, spending on research the outside of every building was commissioned by government covered in a photovoltaic material departments has dropped over that was attractive but efficient at the last few years, King admits: making energy out of sunlight?’ ‘I have to take that on the chin. King’s own research group at I think it was an accidental Cambridge, which has around 20 scientists working on the chemistry and physics of surfaces, always has an eye to practical applications – such as developing catalysts for producing biofuels in a zero-carbon cycle. The team often works with private sector companies such as Johnson Matthey, Shell and BP. How does King find the time to keep up with the instrumentation and fundamental theory that his group develops? He leaves most of the work to colleague Stephen Jenkins, he says: ‘I’m the wise old person who turns up on Fridays and goes to the seminars, but I still spend time with each of the research students.’ Regulation, regulation, regulation The key to getting any technologies from bench to industry is government regulation, says King, www.chemistryworld.org Chemistry World | July 2008 | 59 Interview BARRY CROSSLEY / ISTOCKPHOTOS / CROSSLEY BARRY process.’ has announced that the volume King is heading up the well-intentioned aim of guiding He says that, when they are of investigator-led funding it can the Smith School of science to concentrate on tackling managing tight budgets, government support will drop by 12–15 per cent. Enterprise and the problems such as climate change departments tend to make cuts across But King stoutly defends the Environment in Oxford resulted in too much regulation of the board rather than protect high science settlement. ‘What we’re academic research? priority areas. ‘If you look at the actually talking about is the ‘We haven’t yet seen an analysis state of the government’s Pirbright distribution and the management of of whether scientists are getting laboratory [which researches farm the cake, not the size. And I’m one funding for what they actually want animal diseases], which started of those who thinks tough decisions to do, or whether they are being the 2007 foot and mouth epidemic have to be made. The priorities pushed into what they don’t want to through a leakage, it’s very clear of the 21st century are different do. I would be surprised if it turns that should have had a substantial from the priorities of the late 20th out UK scientists are pushed by their upgrade – if not been turned to century. Historical budgets, governments more than others,’ says rubble and replaced. So there’s been and the distribution of King. ‘The bottom line is, it’s very some cost-cutting that has not been money within and difficult. Does there have to be productive, and I hope my successor between research a choice between finding the manages better than I did on that.’ councils, shouldn’t next fundamental particle The coverage of last year’s science be engraved in by building a bigger and budget for 2008–11 painted a gloomy stone.’ He won’t more expensive successor picture of mismanagement and harsh comment to Cern, versus putting funding settlements. Physicists on whether money and the best are worst affected: in December the STFC brains into tackling 2007 an £80 million shortfall was mismanaged its environmental issues? I discovered in the budget of the funds this time think that’s a debate that Science and Technology Facilities around.