The Association of Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Project EDMUND McWILLIAMS Interviewed by: Charles Stuart Kennedy Initial interview date: December 1, 2005 Copyri ht 2007 ADST TABLE OF CONTENTS Background Born and raised in hode Island University of hode Island, Ohio University US Army, Vietnam Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) Entered the Foreign Service, 1975 ,amp Pendleton, ,A- Indochina efugee Program 1975.1976 Placing refugees throughout the US 0on.1overnment Organi2ations (01O3s) Vientiane, 4aos- Political Officer 1976.1978 Other Agency representation Tom ,ochran Pathet 4ao 4aos and Vietnamese relationship Soviets US 6IA3s Environment Diplomatic representation elations State Department- 4aos7 ,ambodia7Vietnam Desk Officer 1978.1980 elations U0 Delegations :hmer ouge government efugees ,hinese invasion of Vietnam 6onitoring events in Vietnam 6IA3s Vietnamese invasion of ,ambodia Soviet reaction to ,hinese invasion 1 Bangkok, Thailand- Indochina Watch Officer 1980.1982 Yellow ain Sihanouk and :hmer ouge Hmong Hanoi leadership7Viet ,ong relationship efugees 01O3s Boat People 6IA3s State Department, FSI- ussian language training 1982.1983 6oscow, Soviet Union- Political Officer 1983.1985 Publication and language programs Soviet leaders Dissidents and efusenicks Environment Signs of foment Jews Infrastructure Soviet travel :1B State Department, FSI- Dari (Afghan) language training 1985.1986 Dari relationship to Farsi and Tajik :abul, Afghanistan- Acting Deputy ,hief of 6ission 1986.1988 Soviet occupation Official relationship 6ilitary activity3 Soviet objectives Stinger assessment Pakistan Information sources Environment 6ujahideen 4ocal views of Soviets Embassy operations Post Soviet thinking ,hinese Foreign diplomatic presence Iranians ug merchants ed ,ross 0ajibullah 2 Islamabad, Pakistan- Special Envoy 1988.1989 6ujaheddin presence in Auetta Inter.Service Strategic Intelligence (ISI) Bena2ir Bhutto 1eneral Bia Hamid :ar2ai Osama bin 4aden Stingers to Iran ,onflict with Embassy eport to Assistant Secretary 6urphy Jalalabad venture Operational obstructions Press reports Embassy3s devastating report State Department- FSI- Spanish language training 1989 6anagua, Nicaragua- Political ,ounselor7D,6 1989.1992 US policy Violetta ,hamorro elations Sandinistas Economy Election analysis The Ortega brothers ,ongressional interest Atrocities reporting US AID ed Eye 6issiles ,atholic ,hurch Vice President Auayle visit 6iami Nicaraguans 1overnment Bishkek, :yrgy2stan- ,harge d3Affaires, a.i. 1992 Setting up a new Embassy operation Environment eporting ,risis elations ussians Dushanbe, Tajikistan- ,harge d3Affaires, a.i. 1992.1994 Setting up a new Embassy operation Unrest Ambassador arrives 3 Establishing relations Iranian backed Islamists takeover Turk role in US policy ussian presence 6inorities Islamic fundamentalism Tribal rivalry Evacuation 01O3s Superior Honor Award 4ocal Staff Diplomat in esidence, University of New 6eEico 1994.1995 Assessment Development of course in ,entral Asian History State Department3 FSI- Bahasa language study 1995 ,omments on Afghanistan and U.S. policy 1995 Djakarta, Indonesia- Political ,ounselor 1996.1999 Human rights and corruption 6ilitary relationship Dissent Suharto egime Economy ,hinese 01O3s eporting Environment AID East Timor Islam US Policy 1rowth of terrorism Indonesian elite iots Habibie ,ongressional interest Foreign embassy intelligence capabilities eferendum Indonesian military 6ilitias The iattis State Department- Director, Intl. 4abor and Human ights 1999.2001 4 US 4abor Policy ole of 4abor in diplomacy 0AFTA Worker rights in Trade Agreements African 1rowth and Opportunity Act (A1OA) Human ights and labor ole of N1O3s AF43s Solidarity ,enter Trafficking in people ,ongressional interest World Trade Organi2ation AF4.,IO elations with US Embassies etirement 2001 ,omments on Secretaries of State Travels and writing Indonesia INTERVIEW $: Today is December 1, 2005. This is an interview with Edward Mc(illiams. 6,WI44IA6S: Edmund, actually. $: Edmund. Edmund Mc(illiams. M-C-(-I-L-L-I-A-M-S. And you go by Ed or? 6,WI44IA6S: Ed3s fine. $: Ed. And this is bein done on behalf of the Association for Diplomatic Studies. And I-m Charles Stuart Kennedy. Ed, let-s start at the be innin . (hen and where were you born? 6,WI44IA6S: I was born February 18, 1947 in Providence, hode Island. $: ./ay. Now, tell me somethin about, let-s tal/ about your family on your, let-s do the father-s side. 6,WI44IA6S: 6y father. $: And bac/ as far as, you /now, give an idea where they all came from. 5 6,WI44IA6S: Alright. Old Irish immigrant stock. ,ame over in the late 1800s. 6y dad had been a mill worker all his life and at the age. $: How about your grandfather? Do you /now? 6,WI44IA6S: 6y grandfather was a mill worker also, teEtile mills in New England. $: And both were te2tiles? 6,WI44IA6S: That3s right. 6y grandfather died Guite early of a heart attack. I never met him, died in the H30s. 6y father had a heart attack at the age of 47 and was what they call a heart cripple for the rest of his life, so. $: (ould you put this to mill wor/ in the-? 6,WI44IA6S: Well, it was, I think to some eEtent mill work. And we were not wealthy. He worked very hard, worked double jobs and so on to keep us going. And in those days diet was not very good but also genetics on his side were not good- his father had died at 54 of a heart condition. But as a result my mother had to go back to work in her middle 50s. And so it was a very good family. I had a twin brother and we3re both fairly academically oriented, principally because of my father, who although he only went as far as the eighth grade was very well read and very interested in public affairs and current affairs. He had volunteered to serve in World War II Guite late in life (he was 33) and I think that gave him a great interest in the world and he tried to convey that to us, both my brother and I, and I think as a conseGuence I became very interested in international affairs. $: (ell, where did your father serve, do you /now? 6,WI44IA6S: He was in what they called the ,hina.Burma.India Theatre. $: .h yes. 6,WI44IA6S: And spent a lot of time in India but also was in bombing missions into ,hina, over Burma and so on. ,ame back with a Silver Star and Distinguished Flying ,ross. $: .h boy. That was a very difficult thin , flyin over the hump. 6,WI44IA6S: EEactly, flying the hump, that3s right. $: .h yes, very much so, that was- (hat about your mother and her side of the family? 6,WI44IA6S: She was old Yankee stock. The family actually, on her side, goes back to Plymouth ock and the Pilgrims through several lines. But basically what they used to call Swamp Yankee, which is the old New England Yankee farmers and it was an 6 unusual arrangement because my father3s side, of course, is very ,atholic, being Irish, and my mother3s side is very Protestant and in neither family had ever, there had never been an inter.religious marriage so that was a bit of a problem because there was a Guestion as to whether my brother would be raised ,atholic or Protestant and it created some family tensions but. $: (ell, you were twins, couldn-t they compromise? 6,WI44IA6S: Well, that would have been one way to approach it, I suppose, but in any event that was. it was interesting because I grew up in a, very much a ,atholic neighborhood, a French ,atholic, again, the old mill towns, teEtile mills. I worked in the teEtile mills myself between college, in my high school summers and then early college years. $: It-s hard to thin/ of doin wor/ in te2tile mills in the modern conte2t because- 6,WI44IA6S: Yes, it3s all gone, it3s all gone. $: They-ve all moved south. 6,WI44IA6S: That3s right. Or to ,hina. $: .r to China or stuff li/e that. (ell, what, you were born and where did you live? 6,WI44IA6S: I lived in rural hode Island, up in the, as they used to say, the sticks, up in the corner of hode Island between ,onnecticut and 6assachusetts on essentially old farmland but, as I say, most of the village had become, this is the village of 6ohegan, had become a teEtile village and in the late 19th, early 20th centuries a lot of the French ,anadians had moved into that area, it had previously been Yankee predominantly but it was a very French ,anadian neighborhood to the eEtent that some of the older people could not speak English and you3d go down the sidewalks and so on and people would be speaking French, not English. It was Guite interesting. $: Did you grow up there? 6,WI44IA6S: I grew up there and then went off to school. And then once I had gone to school I continued to consider that my home. Indeed, I still vote back in hode Island but basically only visits and holidays and so on. $: (ell, let-s tal/ about the town. (hat was it li/e growin up as a /id, this bein the 340s and 350s? 6,WI44IA6S: Well, it was something of a rural town. The mills were dying and it was essentially a country town. 6ost of my classmates in high school and of course in 7 grammar school came very much from the same background I came from. Their parents would have worked in the mills and indeed in the H50s were still working in the mills. Every single village in the town had a major mill in it- indeed the villages were built around these mills and that was the culture, really, it was very much a mill culture. $: How about as a /id? Particularly interested as a small /id6 what was it li/e? 6,WI44IA6S: It was a good childhood. The school was just about a mile from the house.