Speakeasy with Denene: Freedom Denene Millner: Welcome to Speakeasy with Denene, a podcast from Georgia PuBlic Broadcasting. I'm your host, Denene Millner. Each episode of Speakeasy focuses on a one-word topic, and we dive into the many ways it affects the African American community. On this episode, the topic is freedom. Just a note, you'll [00:00:30] hear some explicit music on today's show that absolutely is not suited for little ears. Denene Millner: On Speakeasy with Denene, I'm introducing you to my two daughters, Lilia and Mari. Now that they're older, my lessons are less mom to daughter instruction, and more woman-to-woman, heart-to-heart discussions. I've been talking to them a lot about freedom, specifically what it means to be a free, Black woman in a society that goes out of its way to tell us what to do and how to be, all while [00:01:00] holding its foot on our necks. I want my girls to know that they have the freedom to decide what they wanna do, how to do it, and who they want to give their energy to, and especially that they have the right to color all outside the lines. Denene Millner: This is a lesson I'm just starting to learn myself as a newly single woman, living on my own for the first time in more than two decades. That word is so incredibly important to me that I actually had the word free tattooed on my [00:01:30] wrist. It's a constant reminder that my capacity to love, work hard, and have empathy must extend to myself first. Outcast: (singing): There's a fine line between love and hate you see Came way too late but baby I'm on it Denene Millner: I have the freedom to do what's right for me, what feels good to me, and to be strong in my insistence that I care for and about myself, in a way that is deeply [00:02:00] gratifying, in a way that makes me happy, no matter what anyone else has to say about it. Outcast: (singing) Can't worry bout, what a nigga think now see That's Liberation and baby I want it Denene Millner: OutKast had it right in their hit LiBeration, which is the centerpiece of my freedom songs playlist. Outcast: (singing) 1 Can't worry bout, what another nigga think Now that's Liberation and baby I want it [00:02:30] Denene Millner: That's the ultimate freedom right there. We're going to Break format today and spend our entire episode with one guest. This is someone who uses his voice to elevate the conversation of freedom in a Big way. [00:03:00] Killer Mike: (singing) The end of the Reagan Era, I'm like number twelver Old enough to understand the shit'll change forever They declared the war on drugs like a war on terror But what it really did was let the police terrorize whoever But mostly black boys, but they would call us "niggas" And lay us on our belly, while they fingers on they triggers Denene Millner: That's Atlanta based artist, Michael Render, known as Killer Mike. With rapper and producer El-P, Mike is one half of the group, Run The Jewels. The song you're hearing is Reagan, released on Mike's 2012 alBum, R.A.P. Music, which El- P produced. The R.A.P. in the title stands for Rebellious African People. [00:03:30 ] Killer Mike: (singing) Involuntary servitude and slavery it prohibits That's why they giving drug offenders time in double digits Ronald Reagan was an actor, not at all a factor Denene Millner: Killer Mike has Been a vocal defender of the free speech in rap music, which has been challenged in the courts. In 2019, he joined an amicus brief in a case involving Pennsylvania rapper Jamal Knox, who was convicted for threatening police in one of his songs. In 2012, Knox and another rapper wrote a song after the pair had been arrested on gun and drug charges. One of the lyrics is, "Let's [00:04:00] kill these cops 'cause they don't do us no good." Denene Millner: The song identifies the arresting officers by name. Both of the men behind the song were criminally charged and sentenced to prison. Now, Jamal Knox argued they were protected by the First Amendment. A chorus of artists, including Killer Mike, urged the U.S. Supreme Court to take up the case. The High Court declined. Mike says Jamal's rights were violated. Killer Mike: He used his voice, Because a lot of times, you get angry, you just need to go in a [00:04:30] room and yell, to protest, and in it, he named a cop. Now, what are the chances 2 that this boy can really track down a cop and find him, and kill him? But still, he was prosecuted, and- and- and- and in jail, so right now, if you're a famous rapper, if you're Killer Mike, you can make a song like Reagan, and not really much worry aBout prosecution. Killer Mike: But if you're a kid just from around the corner and you make a song that the government decides for whatever reason, they don't like, you can be [00:05:00] prosecuted. You can be put in jail. And, um, I fear things like hate speech laws. I fear things like politically correct laws, Because what they do is give you a prettier cage to be put in. Denene Millner: I spoke with Killer Mike at his Atlanta barber shop called, The Swag Shop. He co- owns it with his wife, Shay. The concept of freedom weighs heavily on Mike, every day. Killer Mike: You're 55 years into freedom. Denene Millner: Mm-hmm (affirmative). [00:05:30] You are 55 years into the experiment that America promised. That means that, Killer Mike: um, freedom is only 11 years older than me. And I do not trust anyth- any RepuBlic to take care of me Better than me. Denene Millner: No. Killer Mike: Now you can recognize my human rights, you can recognize my constitutional rights, but you cannot take better care of me than my family. Denene Millner: Right. Killer Mike: No one can take Better care of me than my grandparents did. Denene Millner: Right. Killer Mike: No one can feed me, naturally off the earth like my grandfather did. No one can defend my household like my grandfather did. And if I don't live up to that standard, then I am not the man he raised me to be. [00:06:00] Denene Millner: Right. Talk to me about hip hop and how freedom works with the music that you've created- Killer Mike: Yup. Denene Millner: ... the sounds that you've created, the words that you say, in- in that music, 'cause I grew up in a era- 3 Killer Mike: Yeah. Denene Millner: ... I'm 50. Killer Mike: Yeah. Denene Millner: I grew up in a era- Killer Mike: Oh, man. Denene Millner: ... where- Killer Mike: Look here, Black don't crack for real, man. Denene Millner: (laughs) Killer Mike: I would have guessed you for 30 something. Denene Millner: (laughs) I'm 50. Killer Mike: It's a blessing. Denene Millner: And I was there, as a journalist, when they were running over, you know, tape cassettes- Killer Mike: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Denene Millner: ... with bulldozers- Killer Mike: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. [crosstalk 00:06:24]. Denene Millner: White folks were doing that. Killer Mike: Tipper Gore shouts out- Denene Millner: Right. ABsolutely. Killer Mike: ... to C. DeLores Tucker- Denene Millner: And C. DeLores Tucker- Killer Mike: Yeah. Um- Denene Millner: And the NAACP- [00:06:30] 4 Killer Mike: Oh, God- [crosstalk 00:06:30]. Denene Millner: ... was out there. Because [crosstalk 00:06:31]- Killer Mike: ... but I get it wrong, so many times. Denene Millner: So, talk to me about how- about the growth- Killer Mike: The same people- Denene Millner: Because there is growth. Killer Mike: ... that had- that had heralded themselves as revolutionaries and standing next to Dr King, and standing next to people supporting like, um, the SCLC, were the same people that once in authority became oppressors of freedom of speech, because they didn't like the fact that rappers cursed or talked sexually explicit, or said things that they didn't agree with. Some of these people are just charlatans. [00:07:00] I didn't- you know, I knew Reverend James Orange, you know, he never spoke of this- you know, talking to me in terms of, sometimes acting on the campaign like, James Orange was such a wonderful man. He didn't like my name, Killer Mike, he called all young Black men leader. He refused to call me Killer. But he never would call for a censorship of me. He never would have said, "This kid shouldn't ha- have this name." I didn't even name myself that. Um ... I saw freedom of speech challenged and defended by Luther Campbell. Luther Campbell: (singing) Don't stop pop that pussy Let me see you doo doo brown [00:07:30] Denene Millner: Luther Campbell, aka Uncle Luke, was a controversial rapper and producer, out of Miami. He was known for hits like, I Wanna Rock. Luther Campbell: (singing) I wanna, I wanna, I wanna I wanna rock my man… Heeeey, we want some puuusssy (Heeeey, we want some puuusssy) Let me hear you say, "Heeeey, we want some D.I.C.K" Denene Millner: As the leader of the rap group 2 Live Crew, Uncle Luke created explicit and [00:08:00] sexually charged music that sparked nationwide protest from the likes of Tipper Gore, the wife of former U.S.