5243 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL Wednesday 25 September 2002 ______ The President (The Hon. Dr Meredith Burgmann) took the chair at 11.00 a.m. The President offered the Prayers. DISTINGUISHED VISITORS The PRESIDENT: I welcome into the President's gallery the Ambassador for The Netherlands, Dr Hans Sondaal, and Mrs Els Sondaal and the Consul General of The Netherlands, Madelien de Planque. FARM DEBT MEDIATION AMENDMENT BILL CRIMES (ADMINISTRATION OF SENTENCES) FURTHER AMENDMENT BILL AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY SERVICES AMENDMENT (INTERSTATE ARRANGEMENTS) BILL Bills received and read a first time. Motion by the Hon. Michael Egan agreed to: That standing orders be suspended to allow the passing of the bills through all is remaining stages during the present or any one sitting of the House. LAND AND ENVIRONMENT COURT AMENDMENT BILL Message received from the Legislative Assembly agreeing to the Legislative Council's amendments. AUDIT OFFICE Report The President tabled, in accordance with the Public Finance and Audit Act 1983, the performance audit report entitled "e-government: Electronic Procurement of Hospital Supplies" dated September 2002. Ordered to be printed. TABLING OF PAPERS The Hon. Carmel Tebbutt tabled the following papers: (1) Bank Mergers (Application of Laws) Act 1996—Treasurer's Report on the Statutory Five Year Review, dated September 2002. (2) Bank Mergers Act 1996—Treasurer's Report on the Statutory Report on the Statutory Five Year Review, dated September 2002. Ordered to be printed. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE Withdrawal of Business Business of the House Notice of Motion No. 1, withdrawn by the Hon. Richard Jones. 5244 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL 25 September 2002 BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE Suspension of Standing and Sessional Orders Motion by the Hon. Michael Egan agreed to: That standing and sessional orders be suspended to allow a motion to be moved forthwith that Private Members' Business Item No. 97 outside the Order of Precedence relating to pecuniary interests of Mr Obeid be called on forthwith. Order of Business Motion by the Hon. Michael Egan agreed to: That Private Members' Business Item No. 97 outside the Order of Precedence be called on forthwith. MINISTER FOR MINERAL RESOURCES, AND MINISTER FOR FISHERIES PECUNIARY INTEREST DISCLOSURE The Hon. GREG PEARCE [11.09 a.m.]: I move: 1. That this House notes the requirements of section 14A (1) of the Constitution Act 1902 and the Constitution (Disclosures by Members) Regulation 1983 for Members to disclose the following pecuniary interests or other matters: (a) real property (b) sources of income (c) gifts (d) contributions to travel (e) interests and positions in corporations (f) positions in trade unions and professions or business associations (g) debts (h) dispositions of property, and (i) discretionary disclosures, and that the requirement for lodgment of a return with the Clerk before the prescribed date in each year is absolute and not subject to revision or supplementary returns. 2. That this House further notes section 14A (2) of the Constitution Act 1902 which states: (2) If a Member of either House of Parliament wilfully contravenes any regulation made under subsection (1), that House may, in accordance with subsection (3), declare his seat vacant and the seat of the Member shall thereupon become vacant. 3. That this House is of the opinion that it was misled by the Honourable Edward Moses Obeid, in his response to various questions without notice directed to him about his pecuniary interests returns, when he stated, among other things: (a) "…Since I became a minister I have had no active part in any professional practice or in any business."—Letter to Premier in Hansard, 8 September 1999, p. 64, (b) "…my pecuniary interests of 1999 stand."—Hansard, 29 August 2000, p. 8392, (c) "I have complied with the requirements of my pecuniary register every year."—Hansard, 31 August 2000, p. 8555, (d) "My pecuniary interests are well in order…"—Hansard, 5 September 9 2000, p. 8602 (e) "…I have answered enough questions on my pecuniary interests. They are there for everyone to see. They comply with the requirements of the Constitution…"— Hansard, 31 October 2000, p. 9331, (f) "…Anything I have to say about my pecuniary interests is well recorded. Any time that I feel it should be corrected, I have done so."— Hansard proof, 18 September 2002, p. 16. 4. That this House notes that in letters to the Clerk dated 3 and 17 September 2002 the Honourable Edward Moses Obeid, Minister for Mineral Resources and Minister for Fisheries, has admitted that he made errors and omissions in his pecuniary interests returns and has made further declarations in relation to his interests and positions in various corporations in his primary return and ordinary returns for the years 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996 and 1999. 5. That this House notes that the Honourable Edward Moses Obeid, Minister for Mineral Resources and Minister for Fisheries, may have contravened the requirements of clause 12 of the Constitution (Disclosures by Members) Regulation 1983, by failing to disclose in various primary and ordinary returns lodged with the Clerk by 1 October each year, his interests and positions in the following corporations: 25 September 2002 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL 5245 (a) Linkban Pty Limited (b) 15 Garners Avenue (No. 2) Pty Limited (c) Sydney Shout Pty Limited (d) Beirut Sydney Publishing Pty Limited (e) Riovale Pty Limited (f) Metrona Pastoral Pty Limited (g) 15 Garners Avenue (No. 3) Pty Limited (h) Oceanline Constructions Pty Limited (i) Hafomo Pty Limited (j) Media Corporation Pty Limited (k) 15 Garners Avenue (No. 1) Pty Limited (l) Southpac Pty Limited (m) Brinba (or Maxicon Group) Pty Limited (n) Southpac Holdings Pty Limited (o) Pondzsash Pty Limited (p) Oceania Export & Import Co Pty Limited (q) Moona Plains Pastoral Pty Limited (r) Redpoc Pty Limited (s) Cecourt Pty Limited (t) Keltham Pty Limited (u) Jensay Pty Limited (v) Olympia Group Pty Limited (w) Max Cutting Pty Limited (x) Law Foundation Superannuation Nominees Pty Limited (y) South Sydney Leagues Club (z) Rainbow Pacific Pty Limited (aa) Ashglide Pty Limited (bb) Detuca Pty Limited (cc) Jetset Constructions Pty Limited. 6. That the Standing Committee on Parliamentary Privilege and Ethics investigate and report on: (a) whether, under section 14A (2) of the Constitution Act 1902, the Honourable Edward Obeid, Minister for Mineral Resources and Minister for Fisheries, has wilfully contravened the requirements of clause 12 of the Constitution (Disclosures by Members) Regulation 1983 by failing to disclose any pecuniary interest as required under the Regulation, (b) what, if any, sanctions should be enforced in relation to the conduct of the Honourable Edward Obeid, Minister for Mineral Resources and Minister for Fisheries, in this matter, and (c) whether the provisions of the Constitution (Disclosures by Members) Regulation 1983 should be amended to provide for the provision of supplementary or amended disclosures by members. 7. That the Committee have power to take evidence, and to send for persons, papers, records and things. 8. That leave be given to members and officers of the Legislative Council to appear and give evidence to the Committee in relation to the inquiry. 9. That the Committee report in relation to paragraph 4 (a) and (b) by Thursday 31 October 2002. It gives me no joy to be forced to move this motion today. The Constitution Act of this State requires that members disclose their pecuniary interests. I did not write the Constitution. The Hon. Michael Egan: Did Mr Brogden write it? The Hon. GREG PEARCE: Treasurer, have some dignity. This is a serious matter and it should be treated seriously. I am endeavouring to treat it seriously and the Treasurer should also treat it seriously, although I know he is off his game, The relevant provision in the Constitution Act was inserted in 1981 and the regulation was made in 1983, so it has been on the books for a great deal of time and people know what it says. Bob Carr, when Leader of the Opposition, said: We have a legally binding official register entrenched in the Constitution. As has been noted, that obligation makes disclosures absolute. There is no provision for amendment or supplementary returns, there is no penalty for inadvertent errors. It is the case that members may make genuine errors and inadvertent errors, but clearly the draftsmen of this constitutional provision did not regard that possibility with great concern. The draftsmen were concerned about the very position we are now facing, of a wilful, false disclosure or failure to disclose. In that case the penalty is a very serious one: expulsion of the member by this House. That is a very serious consequence for a very serious breach of parliamentary obligations of transparency and accountability. These issues go to public confidence in the integrity of the parliamentary and political system and, in particular, of Ministers. This is indeed serious. This matter has been brought before the House because the 5246 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL 25 September 2002 Premier has failed to take any action. This issue is a reflection on the Carr Government's disregard for the Westminster system and the parliamentary process and it provides another example of the Government's lack of accountability and arrogance. Before I proceed to some of the details of this motion, I point out that the motion has been drafted to avoid any suggestion of ambush of the member by setting out in detail the breaches complained of. Reverend the Hon. Fred Nile would understand that we have gone about this by the correct process of a substantive motion and have put on the table all of the facts and concerns that we have to ensure that the member was not ambushed. The Opposition is treating this matter seriously and is making sure that it can be debated properly.