Tuesday Volume 685 1 December 2020 No. 144 HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) Tuesday 1 December 2020 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2020 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 135 1 DECEMBER 2020 136 House of Commons Ineligibility for Covid-19 Financial Support JessicaMorden(NewportEast)(Lab):Whatrepresentations Tuesday 1 December 2020 he has received from organisations representing people who are ineligible for covid-19 financial support schemes; and if he will make a statement. [909585] The House met at half-past Eleven o’clock Chris Elmore (Ogmore) (Lab): What representations he has received from organisations representing people PRAYERS who are ineligible for covid-19 financial support schemes; and if he will make a statement. [909587] [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] PaulBlomfield(SheffieldCentral)(Lab):Whatrepresentations Virtual participation in proceedings commenced (Order, he has received from organisations representing people 4 June). who are ineligible for covid-19 financial support schemes; [NB: [V] denotes a Member participating virtually.] and if he will make a statement. [909606] AfzalKhan(Manchester,Gorton)(Lab):Whatrepresentations he has received from organisations representing people Oral Answers to Questions who are ineligible for covid-19 financial support schemes; and if he will make a statement. [909613] RachelHopkins(LutonSouth)(Lab):Whatrepresentations TREASURY he has received from organisations representing people who are ineligible for covid-19 financial support schemes; The Chancellor of the Exchequer was asked— and if he will make a statement. [909616] Universal Basic Income The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Rishi Sunak): Before I start, I know that Members from around the House Ronnie Cowan (Inverclyde) (SNP): Whether he has will join me in commemorating World AIDS Day and had discussions with Cabinet colleagues on the potential the many organisations that make this day happen. As merits of introducing a universal basic income to support we remember those we have lost to HIV and AIDS, we economic recovery following the covid-19 outbreak. also remind ourselves of the need for further action. I [909584] am proud that this Conservative Government’s policy is to end new HIV transmission by 2030—a commitment The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Steve Barclay): reaffirmed today at the launch of the HIV commission. Wehave supported those on the lowest incomes throughout Throughout this crisis, the Government’s economic this crisis by investing more than £7 billion in the priority has been to protect jobs, livelihoods, businesses welfare system, and we are focused on helping people to and public services, and we have spent more than get into work by making up to £30 billion available £280 billion in doing so. through our plans for jobs. Jessica Morden [V]: Given that the Chancellor has Ronnie Cowan [V]: Councils throughout England, accepted that the job retention scheme and the self-employed Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland have asked for income support scheme need to be in place until March, support to run basic-income pilots, designed to increase does he think it is right that those who have fallen our knowledge of the pros and cons of basic income. through the gaps in those schemes—highlighted by the Five hundred and twenty elected politicians from across Federation of Small Businesses—will have been without the UK sent a letter to the Chancellor on this subject support for an entire year by then? Why have Ministers and got a frankly derisory response. Does the Chancellor not had the decency to meet groups such as ExcludedUK? honestly believe that he knows everything there is to know about a basic income and would not learn from such pilots? If he does not, will he back the basic-income Rishi Sunak: My right hon. Friend the Financial pilots and let us learn together and make evidence-based Secretary is meeting that group and other Members, policy? and I and other members of my team have met various representatives of the self-employed and other employed Steve Barclay: I am happy to learn from the 2017 people who would like to make representations. It is fair Work and Pensions Committee report that said it was to say that I do not agree with the idea that those people have been excluded: the Government have provided support “difficult to see how”— in many different ways to many people in different a universal basic income— circumstances. We remain committed to that support “would substantially alleviate poverty”, throughout this crisis. or from the OECD, which said that a universal basic income could “increase poverty” and negatively affect Chris Elmore: Surely the Chancellor can understand the poorest. If the hon. Gentleman is putting forward that these people do not have any money—they have this proposal, he should set out what the specific amount not benefited from the Government schemes that Members is. I note that to date the SNP has refused to do that. from all parties welcome. How can it be that the Musicians’ 137 Oral Answers 1 DECEMBER 2020 Oral Answers 138 Union, ExcludedUK, the FSB and various other tens of billions of pounds to a million small and medium- organisations and trade unions can be wrong, and that sized businesses—up to £50,000—to help exactly those the people who have not benefited from the schemes companies to get through this difficult time. can be wrong, and the Chancellor can be right? Why does he not accept that he has made a mistake and Rachel Hopkins: While the Government have provided introduce additional funding to support those people support for creative institutions through the culture who have been excluded from the schemes? recovery fund, they are running the risk of losing our world-renowned elite west end musicians who are excluded Rishi Sunak: I am not making the point that every from financial support due to being freelancers or limited single person can access every single scheme that the companies. We risk losing these elite skills altogether Government have put in place. That is not what I am and damage to the industry would have a negative saying; everyone will have different circumstances. What impact on the ability of young musicians from working-class I am saying is that across the suite there is a range of towns such as Luton being able to pursue a career in support—a sum total of £280 billion-worth—designed music. to protect businesses, the employed, the self-employed Considering the sector provides more than £5 billion to and public services. Indeed, councils have been given our economy, can the Chancellor update the House on large amounts of funding—billions of pounds—to help what barriers remain to getting support to musicians? those in their communities who need it most, and they are well placed to make those decisions. Rishi Sunak: There is no barrier to support for anyone to access any of the various things that we have put in Paul Blomfield [V]: In the summer,one of my constituents place. I am glad that the hon. Lady mentioned the opened a new bar in a previously thriving area, but she culture recovery fund. At £1.5 billion, it is something shut it on 23 October as we went into tier 3. She paid that I do not believe any other country has done at such her workers for that week, but she could not get furlough a scale, coupled to which is our further support for the support until 1 November because, as hers was a new creative arts and the film and TV production industry, business, her staff were not eligible for registration with which my right hon. Friend the Financial Secretary to the previous scheme. She is just one of many who the the Treasury will be talking about later. We agree that Chancellor will know have fallen through the gaps in his this is an important sector and we want to ensure that it support schemes. Will he recognise the problem, act to can get back to work. close the loopholes and provide the support that is needed, particularly in the hospitality sector and its Alison Thewliss (Glasgow Central) (SNP): I would supply chain? never accuse the Chancellor of misleading the House, but he certainly seems to have misled “Good Morning Britain” when he told viewers that he had spoken to, Rishi Sunak: The hon. Gentleman mentioned support and had back and forth with, representatives of excluded for the hospitality sector and bars; he will of course groups. Those groups are clear that he has not. Will he know that support has been provided through initiatives apologise for the oversight and make amends by meeting such as the business rates holiday, which I am sure his MPs and representatives of all groups that have been constituent benefited from for this entire year up until denied financial support? the point she was struggling, as well as the cash grants for businesses earlier in the crisis, the VAT discount, eat Rishi Sunak: I know that my right hon. Friend the out to help out and the further support provided to Financial Secretary to the Treasury is meeting with that local authorities to support the supply chain. There is a particular group. In that interview, I was making a significant amount of resource to help businesses like general point about the fact that I and my team had met that of the hon. Gentleman’s constituent, which I know with various representatives of those who are self-employed. have had an extremely difficult time. It is something that we did right at the beginning of this crisis as we looked to design the self-employed scheme Afzal Khan [V]: I was recently contacted by David and we have continued to do so throughout.