THURSDAY, 26 JULY 2012
PROCEEDINGS OF THE LEGISLATURE OF THE PROVINCE OF THE EASTERN CAPE
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The House met at 14:15.
The Deputy Speaker took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please be seated. Are there any notices of motion? Hon Abraham-Ntantiso.
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO: Madam Speaker, I move without notice in terms of Rule 130.6 that the House:
Noting with sadness the horrific road accident which took place on Saturday, 21 July 2012 between Cradock and Graaff-Reinet and which claimed the lives of 20 people, including two children.
Further noting the increasing number of similar tragic accidents in the province and in the country that often lead to loss of life. Further noting that the accident involved a school bus from Cradock and a taxi from Cape Town.
Therefore resolves:
1. To express its deepest sympathy with the relatives of the unfortunate people, including the school principal and a child from Cradock School who were attending sport activities.
2. Offers its sincere condolences to Cradock School which lost a teacher and a pupil in the collision.
3. Wishes a speedy recovery to those injured in that collision, including educators.
4. Call on the people of the Province of the Eastern Cape, in particular and in South Africa generally, to exercise extreme care and caution on the roads, to arrive alive at their destinations.
I thank you, Madam Speaker.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Ntantiso. I put the motion.
Agreed.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Any objection?
No objections.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Haddon.
Mr D B HADDON: Speaker, good afternoon. I wish to put this motion with notice in terms of Rule 131.1 that:
1. The House noting that the continued acting appointment of the current Municipal Manager of the Nelson Mandela Council is unlawful.
2. Further noting that due to the illegal appointment of this Municipal Manager, any decision made by him will be unenforceable until his appointment is regularised.
Therefore resolves:
1. That the MEC for Local Government immediately instruct the Nelson Mandela Metro Council to (a) regularise the appointment of an acting manager with immediate effect and (b) instruct the Nelson Mandela Metro Council to appoint a permanent Municipal Manager in accordance with section 54(a)(8) of the Municipal Systems Act.
Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Haddon. I will ask the secretary to read the first order of the day.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT ON THE VISIT TO LOCAL SERVICE AREA OFFICES AND PROJECTS FUNDED BY THE DEPARTMENT IN THE ALFRED NZO AND OR TAMBO DISTRICTS.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Xhanti.
Ms N T XHANTI: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. Let me start by greeting the Deputy Speaker, Premier in absentia, MECs, Members of Parliament, department officials and guests. Ndiyabulisa kuni nonke. Allow me, Deputy Speaker, to table the report of the Portfolio Committee on Social Development on the visit to the local service area offices and projects funded by the Department of Social Development in the Alfred Nzo and OR Tambo Districts.
Let me go straight the projects that we visited as a portfolio committee. We visited 10 projects, but because of time I will report perhaps on seven projects or eight. Let me start by Siyaphambili Internet Cafe. I will go straight to the findings, Deputy Speaker.
Findings:
(a) Siyaphambili is no longer in operation due to the unauthorised expenditure that was incurred. However, no steps have been taken against the alleged culprit(s). (b) Senamile Internet Café is utilising all the assets that were previously utilised by Siyaphambili. It is still in the process of being registered as a close corporation and has not yet received funding from the Department. (c) The facility is not secured and there have been reported cases of burglary. (d) There is a need for additional computers because it is the only internet café in the area, and as a result the demand for the service is high.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must provide the committee with a full report on the investigations undertaken against the culprit(s), including any action that has been taken in accordance with the requirements of the PFMA. (b) The Department must assist the project with speedy registration so that it can be financially boosted - especially because it is the only internet café in town. (c) Tight security measures must be provided, as the project is utilising departmental assets because it is the only internet cafe in the area and a result the demand for the service is high. (d) The Department must urgently assist the project with acquiring additional computers.
Let me go to Yandlana Mpisini:
Finding:
(a) The project was hit by a hail storm in December and after six months still no production has taken place.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must urgently ensure that the project is operational and must submit a progress report on this matter 30 (thirty days) after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(b) The fence that was installed needs to be re-enforced.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must assist the project with the re-enforcement of the fence. A progress report must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty days) after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(c) The project does not show signs of sustainability given the fact that it was funded with R750 000.00 three years ago. Furthermore it is in need of a tractor.
Recommendation:
(c) The Department must liaise with the Department of Agriculture and must ensure that the project receives all the technical assistance it needs. This includes a tractor in order for it to be sustainable. The Department must submit a progress report 30 (thirty days) after the adoption of this report.
Ntabankulu Local Service Area Office:
Finding:
(a) The office has three small buildings that were badly damaged by snowfall. There is also a shortage of office accommodation.
Recommendation:
(a) The provincial office must urgently ensure that the damaged buildings are repaired - especially as there is a shortage of office accommodation. A progress report in this regard must be submitted to the Committee 30 (thirty days) after the adoption of the report.
Finding:
(b) There is a dire shortage of motor vehicles and prompt processing of applications for subsidised motor vehicles proves to be a challenge.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must expedite the provision of subsidised vehicles to deserving employees. A report detailing all applications in this regard must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Bhala NIP (National Integrated Programme):
It is a home-based programme which focuses on HIV and Aids ine activities ke ezininzi ezenzayo.
Finding:
(a) The project started with 30 caregivers, but the number dwindled to 20 due to non-payment of stipends by the Department.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must, 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report, submit its retention strategy for caregivers throughout the Province.
Finding:
(b) The Department has budgeted for only 10 caregivers this financial year instead of 20, in spite of the fact that the programme is servicing a vast area.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must ensure that it allocates funds for payment of all caregivers at the centre.
Siyaphambili Project:
Siyaphambili project is located at Bhala Administrative area in Njimbixeni location, Flagstaff. It is a poultry project.
Finding:
(a) The poultry structure made of corrugated iron was procured at the price of R165,000.00 and is way below the expected standard. It is therefore evident that the department failed to provide guidance to the project during the procurement process.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must investigate this matter and ensure that the poultry structure is built according to acceptable standards without any further expenses being incurred by the project. A progress report must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(b) The service provider did not install the corrugated structure; project members - being elderly women - had to install the structure on their own.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must ensure that the service provider pays back the poultry structure installation costs to the project. The committee must be furnished with a report detailing steps taken against officials who failed to monitor departmental assets (which led to the elderly women completing the work of the service provider). This report must be submitted 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(c) The project is operational and income is being generated by the women. However, income generated is very little considering that the project was first funded in 2006.
Recommendation:
(c) The Department must ensure that the project becomes self- sustainable. The department must submit an action plan 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Flagstaff Local Service Area Office:
Finding:
(a) Transport is the biggest challenge experienced by the office and this negatively affects monitoring of projects and home visits. It also strains relations amongst workers. Prompt processing of applications for subsidized motor vehicles also proves to be a challenge.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must expedite the provision of subsidised vehicles to deserving employees. A report detailing all applications in this regard must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report. Finding: (b) There is a need for additional office space; officials share an office and as a result it becomes very difficult to have private consultations with clients.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must ensure that there is additional office accommodation. A plan of action and progress report must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Phumelela Buthulo:
The project was funded as a result of the intervention made by the MEC by means of an Umhlobo Wenene FM Radio programme (named 12 Down). It is a poultry project.
Finding:
(a) The poultry structure made out of bricks - which costs R77,000.00 - is not up to standard even though the specifications was approved by the Department of Agriculture.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must investigate this matter and rectify it, and must furthermore report to the Committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(b) The Department allowed the project to spend its allocated amount without first capacitating the project members with financial and project management skills. This practice is not consistent with the department’s general approach to its management of projects.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must be consistent in its operations and must speedily capacitate the project members with regard to the basic financial and project management skills.
Phumlani Disabled Centre:
Finding:
(a) Infrastructure such as additional classrooms, sporting grounds and workshops is the biggest challenge faced by the centre.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must, through inter-governmental relations, assist the centre with the building of the requested infrastructure in order to effect the smooth running of all aspects of the centre.
Finding:
(b) Children ranging from 5 years to 17 years of age are in one mixed classroom, without having undergone psychometric assessment.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must furnish the committee with a report explaining why psychometric assessment was not carried out. The report must be submitted 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(c) There is no professional teacher employed and the centre is relying on unqualified caregivers for providing curriculum services to the learners.
Recommendation:
(c) The Department, together with the Department of Education, must ensure that a professional teacher is employed and that the training of caregivers is expedited. A plan of action and progress report in this regard must be submitted to the Committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(d) The centre is in need of reliable transportation because sometimes children are not picked up.
Recommendation:
(d) The Department must assist the centre with the sourcing of potential donors for provision of reliable transportation – especially because it is charged with the responsibility of coordinating special programmes and caring for people with disabilities. Periodic progress reports must be submitted to the committee on a monthly basis.
Finding:
(e) There is no school furniture; the disabled children are taught whilst sitting down on the floor.
Recommendation:
(e) The Department must urgently assist in providing the centre with school furniture and must, 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report, report to the committee. The department must ensure that payment of stipends is in line with the EPWP guidelines. A report in this regard must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(f) The centre is paying a monthly stipend of R300 to caregivers. This is below the minimum living wage and is not in compliance with the EPWP guidelines.
Recommendation:
(f) The Department must urgently assist in providing the centre with school furniture and must, 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report, report to the committee. The department must ensure that payment of stipends is in line with the EPWP guidelines. A report in this regard must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Ikhwezi Lokusa:
Ikhwezi Lokusa is a Christian organisation dedicated to the promotion of independent living for persons who are physically/mildly mentally disabled, by means of rehabilitation and skills training. The centre is funded at the rate of R200 per person per month since 1998 to date.
Finding:
(a) The centre is doing well and 58 people with disabilities are trained in leather work, pottery, crafts, sewing and computer literacy.
Recommendation:
(a) The committee commends the work done at this centre and the Department must use this centre as a benchmark for other protective workshops.
Finding:
(b) A total of 18 trainees have graduated in December 2011 (3 in leatherwork, 2 in crafts, 3 in pottery and 10 in sewing). The centre has managed to place 9 trainees in employment positions.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must assist the centre with the placement of trainees in relevant employment positions, or the establishment of co-operatives. A plan of action and progress report must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(c) The centre has good relations with other government institutions; they receive free medical assessments once a month from Dr Mashiyi, trainees are assessed by the Walter Sisulu University and trainees are offered ABET training by the Department of Education.
Recommendation:
(c) The good inter-governmental relations are commendable and the Department must learn from such best practices so that all other centres receive the same benefits as this one.
Finding:
(d) Instructors are not subsidised and the centre has in the previous year been using Lotto donations to pay these instructors. However, the centre did not receive any donations from the Lotto this financial year.
Recommendation:
(d) The Department must allocate a budget for the payment of stipends to instructors so as to retain them. A plan of action and progress report must be submitted to the Committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
Finding:
(e) Disparities in salaries of NGO social workers and government social workers pose the biggest threat to the centre, as the centre cannot retain their social workers.
Recommendation:
(e) The Department must fully fund all NGO social workers; this will retain them in such an organisation. A plan of action must be submitted to the committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
General findings:
(a) The Department is failing to conduct assessments of the impact of its funded projects on the communities it serves, as well as the intended beneficiaries.
General recommendation:
(a) The Department must conduct research on the impact made by the projects since their inception, with regard to the communities and beneficiaries they serve. The Department must furnish the Committee with a plan of action and a progress report in this regard.
General Finding:
(b) Project funds are exhausted on those procurement processes that are characterised by service providers inflating their prices. This compromises the primary objectives and the reason of existence of these projects. There is no value for money in most of the services sought from these service providers.
General Recommendation:
(b) The Department must ensure that service providers do not inflate prices and that there is compliance with the Provincial Price Index. Those found to be in contravention must be subjected to legal corrective measures. A progress report must be submitted to the Committee 30 (thirty) days after the adoption of this report.
General Finding:
(c) The Department injects funds into these projects to better the lives of the poor and vulnerable people. However, there are no positive signs that the projects are sustainable.
General Recommendation:
(c) The Department must conduct an assessment of improvement made by the projects since their inception, where the project members are concerned. On the basis of sustainable livelihoods this audit must be done on all projects funded by the Department.
Hon Deputy Speaker, let me take this opportunity ndibulele iportfolio committee ngentsebenziswano, ndibulele isupport staff sekomiti, ndibulele idipatimenti especially utata uMaxegwana ngesikhokelo sakhe kuba for the first time sivizithele iprowujekthi sikwazile into yokokuba sibe ne senior managers ezingabo ibinguye utata uMaxegwana junior noMr Mazizi, noMr Ncathayi and ne district managers. Siqhele ukuya ke sihamba ne junior officials but for the first time besihamba ne senior managers. Siyayibulela lonto. Enkosi kakhulu. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Xhanti. Clarity by hon members? Hon Ntantiso.
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. I wish to really appreciate this report of the portfolio committee of women and just one man as its member and I hope the man is effective enough.
Hon Deputy Speaker, my concern is on page 230. You know on 230 the second finding on top there on the caregivers that have been budgeted for, I don’t know whether because the committee must explain a bit to the House as to what the situation is there because I am afraid that they would say that the Department has to pay, to allocate funds for payment for all caregivers whilst the department says they have budgeted for so many. I am just saying if we could get an explanation there because we do not want to accept recommendations as a House that would cause problems to the department when they have to implement.
My second question hon Deputy Speaker is on page 234. It is not a question as such, just to say that as a committee you had to separate finding (e) from finding (f) on page 234 – I mean recommendation (e) and (f) because you have finding (e) and (f) and yet you have just one finding lumps together both, I mean recommendations, lumping together finding (e) and (f).
Generally speaking, hon Deputy Speaker, everybody is aware that the response time for each recommendation is 30 days, but it would assist the House if for each and every recommendation at least we have an indication as to by when should this happen. It has happened in some areas, but in some areas it hasn’t. Thank you so much Madam Deputy Speaker.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Committee.
Ms N T XHANTI: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. Hayi nam ngoku bendifunda I have noticed that on page 234 there is a error that was made by those who were compiling this document because in our report we separated both recommendations with recommendation (e) and recommendation (f) and ilishwa yinto yokokuba ke ezi dotyhumenti sizifumana xa silapha.
Then on the question hon member has raised on why the stipend, on the recommendation that we are requesting that the department must pay 20 members a stipend is because when we visited the project we discovered that as much as they are community based care programme, we discovered that there is a lot of activities that they are doing. If you can look at page 229 of this report you will see there are a lot of things that the project is doing and even the areas that they are services. If you can look at the background of the project you will discover that 10 is very few to service these areas and even a lot of work that they are doing, hon member. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Ku ne follow-up?
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO: Maybe hon Deputy Speaker just to say that the way the recommendation is crafted should be futuristic in nature. Thank you very much.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: I hope the committee has noted that. Thank you very much hon members. Questions to the MEC? Hon Martin.
Mr C MARTIN: Hon Deputy Speaker, I just wanted to ask on page 231, recommendation... [microphone not switched on] lack of monitoring on the project itself [inaudible].
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon MEC, I hope you have noted the questions. At the right time ukwazi ukurisponda. Hon Ndabeni from Cope.
Ms N NDABENI: Enkosi hon Deputy Speaker. Mandizibulisele kuwe, ndibulise kuPremier in absentia, ndibulise kuChief Whip in absentia, MECs at least three of them are here, the hon members of the House, amanene namanenekazi ndiyanibulisa ngegama leNkosi.
Hon Deputy Speaker, le programme yi programme engeba intle kakhulu u-development and research, Programme 3 phaya kwa Social Development. Ibhajethi yayo kulo nyaka nguR251 387 million of which imali yayo eninzi ibheka kwifandingi yeprowujekthi. As Congress of the People we applaud idipatimenti on its strides to b developmental than a well fairy department.
However we are noting with concern the misuse of public funds kanye-kanye apha kule programme udevelopment and research because ukubangabana uyatshekisha kwezi prowujekthi most of them zakholapsa Deputy Speaker and asinayo into ethi nezi zizakufandwa this financial year azizokukholapsa. I know ke into yokubangaba ndikwezi sele zihleli zifandiwe kuba besiye kutshekisha iprogress phaya kuzo.
Ezi projects ukubangaba utshekisha kwiminyaka egqithileyo uzakufumanisa ukubangaba ibhajethi yazo i-ekzostedi. But xa ufumanisa ufuna ukutshekisha ukhomperisha imali ethe yasetyenziswa nenkqubela phambili kwezi prowujekthi akukhonto uyibonayo. Ufumanise ukubangaba ukuba kuthiwa yayiyiprowujekthi yeenkuku akukho nenkuku le inye.
Noko ke lonto iye isivise kabuhlungu kungabikho neqanda elo elenza ithemba lokuba inkuku mhlawumbi izakuba khona ngomso. Noko hon Deputy Speaker lonto isibonakalisa mhlophe into ethi noko imali kaRhulumente kukhona ukungasetyenziswa kakuhle phaya eziprowujekthini. Asiyazi ke nokubangaba mhlawumbi idipatimenti iyasilela na ekubeni ibafundise abantu bakuthi ukuba imali kaRhulumente isetyenziswa kanjani na.
Andizokungena kuzo Deputy Speaker one by one but ndiza kubetha i- overall yazo because ziyafana itshalenjizi ezikwezi prowujekthi. U- monitoring and evaluation hon Deputy Speaker is lacking kakhulu asiyazi into yokubangaba inokuba mhlawumbi ingxaki indawoni na. Even namagosa ebesihambe nawo ayayingqina lonto that in fact nabo bebe surprised that imali kaRhulumente ichithiwe but akukhonto oyibonayo, engqinelana nokubangaba R750 000 mhlawumbi kule prowujekthi ibikhutshiwe yintoni ke ngoku oyibonayo othi le R750 000 yenze ntoni na.
Nalapho kuthe kwakhiwa khona istructure uvele ufike ubone into yokokuba yigaraji onokufaka imoto nje mhlawumbi zabantu abathathu. Akukhonto uyibonayo, akukho nkukhu, akukho ntoni. Ukuba iinkuku zikhona zinkuku ezithengwe kuba iPorfolio Committee inikeze inothisi that we are coming kukhawulezwe ke kuyiwe kuleqwa kufunwe iinkuku. Noko lonto ayisivisi kamnandi hon Deputy Speaker. [Interjections.] I-oven ibande nyani, unyanisile hon Madlomo.
Hon Deputy Speaker we have also noted that ibhenefishiyarizi ezi ziba zi-soft targets of criminal activities and i-officials zedipatimenti azibancedisi kakhulu xa kufuneka kuthengiwe okanye mhlawumbi kusetyenziswe imali leyo yedipatimenti. Iphela imali ingasebenzi kwi- core business okanye ingenzi lento bebeyicelele yona imali. Ufumanise ukuba iza kufika i-service provider ibakhele esi structure ibize iR250 000 or hundred and something thousand. Sicinga fanukuba amagosa la esebe eli ebefanele ukuba ayazincedisa ibeneficiaries.
Sakukhumbula kaloku into yokokuba ezi prowujekthi ingakumbi nangakumbi uzibona phaya emaphandleni abazali bethu ke ngabantu abangazi, ababahloniphaya abantu baseburhulumenteni nokuba umxelela ntoni na engekho semgceni in as long as ba isuka emntwini waseburhulumenteni bayithatha ngokubangabana yinto elungileyo leyo.
Sifuna ukuthi ke hon Deputy Speaker enye into esiyiqwalaseleyo yinto ethi le dipatimenti yakwa Social Development iyabancedisa kakhulu abantu bakuthi siyavuma kodwa ezinye iprowujekthi uye ubone into yokokuba azibhilongi kweli sebe lakwa Social Development noko zezaphaya kuhon Capha, zezakwa Agriculture. Noko siyafuna ukuwacela ke amasebe into yokubangaba mawa-asiste ekubeni xa kuthe kwayiwa kunkqonkqozwa kwaSocial Development mababakhombise umnyango orayiti bathi noko lena ayibhilongi apha ibhilonga phaya kulowana umnyango so that kungazokuba khona ipressure kakhulu kwaSocial Development.
Sifuna ukumcela hon Deputy Speaker ngemvume yakho u-MEC a- investigeyithe the role played by officials in the procurement processes and or hiring of service providers. Because xa ufika phaya kwi beneficiaries ziyatsho ukuba uNdabeni ebelapha nguye othe masithathe uMvenya. Noko ke lonto leyo iye isinike into yokubangabana sibe nokukrokra okuthile abe uMvenya ebiza imali mhlawumbi ezakuyigqiba yonke le mali yeprowujekthi kungekafikwa kanye phaya kundoqo.
We are saying we can no longer turn a blind eye whereas there are clear sins of where these funds are going. Something must be done urgently to stop those who use the government money to serve their selfish interest.
We also want to plead, hon Deputy Speaker, the Department to go back to the drawing board in as far as the funding of projects is concerned. It must come up with innovative ways or new strategies to cap the abuse of funds otherwise ngokwangoku siyibona igalela kwisaka elivuzayo. These projects are meant to change the lives of our people but the opposite happens. It worries us. They are not sustainable at all.
Masizincome hon Deputy Speaker ezi prowujekthi ezilandelayo, Ikhwezi Lokusa kwakunye nala prowujekthi, ndiyilibele igama layo iphaya ePort St Johns. Ezo prowujekthi zoyi two zidilishana nabantwana aba disabled. Noko zona ziqhuba kakuhle kakhulu ukubangabana idipatimenti ingakhe yandise apha ekuzisapoteni eza prowujekthi noko umahluko ungakhona mhlawumbi singatsho si- impruve nakulento ingathi asiyimithi ithagethi when it comes to employment of people with disabilities.
Xa ndiza kuhlala phantsi hon Deputy Speaker andinakuhlala kakuhle ndingamncomanga uMamkwayi the hon Chairperson wekomiti ngoku-enkhareyija kwakhe i-team work sisebenzisana kakhulu kula komiti. Yes we are from different political parties but xa sisekomitini siba sekomitini wenza sure that sisebenza as a team without compromising umbutho wakhe omthumeleyo apha eLegislature. Siyancoma kakhulu but we are saying noko apha kwiprowujekthi makubekhona into eyenziwayo iyatyiwa imali hon Deputy Speaker. Enkosi. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Ndabeni. Hon Mvenya from DA.
Ms V MVENYA: Hon Deputy Speaker, hon three MECs, hon MPLs, officials zedipatimenti zombini, istafu ingakumbi esiya sisithuthela iziphetshana.
Kuqala hon Deputy Speaker on behalf of Democratic Alliance Women’s Network ndicela kuleNdlu ndikhongratyuleyithe uhon Deputy Speaker ngokuba enyuliwe phaya ngokuya amabomvana ebene congress kwa National. [Applause.]
Ndivile ke ukuba nohon Majodina naye ukho-opthiwe phaya kwesa structure samakhosikazi kwaphaya kwa National. [Applause.] Sithi ke siyi Dawn ne DA xa kuthethwa ngama women akuthethwa nge political affiliation, umfazi ngumfazi kuphela. Sithi ke ntingani maqobokazana eprovince yethu niye kusiriprezenta thina singamakhosikazi kwezo ndawo nikuzo. Bendikukhongratyuleyitha ke hon Majodina ndiza ke ngoku kwiripoti yakho. Siyekile ke ngoku ukuba ngabahlobo. [Laughter.]
Kule ripoti i-disease ye non implementation of resolutions ne lack of monitoring ziya manifesta xa uyijonga kakuhle. Ngoba le ripoti ithi yenza i-follow up ikomiti kwivizithi ezazenziwe ngo-2009. Iyacaca ke lonto into yokokuba kungaphinda kubekho i-recommendations ezazenziwe kwangezi prowujekthi ngelo xesha kwakusenziwa iripoti apha iyacaca ukuba akukhonto yaye yayenziwa idipatimenti. Siyayikhalimela ke lonto strongo futhi into ye non implementation of resolutions kudala siyireyiza siyile House ngoba yiyo ebuyisela i- service delivery ngemva.
Ndifuna ke hon Speaker ndireyize strongo nale yalanto yala Internet Café ukuba phayana kutshintshwe kuze abanye abantu kuba bekutyiwe imali ngaphambili kodwa akukho mntu ubanjiweyo. Irongo lonto hon MEC into yokokuba kungabanjwa mntu xa bekutyiwe imali endaweni ngoba akusobe ibekhona i-lesson kwezinye iprowujekthi iprowujekthi ziza kuhlala zisitya imali okokoko ziyazi ukuba hayi kwakuse kutshintshwe kuthathwe enye igroup ingene. Ayikho rayiti lonto leyo. Ndiyayicela into yokokuba nokuba kuthiwa bekukudala kangakanani makubekho umntu ekwenziwa umzekelo ngoba yimali kaRhulumente ihambile, ihambile akukho nto izakuthini kulonto leyo.
Uyabona ke kulento yokunga implimenti resolution kula mcimbi wala poultry structure yamazinki sasithe sicela kwenziwe i-investigation. Akukabikho investigation. Naphaya kukho imali kaRhulumente ehambe rongo. Uku implimenta i-resolution ayikokuya nje uye kujonga uthi oh kanti nime ngolu hlobo kufuneka u-ekthe xa kubonakala ukuba kufanele ukuba ku-ekthiwe ngoba imali ityiwe, ityiwe.
Kulento yale garden project yayibethwe sisichotho noko madoda ayamkelekanga into yokokuba iprowujekthi xa ibe yahlelwa yingxaki enjalo ingavizithelwa iphinde i-imvuvwe ngoba nalapho imali imkile. Uyabona ke ezi zinto ke hon Deputy Speaker zenza into yokokuba idipatimenti imane ibheka phambili ibuya umva, ibheke phambili ibuye umva ngoba ibifanele ukuba ngokommo iprowujekthi xa zifandiwe zigqithe kuphinde kungene ezinye ziphinde zigqithe kuphinde kungene ezinye.
But okokoko sibuyela umva kwiprowujekthi eziyi one, sifanda iprowujekthi eziyi one ngoba azikwazi ukuba sustainable because azimonitharishwa. Ithi ke lonto iprovince yethu ayisobe ide deske iyi atshive lento yokukususwa kwale ndlala and nezinye i-areas kufuneka zixhamlile kulento yalapha kwaSocial Development.
Ipolisi yalento ye-stipends kufuneke icaciswe ukuba kwenzeka ntoni na hence uhon Abraham-Ntantiso ebereyiza lanto ebeyireyiza yinto yokokuba akukhonto icacileyo ngalento yezi caregivers ukuba zibhatalwa njani ezi caregivers.
Uyakufika phaya bekhalaza kanti bekumele ukuba abakhalazi. Ufike phaya bekhalaza kanti yonke lonto leyo, kufuneka kubekho into ebhaliweyo ngalento yezi stipends iphume ize kuthi ibheke nakwi centres ukwenzela ukuba nathi sibe kwi level enye naba bantu abaya singafiki thina sithi hayi manibhatalwe kanti umthetho awuvumi into yokokuba abantu bayabhatalwa yinto yokokuba akukhonto ibhaliweyo ecacileyo.
Kumcimbi we-offices ne vehicles okokoko ndangena kule komiti kulo nyaka ndandingene ngawo kuba ke noko sele ndisisikhoko phaya, oko sathetha nge offices ne vehicles. Uyabona ke lento yokungalungiswa ke lento ye offices ne vehicles yingozi apha edipatimentini. Ifana nokuya kukha amanzi ngebhekile evuzayo. Ngoba ngapha ni-adresa i- shortage ye social workers nikhupha ibursaries ukuba abantu mabahambe babe zi social workers.
Xa bebuya bebheka efilidini bafika abananto zokusebenza. Ifana nalento yokokuba kuthiwe bheka emlanjeni kodwa awunapheyile lokuya kukha amanzi, kuthiwa yikha ngantoni? Uza kuyenza njani iservice delivery ungenayo ithuli yokwenza iservice delivery? Ngoba iservice delivery yaphaya kufuneka kubekho iimoto zokuhamba zibheke phaya ebantwini ziye kumonitharisha ezi prowujekthi sithetha ngazo sithi azimonitharishwa kuba ngahle ilele apho naleyo.
Phaya kulento ye vehicles ndibone isimanga mna eNyandeni hon Deputy Speaker ukuba iNyandeni, iPort St Johns inemoto enye, iLibode inemoto enye, iNgqeleni inemoto enye. Andizange ndisive ke eso simanga. I-wards zendawo nganye elo xesha zingakanani umntu i- wards azabelwayo. Kudesike isi-aramu somntu kuba sifuna umsebenzi wenzeke sithathe imoto yaso ye-subsidy. Ayikho rayiti lonto leyo. Idipatimenti mayi prayarathayize, mayijonge ukuba lento yokufakwa kwezi bursaries iyasebenza na kweli cala kuba awunakufaka ibursaries ngapha kweli cala kube kuvuza ngapha abantu bangakwazi ukusebenza. Makuprayarathayizwe kujongwe ukuba makulungiswe ndawoni na. Faka i-offices zibe rayiti abantu baze kusebenza, ufake i-vehicles zibe rayiti size kukwazi ukukhompleyina apha ngemonitharingi nangezinye, nangezinye.
Iphayilothi prowujekthi yasePhumlani yabantwana base Port St Johns aba disabled kuthiwa yiphayilothi prowujekthi kodwa ifeyilishile. Ifeyilisha njani iphayilothi prowujekthi ngoba ithetha ukuthi xa kufeyile laphayilothi prowujekthi idipatimenti ayizokukwazi ukuzi adresa inidi zabantu aba disabled.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Unfortunately unomzuzu omnye oshiyekileyo.
Ms V MVENYA: Fortunately Speaker besele ndigqibezela nam. Ndithi ke le phayilothi prowujekthi ibalulekile mayikhe kuhanjwe ayizange ifeyilishe iphayilothi prowujekthi ngoba yinto nje yokuthesta into yokokuba lento iza kulunga na. Ukutsho ukuthi ke ngoku iphondo lonke alizokukwazi ukuyenza lento xa kufeyilishe iphayilothi prowujekthi yenu.
Xa ndivala ke hon Speaker ndithi iSocial Development mayimonitharishe, mayi implimente irizolushini. Siyayisapota iripoti with the implementation of resolutions. Thank you hon Deputy Speaker. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Siyabulela hon Mvenya sivuyisana nawe ngokuba usisithethi salo mbutho wakho. Hon Thabaneng.
Ms Z HLEKISO-THABANENG: Enkosi Deputy Speaker. Ndibulise kumalungu ePalamente onke akhoyo apha. Le vizithi ibingeyo vizithi yokuqala apha, siyile oko kuqala ngo 2009. Akukho nto siyibonileyo engumahluko ke siyi UDM ke thina ke kwiripoti yethu kulanto sasiye kuyo kuqala ngoku beziqala iprowujekthi. Eyona ke isuke yawesi phaya eSiyaphambili Sinamile ikhorapushini phaya ivunyelwa zi- officials. Aba bantu bafunyenwe aba bebenguSiyaphambili beyityile imali xa kufika aba banguSinamile babiza aba bantu batye imali bazo kubasayinisa imali abasekho kule prowujekthi ngoku mabaze kusayina imali kuzokuthengwa izinto ezizakusetyenziswa ngaba banguSinamile.
Sishiye ke kuphandwa ke besithi bazakuphanda, kudala ke kuphandwa ke iprowujekthi phaya zonke awude uyifumane iripoti kuthiwe nabu ubunyani, yenzekile lento okanye ayenzekanga okanye nanku umntu ubanjiwe kwiprowujekthi zonke nje gabalala awude uve nto kudala sahamba sijikeleza.
Kulena yaseNtlanampisi, yeye agriculture phaya. Eneneni la prowujekthi thina siyibona ingekho relevant kule dipatimenti okanye kule komiti ifanele ukuba iya kwa Agriculture. Kuba inidi abazifunayo aba bantu akanakukwazi uSocial Development ukuba abe nazo kuba bafuna itractor, bafuna ntoni. Zizinto ebezifanele ukuba ezo bazifumana kwa Agriculture, lanto kuthiwa ke uncediswano malubekhona.
Hon Ntantiso lento ine payment yeprowujekthi ayiqali kulento yodwa kwaphaya kwiprowujekthi zodwa uyakufumanisa ukuba kuthiwa iprojects members beziyi 30 eziyi 15 kufike kuthiwa zizakwamkela kuthiwe ke ngoku kuza kwenziwa kanjani. Yinto ebuhlungu esifike sayifumana leyo. Iza kwenziwa kanjani lento? Kuthiwe hayi uHlekiso ebemana engezi akazokufumana kubalwe kuthiwe mabatsho ngokwabo.
Iyaxabanisa ke lanto iprowujekthi because yeyasekuhlaleni ayizokuphelela apha lento iyahamba iye nasekuhlaleni into yokokuba hayi wena uthe mandingayifumani imali, hayi kuthiwe mandiyifumane. Kuphinde kulo 15 xa uphinda kwinyanga elandelayo kuthiwe hayi kuza kufumana abayi 10 ngoku kufuneke kuphindwe kugecwe i-5, ihamba ngola hlobo.
Apho sisithi ke ewe siyazivuyela iprowujekthi ziyabaphuhlisa abantu and zibanika inxaxheba yokokuba mababe nento yokwenza ingakumbi abantu abatsha bangazifumani besihla besenyuka kodwa iyafuna ukuqwalaselwa ukuba linikwe ngurhulumente okanye yidipatimenti.
Kwesi ke isikolo se disabled hon Wana ndacinga wena phaya sidibana nendwendwe, ne visitors. Phayana akukho ziklasi apho kuthiwa aba ba mental aba batheni bafakwe kwi classroom enye umbone lo umntwana u-mental urayiti qha unale problem anayo. So uzakufumanisa ukuba naye ngoku, sade sabuza lo umntwana yena kwathiwa hayi uye wathathwa emveni kwexesha wayeka kwisikolo esirayiti sabantwana une problem yemilenze.
Kodwa kufunyaniseke phaya kaloku u-afekthwe ngaba ahlala nabo naye ngoku sele ebhiheyiva ngale ndlela kuba kaloku kufuneka alingane naba bantu ahlala nabo. Sitsho ke kule ndaba yendwendwe ne-visitors iyafuna ke ukujongwa iqwalaselwe. Phaya ePhumelela phaya sifike zi-honest belunge abantu kuKrestu ngokwasemalini i- project members apho ke safika sayibona iproject yenkuku ziyaqhuba.
Kodwa ukuba imali iphi u-treasury akazi nokuba kubethwa abaphi imali yaziwa ngonontlalo, onontlalo abayokufuna indoda yaseKomani ukuba mayiye kwakha ngapha, kuseNgqele….. andiyazi landawo besikuyo eFlagstaff, ePort St Johns akukho bantu bokwakha ePort St Johns iye kufunwa ngonontlalo kwathiwa hayi siza kunifunela oza kuyikhawulezisa ubani-bani uzakuyikhawulezisa, likhona ke igama lakhe ke phaya kwiripoti, ubani-bani uza kuyikhawulezisa waya kufunwa eKomani eyokwakha ngapha ePort St Johns. Sitsho ukuthi ke lendaba inemali ikhona into efuna ukujongwa phofu kwa yonke nje into enethenda phakathi kuba ufumanisa ubone ukuba le ndlu yakhiweyo nam andinakuze ndiyakhe ngale mali yakhiwe ngayo lendlu. Iprowujekthi yenkuku ufumanise kuthiwe yakhiwe nge R120 000 uyibone ukuba awuyiboni, kusezilalini.
I-UDM ke ngoku iza apha ithi sifike kule themu ngo 2009, kulento ithi ezi ripoti siyazithebhulisha apha sithi 30 days ingenzeki i-30 days. Ithini into ebheka phambili? Ngubani lo ufeyilayo? Ukuba singakhe sincediswe ithemu iyaphela o-30 days kudala sibabeka akude kubekho sisombululo kuthiwa kule into nantsi impendulo, kule into nantsi impendulo. Ukuba kufeyila iHouse okanye kufeyila ikomiti ingase ke noko ikhe icaciswe ngoku kudala sibaxoxa aba 30 days, 30 days abasisi ndawo. Enkosi. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Thabaneng. Akhako u- hon Galo. African National Congress, hon Xhanti.
Ms N T XHANTI: Enkosi Deputy Speaker. Hayi ndizityela itheko lam namhlanje. [Interjections.] Ndiyakuxelela. Mhlawumbi ke mandiqale maan ndikhe ndithi ndiveze, oh bendibulisile ndiyabulisa kumntu wonke kwakhona, ndiphazanyiswe yilento yokuba ndiyayiphinda le ndawo ndicela uxolo Deputy Speaker.
Mhlawumbi ke mandithi ibuhlungu into eyenzeka eBhayi, ePort Elizabeth apho children, abantwana baya rikhruthwa barikhruthwa into yokokubana mabathengise idrugs and kwakhona bakwa zizisulu ze-sex trade. Aba bantwana ke bathagethwa ezikolweni kuyiwa kanye ezikolweni kuthiwa ke they do not care even if lomntwana u-rich or u- poor as long as idruglords zizayi atshiva lento ziyifunayo that idrugs zabo mazithengiswe. Ibuhlungu because we are talking about future leaders, abantwana bethu ithi lonto we need to join hands in protection of children.
Ndiphinde Deputy Speaker maan hey ndimthandile uHealth Minister u-Aron Moetseledi has warn South African that they will face harsh health laws if they do not become healthier. Niza kubanjwa. Ndiqalile ke mna ke ndakhomplaya kulento ayireyizayo utata uMoetseledi because ihealth yethu ibalulekile.
Mandingene ke apho kufele khona ithole. Kulo unyaka ngunyaka weshumi elinambini apho nathi singuMzantsi Afrika sathatha inxaxheba kwisivumelwano se United Nations soku-adoptha i- millenium declaration which sure the members country is committing their nation to global partnership to reduce extremely poverty by 2012.
Sithi ke uMzantsi Afrika addressing ipoverty under idevelopment and inequality is also, hayi maan ndiyaphazama, ndiyabhuda. In South Africa addressing poverty and under development and inequality is also about restoring the dignity of millions of people who have been oppressed and under privilege for many decades. The social and economic vulnerability faced by women and children, youth, people with disability and the elderly in our communities strips them off their dignity and compromises their quality of life.
Hon members, the ANC is committed in developing the economy of the transformation of our country. We are and will continue to work towards a more sustainable, equitable and in possive development parts which will enable us to address issues such as creation of decent work and sustainable livelihood.
Government is committed to the socio-economic growth that will benefit all the people of this country. The ANC government through the Department of Social Development and Special Programme has embarked on policies and programmes that are aimed at ensuring that the poor, vulnerable and marginalized members of the community participate in the community activities and self empowerment so that they can support themselves in the future.
These programmes are aimed at improving the quality of life of all people through facilitating protection and development condition of the poor and vulnerable, this special target youth, women, rural masses and people with disability. Significant strides have been taken by the government in addressing the challenges of unemployment, inequality and poverty. This has been inform of entrepreneurship development initiatives funded by the Department.
Last year alone about 35 youth initiatives, 55 women initiatives and 45 food security initiatives for sustainable livelihood were funded by the Department. Also about 3 988 job opportunities were created through EPWP programmes. These initiatives are intended to ensure that vulnerable and marginalized groups have improved income, access to food and are empowered towards sustainable livelihood. These social protection programmes has enhanced their capacity to manage economic and social risk such as unemployment and poverty.
But ke while we acknowledge the progress made by the Department siyi ANC in mitigating poverty and unemployment much more needs to be done. Siyavuma ke ukuba there are challenges ezibubunqina kule vizithi besiyenzile that idipatimenti kufuneke ijongane nazo. Enye yazo Mphathiswa iprowujekthi ezi project members are not capacitated on project and financial management which are the main skills needed for these project to grow into sustainable business.
Kwakhona ibikhe yavezwa ke zimembazi ezisekomitini ebezikhe zathetha phambi kwam that i-community development practitioners or i-social worker ezi athatshiweyo kwiprowujekthi kufanele ukuthi they need to mentor the project zithi make sure into yokokuba ziyazincedisa iprowujekthi membazi khon’ ukuze zize kukwazi ukuba sustainable. Si-avoyide nalento yokokuba iprowujekthi, icommunity development workers okanye isocial workers ibe zizo ezixela iservice provider into yokokubana makuthathwe eyiphi na. Sifuna ke leyo siyi ANC iphele because ayikho rayiti zezi zinto zibangela ukuba kubekho utyiwo lwemali.
Nakhona ke MEC sinqwenela into yokokubana iprowujekthi membazi zincediswe kwi- marketing. Ndiza kwenza umzekelo ngale yenkuku. Uyakufumanisa into yokokuba nyani bayazikhulisa iinkuku but abayazi ukuba mabathengise phi. Sithi ke idipatimenti nyani mayibancedise kuye kuthethwa nezi khampani zinkulu zifana noSpar nobani kuthengwe kuzo khon’ukuze baze kukwazi ukuzimela bangaxhomekeki edipatimentini.
Sithi ke idipatimenti mayigxininise kwimonitharingi yeprowujekthi kodwa sinethemba tata uMaxegwana usibonisile ngela xesha ubuhamba nathi ezinye izinto ubuzothuka ukuba ziyenzeka. Lonto ke yasinika ithemba into yokokubana nyani uzakuthi make sure that iprowujekthi ezi ziyamenthorishwa, ziya monitharishwa kwaye ziyakhaphasitheyithwa. Siyi ANC siyayamkela iripoti. Enkosi. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Xhanti. MEC Majodina.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT AND SPECIAL PROGRAMMES: Thank you very much Deputy Speaker. Hon MECs, hon Members, officials from both the Legislature and other departments and my top management present here.
Let me start by acknowledging all the comments from political parties. I have 15 minutes plus 10; the 10 that was put aside for questions. On the question from hon Martin – monitoring and evaluation – as a department we are developing a programme wherein we are saying before we transfer funds, upon signing of a particular project that needs to be funded, we must start by capacitating the project members that is why hon members you see Mr Maxegwana now being Programme 3 manager. He used to be Programme 2 manager, but we said out of the vast experience that he has and also to bring a person with a new vision to the programme, we have deployed him there as Programme 3 manager to be able also to bring integration between Programme 2 and 3.
In terms of misuse of public funds:
Indeed it cannot be acceptable. The Legislature rules as I understand them well, 30 days; not each and every recommendation can be attended to within 30 days. Maybe we must also be able as a department to indicate that within 30 days we are unable to act on these resolutions, but we need 30 or 45 days to be able to give a proper and concrete report.
The issue of poultry:
When you go there, there is hardly a chicken. Hayi iyenzeka nakwezi zakwa Agriculture sikhe zibolekwe there is one project that I went to. Ezihagu enye imhlophe, ezinye zibrawuni, ezinye zinamaqhabhaza kodwa ziyalumana apha ehogweni, isikhalo seza hagu. Ngeli xesha sigqiba kuzibona zivuz’igazi xa sifuna ukuya kwi next project kuthiwe hayi khanikhe nifumane iti kanti siyamaneyijwa apha. Fortunately ke ndakhe ndazifota ngefowuni eza hagu zilwayo apha ehokweni. Xa sifika kwi-next project nazi ezihagu zibolekwe kwenye indawo zahanjiselwa phaya.
I am saying ke really at time ezo zinto abahlali bayazenza baziqokelele apha ihagu. There are issues that are already with the Hawks in terms of the levels of corruption that is alleged to be conducted by officials. I cannot disclose them right now, but we are taking the issue of fraud and corruption very serious.
The issue of caregivers:
Not all caregivers are supposed to be on the stipend level. There are certain categories. I think we are going to ensure that we provide you with that information into yokokuba ngotheni ofumana iR600, ngotheni ofumana iR300 ibengotheni ofumana iR1 200, kujongwa ntoni. We will provide that information.
It is true that as Social Development we are supposed to be establishing projects within limited resources that we have, but then let Dr Dah come in with airtime, serious airtime – R275.00 – then contract at the end of the day. Social Development is supposed to assist people sibuye umva thina uDr Dah abe kubancedisa in terms of tractors because ezi prowujekthi ziyakhula and when zikhula zibangaphaya kwamandla wethu as Social Development.
So we have put that to our anti-poverty strategy to say how do we integrate these three departments in terms of sustainability of projects. Investigations really siza kukwazi ukuzenza. Ndigqibe ke la micimbi ibingathi inemibuzo.
ISISOTHO.
I stand here today as a foot soldier of our titanic movement, the African National Congress and commit myself that I will continue to walk the difficult path side-by-side with the poor and vulnerable until the agenda to implement the Freedom Charter has been accomplished, or until death do us part because this organisation is very much committed to ensure that we bring better lives to our people, irrespective of the areas where they find themselves.
ISISOTHO. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you very much, hon Majodina. I put the reports.
Agreed.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: I will ask the secretary to read the second order of the day.
CONSIDERATION OF THE REPORT OF THE PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON HOUSING ON VISIBLE HOUSING PROJECTS.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Dennis Neer.
Mr D NEER: Hon Deputy Speaker, hon MECs present, hon members, may I through you hon Speaker find out who would be representing the MEC for Human Settlements? Thank you very much. I note with concern that I don’t see any senior officials from that department here and we are presenting a very serious report on the wards of Nelson Mandela. Please take note of that and convey to the MEC.
I am asking because the officials played a very meaningful role when we were there in Nelson Mandela, so I expect continuity in that regard. The report is on page 238 of the ATC.
The Committee attended a meeting with the residents of...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Next time chairperson ungazihluphi ngokuba ubuze ukuba ngubani na we will take care of that next time.
Mr D NEER: Andiku andastendi kodwa ke ndiza kuyinantsika because kaloku I don’t want to debate the issue Deputy Speaker because kaloku xa umandeyitha ipartner yakho to be there, you must also tell the officials go and assist and listen. Ihamba ngolo hlobo.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Dennis Neer, I am talking about the MEC. You are right. There is nothing wrong with your concern, but in terms of what you are supposed to do apho xa ume apho. Yilento ndithi ke ubokuyiyekela kuthi yona no Chief Whip. Thank you very much.
Mr D NEER: Okay. Hayi ndiyeva mna xa kuthethwa nam hon Deputy Speaker.
The Committee attended a meeting with the residents of Nelson Mandela of Wards 29, 37, 38 and 41 on 1 March 2012. The method is as presented on the report.
Ward 29:
Findings:
(a) Some of the residents are living since November 2011 in temporary structures which are in a very poor condition. (b) The contractors are not monitored and they do the rectification of certain houses in spite of the fact that these houses have damaged foundations and walls. This procedure will result in the need for more rectification to be done in future. (c) On average, it takes the contractors up to four months to complete one housing unit. (d) Some builders attend work while being intoxicated and without the necessary protective clothing. (e) The Department failed to prioritise vulnerable groups in this project. This resulted in one community member - who is infected with HIV - losing a child, due to exposure to bad weather conditions. (f) Some of the houses have serious structural defects such as huge cracks and both baths and roofs that have not been properly fitted. (g) There is confusion about the role of the community liaison officers and the role of members of the Project Steering Committee in some of the projects. This confusion leads to tension.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must provide quality shelters and expedite the building of quality houses to prevent people from staying in temporary shelters for long periods. (b) The Department must ensure that there is continuous inspection during the construction process to avoid wasteful and fruitless expenditure. (c) The Department must ensure that the contractors stick to the provisions of the contract and penalties must be applied when these provisions are violated. (d) The Department must ensure that health and safety regulations are adhered to in order to avoid unnecessary fatalities. (e) The Department must identify the vulnerable groups and ensure that they are prioritised. (f) The Department must compel the contractors to attend to all houses with structural defects before they receive their remuneration. (g) The Department must use social facilitation to clarify the role of the community liaison officers and the Project Steering Committee. The Department must also conduct elections for any Project Steering Committee where necessary.
Ward 37:
Findings:
(a) Some of the houses are left incomplete for long periods of time. For example, one of the contractors - Green Bars - has not been on site for seven months. (b) In Kleinskool some houses were demolished for rectification purposes and are yet to be reconstructed. (c) Some of the houses are handed over to beneficiaries without any water and electricity supply. (d) People in Walmer A, who were promised houses in 1994, have been living in shacks since 1994 without any water and electricity. I must explain that there is total confusing with Walmer because people from Walmer attended this meeting because they knew it was going to be arranged, so they went there to raise their grievances in that ward.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must ensure that contractors adhere to contractual provisions and introduce punitive measures where necessary. (b) The Department must ensure that all the demolished houses are reconstructed as a matter of urgency. (c) The Department must ensure that all houses have a water and electricity supply before they are occupied. (d) The Department must develop and submit a plan within 30 days of how it plans to deal with the situation of the people of Walmer A.
Ward 38:
Findings:
(a) Only 28 of the 59 appointed contractors are on site, while two of these contractors are underperforming. (b) The contractors do not remove their rubble after they have completed their work. (c) Different standards are used to rectify houses that pose similar challenges, and aprons are constructed incorrectly.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must conduct an investigation into the behaviour of these contractors and take appropriate action against them. (b) The contractors must be forced to remove all the rubble after completing the construction of the houses. (c) The Department must ensure that the same standards be applied to rectify houses with similar challenges, and contractors must attend to the incorrectly constructed aprons.
Ward 41
Findings:
(a) Some residents have title deeds for years while other people occupy their houses. (b) A number of houses of this ward do not have electricity. (c) A number of houses have been vandalised as they are not occupied. This creates a conducive environment for criminal activities.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must deal with this matter within the next six months and must provide the committee with a report upon completion. (b) The municipality must be approached to address the challenge of lack of electricity supply. (c) The unoccupied houses must be given to other needy beneficiaries who appear on the beneficiary list.
Algoa Park Residents
Findings:
(a) Only the arrears of residents that stay in phase 2 of the Algoa Park flats were scrapped. However, the arrears of the residents of phase 1 was left intact, which resulted in these residents being blacklisted. (b) Residents are unable to buy these flats because of their income.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must scrap the arrears of the residents of phase 1, as was done to residents of phase 2. (b) The Department must consider an instalment sale or use the benefit scheme to enable the residents to buy these flats.
General findings:
(a) The contractors are constructing houses at a very slow pace, which results in people waiting for months for houses and others having to stay in temporary shelters for long periods of time. (b) The serious lack of continuous inspection and contractors not complying with contractual obligations will result in perpetual rectification. (c) The lack of social facilitation led to all project management teams not being properly constituted. (d) The temporary structures are of very poor quality. (e) A number of unoccupied houses have been vandalised, thus creating a conducive environment for criminal activities. (f) The department did not prioritise the vulnerable groups in all of the projects.
General recommendations:
(a) The Department must ensure that contractors adhere to contractual obligations and punitive measures must be introduced where necessary. (b) The same recommendation as above. (c) All the project management teams must be reconstituted properly by the department. (d) The department must ensure that people are provided with quality temporary structures when the need arises. (e) The Department must ensure that all unoccupied houses are temporarily given to other needy beneficiaries on the beneficiary list. (f) The Department must prioritise the vulnerable groups in all of the housing projects.
Lastly, hon Deputy Speaker, we want to commend the response from the MEC, her officials, the Nelson Mandela team and senior staff of the department when we met to attend to these matters. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Neer. Clarity by committee members. Hon Mtsi, hon Mvenya; in that order.
Mr S A MTSI: Well thank you very much, hon Deputy Speaker. I am noting from the report by the committee that to a greater degree there is an absence of monitoring of the work done by contractors hence it has been noted that in Ward 29, but it appears that this is consistent in other words as well, but I just wanted to check if the committee has ever satisfied itself as to whether the department does have an efficient mechanism to do the monitoring, whether through inspection of all these houses, so that issues can be identified before they get worse. Thank you very much.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Mvenya.
Ms V MVENYA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. There are three sets of houses – the demolished houses, the incomplete houses and the poorly built houses. Which one of these three sets are in the rectification programme? Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Committee members. Hon Martin, hon Matomela.
Mr C MARTIN: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. Hon Deputy Speaker, to the question of hon Mtsi; yes, we did raise this matter. As the hon member rightfully say it is something that goes through the report, this thing of monitoring and evaluation. We did raise it in our portfolio committees with the relevant department and with the MEC, therefore with even the appointment of budget for scarce skills they did try go get some inspectors and project managers, but it is a concern and we are always raising that matter. So from our side the department said they are going to see and look into it.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Matomela.
Mr M M MATOMELA: Deputy Speaker, bendifuna nje ukongeza kwethi sikhe ngathi sibe zezi inspectors simonitharishe siyikomiti in fact on the main i-oversight yethu ilapho. I communities zistrongo kakhulu ekumonitharisheni nazo. So njengokuba esitsho ke ugxa wam lo ingxaki yi shortage ye inspectors kangangokuba ke siyikomiti side sancedisa idipatimenti ukuba masimothiveyithe kwa Treasury. I think bayinyuselwe imali kule financial year ukwandisa i-inspectors. Enkosi.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Hon Pakati and hon Komose.
Mr X A PAKATI: Thank you very much Chair. The Freedom Charter envisages a situation where there shall be houses, security and comfort. So my question to the committee is whether he houses that they are building are consistent with such outcomes – security and comfort. Are they secure and comfortable? Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Komose.
Ms D KOMOSE: Owam umbuzo uzokuya phaya ku MEC Deputy Speaker.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Moerane.
Ms N MOERANE: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. i-question ka hon Mvenya on the rectification; whether it is with regard to poorly built, incomplete and what was the third one – demolished. Yes, it refers to all those three. Rectification is about that.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Hon Matomela and hon Neer.
Mr D NEER: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. On the question of the adherence of what is enshrined in the Freedom Charter; indeed that is why now we have transformed the Department from Housing to Human Settlements because you can never be secured as a community member if you live in a house that has not been properly built. You can never be secured if you are unhappy about the environment in which one stays. You can never be secured if your children attend school far away from the residential area. If there are no other resources that are available to the children and the young for them to be able to go and play together, to go and entertain themselves, within the environment of the community where they say. The community can never be safe if there is no constant transport that is available to take them quicker to areas closer where they could do their shopping and come back, etcetera, etcetera.
So the security and comfort of the people can only be realised when we construct B&G communities (Breaking the new Ground) so that there are schools, there are areas where the children can play, etcetera, there are shops nearby, there are parks – that whole package of the B&G is non-existent as yet. We don’t have a single B&G in this province. We are just talking human settlements, but we are still constructing houses only.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member.
Mr D NEER: I just wanted to add one small point on the question of inspection. They have already indicated which areas and which stakeholders are responsible for inspection. I just want to emphasise that contractors themselves must have their own inspectors and not rely on the municipal as well as housing inspectors or the communities. They can work together with the communities. The communities are always there, but they must have their own inspectors, which sometimes are not available. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: I hope the MEC has noted the questions. Congress of the people. Thank you very much committee members. Okay, questions to the MEC? Hon Peter, ndi qhala wena hon Komose, hon Peter, hon Wana, hon Mvenya; in that order.
Ms D KOMOSE: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. Deputy Speaker, umbuzo wam u-around ukususwa kwabantu baseDuncan Village to eRiston and then kwi process kwahamba abantu ebebengekho supposed ukuya phaya ba-otyhuphaya izindlu zaba bantu bebefanele into yokokuba baphaya. Now my question is, what are the interventions ezenziwayo yidipatimenti or i-plans because aba bantu basahlala emagalini of which izindlu zabo zibhalwe ngabo phaya eRiston but akukho nto ithethekayo ngoku. I am sure it is about two or three years if I am not mistaken. Thank you, Speaker.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Hon Peter.
Mr M PETER: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker, just a few questions. The first one; the Public Protector was here sometime last week, coming from Cala, Sakhisizwe Municipality, where she is complaining about the standard of an RDP house. I would like to hear from the MEC, in order for an RDP house to meet the required standard, what do you want to see in that house? Hon Deputy Speaker because in Nelson Mandela Metro you see RDP houses which have a tiled roofing, just a step out of Nelson Mandela go to Port Alfred, you get a zink on top of the house, hence I am talking about the standard of an RDP house. What do you want to see? In Nelson Mandela you also see a geyser on top of the house.
Then the second one is also closer to the question asked by hon Pakati on the comfortability after we have constructed houses because in January we always embark on a back-to-school programme. We see a number of problems in new settlements where there are no schools, there are no clinics around, no recreation facilities, as a result in some areas there is a movement of people to new settlements. You see overcrowding of schools which are near these settlements. Now it relates to this comfortability; schools which have got no furniture at times; learners are just sitting on the floor. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Wana. Hayi sukungxama Mphathiswa kusekho nalowa ka hon Mvenya. Hon Wana.
Ms T WANA: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. My question is similar of what has been said; what planning or the design of these RDP houses because in other houses we see it is just a hall, there is no division inside of the house of a bathroom, bedroom, dining-room and here in the Eastern Cape what is taking place, like Engangelizwe, there is place called [inaudible]. There are no new houses; nothing is being done, but one of the issues, the planning was that at least in this there would be an intervention in Mthatha because there is also that presidential project. At least there was an understanding that Human Settlements will also upgrade the old location of Engangelizwe, ibithiywe ngotata omkhulu. Enkosi.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Mvenya.
Ms V MVENYA: Thank you once again hon Deputy Speaker. The rectification programme started in 2006 by the former MEC Kwelita. The pace is too slow. What is the departmental plan to fast track this programme so that we don’t talk about rectification; we talk about building houses, not rectification? What is the plan of the department in that regard?
The second question hon Deputy Speaker to the Acting MEC; where are the officials of the department.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you. Hon MEC... Thank you very much hon members. Hon MEC, unowuthile mos uzakuphendula xa uzokuthetha apha? Hon Petela-Ngcanga from Congress of the people.
Ms N PETELA-NGCANGA: Hon Deputy Speaker, three MECs, Members of the Provincial Legislature, members of the public, officials from other departments, ndiyanibulisa namhlanje ngale njikalanga. ICongress of the People ithi iyayibulela le ripoti ithiwe dakanca kuyo leNdlu namhlanje kuba nathi siyiyo ingxalenye yala ripoti. Isithi ke iCongress of the People. Kwakukhe kwafika utata owayengxamile kweli phondo lethu esithi uze kudiliza izindlu ukwenzela into yokokuba le rectification icace. Asikamboni ebuya aze kwakha ezi zindlu wayezidilizile.
Siphinda sithi xa sijonga ibhenefishiyarizi zezindlu ezakhiweyo ayize ibe zizo eziye zihlale kwezi zindlu kuhlala bantu bambi. Abanye bayazithengisa, abanye bayazigcinisa aqonde ukuba umntu ndifuna ukuphinda ndihlale apha etyotyombeni. Ingaba idipatimenti yeyiphi ipleni enayo ukukwazi uku-ayidentifaya nokulungisa lento yenziwa ngodadethu nomama bethu bokuthengisa ezi zindlu nge R500 baphinde babuyele ematyotyombeni?
ICongress of the People iyayivuma into yokokuba yona imonitharingi ayikho kule dipatimenti. Ayikho imonitharingi kule dipatimenti, akukho kunye nabo bantu baqeshwa ngomasipala nabo baqeshwa yidipatimenti nabo baqeshwa zikhontrakthazi akukho nto ikhoyo.
Unokontraka ukuba unikiwe umsebenzi uthatha unokhontraka main contractor kuba ebeyifakile yonke into yekhampani yakhe, lanto kuthiwa yi profile yekhampani yakhe. Wena use ofisini uthatha iprofayili uthi wakugqiba uthi ndiya kunika umsebenzi adlule yena athathe umama uFihlani athi wena mama uFihlani uzakusapa ndishiya wena apha emke adlule akhangele utata uMatomela anike utata uMatomela omnye umsebenzi athi qhuba tata uMatomela. Idipatimenti yona iqhuba ibhatala u-main contractor lo ungawenziyo umsebenzi uqhutywa ngabanye abantu.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Petela. Hon Matomela.
Mr M MATOMELA: Sekela Somlomo ilungu eli libekekileyo malikhe lenze imizekelo ngememba ze opposition lisiyeke thina.
Ms N PETELA-NGCANGA: Enkosi kakhulu mhlekazi wam. Kwale njengokuba le bhizinesi ibinikwe umama uMajodina aqhube umama uMajodina ethatha ibhizinesi kuzo zonke iindawo. Ichaza into yokokuba ke lonto leyo idipatimenti ayinayo i-risk management kuba i-risk ezi ayitsho into yokokuba kule ndawo i-risk ingayile masizijonge. Siyakhupha phaya imali siyabhatala, siyabuka sithi izindlu ziyakhiwa. Kona uHuman Settlement ukho ngegama ngoku into esiyenzayo kukwakha nje izindlu ezidilikayo ngomso.
Lento yokusetilisha abantu nge dignity sisayiyekile ukuyenza sakha izindlu ukwenzela into yokokuba ndize ndiphinde ndibuye kuphinde kuthiwe mandize kwenza i-rectification. Yeyonanto ibonakalayo apha ngaphandle.
U-project managers, ayifani nawe ke tata uMatomela lento undenza yona. I-project managers kunye ne liaison officers bayaxutha-xuthana ngala msebenzi. Sicela ke singulo mbutho weCongress of the People sincediswe ndamgqibela kudala noMEC wam bendicinga ukuba ndakuthi ndimbone ke namhlanje. Ndicela, ndicela ukuyifaka lento yam phaya uMEC wakwa …[Interjections.]…not Social Development uzithanda gqitha. U-MEC utata uQhoboshiyana asincedise phaya komama notata abangoceba banako ukuyibhloka idevelopment ekuhlaleni.
Xana sisiya, abahlali besiya besenza idevelopment ukuba sinokuthatha umzekelo waseMxaxo kune development phaya ebonwayo ngabahlali baseMxaxo kodwa u-councillor umile into yokokuba ayinakuqhuba lena, akukho dipatimenti inokuza sele beqalisile bona ukuya kwidipatimenti ka Human Settlement, beqalisile ukuya kwezinye idipatimenti but u-councillor umile uthi ayinakuqhuba le development ngaphandle kwam bayaba owuna abahlali i-voters.
Mandiyibulele la dipatimenti kakhulu isebenzisana kakhulu nathi qha andiyazi iphi ngoku, isebenzisana kakhulu nathi. Ukuthatha ifowuni ubafowunele bayasincedisa kakhulu, uze usigqithisele MEC, wokha izindlu namhlanje. Enkosi kakhulu. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Ngcanga. Hon Haddon from Democratic Alliance.
Mr D B HADDON: Deputy Speaker, Madam Premier, three or how many MECs is it now – three MECs out of 10, Members of the Legislature, officials and members of the public; good afternoon. Speaker, when we are reading this Housing report one must wonder whether there is not some collusion between officials and corrupt contractors with regards to housing construction in this province. Could it be that contractors deliberately construct houses in such a way that they need to be rectified in the future? This practice ensures ongoing income and job creation, as these contractors bid for rectification tenders. I would like to illustrate my point, Speaker. If we look on page 239 under the findings of Ward 29, 1(b), it says:
“The contractors are not monitored and they do rectification of certain houses in spite of the fact that these houses have damaged foundations.”
So there is already bad building.
“This procedure will then result in the need for more rectification to be done.”
So the pattern goes on. Then at the end it says:
“Some of the houses have serious structural defects such as huge cracks and baths are not correctly fitted.”
I raise this issue because time after time, report after report the same challenges regarding housing construction in this province are highlighted and I have made a series of allegations, Speaker, but it needs to be challenged.
Lack of performance in management of housing projects is a problem in the Department that needs urgent attention. Is the Department applying punitive or corrective action against non-performing officials in such instances? If performance is bad as is shown, it needs to be unambiguous and it needs to be recorded in the performance of evaluation of that employee. With every housing project Speaker, departmental officials are mandated to oversee the project to completion.
However, when we study this report we note how inspections of building practices during the contract phase are not adequately monitored. We already had a long discussion today about the fact that there is no monitoring and about inspectors. In the report we read about Ward 37 in Mandela Metro where a contractor, Green Bars, has not been on site for seven months. The completed houses in this project are vacant and are now being vandalised. Where is the project management in the Department? Which officials are involved in overseeing and driving this project? Why is there so little supervision? I have asked the MEC through written questions why this state of affairs is allowed to happen and whether the officials involved have been taken to task.
In Ward 29, Speaker, in the Mandela Metro, finding (c) states that contractors take up to four months, four months to complete one unit in a project. Why? Now Speaker, in standard building contracts there are normally penalty clauses that are applied to mitigate against construction delays; do the contracts entered into between the department, municipalities and contractors contain these clauses; if not, why not?
The province cannot continue with producing ongoing substandard housing and budget millions of rand every year for rectification upon rectification upon rectification where projects should have been properly managed in the first place by the Department. In this province housing contractors are calling the shots. Are these housing contractors also managing the Department? So Speaker, where to from here?
The Democratic Alliance has said many times in this Legislature that the current housing provision in its present form is unsustainable and we need to realise this. This has been echoed by our hon Minister, Tokyo Sirwali on numerous occasions. The department must move away from mass construction of housing towards empowering beneficiaries by giving them a serviced plot with a title deed.
However, the Department needs to ensure that the following happens with immediate affect:
That this Legislature must instruct the department to undertake an investigation, preferably a forensic investigation if need be if there is collusion between officials in the department and contractors. Ensure that bad performance by officials is recorded in their performance evaluation and appropriate action taken. Ensure that the required action be taken from performance management, bad performance must be addressed and outstanding performance on the other hand must be rewarded. Scrutinise all legal documentation and contracts with contractors, suppliers and other third parties to prevent any misrepresentations and to apply penalty clauses.
In addition Speaker, the Democratic Alliance calls on the MEC for Human Settlements not to be aloof and to be more accountable to the committee and I trust acting MEC that you will convey this to your colleague.
Secondly, it is imperative that the department has a fully committed MEC and not an MEC that has divided loyalties to other portfolios in the Legislature. Housing is so serious that we need a dedicated hands- on MEC that will only concentrate on housing. If we start applying these steps the department will become far more efficient and serve the population of this province more effective. I thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Hon Mhlati, United Democratic Movement.
Mr M M MHLATI: Hon Deputy Speaker, hon MECs, hon Members, iUDM iyayixhasa iripoti. Kubuhlungu hon members ukuba le dipatimenti inebhajethi eninzi, ibhajethi yokuba ikwazi ukunceda abantu ibaprovayide ngezindlu. But le dipatimenti indlu inye yakhiwa nokuba kukathathu ngenxa yalento kuthiwa yi rectification.
I-contractors ezi qashwayo zizikha ngamabom ukuba zibe ne defects kuba bathi bakhriyeyitha imisebenzi, i-employment. Kuba ukuba bazakhe azabina defects izakuphela ijopu kubo so kufuneka kuphinde kubizwe abanye kuthiwe yizani nize kurekthifaya nazi i-defects kwezi zindlu. Iyamtya ke uRhulumente lento yokuphinda-phinda izindlu ezinye kuba kaloku kukho abantu abangqangileyo abalindele nabo ukuba ezi prowujekthi zokwakhiwa kwezindlu ziye kufika kubo. Azizokufika xa ithi le ibiyakhiwe izolo kufuneke ukuba makuphinde kuyiwe kuyo.
UMinister at national level uthi xa ebuzwa ukuba ingaba ziza kukhosta malini irethifikheyishini yezindlu ezakhiweyo. Uthi andikwazi andinakutsho ndithi ziza kuza uthi kodwa zi billions andikwazi ukuyikhwantifaya ndithi ziza kudla so much ngenxa yokokuba nezi zakhiwayo namhlanje are not guaranteed ukuba azizokuba na defects. Nantsi ke ingxaki esinayo hon members yeyokokuba xa wakhelwa indlu wena phaya kwakho yakhiwa ukho uyayijonga, uyayijonga kunjalo nje uyamqhaqhisa nokuba ubusele ufike sele esefestileni uthi makaphinde ezantsi makachithe.
Apho ke kuRhulumente kwezo inspectors zimbalwa sinazo zithi ukubakhe zayibona i-defect zithi zakuyikhomba kunokontraktha unokontraktha abeyinto ebilayo kulo mqeshwa kaRhulumente ukuba wena ulambisa usapho lwam kuba ngoku undenza ukuba mandiphinde ndidilize and iza kudla mna ukuphinda ndilungise ezi zindlu. Kwenzeka lonto phaya.
Abanye abafana phaya ubomi babo busesichengeni kulento yokokuba zi inspectors. Kuya nyanzeleka ukuba kuthiwe pasisa, kuthiwa sayina, pasisa esi certificate ngoku uyibonayo ngenxa yokokuba ukhusela ubomi bakho okanye abantwana bakho. Iyafuna ke hon members ukuba siyijongeni lento nento yokuba ela sebe silibuzile ukuba zingaphi iprowujekthi lathi iprowujekthi zi about 225 ezi ranayo ngoku iprowujekthi.
Usakubuza ukuba iprowujekthi managers zingaphi, ufumanise ukuba ziyi 60. So which means ukuba kukho iprowujekthi eziqhubayo kungekho inspectors ezikhoyo on the ground. Awuzokukwazi ke ukuyibona indlu apho kuxutywe khona isamente nesanti rongo xa ufika sele igqityiwe, awuzokukwazi ukuyibona.
Siyacela ke bantu bakuthi noko lihlazo lento. Siyahlazeka thina singabantu abaMnyama kuyo yonke lento kuthiwa jonga, bajongeni ke sasinixelele akukhonto bakwaziyo ukuba bayenze ibe yiyo, izimele. Kusafarisha abantu bethu ngexesha ekuphethe abantu abaMnyama.
Uyabona ke ngela xesha likapoqo yeyonanto upoqo owayeyimele ke leyo ukuba umntu oMnyama he must prove a point. Umntu oMnyama ne black consciousness babesithi umntu oMnyama xa enikwe into makathi prove a point aqiniseke ukuba akuzokubakho zikhalazo ziza kuvela ngasemva kusithiwa mjongeni ke into ayenzileyo. Siyazihlaza ke ngoku noko masitshintsheni bantu bakuthi. URhulumente ngowethu isezakuba ngowethu kodwa ke izinto ezenzekayo ziyasihlaza. Enkosi mhlali ngaphambili. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Mhlati. African National Congress, hon Christian Martin.
Mr C MARTIN: Thank you. Hon Deputy Speaker, hon Kwelita in permanent absentia, hon Korkie in absentia, hon Dunywa in absentia, hon Kuluta in absentia, hon Ndabeni in absentia, hon Bici in absentia and last but not least hon Bhele in absentia. [Laughter.]
Hon Deputy Speaker, we have come a long way since the gathering at Kliptown where the Freedom Charter has been adopted and endorsed. The preamble of the Freedom Charter clearly outlines that there will be houses, security and comfort. Houses; yes we have delivered and indeed attained milestones in respect of the number of units constructed, many who have been living in slumps or a house and received title deeds as proud new owners of these houses. One has simply to drive through our province and see the massive progress made in terms of housing delivery.
The question however needs to be contemplated is that are we as a government doing justice as to what is enshrined in the Freedom Charter. Are we not seriously compromising what is clearly outlined in this document? The need for safe and comfortable houses was identified more than 60 years ago and more alequently point by Nobel Lorette novelist Tony Morrison and I quote:
“Home is an idea rather than a place. It is where you feel safe.”
Madam Deputy Speaker, this cannot be attained during rainy weather, as each family member from young to old has to labour hours to rid and protect themselves against the elements of nature.
Another critical question that needs to be entertained is the areas where houses for our previously disadvantaged as being constructed. Sites that have been left abandoned and untouched for centuries are randomly selected for development. Water lock sites and suspicious soil conditions contribute massively to defected structural defects to houses.
The question that comes to mind is that if the appropriate geotechnical and topographical conditions relating to soil and groundwater conditions that can compromise and influence the quality of housing has been considered. While the need for rectification is undeniable and unquestionable, it is vital that government spends public funds on getting houses built right the first time.
In the Jacksonville Housing Rectification Project, initial assessments show that only 40 houses were embarked or earmarked for total demolishing and rebuilt. Three months into the project, 105 units were found for total demolishment and rebuild. There is widespread speculation that of the existing units that was initially identified for rectification are now considered for demolishing and not to be rebuilt due to soil conditions. Beneficiaries of these houses who have been residing in this area for 12 years now face relocation to other areas.
Furthermore, hon Deputy Speaker, I would like to use this opportunity to reveal our findings when the Standing Committee visited Ward 29, 37, 38 and 41 in the Nelson Mandela Bay Municipality. This visit specifically targeted the Jacksonville area where this rectification programme is in process, notwithstanding the fact that this project has already had two developers – Amakhaya CC and Westside Trading and now SVA. The community members of this area had the privilege of engaging all the MECs ever since – since MEC Nkwinti, MEC Kwelita, MEC Xasa, the late MEC Mabandla and MEC Helen Sauls-August at present – in their quest to ensure they receive quality houses.
The astonishing revelation observed in this project is the fact that the Nelson Mandela Metro has appointed 55 emerging contractors to do the rectification. It has also been reported – this needs to be verified – that the municipal project manager has withdrawn from this project.
Furthermore, that the contractors have embarked on a march to the municipal offices for financial assistance, this while beneficiaries who have been told to vacate their houses and occupy temporal structures, have been occupying these temporal structures for more than eight months. During the recent Taranto rains beneficiaries had to endure hardships in these temporal structures because it is of poor quality and inferior material. There are no internal utilities to provide heat and it is reported that conditions inside these structures force beneficiaries to seek alternative form of accommodation. This is going against the grain of the Freedom Charter which speaks of comfort and security.
What puzzles me, hon Deputy Speaker, is as to why we still refer to contractors as emerging in the building industry, 18 years into our democracy. Contractors with no skill and total lack of resources are utilised to construct houses for our most vulnerable and most priced asset.
The hon Minister Tokyo asked the question as to whether the time has not arrived for us to use sizeable established contractors. The hon Minister further stated that, and I quote, “this question is posed because when large construction projects like harbours and power stations, roads and transportation stadia, Gautrains are built, the services of large companies with good track records are enlisted.
They are also forced to bring their black economic empowerment partners, yet when houses are built by our citizens in the government housing programme, we rely by enlarge on inexperienced, shovel, wheelbarrow and bakkie brigades. Many of these discredit the good name of genuine and committed small to medium emerging contractors. Is it perhaps not the reason why the rectification bill continues to grow year after year?
This does not take away the fact that some small companies have experiences, but a lot of fly-by-nights take the taxpayer to the cleaners for their shoddy workmanship. Is it perhaps not time to establish a State-owned construction company? A rectification or temporal structures has subsequently been launched in the Jacksonville project, as only plus/minus 200 temporal structures have been allocated for 1,126 houses to be rectified. One can only imagine what condition these temporal structures would be in after being moved more than once from erf to erf.
During the Standing Committee’s visit – and this fact can be verified by the chairperson Dennis Neer – during an onsite interaction with Stemele Bosch site agent, which name is known, the site agent said and I quote:
“That another rectification is eminent due to the quality of work currently being delivered and with the calibre of contractors being utilised.”
The question that now arises is as to how building contractors delivering substandard houses are being held to account for shoddy workmanship and again, why are we still in this day and age still referring to contractors as emerging contractors? Serious questions are also posed as to the absence or lack of the presence of the NHBRC, as these developments must have their stamp of approval.
My office is currently inundated with visits from beneficiaries from the rectification project in the area, visited, claiming that the contractors have abandoned the site. It is also further reported that the project steering committee wrote a letter to the hon Tokyo Sigwali and he intends to lodge a complaint at the office of the Human Rights Commission.
In the Walmer area in the Nelson Mandela Bay Metro the streets are strewn with litter and burnt tyre barricades as community members express their frustrations. In this specific project the developer NewCor abandoned the site almost 17 years ago and still houses are not completed, let alone the absence or commencements of rectification processes. Then one has to note that projects initiated in 2005 are in the process of rectification.
As a government we have to declare that we are ill impressed by the continued failure on the part of the developers, contractors and the NHBRC to deliver or ensure the delivery of quality and sustainable human settlements. It is embarrassing to witness that units built five years ago are falling apart next to units that have been built more than 50 years ago that is still intact, comfortable, safe for human occupation.
Hon Deputy Speaker, aside from all mentioned here today, I will be failing as a public representative and be doing this gathering here today an injustice if I do not mention the massive amounts of financial resources wasted due to our own doing as a government, in particular to local government. Here I want to highlight the funds wasted in the relocation process of alleged prospective beneficiaries and the numerous administrative errors and legal costs this process has married to.
Let me elaborate on this. In the Nelson Mandela Bay, truck loads of people are relocated from one area to another to develop areas. This process is done without the persons be pre-screened for qualification for low cost houses. The delay in project implementation and execution further contributes to future disgruntled applicants, as it was found in numerous projects that years later after relocation a great number of those relocated do not qualify for low cost housing subsidies.
In this Metro a court battle is in sight as more than 26 relocated persons are in houses whilst the title deeds owners are not in these houses. The tenants of these houses are in possession of letters of ward councillors of the DA not in office anymore, stating that these properties belong to the tenants. It is evident that massive amounts of monies will have to be spent on the re- and de-registration of these people.
Hon Deputy Speaker, it is my humble yet stern recommendation that the Department of Human Settlements speedily intervenes with progression to remedy the housing situation in the Nelson Mandela Region. Serious intervention should be considered to establish if the Nelson Mandela Municipality has the capacity to execute these existing and future projects as a developer. It is my recommendation further that it be determined if Stemele Bosch Africa had not been unduly overloaded with the bulk of projects they have been managing.
I would further like to recommend that that all the necessary internal legal avenues be explored to establish if these projects cannot be taken over by the provincial department and that accredited contractors with good track records are enlisted and appointed to these projects.
Madam Deputy Speaker, all emerging contractors should then be utilised as sub-contractors. If the status quo is to remain in Jacksonvile, Ward 29, 37, 38 and 41 regarding the appointment of the 55 contractors it is the housing director to then urgently engage to establish the feasibility of financially assisting the cash-strapped contractors. It is also my recommendation that a forensic investigation should be launched in the Chetty 34 project to establish the number of wrong allocation and alleged illegal occupations of the properties.
Let it be further known that during the MEC’s visit on 1 March 2012 all the above was raised and out in the outreach programme, but until to date very little, if any progress or change has been effected.
Hon Deputy Speaker, members of the House, transforming human settlements and bringing about the change that we want to see, we will have to apply our political wit and without fear or favour take the necessary action and bring back the dignity, security and comfort of our people. Let us not forget those that went before us, especially the late Joe Slovo, are screaming from the grave that we should realise the vision or dream that housing, security and comfort become a reality in our time.
Madam Deputy Speaker, I want to thank the committee coordinators, the two researchers for the sterling work in assisting us with our work. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Thank you very much, hon Martin. Can I now invite the next speaker, hon MEC, hohn Jonas.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS (ON BEHALF OF THE MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR HUMAN SETTLEMENTS): Hon Speaker and Deputy Speaker, hon Members of this House, portfolio committee members, the chair of the portfolio committee, can I start off by expressing my appreciation on behalf of the MEC of report that has been tabled before this House? In many sense these visits to projects they do two things, amongst many other things – (1) they ensure that we come into contact with the realities that we have to face, but secondly they also help us that we have an engagement that is more informed.
I was listening to the debate, trying to compare with the report itself, but also trying to compare it with the facts. Anyone who comes from elsewhere will probably believe that there is nothing happening at all, after listening to some of the speakers. We would want though to acknowledge that there are serious problems and challenges in the arena of delivery of housing not only in the province, but in the country. Those who think that there is nothing happening are either lost or unfaithful or untruthful or they smoke something because the reality of the matter... [Interjections.]
The reality of the matter is that if you go to the ground you would realise that there is a mixed bag of experiences. There are cases where there has been a lot of progress and the quality of houses that have been produced and developed in these areas are according to the standard as required by law. There are areas of course where there are huge gaps, problems, mistakes and failures.
I want also to argue that the journey of housing delivery in South Africa is a long one. Remember that historically housing delivery in South Africa has been delivered purely for one segment of the population. We have now adopted a policy that ensures that every citizen in this country must have a roof over his/her head. The complexity of the challenge itself means that as we deal with restructuring of the department, strengthening its capacity, to monitor, manage and implement some of these programmes, we also have to teach and skill our communities to be able to participate in a more informed way in this programme.
I want to urge members that we should not over-politicise this issue of housing delivery; let’s face our challenges honestly, which we think are huge. They are very huge, the challenges and they do not require that we... They do not require that... [Interjections.] [Laughter.]
These challenges in themselves require that we built government consciously, strengthening the partnership between local authorities, the communities to whom we deliver such services and the provincial government and national government. We are in that path as government.
I would want to also respond to some of the specific issues that have been raised. One of them is the fact that...
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order, hon member. Can I appeal to hon members that whilst you are allowed to hackle, but you may not interrupt the speaker whilst he/she is on the podium. Please continue.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS (ON BEHALF OF THE MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR HUMAN SETTLEMENTS): The first issue I would want to respond to essentially is the accession that most of the problems in housing delivery are as a result of emerging contractors. I do not agree. The problems that we have in housing delivery are mainly as a result of the fact that over the years we have been struggling to consolidate project management capacity both at a provincial government level and at a local government level. Progress has been made in this regard I must argue.
Secondly, if you are saying that we must not use emerging contractors, you are effectively saying that we must not transform the construction industry. The argument should be different. The argument that we should be presenting here is, we should strengthen our contractor development and contractor support programme. That argument is correct because indeed there are programmes that we are using to support emerging contractors. Perhaps these programmes are not at a stage and at a scale where they are supposed to be. The task that we are supposed to do, all of us combined, is to see how do we build and strengthen these programmes.
The second accession of course that has been made here is that there is a case where government willingly go out and waste resources. The department is currently embarking on a programme of tight monitoring of contractors, a programme that intends to ensure that those that are not performing are taken out of the projects and their contracts are terminated.
The partnership with NHBS is in part to ensure that norms and standards are maintained. I am saying much as there are problems and huge challenges; it is not correct to say that we are having a disaster. I thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Thank you very much hon MEC. Order hon member! May I now put the report?
Agreed.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Are there any objections?
No objections.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Thank you very much hon members. I will now call upon the secretary to read our next order of the day.
CONSIDERATION OF THE REPORT OF THE PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE AND RURAL DEVELOPMENT ON VISITS TO JOE GQABI DISTRICT.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon member; hon chairperson; hon Phila Nkayi.
Mr P NKAYI: Thank you, Chair of Chairs. Members and guests; good afternoon. Good afternoon. Hon Chair of Chair, I am only going to read recommendations from page 245.
Meeting with Maclear Farmers’ Association (Maclear):
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must engage with the Maclear Farmers’ Association as well as the African Farmers’ Association of South Africa (AFASA) on a monthly basis in order to address farmers’ concerns. (b) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a report to the committee on how it plans to regularize the expenditure of the Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme (CASP). (c) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a plan to the committee on how it will address farmer training and development in the region. (d) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a report to the committee on how it intends engaging farmers in its budget processes. (e) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a report to the committee on how it plans to address the shortcomings of the Food Security Programme. (f) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a report to the committee on how it will diversify crop production for the region’s food security programmes. (g) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the Committee with a report on how it plans to address regional marketing and storage facilities provision. (h) The Department must engage the Department of Roads and Public Works to develop a plan on how it will address the problem of access roads to farms and commonages in the region. (i) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a report on how it will provide disaster relief to the affected farmers in the region.
Meeting at Eastward Ho Farm (Sejoseng Farm):
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must engage the farmer on the need to sell cattle, provide alternatives, and provide training that will create the opportunity to persuade him with their advice. (b) The Department must look into the problem and help facilitate a solution to the conflict. (c) The Department must look into the acquisition of large scale harvesters, centralise them and aid farmers during the harvesting season. (d) The Department must ensure that Siyakhula is an all-inclusive and properly packaged programme, which includes the supply of inputs and the provision of marketing. (e) The Department must engage the farmer and help provide solutions for water infrastructure and management.
Umnga Flats Farmers’ Association (Ugie):
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must provide a plan on how it intends providing boundary fencing to the 32 farms, and must report to the committee within 30 days. (b) Recommendation (a) applies. (c) The Department must engage the National Wool Growers’ Association (NWGA), to investigate the matter, and report to the committee within 30 days. (d) The Department must engage the South African Police Service and stock theft strategy development and management in the need to open an additional police station in Ugie. (e) The Department must determine the needs of the farmers, provide infrastructure, and cluster the farmers where possible. (f) The Department must engage the Department of Roads and Public Works as well as the Department of Transport for providing solutions in terms of roads proclamation. (g) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a report on how it plans to extend extension services in the Ugie-Maclear region. (h) The Department must assist the farmers in engaging Elundini Municipality and ESKOM with regard to electricity installations.
Glencole Farm (Ugie):
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must advise on and monitor the proper use of the infrastructure.
Evian Farm (Ugie):
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must have stricter terms of service for part-time farmers in order to ensure value for money in terms of the department’s investment. (b) The Department must engage the farmer in the need to sell cattle, provide alternatives and provide training in order to create the opportunity to persuade the farmer with their advice. (c) The Department must engage the South African Police Service and stock theft strategy development and management in the need to open an additional police station in Ugie.
Mt Fletcher Farmers’ Association (Mt Fletcher):
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must, on a monthly basis, engage with the Mt Fletcher Farmers’ Association as well as the African Farmers’ Association of South Africa (AFASA) in order to address the farmers’ concerns. (b) In discharging its rural development mandate, the department must consider establishing information centres for the benefit of farmers and communities at large. Furthermore, the department must liaise with the Office of the Premier with a view of establishing the Thusong centres, and must respond within 30 days. (c) The Department must continually educate and update the farmers with regard to changes in laws related to the funding policies in development agency based government institutions as well as other departments that fund development projects. (d) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a plan on how it plans to address farmer development and support with respect to mentorship, and the identification of strategic partners for farmers. (e) The Department must engage the Department of Roads and Public Works and must report to the committee within 30 days on how it plans to address this matter. (f) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a report on how it plans to address this challenge. (g) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a report on how it plans to address the drop-out rate from the Siyakhula Programme. (h) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a report on how it plans to assist co-operatives. (i) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a report on how it plans to consult and educate farmers about its plans to centralise the provision of tractors. (j) The Department must, within 30 days, provide the committee with a report on how it plans to develop a sector and commodity-specific database for emerging farmers.
Luzie Dip Tank (Mt Fletcher):
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must, within 30 days, provide a report on how it plans to address the dip tank leaks.
Mqokolweni Imbizo (Maclear – Ward 6):
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must engage the Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries (DAFF) as well as local traditional leaders regarding the forestry beneficiation programme at Ntywenka.
Page 255, bottom; Sinxako Dip Tank: Recommendation:
(a) The Department must advise on and monitor the proper use of the infrastructure.
Meeting with Maletswai Farmers’ Association (Aliwal North) Page 257, 2:
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must ensure that it provides the necessary training and support – like earlier.
Page 258, Meeting with the Sterkspruit Farmers’ Association:
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must consider budgeting for disaster management – in terms of the damaging impact of snowfall on farmers’ crops and livestock - for the next and subsequent financial years, and must report to the committee within 30 days of the adoption of this report. (b) The Member of the Executive for Agrarian Reform and Rural Development must engage with the MEC for Safety in order to bring the matter to the attention of the MEC and come up with strategies that will assist in curbing stock theft. Like before and the rest are repeated.
Page 259: Vukani Mangwe Veg and Crop Co-op:
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must, within 30 days, submit a report to the committee on how it will repair the damaged irrigation system.
Page 263: Lower Mdakana Rural Development:
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must deploy technical and financial assistance to the cooperative as the programme has the potential to change the farming landscape of Herschel. The department must report to the committee within 30 days. (b) The Department must assist the cooperative with the building of the hydroponic structure to ensure that the programme receives support from the ECDC.
Page 261: Tugela Wool Growers’ Association:
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must continue providing the support it has rendered so far to ensure that the project never loses the standards it has set. (b) The Department must integrate the economic activities of the Shed with the local and district economic activity and facilitate growth in the regional economy by making use of the Joe Gqabi Development Agency.
263, the last page: Luncedo Tunnels:
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must plan and budget for erecting the windbreak fencing for the project and must report to the committee within 30 days of adoption of this report on how it plans to do this. (b) The Department must, within 30 days of adoption of this report, submit a plan to the committee on how it is going to resolve the problem of electricity.
The rest is the same. Thank you, Chair. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Thank you very much, hon Nkayi. I will now allow an opportunity to questions to the committee members by the House. Hon Abraham-Ntantiso. You seem to be the only one.
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO: Thank you, hon Chair of Chairs. On page 255, I appreciate the positive finding by the committee there because we sometimes seem to think that we always have to have negative findings, but I would like to have clarity on the recommendation, whether it is semantics or grammar, but I would love to know what the committee wanted to say when they say that “the department must advise and monitor the proper use of the infrastructure”. Was there something that the committee had picked up there?
On page 247, all the recommendations on the eastward farm, all the recommendations on page 247 do not necessarily have timeframes, unlike in others where... On page 247 all the recommendations don’t have timeframes. Andazi Chairperson ingathi uyabuza.
Then on page 249, I pick up there that the hon members of the committee recommend that there should be an additional police station in Ugie. I would just like to know whether there is a police station in Ugie, but is not able to service properly the stock theft in the area, or is there no police station at all? If no, which or where is the nearest police station to deal with the issue of stock theft in the area? Thank you so much.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Ntantiso. Hon Neer.
Mr D NEER: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. The last question on stock theft and the police station; you would find that there might be a police station and there might be police personnel in that police station, but there is no one who is trained in terms of investigating stock theft because there must be a dedicated person who is trained to be able to trace and investigate stock theft because it is a specific matter that needs one to be properly trained. There is normally a unit stationed in that particular area to be able to investigate stock theft, in a number of areas where there are police stations. That is what is being impressed there.
Secondly, with the one on the dipping tank; you may build a well constructed dipping tank, but its usage is very critical because how you take your livestock through that dipping tank is very important because if you press a lot of stock because you are in a hurry because you have to go somewhere else, then you are going to damage that dipping tank.
That is why we were emphasising that the Department must be able to train farmers as to how the usage of that dipping tank must be maintained so that the dipping tank lasts for a number of years. From time to time water has to be changed and so on. People are lazy these days. They don’t normally change the water as required and put in water gathered maybe from the river or in a closer water supply area. If they don’t do that it will be ineffective to the stock when it has to deal with indlanga.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Nkayi.
Mr P NKAYI: Thanks Deputy Speaker. I am sure we can consider this thing of police station needs to be captured exactly the way it is meant. I am sure what we are talking about is additional capacity, focussed on that area. Thanks for pointing out that shortcoming.
On the question of timeframes; we agree. We must advise now that in fact our timeframe would be 30 days in this regard.
255; advice on and monitor. Advising is the task of extension officers, so we are saying this task must be properly done. Monitoring of use of infrastructure needs to be undertaken because if this doesn't happen, vandalisation takes place and infrastructure is damaged. Thank you, Chair.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Questions to the MEC? Hon Msti.
Mr S A MTSI: Deputy Speaker, I am very sorry. I was just going to refer this to the committee. It is just a grammatical error I just wanted to check on, on page 244, the very last sentence, finding (b). The last sentence there reads:
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hlalani phantsi malungu abekekileyo.
Mr S A MTSI: The sentence reads:
“Centralisation and non-transparency with regard to the comprehensive agricultural support programme result in delays. Money is being dumped late.”
I think this would send maybe a wrong message, unless it is deliberate. I am not sure if it was deliberate for the committee to use the choice of dumping money instead of allocating money.
Mr P NKAYI: No, allocation has got a process. If you don’t follow process and take timeframes, you know, the inevitability is that the money is dumped because what happens is that if the Department cannot use the money this financial year coming, they either go and give the municipality or an entity because due processes have not been followed. In the process they say money has been committed. Even in that event the entities and municipalities are not advised on how to use that money. This is dumping. It is not unfortunate use of a word. It is proper because this is what happens. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Nkayi. Imibuzo eya kuMphathiswa? Ayikho. Thank you very much hon members. Hon Woodhall from Cope. Bonke abantu abakhoyo apha abangengomalungu bamkelekile siyababona phaya phezulu and officials of the department. You are all welcome. Hon Woodhall.
Ms A S WOODHALL: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. I would like to greet everybody who is here, who is not in absentia, including our hon members, MECs, especially the department officials – very happy to greet you – and hon Kwelita. I will talk to him later and visitors and guests.
For some time we in the Congress of the people have been concerned about progress and the work done to ensure adequate food production. Furthermore, this province needs to see food production and other agricultural activities reach a point where investment of the time, money and effort is exceeded by the return on those investments.
From this report the main issues that we can identify are sustainability, growth, self-sufficiency, planning and laying a suitable foundation for projects. It was good to visit so many projects and I think the committee did well to visit so many and be able to make this report. It gives us a very good picture of what is happening on the ground.
The successes can be seen: those that have taken funds and equipment and utilised them to work the project and received mentoring by the department or municipal departments with monitoring and follow-up.
However, we identified challenges:
For some projects there have been insufficient funds for long enough for the project to be seen to be successful. In some cases we ask will they ever be self-sufficient. We also say that security needs to be factored into the basic planning of the projects. Legalities must be identified. We have seen so many problems around commonage use which seem to be tied in with the legal aspects. Insufficient understanding and inclusion of stakeholders has caused problems and we have seen that in the [inaudible] Farm. The consultation over the issue of diversification as reported in Maclear. Another challenge is the untimely responses to problems. If a dipping tank leaks it needs to be repaired fast, as neglect can lead to serious consequences. It makes me think of that old saying that my grandmother used to puzzle me with, “a stitch in time saves nine”. Somebody knows it – good. [Laughter.]
I think there should be great concern that is shown in the report that China, a major importer from us, will no longer buy wool from South Africa due to a mixing of contaminated wool from Ugie. This actually should be followed up and trade relations improved on this particular issue.
Another challenge is:
The lack of access to farms and even to commonages. This was reported in the Maclear District, but it is a problem throughout. The lack of access to farms mean that produce cannot be taken to market and makes it very difficult also – I am sure the officials would agree – to actually travel to projects to give advice and to have monitoring of those projects. So we actually think that this is something that needs to be addressed very seriously. A lack of storage facilities, which is a shortcoming in one particular project that was described and it leads to crop being lost, not actually a disaster.
The report from Maclear is disappointing. The reports that we expect from the department in 30 days, we as Congress of the people say those reports must be produced and not delayed. The department has gained a reputation for delays and producing documents, so we don’t want to see this continue. Please let’s have a speedy response this time.
It seems that the lack of continuous follow-up in the Sikalula Programme, particularly in Maclear and there is also reported on the Sejoseng Farm near Maclear.
In the Ugie area there from the Umnga Flats Farmers’ Association is quite frankly a disaster. This is actually an old or a longstanding project and it seems there is neglect with no follow-ups since 1986; it was identified easily. Now is this another example of abandoning projects set up pre-1994? I hope not. I hope it is just something that is an oversight and urge the department to follow it up.
I must say the reports from Glencole Farm in Ugie and the Evian Farm in Ugie are positive and it is good, as was already commented. It is good to be able to read positive reports. However, we must look at the question of sustainability because we must also see what happens when there are heavy rains and fires and enable the farmers to be able to deal with those, not only just mean deal with them as they happen, but to recover from those.
The report from the Mount Fletcher Association indicates a lack of proper planning and laying of foundations for the project. We need the training to be carried out as well. If there is a 70% dropout rate of those in the Siyakhula Programme then things are seriously wrong.
We must commend the apparent success of the Sinxako Dip Tank project and we recommend the department investigate the factors for success as against those that are failing and that could be a good way to measure what is happening; where we are successful; why we are successful; what are the factors that were put into place. It is so easy to point the finger when something fails, but we do need to be analytical and to measure the successes against the failures and learn from both.
The Congress of the people commends the committee for this report and supports its findings and recommendations. I thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Woodhall. Hon Mvenya from Democratic Alliance.
Ms V MVENYA: Ndiyabulela kwakhona hon Deputy Speaker. Ndibulisa ababengekho ngokuya bendize apha kuqala. Hon Deputy Speaker kumadol’anzima ukuthi xa ikomiti ka Agriculture iphuma iza kuvizithela iprowujekthi utake, kuba madol’anzima ngoba akubuhlungu nje uvizithele eza prowujekthi akufani nokuya kwi housing nokuya kwezi offices zikaSocial Development nentoni kubuhlungu kunzima ifama zisezantsi kodwa asifumani value ngokwenza lonto sizi members zakomiti ngoba oko sangqisha akude ubone ukuba kukho umahluko.
Uyabona ke lento yokusoloko ikomiti ziphuma zivizithe kungabikhonto ilandelayo emva kwazo iyayichaphazela i-reputation ye members singobenilapha nakulo nyaka uphelileyo. Imbi ke lonto kuba uyaziwa ukuba uzakuthetha ashiye akukhonto izakulandela kuyafana. So i-reputation ye members iyachaphazeleka yilento yale non implementation of i-resolutions.
Abayiqondi ke idipatimenti ndijongile nje into yokokuba xa kusenziwa ezi recommendations iyancedakala nayo ngoba ikomiti iyabancedisa iba bonise izinto ezikhoyo phaya itsho bakwazi ukufulfila imandeyithi yayo kuba lento ngu 50/50 bane mandeyithi abanayo izinto xa zisonakala imandeyithi yabo ayifulfileki kakuhle sincedisana nabo ke ngoku ukuba ezi zinto baziplenayo zihambe ngohlobo abafuna zihambe ngalo but ayisincedisi nganto lonto ngoba abazenzi ezi recommendations.
Kusekho amafama asathetha ngo massive food nangoku. Ithi ke lanto ezi policies zedipatimenti zimane zirivayizwa, zimane zirivayizwa azithotyelwa phaya ezantsi, azaziwa ngamafama ne officials eziya zisezantsi azazi ukuba kwenzeka ntoni na ngoba ngoku bekumele ukuba kuthethwa ngo rural development kodwa kusekho abantu abasathetha ngo massive food and kusekho abantu abasathetha ngombona xa bethetha nge massive food.
Kudala ke siyi adivokheyitha siyikomiti into yokokuba makukhe kutshintshwe le crop ngoba awukho umzi ongawulimiyo umbona wonke umzi unombona and wonke umzi unetanki lawo lombona akukho mntu ufuna mbona.
Yiyo lento ingathi amafama axakene nombona kuba awanandawo yokuwugcina and awana makethi kakuhle ngoba sinazo igadi zethu emakhaya zokulima umbona. Ingase ke ide ijongwe ke lento ukuba makhe kujongwe i-crop ezakuncedisana namafama athi xa eyithengisa ithengiseke kwabanye abantu abasifunayo ungathengisi into ekhoyo kumntu wonke.
Nalento yokukhomunikheyithwa kwezi policies iyafuna ukuba idipatimenti unfortunately ke no hon MEC akakho namhlanje njengokuba sidibheyitha iripoti yakhe. Enye into eyingxaki ekudala sayireyiza lento ye IGR. IDepartment of Agriculture ayikwazi ukuba ingazenza iziphuhlise iprowujekthi zayo i-IGR ingaqinanga apha ephondweni because yiyole iprowujekthi masithi i-successful, masithi iyamonitharishwa yonke into iyenziwa but akukho kwa indlela le iya pha kuyo, ayinambane mhlawumbi enye iprowujekthi enye ayinamanzi.
Ukubangaba idipatimenti bezithetha enye ithetha kwenye kulento ye- IGR ngekuthetha into yokokuba ezinye zeprowujekthi noko zi successful azichatshazelwa yilento yokokuba kuthiwa hayi azimonitharishwa, hayi azitheni. At least ezi zona noko zingezinye zikwazi into yokokuba zifikeleleke zibe nayo yonke into i-IGR ayiqinanga.
Uyabona ke irural development ndandikhe ndeva into yokokuba yona yiyo enoxanduva lokuba i-inthagreyithe ezi programmes ngoba yiyo kakade ene rural development. Iyafuna ke naleyo into ukuba nezi dipatimenti ezi MECs zikhoyo ziyijonge lento yale integration ngoba ibuyisela umva into yokungabikho kwe integration kwezi dipatimenti.
Kukho lento ka LRAD, la programme ka LRAD uyabona la programme lento yokubuyiselwa komhlaba kumafama asafufusayo or emerging farmers andiqondi ukuba lanto uRhulumente uyenzela into yokokuba nje kuthiwe hayi abantu sibanikile imihlaba for ukuba ba- owune nje imihlaba. La mihlaba ibuyiselelwa into yokokuba abantu baphuhle, abantu balime bafuye.
Ngoku into eyenzekayo umntu unikwa ifama kuthiwe nantso siyithathile ibuyele kuwe athi asogqiba umntu angasapotwa. Ahlale umntu nefama enkulu kodwa akukhonto ayilimayo, akukhonto ayifuyileyo ngoba akasapotwa yidipatimenti akamonitharishwa. Ngoba bekufanele ukuba umntu esakunikwa ifama asapotwe asuke kwi-emerging a-apgreyide abheke ku-commercial. Uyabona ke ngoku abantu abaMnyama kuthiwa bambalwa abazi commercial farmers because kaloku idipatimenti ayincedisani naba bantu banikwa la mhlaba.
Hon Deputy Speaker, ngoba ke noko asiyo dibheyithi yebhajethi le okanye i-annual report ndiza kuvala ngelithi ndiyacela hon Deputy Speaker leNdlu ikhe iyithathele ingqalelo lento yokunga implimentwa kwe resolutions ze House because siza kusoloko sema apha okokoko sisithi kudala siyithetha, kudala linye iyeza kukuba makude deske kubekho i-tool yokuba kwaziwe ukuba kudilwa njani ne MECs ezinga implimentiyo iresolutions kungenjalo sobe siye ndawo.
And naleNdlu kudala ndiyireyiza lonto ukuba leNdlu ayizokuba nasidima kulento yokokuba kunga implimentwa iresolutions kuba singobebelapha nayizolo. Siyayisapota ke le ripoti Chair sinethemba ukuba noko kule igemu ezi zinto ezireyizwe yikomiti zizakukhe zi- implimentwe kungafani nale iripoti yale gemu igqithileyo. Ndiyabulela hon Deputy Speaker. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Mvenya. Hon Pikinini from the African National Congress.
Mr I A PIKININI: Madam Speaker, hon Members, staff and guests, mandizibulisele namhlanje.
Everybody agrees that the economic competitive advantage of this province rests with agriculture, but the province relies heavily on auto sector. That is the challenge that we are having. This fact underlines the urgent need for us to re-double our efforts, capabilities and time to exploit all the opportunities available for economic development vested in the agricultural sector.
The visit of the committee to the various projects has once more exposed our shortcomings in approach in planning and implementation. Most, if not at all of these projects, have high potential to contribute significantly to meaningful economic growth by addressing the serious challenges of inequality, unemployment and poverty, which are pronounced mostly in the Eastern Cape.
For instance, one of the most disturbing issues is the lack of regular contact with the farming communities. Implementation of this tendency undermines the growth. This results in farmers remaining emerging and never become commercial farmers. They enjoy ke lento yokuphiwa all the time, so they are not prepared to stand on their own, so they will always go back and beg.
Poor conditions of food security programme will have to lead to maximum production. This lack also limits the scope of creativity, for instance there is a maize production that is taking place. This is despite the fact that some farmers have expertise in other production in other crops, like potatoes in our area in Cacadu for instance. Development of market strategy is not visible. We need to have one. Property market needs to be developed as a matter of urgency in order to address the poverty and waste.
A slow pace in implementing the intergovernmental relations and developmental plans remains a challenge because we are working in silos – the other government is doing something else; the other department is doing other thing else. If you can mix that money together at least you can do a meaningful change in each and every area.
Government in all spheres must ensure that intergovernmental relations and intergovernmental plans are prioritised. This will ensure resources, human and financial can be economically utilised and benefit communities more broadly.
Madam Speaker in conclusion, all these things are not impossible to achieve, but they need dedication, commitment, efficient and above all a political will. The ANC supports the report and recommendations. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Pikinini. Hon MEC Qoboshiyane.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND TRADITIONAL AFFAIRS (ON BEHALF OF THE MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR AGRARIAN REFORM AND RURAL DEVELOPMENT: Thank you very much Deputy Speaker. I want to take this opportunity once again to welcome this fair, just and quality monitoring report presented by the committee and I am pleased also with its contents and well considered recommendations tabled.
Hon Deputy Speaker, the Department is surely wiser and better after this report and we shall of course try by all our possible capacity and skill to implement these recommendations and submit such to the portfolio. Before I make a bit of response to some, hon members I think I must remind this hon House by quoting one of the presidents that passed through this country in years. By way of quoting hon members I want to indicate that there has been a speech that was delivered in 1985 by a man that was born in 1916 and I quote:
“Hence, we have good reasons to let them all - the Mandelas - rot in prison, and I think we should be commended for having kept them alive in spite of what we have at hand with which to finish them off.
I wish to announce a number of new strategies that should be put to use to destroy this Black bug. … I have exciting news that our scientists have come up with an efficient stuff. I am sending out more researchers to the field to identify as many venues as possible where the chemical weapons could be employed to combat any further population increases. The hospital is a very strategic opening, [so says the President] for example and should be fully utilised. The food supply channel should be used. We have developed excellent slow killing poisons and fertility destroyers. Our only fear is in case such stuff came into their hands as they are bound to start using it against us if you care to think of the many Blacks working for us in our domestic quarters.
[…]
I have set aside a special fund to exploit this avenue. The old trick of divide and rule is still very valid today. Our experts should work day and night to set the Black man against his fellowman. His inferior sense of morals can be exploited beautifully. And here is a creature that lacks foresight.”
This is P W Botha trying to illustrate how the majority of this country must be removed and wiped from the data screen of society of living human organisms. I just have the question this afternoon; where are these scientists today with their capacity and potential to execute this mandate that the Head of State could deliver in Parliament, broad daylight with other people witnessing and watching. But Nelson Mandela and the African National Congress chose to build this nation through peace, growth and development. Agriculture equipment could have never had escapade the skewed developmental patterns. Water disfavoured majority. Implements, equipment, skills, funding, as well as technology were never invested in the majority of the citizens of this country and this remains a challenge even today.
We may forget that the interventions that this Department is trying to make is to redress this past imbalances and skewed developmental patterns and I want to say this Department is ready to shoulder this mandate and task going forward. The issues of planning, integration, coordination, support, as well as implementation of even the recommendations tabled here, will be our core key drivers going forward.
Hon Deputy Speaker, the Department acknowledges the report, contents of it, of which also have been noted with thanks and appreciation. There are a number of issues raised by the committee that the department will attend and pledges to engage the farmers as the recommendation suggested and this will be followed by a detailed report to this hon House on the few issues we find to be common in all areas we highlighted and the regular meeting with farmers. Currently there are processes in place to meet in a quarterly basis with farmer’s associations in this province, including those that are cited in the report on areas of Mount Fletcher as well as Maclear.
We have noted poor attendance in some of these meetings, due to the fact that some of the farmers are not full-time in farming or are employed elsewhere. There are information days arranged for farmers, organised by the department to ensure that they get updated, get information in time and quality of the information they are supposed to receive and interactions that are taking place.
Siyakhula Food Security Programme at local level, hon Deputy Speaker, we have provided storage, sheds and silos to assist farmers to store their produce. The Department at provincial level is looking at the strategies to assist farmers to get their produce to the market on a wider scale.
On the issue of alternative crop production as proposed by hon Mvenya, farmers have a choice to produce whatever they like, but the department has the responsibility to advise them to plant other crops at smaller scale because of cost involved. I think the hon members here must know, as it is more expensive to plant crops such as potatoes than maize. This is one of the critical issues.
On stock theft:
The Department is working in conjunction with the Department of Safety and Liaison, as well as with the Department of Local Government and Traditional Affairs. As such they are always present in our IDP meetings at local level. The farming community also needs to be mobilised to be part of the campaign against stock theft. Farmers are being trained on livestock branding. This is one of the mechanisms to kerb this scourge.
The Department is in the process of informing the farmers about mechanisation plans which had to be developed on an urgent basis because of the challenges that were experienced with the previous system. In the year 2012/13 hon Deputy Speaker, the department has budgeted R10.9 million for infrastructure development in the area of Joe Gqabi for which this report is highlighting some of the challenges, of which Maclear subsistence and smallholder farmers are allocated R1.3 million. Mount Fletcher; both smallholders and subsistence stands to receive R1.3 million as well to support beef, wool in Mount Fletcher area.
Let me take this opportunity therefore hon Deputy Speaker to thank the portfolio committee for the support and assistance in identifying the areas that are faced with challenges and where quick interventions are required. We shall guarantee that we shall do so without fear of contradicting our own policies.
Sicinga ukuba sililungele ke olugqatso mhlali ngaphambili sakusoloko silwamkela uncediswano phakathi kwethu nale komiti senze ngcono apho abantu bahlala khona maxa onke. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon MEC. I put the report.
Agreed.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Any objections?
No objections.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Dimaza. Iza. Iyho ndingxamile. Funda ke mhlekazi.
The SECRETARY: Consideration of the Report of the Portfolio Committee on Health on visit to SS Gida Hospital.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon chairperson; hon Dimaza Mxolisi.
Mr M DIMAZA: Thanks hon Deputy Chairperson. Deputy Speaker, hon MECs present, hon Members and hon guests. I am going to be presenting two reports – one is the visit to SS Gida from page 265 to page 267 and the other one is the visit to Madzikane kaZulu Hospital and St Elizabeth Hospital from page 267 to page 274.
As members would notice the two reports; the first one, SS Gida, the visit was made from 6 and the 7 February 2012. As far as that report is concerned, some of the findings raised in the report yesterday around vacancies and quite a high number of vacancies in that particular hospitals also is the one that is depicted, but critical with SS Gida is the finding:
(a) The quantity and quality of food is not certified to be at the standard of hospital food, due to the absence of a dietician. Consequently, there is not even a special diet for diabetic and hypertensive patients.
The recommendation that we are making on page 266:
(a) The Department must submit a report with respect to progress on the recruitment of a dietician and interim measures to be taken to ensure that the patients’ diets are not compromised. I will request members, from page 267; 267 starts with a (d). It is not (c). It is (d) and then you will change all the letters – that will be (d), (e), (f), (g), (h), (i). That is what is very important about the question of SS Gida and I want to direct members to page 267, starting with the report, the visit is to Madzikane kaZulu Hospital at page 268.
Critical findings:
(a) The moratorium on recruitment of staff to non-clinical posts, and the high vacancies in various categories of medical posts, has created a huge number of unfunded posts.
We recommend as follows:
(a) The Department must review the moratorium and present an account of how it seeks to reconcile the rationalisation of health services and implementation of core standards in health provision, taking into account the high vacancies and/or unfunded posts. Such account must reach the Portfolio committee within 30 days after the adoption of this report.
Finding (c):
There are poor infection control measures, resulting in high risks of cross-infection. Due to a shortage of space, it is not possible to separate TB wards and isolation wards.
Recommendation: (b) The Department must report to the Portfolio Committee on its plans to rectify the situation in a report to reach the Portfolio committee within 30 days after the adoption of this report.
St Elizabeth Hospital:
There is finding (a). Again that finding also refers to the question of the high vacancy rate. You will see also it is the same as the one that is said around Madzikane kaZulu.
Critical recommendations on St Elizabeth is the recommendation (a) and (b). a. The Department must account for how it intends to reconcile the service package offered at the hospital with the human resource supply as well as its plans to rectify the situation, and include it in a report to reach the Portfolio Committee within 30 days of the adoption of this report.
(f) The Department must account for progress on the revitalisation of the hospital and detail future plans in this regard. This must be contained in a report to reach the Portfolio Committee by not later than 30 working days after the adoption of this report.
Empilisweni Hospital:
We are in recommendations, page 271. The finding is (b).
(b) The closure of the theatre due to poor infrastructure and un- serviced equipment and gas machines puts undue pressure on nearby hospitals to which theatre clients have to be transferred.
We recommend as follows:
(b) The Department must rectify the situation and report to the Portfolio Committee not later than 30 days after the adoption of this report.
We go to page 273, Mthatha Forensic Pathology Services.
There are two findings; not very critical.
(a) The Department has continued to demonstrate utter disregard for a resolution taken by the Legislature with respect to the installation of a X-ray machine which has stood unused for years because it could not fit through a doorway.
Recommendation:
(a) The Department must indicate in a report to be submitted to the Portfolio Committee, reasons why it has not invoked any action in line with provisions of Section 81(a) of the Public Finance Management Act (PFMA) on the basis of contravention of Sections 38(1)(b); 38(1)(c)(ii) and 38(1)(h)(i). The report must also contain details of action to be taken to rectify the situation, including timeframes.
Finding:
(b) The infrastructural design of the facility does not fully respond to the operational needs of the services rendered.
Recommendation:
(b) The Department must indicate how it intends to rectify the situation, including timeframes, in a report to reach the Portfolio Committee by not later than 30 days after the adoption of this report.
Conclusion:
The Department must take House Resolutions seriously and respond to them according to the timeframes, as any disregard thereof impacts negatively on the parliamentary oversight function.
We thank, Deputy Speaker, that everybody, especially the members of the committee for the work that they have done. I thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon chairperson of the committee, hon Dimaza. Clarity by committee members? Hon Mvenya, hon Abraham-Ntantiso; in that order.
Ms V MVENYA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. On page 266, finding (e); I have a problem with the recommendation of that finding. It focuses on the quality and quantity of food. It is not mentioning the use of the main kitchen, which I think is the main problem there because they are using the kitchens that are in the wards instead of using the main kitchen and the recommendation is not mentioning that use of the main kitchen. They can look at the quality and quantity of food, but they continue using that kitchen that is in the wards, which could be a problem.
The second one is on page 271, finding (f); the cost of access to dental services has increased. Again the recommendation is talking about the rectification of the situation, so I am not sure which situation that; whether it is the cost that has increased or the fact that people are paying for the dentist. What is this rectification? What is this situation that has to be rectified? Thank you, hon Speaker. I don’t know whether this question is clear.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Okay. Thank you, hon member. Hon Ntantiso.
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO: Thank you. Hon Deputy Speaker, may I start on page 265 in the background that the committee gives there. They say that the hospital is supposed to admit 122, but it hardly receives that number. Whether for the committee that is a positive or negative observation, in my view if you have less patients it means you have healthy communities. I don’t know; maybe they could elaborate on that.
Still on the background on the same page, I think also the committee should find on the breakfast time because as I observe there, nine o’clock is too late for patients to be having breakfast. It is not normal, especially if you are going to be having lunch at 12h00. I think the committee should find around that.
Hon Madam Deputy Speaker, for finding – on page 266 now – for finding (b) and (f); you know I see some contradiction there because finding (b) says at the end “in spite of there being no shortage of food stuff”, but finding (f) says “food is insufficient”. For me there is a contradiction there, so maybe the committee can really assist the House in saying what is the situation.
I share – partly I share the sentiments raised by hon Mvenya on page 267. Uyabona, though in my view you have findings on page 266 and then recommendations on the same page ending on 267, there hon Dimaza says to us instead of (c) we must mark the first recommendation on page 267 as (d), going down that way up to (i), but that means there is no recommendation (c). Is that the case? You say to us we must change the (c) on page 267 to (d), so it means there is no recommendation on the (c) finding.
Then the conclusion on the SS Gida report of the committee; the conclusion on page 267 talks about the Bhato Pele Principles. If only we could get a sense as to what is it that was violated around that principle, hence the recommendation by the committee to that effect. Just lastly Madam Deputy Speaker; I would like to commend the committee in the conclusion of their report because the area of resolutions and responses by the department is critical and is a cause for concern for the House. Thank you very much.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon members. Committee members.
Mr M DIMAZA: Thanks, hon Deputy Speaker. I think the first point that we need to highlight and clarify is on page 266. We said the findings there go up to, from (a) up to (i) and then when you get to the recommendations it will have recommendation (a) and there is also recommendation (b) and (3) instead of (b) and (c). That is what I said at the beginning. When you turn over the page I said members must correct those particular letters; instead of it being the (c) it is the (d); you start with the (d) and then it follows correctly like that, so that you will find that for each and every finding there is a recommendation that has been captured for each and every finding.
On the other question which hon Ntantiso was asking, about whether it is showing that people are healthy or what when the usage there is far lesser than the numbers of beds that are there; it is a question that you can't say properly everybody is healthy because at the end of the day you will understand the distance between SS Gida and also King William’s Town where people move sometimes up to Grey Hospital and they move to other hospitals in the surrounding areas. So it is not a question that we can promptly say they are healthy, unless it needs some kind of a serious investigation.
Ms V MNTONGANA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. As to the conclusion of the Bhato Pele Principles on page 267; I am not really sure because there is no indicative. page 267 when the hon member is asking which area of the Bhato Pele Principles. If my memory serves me well there are 48 principles under Bhato Pele and then therefore we are emphasising on the adherence to those because when we were called there, we were called because they were saying there was no food, but when we were there, there was food, but it is just the problem was the constituency of each food groups.
So it was a matter of being... Because even when they were saying there was no meat; there was meat, but it is just that it was white meat; there was mince, of which they did not regard it as red meat. So it is just the understanding of the language that we are using, but otherwise we agreed that there was no red meat, but there was mince meat. Le inezihlunu kodwa i-mince meat ikhona and mince meat remains red meat. The understanding is that if you don’t get red meat that is not meat, but there was chicken. What were saying; in terms of the food groups it was just the understanding of the food constituency. That was it. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Dimaza.
Mr M DIMAZA: I think the last part, I think the question by hon Ntantiso; I think on (f) it is just a mistake there – we said quality instead of the quantity of food. Change that to quality of food; sorry.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Is there any other question? Questions to the MEC? Hon Mvenya.
Ms V MVENYA: On page 266, finding (a), the hospital floods during rainy seasonings as it is fabricated; the recommendation by the committee that there should be a progress report, so the question hon Deputy Speaker is, is there any plan or anything that you are doing about the situation because there is progress that is needed from you? What are you doing as a department to deal with that issue of... In fact the issue there is prefabs because the floods is as a result of the prefabs that are old. What is the department doing about that situation?
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Uziqwalasele mos le mibuzo? Masixoxe Hon Jam-Jam from the Congress of the people.
Ms N JAM-JAM: Hon Deputy Speaker, iCongress of the People iyijongile le ripoti yayiqwalasela sayijonga ke lento yokuba kwehle amanani kwesiya sibhedlele sase SS Gida xa kufanele ukuba kubezi admissions i-122 but ihle kuyo kuma ku 65%. Esicela thina into yokokuba makwenziwe thorough investigations ukuba kwenzeke ntoni, yintoni le yenzekayo singawala-walazi sithathe for granted ukuba inokuba kwenzeka enye into kanti akwenzeki lonto.
Lento yendlu enethayo ke yi lack of maintenance lena singavuya ukuba idipatimenti ingayithathela ingqalelo kuba xa kunetha abantu abasebhedini belele begula ithetha ukuthini lonto. Nalento ye delays kwi supply chain management Sekela Somlomo it’s a common problem ingakumbi kule dipatimenti yakwa Health ukuba akukhanga kwashota amayeza kuthiwa hayi yi supply chain management process iza ekutyeni ngoku.
Siye kule vacancy rate eMadikane ibuhlungu ke lento iMadikane neSaint Elizabeth eziyana izibhedlele iwesi iMadikane iMadikane isevisa i-villages ezininzi kakhulu so xa kukho i-vacancy rate that is why uzakufika phaya ubone abantu baza kuhlala etyhwini imini yonke belinde ukuba babe bayaseviswa sisibhedlele bade bangaseviswa.
Iyafana ke nale ye infection control iyintlungu. Noko ngoku MEC makukhe kubekho indlela yokuziphucula izinto. Uyabona kwesiya sibhedlele kwaku kade kudala kulaliswa, kulaliswe abantu omnye ajonge ngapha omnye ajonge ngapha apha ebhedini eyi one. Ngela xesha ke awuyijongi into yokokuba ugula yintoni nomnye ugula yintoni. Omnye umfake ngaphantsi kwebhedi wenze i-floor bed. Noko makungabi ngeli xesha kusenziwa ezo zinto mayibe iyatshintshwa lento.
I-EMS ke iba yintlungu bahlala abantu phaya bebize i-ambulance kuhlalwe imini yonke ibibizwe ngo 8 iya kufika ngo 5 okanye ingafiki abantu bade bancame mhlawumbi umntu aye kuqesha imoto ngemali engekhoyo. Noko siyayicela ukuba u-MEC makazijonge ezi zinto.
Ziyintlungu kakhulu kwela cala kuba eza zibhedlele zela cala ayizozibhedlele noko zisondeleyo ezindaweni ezinempiliso zikude kunabantu. So abantu bayaxhaphazeka xa kuza kufuneka umntu makade aphinde athi ngoku isevisi ikhona kaRhulumente but aphinde aye kubhatala imali because ayifiki.
Nale ye-dental services ke mhlawumbi makurikhruthwe phaya bethunani kungade kucace ukuba abantu ….because abantu bayokubhatala kuba kungekho mntu wokukhupha amazinyo umntu aphele eyo kubhatala kanti ukuba ebeye kukhupha amazinyo esibhedlele ebengazokubhatala phaya eMpilisweni.
Ikhona ke lento yokunga implimentwa kwe resolutions Somlomo ekudala kuthethwa ngayo apha ukuba masiyijonge. Andikwazi ke ukuyichana kakuhle lento ye vacancy rate eSaint Elizabeth kugqibe kuthiwe ku-ova spendiwe ibhajethi kwi compensation of employees.
Xa kukho i-vacancy ku ova spendwa kanjani, i-organogram, ngobani aba bakhoyo babhatalwayo apha xa kanti kukho i-vacancy rate because xa kukho i-vacancy rate akunaku ova spendwa okanye ….bhajethe kanjani xa ngoku bengakwazi ukuba bagcwalise i-posts kuba ku ova spendiwe?
Siyi Congress of the People siya rikhomenda ke apha into yokokuba i- basic education curriculum mayikhe i-inklude i-basic hygiene and nutritions so that xa sele kufikwa ke ngoku kwa Health abantu ….[Interjections.] …hayi ndiyayazi ndiyithetha ndikwa education mayenziwe kwa education because iza kuncedisa abantu ufike xa kuye kufunwa i-dieticians ungafiki, because sine problem apha ye dietician engekhoyo kuba zinqabile i-dieticians but ukuba siyayithatha lento ifakwe kwi curriculum azizokunqaba i-dieticians ziza kuba khona kungabikho bantu badla ibe worse eyokokuba kuthiwe abantu abakwazi kutya, abantu be diabetic ne hypertensive abatyi treatment, abatyi kutya kurayiti, kureleventi for ezi zinto zabo.
ICongress of the People iyayamkela ke le ripoti Sekela Somlomo. Enkosi. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Jam-Jam. Hon Cupido from Democratic Alliance.
Mr J C CUPIDO: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. Hon Deputy Speaker, Madam Premier in absentia, Executive mostly in absentia, Members of the House and a few guests of the House.
Nutrition is the power source that enables the body to function properly and keeps it healthy. The supply of nutrition furnishes the body via the intake of various food items. It enables it to carry out the body functions appropriately, thereby enabling it to protect itself from the invasion of viruses, bacteria and other toxins. During the current economic hardships faced by many in this province it is difficult to maintain sustainable diets in order to maintain health properly. As we know, the poorest of the poor in the Eastern Cape usually live in the most rural parts of this province. Many of the patients that make use of hospitals, like SS Gida Hospital that forms the basis of this report, suffers from ailments directly linked to lack of sustenance.
I mention all of this because many people disregard the importance of food and nutrition during their treatment and recovery in hospital. Not only will the nutrition received almost instantly help strengthen the body to fight the ailment, but many, no, most medications require the nutrients in food to aid it in absorption of the active chemicals within the medication. Many people don’t realise that medications can actually do significant long-term damage if taken on an empty stomach.
All the State-run hospitals in the Eastern Cape have severe shortages in doctors, professional nurses and other clinical staff, so we need to ensure that with the current staff we have the hospitals work as efficiently as possible. If medications are given properly in a way that work most efficiently then recovery times are cut down significantly, meaning that the few doctors we have can see and treat more patients and the cost and spend per patient is drastically reduced. Patients that have jobs can return to work quicker, creating a positive effect for the economy of this province.
All the members of this House are aware of the severe clinical vacancies in this province and dieticians are amongst those shortages. The reality of the matter is that those dieticians aren’t going to be appointed any time soon. As an alternative with hospitals currently without dieticians, we need to look at having the types of patients that they receive, categorised by the types of medication that they take and create a benchmark document and/or chart to ensure that they receive the right food for active ingredient absorption. Until we have dieticians in every hospital this measure can help to decrease the amount per day spent in hospital by patients.
Members of this House need to realise how important seemingly unimportant things are. We must just make sure that patients get food. We must not just make sure that patients get food. We must make sure that the meals are there with a reason.
The hospitals visited; as we all know and we have spoken at nosium over the last three months; there are major shortages, clinical shortages throughout this province. We are sitting with a vacancy rate of over 44%. There are 27,000 vacancies in this province; 1,200 medical doctors and medical specialists; 16,000 professional nurses.
Now as many people know, professional nurses are probably the most important part of all that list because they are the first contact for many of the patients. They are the people that deal with the immediate ailments that the patients have. So going to all these hospitals and seeing the different shortages that they have just clarifies that the budget that was received and the budget that was approved by this House is deficient. There is a budget that is not enough for healthcare in this province.
The infrastructure backlog is also very notable because just in the report alone and just two of the hospitals are mentioned of how many beds were not usable. It is 110 of one and 44 of the other. That is just the two that were mentioned – 150 beds. Now imagine with a hospital stay of three days for each patient. Just imagine and do the calculation of how many patients can be seen or seen to by doctors in hospitals if those beds were functioning.
It is the same thing that we saw at Komani Hospital when they had the rigmarole that happened over there. There were bed frames standing outside, rusting. Those were recoverable bed frames and yet we have patients that were sleeping on the floor in Queenstown where it snows during winter – and it did snow last year and it did snow this year and we can expect it to snow this year and we can expect it to snow next year also.
We need to ensure that the infrastructure that we have there gets maintained and we need to ensure that the infrastructure that isn’t there needs to be planned. We need to ensure that we can have more infrastructure and the only way we can do that unfortunately is to increase the budget. So yet again the budget that we pass as the House was deficient. I can carry on and list all the things that says in the report and bring it back to the budget. We severely need to re- look this budget.
We need to inject healthcare in this province with billions of rands and we need to have clear plans on how we are going to bring down the backlog and how we are going to bring us up to par before we can even start going ahead with infrastructure; before we can even start looking at implementing NHI in this province.
So, until we do that we can say that healthcare in the Eastern Cape is regressing at an alarming rate and it won't be long before we are looking at the type of healthcare that the people received in the middle ages.
The Democratic Alliance supports the reports. Thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Cupido. Hon Mhlati from UDM.
Mr M M MHLATI: Hon Deputy Speaker, hon MECs and hon members. Kudala imembers zekomiti yakwa Health zityelela izibhedlele, zikhupha iripoti but asina feedback esinayo esuka edipatimentini apho siza kukwazi ukuba siphinde back ebantwini siye kuthi njengokuba sasilapha nanku u-a,b,c,d esimphetheyo olungisiweyo.
Lonto ke yenza ukuba thina sibe zintlekisa kwaba bantu because siyikomiti nje yokuhamba iqokelela idatha ne-statistics engakwaziyo ukuba iye back ibalungiselele abantu izinto. Abantu bayabuza, bayasibona bathi siyaninqwenela ukuba niphinde nize kusinika i- feedback ube niqonda ukuba anizokukwazi ukuya kwaba bantu ukuyobanika i-feedback because ayikho, aninikwa feedback yidipatimenti so anikwazi kuya kwaba bantu.
Uyabona ke le into yokokuba kuthiwe abantu bayalamba esibhedlele ikhonfema lanto ukuba kuthiwe ukuba uye kulala kwezi zibhedlele zethu zilapha emaphandleni kukuyo kufa qha. Uyela ukuba uye kulinda ukufa kwakho … [Interjections.] ….kwezi zibhedlele abantu balambayo. Uza kuvuka kanjani ulamba? Uza kuvuka kanjani ulamba? Amandla uza kuwafumana phi? Amandla. I-treatment uyitya kanjani? [Interjections.] Ewe kaloku injalo into. Ukutya ukutyela ukuba kuze kunika amandla. Lo ugulayo ke ngoku, olambayo uyakuphakama kanjani kulabhedi elamba? Ulamba kwi institution kaRhulumente akugqiba elamba emakhaya, bebelamba emakhaya ulambe ngoku sele engaphakathi kuRhulumente. [Interjections.]
Kwezi zethu kuyalanjwa aba bantu batyiswa umvubo, umvubo ngesitya, umvubo ngalento kuthiwa yintoni, le sosa, le sosa yeyokubeka isonka xa uza kutya ubeke ewe, nge side plate. [Interjections.] Bayalamba abantu bakuthi intokunayo kea bantu bafumana imali eyonanto iphambili yinto yokokuba abantu bakuthi ndinethenda, ithenda yeyam mna ndiyatya. No madoda noko masicingeni elinye icebo kulento.
Phaya kula dipatimenti kukho i-unit ye quality assurance, kukho i-unit phaya kukho i-Directors phaya kukho iChief Directors ze quality assurance zenza ntoni? Aba bantu benza ntoni? Baqashelwe ukuba bamkele i-salaries qha bengawenzi umsebenzi wabo? Yeyiphi le quality assurance bayenzayo xa sifumana ezi zinto? Iphi le quality assurance bayenzayo xa sifumana iripoti ezinje?
Bantu bakuthi makutshintshweni madoda, singabantu abaMnyama ngodade wethu nomama bethu notata omncinci, notata omkhulu bethu aba balamba kwezi zibhedlele. Mawungathi uzube wena Pemmy uthi nokuba utshayiswe ngapha eMt Frere uxolele ukuba mawusiwe eSt Dominics uzishiya zonke eziya zakho izibhedlele ubalekiselwe eMonti kuba eziya zezokulala odyaloyi aba bangathathi ndawo.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Mhalti, ngubani uPemmy?
Mr M M MHLATI: Hon Majodina.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Oh, okay. [Laughter.[
Mr M M MHLATI: NguPemmy ke elinye igama yakhe. I-UDM iyayixhasa le ripoti. [Laughter.] [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Mhlati. African National Congress, hon Wana.
Ms T WANA: Deputy Speaker, Members of the Executive, Members of the Legislature, communities, distinguished guests, officials of Health. Deputy Speaker, let me greet you all in the name of love. [Interjections.] As we are aware Deputy Speaker that the African National Congress has got a manifesto and within its manifesto there are five priorities. Health is the second priority of African National Congress. Speaker, although this Department of Health has got many problems, there are also good efforts that give hope that one day we will overcome all these difficulties because the Department has managed in these difficulties to have a qualified audit opinion.
As the committee has visited these hospitals and fortunately most of their problems are the same. First of all, the department is lacking to employ in the vacancies, more especially the ordinary workers. We are appealing because within the manifesto the African National Congress is requesting us in power that we must create jobs. Most of these hospitals that we have visited there is a lack of workforce within the institutions.
Secondly Deputy Speaker, I am very proud to stand up in front of this august House saying that in... [Interjections.] ...in Stellenbosch the Medical Research Council is trying to design a medication which is going to remedy the TB for less than six months and the average estimate of that treatment is going to take two weeks, so our communities are going to be free in this tuberculosis widespread, more especially in the rural areas.
When we are talking about this hospital in Keiskammahoek, SS Gida Hospital, it is situation in a flat area and as a result when it is raining the patients are suffering and the hospital is built with prefabs, so the department must try and set aside a budget to rebuild that hospital with a very solid material and try to relocate it.
Secondly, all these hospitals that we have visited there is a shortage of special skills, like Madikane, special doctors; like Elizabeth; and secondly, in the OR Tambo, we are very proud because we have identified as NHI place so that we can try and implement the NHI.
Secondly, in Gida Hospital there is no organised labour, as a result it is not easy to manage the workers without an organised labour because we do not have a clear platform to communicate to the staff because there is no organised labour within the institution. All these hospitals that we have visited, the department must revisit, to rebuild and capacitate their hospital boards and put in institutional structures so that all these hospitals can function smoothly. I am very proud because all of them are very clean. Having all these problems that I have highlighted, keep it up Department of Health.
Deputy Speaker, I am appealing to all of us. Tat uBele, please listen to me; I am talking. [Interjections.] Let us be proud of being South Africans because if you can listen and follow the incidences; in the United States of America in the AIDS Conference, South Africa was congratulated because of reducing the spread of HIV/AIDS and prevention of mother-to-child transmission that has been made by us as South Africans. [Applause.] As a result, the Americans have pledged an amount of $480 million to assist us in South Africa. Let us be proud of ourselves as South Africans.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Wana, kukho isandla esiphakamisileyo.
Ms T WANA: Oh, just tell her she must...
Ms V MVENYA: Enkosi hon Deputy Speaker. Bendicela ukubuza apha kuhon member ukuba ngubani utata uBhele?
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Wana.
Ms T WANA: Tat uBele is that old man from UDM. [Laughter.] So we are proud. All what I said Deputy Speaker, as African National Congress we salute our former President, Dr Albert Batini Quma, who was a gynaecologist, who fought and defend women’s rights. We also salute Albertina Sisulu who also have formed a Professional Nursing in a very distinct manner. All these heroes that I highlighted are coming from a poor rural Chris Hani District. [Interjections.]
Lastly Deputy Speaker, let me congratulate African National Congress for building a solid foundation and a good ideological concept, as a result today we stand proud as African National Congress. We can defend the African states from the colonisers, as a result we have put Dr Nkosazana Zuma as the Commissioner of Africa. For that I solute ANC. Thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Wana. Hon MEC Jonas.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS (ON BEHALF OF THE MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR HEALTH): Hon Deputy Speaker, hon chairperson of the portfolio committee...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Inzolo.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS (ON BEHALF OF THE MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR HEALTH): Hon members of the committee and Members of the House, on behalf of the Department of Health I hereby accept the report by the Portfolio Committee on Health.
We must say that the information coming out of these visits is always useful, both in pointing to our weaknesses, but also ensuring that it enhances and strengthens our planning moving forward. Importantly, I wish to appreciate the extent and contrasting nature of the work undertaken by the committee during these site visits. The visits were very interactive and informative, as well as inclusive, as they left nothing to chance.
However, I must say that the menu of issues emerging out of these visits is probably a common place these days. It is raised from the quality of care and patient management, infection control, service packages, infrastructure development and maintenance, human resources, supply chain management and many more other things. It is very clear. I think the task of turning around health in the Eastern Cape and probably in the country is a very big one and it is also clear that a lot of progress has been made in many parts of the province, as at the same time a lot of challenges are with us.
Two issues seem to be emphasised by most of the speakers and I would want to highlight them. The first is that it is very clear the resources with which we have to deal with these problems are not adequate, as a result many speakers respond by saying that we should increase the budget to support the turnaround and transformation that we want to have.
However, we need also to make another point that we think is important in moving forward, which is the need to enhance efficiencies within the system and restructure and rationalise our service delivery platform. It is very clear I think that if you look at the structure of our public health system in the province it does require that we do major work to improve efficiencies, reduce wastage within the system so that we can save more resources that we can direct to real development and implementation.
That is why as a Department we have actually introduced the multi- agency working group to ensure that we deal and confront the challenges and the scourge of corruption and ensure that we also re- engineer our supply chain management and resource management processes in order to generate more outcome out of these things.
We commit ourselves to get back to the committee in the time prescribed with detailed responses to all the questions and issues raised. I thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon MEC. I put the report.
Agreed.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Any objections?
No objections.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: I will ask the secretary to read the fifth order of the day.
CONSIDERATION OF THE REPORT OF THE PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON TRANSPORT ON THE VISIT TO TRAFFIC STATIONS.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Nodada; chairperson Makaula.
Ms M B NODADA: Sekela Somlomo ohloniphekileyo, iNkulumbuso ingekho, abaPhathiswa, amalungu ePalamente ogxa bam, amalungu asuka kula department ndimele yona apha, iindwendwe ezikhona phaya phezulu.
I am going to table the report on the Portfolio Committee on Transport about the visit we undertook to traffic stations. The report is on page 274 and hon Deputy Speaker, I will not read the findings of the traffic stations, but I will just move straight to...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Ingathi le ngxolo yenu iyongamela isithethi ngoku, siya cela malungu.
Ms M B NODADA: I will just move to the general findings because all these findings that are tabled under each traffic station are similar and they are compiled under general findings.
General findings are in page 284.
General findings affecting all stations:
(a) The delay in distribution of uniforms resulting in other stations not receiving the same uniforms, causes there to be no standard followed nor any proper insignia to instil dignity into the traffic fraternity. There is no discipline in terms of the wearing of an uniform; traffic officers wear wrong ranks.
General Recommendation:
(a) The Department must resolve with speed and must develop and approve the uniform policy in order to have a smooth and professional execution of operations under the traffic control section. General Finding:
(b) The upliftment course was not relevant to the law enforcement function as it included English grammar lessons, being of low standard (conducted by a FET College) and proving to be a fruitless expenditure. The East Cape Midlands College has not been of much benefit to traffic officers as it is a FET College. Nonetheless, the department awarded a R3.1 million contract based on a “belief or hunch” that this contract was the best.
The Department is requested to forward the responses to the following recommendations to the Committee within 30 days of adoption of this report.
General Recommendation:
(b) A forensic investigation of the awarding of the training contract to the East Cape Midlands College is needed.
General Finding:
(c) The centralisation of resources, including stationery, has a negative effect on the appropriate operations of different traffic stations. The lack of involvement of all station commanders in strategic discussion, results in poor attempts to address the unique challenges faced by traffic stations. The non- involvement of station commanders result in:
Improper allocation of resources to stations, not prioritising stations that are disadvantaged but yet are working hard to reduce road accidents.
Distorted flow of communication and information, especially to stations like Maluti, Maclear, Mt Ayliff, Butterworth, Mbizana and Sterkspruit that cannot access electronic information.
General Recommendation:
(c) The Department should consider the decentralization of the budget to allow planning, operation and control by station commanders, as well as the ability to implement their plans efficiently for their stations. The involvement of all station commanders in strategic discussions and information flow is required in order for the department to understand and address the unique challenges of each station and to enable the prioritisation of disadvantaged stations so that they can work efficiently in reducing road accidents.
General Finding:
(d) The satellite stations that were reported to have been built for Humansdorp, Stutterheim and Lovers Twist have been vandalized. This exposes the traffic officers in these areas to non-conducive, unhealthy and unsafe working environments. Humansdorp satellite station expressed a need to be allocated proper office space with equipment and furniture.
General Recommendation:
(d) The Department must explain to the committee the reasons for allowing fruitless expenditure in terms of purchasing mobile offices for satellite stations that were never used and that were exposed to vandalism, even though they were mainly meant for effecting a proper traffic control service (two are located in Humansdorp, two in Kareedouw, two in the Langkloof, two in Stutterheim and one in Lovers Twist).
The Department must seek assistance through the Department of Public Works with regard to a house (erf 53) that needs to be allocated to the Department of Transport as proper office space with equipment and furniture (Humansdorp satellite station).
General Finding:
(e) There is no space for impounded cars and therefore traffic officers do not impound cars even if they deserve to be impounded.
General Recommendation:
(e) The Department must liaise with other departments like SAPS, Agriculture and/or municipality with regard to land that can be used for keeping impounded vehicles and stray animals.
General Finding:
(f) The vehicle mileage restriction is hampering services of law enforcement due to vast areas that each station has to cover; 3125km per month is not adequate in order to execute operations.
General Recommendation:
(f) Reviewal of the 3125 mileage restriction per month for traffic control vehicles to cover fast distances such as the Alfred Nzo and Joe Gqabi districts, is needed in order to address challenges relating to effecting law enforcement.
General Finding:
(g) Drunken driving is no longer tested by means of screens, only by means of blood tests. However, the blood test takes longer because the blood kit is with SAPS. Blood kits are sometimes being tampered with, which can result in people suing the government. This challenge leaves the department with ineffective/non-existing law enforcement in terms of drunken driving.
General Recommendation:
(g) The Department needs to find a way of ensuring that law enforcement is carried out efficiently. Options of getting blood kits to reside with the traffic control section need to be explored with a view of effecting a well-organised law enforcement programme. This is especially relevant to drunken driving as it has proved to be a significant cause of road accidents.
General Finding:
(h) The non-payment of acting allowances for the Maclear traffic station from 2004-2005 and again from 2008-January 2012 - whilst other acting station commanders were paid – is an indication of inconsistency in departmental operations and poor decision making.
General Recommendation:
(h) The Department must issue a payment to the officer who has been an acting station commander for all the services he has rendered to the department. The department has an option of requesting district managers to confirm the acting station commander’s services and issue payment.
General Finding:
(i) There is no driver license traffic centre in Joe Gqabi, nor computers with working e-natis systems. This situation poses as a threat to efficient operations in the district.
General Recommendation:
(i) The Department must ensure that all traffic stations have up-to- date and functioning computers with e-natis systems to allow traffic officers to carry out their law enforcement functions with ease. The possibility of having DLTC in each local municipality would mean services are brought to the people in order to avoid long distance travelling for learner and driver license tests.
General finding:
(j) There are general assistants attached to the traffic station, who are on Level 2 and who qualify for Level 3 due to the number of years of service. Some stations do not even have general assistants.
General recommendation:
(b) The general assistants who qualify must be promoted as soon as possible and also be paid back outstanding monies if applicable. The Department must ensure that all stations have general assistants.
General finding:
(k) There is an officer at the Port Elizabeth Station who in 2009, when the committee visited the station, came forward with information on alleged maladministration, corruption, nepotism, racism and sexual misconduct. Subsequent to the committee’s visit this officer was dismissed for an offence which allegedly happened before the committee’s visit.
General recommendation:
(k) The Department must seriously consider reviewing the sanction that it imposed on the official, due to the fact that it is illegal in terms of Section 4 of the Evidence and Information before the Eastern Cape Legislature Act, Act 4 of 2007, to penalize or victimise officials who provide evidence or information to any Portfolio Committee of the Eastern Cape Legislature with a view to assisting it in discharging its oversight functions over the departments. In the absence of this protection from the Act, witnesses or officials will not be keen to give evidence to the Committee for fear of victimization as allegedly was the case in the above matter. A progress report must be submitted to the committee within 30 days of adoption of this report.
General finding:
(l) The committee’s visit to traffic stations in 2009 has made a difference to traffic operations in the province - especially with regard to the disbanding of the “provincial task team”. However, vigorous oversight is needed because more challenges are experienced in the traffic control section, which results in the demoralisation of traffic officers.
General recommendation:
(l) The Department is commended for acting on the resolutions of the House. The committee hopes that the department will continue to implement the resolutions of the House to strengthen its mandate and carry forward the vision of quality transportation.
General finding:
(m) The Mfundisi case resulted in some stations experiencing a challenge of not having any Level 7s to supervise Level 6s.
General recommendation:
(m) The Department must organise the traffic control directorate in order that all levels are represented and acting positions are filled.v The Mfundisi case has caused operational challenges that need a speedy organisational structure solution.
General finding:
(n) The traffic officers are exposed to much danger by driving vehicles that are long overdue for service and having to drive fast in order to escort correctional services transporting dangerous inmates.
General recommendation:
(n) Traffic officers must be given danger allowances to cover them for the dangers they are exposed to.
General finding:
(o) The Department is faced with a challenge of having many L10 officers in one station whilst there are stations with L8 traffic officers acting as station commanders.
General recommendations:
(o) The Department should consider better utilising the experience of L10 traffic officers by opening up new traffic stations and satellite stations in order to normalise the operations at traffic stations.
The committee wishes to thank the staff for assisting it in the compilation of this report and also the committee members themselves are thanked for their well availability. Thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Makaula. Questions? Hon Fihlani.
Ms K FIHLANI: Ndiyabulela ke Somlomo obekekileyo. Bendikhanuka ukuqonda ke Somlomo phaya kwala phepha lamakhulu amabini anamashumi asibhozo anesine kula ndawo ingu “k” ubani ebedibene nesebe liye lathi kwenzeke ni kulamntu kuthiwa baye bafumanisa ukuba uthe xa exeleli i-information ebeyifunwa yi Legislature bathi ukuba bemke wagxothwa umntu. Lithi bekutheni isebe ize lide lifikelele kulento ba lixhothe umntu obegqithise i- information ibifunwa ngabo?
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Neer.
Mr D NEER: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. Mine is a minor, but important question. I just need to be schooled because the report in some areas talks about a car and in other areas talks about vehicles. My knowledge is that a car is a car, but it is also one of the vehicles; also referred to as a vehicles because there are LDVs (Light Delivery Vans) which are also vehicles. So when it talks about vehicles about in one finding and recommendation and talks about cars it is a bit confusing. [Laughter.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Committee members.
Mr M B NODADA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. The first question by hon Fihlani, we can respond to say it is still work-in- progress between the committee and the department, the issue of the traffic officer that we feel has been victimised.
The other one of the semantics hon Speaker, I don’t know; car and vehicles I think it is just the same thing.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Okay. Clarities to the MEC? Hon Mvenya and hon Fihlani.
Ms V MVENYA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. The committee has a finding about the conditions in the Butterworth station and as far as I can remember this issue was raised in the portfolio committee and the department promised to do something about that station. They even went further and visited the station and now the committee is still finding about the same issue.
Hon Deputy Speaker, the issue there is not just about the renovations; it is about the contractor that left the work incomplete and then everything was just left there lying. There are no offices there at all. They left the floor i-tiles, yayintoni le yayikhona, the floor ayikhona yaxotyulwa andazi nokuba yayiyintoni na but kukho umhlaba there in those offices, so they can't occupy those offices.
Hon Deputy Speaker, to hear the committee finding about the same issue noko hon Speaker, we must think about those traffic officers who can't occupy offices and the number of traffic officers that were there and the promise that was made by the Department. Uvile njena.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Fihlani.
Ms K FIHLANI: Hayi sele ndehlikile ndihleli nosihlalo apha ecaleni kwam.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Congress of the people, hon Korkie.
Mr J P KORKIE: Goeie middag Agbare Speaker, Lede van die Huis, departementele amptenare, geeerde gaste, personeel, ek groet elkeen vanmiddag, asook die Lid van die Uitvoerende Raad. Because I know some of us won't understand what I have said in this beautiful language of ours, I will repeat here and there in English. I think the part the MEC for Transport would like to hear is how did I greet her. I have not yet greeted you. I saved you for the English part. Good afternoon to a very beautiful MEC today. I don’t know why you are dressed so beautifully. Is it designed to make me soft so I don’t go too hard on you? [Interjections.]
Hon Speaker, this is one of those speeches where ndiyancoma; I am very happy with the report that has been compiled, specifically because it is a follow-up report. The Legislature is working. We promised and the promise is not empty. We went into 2009 after a few months in office, we made a few observations hon Deputy Speaker, we came back, we made findings, we made recommendations, we brought it to this House, there were resolutions and quite a few of them were implemented where possible. Where it was not possible... [Interjections.] He is asking whether I am making eyes for you, hon MEC. It is not the case. [Laughter.] The emphasis is on the fact that we made a promise and we were able to keep some of those promises. Where we were not able to keep some of those promises there was a tangible explanation.
In the offices that we visited, in the stations that we visited, I can understand hon Cingo’s message yesterday was sisaklerisha asikazokusebenza ncam; we have been given limited time to complete the process. Now whilst I hear what hon Cingo is saying there are areas, like the one that hon Fihlani asked a question about – the officer, the process and the reply by the chairperson – some of the things were not worked on and we complained about it, or it was not sufficiently addressed and we complained about it; we made findings, hence it is appearing here. Hon Mvenya in absentia – oh sorry; no you are absent there. You are absent in your seat, so I didn’t see you.
The question of the Butterworth Station is not one that can be easily solved. When we were there also the last time we could see it is going to take some serious footwork in order to address the problem that is in that station. So all in all I am happy with some of the progress that was made in many of the stations. We were really happy that some members moved from the one level to the next.
However, I am going to highlight a few things which I think is still a problem and it is a problem that can end. It is not something that cannot be worked on as long as there is a plan in place and meticulously worked to sort it out. Can I make an example? I think what we need to understand is a department operates according to a philosophy of the ruling party, oh sorry, the governing party. Let me not say ruling party. There is a difference. If you govern and you govern with a particular philosophy and hon, I think hon Nkayi one day made an appalling speech about social conscience and in that speech he mentioned what is your ultimate aim for your people; what is it that you want to achieve for society. Now I notice we still have officials or sensibly carrying out the mandate of the party in government wrongly. I repeat that. It is being carried out with the misconception of what must actually be done.
I think what is important is that the currency has changed from being an ANC government that had to make sure things are done right; they are now the ones who must actually make it right. So the thinking we should have is developmental state, but we should also be strict.
Masiyeke ukucenga aba bantu basivotelayo. We must stop doing favours for those people who make sure that the ANC gets a lot of votes and we must just be precise when dealing with that. If an official is powerful in terms of working very hard for the ruling party, he cannot be rewarded. He cannot be rewarded by not disciplining him when he is naughty. That is one big problem we are having in the government department. The department’s systems quite often is running like clockwork, it is there, it is revolutionised, it is up-to-date in terms of the latest technology, but someone somewhere is holding the entire department to ransom. It is a political matter. It must stop. It is not administrative.
I must say on the question of the Transport Department and the traffic stations that we visited, if there is one thing that stands out like a pole above water then it is the low morale in the traffic department in the traffic services. My observation is, they do feel like the stepchildren of the security forces of the law enforcement agency. You find the traffic officers standing at night or at a roadblock, making a very important arrest. Let us say it is the Boeremag that he is arresting; a car full of traitors; he calls in the Police; the Police takes over; the Police appears in the press as the heroes; they have made the arrest; they've saved this country from these traitors, but the actual people who arrested them and who detected these people were traffic officers. Quite often when the traffic officer is making the arrest he does so without a bulletproof vest. He does so with conditions of service that are far inferior to the Police who actually gets the glory for all of these good things. It is wrong.
We have heard in the report that they escort dangerous prisoners to a maximum prison in Kokstad. They are part of the procession, but they are not in the chain of the security cluster. The Correctional Services are part of security, the Police is part of security, the Intelligence Services are part of security, but the donkey workers are not part of it.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: One minute left.
Mr J P KORKIE: They are left out in terms of salary; they are left out in terms of treatment; they are left out in terms of exposure; they are left out in terms of career development. Now how are these people going to have a high morale? You tell me. So I hear the noises made by RTMC (Road Traffic Management Corporation) about it a national services. I support that move, although I don’t support this name called nationalisation. It has got some sort of negative connotation, so I don’t want to talk about nationalising the traffic officers. Just now people think they must go and work in the mines. I don’t want that.
It is important hon Deputy Speaker that a person cannot sit on one level for 26 years, about to retire and then someone else comes in and in seven years the person moves to level 10. It can't be, leaving behind the old man who has been sitting on the level for X number of years through no fault of his own. So I am asking hon Deputy Speaker that these matters be addressed as a matter of urgency. Cope supports the report. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Korkie. Hon Haddon from the Democratic Alliance.
Mr D B HADDON: Hon Deputy Speaker, Madam Premier, MECs, Members of the Legislature, our officials and guests in the gallery; good evening to you.
Effective law enforcement doesn't just happen. The basic managerial building blocks have to be put in place for effective law enforcement to take place in our roads. The Department needs proactive budgeting in order to equip all provincial traffic stations.
The Democratic Alliance welcomes the commitment by the MEC for Transport to introduce a 24-hour traffic patrol in the province following the tragic Cradock bus accident on Saturday 21 July.
However, Deputy Speaker, what is of concern is why do we get this commitment from the MEC after 21 people or 18 people or whatever have died? Why do we always have to implement these things after a tragedy? If there had been traffic officers deployed at the Eastern Cape road boundary, is it possible that early law enforcement interventions by these officers when the vehicle entered the province, could have prevented this horrific accident from happening?
Deputy Speaker, two years ago in this Chamber I put forward a motion on behalf of the DA that there should be increased cross- provincial traffic law enforcement at our Eastern Cape provincial road boundaries and the reply from the then MEC Barry was that it would be done, subject to human resources.
Clearly, however, effective traffic law enforcement is ineffective in this province and the department needs to get back to the basics of good traffic management. I would like to follow on what my hon friend, hon Korkie said that traffic officers need to be motivated. They need to be well equipped and have high morale if this province is to radically reduce motor accidents on our roads.
I think also what is very important that has been said by hon Korkie as well is that we are dealing here with lives; above anything else we are dealing with lives and it is absolutely important that we have safe roads.
The report before us unfortunately shows us how this province is failing in this regard. How can we have a traffic station effectively police its area of jurisdiction without adequate police patrol vehicles? If you read the report it is riddled with stations that don’t have enough vehicles.
How can an officer perform law enforcement tasks on our roads without adequate uniform and a bulletproof protected vest? Why do traffic stations like Butterworth and Mbizana and others not have basic equipment, like fax machines, furniture and computers, as has been raised now by my hon friend, hon Mvenya? How can we curb drunken driving law enforcement in this province when the alcohol testing centre in Port Elizabeth which was defunct two years ago when we visited there is still not operational today? Why is the Department allowing alcohol blood samples to be tampered with while under the control of the SAPS?
I mean, these are basic things that shouldn’t be happening and it is showing lack of management and proper management authority. How can the Kinkelbos Weighbridge Station have offices who operate the weighbridges without the necessary qualifications and certificates? Then we wonder why our roads are broken all the time because of the trucks because of inadequate weighing and then we have a weighbridge that is not working in Queenstown? Why are such mundane functions such as general assistants not being properly equipped and empowered to do their work?
So the list goes on and I can go on adnosium. If managerial basics are in place then issues like staff morale and willingness to go the extra mile will automatically fall in place, resulting in effective traffic law enforcement. That is basic; that is a natural law. You put the building blocks in; things would develop from there.
Speaker, the Department can't expect positive results from campaigns like Drive Alive unless the basics of traffic management and law enforcement are in place. Speaker, in the Western Cape the Transport Department under colleague...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Haddon, there is a hand that is up. Hon Majodina.
Ms P MAJODINA: Thank you very much. I just wanted to check if the member did not make a mistake when we is saying we must drive alive? You cannot drive when you are dead. [Laughter.]
Mr D P HADDON: Sorry, what is the problem? Speaker, in the Western Cape the Transport Department under MEC Robin Carlyle, has reduced the death toll on its roads by 28 percent; from 1,682 deaths in May 2009 to 1,254 deaths in May this year. Why is this being achieved? The basics are in place. The number of staff in Western Cape Blood Testing Centres has quadrupled. Drivers with outstanding warrants in the Western Cape can't transact with eNatis until their cases are finalised. Breathalysing testing is to be re- introduced under improved regulations in the Western Cape.
Speaker, the Western Cape was introducing a Provincial Traffic Bill in June this year. This Bill will give the MEC powers to create appropriate and applicable traffic regulations for the province.
Speaker, in conclusion, what do we need to do?
1. The Department needs to do an urgent reprioritising of the back- to-basics budget that ensures that all traffic stations and offices are adequately resourced. 2. A skills audit and training of offices where...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: One minute left.
Mr D B HADDON: ...we have the greatest need.
3. Immediate decentralisation of traffic station management from district to station level is of urgent priority. 4. Every traffic officer needs to be equipped with full and correct uniform, ranking signia and relevant equipment.
Hon Deputy Speaker, if the Department implements these recommendations as soon as possible and take a leaf out of what is happening in the Western Cape for example, this province will see the fruits of effective traffic management for many years to come.
The DA supports the report. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Haddon. United Democratic Movement, hon Hlekiso-Thabaneng.
Ms Z HLEKISO-THABANENG: Enkosi Deputy Speaker. Xa sithetha ngo Transport oko kuqala mhlawumbi sithetha ngo traffic officers kufuneka sithelekise nenani lengozi ezenzekayo apha ephondweni sijonge amaxesha nendlela ezenzeka ngayo.
One – ukuba i-traffic officers zingena ngo 6 ziphuma u-6 ayithethi kuthi imoto azihambi ngo 7 zona, ziyahamba akukho mntu ukhontrolayo ngelo xesha. Yiyo lonto kuya kufumaniseka iingozi zikhona.
Two – ukubangaba i-centres zokuthesta iimoto ziprayivethayizwa nguRhulumente lonto ithetha ukuthi iimoto zipasiswa zingalungelanga ukuba zingene ezindleleni.
Okwesithathu – ikhondishini eziphangela kuzo i-traffic officers zinegalelo nazo. One – baphuma ekholejini, two uyaqeshwa umntu uya kwesiya sitishi besithethwa phaya saseGcuwa besithethwa nguhon Mvenya esiqale ngo 2009 ukurenoveyithwa akukabikho nethemba lokuba size sigqitywe ngoku ngu-2012.
Uphuma ekholejini uza apha uzixelele ukuba uze kuphangela ufika akuna ofisi, ufika akukho nto uzakuyenza akukho fax, akukho ntoni akukho nto uzakuyenza, akukho nto ikubangela ukuba mawuphangele ncakasana. Kuza kuthi kufika ukuba silungiswe isitishi ube sele umoshakele sowungakwazi ukuphangela, ungasakwazi ukuphangela. Zezinye ke zezinto ezibangela ukuba kubekho igalelo le ngozi ezininzi.
If i-traffic officers ziya pat-thayima ukuphangela kwazo if ba kuthiwa yi overtime kuthiwa hayi i-overtime siza kubhatala i-hours ezithile asikwazi kubhatala konke so abantu abazokuphangela umntu uzakuphangela eza hours azakuzibhatalwa ukuba zimbini uzakuphangela i-two hours ezinye abuye ahlale phantsi. Zezo zinto ke ezibangela ukuba kubekho igalelo le ngozi ezininzi apha ephondweni.
Ukuba uyayibona ke iripoti yakwa transport uzakufumaniseka ukuba akukho zi recommendations per isitishi. Kuba uza kuthatha iripoti yala themu iphelileyo ka 2004 ithetha into enye yayokuphela ngo 2009. Uphinde uthathe u2009 ukuza kutsho ngoku uthetha into enye thus ke siye sabona ukuba hayi masingabinazo i-recommendations per isitishi kuthethwa into enye.
Ibuye ke ngoku ize kulento ithi ithini irowuli yePalamente kwi resolutions ezithathwa yiPalamente ezinga implimentwayo zidipatimenti? Ithini irowuli yazo? Sithetha apha sibeka o-30 days ithini lento emveni kwe 30 days? Ithini yona iripoti yePalamente ezakuyiveza xa kuphela ithemu ithi kule dipatimenti nazi i- resolutions, nazi ziye zapasa ezi, ezi zixinge phaya? Zikhona ezo records size kukwazi ukuba sizifumane?
Ukuba lomsebenzi siwenzayo uthetha ukuthini? Siyaphuma sihamba siya ezitishini senze i-findings sibuye size kuthetha apha sixoxe senze yonke into ekugqibeleni ithini yonke lento?
Enye into ebangela ukuba lo msebenzi ungahambi zi promotions ezenzekayo phaya yena umfundisi urayiti ikomiti yamlwela umfundisi and others case, lakheyisi yapasa but idipatimenti ayikwazi kulungisa. Kufumaniseka esitishini ukuba i-traffic officers ziyi 14 abayi 10 bakwi level eyi one ephezulu bonke abayi 4 balapha ezantsi. Ngubani oripota komnye, ngubani ozakuthini? Akukho nto ilungiswayo.
Zezinye ezibangela ukuba kungabikho ndlela imbi intle yokusebenza phaya. Asizokuthetha, eyi problem ekhoyo ke yila uniform yayakufunwa eWestern Cape ebangela ukuba kungabikho uniform nanamhlanje.
Idipatimenti ke isiqhathile ngoku besiyenza yathi hayi kwezi veki zizayo i-uniform iyaphuma iya ezitishini. Ayikafiki. [Interjections.] EWestern Cape. Ayikafiki i-uniform. O-traffic officer abana uniform since 2009. Besijikeleza kwezi veki ziphelileyo i-uniform ayikabikho. Usebenza kanjani wena kuqala ungengomzekelo, ungena uniform?
Lento ye acting allowance, kukho izitishi, bona abantu abaphethwanga kakuhle kwa traffic department besamkela imali encinci benjalo. U- ekthe from 2004 uze kutsho kunanamhlanje akukho nto uyifumanayo abanye bayafumana. Lento iyenzeka ke phaya eMaclear ayiyo ntsomi.
Nokuqhuba kwabantu ke i-license zingaziwa, andazi ke eJoe Gqabi uhon Majodina kufuneka asijongele ukuba i-license zipaswa phi na phaya eJoe Gqabi kuba yenye yendawo ekhankanyiweyo asiyazi ukuba bazifumana phi abantu baseJoe Gqabi i-license.
Ofenisha zizinto esakhala ngazo yonke le mihla esithetha ngazo, zizinto ezibangela ukuba kungabikho msebenzi. I-UDM eyonanto iyithethayo iphambili kukuba sizimisele sakukhala yonke le mihla akuzokunceda nto simane sibaleka kuthiwa kwenzeke ingozi kubhubhe abantu abayi 20 siye phaya siye kukhala. Senzani emveni koko? I-UDM ke iyayixhasa iripoti yekomiti. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Thabaneng. Hon Dimaza from African National Congress.
Mr M DIMAZA: Enkosi Deputy Speaker. Hon MECs, Chief Whip, Members of the House, departmental officials and officials of the Legislature.
Masiqala Deputy Speaker by indicating that as the African National Congress masiyincome into yokokuba oko kuthe kwaqashwa i-HoD kula dipatimenti ikhona i-improvement ebonakalayo as far as management is concerned. Siyayincoma kakhulu lonto as i-African National Congress.
Okwesibini kuya bonakala kwakhona into yokokubana because kukho u-HoD at least there are responses that are coming to the Committee where as a Committee siphetha sixola zi responses that we are getting. Before that besixabana oko koko nedipatimenti but it doesn’t mean akukho ukuxabana ngoku. Kodwa what just as a committee we need to indicate there is an improvement in management of the department of transport and overall accountability.
The second thing hon Speaker that we want to highlight before I get into it masikhe sizame ukucacisa lento soloko sikowutelwa nge Western Cape apha. I-Western Cape hon Haddon it is only a person who is a visitor in South Africa that will believe time and again what we are saying about Western Cape. What you must understand Western Cape was a Cape Province. Western Cape as Cape Province it was developed through the taxpayers of this particular province and other provinces. That is why in the Western Cape you can move from Tulbagh, you can move to Ceres, you can move to Wesley you can move to everywhere. You will never get a gravel road even some going to the plase. So it is wrong that time and again people come here and tell us about the Western Cape which that particular Western Cape is where it is because of the taxpayers money of the people of this particular province and other provinces.
Okwesibini I think hon Haddon iWestern Cape basics in the Western Cape were build by the African National Congress that you must recognized. Otherwise ukuba bekungekho apha kule House bendifuna ukuyiphendula ke lento uyithethayo. Secondly I want to indicate also to my learned friend Korkie, Korkie in absentia Korkie must understand I think as a learned friend that there are labour force …..
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Ngubani uKorkie?
Mr M DIMAZA: Hon Korkie as a learned friend that there are labour laws that are governing the employment of any employee in this particular country. It cannot be said because we are here it is going to be easy to dismiss any official. If the department there are processes that are being followed by the Department we need to understand that. But you must not come here and just play in the gallery and think to dismiss an official it can happen over an night. It does not happen in South African. And yet if that was happening people are going to say it is a banana republic. But it is not happening there are labour laws that needs to be followed whenever you are going to dismiss any official because officials in this country are covered by labour laws that we have set up. People must not continue to think there are those particular old labour laws that were there before.
I think as the African National Congress we support the investigation that the Department of Transport is making as far as the Stroondale traffic office is concerned. Also we do hope as the African National Congress that the outcomes of that particular report of that investigation will be quickly reported to the portfolio committee and the department will act as such.
We do also believe the department must take the recommendations of other investigations seriously and take the necessary remedial steps required to enable smooth and effective operations of all the stations where there are investigations that are being made.
As the African National Congress we still believe there are challenges that are facing the department as far as traffic is concerned. The department has not demonstrated that it has sufficient internal capacity to run the provincial fleet since it took it over from Fleet Africa in 2012. This has a spill over effect on the provisioning of vehicles to the traffic officers.
The challenge of level 10 station commanders, traffic officers in one Imfundisi Station is also a challenge that we believe the department needs to look into seriously and correct this matter the sooner the better. I think because Imfundisi case also has led to some kind of double parking that is taking place in a number of stations that is in the province and the department needs to look into this particular matter and correct them the sooner the better.
The centralisation of resources and functions at district level and the non-involvement of station commanders in budgeting and planning at district level is something that needs the department to look at it and also it needs some kind of corrections as quickly as possible.
Also as the African National Congress we note that there are improvements that have been made by the department. (1) it is the question of the disbanning of the provincial task team and which we welcome that particular disbanment of the provincial task team.
Secondly, second traffic stations such as Engcobo and Grahamstown have improved and the department is encouraged to replicate this into other stations.
Engcobo; when we went there, the traffic officers zazingenazo i- firearms, even the station commander, but now when you go to that Engcobo you will see the station commander, even some of the traffic officers they do have the safety vest, they do have the firearms and that is something that we need to say it is something that is encouraging. We need to applaud the Department for that, but we are saying the department needs to replicate this even to the other stations.
The issue of the vehicle occupancy rate:
Again, when we went to these particular stations in 2009 we noticed that there was four traffic officers per vehicle, but now we have seen improvement because there are two traffic officers per vehicle, but there is still an improvement as far as some of these particular areas are concerned. So as the African National Congress we are saying there is improvement in that respect that has been made by the Department.
The commitment of traffic officers is commendable under the conditions they work. We commend the traffic officers for the work that they are trying to do under very difficult circumstances that they are working under, but also I think for us also we need also to understand, ayisoze malungu eNdlu yoWiso-Mthetho nawuphina uRhulumente akwazi ukubeka itraffic officer after each and every 10 kilometre kukho itraffic officer, ayisoze yenzeke lonto. Awusoze ukwazi ukuthi ingozi ayisoze ibekhona what so ever.
But what is critical is the Department must employ traffic officers, but also on our side we need to continue educating people around road safety. That is what is critical. People need to understand what is it that is road safety. If we come here all the time, we think it is only government that is going to stop the questions of these carnages that are taking place, we are making a serious mistake. What we need to do, we need also to educate people.
It is just like in Health. It is just like in Health. Government can have all the types of medicines for HIV and AIDS, but what is critical is you to be disciplined. All of us as drivers, we need to be disciplined as drivers. If we are not disciplined as drivers, every day we are going to experience the serious problems that we have and some people will come and blame government for that.
As the African National Congress, we support the report. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Dimaza. Hon MEC Marawu.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR PUBLIC WORKS, ROADS AND TRANSPORT: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. Hon Premier in absentia, hon members, distinguished guests, government officials, ladies and gentlemen.
Let me first take this opportunity to thank the Portfolio Committee on Transport for this report, which in my view will help us to improve the working conditions of our traffic officers and ultimately make the Eastern Cape Department of Transport an employer of choice.
As a Department we have noted all the findings and recommendations and I would like to assure this House that we will respond within the stipulated period. As the political head of the department I am convinced that we can improve the working conditions of our traffic officers so that they can diligently reaffirm their commitment, the values of the public services as enshrined in our department’s value standards, which include amongst others, loyal executing the policies of government, being faithful to statutory requirements and instructions, creativity in the execution of duties.
The Province of the Eastern Cape continues to be one of the hot spots in the country with a high number of road accidents. It then becomes imperative for the department to ensure that we create conducive conditions for our traffic officers in order to motivate them to adhere to the traffic officer’s oath which they have made when they joined these noble professions in which they promised to, amongst others; to serve mankind; enforce law appropriately without fear or favour, malice or ill will, always endeavour to make a contribution in the performance of their duties; recognise the badge as a symbol of public faith and accept it as a public trust to be held and be true to the ethics of the Traffic Police Service; continually strive to achieve Traffic Police Service objectives and ideals and dedicating themselves before God to their chosen profession, which is law enforcement.
With regard to the recommendations that have been presented to this House, I hope hon members would appreciate the efforts that have been made so far by the department in order to have a uniform policy, which is currently in draft form and is undergoing the consultation processes necessary for approval thereof.
The East Cape Midlanes College matter is one of the cases that the department has forwarded for the Special Investigation Unit for investigations and we are still awaiting a report in that regard.
Hon Speaker, the Department has six districts with traffic managers, whose responsibilities include preparations of budget and operational plans with the station commanders, therefore the station commanders are involved in these processes.
However, the Department acknowledges the concerns around inadequate resources allocation occasioned by inadequate budget. That is the only problem we are having. I doubt very much any political head can be comfortable and relaxed whereas the environment in which our traffic officers is not conducive for them to perform, but because of budget constraints we are unable to fulfil whatever we would like to see within their different areas of functions.
However, the Department acknowledges the concern around inadequate resources allocation as I have alluded earlier on. Budget for stations resides at the relevant district, except for the uniforms and PTT communicators, due to the fact that in the past these were not procured uniformly at all districts. In an attempt to improve the situation the department has recently established a station commander’s forum which will meet quarterly to address transversal concerns, with a view to deal with revealing challenges. I hope some of the challenges that have been identified by the portfolio committee will be addressed by this forum.
The Department acknowledges that the pilot project of establishing satellite stations has some challenges and we are in the process of reviewing the result of the project to form part of our traffic organisational structure, which will include establishment of permanent traffic stations. The re-establishment of those satellite stations which are recommended for permanent traffic stations will form part of our forward planning.
Hon Speaker, we remain committed to ensure that we work closely with the local authorities because the Pound Act stipulates that pounds are the competencies of the local authorities. The province has utilised the local authority and SPCA for stray animals and SAPS premises for vehicles. The impounding of vehicles is limited to incidents where those vehicles are used in criminal acts and must be placed in the custody of the police. Un-roadworthy vehicles must be removed from the roads under conditions stipulated in the National Roads Traffic Act and not impounded. The route vehicle for law enforcement is plus/minus 50kms distance throughout the province.
The Department is also undergoing austerity measures. The kilometre increase request will be considered after an investigation and if found necessary we may adjust in the next financial year.
With regard to blood kits:
All traffic officers are compelled by law to obtain blood kits from SAPS after registering a case. The SAPS obtains blood kits from the Forensic Laboratory in Cape Town. The SAPS is the link between the laboratory and traffic. This procedure is statutory.
Hon Speaker, with the implementation of RTO all traffic stations will have the eNatis system with computers. The issue of establishing driving licence testing centres is the prerogative of the local municipalities.
However, we are lobbying municipalities at a TransMec level. Maybe I need to remind hon members that TransMec is a structure that the department revived last year in order to improve coordination and lines of communication among ourselves as transport authorities at provincial and local levels, guided by common understanding and commitment to the principles of co-operative governance and intergovernmental relations as set out in the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa and the Local Government Municipal Systems Act.
The NLTA demands that a MEC must coordinate transport initiatives with municipalities and other stakeholders in the transport field by establishing coordinating structures or by other methods. TransMec is a political structure with the MEC for Transport as chairperson and we will include political representatives from district municipalities, the metropolitan municipalities and King Sabata Dalindyebo Municipality. This structure is not meant to duplicate already existing or legislative structures, but to complement and integrate such structures.
Again, siyathemba kuba ke the Transnet Revival it will assist us in terms of addressing the shortage of traffic officers and the visibility of traffic officers because what we decided upon as a department is to make it a point at least now we’ve got an integrated approach as far as roadblocks are concerned because most of the time uyakubona iroad block yephondo uphinde udibane neya kwamasipala kwi radius ebulingana.
As from yesterday we had a meeting whereby we said we must come with an integrated approach to address the issue of shortage of traffic officers, to make it a point at least both the provincial one and the local municipalities are fully utilised in an integrated approach programme.
The plight of general assistants and traffic officers levels will be resolved as part of drawdown process of the review of our strategic plan as the restructuring of the department, as we are convinced that the current strategy and our organogram are not helping us to pave a way forward for a new era of quality transportation system for a better life for all. This exercise will further include the identification of staff within the department that can be deployed in areas where they can be more productive and be geared towards service delivery.
Hon Speaker, with regard to the traffic officials what were dismissed, I think this House would appreciate the fact that this particular case was appealed and upheld the sanction, based on information that was available to me as an executive authority. The officials then appealed to the CCMA and the sanction was confirmed by the CCMA, which means that I took the right decision.
Hon members, the legislation prescribes that we pay a danger allowance to our traffic officers and all traffic officers in the Eastern Cape are paid danger allowance in accordance with the DPSA prescripts.
On 24/7 hour shift:
It is not for the first time. We are lobbying for this long ago in RTMC, but because of the legislative predicament, for it supposed to be legislated first because the traffic officers are employed under the Public Service Act, so it means if you have to make it a point that they are on the streets throughout, you must be prepared with your budget in terms of paying them overtime.
But if you noticed now there is improvement in terms of visibility within indlela zethu ziyabonakala even na after 6 now uyakuzibona naphaya ko 8 ebusuku we are trying into yokokuba at least zisebenze but ke yibhajethi leyo. We are paying them overtime around that; that is why we are again reiterating lobbying here ye 24/7.
Again around the issue of Butterworth:
As the Department we have engaged. Fortunately they all belong to my ministry – the Department of Public Works – trying to address precisely the Butterworth issue and again the Butterworth Station is among the stations that are going to be revamped for this financial year.
Again, kwicala lengozi:
You know, hon obesuka apha obemele i-ANC, he is 100 percent correct. Into yengozi it needs all of us present here. You can have thousands and thousands traffic officers on the road, but if there is reckless driving that will not assist because some of the accidents which are taking place zenzeka apho there are traffic officers because you cannot say umntu o-ova theyikayo kwindawo ekungafunekanga e- ova theyike kuyo lonto ifuna itraffic officer, like a recent accident where a taxi driver just overtake in an area where he is not supposed to do that, are you going to say to me the traffic officer, if it was there for argument sake, was it possible for that traffic officer to avoid that overtaking? It means it is a joint effort for both the users of the road.
We have to assist each other in terms of how best can we curb the accidents on the roads. It needs a joint effort, which means hon Dimaza is 100 percent correct. As much as we need more traffic officers, but even we have a duty to play in terms of making it a point that at least there is education with the communities. [Interjections.]
About uniforms:
Uniform is available in our...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: [Indecipherable.]
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR PUBLIC WORKS, ROADS AND TRANSPORT: ...le uniform ekhona ine problems, i-uniform ikhona edilivarishiweyo. There is a uniform which has been distributed, but ke ine problem, especially around female traffic officers whereby ufumana iskirt sine problem otherwise idilivari yenziwe.
In conclusion:
On behalf of the Department I would like to appreciate the recommendations we’ve received after many years when we were always unable to provide information to the portfolio committee on time. As I have previously committed myself to this House to ensure that our situation is improved, it is indeed satisfying for the committee to identify and acknowledge that improvement, but as I alluded earlier on, we will respond and comply to the recommendations of the portfolio committee. I thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon MEC. I put the report.
Agreed.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Any objections?
No objections.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: I will ask the secretary to read the sixth order of the day.
CONSIDERATION OF THE REPORT OF THE STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon chairperson of Public Accounts, hon Mhlati.
Mr M M MHLATI: Hon Deputy Speaker, hon MECs and hon members, I am presenting the report of the Public Accounts Committee on the auditor’s report for the various departments for the financial year 2009/2010.
The abovementioned reports of the Auditor General were tabled in the Provincial Legislature – that is page 288 – and referred to the committee for consideration and reporting. The committee considered the Auditor-General’s reports and raised formal questions which the Accounting Officers of the respective departments were requested to respond to. The committee conducted hearings between 8 February and 18 March 2011.
(1) During this period, the committee met with the Department of Health on two different dates. This was due to the absence of both the Executive Authority and the Accounting Officer in the first meeting scheduled for 8 February 2011 and the committee felt it could not continue with the hearing without their presence. The second meeting took place on 18 March 2011. (2) These hearings as listed in the table above were attended by the Accounting Officers and their staff. (3) At these hearings, the Accounting Officers were given an opportunity to respond and give further evidence to the questions raised by the committee. The following findings and recommendations emanate from those responses and interactions with the departments. (4) Hearings for the Office of the Premier; Provincial Treasury; Safety and Liaison, Roads and Public Works; Transport; Sport, Recreation, Arts and Culture; and Social Development were not conducted as the committee felt it was satisfied with these departments’ audit reports. The committee would like to express a word of appreciation to the heads of these departments for these achievements.
The first report is the report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 2: Eastern Cape Provincial Legislature for the year ended 31 March 2010. I won't read the findings, hon members and hon Deputy Speaker. I will go straight to the recommendations, but in a nutshell all the findings refer to non-compliance with the provisions of the PFMA; all of them.
The Committee recommends as follows:
(a) Disciplinary steps must be taken against all the officers of the Legislature who have failed to comply with the provisions of the Public Finance Management Act as contained in Sections 38, 39, 40, 41 and 45 of the same Act which led to the findings above. (b) The Legislature must submit on at least a quarterly basis, a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action plan.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 3:
Department of Health for the year ended 31 March 2010.
The committee recommends as follows:-
(a) Disciplinary steps must be taken against all the officers of the department who have failed to comply with the provisions of the Public Finance Management Act as contained in Sections 38, 39, 40, 41 and 45 of the same Act which led to the findings above. (b) The Department must submit on at least a quarterly basis, a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action and turnaround plans, including timeframes on the turnaround plan of the department. (c) The committee re-affirms its previous recommendations in its report on the 2007/08 and the 2008/09 financial years that Provincial Treasury should consider providing funds for a forensic investigation to be conducted into the financial affairs of the department - taking into account the magnitude of financial mismanagement reported by the Auditor-General and the failure by the management to account fully for the funds used - and to produce supporting documentation to support the expenditure.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 6:
Department of Education for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) Disciplinary steps must be taken against all the officers of the department who have failed to comply with the provisions of the Public Finance Management Act as contained in Sections 38, 39, 40, 41 and 45 of the same Act which led to the findings above. (b) A performance management system that is functional must be implemented in the department. (c) With respect to HROPT, the committee wishes to recommend that the Office of the Premier and Provincial Treasury must coordinate with the department to resolve the matter expeditiously. (d) The Department must submit on at least a quarterly basis, a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action and turnaround plans, including timeframes on the turnaround plan of the Department.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 7: Department of Local Government and Traditional Affairs for the year ended 31 March 2010.
The Committee recommends that:
(a) Disciplinary steps must be taken against all the officers of the department who have failed to comply with the provisions of the Public Finance Management Act as contained in Sections 38, 39, 40 and 41 and 45 of the same Act which led to the findings above. (b) With respect to HROPT, the committee recommends that the Office of the Premier and Provincial Treasury must coordinate with the department to resolve the matter expeditiously. (c) While the concerns of the department with respect to limitations on holding municipalities accountable are noted, the committee is of the view that the department has not effectively utilised the existing legislation. The committee therefore recommends that the department should effectively utilise the existing legal framework such as the PFMA to ensure accountability by municipalities with respect to transfers. (d) The Accounting Officer must investigate the possibility of recovering the staff debt from the department’s ex- employees. (e) The department must submit on at least a quarterly basis, a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action plan.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 8:
Department of Rural Development and Agrarian Reform for the year ended 31 March 2010.
The committee recommends that the Department must:
(a) Address all the issues of non-compliance with the PFMA and provide adequate responses to all the matters raised by the committee. (b) Submit a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action plan.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 9: Department of Economic Development for the year ended 31 March 2010.
The Committee recommends that:
(a) Disciplinary steps must be taken against all the officers of the department who have failed to comply with the provisions of the Public Finance Management Act as contained in Sections 38, 39, 40, 41 and 45 of the same Act which led to the findings above. (b) The Department must submit on at least a quarterly basis, a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action plan. (c) With respect to HROPT, the committee recommends that the Office of the Premier and Provincial Treasury must coordinate with the department to resolve the matter expeditiously. (d) The committee recommends that the department must institute civil proceedings against the official responsible for the loss of R1.1 million in order to recover the money. (e) Provincial Treasury must provide the committee with a report on how the rollover of unspent funds transferred to public entities and municipalities should be treated in order to assist the Department in its reporting on the matter.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Vote 11:
Department of Human Settlements for the year ended 31 March 2010.
The Committee recommends that:
(a) The Department must solicit the necessary support from Provincial Treasury where necessary, take all necessary steps to rectify the situation as noted in all findings, and report to the committee in this regard. (b) Disciplinary steps must be taken against all the officers of the department who have failed to comply with the provisions of the Public Finance Management Act as contained in Sections 38, 39, 40, 41 and 45 of the same Act which led to the findings above. (c) The Department must submit on at least a quarterly basis, a detailed report on the implementation of its audit action plan.
Report of the Standing Committee on Public Accounts dated 24 July 2012, as follows:
The abovementioned reports of the Auditor-General were tabled in the Provincial Legislature and referred to the Committee for consideration.
The Committee considered the Auditor-General’s reports contained within the annual reports and raised formal questions to which the Accounting Authorities of the public entities responded.
The Committee conducted hearings on 9 February and on 15-17 March 2011, which were attended by the Accounting Authority or representatives of the Accounting Authority and senior officials from the Public Entities and the departments concerned.
At these hearings, the Accounting Authority was given a chance to respond and give evidence with regard to questions raised by the Committee in respect of the reports mentioned above.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Mayibuye Transport Corporation for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) The Accounting Authority must take disciplinary steps against officers who committed transgressions which undermined the financial management and internal controls of the Corporation. (b) The Corporation must ensure that the new revenue management system includes the complete revenue recording as required in terms of Section 51(b) of the PFMA. (c) The Corporation must submit a detailed audit intervention plan and quarterly progress reports to the committee.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Eastern Cape Provincial Arts and Culture Council for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) The Accounting Authority must ensure that the Council complies with Section 51(1)(a)(i) of the PFMA. In addition the Council must ensure that this matter does not occur in the future. (b) The department must ensure that the performance of the Council is adequately monitored and the necessary support is provided to the Council. (c) The Council must submit a detailed audit intervention plan as well as quarterly progress reports to the committee.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Eastern Cape Liquor Board for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) The Accounting Authority must take disciplinary steps as required in terms of Section 51(1) of the Public Finance Management Act (PFMA) against the officers responsible for the afore-mentioned finding, which is in contravention of the provisions of the PFMA and Treasury Regulations. (b) The Accounting Authority must perform his responsibilities as required in terms of Section 51(1)(a)(i) of the PFMA. (c) The entity’s policy on performance management should be finalised before the end of the current financial year. (d) The entity must submit a detailed audit intervention plan and quarterly progress reports to the Committee.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Eastern Cape Tourism Board for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) The entity must ensure that proper procurement procedures are followed for each purchase at all times and should avoid a recurrence of such a transgression in line with Section 51(1)(a)(iii) of the PFMA. (b) Disciplinary action must be taken against the official who failed to exercise his/her duty in preventing the unnecessary loss incurred by the entity if he/she had acted accordingly. (c) The Accounting Authority must ensure that proper control systems are in place and information remains undistorted throughout and to avoid any inconsistencies as required by Section 51(1) of the PFMA. (d) The Chairperson should have resigned in order to avoid any possible conflict of interest and in future this should be part of the policy to avoid similar future occurrences as required by Treasury Regulation 16A.9.1. (e) The entity must submit a detailed audit intervention plan and quarterly progress reports to the committee.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Eastern Cape Appropriate Technology Unit for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) The Accounting Authority must take the necessary disciplinary action against the official(s) who failed to make available the documents required for audit as they failed to comply with Section 51(1)(e) of the PFMA. (b) The entity must provide the committee with details about the action taken against the senior official and the outcome in terms of recovering the resources that was allegedly misused by the official. (c) The Accounting Authority must always ensure the presence of its officials during the audit period in order to provide all the required information in facilitating a smooth audit process.
Report of the Auditor-General on the financial statements of Eastern Cape Rural Finance Corporation for the year ended 31 March 2010.
Recommendations:
(a) The Department must apply PFMA and Treasury Regulations and transfer funds as subsidy and/or transfer and not as administered funds to the entity, and allow the entity to exercise its powers with regard to procurement processes and accountability. (b) The entity must provide the committee with relevant proof or evidence of loan repayments by employees with loans, whether through PERSAL records or debit orders confirming such repayments within 30 days. (c) The entity must provide a written performance management plan to the committee within 30 days and must in future avoid implementation of undocumented systems as required in terms of Treasury Regulation 30.2.1. (d) The entity must submit a detailed audit intervention plan and quarterly progress reports to the committee.
General recommendation:
The committee needs to be allocated more time to deal with all the matters raised as recommendations in this report. I thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Mhlati. You will agree with me hon Mhlati that sele siqalile ukunika more time to deal with this. Kudala liphelile ixesha lakho. Thank you very much hon members. Questions? Hon Martin.
Mr C MARTIN: Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. page 296(b) it is being said the department failed to make payments amounting to R437,5 million within 30 days. The question is just did the committee find out if any interest were paid on these amounts of non-payment within the due period. How much was the interest paid, or if any was paid? Did they find that out?
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Committee members. Nifuna baphinde? Phinda hon member.
Mr M M MHLATI: There is nothing which reflect that the department was charged any interest. What the department...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Ilayitile lonto yakho? Oh okay.
Mr M M MHLATI: The Department withheld the payment because if they paid within the required time by the government they would have incurred unauthorised expenditure. That is what is happening in most of the department. Like for instance Health; Health does not pay from January, February and March because they are avoiding unauthorised expenditure. They only pay from April once they get a clear result that there is a budget and so much is given, otherwise there is nothing which says the Department was charged by the suppliers interest because of paying late.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Umbuzo kuMphathiswa? Thank you, hon members. Siyaxoxa ngoku. Hon Stevenson from the Democratic Alliance. Akubhalwanga apha. Okay, hon Stevenson let us allow her. Hon Woodhall from Congress of the people.
Ms A S WOODHALL: Thank you. I do attend the SCOPA sittings sometimes when I am able to, so I do have some insight. Good evening hon Deputy Speaker. Thank you, hon members, hon MECs and those very resilient members of the public and officials who are still with us this late hour.
The Congress of the people welcomes this report. It is detailed. We agree that it needs a lot more consideration. When we look at the list, if one was to make a list of the problems that have been found in these departments, or I will make this point; that although this dates from March 2010, we are still seeing some of the same problems a year and a half later. I think we have to make that point.
Overpayments:
I want to make the point that there are overpayments, particularly with performance awards and the Department of Education is one of those where overpayments have been made, really playing havoc with the budget to compensation of employees and yet we still have educators who are not paid. It has taken seven months to load the Funza Lushaka new teachers who started teaching at the beginning of this year and they are only being loaded this week. That is something else that is a big red light that we need to look at.
The lack of effective, efficient and transparent systems and internal controls; I know that Treasury is working with the departments to try and rectify this, but it is still a problem. Payments not made within 30 days, leading to under-expenditure and then we have the Department of Education with accruals from 2005. We have heard a promise that they will finally be paid off this year.
Insufficient evidence and presentation of documentation has been a constant complaint from the Auditor-General’s office, particularly with some of these departments that we’ve been looking at today. Poor control systems, lack of asset registers, poor internal audits and work of audit committees, fruitless and wasteful expenditure, contravention of regulations and the list goes on. I am not going to bore everybody.
Then we come to the entities. There is still areas of non-compliance, inconsistencies, cases of conflict of interest, process of tendering cuts across many government entities, as well as department. Now who is getting it right? We need to look at those who are getting it right with the whole tendering process, but I know and I think all of those of you who are involved in the committees and hear the reports, the tendering process is a huge problem.
Cope takes the opportunity to say that we accept the report and we appreciate the final comments that more time is needed to work on it. We also note that in 2012 suspensions in Education officials were lifted. Some of those suspended had been suspended for two years. It goes back to this report. We note also that the suspensions have been with officials who have been not necessarily corrupt, but there is misadministration.
Now it does raise the question that the report talks about many issues that point to misadministration. Now when you suspend an official for two years you are not really paying proper attention to what is going on. We urge that all cases are dealt with timeously and we start today. There are different ways to deal with disciplinary action. While investigating one can change the responsibilities, even if you keep officials in place, but don’t fail to find out who has been responsible.
Cope also takes the opportunity to commend the Premier in her absence and please would perhaps Deputy Speaker, would you convey to her our recommendation, for her stand that she has taken over tenders as was reported on the front page of the Daily Dispatch? We support the effort to eliminate corruption by officials and public servants. We also support all efforts that lead to an efficient and transparent system. We say again our business is service delivery. That is our business. That is why we are here. That is why officials are in the positions they are, for service delivery and it is using funds from the public who expect value for money. So we support this report.
My final word is on the eve of Women’s Month, we, the Congress of the people, congratulate all members of the Women’s Caucus for the work that is done to change the lives of women and we commend the support that our gentlemen members give us. Thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you. Hon Woodhall, you said I must convey the message to the Premier?
Ms A S WOODHALL: Yes.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: The Premier is here. Thank you, hon Woodhall. Hon Bobby Stevenson from the Democratic Alliance.
Mr R S STEVENSON: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. Hon MECs, Members of the House, the hour might be late, but the need is still urgent; that we really focus on this very important report.
I want to start off by dealing with the issue of financial misconduct. You know there was a very interesting report tabled in the National Assembly this week, on Monday by the Public Service Commission that dealt with financial misconduct for the 2009/2010 year and it is in the public domain for those who would like to read some of the reports that are tabled in the National Assembly.
It is interesting to note that as far as the Eastern Cape is concerned we were reported with the highest cost of financial misconduct, namely a R35 million or 43 percent of all the provinces. What is interesting, when you compare these figures to what is in our report you will see the disjuncture and it points to the fact that not all these cases of financial misconduct in the province are reported to the Public Service Commission. Of the R35 million of financial misconduct that was reported, R34.3 million comes from the Health Department, or 98 percent; only R565,000 hon Majodina from Social Development. The Education Department which has a disclaimer in this 2009/10 year, they only reported seven of the 120 cases. Ninety of the 120 cases came from Health. You know what the value of the financial misconduct is reported by Education that has 40 percent of our province’s budget, it was R29,128.00 out of a total of R35 million.
Now I really ask you, does anyone believe that of 120 cases reported, 90 comes from Health and only seven could possibly come from Education? What this really points to is that financial misconduct that is taking place in the Department of Education is not being reported to the Public Service Commission and we need to know why. [Interjections.] Yes, I am sure you believe that. I am sure you believe that. Nobody believes it.
Now financial misconduct can involve, hon member, fruitless and wasteful expenditure, failure to follow procurement procedures and payments to service providers without receiving goods. If you look at the report before us from Public Accounts, you will see that irregular expenditure by Health I think was understated by R954 million and Education by R576 million, so there must be lots of financial misconduct there and certainly in the case of Education, fruitless and wasteful expenditure is report of R26.7 million, was disclosed in the annual financial statements and in our report before you now you will see it was understated by R31 million. So again it raises the question whether financial misconduct is being reported.
If one looks at this report you will see that year in and year out they are the same issues – irregular, wasteful expenditure, under- expenditure of capital assets, poor controls, poor recordkeeping, understatement of accruals, non-payment within 30 days and this issue of the HROPT that hangs over us. The big question hon member, the big question and that hon member needs to listen now, is what is this House going to do? What are the departments going to do that is different this financial year to what has not been done in previous financial years? At the end of our report our committee chair did say that we need more time so our reports can be dealt with timeously.
The SCOPA report should not be coming before the House so late, but the problem is the time slot allocation in the Legislature and this was alluded to in the last paragraph of our committee report. What really needs to happen is that the provisions of the Financial Management Act that contain punitive sanctions need to be enforced.
I know the hon Dimaza earlier on spoke about labour laws. The one issue is labour laws; the other is enforcement of the sanctions that there are in the PFMA and if you don’t enforce the sanctions that are in the PFMA we are not going to get any change in the financial management in this province. We need to enforce these sanctions to engender a spirit of real accountability. No sanctions; no change and where there is no consequences for poor performance and wrongdoing you get no change in our outcomes.
The question is, why aren’t the sanctions of the PFMA enforced? You know, it boils down to political will, but the problem that there is in the ruling party is the issue of factionalism. When you employ or deploy people for the wrong reasons, you can't discipline them for the right reasons because your hands get tied. We need to make sure that when people are employed in positions it is done for the right reasons.
Unless one comes to grips with this issue and enforces the sanctions within the PFMA we are not going to change the direction of this province. The ruling party needs to take note; if you are not prepared to fire the people...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: One minute left.
Mr R S STEVENSON: Thank you. If you are not prepared to fire the people that are involved in financial mismanagement and messing up service delivery, the hon member is quite correct; the people are going to end up firing you.
There is also other legislation that is provided in Treasury Regulations and also particularly the Prevention and Combating of Corrupt Activities Act of 2004, which criminalises to report broad categories of corruption and I would be interested to know if any cases are being reported to the SAPS in terms of the PSSA Act.
Hon Deputy Speaker in conclusion, we in this House have an obligation to ensure that there is effective oversight. The only reason why people are going to court all the time to enforce departments to do their work is because this House is failing to do effective oversight. [Interjections.] Exactly. Exactly. [Interjection.]
I am a member of this House, hon Martin, but unfortunately I am not part of the ruling party yet, but when my party becomes the governing party of the Eastern Cape, we will enforce the punitive sanctions in the PFMA. [Interjections.] We will ensure that financial discipline is returned to this province and we will ensure that effective...
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Your time is up hon member.
Mr R S STEVENSON: I thank you, hon members. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon member. Hon Mhlati.
Mr M M MHLATI: Hon Deputy Speaker, hon MECs and hon members. URhulumente uzibekele umgomo wokuba by 2014 ufuna i- clean audit. Ibhola ikuthi ukuba njengokuba sifumana iripoti enje nezayo ngo-Agasti izabe ikwafana nale ukuba ingaba siza kufika na kule clean audit ka 2014.
Umcimbi ke hon Majodina, hon Speaker umcimbi ukuni, umcimbi ukwi Executive. Thina sithetha nje i-Constitution izohlule i-powers between iLegislature ne Executive yathi ukuranishwa kwe administration ezidipatimentini ngumsebenzi we-Executive. Yiyo ke lento sithi ke umcimbi ukuni. Nina niyabaqhatha omabhalana, omabhalana baqhathwa nini so nokubagxotha kukuni. I-PFMA zonke ezi zinto sizithetha apha yifeyila ye managers ukuba zithi comply ne provisions ze-PFMA.
Kwathiwa ngukuya eKapa ngoku kwenziwa lo mthetho we-PFMA kwathiwa kulungiselelwa ukuba i-managers zikwazi ukumaneyija idipatimenti zingaqhutywa ngasemva. Kodwa ke ngoku ayenzeki lonto umthetho wona wenziwe eKapa wathiwa thaca kunjalo nje usenziwa nguRhulumente lo wethu kodwa awuthiwa comply ngabantu bethu ababekwe ukuba mabaranishe uRhulumente.
Yiyo ke lento sithi ke ibhola ikwi Executive thina asikwazi, asinakutshaja mabhalana thina, asikwazi tu, asikwazi. And asifuni ukuba nize kukhalaza nithi no iLegislature ifuna ukuthi micro manage i-executive asifuni. And asitsho ukuba xa ningafuni hon members ze ruling party ukugxekana phambi kwethu i-caucus yenzelwe ukuba amalungu akwazi ukulungisana khona, lento iyi caucus yepati.
Kaloku i-caucus idilishana nezinto zepati. La malungu adiploywe nini kwi executive nimele ukuba nidilishane nalonto ukuba madoda njengokuba sinibeke entloko nje kutheni soloko sifumana, yintoni le niyenzayo ngezi managers zenu? Umcimbi ulapho bantu bakuthi, umcimbi ulapho, umcimbi ukwi caucus ye ruling party sakuthi ukuze siphume kolu daka ibe i-caucus iyakwazi ukudilishana ihlale ne executive yayo babonisane ukuba bayikhupha kanjani iprovince kule meko ikuyo. Enkosi mhlali ngaphambili. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Mhlati. African National Congress, hon Xola Pakati.
Mr X A PAKATI: I am waiting for the noise to subside hon Deputy Speaker. Hon Deputy Speaker, Members of the Executive Council, honoured guests, fellow members; good evening.
As we celebrate the 94th birthday of our icon, former President Nelson Mandela, we should be reminded of his 67 years of activism against injustice, courageous leadership, dedication to the cause of freedom and exemplary leadership which we should all emulate. Nelson Mandela, during his 67 years as an activist of our proud movement, became the ANC personalified. He expound the value system that is rooted in the culture and tradition of the movement that being selflessness, sacrifice and human solidarity.
We are gathered in this august House, trying very hard to resolve the inherent contradictions that continue to engulf our society, the poverty, unemployment and equality, as we seek to establish a new and successful modern society.
As we debated the 2009/10 report of the Standing Committee on Public Accounts, we should remind ourselves that the state is not immune from being corrupted. Apartheid state perpetuated a system they knew to be a lie. Respectable people were indoctrinated by their own propaganda and became incapable of recognising truth. When lies are proclaimed as truth, honesty devalues. When Statesmen were allowed to practice deception within impunity, national integrity was corrupted. The State is expected to be the organ through which any societies mediate the [inaudible] societal contradictions. It is expected to act as a moral arbiter of that society and it is entrusted with the supreme power to maintain the agreed norms of that society.
When the State pursues policies that negates the social and ethical behaviour that it is supposed to uphold, it loses its position as the arbiter of society. This is what happened to the apartheid regime, which was based on the lie of white supremacy. In the civil service we need Nelson Mandela’s courage and determination to address the culture of unaccountability, declining stewardship over public money and be contra of entitlement.
I am raising these matters Deputy Speaker because the spending patterns and financial management in the departments leaves much to be desired. Those who are fortunate to receive clean audits have matters of emphasis. This is despite the fact that all departments have highly educated Chief Financial Officers from reputable institutions of higher learning, yet they have nothing to show in terms of output. There is a high risk of casting aside truth, honesty and reliability, which are the hallmarks of good stewardship. Key to this encroaching culture is the utter disregard of the legislation that governs public finances and Treasury Regulations which are meant to be safety valves against corruption.
Operation Clean Audit by 2014 which the late comrade Siceka spoke about remains a pipe dream. It is only mentioned in the House today so that we can feel good and yet beyond the parliamentary debates nothing happen, hence repetitive findings by the office of the Auditor- General. If there was political will, coupled with Nelson Mandela’s courage and determination, these matters would have been arrested.
The twin challenges of circumventing supply chain management system and that of officials of departments presiding over their own tenders is constantly raised by the office of the Auditor-General.
Coupled with this is the inability to provide auditors with the necessary information to arrive at a determination, or simply put, general absence of paper trails. We should be reminded that the office of the AG relies on us, the legislators, to provide leadership on these matters. In many instances the audit committees are ineffective or their recommendations are not taken seriously by senior managers or both. Having said all this, we are confident that the political leadership is equal to the task. We should not despair.
Coming to the point of cadetship deployment that hon Stevenson spoke about; this is what the DA is doing in the Western Cape, yet it is undesirable for others. [Interjections.] Yet it is undesirable for others. Yet it is undesirable for others. [Interjections.] This expression of selective morality must be condemned as and when it raises its ugly head. Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. [Applause.] The ANC supports the report.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon Pakati. Hon MEC.
The MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS (ON BEHALF OF THE MEC RESPONSIBLE FOR FINANCE): Hon Speaker, hon Premier in absentia, Members of the Executive Council, hon Members of the Provincial Legislature, Heads of Departments, ladies and gentlemen.
Hon Speaker, let me take the opportunity to express our deep sense of appreciation to the Auditor-General and the Standing Committee on Public Accounts in ensuring that there is accountability for the use of public resources. The findings and recommendations tabled before this House are the result of some robust engagement between SCOPA and the departments regarding the audit outcomes issued by Auditor- General for the 2009/10 financial year, notwithstanding the misgiving of some misgivings of some of the members of this House the goal of effective oversight remains important to us as government, as well as the African National Congress.
As the Executive Council we take the findings of the committee very seriously. We commit to the implementation of the resolutions as contained in the report and to providing regular updates to this House on the progress thereto.
Hon members, whilst we know and we have stated in this House that there are a number of interventions and work being done to turn around the two major departments (Education and Health) as well as work to effect effective management in all other departments, these interventions would largely be dependent on strong oversight on the part of the Parliament, as well as commitment by all of us to ensuring that we change the situation.
I want to end by saying that the SCOPA resolutions and recommendations remain very important to us. We will implement all of them. I thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you, hon MEC. I put the report.
Agreed
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Any objections?
No objections.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: That concludes the discussion on this matter and business for the day. What is happening hon members; there are three announcements; the first one, you are reminded about the CPW meeting tomorrow at half past eight.
The second one is that hon members are reminded about an invitation from the Office of the Premier about a prayer service organised by the Moral Regeneration Movement that will be held tomorrow at Skenjana Roji Hall and the time is 10h00. The last one is dinner is served at the members’ lobby. The House will adjourn until further notice. The House is adjourned.
The House adjourned at