!"#   SUSAN

Jina: Someone told me they’d seen some don’t, then it’s not a problem. That was a choice "&(' you riding on the New York sub- that I didn’t consciously make but has kind of hap- '-%0(&' way not long ago. Was it really pened. There was in 2006, for ex- you? ample – a two-hander with me and Ralph Fiennes – Susan: Quite possibly. Last night that was divine. And I love the Duplass brothers, who I went to Brooklyn on the sub- are kind of the indie darlings, who did Jeff Who Lives way, to visit the Brooklyn art at Home in 2011 – I play the mother who’s trying to museum. I walk a lot, too, and figure out what life means and looking for signs in have a bike. One of my favourite the universe. Last year I just went to Berlin again to things about New York is going work with on Cloud Atlas – in it, I down the High Line at odd times play a number of characters across time, including a of the day, or just walking the male Indian scientist. Those were all tiny parts, and it streets. That’s the problem with was so much fun. And of course, I just did Arbitrage living in LA – the business of being in your car all the with . I’m like a temp secretary who time. If you run into somebody you weren’t expecting goes in when there’s a problem for a few weeks, and to see, it means you’ve had a car accident, you know? then I leave. If you’re in New York, you bump into people, you see an exhibit, you hear a funny story, you talk to someone What determines whether or not you take on a role? you would never talk to. It depends. I think it’s probably easier for women  -,'(-#.,-.,'+'(',0"1%(($,'%' who have had families to age and go through the ca- ."/("-!-",-"' .",! !+ +(& %% -! (-!+ -(+, People must recognise you. reer change, because their identity’s not all tied up Yeah, but they’re fine. They smile, and you know... in who they were in their 20s or 30s as movie stars. ( !+ '+-"('++' ( +(%, +(&"' 3'.'- New Yorkers are very cool. They don’t start scream- Sometimes it’s harder for guys who used to be the ing. They’re like, “Hey, how are you doing? I like your leading man and are now character actors; they might ",,"'!($1(++(+"-.+!(0-("'&,&(,- work. You’re looking good,” or whatever. If they do feel it’s like a step down. I’ve discovered that work- scream, they’re usually from Argentina or Brazil or ing with interesting people and challenging myself is !"#$%!&'$(!)%*+',*-.%/('(,(/'%+'!.' +!,&+$!+ Italy or one of the more emotional countries. something I can do in two weeks; it doesn’t have to be two months. (.-, +%,,'+"%%"'-"'*.%&,.+ There must be moments when you’d like to be invisible.  &(.,%1 (.-,)($' (.- !+ )(%"-"% ('/"-"(',' It was more difficult when the kids were little. But It also sounds a lot less disruptive than camping out on you’re in this business because you want to reach peo- a film set for months. .,',1,,!!(), +$&0"%%&(+(.+ ple, and it’s great to know that you do. The problem I’ve lived all over North America making mov- with making films is that you never have any sense of ies – Vancouver, , St Louis, Montreal. A lot (.,"'!",,('-+&!!,-(-!1(.' ,- 1+ what’s going on with the audience. I always say the of the big ones were made in the summer vacation, difference between theatre and film is the difference to accommodate the children’s schooling when they (%(.--!+!/"' #.,-(&-!(0'+( ,.,, between making love and masturbation. When you were little. The Client, Thelma & Louise – I’m trying make a film, you just have to get one little moment to think of which other ones – were all in the summer .%,-+"' ( )"' )(' +,%%)"''('-"'."' -( right, practically by yourself; in theatre, you have a re- on location. %" !-.)-!,+'&(,-+'-%1,"!++,0" "'' lationship, for better or worse, with the audience. You can see their faces, they’re crying, they stand up at Your kids were travelling with you? You must be in- +"-+  ' ,&% '"' ,"'-",- "' -! ,(('-( the end. credibly organised. The other day I found a list I’d written for the per- 0.(+' %(. -%, You seem to be embracing a wide range of roles at son at the accommodation I was moving into some- very different scales now, both on the stage and on where with the kids. It said to take out all glass fur- the screen. niture, put tape around the edges of everything, how Now my kids have gone their own way, I’ve been many boxes of diapers, so much soya milk... I would 1(2"')#'3%+*'4&*##(/ able to do seven films in two years! I can go in and just move with boxes of toys they hadn’t played with (+-+"-,1.+ '%%+ work with a new director every time – something I’ve much, and then I would donate them when I left, leav- never done before – diversifying my stock, expanding ing them behind. I had a whole system. It wasn’t until -1%"' 1(" +', my portfolio. So if some of my stocks succeed and I was in Winnipeg with Richard Gere and Jennifer

  195 SUSAN

Lopez doing Shall We Dance in 2003 that I was with- assistant, like, 15 years ago. And then one of them stole out a nanny or kids. The boys were in camp – I have from me. two sons, Jack and Miles – and I think my daughter, Eva, was in Italy visiting her father. I didn’t know what That must have been horrible. to do with myself. Normally I’d be finding the chil- Yeah, because your assistant becomes like a part of dren’s museum, making schedules, and shopping or the family and knows everything. At one point I had a planning the meals, and suddenly I was just by myself publicist, and at another I had a nanny, and then even- on location. I got so self-conscious, because I had so tually I got a housekeeper, but that support was often much time all of sudden. Not that Winnipeg was the in spurts. To have one child and not have any help is most fabulous city to find your identity in. fine, but when you’re outnumbered and working, it reaches a whole other dynamic. I don’t know how my And now your time is completely your own? mother did it – she had nine kids. Though she says Sort of. All the kids grew up in New York, and now that she wishes she’d enjoyed her kids the way they love it here. I’ve had my apartment in Chelsea I enjoyed mine. for 21 years, and they still regard it as their home. My youngest, Miles, is still at school, at Brown, but he Was it the experience of being a working mother that DJs, so he comes back every weekend to do gigs. Then got you interested in politics? my next up is 22; he graduated from the University No, it was the times. When I was at college study- of Southern California and is making films. He’s not ing drama in DC in the ’60s, we saw the city burn. quite sure which coast he wants to be on, so he’s still Kennedy was assassinated. And coming of age in that got his room. time, you saw what was going on. It wasn’t like now,

“I believe every film is a political film; some reinforce the status quo, some challenge it.”

Did you have both boys with ? where the corporate media really regulates what you Yes, both Jack and Miles. I found out I was preg- see. The journalists were allowed right in to report nant with Miles when I was doing Lorenzo’s Oil. what was happening in Vietnam; the government will I already had a two-year-old and a six-year-old, and never make that mistake again. Then there were the Tim was doing , and it was clear that I civil rights marches in the South – you saw pictures could not be home for dinner. That’s when we came of dogs and hoses, and if you had half a brain and any upon the formula that he would live in a hotel and I empathy at all you were in the street yourself. I got would be in the house with the kids. arrested a few times. We were probably less informed than the kids are now, but it made So he’s off in a hotel with 24-hour room service and no perfect sense, you know? But the drugs – the drugs children crying. Who took care of you? were something that were more inclusive. There’s this Nobody. I don’t know how I did it, now I think amazing thing that starts to happen when people take about it. Especially when the nanny went away and hallucinogens; that was a big, big factor. I wasn’t a didn’t come back. I would walk my daughter to huge fan of LSD. But back then – peyote, mushrooms, school across the street – we were living in a neigh- mescaline, weed, sure. That has to help your framing bourhood that had a school – and then I would take of things. But I’m very sensitive to drugs; my body my son to work with me. But I started bleeding, so isn’t strong enough to get addicted. I don’t have the I couldn’t go up the stairs, and someone else, like constitution for chemicals. my driver, would have to help me at night. I really wasn’t very good at planning help. You get in those Would you describe yourself as an activist now? situations and you’re so overloaded. I only got an If you have empathy and if you have any imagination

196  SUSAN

– which hopefully as an actor you do – then the next because everything I do I see as a love story. It wasn’t step is becoming an activist. Because how can you not just about the death penalty, it was really about do something? If you’re connected to the media, then these two people – a nun falling in love with a man how could you not take advantage of that to dissemi- on death row. Tim did a brilliant job of writing and nate information that other people aren’t getting, to directing it. represent people who don’t have a voice? It’s not that I have all the answers, but once you stand out from When did you two split up? the crowd and say, “I’m listening,” they will get you In 2009. Leaving a long-term relationship at that information. Sometimes it’s difficult information that point was very scary, and very thrilling. I still don’t people don’t want to hear, and that’s where you get understand where I’m going to end up, but I’m trying in trouble. But it’s not because I loved being on the not to focus on that. steps of the library with 30 microphones; that’s always been really daunting to me. I don’t know who that Did you enjoy being married? How old were you when person is. you married your first husband, ? I was really young, just 20, and I never thought it Is cinema a good political medium? would be forever – we did it just to be able to live to- I believe every film is a political film, because eve- gether. He made me feel safe, and he was the first man ry one tells you what it means to be a woman, what’s I slept with. But I never really wanted to get married; funny, what the justice system is, or whatever. Some I didn’t have the yearning for possessions. I didn’t films reinforce the status quo and some films chal- dream about having a house and a husband and kids, lenge it. The ones that challenge it are called political which at that time was unusual.

“I always say the difference between theatre and film is the difference between making love and masturbation.”

films; the ones that reinforce it are called comedies. I have to ask you about . How did you get But if you see The Nutty Professor with Eddie Murphy, together with him? that’s incredibly political. The whole audience roots He cast me in Pretty Baby in 1977. I’d already done for this girl to be with this fat guy. I think you have some major roles, but when I landed that one, I kept to take seriously what you’re saying in a film, and I thinking: He thinks he’s cast someone else. That mov- think you have to know that you’re affecting people. I ie was a really interesting experience because of Sven took my kids to see The Truman Show, and afterwards Nykvist’s cinematography and the way he worked, we had the most interesting conversations about what and also because Louis had cast a lot of people who you would exchange to be safe. What freedoms would weren’t actors – local girls he’d found in Mardi Gras you give up to be safe? What is friendship? And so whose work ethic was very different. They didn’t real- on. That’s what’s interesting to me – giving people ly understand how tedious it is to make a movie. Then something to talk about at breakfast the next day or there was Brooke Shields, who was in a very volatile have an argument over. It shouldn’t tell you what to situation. Her mum ended up in jail, and they asked think, but it can give you the opportunity to see the me to take custody of Brooke for the duration of the world differently. film. Then Sven Nykvist’s son killed himself and he had to leave and come back. And Brooke kept disap- Like Dead Man Walking, which went on to change the pearing. That’s when I fell in love with Louis. discussion about the death penalty. Yes. I’d met Sister previously and How long were you together? read her book and was determined to make a film Three and a half, four years. He was much older, about her. What I loved about it was the love story, and I had never lived in France. I started living in

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Paris; that was a very interesting experience. I loved requests from a lot of places, and we’ve done con- his two kids. And of course we did Atlantic City to- tracts with Chicago. Portland would be great, San gether also. Francisco…

Is there anybody now? Are you turning into a businesswoman? I’m still a searcher; you’re in trouble when you I’m not going to be the franchise person, and it’s stop looking. I have a tattoo on my wrist, ANDAND, still very mom-and-pop, though we’re at the point that stands for “A New Dawn, a New Day”, meaning where we have to decide whether to go bigger or not. that every day you get to see things afresh. If you’ve Jonathan came up with a great idea of a social network made a mistake or someone’s hurt you or whatever, where you can challenge people and have ladders. You !$!* you can get another shot. So I just throw it out to the can pick up a game with anyone, anywhere, and wager   universe, and it always answers. I’m always surprised. an amount of money, and there’ll be 10 or 15 charities * How would I build a ping-pong business, for exam- that I’ve suggested, that I know are legitimate, who’ll ple? I mean, like, seriously – did I think I would do get the winnings. You’ll play against someone for $10 that? No. or $100 or whatever, and the loser pays that money to !)$# the charity of the winner’s choice. So, let’s talk about Spin, the ping-pong club you’ve set &(  up with Jonathan Bricklin. How did it happen? So, when can we expect your memoirs? If any! Well, I like the idea of ping-pong because it cuts I’ve seriously thought about telling people to shoot across the idea of age and gender and body type. me if I ever decide to write anything. (&+*!&% It’s the one sport where little girls can beat great big guys, and a sport you can play until you die, un- til your 90s – there are people competing into their (%/, 100s. So it’s very easy for me to get behind it. It’s not expensive; you don’t get hurt. We’ve provided ta- !$&*/ bles and instructors to 40 schools in New York that had no phys ed programmes. It’s perfect for urban ar- eas where kids don’t have space in their schools. And ))!)*% it’s inexpensive. */#!% Are you making it cool again? (( It’s never been cool, has it? But we’re trying to make it cool to be geeky. I see Spin as a kind of glam-

orous, fun rec room. We’ve got 17 courts at East 23rd %,!, Street, and Todd Oldham, who is a friend of mine and has built a lot of things, helped with some of the design, doing things to scale, getting art and sourcing "+' things inexpensively.

It sounds like great fun! ('%*(

Yeah, totally! I’m very happy. I would like to keep !* upgrading, and we’ve learned through trial and error how to create a larger profit margin, because since !( this project is the first of its kind, the computer sys- tems and everything about the way to run it had to be started from scratch. Now we’ve got that pretty much down, and we’ve got a club in Toronto and Milwaukee. Green-fingered journalist Jina be throwing dinner parties every +)% ) ''( !%  !#$) &$ & *  (&#) )  ) '#/ #&"-!) (&$ We opened one with André Balazs in the Standard Khayyer plans to add a lavender Thursday to show them off, where bush and a Japanese maple tree to she’ll serve her saffron chicken with *&' #* !%#+%+% % . (&+'!$&* (-!*())!,&( $&* ( downtown in LA last December, and we’ll probably her collection of plants at home a pomegranate salad and crispy rice. )## (&+'!$&,! )*(#+)!&%# $&* ()+)'!!&+) &+)-! % open more with him in Berlin and Miami. We’ve had in Paris this spring. She’ll also !)* &+)-!

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