Jilid III Hari Selasa Bil. 52 15hb Januari, 1974

PENYATA RASMI OFFICIAL REPORT

DEWAN RAKYAT HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

PARLIMEN KETIGA Third Parliament

PENGGAL PARLIMEN KETIGA Third Session

KANDUNGANNYA

JAWAPAN-JAWAPAN MULUT BAGI PERTANYAAN-PERTANYAAN [Ruangan 5973] RANG UNDANG-UNDANG: Rang Undang-undang Perbekalan, 1974: Jawatankuasa— Jadual— Kepala B. 28 [Ruangan 5991] Kepala B. 29 hingga B. 54 [Ruangan 6053] USUL: Anggaran Pembangunan, 1974: Jawatankuasa— Kepala P. 28 [Ruangan 5992] Kepala P. 29 hingga P. 31 dan P. 34 [Ruangan 6053] Waktu Mesyuarat dan Urusan Yang Dibebaskan daripada Peraturan Mesyuarat [Ruangan 5990] MALAYSIA DEWAN RAKYAT YANG KETIGA Penyata Rasmi PENGGAL YANG KETIGA

Hari Selasa, 15hb Januari, 1974

Mesyuarat dimulakan pada pukul 230 petang

YANG HADIR:

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, TAN SRI DATUK CHIK MOHAMED YUSUF BIN SHEIKH ABDUL RAHMAN, P.M.N., S.P.M.P., J.P., Datuk Bendahara Perak. Yang Amat Berhormat Timbalan Perdana Menteri dan Menteri Perdagangan dan Perindastrian, DATUK HUSSEIN BIN DATUK ONN, S.P.MJ., P.I.S. (Johor Bahru Timur). Yang Berhormat Menteri Perhubungan, TAN SRI HAJI SARDON BIN HAJI JUBIR, P.M.N., S.P.M.K., S.P.MJ. (Pontian Utara). „ Menteri Hal Ehwal Sarawak, TAN SRI TEMENGGONG JUGAH ANAK BARIENG, P.M.N., P.D.K., P.N.B.S. (Ulu Rajang). „ Menteri Buruh dan Tenaga Rakyat, TAN SRI V. MANICKAVASAGAM, P.M.N., S.P.M.S., J.M.N., P.J.K. (Kelang). „ Menteri Pertanian dan Perikanan, TAN SRI HAJI MOHAMED GHAZALI BIN HAJI JAWI, P.M.N., D.P.C.M., P.N.B.S. (Kuala Kangsar). „ Menteri Pembangunan Ekonomi Desa, TUAN ABDUL GHAFAR BIN BABA (Melaka Utara). „ Menteri Kerja Raya dan Tenaga, DATUK HAJI ABDUL GHANI GILONG, P.D.K., J.P. (Kinabalu). „ Menteri Kesihatan, TAN SRI LEE SIOK YEW, P.M.N., A.M.N., P.J.K. (Sepang). „ Menteri Kemajuan Tanah dan Menteri Tugas-tugas Khas, DATUK HAJI MOHAMED ASRI BIN HAJI MUDA, S.P.M.K. (Kota Bharu Hulu). „ Menteri Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri, TAN SRI HAJI MUHAMMAD GHAZALI BIN SHAFIE, P.M.N., D.I.M.P., P.D.K. (Lipis). „ Menteri Kerajaan Tempatan dan Perumahan, DATUK ONG KEE, HUI, P.N.B.S. (Bandar Kuching). „ Menteri Teknoloji, Penyelidikan dan Penyelarasan Kampung-kampung Baru, DATUK LEE SAN CHOON, S.P.MJ., K.M.N. (Segamat Selatan). „ Menteri Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sukan, DATUK ALI BIN HAJI AHMAD, S.P.MJ., S.M.J. (Pontian Selatan). „ Menteri Penerangan dan Menteri Tugas-tugas Khas, Y.M. TENGKU AHMAD RITHAUDDEEN AL-HAJ BIN TENGKU ISMAIL, P.M.K. (Kota Bharu Hilir). „ Menteri Pelajaran, TUAN HAJI MOHAMED BIN YAACOB, P.M.K., S.M.K. (Tanah Merah). 5963 15 JANUARI 1974 5964

Yang Berhormat Menteri Tugas-tugas Khas, TUAN MICHAEL CHEN WING SUM (Ulu Selangor). „ Timbalan Menteri Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri, DATUK ABDUL SAMAD BIN IDRIS, J.M.N., A.M.N., P.J.K. (Kuala Pilah). „ Timbalan Menteri Perdagangan dan Perindastrian, DATUK MUSA HITAM, S.P.M.J. (Segamat Utara). „ Timbalan Menteri Penerangan, TUAN SHARIFF AHMAD (Langat). „ Timbalan Menteri Jabatan Perdana Menteri, DATUK HAJI WAN ABDUL KADIR BIN ISMAIL, D.P.M.T., P.P.T. (Kuala Trengganu Utara). „ Timbalan Menteri Kewangan, DATUK MOHAMED BIN RAHMAT, D.P.M.J., K.M.N. (Johor Bahru Barat). „ Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri Buruh dan Tenaga Rakyat, TUAN HAJI RAMLI BIN OMAR, K.M.N., P.M.P. (Krian Darat). „ Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sukan, TUAN MOKHTAR BIN HAJI HASHIM (Rembau-Tampin). „ Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri Pembangunan Ekonomi Desa, DATUK HAJI MUSTAPHA BIN HAJI ABDUL JABAR, D.P.M.S., J.M.N., J.P. (Sabak Bernam). „ Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua, TAN SRI HAJI NIK AHMED KAMIL, D.K., P.M.N., S.P.M.K., SJ.M.K. (Ulu Kelantan). „ NIK ABDUL AZIZ BIN NIK MAT, J.P. (Kelantan Hilir). DATUK DR HAJI ABDUL AZIZ BIN OMAR, D.J.M.K., J.M.N., J.M.K., S.M.K. (Tumpat). „ TUAN ABDUL RAHMAN BIN SBRI (Johor Timur). „ TUAN HAJI ABDUL RASHID BIN HAJI JAIS, A.D.K. (Sabah Selatan). „ TUAN HAJI ABDUL WAHAB BIN YUNUS (Dungun). „ PENGHULU ABIT ANAK ANGKIN, P.P.N. (Kapit). „ TUAN ABU BAKAR BIN UMAR (Kubang Pasu Barat). „ TUAN HAJI AHMAD BIN ARSHAD, A.M.N. (Muar Utara). „ TUAN AHMAD BIN HAJI ITHNIN (Melaka Selatan). „ TUAN HAJI AHMAD BIN SA'ID, J.P. (Seberang Utara). PUAN BIBI AISHAH BINTI HAMID DON, A.M.N., P.J.K. (Kulim Utara). „ TUAN AZAHARI BIN MOHD. TAIB, S.M.K., J.S.M., A.M.N., J.P. (Sungei Patani). „ DATUK PENGARAH BANYANG ANAK JANTING, Q.M.C, P.N.B.S., P.B.S. (Julau). ,, TUAN BOJENG BIN ANDOT (Simunjan). „ TUAN BUJA BIN GUMBILAI (Tuaran). „ AWANG BUNGSU BIN ABDULLAH (Limbang-Lawas). „ TUAN HAJI AWANG WAL BIN AWANG ABU (Santubong). „ TUAN CHAN FU KING (Telok Anson). „ TUAN CHAN SIANG SUN, A.M.N., P.J.K., J.P. (Bentong). „ TUAN CHAN YOON ONN (Ulu Kinta). „ DR CHEN MAN HIN (Seremban Timur). 5965 15 JANUARI 1974 5966

Yang Berhormat DR CHU CHEE PENG (Kluang Selatan). „ TUAN VALENTINE COTTER alias JOSEPH VALENTINE COTTER (Bau-Lundu). „ TUAN PETER PAUL DASON (Pulau Pinang Utara). TUAN V. DAVID (Dato Kramat). „ TUAN EDWIN ANAK TANGKUN, A.B.S. (Batang-Lupar). „ TUAN FAN YEW TENG (Kampar). „ TAN SRI FATIMAH BINTI HAJI HASHIM, P.M.N. (Jitra-Padang Terap). „ TUAN THOMAS SELVARAJ GABRIEL (Pulau Pinang Selatan). TUAN GOH HOCK GUAN (Bungsar). „ TUAN HANAFIAH HUSSAIN, A.M.N. (Jerai). TUAN HASHIM BIN GERA (Parit). TUAN RICHARD HO UNG HUN (Sitiawan). „ TUAN HOR CHEOK FOON (Damansara). „ TUAN HUSSAIN BIN HAJI SULAIMAN (Besut). TAN SRI SYED JAAFAR BIN HASAN ALBAR, P.M.N. (Johor Tenggara). DATUK KHOO PENG LOONG, P.N.B.S. (Bandar Sibu). TUAN EDMUND LANGGU ANAK SAGA, P.B.S. (Saratok). „ TUAN LATIP BIN HAJI DRIS (Mukah). TUAN LEE SECK FUN, K.M.N. (Tanjong Malim). TUAN LIM CHO HOCK (Batu Gajah). „ TUAN LIM KIT SIANG (Bandar Melaka). TUAN LIM PEE HUNG, P.J.K. (Alor Star). „ TUAN LOH JEE MEE (Batang Padang). „ TUAN WALTER LOH POH KHAN (Setapak). „ DATUK PETER LO SU YIN, P.G.D.K. (Sandakan). „ TUAN LUHAT WAN (Baram). „ TUAN ANDREW MARA ANAK WALTER UNJAH (Betong). „ TUAN HAJI MAWARDI BIN LEBAI TEH (Kota Star Utara). DR MOHAMED BIN TAIB, P.M.K., P.J.K. (Kuantan). „ TUAN MOHD. DAUD BIN ABDUL SAMAD (Kuala Trengganu Selatan). „ TUAN MOHD. NOR BIN MD. DAHAN, A.M.N., J.P. (Ulu Perak).

„ TUAN MOHD. SALLEH BIN DATUK PANGLIMA ABDULLAH (Darvel). „ TUAN MOHD. TAHIR BIN ABDUL MAJID, S.M.S., P.J.K. (Kuala Langat). „ TUAN MOHD. TAHIR BIN HAJI ABDUL MANAN (Kapar). „ TUAN HAJI MOHAMED YUSOF BIN MAHMUD, A.M.N. (Temerloh). „ TUAN HAJI MOHD. ZAIN BIN ABDULLAH (Bachok). „ DATUK ENGKU MUHSEIN BIN ENGKU ABDUL KADIR, D.P.M.T., J.M.N. (Trengganu Tengah). 5967 15 JANUARI 1974 5968

Yang Berhormat WAN MOKHTAR BIN AHMAD, P.J.K. (Kemaman). TUAN HAJI MOKHTAR BIN HAJI ISMAIL, J.S.M. (Perlis Selatan). TUAN MUHAMMAD FAKHRUDDIN BIN HAJI ABDULLAH, J.P. (Pasir Mas Hilir). TAN SRI SYED NASIR BIN ISMAIL, P.M.N., J.M.N., D.P.M.J., P.I.S. (Muar Dalam). TUAN NG HOE HUN (Larut Selatan). RAJA NONG CHIK BIN RAJA ISHAK, S.M.S., P.J.K. (Kuala Selangor). DATUK PANG TET TSHUNG, P.D.K. (Kota Kinabalu). PENGARAH RAHUN ANAK DEBAK (Sedan). TUAN R. C. M. RAYAN alias R. C. MAHADEVA RAYAN (Ipoh). TUAN SEAH TENG NGIAB, S.M.J., P.I.S. (Muar Pantai). DR S. SEEVARATNAM, P.J.K. (Seremban Barat). DATUK SENU BIN ABDUL RAHMAN, P.D.K. (Kuala Kedah). TUAN HAJI SHAFIE BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N., B.C.K. (Baling). TUAN SOH AH TECK, A.M.N. (Batu Pahat). DR A. SOORIAN (Port Dickson). TUAN SU LIANG YU (Bruas). TUAN SULAIMAN BIN BULON, P.J.K. (Bagan Datoh). WAN SULAIMAN BIN HAJI IBRAHIM, S.M.K. (Pasir Puteh). TUAN SULAIMAN BIN HAJI TAIB (Krian Laut). PENGIRAN TAHIR BIN PENGIRAN PATERA (Kimanis). TUAN TAI KUAN YANG, A.M.N., P.J.K. (Kulim-Bandar Bharu). DATUK TAJUDIN BIN ALI, D.P.M.P., P.J.K. (Larut Utara). DR TAN CHEE KHOON (Batu). TUAN TAN CHENG BEE, A.M.N., J.P. (Bagan). TUAN TIAH ENG BEE, P.I.S. (Kluang Utara). TUAN JAMES STEPHEN TIBOK, A.D.K. (Penampang). TUAN JOSEPH UNTING ANAK UMANG (Kanowit). TUAN V. VEERAPPEN (Seberang Selatan). TUAN YEH PAO TZU, A.M.N. (Tawau). TUAN YEOH TECK CHYE (Bukit Bintang). DATUK STEPHEN YONG KUET TZE, P.N.B.S. (Padawan). TENGKU ZAID BIN TENGKU AHMAD, D.P.M.K., J.M.K., S.M.K. (Pasir Mas Hulu).

YANG TIDAK HADIR Yang Amat Berhormat Perdana Menteri dan Menteri Luar Negeri, TUN HAJI ABDUL RAZAK BIN DATUK HUSSEIN, S.M.N., K.O.M. (Pekan). Yang Berhormat Menteri Kewangan, TUN TAN SIEW SIN, S.S.M., J.P. (Melaka Tengah). 5969 15 JANUARI 1974 5970

Yang Berhormat Menteri Perpaduan Negara, TUN V. T. SAMBANTHAN, S.S.M., P.M.N. (Sungai Siput). Menteri Tak Berpotfolio, TUAN MOHAMED KHIR JOHARI (Kedah Tengah). „ Menteri Pertahanan, DATUK HAMZAH BIN DATUK ABU SAMAH, S.M.K., D.S.R., S.I.M.P. (Raub). „ Menteri Perusahaan Utama, DATUK HAJI ABDUL TAIB BIN MAHMUD, P.G.D.K. (Samarahan). Timbalan Menteri Perusahaan Utama, TUAN HAJI YUSOF BIN HAJI ABDULLAH alias HAJI YUSOF RAWA (Kota Star Selatan). „ Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri Kemajuan Tanah, TUAN MOHAMED BIN UJANG, K.M.N., P.J.K. (Jelebu-Jempol). „ Y.A.M. TUNKU ABDULLAH IBNI ALMARHUM TUANKU ABDUL RAHMAN, P.P.T. (Rawang). „ DATUK HAJI ABDUL-RAHMAN BIN YA'KUB, P.N.B.S. (Payang). „ PENGIRAN AHMAD BIN PENGIRAN INDAR (Kinabatangan). „ TUAN HAJI AHMAD DAMANHURI BIN HAJI ABDUL WAHAB, P.M.P., P.J.K. (Hilir Perak). „ TUAN AJAD BIN O. T. OYONG (Labuk-Sugut). „ DR AWANG BIN HASSAN, S.M.J. (Muar Selatan). „ CHEGU BAUDI BIN UNGGUT (Bandau). TUAN CHEN KO MING, A.M.N., P.B.S. (Sarikei). DATIN HAJJAH FATIMAH BINTI HAJI ABDUL MAJID, J.M.N., P.I.S. (Batu Pahat Dalam). „ DR LIM CHONG EU (Tanjong). „ TUAN MOHAMED ARIF BIN SALLEH, A.D.K. (Sabah Dalam). „ TUAN HAJI MOHD. CHIK JOHARI ONDU MAJAKIL (Labuan-Beaufort). TAN SRI HAJI MOHAMMAD SAID BIN KERUAK, P.M.N., S.P.D.K. (Kota Belud). TUN DATU HAJI MUSTAPHA BIN DATU HARUN, S.M.N., P.D.K., K.V.O., O.B.E. (Marudu). „ TUAN MUSTAPHA BIN HUSSAIN (Seberang Tengah). „ TUAN JONATHAN NARWIN ANAK JINGGONG (Lubok Antu). „ TUAN OTHMAN BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N. (Perlis Utara). „ DATUK SRI S. P. SEENIVASAGAM, S.P.M.P., D.P.M.P., P.M.P., J.P. (Menglembu). „ TUAN TING MING KIONG (Bintulu). „ DATUK JAMES WONG KIM MIN, P.N.B.S. (Miri-Subis).

YANG HADIR BERSAMA: Yang Berhormat Menteri Kebajikan Am, PUAN AISHAH BINTI HAJI ABDUL GHANI, J.M.N. (Dilantik). „ Timbalan Menteri Perhubungan, TUAN WONG SENG CHOW, A.M.N., J.P. (Dilantik). 5971 15 JANUARI 1974 5972

DEWAN RAKYAT

PEGAWAI-PEGAWAI KANAN Setiausaha Dewan Rakyat, Datuk Azizul Rahman bin Abdul Aziz. Timbalan Setiausaha, A. Hasmuni bin Haji Hussein. Penolong Setiausaha, Mohd. Salleh bin Abu Bakar. Pemangku Penolong Setiausaha, Ghazali bin Haji Abd. Hamid.

BAHAGIAN PENYATA RASMI Penyunting, Yahya Manap. Penolong Penyunting, P. B. Menon. Penolong Penyunting, Osman bin Sidik. Pemberita-pemberita: N. Ramaswamy. Louis Yeoh Sim Ngoh. Abdul Rahman bin Haji Abu Samah. Rani bin Rahim. Suhor bin Husin. Ng Cheng Kuai. Jamaludin bin Haji Ali. Amran bin Ahmad. Mohd. Saleh bin Mohd. Yusof. Margaret Chye Kim Lian. Quah Mei Lan. Puan Kong Yooi Thong.

BENTARA MESYUARAT Mejar Musa bin Alang Ahmad 5973 15 JANUARI 1974 5974 DOA (BMA) dahulu memerintah di sini, maka pengganas-pengganas (Bintang Tiga) telah (Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan menjadi-jadi. Ada seorang daripada Bintang Mesyuarat) Tiga itu ialah Abdullah Sidi, Cik Dat bin Abdullah. Pada satu masa saya telah dapat JAWAPAN-JAWAPAN MULUT bertemu dengan dia, sebelum dia melarikan BAGI PERTANYAAN- dirinya masuk ke dalam hutan, dia baharu sahaja balik bermesyuarat Parti Kominis di PERTANYAAN India. Dia berkata kepada saya walaupun negeri ini rakyatnya orang Melayu menuntut HARGA BARANG-BARANG— kemerdekaan tidak menghalangkan kami, KENAIKAN tetapi cita-cita kami orang kominis yang 1. Awang Bungsu bin Abdullah {di bawah saya dapat hadir di India, wakil daripada S.O. 24 (2)) minta Menteri Perdagangan dan orang Melayu saya, orang Indianya, Permal Perindastrian menyatakan apakah langkah- dari sungai Siput langkah yang sedang diambil oleh Kerajaan untuk memberhentikan kenaikan harga Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Ini apa kena- mengena dengan harga-harga barang melam­ barang-barang keperluan hari-hari di bung tinggi? Malaysia. Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Ada kena- Timbalan Menteri Perdagangan dan Per­ mengenanya. Dengar hujungnya, Tuan Yang indastrian (Datuk Musa Hi tarn): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kalau dibenarkan—ada kena- di-Pertua, soal yang berupa sama telahpun mengena. dibangkitkan beberapa kali oleh Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat dalam sidang Dewan kali Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Tolong cepatkan- ini dan telahpun dijawab dengan panjang- lah supaya tiba ke hujung itu. lebarnya. Saya tidaklah ada apa-apa yang hendak ditambahkan. Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Ya. Jadi kata dia tidak mengapa, tetapi kami berkehendak­ Tuan Lim Kit Siang: Tuan Yang di- kan ekonomi Malaya ini di tangan kami Pertua, oleh kerana sudah lebih satu tahun orang-orang Cina Kominis, walau sekali- semenjak pengumuman oleh Yang Berhormat pun dari ekonomi inilah kita akan dapat Menteri Kewangan untuk membatalkan tarif menyusahkan rakyat Malaysia. Dengan atas 33 perkara dan mengurangkan tarif atas keadaan harga barang naik ini tak dapat 9 perkara, bolehkah Yang Berhormat tidak mereka ada bersangkut-paut juga, dan Timbalan Menteri memberi satu lapuran orang yang menaikkan harga barang ini kepada Dewan ini bahawa samada sampai patut dihukum dengan keras, Tuan Yang di- hari ini barang-barang yang berkaitan itu Pertua, mengapa Kerajaan tidak mahu ber­ sudah turun harga untuk membayangkan tindak? pembatalan cukai atas mereka. Datuk Musa Hitam: Tuan Yang di- Datuk Musa Hitam: Tuan Yang di- Pertua, perkara yang baru dibawa ke Pertua, oleh sebab Ahli Yang Berhormat itu pengetahuan kita ialah cerita yang dibawa berkehendakkan lapuran, saya berkehendak- oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat itu, tetapi dari kan notis. segi jawapan-jawapannya saya balik kepada jawapan asal saya. Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Soalan tambahan. Beberapa kali pihak Kerajaan menyatakan Tuan Goh Hock Guan: Soalan tambahan, cukai-cukai barang daripada luar negeri Tuan Yang di-Pertua. Perumahan bolehlah tidak dinaikkan, tetapi barang yang sudah dianggap sebagai satu keperluan untuk dimaafkan oleh Kerajaan daripada cukai itu rakyat, dan tiap-tiap hari harga rumah naik, masih juga melambung tinggi. Mengapakah dan saya baru dapat tahu bahawa bank rates Kerajaan tidak bertindak menangkap mereka sekarang sudah naik 10%. Oleh yang demi- itu dan dihukum dengan keras. Tuan Yang kian, harga pembinaan rumah-rumah pun di-Pertua, saya suka memberi satu pen- naik, dan cost of living misti naik. Apakah jelasan, samada Kerajaan percaya atau tidak langkah-langkah yang telah diambil oleh cakap saya, pada masa Kerajaan British Kementerian berkenaan dengan bank rates? 5975 15 JANUARI 1974 5976

Datuk Musa Hitam: Tuan Yang di- Menteri Kebajikan Am (Puan Aishah binti Pertua, saya balik kepada jawapan asal Haji Abdul Ghani): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tadi dan saya suka menarik perhatian Akta Perlindungan Wanita dan Gadis-gadis, Ahli Yang Berhormat bahawa soal bank 1973 kini hanya dipakai untuk Semenanjung rates bukanlah di bawah Kementerian saya. Malaysia. Sungguhpun begitu, Akta ini akan Kalau hendak jawabnya buatlah soalan lain. dilanjutkan ke Malaysia Timur apabila ke- mudahan-kemudahan yang cukup telah dapat Tuan Goh Hock Guan: Tuan Yang di- diadakan bagi melaksanakannya di bawah Pertua, oleh sebab housing is also included Rancangan Malaysia Yang Ketiga. as one of the daily necessities atau sebagai satu barang yang menggunakan wang yang PERTUBUHAN BELIA DAN lebih, sungguhpun housing bukan tanggung- KEBUDAYAAN jawab Yang Berhormat Timbalan Menteri, bolehkah Yang Berhormat Timbalan 3. Dr S. Seevaratnam {di bawah S.O. 24 (2)) Menteri berhubung dengan Menteri Ke- minta Menteri Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sukan wangan berkenaan dengan hal ini? menyatakan: (i) mengapa lawatan-lawatan dan ran- Datuk Musa Hitam: Tuan Yang di- cangan-rancangan pertukaran belia Pertua, berbalik kepada jawapan asal saya ia- yang diurus oleh Kementerian beliau itu sudah dihuraikan dengan begitu jelas oleh tidak dihadkan hanya kepada kelab- pihak Kerajaan di dalam soaljawab dan kelab belia; juga di dalam perbahasan yang sedang di- jalankan pada masa ini. (ii) mengapa ahli-ahli politik dari pihak pemerintah ditempatkan dalam kum- pulan-kumpulan belia ini; dan Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Soalan tambahan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua. Soal saya adalah ber­ (hi) samada menjadi hasrat Kerajaan kenaan dengan kelapa (nior). Adakah Yang hendak menyekat perkembangan ber- Berhormat Timbalan Menteri sedar atau fikir secara bebas dan akal yang meng- tidak harga-harga nior sekarang terlalu kritik di kalangan belia-belia kita. tinggi lebih kurang 50 sen sebiji. Bolehkah Yang Berhormat Timbalan Menteri mem- Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri beritahu apakah sebabnya harga nior me- Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sukan (Tuan lambung tinggi dan jikalau sedar apakah Mokhtar bin Haji Hashim): Tuan Yang di- tindakan Kerajaan hendak ambil bagi me- Pertua, nurunkan harga-harga nior di negara kita. (i) Lawatan-lawatan yang diuruskan oleh Bahagian Belia Kementerian Kebu­ Datuk Musa Hitam: Tuan Yang di- dayaan, Belia dan Sukan adalah dihad­ Pertua, soal asal tidak kena-mengena dengan kan kepada pertubuhan-pertubuhan nior. Jadi kalau hendak soal nior tolong- belia dan kebudayaan. lah kemukakan kepada Kementerian yang (ii) Kadang-kadang memang ada pemim- berkenaan. pin-pemimpin belia yang terpilih itu terdiri dari anggota parti-parti politik PELACUR—GADIS LUAR BANDAR tetapi pemilihan mereka adalah ber- SARAWAK dasarkan kepada latar belakang mereka di dalam pergerakan belia dan bukan 2. Tuan Andrew Mara anak Walter Unjah berdasarkan kepada latar belakang minta Menteri Kebajikan Am menyatakan mereka di dalam kegiatan politik. samada Kerajaan sedar bahawa ramai gadis- (iii) Bukanlah menjadi dasar Kerajaan gadis muda dari kawasan-kawasan luar- untuk menyekat perkembangan ber- bandar di Sarawak sedang dipujuk pergi ke fikir secara bebas di kalangan belia- bandar-bandar besar untuk menjadi pelacur- belia tetapi sebaliknya, adalah menjadi pelacur, dan jika sedar, apakah langkah yang dasar Kerajaan untuk menggalakkan akan diambil oleh Kerajaan untuk meng- perkembangan berfikir secara bebas, atasi perkara ini dan memulihkan akhlak sihat dan membina melalui pertubuhan- mereka yang sudahpun terjerumus dalam pertubuhan belia, Majlis Perunding lapangan ini. Belia Negara dan Iain-lain pertubuhan. 5977 15 JANUARI 1974 5978 Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Soalan tambahan. Lembaga Kemajuan Pertanian Muda atau- Beberapa bulan yang lalu ada sekumpulan pun MADA pada masa ini sedang menguji belia-belia dari Malaysia pergi melawat ke berbagai-bagai jenis jentera yang boleh Canada. Adakah rombongan itu mem- digunakan di dalam ikhtiarnya memilih buat satu rumusan atau penyata yang bentuk jentera mengubah benih dan me­ dikemukakan apa yang dibuat oleh mereka di motong padi yang sesuai dengan keadaan di Canada sana kepada Kementerian Kebu- dalam kawasan Rancangan Perairan Muda. dayaan, Belia dan Sukan dan Menteri Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sukan adakah boleh Buat sementara ini Kementerian saya menyebarkannya kepada Ahli-ahli Parlimen telahpun menganjur dan berikhtiar bersama ini supaya diketahui adakah lawatan itu di antara MADA Kerajaan-kerajaan Negeri membawa faedah kepada negara atau untuk Kedah, Negeri Perlis dan petani-petani di mereka bersuka ria sahaja? Kelantan bagi mencari jalan menambahi lagi tenaga buruh yang dibawa daripada negeri luar iaitu negeri Kelantan ke kawasan Tuan Mokhtar bin Haji Hashim: Tuan berkenaan untuk membantu penanam-pe­ Yang di-Pertua, lapuran itu telahpun kita nanam padi di situ terutamanya di dalam kumpulkan dan sekarang ini berada di kerja memotong padi pada musim yang akan Kementerian dan kalau Ahli Yang Berhormat datang ini. itu berkehendakkan sendiri atas keterangan- keterangan yang berkenaan, saya harap Ahli Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Soalan tambahan. Yang Berhormat bolehlah berhubung dengan Tadi Yang Berhormat Menteri telah me- saya. ngatakan di kawasan Muda jika seorang petani hendak menuai padi, Kerajaan ada PENANAM PADI DI PERAIRAN beri mereka alat-alat mesin memotong padi. MUDA Adakah itu betul atau tidak? 4. Tuan Haji Abdul Wahab bin Yunus Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji (di bawah S.O. 24 (2)) minta Menteri Jawi: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya rasa saya Pertanian dan Perikanan menyatakan samada tidak berkata demikian. beliau sedar bahawa penanam-penanam padi di kawasan-kawasan Rancangan Perairan Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Di dalam rancangan Muda sentiasa menghadapi kekurangan kedua Kementerian Pertanian ada dinyata- tenaga buruh untuk menuai padi terutama kan bahawa di kawasan Muda jikalau petani sekali di masa luar musim yang mengakibat- hendak menuai padi, Kerajaan ada satu kan kerosakan buah-buah padi dan rancangan memberi mereka alat-alat mesin, penanam-penanam padi selalu terpaksa combine harvestor menuai padi di situ. membiarkan beberapa ekar tanaman padi Bilakah rancangan ini boleh dijalankan? mereka tidak dituai, dan jika ya, nyatakan langkah-langkah yang diambil oleh Kerajaan Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji untuk menambahkan tenaga buruh untuk Jawi: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di dalam mengatasi masaalah-masaalah ini. jawapan saya tadi, saya telah menyatakan iaitu pihak MADA atau Lembaga Pertanian Menteri Pertanian dan Perikanan (Tan Muda sedang menguji jentera-jentera yang Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji Jawi): dibawa daripada negeri Jepun, Belgium dan Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya sedar tentang Iain-lain lagi iaitu bagi mengubah dan juga masaalah kekurangan tenaga buruh di waktu menuai padi. Sehingga hari ini kita belum kerja-kerja yang berkehendakkan bilangan lagi mendapati jenis-jenis jentera yang tenaga yang ramai pada musim mengubah sesuai benar bagi dijalankan peranan- dan juga masa menuai padi. Kekurangan peranan mengubah dan memotong padi itu. tenaga buruh ini bertambah buruk pada Sehingga kita dapat jentera-jentera yang ketika menuai padi luar musim. Kerja- sesuai bagi menjalankan perubahan dan juga kerja memotong padi luar musim ini hendak- memotong padi itu, maka pada masa lah sempurna sebelum hujan lebat turun. sekarang ini kita sedang menggunakan Jika tiada siap kerja-kerja itu padi-padi tenaga-tenaga buruh. Dengan sebab tenaga- yang masih belum dituai akan terbiar dan tenaga buruh yang ada di dalam negeri melibatkan kerugian kepada penanam- Kedah tidak mencukupi, ikhtiar sedang di­ penanam padi. jalankan hari ini untuk mendapatkan tenaga 5979 15 JANUARI 1974 5980 buruh daripada negeri-negeri jiran terutama supaya pihak MADA, pihak Kementerian sekali daripada Negeri Kelantan. Jadi ikhtiar dan pihak-pihak yang lain untuk men- sedang dijalankan sekarang ini untuk men- cari jalan berkenaan hendak modify, hendak dapatkan tenaga-tenaga buruh daripada menyesuaikan jentera itu sedang dijalankan Negeri Kelantan bagi menolong di dalam pada hari ini, tetapi hasil yang sempurna masaalah menuai di dalam Negeri Kedah atau yang memuaskan belum didapati. atau di kawasan Perairan Muda itu. Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Saya pun bersetuju Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kita boleh beli jentera-jentera dari luar mengikut ucapan Menteri tadi, katanya negeri, tetapi soalan saya dan maksud saya, alat-alat dan jentera-jentera boleh didapati adakah negara Malaysia satu rancangan dari Eropah, Belgium, England atau Iain- untuk membuat alat-alat menuai padi sendiri, lain tempat, tetapi saya pun tahu dengan bukan to depend on other countries. masaalah combine harvestor atau jentera- jentera menuai padi dan saya sendiri tahu Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Itu sudah dijawab jentera-jentera tidak boleh pakai di ladang- tadi. ladang atau di sawah di Kuala Muda. Soalan saya adakah Kementerian Pertanian Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Kata Menteri kita satu workshop untuk membuat jentera sendiri beli dari lain negeri dan kita kaji mesin- bagi menuai padi Malaysia dengan tidak mesin itu, saya pun bersetuju, tetapi kita payah beli daripada negeri lain sebab sendiri ada satu Kumpulan Engineers buat jentera-jentera daripada luar negeri tidak mesin itu sendiri to suit our local condition. boleh dipakai sebab berat dan sawah-sawah Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji di kawasan Muda di bawah tidak ada firm Jawi: Saya telah terangkan iaitu kita bawa soil dan jentera-jentera tidak boleh berjalan. jentera daripada luar negeri. Pakar-pakar Jadi adakah Kementerian Pertanian satu engineer kita termasuklah Universiti Per­ rancangan untuk menubuhkan satu mesin to tanian, Universiti Malaya dan Iain-lain suit our condition? sedang menjalankan kajian atau research experimenting dan Iain-lain untuk hendak Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji modify mesin-mesin yang dibawa daripada Jawi: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya telah Jepun dan Iain-lain itu bagi menyesuaikan, menyatakan iaitu pihak MADA sedang to make it suitable to our condition here, menguji ataupun experimenting berkenaan sehingga kita mendapat mesin yang baik dan dengan kegunaan jentera-jentera yang di- betul tidaklah dapat kita hendak mengeluar- bawa daripada luar negeri seperti daripada kan mesin itu. Kalau kita hendak keluar Jepun, Belgium dan Iain-lain. Combine bermakna kita cuma mengeluarkan barang harvestor yang dibawa daripada Belgium yang sudah dibawa masuk iaitu cuma either adalah besar, berat dan dengan sebab tanah assembling ataupun duplicating apa yang sawah di Kedah itu kecil maka susah dibawa daripada luar negeri. Saya rasa saya jentera-jentera yang besar itu hendak di- sudah jawab cukup terang cuma barangkali gunakan di dalam kawasan tanah sawah Ahli Yang Berhormat itu pening sedikit dan petak yang sebegitu kecil. Dan kita juga kurang faham apa yang saya jawab. Saya membawa atau membeli jentera-jentera harap dengan ini dia cukup faham. Jepun dan jentera-jentera daripada Jepun itu juga didapati tidaklah begitu sesuai di- Tuan Goh Hock Guan: Tuan Yang di- gunakan di kawasan yang tertentu. Maka Pertua, pada masa sekarang harga beras di dengan sebab itu, kajian sedang dijalankan dalam negeri dan di dunia pun sangat tinggi bersama-sama dengan Universiti Malaya, dan oleh sebab itu penderitaan rakyat itu Universiti Pertanian dan Iain-lain untuk men- adalah terok dan satu sebab yang menyebab- cari jenis jentera yang sesuai, iaitu selain kan masaalah ini ialah kekurangan tenaga daripada kita cuba menguji jentera-jentera penanam-penanam padi. Dengan demikian yang dibeli atau dibawa daripada luar negeri itu bagaimana kita boleh dapat memenuhi itu, kita juga cuba modifykan perkara- tujuan Kerajaan untuk mencapai self- perkara yang patut dipinda untuk kegunaan sufficiency in rice dalam kenyataan Kerajaan dan untuk menyesuaikan dengan keadaan dalam tahun 1980? yang ada di dalam negeri ini. Perkara yang dikehendaki oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Itu soalan lain. 5981 15 JANUARI 1974 5982 Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad: Dalam Nik Abdul Aziz bin Nik Mat: Oleh Kementerian ini hendak mengikhtiarkan kerana masa menanam padi dua kali setahun kekurangan buruh kerana menuai padi tadi, ini memakan masa hanya kira-kira 9 bulan adakah Kementerian ini ada berhubung atau 8 bulan, baki lagi 2 bulan atau 3 bulan, dengan Kementerian Buruh dan Tenaga maka bolehlah atau tidak pihak yang ber­ Rakyat dan juga Kementerian Belia dan kenaan menyiasat supaya bulan 12 atau Sukan bagi mendapatkan buruh-buruh ini bulan banjir ini dijadikan bulan rihad bagi bukan sahaja di Kelantan bahkan di seluruh petani-petani supaya buah masak itu tidak Malaysia ini? kena banjir?

Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji Jawi: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perhubungan Jawi: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, setelah men- dengan Kementerian Buruh adalah dijalan- dengar berita-berita berkenaan dengan kan dan cara yang kita akan jalankan iaitu kerosakan padi yang berlaku terutama sekali dalam Negeri Kelantan pada tahun menerusi penghulu-penghulu, ketua-ketua ini, maka Kementerian saya sekarang ini kampung, Pegawai-pegawai Daerah di dalam sedang mengkaji bagi menyusun dan menye- Negeri Kedah akan membuat bancian berapa suaikan tarikh-tarikh penanaman padi banyakkah bilangan buruh-buruh yang di- supaya dapat dielakkan bulan November kehendaki kemudian manakala angka itu dan bulan Disember daripada dijadikan didapati mereka akan memberitahu kepada musim padi samada menanam ataupun Pejabat Buruh di Negeri Kedah, Pejabat menuai dan sebagainya. Perkara itu sedang Buruh Negeri Kedah akan berhubung dengan dalam kajian Kementerian saya. Pejabat Buruh yang ada di Negeri Kelantan dan Negeri-negeri yang lain sekiranya KAJIAN TENAGA MANUSIA mustahak, dan Pejabat Buruh di Negeri itu pula akan berhubung dengan Pegawai 5. Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad minta Daerah dan penghulu untuk mendapatkan Menteri Buruh dan Tenaga Rakyat me- buruh-buruh yang tertentu bagi menjalankan nyatakan tujuan Kerajaan membuat kajian kerja di sana. tenaga manusia di seluruh negara, dan samada kajian ini sudah selesai dijalankan Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad: Soalan dan faedah-faedah besar yang diperolehi tambahan. Apa kemudahan yang dapat dari kajian ini. diberi oleh Kementerian ini kepada buruh- buruh kita yang datang dari luar bagi Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri menjalankan tugas menuai padi di kawasan Buruh dan Tenaga Rakyat (Tuan Haji Kedah? Ramli bin Omar): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tujuan Kerajaan mengadakan satu kajian Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji tenaga manusia bagi seluruh negara yang Jawi: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tidak meliputi kedua-dua sektor swasta dan awam faham apakah kemudahan yang dihajatkan ialah untuk membekalkan maklumat- oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat itu? maklumat untuk melaksanakan yang ber- Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad: Tuan ikut : Yang di-Pertua, kemudahan mereka datang (a) untuk menilai taraf pelajaran dan ke tempat itu, kemudahan mereka tinggal kemahiran kakitangan-kakitangan yang dan juga ada kaitan dengan usaha yang dia digajikan dalam perbagai pekerjaan. hendak buat di kawasan itu. (b) untuk menentukan kedudukan ke­ kurangan kakitangan-kakitangan yang Tan Sri Haji Mohamed Ghazali bin Haji terlatih dalam berbagai pekerjaan. Jawi: Berkenaan dengan perkara urusan tempat tinggal dan sebagainya itu akan di- (c) untuk menilai setakat mana latihan uruskan oleh pihak Pegawai-pegawai Daerah, semasa bekerja telah dijalankan oleh Penghulu, ketua kampung bersama-sama sektor-sektor swasta dan penggunaan dengan petani-petani di Negeri Kedah yang lepasan-lepasan dari institiut-institiut berkehendakkan buruh-buruh itu. awam bagi latihan-latihan vokesyenal. 5983 15 JANUARI 1974 5984 (d) untuk membuat projeksi keperluan tidak kira samada dari Semenanjung Malay­ tenaga manusia di masa hadapan bagi sia, daripada Sabah dan daripada Sarawak, berbagai pekerjaan untuk memboleh- boleh mendapat kemudahan-kemudahan kan perancangan pelajaran dan projek- seperti berikut: projek latihan yang lebih baik, ter- utamanya berkenaan dengan objektif (ft) Tambang Perjalanan; membolehkan ramai lagi orang-orang (b) Bayaran Peperiksaan; Melayu dan bumiputra yang lain supaya lebih mengambil bahagian dalam sektor (c) Asrama dan Makanan; moden. (d) Elaun $15 sebulan. Hasil pertama (data permulaan) Bagi pelajar-pelajar dari Sabah dan kajian tersebut adalah dijangkakan Sarawak pula, mereka dibayar tambang siap dalam bulan Februari, 1974. kapalterbang apabila mereka mula-mula datang ke I.T.M. dan selepas tamat penga- Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad: Soalan jian mereka. Selepas dua tahun mereka tambahan. Dalam jawapan Yang Berhormat belajar di I.T.M., mereka juga dibenarkan Setiausaha Parlimen tadi saya adalah balik ke Sabah/Sarawak dengan kapal­ berpuashati tetapi satu soalan tambahan terbang dan ditanggung oleh I.T.M. Dalam yang saya akan kemukakan, adakah me- masa cuti pula, mereka akan diberi Elaun liputi dalam kajian nilaian bagi men- Makanan sebagai ganti makanan yang tiada saimbangkan tenaga manusia dengan upahan disediakan dalam masa cuti. yang mereka bekerja di mana-mana juga swasta atau juga di sektor awam? Selain daripada itu Yayasan Sarawak juga memberi Elaun Buku kepada pelajar-pelajar Tuan Haji Ramli bin Omar: Tuan Yang Sarawak. Oleh yang demikian, pelajar- di-Pertua, rasa saya di dalam Kementerian pelajar daripada Sabah dan Sarawak men­ Buruh dan Tenaga Rakyat termasuk dapat kemudahan-kemudahan yang lebih Perancang Ekonomi dan Jabatan Perangkaan daripada pelajar-pelajar dari Semenanjung membuat penyelidikan dengan teliti di dalam Malaysia. perimbangan masaalah itu dan perkara ini akan dapat dikeluarkan sepertimana yang Sungguhpun Elaun Bulanan $15 itu saya telah jelaskan dalam Dewan ini iaitu sedikit nampaknya, tetapi eloklah diingat pada bulan Februari, 1974, kenyataan- bahawa pelajar-pelajar itu juga mendapat kenyataan yang jelas untuk pengetahuan asrama dan makanan percuma dan juga bukan sahaja Ahli Yang Berhormat bahkan kemudahan-kemudahan yang dinyatakan seluruh Ahli-ahli Parlimen dalam Dewan ini. tadi. Oleh itu, Kerajaan belum lagi ber- cadang untuk menaikkan wang Elaun $15 PELAJAR-PELAJAR INSTITIUT sebulan itu. TEKNOLOJI MARA LEMBAGA KEMAJUAN 6. Awang Bungsu bin Abdullah minta SEKOLAH—PENUBUHAN Menteri Pembangunan Ekonomi Desa me- nyatakan samada beliau akan memberi 7. Awang Bungsu bin Abdullah (di bawah pertimbangan berat untuk menaikkan wang S.O. 24 (2)) minta Menteri Pelajaran nie- elaun kepada pelajar-pelajar dari Sarawak nyatakan langkah-langkah yang diambil oleh yang sedang belajar di Institiut Tekno- Kementerian beliau berhubung dengan: loji MARA di Semenanjung Malaysia dan di Sabah, supaya pelajar-pelajar yang (a) penubuhan Lembaga-lembaga Kema- berjauhan dari ibubapa mereka dan juga juan Sekolah bagi semua Negeri di yang datang dari keluarga miskin tidak akan Malaysia; dan mengalami perasaan susah dan bimbang. (b) tindakan untuk mendesak firma-firma perdagangan menjalankan "rancangan- Setiausaha Parlimen kepada Menteri rancangan anak angkat" (adoption Pembangunan Ekonomi Desa (Datuk Haji scheme) seperti yang disyorkan oleh Mustapha bin Haji Abdul Jabar): Tuan Kesatuan Guru-guru Kebangsaan pada Yang di-Pertua, semua pelajar-pelajar I.T.M. awal bulan Oktober, 1973. 5985 15 JANUARI 1974 5986

Menteri Pelajaran (Tuan Haji Mohamed lebih baik kepada orang-orang Iban dan bin Yaacob): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Iain-lain kaum yang terlibat dalam Gerakan (a) Bagi Malaysia Barat, kaedah-kaedah Bebatak di Sarawak. Pada masa ini Kera­ sedang digubal. jaan memberi beberapa jenis bantuan kepada penduduk-penduduk dalam kawasan-ka­ (b) Syor ini tidak dikemukakan kepada wasan Bebatak dan pemberian tepung sagu Kementerian Pelajaran oleh Kesatuan adalah merupakan hanya salah satu dari Guru-guru Kebangsaan. bantuan tersebut. PEKERJA PRESTON TIMES Pada amnya Gerakan Bebatak adalah PRINTING/PUBLISHING SDN. BHD. satu konsep untuk memberi keadaan hidup yang lebih baik dan perlindungan kese- 8. Tuan V. Veerappen (di bawah S. O. 24(2)) lamatan kepada mereka yang terlibat bertanya kepada Menteri Hal Ehwal Dalam dalam context keadaan keselamatan Negeri samada beliau sedar bahawa enam di kawasan RASCOM, Sarawak. Sungguh- orang pekerja dari Preston Times Printing pun Gerakan Bebatak itu adalah sementara, & Publishing Sdn. Bhd., Shah Alam telah sekim-sekim ini bertujuan memberi keadaan melapurkan kepada pihak Polis bahawa mereka telah dipaksa oleh pihak pengurusan hidup yang lebih baik kepada penduduk- meletakkan jawatan dari Kesatuan Pekerja- penduduknya. pekerja Perusahaan Percetakan yang mana adalah suatu kesalahan di bawah Akta Kerajaan sekarang merancang untuk Perhubungan Perusahaan tahun 1967, jika menempatkan semula penduduk-penduduk ya, adakah beliau akan menerangkan kepada Bebatak ke dalam sekim-sekim) kemajuan Dewan ini samada pihak pengurusan telah tanah yang kekal. Pada masa ini penyelidikan didakwa; jika tidak, mengapa. tanah sedang dibuat untuk menentukan kawasan-kawasan yang sesuai bagi kemajuan Menteri Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri (Tan pertanian dengan mengambil kira pem- Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin Shafie): bangunan yang akan dilaksanakan di Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sebenarnya bukan 6 kawasan-kawasan yang berhampiran dengan orang tetapi 5 orang pekerja dari Preston sekim-sekim tanah yang kekal itu. Times Printing & Publishing Sdn. Bhd., Shah Alam yang telah membuat pengaduan di Balai Polis Batu 3, Daerah Kelang pada KONFRANTASI INDONESIA— 10-9-1973. TAHANAN Penyiasatan di dalam perkara ini adalah 10. Tuan Ng Hoe Hun minta Menteri Hal di dalam peringkat akhir sekarang. Ehwal Dalam Negeri menyatakan: (a) bilangan orang-orang yang ditahan dan IBAN/NATIVE DALAM GERAKAN dihukum penjara seumur hidup di BEBATAK—BANTUAN Malaysia Barat berikutan dengan 9. Penghulu Abit anak Angkin minta Men­ konfrantasi antara Malaysia dan teri Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri menyatakan Indonesia; samada Kerajaan akan menimbang menye- (b) bilangan orang-orang yang dihukum diakan keadaan-keadaan hidup yang lebih penjara seumur hidup yang telah di- baik dari orang-orang Iban yang terjejas bebaskan hingga tarikh 26hb Novem­ oleh Gerakan "Bebatak" (Rancangan- ber, 1973; rancangan Berkumpul Semula) yang ada sekarang di Sarawak oleh kerana kehidupan (c) bilangan orang-orang yang tersebut orang-orang Iban sekarang ini bergantung dalam (a) yang masih lagi ditahan; semata-mata kepada tepung sagu. (d) bilangan orang-orang yang di bawah Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin perintah buang negeri; dan Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Kerajaan 0) samada Encik Rahim Zakaria ditahan sebenarnya sedang melaksanakan langkah- kerana sokongan beliau terhadap langkah untuk memberi keadaan hidup yang gerilla-gerilla Indonesia. 5987 15 JANUARI 1974 5988

Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, soal Banish­ ment Ordinance ini tiap-tiap orang terlibat (a) 37 orang. di dalamnya adalah sentiasa di dalam (b) 19 orang. perhatian dan pertimbangan. Sekiranya patut (c) 18 orang. atau menasabah maka perakuan akan dibuat. dd) 10 orang, tetapi hendaklah diingat Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad: Tuan bahawa itu tidak bersangkut dengan Yang di-Pertua, di dalam soalan (a) tadi soal konfrantasi tak ada kena-mengena menurut hemat saya apa yang saya faham- dengan konfrantasi. kan seramai 37 orang yang telah terlibat (e) Orang ini bukan ditahan tetapi telah dengan hukuman itu, saya hendak tahu dikenakan hukuman penjara seumur adakah Kerajaan Indonesia sekarang hidup oleh Mahkamah Tinggi Ipoh, mengakui konfrantasi yang dilakukan oleh pada 31hb Mei, 1966, kerana ber- rejim Sukarno dahulu? subahat dengan musuh negara yang bersenjata. Dalam bulan November, Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin 1966 Duli Yang Maha Mulia Sultan Shafie: Apa soalannya? Saya hendak dengar Perak, atas sembah nasihat Jemaah lagi sekali. Pegampunan Negeri Perak, telah ber- Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad: Tuan kenan mengampunkan beliau. Yang di-Pertua, dalam jawapan Yang Berhormat Menteri berkenaan tadi mengata­ Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kan di antaranya 37 orang ada dikenakan soalan tambahan. Sebelum saya tanya hukuman berhubung dengan konfrantasi, soalan tambahan bolehkah Menteri sabar saya hendak tahu adakah Kerajaan dengan saya berkenaan dengan masaalah ini? Indonesia sekarang mengakui konfrantasi yang dibuat oleh regime Sukarno dahulu? Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Saya yang boleh menjaga supaya sabar. Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Itu soalan lain. Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Soalan saya ber­ Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Soalan saya ber­ kenaan dengan (c). Menteri berkata sekarang kenaan orang tahanan dalam masa ada lagi 8 orang dipenjarakan. Bolehkah konfrantasi, namanya Cheah Ah Kaw. beliau beritahu bahawa 8 orang itu ada Sekarang dia ada di Penjara Taiping. Saya merayu kepada Jawatankuasa Ulangkaji atau telah bercakap dengannya di Penjara tidak supaya mereka dibebaskan? Taiping dan dia ada memberitahu mengenai kesusahannya. Katanya, dia mengakui yang Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin dia pergi ke Indonesia mengambil latihan, Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, soalan (c) tetapi sekarang dia sudah insaf dan sedar bukan 8 orang, tetapi 18 orang. Mereka ini bahawa dia sudah buat salah dan apabila dia adalah sedang menjalankan hukuman pen­ sampai ke pantai Malaysia dahulu dia lari jara seumur hidup dan ini adalah mengikut dan menyerah diri dengan sendiri ke Balai peraturan-peraturan penjara samada kes Polis. Sekarang dia ada di Penjara Taiping. mereka itu akan direview atau tidak. Bolehkah Menteri yang berkenaan menim- bangkan kesnya dan jika boleh bebaskan dia, Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sebab dia sudah dihukum dan sudah sedar berkenaan dengan Banishment Ordinance mengenai kesalahannya. berkaitan dengan soalan (d) Yang Ber- hormat Menteri mengatakan sekarang di penjara Malaysia ada 10 orang lagi masih Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin dipenjarakan. Mengikut Seksyen 7 Banish­ Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tidak ada ment Ordinance mereka boleh bawa Kerajaan yang boleh mengambil-alih apa execution of a bond with sureties, bolehkah yang dijalankan oleh Mahkamah, kerana kita mereka dilepaskan jika mereka buat begitu, mengikut peraturan undang-undang—the rule sebab tak berapa lama dahulu di Dewan ini of law must apply—bahawa dia sudah mem- Menteri berkata sudah ada 57 orang yang buat kesalahan, Mahkamah sudah menjatuh- dibebaskan di bawah Banishment Ordinance. kan hukumannya. Dari segi pengampunan 5989 15 JANUARI 1974 5990 dan sebagainya adalah terletak di atas belas Tuan Goh Hock Guan: Soalan tambahan. kasihan dan perkenan Duli Yang Maha Konfrantasi telah 10 tahun tamat dan Mulia. sekarang tahun 1974. Soalan yang saya hendak tanya ialah orang-orang ini yang Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Tuan Yang di- sekarang ada dalam penjara, bolehkah Pertua, soalan tambahan. Saya mendengar mereka mengancam Kerajaan lagi atau tidak? Menteri Keselamatan Dalam Negeri Kalau tidak boleh, bolehkah kita timbang- menyatakan Encik Rahim Zakaria telah kan supaya mereka itu dibebaskan? mendapat keampunan dari Kebawah Duli Sultan Perak. Jadi apabila mendapat ke­ Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin ampunan ini, sudahkah dia dibebaskan atau- Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya hendak pun belum? mengingatkan Yang Berhormat bahawa orang ini menjalani hukuman penjara yang Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin dijatuhkan hukuman oleh Mahkamah, Shafie: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, setakat yang mereka ini sudah bersabit di dalam ke- saya tahu waran yang mengizinkan dia salahannya memegang senjata di dalam masa keluar belum lagi dikeluarkan oleh Kerajaan konfrantasi dahulu. Negeri Perak di bawah Titah Duli Yang Maha Mulia. Raja Nong Chik bin Raja Ishak: Soalan tambahan. Saya hendak bertanya satu Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Tuan Yang di- perkara iaitu orang-orang yang telah meng- Pertua, soalan tambahan. Mengikut pene- kjiianati negara dengan membawa senjata rangan Menteri Keselamatan Dalam Negeri menyerang negerinya sendiri sebagai warga­ bila seseorang itu bersubahat dengan sesebuah negara telah dihukum gantung oleh Kerajaan asing kerana hendak mengguling- Mahkamah tetapi oleh kerana kebaikan kan Kerajaan dia dihukum penjara, tetapi Kerajaan telah direngankan dengan hukuman ada orang lain yang bersubahat dengan penjara seumur hidup. Jadi, soalan saya ini kominis dengan memberikan senjata dan patut atau tidak patut Kerajaan manahan barang makanan dua minggu sahaja ditahan, dia selama-lamanya dan jangan dilepas- dengan tak payah dijamin dia dibebaskan. lepaskan lagi? Mengapakah Rahim Zakaria ini teruk sangat Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Apa soalannya? hendak dibebaskan? (Ketawa). Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Itu soalan lain USUL-USUL sama sekali. WAKTU MESYUARAT DAN URUSAN Tuan Hashim bin Gera: Kalahlah saya, YANG DIBEBASKAN DARIPADA kalau itu soalan lain. PERATURAN MESYUARAT Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Berhubung dengan Timbalan Menteri Perdagangan dan Per- soalan berkenaan dengan Rahim Zakaria, indastrian (Datuk Musa Hitam): Tuan Yang saya tahu namanya ialah Encik Abdul di-Pertua, saya mohon mencadangkan: Rahim Zakaria alias Yaakob Zakaria dan Bahawa menurut peruntukan Peraturan dia sekarang ditahan di Penjara Taiping. Mesyuarat 12 (1) Dewan ini tidak akan Soalan saya apakah sebabnya Idris Tadah ditangguhkan hari ini hingga pukul 7.30 seorang Indonesia sama seperti Abdul Rahim malam. Zakaria, dia pun orang Indonesia, tetapi Idris Tadah masuk ke negara Malaysia sama Datuk Haji Wan Abdul Kadir bin Ismail: seperti Abdul Rahim bin Zakaria. Idris Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mohon Tadah adalah warganegara Indonesia sudah menyokong. dilepaskan balik ke Indonesia, tetapi Encik Usui dikemuka bagi diputuskan, dan Abdul Rahim Zakaria alias Yaakob Zakaria disetujukan. warganegara Indonesia belum dibebaskan. Bolehkah dia dibebaskan? Diputuskan, Bahawa menurut peruntukan Peraturan Tan Sri Haji Muhammad Ghazali bin Mesyuarat 12 (1) Dewan ini tidak akan Shafie: Saya sudah jawab, Tuan Yang di- ditangguhkan hari ini hingga pukul 7.30 Pertua. malam. 5991 15 JANUARI 1974 5992 RANG UNDANG-UNDANG September 4th. I was also invited to this meeting, together with my collegue, Bernard RANG UNDANG-UNDANG Sta Maria, the Malacca State Assemblyman PERBEKALAN, 1974 for Kota Timur. DAN Unfortunately, when in public, the Minister refused to make the commitment, USUL and to this date, with the completion of the work of the Committee of Investigation into ANGGARAN PEMBANGUNAN, 1974 the Malacca Hospital deaths, the Ministerial Jawatankuasa promise has been broken. Aturan Urusan Mesyuarat dibacakan bagi I want the Minister to tell this House why menyambung semula Perbahasan dalam he broke this promise to allow the relatives Jawatankuasa sebuah-buah Majlis (14hb of the deceased to appear before the Januari, 1974). Committee. Is it because of pressures from Majlis Mesyuarat menjadi Jawatankuasa. his subordinates which he could not overrule? (Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan The Minister set up a six-man Inquiry Jawatankuasa) Committee, described subsequently as a "departmental inquiry" by its Chairman, the Tuan Pengerusi: Saya beri dalam masa 10 Secretary-General of the Ministry of Health, minit sahaja lagi. Encik Abdul Majid Yusof, into the so-called 12 deaths mentioned by the Minister on Perbahasan disambung semula. August 24th. 3.15 ptg. To members of the public, all the six JADUAL members of the Committee are directly or indirectly associated with the Ministry of Kepala B. 28 dan P. 28— Health or the Government. The six-man Tuan Lim Kit Siang (Bandar Melaka): Inquiry Committee suffers from four basic (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, as I was defects: saying yesterday, on my initiative I met the (1) Its proceedings were not conducted in Minister of Health in his office in Kuala public. Lumpur on 30th August, 1973 to tell him of the seriousness of the whole affair. He (2) It did not include an Opposition told me that he had no axe to grind and that member, a foreign medical expert or the Committee of Investigation which he a representative of the deceased had established under the Secretary-General families so that its findings would be of his Ministry, together with some represen­ the last word on the matter and tatives from the universities, would be given accepted without reservations by the complete freedom to probe into the matter. public. (3) It did not investigate into all the 106 At my request, he promised that the cases of deaths between July 21 and relatives and next-of-kin of the deceased August 20 last year, when the auto­ would be given opportunities to appear clave broke down. before the investigation committee to relate the circumstances of their dear one's death. (4) It did not hear representations and testimony from the relatives and next- This Ministerial promise was repeated by of-kin of the deceased. the Minister himself to the Malacca State Chief Medical and Health Officer, the The Minister is no stranger to these views Medical Superintendent of the Malacca of mine, for I had in August, September and Hospital, Heads of Departments of the October written to him several letters Malacca Hospital and the then Acting conveying my views, thoughts and the Malacca State Chief Minister, Datuk Tan information in my possession so as to try to Cheng Swee, at a closed door meeting when get him to take firm disciplinary action and the Minister visited the Malacca Hospital on corrective measures. 5993 15 JANUARI 1974 5994

The Minister's objection to the inclusion As I wrote in my letter to the Minister on of an Opposition member on the investigation 21st September, 1973, and I quote: committee is that the investigation is a medical problem and that only medical and "Recently, the Malacca Hospital author professionally qualified people should be rities have launched a witch-hunt to black­ involved. This is not a strong enough reason, list and mark for punishment personnel for the Chairman of the Committee, Encik whom the top administrators suspect are Abdul Majid Yusof, is himself a non­ responsible one way or another for medical person. furnishing information leading to my call and campaign for a public inquiry into Another highly unsatisfactory aspect about the Malacca Hospital deaths. the Investigation Committee's work is its inordinate delays and long postponements. "You assured me at our meeting oil The Minister had personally assured me August 30 that you are personally anxioiis that he wanted to have the Committee to get to the truth of the entire tragic complete its work as early as possible. The affair, and that there would be no witch­ Press Secretary of the Ministry of Health is hunt either by the Ministry of Health or the on record as saying that the Investigation Malacca Hospital authorities to vicitimise Committee would complete its findings at or penalise any officer or staff merely on the end of September. suspicion that persons had given informa­ tion to me. About five months have passed, and we still have no news about the results of the "The most crucial and pressing task at Committee's investigations. I understand that hand is to find out how many innocent the Investigation Committee had submitted people died in the Malacca Hospital in its report to the Minister a few days ago, July and August, and how to restore and if so, I call on the Minister to imme­ public confidence in the Malacca Hospital diately make public the findings and make and not to embark on a witch-hunt which available to every Member of Parliament a can only end up as a wild goose chase just copy of the report. to satisfy some personal pride or venoin. "I urge you therefore to look into this I want to say in advance that I cannot but matter personally, to ensure that the approach the Investigation Committee's findings with grave reservations and qualifi­ Malacca Hospital authorities will not be cations, because of the reasons which I have permitted to victimise or penalise any given and other reasons which I shall touch person for speaking truthfully, or for some in a short while later. unfounded suspicion, or to settle some personal score." Here, I would like to know why the Minister of Health was so opposed to the In this connection, I cannot understand holding of a Public Commission of Inquiry why the Minister did not take immediate into the Malacca Hospital deaths so that a disciplinary action against the Medical proper accounting either way can be made. Superintendent of the Malacca Hospital, Dr There had been public inquiries for lesser Wong Mae Yee, whose continued presence tragedies, like the Jalan Raja Laut four-storey in the administration could only have a building collapse and the Pasir Mas derail­ deterrent effect on the staff, from speaking ments. Compared to them there is no doubt freely. Why wasn't the Medical Superinten­ that the Malacca Hospital deaths put them dent suspended immediately, as the officer in a shade, both in terms of lives involved in overall charge of the hospital during the and the gross inefficiency concerned. mass hospital deaths, to clear the way for a Another unsatisfactory feature about the thorough inquiry? investigations is that the Minister failed to take all necessary action to ensure that I have nothing personal against Dr Wong subordinate hospital staff would feel free Mae Yee. In fact, it is a very unpleasant task and unrestrained to give full, frank and for me. However, I have my duty to my truthful testimony without fear of alienating constituents, the people of Malacca and or antagonising superiors to their future Malaysia, and I shall perform my unpleasant detriment. task with the greatest reluctance. 5995 15 JANUARI 1974 5996

It is my considered conclusion that Dr under the oxygen tent, but he had to share Wong Mae Yee must bear the brunt of the it with another baby. Later in the night, responsibility for the maladministration in the other baby died but Tai Hock the Malacca Hospital. In fact, if the doctors, continued to be under the same oxygen purses and staff are allowed to give their tent. There was no change of bed or views freely without inhibition or fear, I bedsheet or the tent canopy even though have no doubt a similar verdict would be one patient had just died. rendered by them. Since Tai Hock's admission into the On September 14th last year, when opening ward, no other doctor saw or reviewed his a conference of State Health Directors and condition. He was very ill, restless and Heads of Divisions in Kuantan, the Minister breathless. Madam Tan asked the staff of Health ordered hospital authorities to take nurse to help and she gave him an injection. action against the few who are blemishing the His condition did not improve. good name of the hospital service and It was only until about 9.30 a.m. the next assured them of his full support. morning, on 3-9-73—12 hours after his admission the previous night—that Kua Unfortunately, the Minister of Health has Tai Hock was seen by a doctor, by which himself proved that he lacked the resolution time the boy's condition was already very or authority to exercise impartially disci­ plinary powers against heads of divisions. bad. Despite the glare of national publicity The boy died at about 1.30 p.m., following the disclosures about the Malacca despite attempts to save his life. Hospital mass deaths, the administration and standards of service in the Malacca Hospital The cause of death was given as Bronchopneumonia with G.I. bleeding. has not improved. In fact, on the eve of the Minister's This case of Kua Tai Hock happened after special visit to Malacca on 4th September, a the autoclave affair. Many questions cry out two-year old boy, Kua Tai Hock, died for answer here: unnecessarily. The facts of Kua Tai Hock's (1) Was Tai Hock's death unavoidable case is as follows: and necessary, especially when he had been receiving outpatient treatment for Kua Tai Hock was having fever for one one week previously from the week, and had been receiving outpatient hospital—which means that all along, treatment from the Malacca General the hospital doctors did not think his Hospital. Kua Tai Hock had difficulty in case serious enough to warrant breathing, was sweating and had cold admission. hands and feet. (2) Wasn't there a doctor on call at the On September 2nd night, his mother, Malacca General Hospital at night to Madam Tan Leong, took him to the see or review serious cases hour by Malacca General Hospital as he was very hour? ill. Kua Tai Hock was seen by a doctor at about 10.15 p.m., after which he was (3) Why didn't a single doctor attend to given outpatient treatment again, without Tai Hock for 12 hours despite his being admitted. serious condition on admission? (4) Was it hygienic and compatible with While waiting to collect the medicines, standard hygienic practice to continue Tai Hock's condition worsened, his to use any oxygen tent for a patient breathing became more difficult and his although another person has died under finger tips were turning blue. Madam Tan it, without any change of bedsheet? Leong pleaded with the nurses on duty for help. (5) Was there adequate and early and timely medical supervision and nursing This time, the doctor came back, care? accompanied by another doctor, who both examined the boy and had him admitted The mother of the boy, Madam Tan into hospital. When Tai Hock reached the Leong, wrote to both the Medical Superin­ ward, he was seriously ill. He was put tendent of the Malacca Hospital and the 5997 15 JANUARI 1974 5998

Honourable Minister of Health on the boy's And what has the Minister of Health done death. I also wrote to the Minister of Health concerning this case, although I personally on the matter but I did not receive even an wrote to him? As far as I know, he seemed acknowledgement. to have ignored it. On 29th November, 1973, the Medical The reason why I am moving the present Superintendent, Dr Wong Mae Yee, in reply motion is because I am tired of the Minister's to the mother, which apart from "merasa exterior of reasonableness and concern, his sedih di atas kehilangan anak puan dan promise of action, which all comes finally to dukacita di atas segala kesusahan yang nothing. berlaku" failed completely to answer the five questions which I posed. Last Tuesday, in the wake of great publicity, the Minister of Health made a I will quote only one relevant paragraph surprise visit to the Seremban General from Dr Wong Mae Yee's letter to the Hospital and ticked off the authorities for the mother: This is from the letter— shabby state of the General Hospital there. "Sentiasa ada seorang Doctor Pelatih di He also found that only three of the seven dalam panggilan pertama untuk Wad, ambulances were in working order. This is beliau boleh memanggil Pegawai Per­ all good, but the question is whether these ubatan di dalam panggilan kedua apabila visits accompanied by such great publicity perlu dan Pegawai Perubatan boleh juga will do any good. memanggil Pendaftar ataupun Doktor Pakar Perubatan apabila perlu. Oleh On September 4th, the Minister made a kerana anak puan sakit teruk beliau highly-publicised visit to the Malacca sepatutnya memberitahu Pegawai Per­ Hospital. He was good enough to ask me to ubatan dalam tugas panggilan dan juga come along. I told him again of the break­ melihat anak puan semula. Oleh yang down of the lift in the maternity ward of the demikian, doktor yang berkenaan telah Malacca Hospital, which I had raised in diberitahu supaya jangan mengulang Parliament previously (on 24-1-73) and perkara ini lagi." which had been out of order for two years. This has prompted the mother, in her Apart from the inconvenience to the letter to the Ketua Setiausaha of the expectant mothers, in the three-storeyed Ministry of Health on 4th December, to maternity ward, the unrepaired lift posed a make the following very heart-breaking threat to the health and lives of maternity comments and I quote: cases which underwent operation. As I told "Pada ertinya saya dipaksa come to the the Minister and the State Medical and conclusion that: Health Officer during the visit, after an operation, the blood pressure will be low and (a) seorang Doktor Pelatih sahaja telah it is essential that the brain should not lack memeriksa dan memberi rawatan blood or death can esue. If patients after kepada anak saya; operation are carried up the stairs on an (b) Tidak ada Pegawai Perubatan yang incline, with the head at a higher level than reviewkan, assess keadaan anak saya the legs, then the head will not receive blood. pada malam, 2-9-73. Anak saya This is highly dangerous to post-surgical bukan sakit ringgan, dia sakit teruk. cases. Seorang Doktor Pelatih is just learning The Minister of Health promised to take and under supervision. How can he decide immediate action and today, five months on my son's fate? He is not qualified yet. have passed and the lift is still out of order. My son died because at the crucial and If the Minister of Health cannot do a small critical period after admission he was not thing like getting a lift fixed for two years, attended to by a qualified doctor. My son what other things can he do? need not have died. My son is not a guinea pig for the houseman to learn from his I have in this House raised cases of mistakes so that all the Hospital unnecessary deaths before due to negligence authorities can say is "oleh yang demikian, of the hospital staff, but I have never been doktor yang berkenaan telah diberitahu able to get satisfactory action taken by the supaya jangan mengulang perkara ini lagi." Minister of Health. 5999 15 JANUARI 1974 6000 In January, 1972, I raised in this House 3.30 ptg. the death of one Puan Chong Lan Jin, 27, a housewife on 16-9-1971. On 14th September, Tuan Loh Jee Mee (Batang Padang): 1971, she was rushed down from Batang Tuan Pengerusi, saya menyokong usul ter- Melaka to the Malacca Hospital with a sebut. Dan saya minta izin untuk menambah Salvation Army clinic recommendation for sedikit. hospitalisation. But when she came to the Hospital, the Hospital refused to admit her. Tuan Pengerusi: Tidak boleh ditambah Her husband had to take her back to Batang lagi. Telah disokong, cukup! Melaka, about 15 miles away to find the Salvation Army nurse and bring her down to Tuan Loh Jee Mee: Bolehkah saya hendak the Hospital. Only then was she admitted, memberi ucapan? i.e. after getting the poor woman to travel 45 miles. She died on 16th September, 1971. Tuan Pengerusi: Boleh, lima minit sahaja. The Minister took a light-hearted attitude Tuan Loh Jee Mee: Lebih kurang, Tuan to this case and other similar cases. Pengerusi. Tuan Pengerusi: Saya suka hendak meng- Tuan Pengerusi: Kalau kurang maknanya ingatkan Ahli Yang Berhormat bahawa empat minit (Ketawa). Apa yang hendak tujuan kita berdiri dan bangun di dalam ditambah lagi? Sila tentukan, bersetuju Dewan ini ialah hendak membawa satu usul, atau tidak oleh Dewan atas Usui ini supaya hendak ditentukan dan keterangan diberi di dapat kita putuskan. atas usul itu. Saya rasa keterangan itu sudah melebihi masa. Sila bawa usul itu. Tuan Loh Jee Mee: Tuan Pengerusi, bolehkah saya berucap sedikit sahaja? Tuan Lim Kit Siang: Saya akan ringkas- kan. So to conclude, Tuan Pengerusi, the Tuan Pengerusi: Boleh, empat lima minit, Malacca Hospital has acquired such noto­ kerana beliau sudah bercakap panjang. riety that for many years now, the well-to- Masanya sudah suntuk. Hari Raya Cina do and the big shots in the M.C.A., for akan tiba (Ketawa). instance, do not go there but only the poor go there. But for the poor, they have no Tuan Loh Jee Mee: (Dengan izin) Mr other place to go but the Malacca Hospital Chairman, Sir, I am also able to add strength and there is a need for a shake-up at the to what has been said by my colleague, the Malacca Hospital, which has not been done. Member for Bandar Melaka. As I have said If the Ministry of Health is to start on a before in this House, the Health Ministry has new page to regain public confidence and always been under attack from both sides of credibility, then there must be a Public the House and not without any reasons. The Commission of Inquiry into the mass deaths. administration and the running of the This is also necessary because we owe it to Government Hospitals leave much to be the doctors and nurses, because it is a slur desired. Inefficiency is the order of the day. on the reputation of the doctors and nurses Many a patient has lost his or her life at who serve in such a service. I have come the hands of the Government Hospitals in across doctors and nurses who have left this country due either to the gross negligence Government Service because they find that of some doctors with the "tidak apa attitude" they are associated with such incompetence or nurses and hospital assistants trying to and inefficiency to which they see no change, play the role of qualified doctors. Medical no possibility of reform. prudence requires not only a nurse but even the attendant to summon a doctor in the Oleh sebab itu, saya mencadangkan: case of a patient requiring attention. This Bahawa wang peruntukan bagi Kepala B. however does not appear to be followed by 28, Pecahan-kepala (Kod) 1100 dalam Be- some hospital employees in this country. lanjawan Persekutuan Tahun 1974, Kertas Quite often nurses, be they assistant nurses Perintah Tahun 1973 dikurangkan sebanyak or staff nurses, or the hospital assistants and $100 berkaitan dengan gaji Menteri Kesi- even attendants and amahs take it upon hatan, dan rakan saya dari Batang Padang themselves to act as medical experts, thereby akan menyokong saya. hoodwinking the illiterate men. 6001 15 JANUARI 1974 6002 Mr Chairman, Sir, there have been cases On the 12th November, 1973, that was of such people quarrelling with members of three days after the opening of the new the public or relatives of the patients or even Outpatients Department of the Tapah District patients themselves instead of advising them Hospital by the Honourable Health Minister, on the seriousness of the case and the treat­ two doctors went for the Bahasa Malaysia ment they require. This has resulted in many examination without any relief doctors from a life being lost. I would like to bring to the Ipoh leaving behind a lady doctor to hold attention of this House and in particular to the fort. This lady doctor preferred to go on the attention of the Honourable Minister for her rounds while an emergency case brought Health who has been trying shouting from by the police was waiting for medical the roof-tops about the improvement of attention. The patient, a woman labourer, health services in this country of a case was in a coma when she was brought in at where a parent had lost his son due to the about 8.00 a.m. and it was only about 2\ gross negligence, arrogance, carelessness and hours later that the doctor examined her. mere laziness of a so-called qualified nurse That too, Sir, was after I had intervened. of many years experience. Perhaps just because the woman patient happened to be a labourer, her welfare was Sir, I refer to the case of one Lim Koon neglected. Sung, aged 14, of Bidor who was warded at the Tapah District Hospital at about 10.00 For the information of the Honourable p.m. on 29th December, 1973 who complained Minister, here is another case of negligence of having been knocked by a heavy or hard and inefficiency on the part of the hospital instrument. This would have prompted even staff. On the 27th November, 1973, a man a layman to subject the patient to X-ray for by the name of Wong Say Guan, aged 71 of 54 Station Road, Tapah, was admitted to internal head injuries but in the reckoning the ward 9 of the General Hospital, Ipoh of the nurse in attendance it was a matter and was without a blanket for four nights so trivial that it did not even require the although an appeal was made to the nurses attention of a doctor. She therefore told the in charge of the ward but it fell on deaf ignorant parent bluntly that being a Sunday, ears. It was after my intervention that this despite the fact that the boy was admitted poor old man was given a blanket, that was, the previous night, no doctor would be after contacted the administrator of the available. When the parent pleaded with her, hospital by phone from this building. the nurse told him that the doctor might come around but she was unable to say On the 9th December, 1973 and the 2nd of exactly when. This statement was made in January this year the ambulance of the the presence of other hospital staff where­ Tapah District Hospital broke down half­ upon both the parent and the nurse went way while conveying patients from the into a heated argument after which the Tapah Hospital to the Ipoh General Hos­ infuriated parent took his child back home. pital. Sir, ambulances being abandoned or seen being pushed between Tapah and Ipoh Sir, having gathered the impression that is now a common sight. This morning the doctors would not be available on Sundays Tapah District Hospital was without any the parent waited until the following day to ambulance and the hospital had to borrow a vehicle from the police. take this child to the General Hospital, Ipoh where he was admitted and died three hours Such is the state of affairs while the later. Minister goes round the country opening one clinic after another and proudly boasting of Sir, this is a clear case of complete better health services for our people. Whilst negligence and arrogance on the part of the talking about hospitals, doctors in the Tapah hospital staff particularly when the party District Hospital have been entrusted with an seeking treatment happened to be an illiterate. additional task of deciding which patient Just in case the Honourable Minister says ought to be given mosquito nets and I can one swallow does not make a summer, I assure this House this is no simple task as have for him another example to substantiate there is an extreme shortage of mosquito my allegation. nets at the hospital. 6003 15 JANUARI 1974 6004

Sir, a night's stay without a mosquito net Tuan Pengerusi: Saya sekarang hendak will perhaps help convince the Honourable bertanya kepada Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat Minister of Health of the dense mosquitoes samada bersetuju atau tidak dengan per­ at the Tapah Hospital. aturan itu. Kalau mengikut peraturan, Menteri yang berkenaan mengemukakan {Dr Tan Chee Khoon dan Tuan V. David): balik kepada Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat (Bangun). untuk bercakap, jadi kalau bersetuju di atas Tuan Pengerusi: I have not put the peraturan itu, saya kemukakan balik kepada question to the House yet. Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat. Kalau tidak, saya akan putuskan soal itu, samada Ahli-ahli Ada satu usul yang dibawa dan telah Yang Berhormat juga bersetuju usul ini atau disokong. tidak—biasanya begitulah peraturannya di Usulnya berbunyi: atas usul-usul semacam ini. "Bahawa wang peruntukan bagi Kepala Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Tuan Pengerusi, B. 28, Pecahan-kepala (Kod) 1100 dalam bolehkah saya mencadangkan supaya kita Belanjawan Persekutuan Tahun 1974, Kertas Perintah Tahun 1973 dikurangkan membahaskan kedua-dua usul iaitu usul sebanyak $100 berkaitan dengan gaji dari Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Bandar Menteri Kesihatan" Melaka dan terbuka untuk dibahaskan. Tuan Pengerusi: Tidak boleh! Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat, saya suka mengingatkan, iaitu hendaklah dipendekkan Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Kalau tidak boleh, sedikit ucapan itu. Kalau tidak, saya akan saya hendak bercakap tentang usul Ahli berhentikan Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat dari Yang Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka. bercakap. Tuan Pengerusi: Ini kita tentukan dahulu. 3.40 ptg. Kalau itu sudah ditentukan; baharu boleh Dr Tan Chee Khoon (Batu): Saya cuba bercakap balik atas usul yang pertama. seberapa yang boleh, Tuan Pengerusi. Saya hendak bercakap sedikit tentang per- Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Saya hendak ber­ belanjaan yang dikemukakan oleh Menteri cakap tentang usul Ahli Yang Berhormat Kesihatan, dan di samping ini, saya mohon dari Bandar Melaka. izin bercakap dalam bahasa Inggeris. Tuan Pengerusi: Itulah saya katakan tadi, Tuan Pengerusi, terlebih dahulu saya silalah bercakap, tetapi jangan panjang- hendak menyentuh sedikit sebanyak tentang panjang. Kita sudah mengerti Ahli Yang Jawatan Tertinggi kepada Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka tidak ber­ Tuan Pengerusi: Saya suka hendak meng­ setuju tentang perkara ini dan beliau ingatkan kepada Ahli Yang Berhormat mencadangkan supaya dikurangkan gaji bahawa kita membahaskan usul ini sekarang, S100. Jadi hendak ditanya samada bersetuju bukannya Belanjawan—usul ini sahaja. ataupun tidak bersetuju. Kalau tidak ada sesiapa yang hendak bercakap, saya jemput Menteri, jika hendak Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Tuan Yang di- menjawabnya. Pertua, Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka apabila beliau bercakap kelmarin Tan Sri Lee Siok Yew: Tuan Pengerusi, berkenaan usul ini, saya pulangkan balik dan hari ini menyentuh dengan panjang lebar kepada Dewan ini membuat keputusan, apa- tentang kematian yang berlaku di Hospital kah tugas saya sebagai Menteri Kesihatan Besar Melaka dan oleh sebab itu beliau ini terpulang balik kepada Ahli-ahli Yang hendak mengurangkan gaji Menteri ataupun Berhormat yang dipilih oleh rakyat jelata di peruntukan kepada Menteri Kesihatan dalam Dewan ini membuat keputusan. sebanyak $100. Saya hendak sentuh mengenai Selepas itu, saya akan menjawab apa yang lain perkara tentang Kementeriannya, bukan disebutkan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat dari sahaja apa yang disebutkan oleh Ahli Yang Bandar Melaka terhadap usul ini. Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka. 6005 15 JANUARI 1974 6006

Tuan Pengerusi, saya hendak membawa tuduhan-tuduhan yang telah didatangkan perhatian Menteri Kesihatan tentang kepadanya daripada pihak Pembangkang Jawatan-jawatan Tertinggi terhadap doktor- supaya kami yang hendak mengundi akan doktor di Kementerian Kesihatan iaitu dapat mengundi dengan clear mind dan kita kekurangan Jawatan-jawatan Tertinggi atau tahu apa yang kita undi, kerana allegations di dalam bahasa Inggerisnya Superscale yang datang daripada pihak Pembangkang posts. begitu serious dan kita sendiri tidak tahu factnya. Jadi, saya minta daripada Tuan (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, it is no Pengerusi meminta daripada Menteri yang secret that one of the reasons why doctors berkenaan menjelaskan perkara ini supaya have left the services of the Government is apabila diundi kita menyokong atau tidak lack of promotion prospects. Contemporaries menyokong dengan mempunyai rasa tang- of mine who had gungjawab yang penuh. Tuan Pengerusi: Saya mengingatkan lagi, usul ini ialah usul tidak percaya iaitu hendak Tan Sri Lee Siok Yew: Tuan Pengerusi, mengurangkan gaji $100 atau $1 atau 10 sen. terima kasih kepada Ahli Yang Berhormat Itu tidak mengapa. Itu sahaja beliau hendak itu. Saya akan menjawab dan juga menolak menentukan ada kepercayaan penuh atau tuduhan-tuduhan yang dibuat oleh Ahli tidak kepada Menteri yang berkenaan. Yang Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka. Ketentuan itu hendak ditanya sekarang, iakah atau tidak. Kalau dia menang, Menteri Tuan Pengerusi, Ahli Yang Berhormat itu kalah, terpulanglah kepada Kerajaan dari Bandar Melaka sekali lagi telah mem­ mengambil apa-apa langkah. Kalau Yang bawa perkara-perkara kematian di Hos­ Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka kalah, maka pital Besar Melaka yang berlaku dalam kepercayaan penuh berbalik kepada Menteri tahun 1973 yang lalu. Walau bagaimanapun, itu, dan boleh berbahas sebagai biasa. Ahli Yang Berhormat masih lagi berkeras Sekarang tidak boleh bahas, cuma saya mengatakan kematian 107 orang pesakit di mengizinkan bercakap berkenaan dengan Hospital Besar Melaka dari tempoh 21 hb usul tidak percaya. Kalau tidak ada yang Julai, 1973 hingga 20hb Ogos, 1973 itu hendak bercakap, saya hendak bertanya. adalah disebabkan oleh kerosakan alat autoclave hospital tersebut. Tuan Lim Kit Siang: Tuan Pengerusi, bolehkah saya bercakap sedikit berkenaan Tuan Pengerusi, ini adalah hak ataupun dengan masaalah ini? Yang Berhormat Men­ privilege beliau, tetapi sebenarnya kenyataan teri mencadangkan bahawa usul itu diserah- beliau itu tidak betul. Saya ingin menegaskan kan kepada Dewan ini tanpa jawapan sekali lagi di sini bahawa sebab-sebab daripadanya. Adakah itu satu peraturan kematian adalah kerana berbagai-bagai yang patut oleh kerana dalam pandangan sebab termasuklah penyakit-penyakit atau saya itu adalah satu peraturan yang luar kecederaan-kecederaan seperti putus urat biasa. Apa yang dimintanya kepada Dewan saluran darah kerana high-blood pressure, ini ialah satu blank cheque dan jikalau kecederaan otak kerana pecah tempurung beliau boleh memberi satu keterangan yang kepala, keguguran atau premature birth dan betul, saya menarik balik usul itu. sebagainya. Tuan Pengerusi, saya mengakui bahawa memang ada perkara-perkara yang Tuan Pengerusi: Saya yang mengizinkan, tidak memuaskan hati di Hospital Besar itu saya faham, bermakna Ahli-ahli Yang Melaka dan langkah-langkah pentadbiran Berhormat boleh mengeluarkan fikiran ber­ telah diambil untuk membetulkannya. Saya kenaan dengan perkara ini. Itu sahaja suka mempastikan sekali lagi di dalam sebelum usul ini diputuskan. Dewan ini bahawa dalam menjalankan 3.45 ptg. langkah-langkah yang diambil itu tindakan tatatertib akan juga diambil di atas pegawai- Tan Sri Syed Jaafar bin Hasan Albar pegawai yang berkenaan jika perlu. (Johor Tenggara): Tuan Pengerusi, sebelum Tuan Pengerusi membuka usul ini untuk Satu jawatankuasa telah ditubuhkan di diundi oleh Dewan, saya minta daripada bawah Kementerian Kesihatan mengambil Tuan Pengerusi meminta Menteri yang ber­ siasatan rupabentuk dan ahli-ahli yang kenaan to rebut atau menolak segala berkenaan itu sungguhpun perkara ini saya 6007 15 JANUARI 1974 6008 telah jawab pada tahun yang lalu—saya tak berapa puas hati. Benar beliau ada ulang sekali lagi. Ahli-ahli Jawatankuasa datang ke tempat saya dan berunding dengan ini ialah professor daripada Medical Faculty, saya. Saya telah memberitahu dasar Kera­ University Malaya, professor daripada jaan dan tugas saya dan Kemjenterian saya Universiti Sains Pulau Pinang dan juga akan mengambil tindakan. Dengan itu, saya pakar-pakar daripada I.M.R. dan juga melawat ke hospital itu dengan pegawai seorang pakar Pembedahan Darah Kebang- tinggi di Kementerian saya, dan adalah tidak saan daripada Hospital Besar Kuala Lumpur benar saya hendak pergi ke Pejabat M.C.A. dan juga seorang doktor daripada Kemen­ Datuk Tan Cheng Swee ialah sebagai seorang terian Kesihatan dipengerusikan oleh Ketua ahli pelawat hospital itu. Oleh kerana itu, Setiausaha, Kementerian Kesihatan. saya datang ke hospital itu dan beliau datang ke hospital itu mengalu-alukan saya. Ini Satu siasatan telah diambil dan satu tidak berkaitan dengan M.C.A. dan sebagai- lapuran baru disiapkan. Perkara ini me- nya dan saya sentiasa sungguhpun seorang nunjukkan bahawa Kementerian saya telah ahli politik di bawah Perikatan, saya akan mengambil langkah-langkah yang sesuai, bertugas di Kementerian ini tidak bercampur- langkah-langkah yang betul berkaitan dengan gaul dengan fikiran-fikiran politik sungguh­ pegawai-pegawai yang berkenaan. Jikalau pun di dalam politik daripada pihak-pihak ada mereka itu tidak menjalankan tugas Pembangkang. Saya minta pihak-pihak dengan penuh, maka seperti yang disebutkan Pembangkang itu akan bekerjasama untuk oleh saya itu tindakan tatatertib akan di- kebaikan dan kesihatan negara kita. ambil dan perubahan di hospital itu sudah dijalankan. Barangkali dalam seminggu lagi Bila saya mendengar perkara kematian- pegawai-pegawai yang baru akan mengganti- kematian ini, saya sendiri merasa dukacita. kan pegawai-pegawai yang terlibat di Dengan itu, saya sentiasa mengadakan Hospital Besar Melaka. Ini menunjukkan perundingan-perundingan dengan Pengarah- Kementerian Kesihatan tidak ada bercakap pengarah saya, kadang-kadang satu minggu sahaja, akan tetapi menjalankan tugas sekali tiap-tiap hari Isnin kita ada berunding dengan sepenuh-penuhnya dengan keper- dengan pegawai-pegawai tinggi, Ketua cayaan daripada data kita yang telah dipilih Setiausaha dan sama Pengarah Kementerian oleh Kerajaan Perikatan, maka saya sebagai Kesihatan di bawah Kementerian Kesihatan Menteri Kesihatan sentiasa menjalankan bagaimanakah kita hendak mengambil tugas saya dengan sepatutnya. langkah yang sesuai untuk kebaikan pen- tadbiran hospital-hospital yang ada di seluruh Saya katakan dan saya akui ada perkara- tanahair kita. Di sini saya harap Ahli Yang perkara yang tidak memuaskan hati dan Berhormat memberi kerjasama juga saya pun telah jawab di dalam Dewan ini tindakan tatatertib sudah diambil pada Tuan Lim Kit Siang: Kerjasama apa? tahun yang lalu berjumlah lebih daripada 300 orang pegawai-pegawai. Ini bermakna Tan Sri Lee Siok Yew: Untuk kebaikan menunjukkan kepada Dewan ini we mean pentadbiran hospital kita. Beliau berkata business—kita tidak bercakap sahaja, akan juga satu lift hospital telah rosak. Perkara tetapi tindakan itu kita telah ambil. ini kita telah mengarahkan kepada J.K.R. membuat satu peraturan di bawah Kerajaan Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Bandar Melaka untuk mengeluarkan satu tawaran dan telah bercakap perkara ini sudah tiga tawaran sudah diambil dan kita harap di kali—berulang-ulang sudah tiga kali. sini akan siap-sedia pada bulan September Saya tidak boleh mengikut cadangan tahun ini. Kementerian saya tidak boleh beliau supaya Jawatankuasa Penyiasatan ini memberi lift dan dipasangkan di situ. Ini adalah terdiri dari ahli-ahli politik meng­ diserahkan kepada J.K.R. Jadi soalan ini ambil bahagian. Beliau mencadangkan telah selesai. Mereka itu mengulang-ulang bahawa beliau akan mewakili orang-orang sahaja apa-apa yang dicakapkan di Dewan yang mati itu di dalam jawatankuasa. Ini ini pada tahun yang lalu, tahun 1972. Pada saya terus-terang tolak oleh kerana penyia­ fikiran saya ini membuang masa Dewan satan ini tidak boleh campur apa-apa kita ini sahaja. Dengan itu, saya adalah fikiran dengan politik. Ini tidak berkaitan menolak apa-apa tuduhan-tuduhan daripada dengan politik. Dengan itu barangkali beliau beliau itu. 6009 15 JANUARI 1974 6010

Tuan Lim Kit Siang: Tuan Pengerusi, either of a colleague who has retired or of a bolehkah saya menggulung sedikit? colleague who has passed away; literally he must wait until he can step into a dead man's Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Tak boleh! Saya shoes in order to be promoted. I do know akan bentangkan Usul ini ke dalam Majlis: that the Minister is seriously concerned, but I hope he will be able to persuade his Bahawa wang peruntukan bagi Kepala Ministerial colleagues to see that the number B. 28, Pecahan-kepala (Kod) 1100 dalam of superscale posts is enlarged, not by a Belanjawan Persekutuan Tahun 1974, paltry four or five posts as recently. I believe Kertas Perintah Tahun 1973 dikurangkan recently there was an exercise to award four sebanyak $100 berkaitan dengan gaji or five Superscale "D" to a number of Menteri Kesihatan. clinicians. Offhand I can think of at least a Tuan Lim Kit Siang: Tuan Pengerusi, dozen clinicians who deserve not just Super- saya mohon supaya Dewan ini berbelah- scale "D" but perhaps as high as Superscale bahagi di bawah Peraturan Mesyuarat 47. "B" and even Superscale "A". The reason is not far to seek, Mr Chairman, Sir. These (Lebih 15 Ahli berdiri) clinicians, while they stagger along the road to the superscale post and when they reach Usul dikemuka bagi diputuskan. superscale, they have to wait and wait and wait. Those who are in the Home and BELAH-BAHAGIAN Foreign Service, who were literally in their pants while these doctors had graduated, have Dewan berbelah-bahagi: Yang Bersetuju, now obtained very high posts in the Civil 18; Yang Tidak Bersetuju, 68; Yang Tidak Service, many of them Superscale "A" and Mengundi, 1. the like, while the doctors, the clinicians tear Usui tidak disetujukan. their hair with rage waiting to be promoted and they know full well they would not be (Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua mem- promoted until and unless the Government pengerusikan Jawatankuasa) revises its promotion policy, for doctors at least. 4.10 ptg. In Singapore and elsewhere they have a Dr Tan Chee Khoon (Batu): Tuan different policy. They do not have a set Pengerusi, saya bangun bercakap tentang usul number of posts for doctors. They hold an yang dikemukakan oleh Menteri Kesihatan annual exercise and everytime they hold an dan di samping ini, saya mohon izin ber­ exercise they find who is fit for which post cakap dalam bahasa Inggeris. and if there are ten clinicians who are fit for, Tuan Pengerusi, perkara yang pertama let us say, Superscale "B" or "C", then so yang saya hendak sentuh ialah jawatan be it; they promote these people without tertinggi terhadap doktor-doktor atau di having to find out whether there are dalam bahasa Inggeris Superscale Posts in vacancies in the Ministry of Health before the Ministry of Health. these people are promoted. I call on the Minister to present this scheme to his (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, Ministerial colleagues because if he does not contemporaries of mine when I was in do something quick, and very quickly at that, college in Singapore and contemporaries of more people will resign from the Govern­ mine when I was in the service of His ment Service. The Minister knows that right Majesty's Government then have mostly now a number of consultants in the Hospital attained high posts, but there are some who Besar, Kuala Lumpur have submitted their have not. Many of those who were with me in resignation or will submit their resignation college those days, have not attained high very soon to the Ministry in order to go out posts; many of them if they have attained high into private practice. Not that I say that is posts, have reached only Superscale "G', the a bad thing in itself. If they go out into lowest in the superscale—or is it Superscale private practice and if their services are "H" now under Suffian? Many of the offered to the people of this country, then I clinicians in the Medical Service have do not think it is a bad thing. It is only when literally to wait until they step into the shoes they leave this country for pastures outside 6011 15 JANUARI 1974 6012 this country, then a very serious situation will Mr Chairman, Sir, the Member for Bandar arise. Many of these doctors—it is not that Melaka has touched in great detail about the they have reached 50, no, lots of them are in deaths that have occurred in the Hospital their 30's and some perhaps in their 40's— Besar, Melaka from July 21st to August are prepared to throw away all the pension 20th, 1973. My only contribution to it is that that they have earned in order to go out into now that the Minister has said that the private practice for the simple reason that Committee of Inquiry has completed its they look around and they see that there are work, will the Minister consider making no promotion prospects whatsoever for them public the report of the Committee of in the foreseeable future. Inquiry? If he makes public the findings of the Committee of Inquiry then the people of Mr Chairman, Sir, next I wish to touch on this country will be in a better position to the General Hospital, Kuala Lumpur. The judge where things have gone wrong and Member for Bandar Melaka has talked a perhaps if they relate it to their own great deal on the Hospital Besar, Melaka. I experience, they can find whether in their shall come to that in a little while. The own hospitals in their own towns, things have Hospital Besar, Kuala Lumpur is supposed gone wrong or not. I would call on the to be a land-mark in Kuala Lumpur and Minister to make public the findings of the none other than the Prime Minister himself Committee of Inquiry as soon as possible. has stated that the Hospital Besar plus the Faculty of Medicine for the Universiti Mr Chairman, Sir, the Minister has, in his Kebangsaan and the Institute for Medical visits around the country, at least on two Research, the three of them together, will occasions, called on the doctors in his make Kuala Lumpur perhaps the best Ministry not to play politics. He had told medical centre in South East Asia, if not in them in no uncertain terms that if they want Asia. I think the Prime Minister is being to play politics, then they should leave the a little too rash in making such a statement Ministry and go and enter the political arena. because if he has walked through the I entirely agree with the Honourable Hospital Besar in Kuala Lumpur, he will Minister of Health. What I would urge him know that many of the serving officers are to do is to try and name them instead of just tearing their hair with rage over the mentioning them nebulously about doctors inadequacies of the new buildings that have playing politics in his Ministry. He should been built. To give but one example, very name them, or if he does not want to name often the switches do not work, the intercom them, then he should hold inquiries as to does not work, there are leaks everywhere, whether doctors are playing politics because and I believe there are also operation the General Orders are very clear: No theatres that do not work because the doctor, despite his private political opinions, should try to play politics—no Government airconditioning is not working. This is a servant for that matter, despite his own brand new hospital, and for a new hospital political opinions, should play politics while to have such shortcomings— to have this in the service of His Majesty's Government. gone wrong, that gone wrong, airconditioning gone wrong in such a short time—is a very I want to bring to the attention of the serious thing, and I call on the Minister to Minister another thing about doctors in his institute a committee of enquiry into the Ministry, i.e. some of the doctors have building of the Hospital Besar. One of the connections with firms which are supplying reasons why this is so is perhaps that the goods to the Ministry. Now this is a very people who have been commissioned to serious state of affairs where you have civil design the hospital have not been that servants having connections with business adequate and I hope the Minister will take firms outside and these business firms have this seriously and perhaps go and visit the business connections with the Ministry. I Hospital Besar, Kuala Lumpur and talk to call on the Minister to enquire into this and the consultants and talk to the Director put a stop to it because if they want to be there and see whether there are grounds for businessmen, then let them get out of the instituting a committee of enquiry before Ministry. Why do they want to have a foot things get worse in the Hospital Besar, in both camps; one holding a very senior Kuala Lumpur. post in the Ministry and another in the 6013 15 JANUARI 1974 6014 business world. He should make up his mind a policy of trying to reduce the number of whether he wants to be a businessman or he patients in the Leprosarium. That I heartily wants to be a doctor. agree but I would urge the Minister to give instructions to the doctors in the Lepro­ Mr Chairman, Sir, I now wish to touch a sarium that although a patient is cured, if little on the Sungei Buloh Leprosarium. The the patient has been in the settlement for a Sungei Buloh Leprosarium, quite rightly, is long time, and by a long time, I mean 5, 6 regarded as a showpiece of this country, but or 10 years, then he should not be dis­ it does not mean that all is well with that charged unless he has a job waiting for him, hospital. The Minister himself knows; because if he has no job waiting for him, recently he was invited to go and hear the even though he may have relations, he cannot grievances of the patients there. Mr impose himself on his relations because he Chairman, Sir, I want to bring to the is minus two fingers, his nose is out of attention of the Minister the plight of some shape and society, unfortunately, Mr Chair­ of the patients there. Some of these patients man, Sir, does not take kindly to these are Indonesians who have managed to leave people, although I must say that the Indonesia and come to this country and have Ministry and the Leprosy Division of the been admitted into the Leprosarium because Ministry of Health have done their best to they suffer from/ leprosy. They have been educate the people of this country to try kept there; many of them, I dare say, and accept these people. But such prejudices perhaps all of them, for more than 10 years. do not die overnight and although leprosy Now, they are foreigners and there is at is a curable disease these days, society will least one case that I know of who has been not accept these people and once you say discharged. This is a very serious state of so-and-so is a leper, then everybody runs affairs, Mr Chairman, Sir, because this away from him. If such a person is dis­ person who is discharged has no documents charged from the Leprosarium without a to prove that he is from Indonesia; he is job waiting for him, then the Ministry will what one would term as an uninvited alien, be throwing these people into the cruel and I do not know whether he is eligible for world to fend for themselves. Perhaps they a red identity card to allow him to stay may end up either as victims of accidents permanently in this country. Certainly he has along the road because they have no food no blue identity card. and so they stumbled along the road and get knocked down or they would turn to a So I call on the Honourable Minister to life of crime. look into this matter and see whether the Ministry can help this group of patients who Hence, Mr Chairman, Sir, I would urge have come over from Indonesia in the late the Minister to ask the doctors in the 50's or perhaps in the early 60's. Now, of Leprosarium to give very sympathetic course, they are being asked to leave the consideration and on no account should any Leprosarium and if they leave the Lepro­ patient be discharged until and unless there sarium, I suppose they can wander around is a job waiting for him. a little if they do not fall foul of the law but once they fall foul of the law, even if it Mr Chairman, Sir, there are a few other is an accident on the road, then they had it minor shortcomings in the Leprosarium because they have no documents to show which I hope the Minister will look into why they are in this country. I call on the before he is called by the Medical Super­ Minister to take a very sympathetic view to intendent there to help to sort out troubles see whether he can, in the first instance, help bigger than, for example, patients carrying these victims of this dreaded disease to placards and the like. obtain a red identity card to enable them to stay permanently in this country and later I want to assure the Minister that he must on to qualify for citizenship. not think that I am the troublemaker down there. Very often, I tried to pour oil on Mr Chairman, Sir, the other thing is that troubled waters down there but even I the Minister knows there are a number of cannot help the Minister—if patients who, grievances that the patients in the Lepro­ although cured, are discharged into the cruel sarium have. One is regarding the discharge world without jobs, then tempers will soon of cured patients. The Ministry, I believe, has rise in that settlement. 6015 15 JANUARI 1974 6016

Mr Chairman, Sir, I have highlighted Di kawasan saya di Kuala Selangor ada some of these points in the hope that the doktor dari Mesir; ada tiga empat orang di Minister will pay attention to them: sana. Sam daripadanya Dr Hani. Dr Hani ini dan rakan-rakannya mendapat layanan (1) With regard to superscale posts; yang cukup buruk daripada Kementerian (2) With regard to doctors taking part Kesihatan. Lapuran-lapuran dan surat-surat in politics; telah dihantar oleh Dr Hani ini kepada Kementerian dan juga kepada Ketua Setia- (3) With regard to doctors taking part in usaha Kementerian mengadukan bagaimana business; layanan yang telah diberi kepadanya di (4) Finally, with regard to some of the Hospital Tanjong Karang. Aduannya ialah shortcomings of the Leprosarium in terhadap Ketua doktor di situ apa yang Sungei Buloh, in particular of dibuat oleh doktor Mesir ini salah belaka. foreigners who are from Indonesia Ini bukan cakap saya, tetapi ini cakap and who have been admitted there doktor Mesir itu. Dia datang ke rumah saya and now are wandering because they dan mengadukan perkara ini mengatakan have no documents to prove their apa yang dibuatnya salah sahaja, tidak stay here. betul sahaja, kerana saolah-olah benci kepada doktor dari Mesir. Ketua doktor di 429 ptg. Tanjong Karang itu berfikir dia anak orang besar—saya tidak hendak sebutkan kaum- Raja Nong Chik bin Raja Ishak (Kuala nya. Dia mengatakan kepada Dr Hani Selangor): Tuan Pengerusi, saya mengucap- iaitu Dr Hani ini boleh dihantar balik dan kan terima kasih atas peluang yang diberikan sekarang dia sudah ditukarkan ke Grik. kepada saya dan saya menyokong penuh di Dia tidak takut kerana bapanya orang atas perbelanjaan yang diminta dalam besar, dia kenal orang itu orang ini. Orang Kepala B. 28 dan P. 28. tidak boleh apa-apa kepadanya. Jadi, bukan Dr Hani ini sahaja yang kena, tetapi Saya adalah juga menyokong dengan dua orang atau tiga orang lagi doktor- sepenuhnya iaitu gaji Menteri Kesihatan tak doktor Mesir yang ada di situ begitulah boleh dipotong $100 oleh kerana kerjanya kesusahannya. Saya harap kepada Yang banyak dan saya nampak dalam beberapa Berhormat Menteri mengambil perhatian di tahun ini banyak hospital telah dibina. atas perkara ini. Saya ada juga menulis Sebagai manusia tentu ada membuat surat kepada Kementerian di atas perkara kesalahan-kesalahan. Semua orang ada mem­ ini, tetapi tidak berjawab. Barangkali Ketua buat kesalahan, melainkan Tuhan sahaja Perubatan Malaysia mendengar lapuran tidak membuat kesilapan. Sebagai manusia ketua doktor Tanjong Karang, kerana dia kita maafkan kalau ada kesalahan- ini orang besar, maka doktor Mesir ini telah kesalahan yang telah berlaku di dalam masa tercampak jauh ke Grik. Orang-orang menunaikan kewajipannya itu. Melayu terutama sekali di sana memang sayang kepadanya, dia seorang Islam, dia Di samping saya menyokong, ada pula melayan orang cukup bagus, baik dan lemah sedikit kritik. Saya hendak bangkitkan ber- lembut, tetapi dia tidak boleh bertugas di kenaan dengan Kementerian ini. Kemen- sana dan dihantar jauh nun di tepi hutan terian ini bukan tidak bersalah; Yang Grik. Berhormat Menteri sendiri menyatakan ada kelemahan-kelemahan Kementerian ini. Lagi satu teguran saya berkenaan dengan Jikalau Kementerian itu tidak boleh di- P. 28, muka surat 235 berkaitan dengan Grant to University of Malaya for Training keritik, maka pentadbiran Kementerian itu Hospital, Petaling Jaya. Saya hendak me­ akan merosot pada masa akan datang. nyatakan kepada Yang Berhormat Menteri Kritik yang membina, saya fikir tentulah ada seorang Melayu daripada Kampung boleh ditimbangkan oleh Yang Berhormat Medan, orang perempuan berumur lebih Menteri. Satu daripadanya doktor-doktor kurang 50 tahun lebih sakit teruk. Dia daripada luar negeri. Doktor-doktor yang dihantar ke Hospital lebih kurang sebulan datang daripada luar negeri mestilah keadaan dahulu. Lima jam menunggu di Hospital itu mereka diperhatikan. tidak ada doktor memeriksanya. Kalau 6017 15 JANUARI 1974 6018 hendak nama perempuan itu, saya akan beri tahu bagaimana sengsaranya sakit. Jadi di- kemudian. Sesudah lima jam di situ, dia harap layanan yang diberi oleh doktor atau- meninggal dunia. Anak-beranaknya me- pun nurses seperti makanan dan Iain-lain nangis, maklumlah orang mati tentulah sedih diberi secara manusia, jangan ada kelas- dan menangis. Penuntut-penuntut Universiti kelas, high class, middle class, lower class, Hospital ini hendak belah mayatnya, sebab sebab orang yang sakit ini jiwanya ter- hendak belajar dan menengok penyakit singgung. Si pemotong getah misalnya, dia dalam perutnya itu. Apabila pergi ke Hos­ bekerja untuk negara ini, getah sumber pital itu, kalau mati dibelah sebab hendak ekonomi negara ini, dia bekerja teruk-teruk, belajar. Jadi waris hamba Allah yang miskin apa boleh buat dia miskin apabila masuk inipun datanglah mengadu kepada saya, dia hospital di Kelas Tiga, kerana tidak ada menyatakan emak dia pergi ke Hospital wang maka diberikan layanan yang begitu. daripada pukul 10.00 pagi sampai pukul Saya harap diberikan layanan seperti 4.00 petang terus meninggal dunia. Jadi manusia supaya dia lekas baik dan dapat dia tolonglah supaya janganlah dibelah. Saya bekerja untuk faedah negara kita. Sekianlah pun ikhtiarlah, tetapi polis kata mesti di­ ucapan saya dan diharap apa yang saya belah juga, jadi apa boleh buat. Ini adalah cakapkan ini bukan hendak mengkeritik, salah Universiti Hospital, sebab dia me- tetapi satu teguran yang membina supaya nunggu lima jam di situ tidak diperiksa apa kejadian-kejadian ini tidak berlaku lagi penyakit orang ini. Jadi tentulah tidak tahu pada masa yang akan datang. cause of death, sebab orang ini mati. Boleh jadi orang ini mati oleh kerana umurnya (Tuan Pengerusi: Saya harap Ahli-ahli sudah tua, apa boleh buat nyawanya di- Yang Berhormat semua tolong ambil ingatan pegang oleh Tuhan. Tetapi sesudah dia mati supaya memendekkan ucapannya. Jia tidak, sebelum diperiksa terpaksa dibelah. Perkara saya terpaksa menyekat had masa berucap. ini bukan yang pertama terjadi, tetapi banyak kali sudah terjadi begini. Apabila 4.41 ptg. terjadi begini saya pun sebuklah ke sana ke sini mencari doktor yang hendak membelah Tuan V. David: Tuan Pengerusi, saya mayat itu merayu supaya tidak dibelah. minta izin bercakap dalam bahasa Inggeris. Jadi apabila hendak dibelah selalunya jatuh pada hari Sabtu ini yang susah sekali, sebab Hari ini kita telah terima satu usul tidak doktor susah didapati walaupun doktor percaya kepada Menteri Kesihatan. Usul ini sepatutnya berkhidmat 24 jam. Mayat itu telah kalah, tetapi kita tahu macam mana terpaksa disimpan di mortuary sampai hari Kementerian Kesihatan sekarang. Apa Isnin. Orang Melayu yang berugama Islam penyakitnya dalam Kementerian Kesihatan tidak hendak mayat itu disimpan lama-lama ini? Tiap-tiap rakyat negara kita tahu. di mortuary, dia hendak seberapa segera dibawa balik, disembahyang dan dikebumi- {Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, my kan seberapa lekas. Oleh kerana Universiti colleague has dwelt at length in respect of Hospital ini separuh di bawah tanggung- the General Hospital, Kuala Lumpur. Sir, jawab Kementerian Pelajaran dan separuh the position of the General Hospital, Kuala Kementerian Kesihatan, tetapi peruntukannya Lumpur, instead of improving, is deterio­ daripada Kementerian Kesihatan. Oleh itu, rating day to day in progress and develop­ saya minta kepada Yang Berhormat Menteri ment. Sir, there is a constant fear now rising menolong di atas perkara ini. in the minds of the people whether hospitals are safe places for patients. The suspicion Berkenaan dengan Hospital-hospital. is created not only in respect of medical Memang ada layanan-layanan yang tidak treatment but also as regards the belongings memuaskan iaitu ada doktor-doktor yang of the patients. sombong, nurses yang sombong, tetapi tidak semuanya yang sombong, banyak juga yang Sir, in the casualty ward when the patients baik. Saya minta kepada Yang Berhormat are brought in and admitted or before Menteri iaitu layanan kepada orang yang admission when they are brought into the masuk Kelas Tiga ini biarlah diberi layanan casualty ward unconscious, some of them, yang baik, sebab dia sakit. Apabila orang when they become conscious, do not find sakit, baik dia miskin, baik dia kaya, dia their belongings. Their chains, wallets or 6019 15 JANUARI 1974 6020 whatever valuable things they have are taken money he had was stolen from him and his away from them. Who could do this is not clothings were taken. Sir, his registration a mystery. The people who are handling the number is 45743 and another number has patients in the casualty ward—some of them been given as N/L 1482/73. and not all—are responsible for these thefts. In cases when such things take place, nurses Sir, if these could happen in a hospital who interrupt or intercept and check on which is situated in the Federal Capital of these, those nurses are being warned by Kuala Lumpur, one can imagine what will those who handle these patients. "Be careful. happen to district hospitals where the If you report this matter, we will deal with Medical Superintendent is the "uncrowned you outside." Sir, this has become a common king" in the district. The General Hospital feature in the General Hospital, Kuala has become a "slaughter" house. It is no Lumpur. One day, Sir, worse things could more a hospital because such things are happen in the General Hospital. Sir, patients happening and those responsible do not want who are brought into the casualty ward are to take action even when reported; and it has sometimes placed on the wheel-chairs and become a belief that even if one reports, nobody pushes the wheel-chairs. They expect nobody is going to take any action to check the relatives or any others accompanying the on this. patients to push the wheel-chairs right up to the wards. Even when there are people Sir, it is a disgrace for anyone to relate to attend to them, they just do not want to such incidents in this House because this type attend. This, I will attribute, Sir, to lack of of incidents are quite barbarious and supervision and those who are in a position beyond civilisation at all. In a civilised to check on these do not have the guts and hospital such a thing would not happen like the nerves to check on them. Sir, I can also the snatching away of chains and taking quote instances where hospital patients have away of belongings when a patient is left the ward with the hospital clothings on unconcious. With all the pride of the General them, because their own clothings were Hospital, still if we go into the third class missing and those responsible could not give wards 13 and 14, we will find more cats and them the clothings when they were dis­ rats than patients in the hospital wards. This charged. Sir, I will give the Minister the we have seen ourselves, and this is no particulars. hearsay evidence. We visit this Hospital and we know what is happening there. There is no cleanliness because nobody bothers. If The number of the patient concerned is they find a patient has dependents, then 9085/73 and his name is Suppiah; admitted nobody changes his bedsheets and he is left to Orthopaedic Ward Unit II, General to rot there. Sir, if this is going to be the Hospital, Kuala Lumpur, 35 years old and state of affairs of our medical institutions, from Teluk Anson. He was admitted to the then I am sorry it is a sad day for the whole casualty ward, General Hospital, Kuala nation. Lumpur, on 28th November, 1973. His address has been given as 136, Lorong Mr Chairman, Sir, it is high time that the Ceylon, Bukit Bintang, Kuala Lumpur. Sir, Minister acts very swiftly, check on all these he was transferred to the neurosurgery ward irregularities and if necessary refer such on 8th December, 1973. For further inves­ cases to the necessary authorities for tigation, he was transferred later to the disciplinary action against those who do not Orthopaedic Ward for a fracture of the leg. act with conscience and fulfil their obliga­ He was discharged from that Ward with tions. hospital clothings on. When he asked for his clothings and belongings, he was told that Sir, the Penang General Hospital is no they were not to be found. He made many better. A patient on 5th September, 1973, attempts to get out of the hospital. He was who was an attendant of the General stopped by the guard on many ocassions. Hospital, died after a few hours of admission. He had to hang around the hospital premises This particular employee was receiving for two solid days. Then, after that, he made treatment daily for four days prior to his his escape and later he was stranded in death. During the period of treatment, he Kuala Lumpur not knowing what to do, was not extended medical leave to rest and because he did not have any money and the was working in spite of his illness. 6021 15 JANUARI 1974 6022 Finally on 5th September, after his duty sold before even it is delivered to the hours, his condition was terribly bad and he clinics or hospitals run by the Government. consulted a doctor and he was immediately In most of the districts, these medicines are admitted and then died a few hours later. not delivered at all. We only find vouchers Sir, it is not the question of one or two and invoices but they are not delivered. incidents, but is a daily affair in the General Somebody enjoys all the benefits. The same Hospital. Mr Chairman, Sir, I call upon the thing applies to the General Hospital of Ministry and it is the responsibility of the Penang. Very often the patients are told, Minister to shake up the entire system in the "We do not have stock of this medicine; you hospitals. People have taken for granted that go and buy this medicine if you want to." "Who can do anything? If they report, we know how to deal with it." Sir, there have been incidents where reports have been made on the lack of urinals As my colleague has just said, politics has and needles in Penang General Hospital. become a great factor in hospitals. If one When a statement was made, suddenly the knows somebody in the ruling party, then he needles were changed. Patients are shouted at assumes he can do anything he wants. He by doctors at times. Drugs prescribed at can do anything and get out of it because he night to patients are not available and they has a powerful organisation backing him. are asked to return the next day. You find the Intensive Care Unit in the general Sir, another two-year old girl from an hospital, Penang, is too crowded and so dirty estate visited a doctor at the Butterworth and filthy; it is not properly maintained at all. Hospital on 27th November, 1973. The Sir, is this the type of medical treatment that doctor prescribed medicine and did not the respectable citizens of this country should admit the child even though the child was receive, in a country which is always very serious. He again brought the child to acclaiming itself to be proud of its medical the hospital and admitted her on 29th institutions. November, 1973. Later the father of the patient found that the condition of the child Mr Chairman, Sir, I call upon the Minister was very bad and appealed to the doctor for of Health to completely shake up his the transfer of the child to the Penang Ministry, his hospitals, especially hospitals Hospital which the doctor refused. The like the general hospitals of Kuala Lumpur father, against the medical advice, took the and Penang, and also the district hospitals. child to the Penang Hospital and was Sir, the Klang Hospital is no exception; it is immediately admitted at 4.30 p.m. It is one of the worst in the whole country. The understood that the father was told that he Government, of course, has assured of should have brought the child earlier for building new hospitals but in the meantime, immediate medical attention. atrocities are carried out in these hospitals. Doctors and some hospital attendants are all However, the child who was admitted uncrowned kings. Drugs are not given to died on 3rd December, 1973. Sir, this shows patients and they are missing. So I call upon the lack of doctors to attend to children in the Minister to carefully think that he is Butterworth. These are not one or two cases responsible to this nation and he is dealing but many hundred cases of this nature. Sir, with human lives and as a human being I am all the statements are made without malice asking a fellow human being to look into the and there is nothing personal against the whole set up so that drastic changes can be Minister of Health but we want to see some brought about in public health. changes brought about. There is no need for Tuan Pengerusi: Saya hadkan masa 10 promises after promises and we find that the minit sahaja tiap-tiap seorang Ahli berucap efficiency is day-to-day deteriorating and untuk mengambil bahagian dalam perbahasan there is no improvement at all. ini. Nampaknya Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat Sir, now let us take a look at the district tidak mengikuti nasihat saya. hospitals and estate hospitals. They are in 4.50 ptg. the worst condition. In estates, even though money is spent on medicines, these Dr A. Soorian (Port Dickson): (Dengan medicines do not go to the poor labourers izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, it is amazing how who work in the estates; these medicines are after 16 years of Merdeka there has been 6023 15 JANUARI 1974 6024 increasing deterioration of health standards increased domestic food production, e.g. in the rural areas, that is to say in the vegetable gardening, poultry rearing, fish estates, kampungs and New Villages. rearing and so on. Schools should provide free, substantive meals to students, and the Many health problems have their roots in Ministry should launch a massive deworming larger economic and social ills and we campaign to eradicate worms which cause recognise that correcting the economic and anaemia among students, social ills will contribute in large measure to solving the health problems. Malaria is a common problem in the rural areas and it is quite a common sight in the Mr Chairman, Sir, nine out of ten students rural areas to see unhygenic conditions and in the estates suffer from worm infestation. poor sanitation in the estates. The labour This leads to anaemia and ill-health among lines in the estates are jam-packed like the students. Anaemia in turn renders the military cantonments during war-time so students to a pathetic state of inertia where much so that disease spreads like wild fire he cannot concentrate on his studies. This of throughout the labour lines, Lalang is seen course, leads to drop-outs in schools. The to grow unchecked in certain areas in the Malay and Tamil media schools are estates and mosquitoes are rife. Preventive composed primarily of rural children (Malay medicine is poor in the estates and instead 85%; Tamil 80%). The Tamil Schools of spending money on anti-malarial pills the possess the lowest holding power, compared management should be advised if not to all other media schools. The decline in insisted to spray D.D.T. regularly in the enrolment is greatest in the Standard Four vicinity of lines in the estates to kill the and even in the Secondary level the larvae of mosquitoes. Malaria is also attrition rate is the greatest among Indian common in kampungs and New Villages youths. and the Government should take concrete The Tamil students have the lowest steps to eradicate this scourge once and for academic performance and attendance rates all. and the highest truancy rate compared to all other schools. The above findings from the Water Pollution Murad Report illustrate the disadvantaged nature of rural students especially the Tamil The Minister of Health should pay students. unannounced visits to the rural areas to see for himself the sad state of water supplies In view of this, it is high time therefore there. The water in some of the estates, for that the Health Ministry conducted an example the water in Jemina Estate in Port intensive search to find out why rural Dickson and Pengkalan Durian Estate, Linggi health is deteriorating. Mal-nutrition is is unfit for human consumption and little another problem. Although sufficient food wonder how the workers manage to survive. perhaps is consumed to prevent hunger but The water should be clorinated at the rate this unfortunately is not in the balanced or 1.5 to 2.5 parts per million and during adequate amount which is necessary for cholera epidemics the residual chlorine at development and healthy growth in the body. the ends of pipes should be at least 2 parts The main causative factors for this are: per million. The wells in estates in Port Dickson area for example are not thus (i) poverty. chlorinated and during the last cholera (ii) ignorance of nutritional needs es­ epidemic there had been reported several pecially of mothers and young children. cases of cholera in the Port Dickson District (iii) ignorance or lack of initiative in alone. nutrition needs in the production of food. Filiarisis The Health Ministry should lay out and There was an outbreak of this disease in publicise guidelines on this problem, for the Sua Betong Estate in Linggi a few example, breast feeding of children should be months ago. The reason for this is that the taken for the first six months of the baby's Sua Betong Estate is surrounded by jungles life and estate folk should be educated on in which are found monkeys which harbour 6025 15 JANUARI 1974 6026 this disease and the disease is transmitted by Housemanship mosquitoes. The Health Ministry should from The standards of teaching medicine in time to time clear the jungle areas and recognised Medical Colleges in India are on eliminate if necessary the carriers, i.e. the a par with Western Institutes of Higher monkeys. Before the war, estates used to Learning. Therefore, there is no cogent have fully equipped hospitals with resident reason why Indian qualified doctors have to Medical Officers but now the position is do an additional year in housemanship in worst. There are not only no resident Malaysia on their return from India doctors but the hospitals cannot be described whereas graduates from the West, Middle- as hospitals, they are just sick bays and the East, Indonesia, etc. are exempted from this visiting doctors do not really go round the rule. This has introduced an element of estates in detail and attend to health problems frustration into the work of Indian qualified in the estates. This is really deplorable. It is doctors in the country. The Government is, strange to say that health conditions in the therefore, urged to revoke this rule of extra estates were better in the colonial days than one-year housemanship. now, and it is high time that the Minister look deeply into this. Samsu and illicit Family Planning liquor drinking is very common also in the Mr Chairman, Sir, I now like to touch on estates. While the Government has made so item 13, page 240, on the problem] of family much efforts in taking steps to check the planning. The Government is making spread of drug abuse among youths, to check gigantic efforts to combat the drop-out air and industrial pollution and moral situation. It is incontrovertible that a child pollution, samsu and illicit liquor consump­ who is under-fed, under-clothed and under- tion is still a common feature. It is not cared, ill-equipped with books and who sufficient for the Police and the Customs to come from a family where interest in his raid these areas, but the Health Ministry, in scholastic performance is lackadaisical will not do well in schools, even if he has the liaison with the Muhibbah Committees, potential of an Einstein. It is said that two should educate the people as to the facts and out of five children have never visited Asia, consequences of such practices. It should be the other three are already there. This shows drilled into them that such practices can how grave the problem of population cause blindness, liver and brain destruction explosion is. Even all the job-targets and death. Habits can normally be removed contained in the Second Malaysia Plan are only by substitution and hence samsu achieved, another 50,000 people will join the drinking should be substituted by something ranks of the unemployed. The growing a little bit safer—say, toddy. unemployment is worst among the Malay­ sians between the ages of 15 and 24. There­ Shortage of doctors fore, family planning is an urgent problem, and there are some selfish Malaysians who The Government should take concrete advocate family planning only for them­ steps to overcome this problem. The country selves, but advise others against it. Such is still short of about 200 doctors or so. In anti-wellwishers should be brought to book. view of this, it is suggested that scholarships For the sake of tipping the racial balance should be granted to interested Malaysian in this country there are some who go to students to do medicine on the under­ extremes for cheap political gains. Although standing that they will be on contract to the the Minister has announced the use of Depo-Provera, a three-month-once injection Government for a period of five years or so in the fight to curb the population hike after completion of their studies. In the this does not suffice and further measures meantime, doctors should be recruited from should be taken. For example, the Govern­ friendly neighbouring countries like India, ment should institute a referendum to see instead of going all the way to Europe. whether the public want to legalise for abor­ Further, European doctors will be more tion. Mr Chairman, Sir, let us face it. Although difficult to maintain as they have to be paid abortion is illegal in Malaysia, the fact ice allowance, expatriate allowance, and remains that there are women who pay so on. handsomely in resorting to it in a fit of 6027 15 JANUARI 1974 6028 desperation. It is an open secret that perbahasan atas Kepala Pembangunan, P. 28, abortions through the method of D. & C. Kementerian Kesihatan, muka surat 241, di is carried out with impunity. Everybody bawah tajuk Sarawak. knows that it is going on, and I am sure the Ministry of Health is aware of such practices Tuan Pengerusi, kesihatan ini amat penting but is turning a blind eye to it. Now, if there untuk semua rakyat jelata. Dengan itu is abortion going on, why not we legalise it hendaklah diberikan untuk meninggikan and adopt methods that are safer in bringing taraf kesihatan penduduk-penduduk di about abortion—for example, the injection semua peringkat dalam bandar dan luar method by using Prostaglandin. This bandar. Hospital-hospital dan kelinik- hormone has been tried out in America by kelinik patut diadakan dan yang penting medical experts and it is decribed as a land­ sekali iaitu ubat-ubat yang baharu, modern mark in mankind's struggle to protect medicine mesti diadakan di tiap-tiap himself from his own fertility. With this hospital dan kelinik untuk memperluaskan hormone injection, 90% of women abort dan memajukan rancangan-rancangan kesi­ within 36 to 48 hours. It is cheaper, simpler hatan, khasnya di luar-luar bandar di and safer for women. So why not let us have Sarawak. it? There have been cases of desperate Di Sarawak sekarang ini banyak ke- women who have resorted to all sorts of kurangan hospital-hospital, kelinik-kelinik, people and to all sorts of methods to doktor-doktor dan pakar-pakar. Di sini saya terminate pregnancy. This has resulted in suka menggesa Kerajaan untuk mengatasi unnecessary suffering, or even death. This perkara ini. Di bandar Kuching ada sebuah hormone can be used in other ways as well, health centre sahaja yang lama, penuh sesak including the pessary method. There is also oleh pesakit-pesakit pada tiap-tiap hari. another family planning pill, which is used Kadangkala pesakit-pesakit yang datang dari only once-a-month, and the same hormone tempat yang jauh tidak dapat berjumpa is used and this method is employed in dengan doktor-doktor di situ disebabkan ada Britain. It is a convenient form of the pill. kekurangan doktor dan pegawai di situ dan It is a common occurrence the women who saya minta Kementerian ini akan membesar- are on the pill in our country forget to take kan rumah itu dan doktor-doktor patut di- it on certain days. This, of course, upsets the tambahkan lagi. intention of the pill. This new method requires only one pill a month and is Tuan Pengerusi, begitu juga sebuah hospital especially useful for people in the rural areas. yang kecil dan lama di Lundu sekarang There are other adjuncts to family planning ramai orang-orang sakit tidak diterima like the use of "Lugol's Iodine" and the use masuk oleh sebab katil-katil di situ sudah of the "morning-after" pill—Stilbestroel. penuh oleh pesakit-pesakit. Di sana ada dua Vasectomy is another method and the orang doktor, tetapi ada kekurangan pegawai Ministry of Health should popularise this dan Staff Nurse diperlukan dan juga method. This is a simple operation involving makanan orang-orang sakit tidak memuas- only a 15-minute job and it is a 100% birth kan. Saya harap Kementerian ini akan control method and it is reversible in 1 in menambahkan atau extend bangunan lama 4 cases. itu dan menambahkan pegawai-pegawai dan Staff Nurse di situ. Publicity Tuan Pengerusi, kelinik-kelinik kesihatan There is lack publicity in this affair. kanak-kanak dan beranak patut diadakan di kampung-kampung yang jauh dari bandar, Tuan Pengerusi: Masa sudah cukup— khasnya di Bau-Lundu dan mobile sepuluh minit lebih! dispensary patut dijalankan sekurang- kurangnya satu kali dalam satu minggu di Dr A. Soorin: All right, terima kasih, tiap-tiap kampung yang di pendalaman di Tuan Pengerusi. sana. Apa yang dijalankan oleh mobile 5.06 pig. dispensary sekarang iaitu cuma sampai tempat yang dapat dimasuki dengan land Tuan Valentine Cotter (Bau-Lundu): rover sahaja atau out-board dan menunggu Tuan Pengerusi, saya bangun untuk me- selama dalam masa tiga atau empat jam nyokong dan mengambil bahagian dalam sahaja dalam satu hari. 6029 15 JANUARI 1974 6030 Berkenaan kereta ambulan adalah didapati memasukkan sungai ke Lembah Sungai Poi, sangat susah hendak dipakai untuk orang- Bawan, Mapai, Kabah serta lain-lainnya orang sakit yang hendak pergi ke rumah lagi. Dengan memandangkan bertambahnya sakit, khasnya penduduk-penduduk di luar bilangan penduduk sekarang saya mengsyor- bandar. Oleh sebab itu, saya minta kan kepada Kementerian ini supaya sebuah Kementerian ini supaya buat satu rancangan kelinik kesihatan kecil didirikan di Sungai khas kereta ambulan untuk pesakit-pesakit di Poi dan Lembah Ngemah untuk faedah luar-luar bandar oleh sebab selalu ada orang rakyat di sekitar kawasan itu serta gudang sakit kuat waktu malam di kampung- ubat Kanowit diperbesarkan lagi dengan kampung tidak dapat bantuan, kadangkala alat-alat perkakas yang mencukupi. mereka itu tidak dapat diselamatkan disebab- kan kelambatan. Tuan Pengerusi, Daerah Kanowit 10 tahun yang lalu sudah merdeka dalam Malaysia Kesihatan untuk murid-murid sekolah dan tidak ada apa-apa perubahan dan rendah di luar-luar bandar patut diambil kemajuan yang nampak di situ. perhatian juga oleh Kementerian ini supaya semua murid-murid sekolah diberi ubat Akhirnya, saya menyokong peruntukan vitamin dan Iain-lain dengan percuma pada yang dikehendaki oleh Kementerian ini. tiap-tiap orang di sekolah masing-masing untuk memperbaiki kesihatan mereka. 5.10 ptg. Tuan Pengerusi, oleh yang demikian, saya Tuan Su Liang Yu (Bruas) {Dengan izin): berharap Menteri yang berkenaan ambil Mr Chairman, Sir, I wish to refer to Head perhatian atas perkara yang tersebut ini. B. 28, page 229, Sub-head 1100 in respect of Dengan itu, saya menyokong peruntukan Salaries and Wages for which a sum of bagi Kementerian ini. $185,861,100 has been allotted for the purpose of providing further and better 5.12 ptg. health facilities in the country. It is indeed appreciable on the part of the Government Tuan Joseph Unting anak Umang to providing such facilities so as not only to (Kanowit): Tuan Pengerusi, saya suka have hard working but healthy citizens too. bercakap sedikit mengenai Kepala P. 28, However, the provision of mere facilities is muka surat 241, Pecahan-kepala 31— not enough, what is really needed besides this Rancangan Memperbaiki Kesihatan Luar is the kind attention and better treatment to Bandar di Sarawak. the people at large irrespective of whether poor, rich or colour. In this connection, I Tuan Pengerusi, di sini saya suka menarik would like to point out that there is not only perhatian Kementerian ini di atas satu lacking grossly such proper attention or perkara sahaja iaitu berhubung dengan treatment to the people but also among the keadaan gudang ubat di Kanowit pada masa various staffs as well. A case in point is a ini cuma dilengkapkan dengan 8 katil sahaja trained assistant nurse who was asked to be bagi keperluan pesakit-pesakit dengan dua on transfer without giving reasonable notice orang yang bertugas di situ, seorang of her transfer and that she had to report on Penolong Rumah Sakit dan seorang sebagai duty to the new health clinic immediately the Attendan. following day which ultimately culminated in Di Daerah Kanowit yang mempunyai the innocent death of the nurse. Sir, this penduduk seramai lebih kurang 50,000 jiwa particular nurse died not because of natural dan juga gudang ubat itu menjadi tumpuan death but owing to intense mental torture by murid-murid sekolah menengah Kanowit the ruthless, heartless and violent-tempered seramai lebih kurang 700 murid sentiasa Senior Officers. It is my reliable under­ menggunakan kemudahan-kemudahan per- standing that the nurse in question died ubatan di gudang-gudang ubat kecil tersebut. because of nervous breakdown and collapsed and departed this world on 8-8-1973. Tuan Pengerusi, mengenai sebuah gudang ubat bergerak dengan menggunakan enjin In view of the serious incident involving a sangkut yang bertugas di situ hanyalah precious soul, I would like the Government memberi rawatan kepada rakyat di Batang to take appropiate action against those Rajang, Daerah Kanowit sahaja tidak ada officers responsible for the death of the nurse. 6031 15 JANUARI 1974 6032

Further I am keen to know why the Ministry shocked to know of such an incident and he is keeping dead silence over such an had assured us that five pints of blood would important matter; more interesting is the be sufficient for the operation and it fact that there has been no enquiry or was not necessary to donate any further investigation ever carried out by the blood. So the operation was carried out Government. In the light of these circum­ without any further delays. Sir, this sorry stances. I would like the Ministry to assure state of affairs would not have happened had the public that justice would be upheld over it not been that someone in the blood bank such an issue. was trying to collect blood for the Blood Bank. What is the use of storing blood in the Now touching on expansion of supplies Blood Bank? The hospitals should make full and materials there is still lacking greatly use of the blood in the Blood Bank for adequate facilities being provided especially in the rural areas. Sir, I am rather indebted emergency cases and then we must start the to the Government for its kind concern in its campaign for blood donors in the country, so provision for sufficient number of clinics that people on the spot will not have to which has been erected for the benefit of the bother themselves about replacing blood. people at large. However, it is not enough in just establishing health centres here and (Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan there if these health centres are not provided Jawatankuasa) with adequate facilities so as to meet the needs and demands of the people. This is 5.21 ptg. what we call a mere waste of public funds and wasting assets and the building has been Dr Chen Man Hin (Seremban Timur): left idle without making proper use of as (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, I would designed initially. In this connection it is like to touch on a few points on the desirable that these health centre buildings be Medical Services in the country. turned into some form of living quarters either for teachers who are teaching nearby The first is the question of the shortage of or others who could make better use of them. nurses. As you know, there have been many complaints not only from Members of this Everybody will agree and appreciate the House but also from the public about the importance of blood in the Medical Services gross inefficiency of service in hospitals in the Blood Bank. It is a matter which arises largely because of the inadequacy or shortage from time to time, particularly when there of nurses in the hospitals and in the health are accidents and blood is required suddenly services. and urgently and I think it is very essential that adequate supplies of blood of all groups On this particular point, I would like to shoud be available at all hospitals in the ask the Minister of Health what has country; happened to his visit overseas when he tried to woo back some 3,000 nurses in England Mr Chairman, Sir, it is true that blood is to come back and serve in this country. I still difficult to get, but I would appeal under dare say that the success that he had must be the policy of this service that whenever blood very, very minimal and if these nurses do not is required for a patient that blood should be come back, I would like to know the reason given to the patient if it is available in the why. Therefore, it must be due to some very hospitals. I make this observation not to poor administration in the service which criticise the Government or anybody at any they do not particularly like, that is why hospital but to give a practical example they do not come back. Perhaps on this which is within my knowledge. There was a matter, the Ministry itself should consider case in Ipoh where a man was admitted for whether they should give these nurses at an operation and his nine sons were all present serving in other countries better called for and asked to donate a pint of blood incentives to induce them to come back and each for their father's operation. Five of his serve this country. children had each given a pint of blood but the operation was not carried out because all Mr Chairman, Sir, on the question of the his children had not given their blood. Then I shortage of doctors too, this is also quite a managed to contact the surgeon and he was major problem especially in the rural areas. 6033 15 JANUARI 1974 6034

In this instance, I refer to a statement made Seremban and also the whole of Negri by a high Ministry official who said that Sembilan which has a population of 500,000 there is only one doctor to 50,000 people in or so. According to modern standards, Mr the kampungs and rural areas. This is a Chairman, Sir, one general surgeon should shocking state of affairs and no wonder the serve at the most about 50,000 people. people in the kampungs and rural areas do Therefore for a population of half a million, not get adequate medical and health there should be, by right, 10 general facilities and services. It is also quite surgeons in Negri Sembilan. But there we disheartening to note that at this particular have a case of only one general surgeon for juncture when we are so short of doctors, that the hospital in Seremban and for the whole quite a number of them are resigning from State of Negri Sembilan, which is, of course, the Government Health Service when they inadequate and terrifying, knowing that are needed so badly in the hospitals, in the there are more cases for surgery day by day. clinics and the rural areas. Perhaps while Here is a case where the Ministry should there is a case presented by my colleague give more scholarships to the young doctors for Bandar Melaka that there has been a in service to enable them to become specia­ serious case of maladministration and lists, either as surgeons or in other depart­ negligence in the Malacca Hospital, causing ments of medicine. also a demoralisation of staff especially among doctors, nurses and staff who are My last point, Mr Chairman, Sir, is the particularly dedicated to their profession, I question of the shortage of drugs. Right now, would therefore urge the Minister to ensure at the beginning of the year, it is only that these particular people would be kept in January, I have been informed that in the service in hospitals by giving them more Malacca General Hospital, there has been a incentives to work, better pay and better shortage of drugs—medicines—for the promotion—promotion on the basis of merit people. Not expensive drugs or special drugs and not on the basis of friendship or any but ordinary medicine like glycerine for other rule. The young doctors who are still local application. Patients who have tried to in Government service and those whom I get glycerine at the hospitals pharmacy were know in particular, are keen to give them­ told that this was not available and patients selves to public service rather than go into who were also given a simple medicine for private practice where there is better thyroid disease were also told that there is no remuneration; they are prepared to continue such medicine and they were given prescrip­ in Government service provided there are tion to go outside and buy. Why should this better incentives and better conditions of happen at the beginning of the year when work such as studies awards, research there is money available? Something must opportunities and they say that the scholar­ be wrong with the administration of the ships which are available are so few and so health services. Therefore, I would urge the hard to find that they feel frustrated. No Minister to look into these points and to wonder quite a number of them prefer to make amends; otherwise we would suffer a resign from service and we are losing these situation where droves of doctors would quit people who are particularly needed to help the medical services and the people will the poor. Therefore, I urge the Ministry to suffer. grant and consider the question of scholar­ ships for young doctors in service so that 527 ptg. they can stay indefinitely in the hospitals and the public and health services. Tuan R. C. M. Rayan (Ipoh): (Dengan izin) Referring to New Hospitals on page On the question of specialist doctors, Mr 236, Head B. 28, sub-head 4, I would urge Chairman, Sir, I am also shocked to note the Honourable Minister to seriously con­ that the Minister of Health has not been sider making provisions for building a new able to increase the number of specialist hospital at Sungei Siput which is a fast doctors in Seremban hospital, particularly developing town with a population of over specialist surgeons. I understand that for 100,000 people, taking into account all the some months now, there has been only one people living in the town, the nearby general surgeon to serve the whole of kampungs and new villages. The nearest 6035 15 JANUARI 1974 6036 first-class hospital is in Ipoh, which is about Apa yang penduduk-penduduk Seberang 18 miles away, and from kampungs like Prai seramai 400 ribu lebih berkehendakkan Kampung Lasah, Ipoh is about 30 miles ialah sebuah hospital besar yang lengkap away. dengan mempunyai pakar-pakar perubatan yang mana pada masa sekarang ini, Pulau There is a hospital at Kuala Kangsar, Pinang bertambah penduduk-penduduk which is also not so near, being about 13 dengan mengadakan perusahaan di Bayan miles away. Sungei Siput town itself has a Lepas, Prai, Mak Mandin dan banyak lagi dispensary which is opened during the day perusahaan-perusahaan yang lain, tetapi katil- and closed during the night and as the katil bagi hospital-hospital tidak ditambah Honourable Minister knows, sickness does mengikut banyaknya atau lebihnya pen­ not affect people only during office hours. duduk-penduduk di sana. When patients are attacked by sickness during the night, they are helpless and they Saya masih ingat lagi iaitu bangunan yang have to find ways and means of going to besar yang dibuat sebagai hospital di Pulau Ipoh and other hospitals. In any event, Pinang itu ialah yang besar sekali pada Sungei Siput is a growing town which fully tahun 1934, semenjak masa itu tidak ada qualifies for a hospital and this matter tambahan hospital dengan menambah katil- should not be delayed any longer. The katil di Pulau Pinang dan di Seberang Prai, Honourable Minister had previously provided cuma ada tambah sedikit sahaja di Bukit an ambulance or mobile van to take the sick Mertajam. Jadi lebih kurang 40 tahun tidak to Kuala Kangsar or to Ipoh hospital but ada satu tindakan yang tegas diambil untuk an ambulance is not good enough, and it is hendak menambahkan katil-katil bagi no substitute for a hospital. In urgent cases, kemudahan orang-orang sakit di sana. Maka patients may die even before they are dengan sebab itu penduduk-penduduk di brought to hospital to see a doctor. Seberang Prai telah merayu kepada Yang Berhormat Menteri supaya diadakan rumah I hope the Honourable Minister will sakit besar yang lengkap. Dengan adanya seriously pursue the matter and provide a hospital for this town, even a small one rumah sakit besar yang dipusatkan di Bagan will do. Serai ini akan dapatlah Rumah-rumah sakit Daerah di Bukit Mertajam dan di 529 ptg. Butterworth itu dapat ditutup dan dijadikan sebagai polyclinic dan rumah sakit besar Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Sa'id (Seberang ini akan jadi satu pusat untuk melayankan Utara): Tuan Pengerusi, saya bangun untuk penduduk-penduduk di seluruh Seberang menyokong peruntukan bagi Kementerian Prai dan jikalau boleh diberi kemudahan Kesihatan dan saya mengambil peluang kepada orang-orang di selatan Negeri Kedah, ini memberi sokongan yang penuh dan Sungai Patani dan Parit Buntar mengguna- kepercayaan yang penuh kepada Yang kan hospital besar ini bagi kemudahan Berhormat Menteri dan saya percaya Yang mereka dengan menyediakan kelengkapan- Berhormat Menteri dapat menjalankan kelengkapan yang cukup. tugasnya dengan memuaskan. Tuan Pengerusi, saya telah mendengar Tuan Pengerusi, saya ingin bercakap ucapan daripada Pembangkang dan saya muka 238, P. 28, Pecahan-kepala 16 iaitu berasa sangat kesal di atas sikap Pem­ Hospital Daerah Bagan Serai, Seberang Prai. bangkang pada masa sekarang ini. Pada Peruntukan sebanyak $500,000. pendapat saya mereka ini kehilangan modal Tuan Pengerusi, saya ingin menarik per- politik dan sekarang ini menggunakan satu hatian Yang Berhormat Menteri, penduduk- tektik, tektik membunuh watak ataupun penduduk di Seberang Prai tidak berke- character assasination Menteri-menteri kita. hendakkan Hospital Daerah di Bagan Serai Saya berharap kalau dengan cara membunuh sebab Hospital Daerah Butterworth jauhnya watak ini tidak akan memberi satu modal lebih kurang 3 batu daripada Bagan Serai, yang boleh difikirkan oleh penyokong- Hospital Daerah Bukit Mertajam jauhnya 4 penyokong kerana penyokong dari rakyat batu daripada tempat yang akan dicadang- pun sedar siapa yang berjuang untuk kan iaitu Bagan Serai dan sebuah Hospital kepentingan rakyat. Bukan masa persidangan Daerah di Sungai Bakap. Dewan Rakyat sahaja bagi Ahli-ahli Dewan 6037 15 JANUARI 1974 6038 Rakyat pihak Pembangkang hendak me- attack sufferers in Malaysia are plentiful. nyuarakan tidak puashati itu, pihak Kera- Known cases of heart failure patients who jaan telahpun menyediakan cukup alat. could have been saved at an earlier stage jikalau seorang Pembangkang yang ber- have died without proper equipment and tanggungjawab membangkitkan perkara yang adequate attention. I believe that a patient tidak puashati atau apa-apa perkara yang can only survive three heart attacks didapati samada di rumah sakit atau di depending on the seriousness. This is one pejabat patutlah dengan serta-rmerta me- service that the taxpayers require and will ngadu kepada pihak yang berkenaan. Jikalau appreciate. pihak yang berkenaan atau pegawai yang tertinggi tidak mahu ambil tindakan, kita ada If the Ministry and its top officials have Biro Pengaduan yang mana bebas untuk the foresight, many deaths could have been mengambil tindakan kepada siapa juga postponed or lives saved. The District pegawai-pegawai Kerajaan yang tidak men- Hospital at the moment is not supplied with jalankan tugas dengan sepenuhnya melayani modern heart disease equipment; at least a orang-orang yang berkehendakkan per- heart centre to be headed by an expert tolongan. medical man or a qualified doctor for heart disease cases should be provided for each Saya berharap pihak-pihak Pembangkang, state hospital. jikalau tidak ada modal politik, tidak usah- lah gunakan politik secara kotor ini, Mr Chairman, Sir, the building of a new carilah modal politik yang boleh membina hospital in Ipoh under sub-head No. 4A has pada masa hadapan. stopped after piling investigation was held. It has been delayed for many years. The 537 ptg. reason is only known to the Ministry itself. I hope construction work will commence Tuan Chan Yoon Onn (Ulu Kinta): immediately. Also for the present, I hope (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, I wish to the Honourable Minister concerned will be touch on Gaji dan Upahan—Salary and good enough to provide such a heart centre Wages under Code 1100 of this Health With adequate equipment and management Ministry and Code 2700 Supplies and to the General Hospital in Ipoh so that heart Materials on page 232. disease sufferers will have confidence that In my opinion, many of the hospitals have they will be looked after by the Government. not made much improvements either in This is a service that the taxpayers will also equipment or building except for those in be very glad and happy to have. larger towns. Many of us know there is an annual increase of population. No doubt Another matter concerns the Tanjong there is progress, but the hospitals are rather Rambutan Mental Hospital. This is a famous slow in giving treatment as compared with centre for mental cases. I wonder if there is the modern systems employed in other any research made on patients who are similar hospitals in advanced countries. offspring out of marriages between very Perhaps it is due to the brain drain caused close relatives; for instance, offspring of the by the resignation of Government doctors to marriage of the children, grand children or set up their own practices or it may be that great grand children of the same forefathers the medical staff are not co-operating well who were supposed to be in normal health. among themselves, or there may be shortage I presume there are many mental cases of of medicines and equipment as a whole. this nature which can be prevented if the Many patients will have to buy important authority has investigated on and has m#de medicines outside the hospitals from private research on these patients. If it is correct, pharmaceutical firms. the Government should discourage by legis­ lation and ban marriages between children One very important service that all of different mothers from the same family district hospitals should render is the setting- up of modern cardio equipment and qualified tree headed originally by the same forefather. doctors for cardio or heart disease patients. I hope the Ministry will look into this type of mental cases to avoid abnormality of the Mr Chairman, Sir, Honourable Members people in the future. That is all I have to are aware that heart diseases or heart say, Sir. 6039 15 JANUARI 1974 6040

5.40 ptg. people that he would build the hospital in 1969. But now it is already 1974 and only Tuan Lim Cho Hock (Batu Gajah): the piling has been done. Then a mile away (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, I wish to from this particular site, there is a private touch very briefly on this Ministry. If we hospital, known as Fatimah Hospital built just walk into the Ipoh Hospital, we will find up with the aid of some foreign funds and that every day there is a long queue of also with the funds given by the people outpatients hoping to see the doctor for some themselves. This building is nearing treatment. This state of affairs clearly shows completion and it is due to be occupied in a that there is an acute shortage of doctors in few months' time. Now, what is wrong with the Ipoh Hospital. Mr Chairman, the condition the new Government hospital beside the old of the hospital is also in very bad shape. hospital? Has the Government gone There is no privacy at all in the Ipoh bankrupt or has the Government been bogged Hospital. The Hospital itself consists of one- down by red-tapes? That is what we want to storey building blocks and if you walk into know. The people of Perak have been waiting any of the wards, you can find that there is for too long for this hospital to come up. So, no partition, be it made of cloth or planks or I hope the new Minister will take up this any other thing. There may be a lot of matter and will not make empty promises "Peeping Toms" around in the hospital, like his predecessor. particularly in those wards accommodating women. So, I hope the Ministry can look into Finally, Mr Chairman, Sir, the hospitals this matter and provide partitions for these have not been co-operating very well with wards, the Labour Department. In cases of workmen's compensation, for instance, Lately, we have got a new block besides certain forms have got to be filled by doctors this hospital. I think this is a new three- storey new building block for the expansion in hospitals. The forms are provided by the of this hospital. But unfortunately this new Labour Office. But the doctors in the block only caters for the rich and the hospitals invariably give their medical V.I.Ps. There are about, if I am not certificates not conforming with the forms mistaken, 20-odd rooms in this building provided for this purpose. When the Labour block, but these are hardly enough to cater Office receives such medical reports, they for the general need. The charge for a room invariably reject them saying that they are is about $20 or $30 per day; and only the not complete reports. What they want to rich can afford to stay in this particular know is certain particulars numbering (1), block. Mr Chairman, Sir, because of the (2), (3), (4) and so on. If the doctors do not shortage of space and beds in the Ipoh give medical reports in the proper forms, Hospital, a lot of patients who are supposed then the Labour Office would not be able to to be admitted have been turned away by the assist in the award of compensation. So, I doctors simply on the ground that there are hope that there will be a closer co-ordination not enough beds around for them. Some time between the hospitals and the Labour ago, Mr Chairman, Sir, I have seen with my Offices throughout the country. own eyes a bed meant for one person being occupied by two persons. Now, a patient is 5.35 ptg. supposed to rest comfortably in the hospital while at the same time taking treatment. But Tuan Ng Hoe Hun (Larut Selatan): Tuan if two were to sleep on a single bed, then Pengerusi, saya hendak bercakap sedikit even if one is not sick, one may get sick. So, pada Kepala B. 28 dan Kepala P. 28, I hope the expansion of the hospital can be Kementerian Kesihatan, Pecahan-kepala carried out at a very fast rate. (Kod) 1100 Gaji dan Upahan bagi tahun There is a proposed new hospital besides 1974 berjumlah $185,861,100 bagi: this old hospital, and this hospital had been (1) Pentadbiran Am promised for the people of Perak and for the (2) Perkhidmatan Kesihatan Awam people of Ipoh particularly way back in 1969 by the former Minister of Health, Dr Ng (3) Perkhidmatan Rawatan Pesakit, dan Kam Poh. At public rallies, he promised the (4) Perkhidmatan Tambahan. 6041 15 JANUARI 1974 6042 Tuan Pengerusi, saya minta izin berucap Member for Bagan had brought this matter dalam bahasa Inggeris. up before the House, it should be true and I would like to say that in the hospitals in (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, I wish to Taiping the same thing happens. This is touch now on the policy of the Kementerian wrong, and I appeal to the Minister to Kesihatan with regard to the Blood Bank rectify the fault that we have before us in that exists throughout the length and breadth this House and before the country. of West Malaysia, from east to west and from north to south. Now another matter with regard to the policy of the Government to Blood Bank is First of all, I would like to congratulate that blood is sold openly in all hospitals the Kementerian Kesihatan on giving blood where there is a blood transfusion unit. The to the people percuma or free. Questions Minister might deny in this House here that about blood have been raised in this House blood is sold openly but I can vouch for this on many occasions and not very long ago the because I have seen it and many M.P.s in Minister of Health did state in this House this House here will testify to the fact that that he is a donor of blood. I am also a their relatives and they themselves have donor of blood. But this is not enough. The been solicited openly in hospitals to sell their public must be encouraged to donate more blood at a price of $80, $100 or $150 blood freely without any risk and more depending on the blood group that you have. incentives must be given to the public to Probably if you have a group "6" blood induce them to donate blood. But the which is acceptable by all, probably your Ministry of Health has not gone to all the blood is more valuable than somebody with extent to encourage, through the media of "A + ","B + " or whatever it is. Could the the press, the radio or the television, people Minister look into this affair and if possible, to donate blood. Now, although the blood is solve the problem that we have before the being given to the public freely, I have come Blood Bank—the selling of blood. The to understand that blood actually is only selling of blood is a major practice now in given free in words of mouth but in action India and in the United States where blood itself it is not given free. Why do I say so? is sold openly. We have a law before us that It is because whenever a patient has been blood should not be sold openly in hospitals. given a pint or two pints of blood and after I believe this is so. If the Minister could his recovery, he is asked to replace the clarify this matter I shall be most grateful. blood. If that is so, then blood is not given free, because the patient has been asked to Coming back to the equipment that is used donate back blood to the Blood Bank. What by doctors and nurses in extracting blood, sort of policy has the Kementerian Kesihatan like vampires from patients that come before with regard to this by asking a patient to the hospitals, could I have a guarantee in this donate blood after he has recovered? This House that the equipment that are used to policy should not be carried on, and I hope extract blood are properly sterilised. I the Minister of Health would advise the believe these equipment are not properly hospitals throughout the country especially sterilised and I bring this matter before the the Blood Bank to refrain from asking blood House because the extraction of blood is a from patients once they have recovered. simple matter where the tube is tucked into the vein or artery—I do not know and I Another matter which has come to my am not sure—but it is one of the blood attention during the debate in this House, vessels in the arms and blood then is was brought before Parliament by the allowed to ooze out into a bottle which is Member of Parliament for Bagan. He stated below the bed. The equipment that is used that in the hospitals in Bagan and in Bukit for the process of taking blood from the Mertajam and all that, patients are being patient, if it is not kept hygienically clean, it detained purposely in hospitals when they could contaminate the patient before and have recovered already, i.e. they are after a transfusion. As has been brought up prevented from leaving the hospitals, before the House by the Member of Parlia­ because the hospitals want to suck blood ment for Bandar Melaka, the autoclave or back from them—that means asking them to the sterilisation unit of the Malacca General replenish blood. This is wrong. Since the hospital was found faulty and contaminated 6043 15 JANUARI 1974 6044 with a lot of undesirable germs; if it could Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: I am appealing to the happen in an autoclave unit, it could easily Minister. happen in a blood transfusion unit. So taking up the challenge from the Minister of Health Tuan Pengerusi: You withdraw that word! when he visited some of the wards in Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: I withdraw the word, Seremban Hospital, there was hell in the Sir. The former Minister of Commerce had General Hospital in Seremban, everything used it in this House; so I am following him. was shody and in disorder and if it could If you ask me to withdraw it, I withdraw happen there on one of the Minister's visits, gracefully (Ketawa). Encik Khir Johari had it could happen throughout the whole length used it. He had said bull-shit. What can I do, of the country with regard to the blood Sir? I withdraw. transfusion unit. So I appeal to you, Sir, to look into this matter closely so that the Finally, I appeal to the Minister to look blood that is given by the people should not into this matter to give the people the be contaminated and the patients should not benefit of taxes be contaminated. So I appeal to the public Tuan Pengerusi: Will you sit down? now from this House to restrain from giving blood until the Minister can guarantee that Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Thank you very much the equipment used in the transfusion service for giving me the opportunity. throughout the length and breadth of this country are properly sterilised. 5.58 ptg. Coming back to the basic purpose of the Tuan Pengerusi: Ini Ahli yang peng- Kementerian Kesihatan, what is the purpose, habisan sekali bercakap! I ask you, of a hospital? Why do we have a hospital? Tuan Abu Bakar bin Umar (Kubang Pasu Barat): Tuan Pengerusi, saya hendak ber­ Tuan Pengerusi: Are you addressing me cakap sedikit sahaja bersangkut-paut dengan or are you addressing the Minister? Pecahan-kepala (Kod) 1100, Pecahan-kepala (2) Perkhidmatan Kesihatan Awam per- Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: I am very sorry I untukannya $48,224,000. forgot myself. Dalam buku merah ini salah satu daripada Tuan Pengerusi: Time is up anyway. aktiviti-aktivitinya ialah kesihatan luar bandar. Apa yang saya ingin menarik perhatian Men- Tuan Ng Hoe Hun: Let me finish, I teri yang berkenaan supaya dapat dipehatikan would like to finish off, Sir, if you don't mind. dan supaya dapat diubah sedikit sebanyak Just one minute. Coming back to the purpose polisi bersangkut-paut dengan membina Pusat- of a hospital, the hospital is established by pusat Kesihatan, kalau mengikut di dalam the Government for the benefit of the people. buku merah ini, Yunit Kesihatan Luar bandar Should I be sick I go to hospital to get free ini pada asalnya dijangka mengandungi satu treatment. Why, Sir? Because I pay tax on pusat besar, empat pusat kesihatan kecil dan 20 klinik bidan untuk memberi per­ it. So the money that is collected from the khidmatan kepada 50,000 penduduk-pen­ taxes that I pay go towards the establishment duduk luar bandar. Kalau ini dijalankan, of hospitals. But what do the poor people get? maka saya yakin bahawa tujuan matlamat They pay taxes but when they go to the kita memberikan perkhidmatan kesihatan ini hospital they are denied the right to benefit kepada penduduk-penduduk luar bandar from what they pay in taxes. The poor tidak sampai ataupun tidak sempurna people when they go to the Outpatients kepada matlamatnya oleh kerana 50,000 Department they have to pay fifty cents. I orang di kawasan luar bandar penduduknya say this principle is wrong—third class wards, amatlah luas kawasannya. Apabila luas second class wards, first class wards. The kawasannya kebanyakan dan kebiasaannya people have to pay which is all wrong; it is penduduk-penduduk luar bandar ini adalah B.S.—bull-shit. miskin. Jadi apabila miskin dia terpaksa membeianjakan banyak wang untuk men- Tuan Pengerusi: Sit down! Will you sit dapat perkhidmatan kesihatan daripada down? Pusat-pusat Besar dan Pusat-pusat Kecil. 6045 15 JANUARI 1974 6046

Maka apa yang saya ingin menarik perhatian penting di dalam usaha-usaha berdasarkan Menteri yang berkenaan supaya memper- kepada Dasar Ekonomi Baharu Kerajaan kecilkan bilangan kalau boleh 30,000 sahaja. kita. Kalau 30,000 kita dirikan satu Pusat Besar dan Pusat-pusat Kecil daripada klinik bidan Yang Amat Berhormat Perdana Menteri maka berhasillah matlamat dan tujuan kita telah menyatakan baharu-baharu ini bahawa membelanjakan wang untuk kepentingan Kementerian saya adalah satu sektor di kesihatan penduduk-penduduk luar bandar, dalam Rancangan Malaysia Kedua yang itu satu. merupakan sektor yang penting di dalam rancangan sosial, ekonomi Kerajaan me- Yang kedua, bersangkut-paut dengan laksanakan kepada Dasar Ekonomi Baru itu. Hospital Besar Alor Setar. Saya ingat kalau Oleh yang demikian, segala aktiviti-aktiviti tidak lupa, sudah dua tahun saya telah mem- yang dijalankan itu tidak lain dan tidak bukan buat satu soalan mulut di dalam Dewan ini ialah untuk meluaskan perkhidmatan kesi­ supaya didirikan sebuah madrasah untuk hatan di kawasan-kawasan dalam dan luar orang-orang sakit bersembahyang ataupun bandar, dan sehingga masa ini kemajuan- untuk pergi ziarah-menziarah orang-orang kemajuan dalam perkhidmatan-perkhid- sakit di hospital, tetapi sampai sekarang ini matan ini adalah memuaskan. belum ada apa-apa bayang lagi, maka saya harap dicepatkan pembinaan madrasah, Saya percaya bahawa kemajuan-kemajuan tempat sembahyang bagi orang-orang sakit dan langkah-langkah yang telah dan akan di General Hospital Alor Setar. diambil oleh Kementerian saya berdasarkan Yang ketiganya, saya bersetuju dengan kepada tujuan-tujuan yang tertentu sebagai- Ahli Yang Berhormat wakil Bebas ber­ mana yang telah dikerjakan daripada muka kenaan dengan soal pesakit-pesakit luar 460 hingga 498 di dalam Kertas Perintah dikehendaki membayar sebanyak 50 sen. Bil. 32 Tahun 1973 akan dapat memuaskan Saya tidak tahu untuk apakah bayaran itu. semua Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat di Dewan Di Hospital Alor Star pun pesakit-pesakit ini. Sungguhpun begitu saya sukalah sekali luar dikehendaki mengambil kad dan mem­ lagi mengucapkan ribuan terima kasih di atas bayar 50 sen. Saya harap mendapat sokongan Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat kepada penjelasan daripada Menteri yang berkenaan Anggaran Belanjawan bagi Kementerian dan kalau boleh bayaran 50 sen itu dihapus- saya yang berjumlah sebanyak $352,540,272 kan daripada diambil dari tiap-tiap pesakit bagi tahun 1974. Saya suka juga mengucap­ luar yang mengam,bil ubat. Oleh kerana kan terima kasih di atas teguran-teguran sekarang ini orang-orang kampung semakin yang membina yang telah diberi untuk saya hari semakin susah disebabkan oleh inflasi dan keadaan-keadaan dunia sekarang ini. menimbangkan dan menjalankan bagi mem- Muga-muga dengan dihapuskan bayaran 50 perbaiki lagi perkhidmatan ini kepada sen ini merengankan bebanan hidup orang- seluruh rakyat. Banyak teguran-teguran yang orang kampung. telah dibuat yang mana tidaklah dapat saya menerangkan satu-persatu untuk memberi 6.01 ptg. jawapan kepada teguran-teguran itu di dalam Dewan yang mulia ini, akan tetapi Tan Sri Lee Siok Yew: Tuan Pengerusi, saya akan cuba menerangkan di sini perkara- Kementerian saya adalah satu daripada perkara yang saya anggap penting untuk Kementerian-kementerian yang menjalankan pengetahuan Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat usaha-usaha Kerajaan di dalam bidang serta juga rakyat di negara kita. Sungguhpun sosial dan memberi perkhidmatan ini kepada perkara-perkara ini tidak dapat diberi secara seluruh rakyat di negara kita ini, supaya detail, akan tetapi saya suka menyatakan mereka itu berada di dalam kesihatan yang bahawa perkara-perkara yang telah di- baik untuk digunakan di dalam, pembangunan bangkitkan di Dewan ini telah diambil ekonomi dan kemajuan masyarakat negara ingatan oleh pegawai-pegawai daripada kita pada masa ini. Pada masa ini Kemen­ Kementerian saya dan saya akan mengambil terian saya telah mengadakan berbagai-bagai perhatian yang berat untuk mengambil lang­ kemudahan untuk mencapai tujuan yang kah-langkah dan tindakan-tindakan yang tersebut serta memainkan peranan yang sewajarnya. 6047 15 JANUARI 1974 6048

Telah beberapa kali di Dewan Yang Kementerian saya sentiasa mengkaji ke- Mulia ini kita mendengar dan beberapa kali dudukan jawatan Tingkatan Tertinggi bagi disebutkan juga di Dewan ini mengenai Pegawai-pegawai Perubatan dari semasa perkara-perkara yang tidak puashati ber­ ke semasa dan jika difikirkan menasabah hubung dengan Kementerian saya. Perkara- akan diambil tindakan untuk mengadakan perkara yang dibangkitkan itu ada juga yang tambahan kepada jawatan-jawatan Ting­ betul, akan tetapi apa yang mendukacitakan katan Tertinggi itu. saya ialah tidak ada disebutkan tentang perkhidmatan-perkhidmatan yang baik yang Berkenaan dengan perkara-perkara air- telah dijalankan oleh doktor-doktor dan conditioning dan juga alat-alat yang lain di kakitangan-kakitangan yang berkhidmat Hospital Besar Kuala Lumpur, suka saya dengan Kementerian ini. Dengan tidak di­ menyatakan bahawa apabila Kementerian sebutkan perkhidmatan-perkhidmatan yang saya mendapat tahu atas kerosakan-ke- baik itu, maka seolah-olah kita tidak me- rosakan yang telah berlaku satu lapuran ngakui akan perkhidmatan-perkhidmatan penuh telah dihantarkan kepada Ibu Pejabat mereka yang cemerlang itu. Jika sekiranya Jabatan Kerja Raya dan mereka mengambil diperiksa daripada rekod-rekod perkhid- tindakan-tindakan yang sesuai di atas matan yang telah dijalankan oleh Kemen­ perkara itu. Saya berharap Ahli Yang Ber- terian saya maka kita akan dapat banyak hormat akan bersabar atas kerosakan- perkhidmatan-perkhidmatan yang baik yang kerosakan seperti yang dinyatakan oleh telah dijalankan oleh doktor-doktor dari­ kerana mana-mana bangunan yang baharu pada perkara-perkara yang tidak puashati tentulah ada kerosakan. yang dibangkitkan di Dewan ini. Saya telah berulang kali menyatakan bahawa I mean Berkenaan dengan lapuran kematian di business dan saya suka perkara ini diberi Hospital Melaka supaya dibahaskan perkara sebaran dengan sepenuh-penuhnya supaya ini, saya akan memberi pertimbangan. doktor-doktor dan kakitangan termasuk Pegawai-pegawai di bawah Kementerian ini pentadbiran di hospital itu yang tidak faham dengan sesungguhnya tentang ber- menjalankan tugas mereka dengan betul akan politik dan saya hanya memperingatkan diambil langkah-langkah disiplin seperti- mereka supaya jangan bermain politik mana yang ditetapkan. Saya akan menjalan­ dengan menggunakan tugas-tugas mereka kan tugas saya supaya langkah-langkah yang semasa menjalankan tugas ini. Walau bagai- tertentu akan diambil kepada sebarang manapun tindakan mustahak mengadakan doktor-doktor atau kakitangan-kakitangan sebarang enquiry berkenaan dengan hal ini. di bawah Kementerian saya yang mencuai- kan tugas dan tanggungjawab mereka. Saya Tentang doktor-doktor yang ada suka menyatakan dalam Dewan yang mulia hubungannya dengan firma-firma saya akan ini bahawa tidak ada tempat di dalam menjalankan siasatan dan akan memberi Kementerian saya bagi mereka yang tidak amaran kepada mereka supaya berhenti dapat mengutamakan rawatan kepada daripada mengambil bahagian itu. pesakit-pesakit dengan tidak mengira samada mereka itu kaya atau miskin. Jika sekiranya Berkenaan dengan perkara-perkara yang mereka itu mengutamakan diri sendiri dibangkitkan berhubung dengan penem- mereka itu bolehlah berkhidmat di tempat patan Sungai Buluh, saya sendiri faham di yang lain. atas perkara ini dan berkenaan dengan pesakit-pesakit yang semboh ada sebuah Jawatankuasa yang bertanggungjawab yang Tuan Pengerusi, berkenaan dengan teguran telah ditubuhkan oleh saya untuk mengkaji yang dibangkitkan oleh Ahli Yang Ber- pesakit-pesakit itu sebelum mereka dikeluar- hormat dari Batu berkenaan dengan jawatan kan, cuma mereka yang dapat dikeluarkan kakitangan Tingkatan Tertinggi bagi Pe- sahaja akan dikeluarkan, mereka yang cacat gawai-pegawai Perubatan, saya suka me­ dan tidak dapat diterima oleh masyarakat nyatakan bahawa Kementerian saya telahpun tidak akan dikeluarkan. mengadakan urusan mengujudkan jawatan Tingkatan Tertinggi dalam bulan Julai tahun Berhubung dengan perkara yang di­ lalu dan hasilnya ialah tambahan sebanyak bangkitkan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat dari 41 jawatan Tingkatan Tertinggi dan 47 Kuala Selangor, saya suka menyatakan iaitu jawatan Tingkatan Tertinggi dinaikkan taraf. tidak ada aduan-aduan yang dibuat di atas 6049 15 JANUARI 1974 6050 perkara ini kepada saya. Namun demikian bahawa kedua-dua hospital tidak boleh saya akan membuat satu siasatan di atas dibandingkan oleh kerana Hospital Besar perkara ini dan jika sekiranya benar, saya Baru Ipoh adalah satu hospital yang sangat akan mengambil langkah yang sewajarnya. besar kompleksnya dan ada kemudahan- kemudahan yang terlampau banyak. Oleh itu, Seperkara lagi saya suka menyatakan di persediaan pelan telah mengambil masa yang sini iaitu rawatan yang diberikan di hospital- lama sedikit. Saya suka melapurkan bahawa hospital itu adalah kepada seluruh rakyat Kementerian ini telah diberitahu bahawa dan tidak dikira apa juga taraf kedudukan tender untuk blok hospital ini akan ditawar- mereka. kan tidak lama lagi. Berhubung dengan perkara yang di- Tuan Pengerusi, berkenaan dengan bangkitkan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat dari perkara-perkara yang dibangkitkan oleh Ahli Dato Kramat berkenaan dengan kedudukan Yang Berhormat dari Port Dickson, saya Hospital Besar Kuala Lumpur, saya sukalah dapati bahawa Ahli Yang Berhormat itu menyatakan di sini bahawa Hospital Besar yang sebenarnya tidak faham akan perkhid­ itu adalah satu tempat yang selamat bukan matan kesihatan luar bandar. Jika sahaja untuk memberi rawatan-rawatan sekiranya Ahli Yang Berhormat itu bahkan juga menjaga keselamatan dan membaca dengan bersungguh-sungguh harta-benda pesakit-pesakit itu sendiri dan kemajuan-kemajuan dan langkah-langkah jika sekiranya ada terjadi sesuatu kejadian yang akan diambil seperti yang tersebut di yang tidak diingini, ini tidaklah dapat dalam Rengkasan Belanjawan yang di- dikatakan bahawa perkhidmatan hospital itu bentangkan di Dewan ini, saya percaya begitu buruk seperti yang dituduh oleh Ahli tentulah Ahli Yang Berhormat itu tidak Yang Berhormat tadi. Di mana-mana tempat akan mengeluarkan banyak pendapat- jika orangramai dapat melawat dan pendapat seperti yang telah dikeluarkan di bercampur-gaul dengan pesakit-pesakit, dalam Dewan ini. maka tentulah terjadi perkara luar yang tidak diingini di dalam kawasan tersebut. Berkenaan dengan pertanyaan-pertanyaan Walau bagaimanapun perkara ini patutlah mengenai taraf pengajaran di Pusat Per- dilapurkan kepada polis untuk diambil ubatan India yang dikatakan sama tarafnya langkah yang tertentu. dengan pengajaran di negeri-negeri barat, saya sukalah menyatakan bahawa perkara Berkenaan dengan darah di Hospital ini telah saya beri jawapan pada 4hb Besar Pulau Pinang, saya sukalah menyata­ Disember di Dewan ini pada tahun yang lalu. kan bahawa jika sekiranya Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Dato Kramat itu sedar Ahli Yang Berhormat juga telah bertanya bahawa darah telah di salahgunakan dan tentang peruntukan Family Planning. Saya dijual, sepatutnyalah sebagai seorang Ahli suka menerangkan bahawa ini adalah Dewan Rakyat ini memberi lapuran perkara ditunjukkan di bawah Kepala B. 7—Perdana itu dengan segera kepada pihak polis untuk Menteri, Pecahan-kepala 17 yang mana mengambil langkah yang sewajarnya, akan wang sebanyak $1 juta telah diuntukkan bagi tetapi Ahli Yang Berhormat menunggu untuk tahun 1974 ini. melapurkan di dalam Dewan yang mulia ini. Berhubung dengan perkara yang di­ Tuan Pengerusi, Ahli Yang Berhormat bangkitkan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat dari dari Batu Gajah telah menyentuh berkenaan Bau-Lundu yang membangkitkan perkara- dengan hospital baru di Hospital Ipoh dan perkara yang ada hubungan dengan Negeri telah membandingkan kemajuannya yang Sarawak, saya suka menyatakan di sini telah dicapai oleh Hospital Fatimah dengan Kementerian saya berusaha dengan ber­ hospital baharu Ipoh. Saya suka memaidum- sungguh-sungguh untuk memberi per- kan kepada Ahli Yang Berhormat bahawa khidmatan-perkhidmatan yang baik bukan pelan bagi Hospital Fatimah telah disediakan sahaja di Negeri Sarawak dan Sabah, akan dalam tahun 1968. Hospital Baru Ipoh telah tetapi di selujuh Malaysia, kerana sebagai? diluluskan dalam Rancangan Malaysia Yang mana yang telah saya sebutkah bahawa ini Kedua, iaitu pada tahun 1971 sahaja dan adalah menjadi tujuan yang utama di dalam lain daripada itu, saya suka menerangkan Kementerian saya. 6051 15 JANUARI 1974 6052

Berkenaan dengan perkara-perkara yang Berkenaan dengan perkara-perkara yang lain yang telah dibangkitkan pegawai- dibangkitkan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat pegawai saya telah mengambil ingatan dan dari Larut Selatan berkenaan dengan pen- akan menjalankan usaha-usaha untuk mem- jualan darah, saya sungguh dukacita kerana perbaiki lagi perkhidmatan-perkhidmatan perkara ini telah tidak diberitahu kepada itu. saya ataupun kepada Polis kerana perkara ini adalah menyalahi undang-undang. Saya Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Ipoh meminta tidaklah sangat hendak menyatakan dengan supaya sebuah hospital didirikan di Sungei sebenarnya samada darah-darah itu dijual Siput. Ahli Yang Berhormat sendiri telah menerangkan bahawa bandar Sungei Siput openly di hospital-hospital dengan kerana adalah jauhnya hanya 13 batu dari Kuala tidak ada bukti-bukti yang tertentu yang Kangsar yang mana ada sebuah Hospital dapat diambil sebarang langkahan kepada Daerah dan juga 18 batu daripada Ipoh, mereka yang menjalankan kerja-kerja yang yang mana ada sebuah Hospital Besar. menyalahi undang-undang itu. Oleh itu saya Seperti Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Ipoh berseru kepada orangramai supaya me- maklum banyak daerah di Kelantan, lapurkan perkara ini kepada pihak-pihak Trengganu dan Pahang dan juga Negeri- yang bertanggungjawab, terutama sekali negeri lain masih tidak ada hospital dan pihak Polis supaya langkah-langkah yang ramai penduduk-penduduk terpaksa pergi sewajarnya dapat diambil. Ahli Yang Ber­ hampir 59 batu untuk sampai ke hospital. hormat sebagai seorang wakil rakyat patut- Kalau ada cadangan-cadangan di masa lah juga memainkan peranan bagi meng- hadapan untuk pembinaan hospital-hospital hapuskan perkara yang tidak diingini ini. baharu, kawasan dan daerah-daerah di Tuan Pengerusi, berkenaan dengan teguran Negeri-negeri tersebut patut diberi ke- Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Kubang Pasu utamaan. Barat, saya suka menjelaskan di sini iaitu sungguhpun keadaan sekim sekarang ini Berhubung dengan perkara yang di­ ialah seorang doktor bagi 50,000 penduduk, bangkitkan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat dari cadangan Kementerian saya dalam sekim Batu Gajah yang menyatakan tentang baharu ialah hendak mengadakan sebuah kesesakan di Jabatan Pesakit Luar di Pusat Kesihatan Besar dan doktor bagi Hospital Besar, Ipoh, pada pendapat saya 20,000 orang penduduk. Tentang bayaran ini menunjukkan tentang sambutan rakyat yang dikenakan kepada pesakit-pesakit luar dan juga confident orangramai terhadap sebanyak 50 sen itu dihapuskan, jika mereka hospital-hospital. Sungguhpun ramai Ahli- tidak mampu ahli Pembangkang di dalam Dewan ini yang menyebut-yebutkan tentang perkhidmatan- Tuan Pengerusi: Saya sukacita jika Yang perkhidmatan yang tidak baik sahaja, walau Berhormat Menteri dapat memendekkan bagaimanapun Kementerian saya selalu sedikit jawapannya kerana kita kesuntukan berusaha supaya mereka yang datang ke masa. hospital-hospital untuk mendapatkan ra- watan mendapat layanan yang baik. Tan Sri Lee Siok Yew: Ya, terima kasih. Berkenaan dengan perkara 1st Class Ward Tuan Pengerusi, mengenai hal-hal yang lain, yang dikhaskan untuk V.I.P. itu ialah yang disebutkan oleh Ahli-ahli Yang Ber­ sebenar kerana wad-wad tersebut adalah hormat daripada Negeri Sarawak, kemajuan- mustahak untuk V.I.P.-V.I.P. seperti Ahli- kemajuan berkaitan dengan pembangunan- ahli Yang Berhormat di dalam Dewan ini, pembangunan hospital baharu dan Pusat yang akan dimasukkan di wad-wad yang Kesihatan Besar dan Kecil yang baharu akan tersebut jika sekiranya sakit. mengikut jadual yang ditetapkan di bawah Kementerian saya di dalam Rancangan Tentang kekurangan katil-katil pada masa Malaysia Kedua. Dengan itu saya meng- ini tidaklah dapat dielakkan, kerana perkara ucapkan berbanyak-banyak terima kasih ini telah diketahui dan usaha-usaha untuk kepada Ahli-ahli Yang Berhormat yang mengelakkannya ialah dengan cara membina telah bercakap dalam Dewan ini. sebuah hospital baharu yang mana saya percaya Ahli Yang Berhormat itu tentu sedar Masaalah dikemuka bagi diputuskan, dan sedang dibina. disetujukan. 6053 15 JANUARI 1974 6054 Wang sebanyak $290,540,272 untuk Kepala Peruntukan tahun 1974 bagi kelima-lima B. 28 diperintahkan jadi sebahagian daripada aktiviti tersebut ialah sebanyak $16,336,326 Jadual; dan wang sebanyak $62,000,000 untuk dibandingkan dengan $14,477,344 bagi tahun Kepala P. 28 disetujukan jadi sebahagian 1973, iaitu lebih sebanyak $1,858,982 atau daripada Anggaran Pembangunan, 1974. 12.8%. Tambahan ini adalah diperlukan oleh 6.28 ptg. kerana: Kepala B. 29 hingga B. 34, P. 29 hingga (a) Tambahan kakitangan di Kementerian P. 31 dart P. 34— dan Bahagian-bahagiannya; Timbalan Menteri Hal Ehwal Dalam (b) perlaksanaan berbagai-bagai projek di Negeri (Datuk Abdul Samad bin Idris): RASCOM; dan Tuan Pengerusi, saya mengusulkan supaya (c) tambahan kursus-kursus Ikatan Re­ Anggaran Belanja Mengurus Kementerian lawan Rakyat. Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri bagi tahun 1974 di bawah Kepala B. 29, B. 30, B. 31, B. 32, Selain daripada apa yang tersebut di atas B. 33 dan B.34 diluluskan dan menjadi seba­ tindakan sedang diambil untuk menyusun hagian daripada Jadual. semula Lembaga Penapis Filem dan mem- perluaskan lagi peranan Ikatan Relawan Anggaran-anggaran di bawah Kepala- Rakyat bertujuan meningkat 50,000 yunit kepala yang disebutkan tadi adalah seperti di seluruh negara dibandingkan dengan 1,800 berikut: yunit pada masa ini. Kepala B. 29— Tuan Pengerusi, saya juga mengusulkan $16,336,326 untuk Kementerian Hal supaya Anggaran Belanja Pembangunan, Ehwal Dalam Negeri. Kementerian Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri bagi Kepala B. 30— tahun 1974 di bawah Kepala P. 29, P. 30, P. 31 dan P. 34 diluluskan dan menjadi se­ $258,666,888 untuk Polis Diraja Malay­ bahagian daripada Jadual. Anggaran- sia. anggaran di bawah Kepala-kepala yang ter­ Kepala B. 31— sebut tadi adalah seperti berikut: $8,251,830 untuk Jabatan Imigeresen. Kepala P. 29— Kepala B. 32— $10 (peruntukan tanda sahaja) untuk $550,810 untuk Pendaftaran Pertubuhan. Kementerian Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri. Kepala B. 33— Kepala P. 30— $8,153,949 untuk Jabatan Pendaftaran $69,845,138 untuk Polis Di Raja Malay­ Negara. sia. Kepala B. 34— Kepala P. 31— $21,249,040 untuk Jabatan Penjara. $886,695 untuk Jabatan Imigeresen. Jumlah Anggaran Belanja Mengurus bagi Kepala P. 34— Kementerian Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri ialah $3,656,540 untuk Jabatan Penjara. sebanyak $313,208,843 bagi tahun 1974 di­ bandingkan dengan $286,646,682 pada tahun Saya fikir tidaklah payah saya menghurai- 1973 iaitu berlebihan sebanyak $26,562,161 kan dengan panjang-lebar mengenai atau 9.3%. perincian-incian tiap-tiap satu jabatan di bawah Kementerian ini kerana Ahli-ahli Aktiviti-aktiviti yang berada di Kemen­ Yang Berhormat telah sedia menatap buku- terian ini pada tahun 1974 ialah: buku belanjawan yang terkandung huraian- (i) Pentadbiran Am; nya dengan jelas. Oleh yang demikian, (ii) Keselamatan Sempadan; Tuan Pengerusi, saya mengusulkan Anggaran Belanja Mengurus dan Anggaran Belanja (Hi) Keselamatan Negeri-negeri; Pembangunan, Kementerian Hal Ehwal (iv) Tapisan Filem dan Penerbitan; dan Dalam Negeri dan Jabatan-jabatan di (v) Ikatan Relawan Rakyat. bawahnya bagi tahun 1974 diluluskan. 6055 15 JANUARI 1974 6056 632 ptg. occasions, reported in the Press, at least in the English Press, these incidents have gone Tuan V. David (Dato Kramat): (Dengan unnoticed. izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, this House should be gravely concerned over an unforeseen and Sir, the International Amnesty has been unfortunate incident which has taken place concerned over the detainees in this country. during the last few days. There has been a They are concerned whether fair, reasonable hunger strike in the Detention Camp of Batu treatment is given to these detainees in Gajah where the detainees have gone on a accordance with the international obligations, hunger strike as a protest against the rules of human rights and other requirements authorities' decision not to enquire into or to which a political detainee should enjoy. To listen to the detainees representatives on the my mind, Sir, the political detainee in this suicide action of a detainee. A detainee has country suffers the worst. Under the Internal committed suicide and nothing has been said Security Act, the moment a person is or no statement has been made by the arrested for political purposes, he is kept Ministry concerned and, as a result of this, in a lock-up like other criminals for the first the detainees got together and their repre­ two months. During this two months' sentatives wanted to meet responsible people period, a detainee does not enjoy the to put across their views relating to this facilities of a political detainee. He is only unfortunate incident but the authorities allowed to enjoy the facilities enjoyed by refused to meet them and not only did they others detained for committing crimes under refuse to meet them, but they have the Criminal Procedure Ordinance and Penal summoned the riot squad and the riot squad Code. After these two mlonths the arrested has terrorised the detention camp by bashing person is transferred to a camp by an Order up quite a number of helpless detainees, made by the Minister. causing hardship to them and the detainees now have gone on a hunger strike from 28th Sir, this country is not giving enough December, 1973. The hunger strike seems to attention to political detainees because of the be continuing until this moment without the fact that most of the politicians who are in Government finding a solution to this the ruling party had never had any history of problem. fighting the British or going to detention camps or jails. Most of those who fought for Mr Chairman, Sir, I would invite the independence in this country and had gone Government to appoint an enquiry into this into jail are, I would say, even unemployed; hunger strike and such an enquiry should they had served in jail for seven/ten years be headed by an independent High Court and so on fighting the British in the inde­ Judge who will be able to hear evidences pendence struggle. Since those who are in the from the detainees impartially and, if Government have not experienced detention, necessary, produce a recommendation. The they do not know how detainees are being terms of reference to this enquiry should treated, how it would be to detain a person in be to study the conditions in the detention a lock-up, in a cell in the absence of sunshine camps relating to the detainees' welfare and and other facilities. also the reason as to why this man had Sir, a detainee is not charged on specific committed suicide. There must be some charges. He is only a suspect. The Govern­ specific reasons leading to this unfortunate ment feels that he is a security risk but at situation. the same time the Government has not said that he is charged for this purpose. An Order Mr Chairman, Sir, the detainees' of detention is only produced after the first complaint has been there for many many two months of his detention in the lock-up. years. As the detainees are cut off from the outside world, they are unable to explain the Sir, it is high time that the Government miseries and hardships imposed on them by review entirely the situation by appointing an the authorities. enquiry to give a new life to the political detainees. Political detainees are not Sir, the hunger strike is not the first time. criminals and they should enjoy certain There had been quite a number of occasions facilities in this country, Sir, if we accept where the detainees had staged a hunger parliamentary democracy as our political strike. As these had not been, on many concept. 6057 15 JANUARI 1974 6058 Mr Chairman, Sir, I invite the Minister I would like the Minister to examine this to treat as urgent and important the hunger aspect. Mr Chairman, Sir, I find somebody strike which is going on among the detainees from the other side is trying to grouse and also as to how the riot squad was because he has been hurt on this. summoned into the detention camp where the detainees have been beaten up by the riot Sir, I have been asked by my colleague to squad for no offences committed. If anyone draw the attention of this House on the has committed any offence, then he should manner the Police behaved in Sabah when a candidate of the Sabah Action Party was be charged and not treated brutally in this supposed to file his nomination papers to manner. contest the State elections. The party Further, we have been told that the headquarters was invaded by Police and it detainees have been kept under solitary was searched and the candidate was confinement and this has sparked the hunger prevented from filing his nomination papers. strike. Sir, an enquiry should be made by I think on previous occasions this matter has a High Court Judge and respectable and been referred to in this House but no action eminent persons to probe into the grievances has been taken. I would invite the Minister of the detainees and also to bring about to give an explanation as to why Police took generally a reform to the political detainees such action on an Opposition candidate in this country. Mr Chairman, Sir, this is of knowing that the election was to be held on absolute importance, and the Government is that day and the candidate was supposed answerable in the international forums and to file his nomination. A deliberate attempt also to the Amnesty International which is was made to prevent the candidate from deeply concerned about the manner of how filing his nomination and he was prevented our detainees are being treated. by the Police. This Police action is most highhanded and it calls for an explanation Tuan Pengerusi: May I remind the from the Government. Honourable Member that the ruling which was made previously that 10 minutes or so (Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua mem- should be only given to a speaker still holds pengerusikan Jawatankuasa) good, and you have spoken for more than 10 minutes. 6.45 ptg.

Tuan V. David: I will be very brief, Sir. Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Arshad (Muar Utara): Dalam saya menyokong Kementerian Tuan Pengerusi: Well, you cannot be yang berkenaan ini, gemar saya membangkit- very brief. kan dua tiga perkara, Tuan Pengerusi, pertama sekali dalam Kementeri Hal Ehwal Tuan V. David: I will be very brief, Sir. Dalam Negeri ini berhubung dengan perang urat saraf. Tuan Pengerusi: But you have spoken Usaha ini patut digiatkan bukan sahaja for more than 10 minutes. penerangan, tetapi dengan menghendaki peruntukan wang iaitu Kerajaan hendaklah Tuan V. David: I am sorry, Sir, I did not berjaya mempengaruhi rakyat di kawasan see the time. I will be very brief. sempadan itu menyokong Kerajaan dengan memulihkan taraf hidupnya dan memberikan Tuan Pengerusi: We are fighting against kemudahan sosial kepadanya supaya dapat time, otherwise I have no objection. mengubah fikiran di situ bersama-sama menentang pengganas kominis, menyokong Tuan V. David: I apologise, Sir, and I dasar Kerajaan dengan syarat diberi per- will be very brief. Sir, I have received quite lindungan keselamatan yang abadi sehingga a lot of complaints from Policemen who pengganas-pengganas kominis itu dapat di- perform duties during public holidays and hapuskan. weekly holidays. According to them, they are not being given overtime or any form of Menyentuh dalam perkara tapisan filem compensation for performing duties during dan penerbitan bagaimana yang telah di- public holidays and other weekly holidays. cakapkan oleh Menteri yang berkenaan. 6059 15 JANUARI 1974 6060 Sejak kita mempunyai hubungan perniagaan berlumur darahnya yang membunuh anggota dengan Cina Kominis, maka negeri ini telah Pasukan Keselamatan kita baru-baru ini. Ini dibanjiri penerbitan-penerbitan buku dari- saya ucapkan tahniah dan syabas kepada pada negeri itu melalui pintu masuk yang Pasukan Keselamatan kita dan juga terima tertentu. Tetapi sekarang telah dirujukkan kasih kepada rakyat yang telah memberikan kepada Ibu Pejabat Kuala Lumpur. Jangan kerjasama. pula dilupai bahawa buku tersebut tidak dapat mereka masuk dengan jalan halal, Dalam masaalah Polis di-Raja, saya mereka akan masukkan dengan jalan haram hendak katakan tugas mereka semakin berat kerana jualannya sangat laris. Ini merbahaya berikut dengan keadaan sebuah negara yang kepada negara kita kerana pembacanya akan sedang membangun, kejadian jenayah dapat menyuburkan dengan fahaman kominis bertambah berlaku. Mereka ini sayugia dan subversif. Saya harap Kementerian diberi latihan yang sempurna kerana pihak ini akan mengawasi masaalah ini. penjenayah juga merupakan golongan yang bijak dan pandai dari segi undang-undang. Yang kedua, dalam masaalah penerbitan Dengan Iain-lain perkataan, kita katakan filem ini, saya harap supaya Kerajaan selalu kita dapati kes-kes yang kita bawa ke memberikan satu syarat kepada penerbitan mahkamah banyak dibuang kes itu dengan filem yang diedarkan dalam negeri ini melalui sebab ketaidaan kenyataan yang lengkap. panggung-panggung wayang hendaklah di- Oleh itu Pasukan Polis kita hendaklah kita dabingkan diambil alih dalam Bahasa lengkapkan dengan ilmu pengetahuan yang Kebangsaan iaitu saya harap samada filem lebih sempurna daripada yang ada sekarang. Inggeris dan juga filem orang-orang Tionghua dan masaalah ini kita harap bahawa Dalam masaalah polis ini juga, saya kata pengusaha-pengusaha ini supaya meng- Polis Hutan kita patut ditambah, demikian hormati dan mematuhi Bahasa Kebangsaan- juga Polis Marine kita kerana ia adalah nya sendiri. Saya junjung tinggi filem-filem membantu Polis biasa dan Kastam. yang didatangkan daripada Hindustan yang Kemudahan-kemudahan perumahan kepada ada didabing dalam Bahasa Kebangsaan. anak-anak mereka ini patut kita berikan kepada Pasukan Polis Hutan kita dan juga Tuan Pengerusi, B. 30—Risikan Kese- kepada kem-kem yang telah kita dirikan. lamatan. Saya harap bahawa risikan ini Kita telah berjaya hendak mendirikan tiga patut dipergiatkan oleh sebab sekarang buah kem di Malaysia ini, pertama di pengganas-pengganas kominis telah membuka kawasan saya di Muar, di Cheras dan taringnya iaitu telah berlaku 5 trajidi yang Jinjang. Tetapi bangunan-bangunan ini saya dahsyat membunuh anggota-anggota Pa- tengok macam kura-kura lambatnya. Dengan sukan Keselamatan kita. Kita harap masa­ keadaan yang macam ini menyusahkan alah ini, kalau Kerajaan adakan risikan Pasukan Keselamatan Polis Hutan kita yang yang begitu sempurna dapat kerjasama bertugas untuk kepentingan negara ini. daripada orangramai tentulah Pasukan Mereka ini patut kita berikan perhatian. Keselamatan kita akan dapat mencegah pengganas-pengganas kominis ini. Saya Yang akhirnya, berhubung dengan harap Kerajaan hendaklah tegas dalam Penjara, iaitu B. 34, muka surat 284. Saya masaalah ini, kalau ganas lawannya ganas. berterima kasih bahawa Pusat Tahanan di Kita jangan berlembut-lembut lagi, kalau Muar telah dipindahkan ke Taiping dan tidak keadaan negeri kita ini akan huru-hara tempat ini pula akan dijadikan Pusat sekali lagi dibuat oleh ancaman kominis ini Membaiki Akhlak Penyakit Dadah dan terutama sekali pada manusia-manusia Ganja di Daerah Muar. rakyat negeri ini yang bersubahat, yang menolong pengganas-pengganas kominis. Dalam masaalah Penjara. Penjara Pusat Saya berterima kasih kepada Kerajaan di Kajang dengan sebab kelambatan Kedah baru-baru ini yang telah menangkap Kerajaan menyiapkan kompleks ini, maka beberapa orang yang disyaki dan kita bertambah perbelanjaannya daripada mengucapkan terima kasih kepada Pasukan $8,350,000 kepada $25,000,000. Sepatutnya Keselamatan yang telah berjaya membunuh didirikan kompleks ini pada tahun 1967 seorang pengganas kominis yang telah kerana pada masa itu barang-barang murah, 6061 15 JANUARI 1974 6062 tetapi pada masa sekarang kita dirikan The sparking point ostensibly was the dengan belanja $25,000,000 maka Kerajaan death of one political detainee, Wong Sooi telah menanggung perbelanjaan sebanyak Sang, from Yong Peng, Johore, who, dua kali ganda daripada yang dijangkakan according to the authorities, committed awal. suicide in December. The political detainees in the Batu Gajah detention camp held a Pejabat Polis di Johor Bahru dan juga memorial dinner for Wong Sooi Sang. At the Penjara di Johor Bahru, sayugia dibuat dinner, the riot squad was called in and the kajian supaya dipindahkan ke lain tempat, dinner broke up and the detaineer beaten up. sebab bandar Johor Bahru sekarang sedang Many were hospitalised, including according sesak dan banyak pelancung-pelancung to my report, Zulkifli Ismail, the Pahang datang ke bandar Johor Bahru itu tetapi State Assemblyman. bilamana masa mereka masuk sahaja ke bandar Johor Bahru mereka terpandang di As a further punishment for the detainees, situ ada Pejabat Polis, dan berjalan sekejap a three-month ban on all visits by relatives lagi dia nampak ada Pejabat Penjara. of the detainees was imposed. Following this Dengan keadaan ini, saya fikir sebuah bandar police brutality and punishment, the yang sebegitu besar tidak sesuai lagi detainees went on hunger strike in protest. A penjara-penjara itu kita hadapkan di muka few days ago, the relatives of the detainees negara ini. staged a demonstration in protest against these actions, Saya harap supaya Kementerian ini mengkaji memindahkan kedua-dua bangunan A public inquiry must be held to establish, ini dan Kerajaan Negeri Johor sebuah firstly, the genuine cause of death of Wong Kerajaan yang sentiasa member kerjasama Sooi Sang; and two, the police brutalities in kepada Kerajaan Pusat, insya Allah, dia breaking up the dinner and beating up the akan berikan tanah tapak untuk kompleks detainees. yang saya sebutkan itu. In this connection, I wish to refer to the reply which the Deputy Minister of Home 6.51 ptg. Affairs gave in this House during question time that one reason why Dzulkifli Ismail Tuan Lim Kit Siang: (Dengan izin) Mr was not being released was because he had Chairman, Sir, first of all, I wish to commend consistently refused to appear before the the Minister of Home Affairs for his liberal Review Board headed by Justice Goode. and enlightened attitude in suspending the This is a ridiculous reason, for I am sure his banishment orders on 63 persons in colleague, Sivasabramaniam who was arrested December last year to give them a chance to together with him, and who has been released lead a new life in Malaysia. I hope that in did not appear before the Review Board. the discharge of his duties connected with Dzulkifli Ismail has been adopted as a individual and basic human rights and prisoner of conscience by Amnesty Inter­ liberties, the Minister will be similarly national, as in the words of the Amnesty informed by this liberal and enlightened International, "the vague allusion to his attitude. involvement in a violent incident has never been taken up by the Malaysian authorities In this connection, I urge the Minister to and charges have not been pressed against let the 12 remaining banishees to have a him". similar opportunity to start a new life by suspending their banishment orders, instead I call on the Minister of Home Affairs to of languishing in the Seremban Remand review all cases of political detainees and Prison for years without end. release all those against whom no charges can be preferred in open court. As for those I have received reports of police brutalities against whom charges can be preferred, they in the Batu Gajah Detention Camp in should be taken to court for open trial. December last year, and in protest the political detainees in Batu Gajah have been The Internal Security Act should be on hunger strike since 29th December. This abolished as it violates basic human rights hunger strike is now spreading to the Taiping against arbitrary arrest and detention with­ Camp. out trial. 6063 15 JANUARI 1974 6064

On 20-12-1973, during the debate on the I hope the Prime Minister's Department Prime Minister's Departmental estimates, can still help to solve a basically straight­ I raised the case of a minor who was forward matter, without any fuss. I am converted into Islam against the parental bringing this matter up here, because on consent or wishes, and which therefore 31-10-1973, the father concerned, Lok Wan contravened fundamental Constitutional Fah, lodged a report with the Batu Pahat guarantees in Clause 12 (3) of the Federal Police that his daughter was missing, vide Constitution. Police Report No. 4764/73. The minor is Lok Kim Eng, and the father, Here let me quote Clause 361 of the Lok Wan Fah of Banang Estate, Batu 4, Malayan Penal Code (F.M.S. Cap. 45): Jalan Tanjong Laboh, Batu Pahat. I had "Whoever takes or entices any minor under hoped that in raising this matter in this fourteen years of age if a male, or under august House, the matter would be resolved sixteen years of age if a female, or any straightaway. To be fair, the Deputy Minister person of unsound mind, out of the keeping to the Prime Minister's Department did of the lawful guardian of such minor or pursue this matter. I have been told by the person of unsound mind, without the consent Deputy Minister that the girl's case was of the such guardian, is said to kidnap such now in the hands of the Police and Social minor or person from lawful guardianship." Welfare. And furthermore, the girl was now staying with one Dato Syed Esa, with the There is here a basis for police interven­ parents' consent. For the information of tion. The Constitution provides for equality the House, Dato Syed Esa was formerly of all persons before the law, which means Deputy Speaker of this Chamber. also that the police must be prepared to help all citizens regardless of their status or The father of the minor, Loh Wan Fah, on position. But in this case, the Police, together 13th January, two days ago, made the with all Government Departments, refused to following statutory declaration, which I have act, although they are fully conversant with here and I would just quote four paragraphs: all the facts and circumstances surrounding the case. "On 2nd day of January 1974, Dato Syed Esa bin Alwi and three others came On December 29, MCA Ministers made to my house and tried to obtain my big speeches about their determination to see permission to allow my daughter, Lok that the Constitutional rights of Malaysian Kim Eng, to stay with him but I refused Chinese would not be eroded away. But completely and demanded my daughter's when this person who is incidentally a return. Then they promised to bring her member of MCA, approached MCA leaders back to me, but to this day she has not yet for help to safeguard his Constitutional returned home. rights, the MCA leaders refused to give any help whatsoever. "I never gave any consent to my daughter, Lok Kim Eng, aged 15 to be Let not the Prime Minister, the Minister converted into the Muslim faith. of Home Affairs, and the Government go "I never allowed or permitted my down on record as unwilling or unable to daughter, Lok Kim Eng, to change from help an ordinary citizen to uphold his Temenggong Ibrahim Girls' Secondary fundamental Constitutional right, and I hope School, Batu Pahat, to any other school. that this matter, which has already been over-prolonged, would be ended without any "To this day my daughter, Lok Kim more fuss. Eng, has not returned to my house." In December last year, a student of the In this connection, let me clarify that Henry Gurney School in Telok Mas, when school re-opened on January 7, Lok Malacca, died under mysterious circum­ Kim Eng was switched from Temenggong stances. I have taken up this matter with the Girls' School in Batu Pahat to the Sekolah Minister of Home Affairs, and I have Kebangsaan Menengah, without the parents' received a letter from the Ministry of Home consent. Affairs informing me of their decision to 6065 15 JANUARI 1974 6066 hold an inquest to probe into the cause of took their time to search the branch. In the this student—Phua Swee Leng's death. I kitchen dustbin, they took out cyclostyled shall therefore not go any further on this sheets in Chinese which the Police claimed case. were thoughts of Mao Tse Tung, issued by the TNKU (Tentera National Kalimantan However, it is pertinent to note here that Utara) formed by ex Brunei rebel leader, the whole concept of a reform school for Azahari (whose men, incidentally, were given teenagers should be to rehabilitate youngsters political asylum in their escape from Bnmei who have gone astray and to give them a to Malaysia and who have been described chance to lead a new life. It is not to treat as national heroes by the Sarawak Chief them as hardened criminals beyond re­ Minister). habilitation. Nor is the reform schools a place where school wardens are given licence Next to the dustbin, a package with a to assault the students. pistol inside was found. On these grounds, all the USAP leaders and members, including I have received complaints that students in the Henry Gurney Reform School are the intended condidate, were detained in the being assaulted. There is a need for thorough premises until 12.30 p.m. (by which time going reform, which I hope, the Minister nomination had closed), and were taken to would undertake. the Sandakan police station. The situation where parents are not It is clear that the object of the entire allowed to see their son alone, without the exercise was to detain the USAP candidate presence or supervision of school wardens, is and supporters from filing their nomination highly objectionable. What has the warden papers. Such high-handed police action or the school authorities to fear? This makes a mockery of the Alliance's professed practice should be stopped, so that students commitment ot the building of a democratic in such reform schools can be made to feel society, as enshrined in the Rukunegara that they are students, and not prisoners. principles. Furthermore, the freedom to confide in their parents would be an excellent safeguard Politically, Sabah is in the dark ages, against gross abuses in the school. where the basic individual freedoms of Malaysians are trodden upon with greater Finally, Tuan Pengerusi, again with regard abandon than here. What is indefensible is to Police, in mid-August, I wrote to the the involvement of the Sabah Police so Minister of Home Affairs asking him to inquire blatantly to help the Sabah Government to as to why the police in Sabah had obstructed the United Sabah Action Party from suppress the political rights of the people of contesting the Elopura State by-election on Sabah. This is a serious state of affairs and August 4. Unfortunately, to this date, I have throw into doubt the integrity and inde­ not received any reply. pendence of the Sabah Police as a non- political and neutral force for the main­ On Nomination Day for the Elopura tenance of law and order. Sandakan State constituency, 4th August, 1973, USAP party leaders and supporters, The discovery of so-called subversive including their intended candidate, Dr Yap documents and the pistol smack of a planted Pak Chan assembled in the USAP Sandakan operation. History is full of such examples Branch Office to set out for the nomination of how tyrants planted incidents to give centre at the East Coast Residency, them an excuse to eliminate the opposition. Sandakan. Thus Hilter burnt down the German Parliament in 1933 to eliminate both the At 9.50 a.m., ten minutes before the communists and the democrats by putting the opening for nomination, a squad of police offi­ blame on them. Nearer home, in the 1930s, cials and plainsclothesmen came and stopped the Japanese militarists in Japan created them from leaving the branch. A search incidents in Manchuria and Nanking to give warrant was produced showing authority to them excuses for their aggression, imperialism search for subversive documents. The police and atrocities. 6067 15 JANUARI 1974 6068 The Minister should act firmly and fairly represented by a Government officer? He in this regard and assure the Sabah people has said something out of his own intention that the Sabah Police is not an extension of and he should pay out of his own pocket political tyranny in Sabah, but part of the for the expenses incurred and not to rely on law enforcement agency in the country which the taxpayers. I hope the Minister will give is above all party considerations. an explanation to this too. 7.01 mlm. I would like to refer to another case where an Honourable Member of Parliament Dr A. Soorian (Port Dickson): (Dengan was involved in giving a speech at a public izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, I like to refer to a rally on Sunday, 20th August, 1972, in rape case in Mambau, that took place some Seremban. This Honourable Member is the time in 1973. The Police there failed to Member for Menglembu, who is unfortunately detain the suspect although the information not here. He was speaking in English and given to the police was that the victim was he was interrupted by a speaker who said, seen being taken away by the suspect on a "Look. I can't understand your high-flown motor-cycle. The Police failed to recognise English. Please speak in Bahasa Malaysia". immediately the seriousness of the case and The Honourable Member said, "If you like categorised that case as one of "Missing Bahasa Malaysia, you can go and sleep with Persons", although there was evidence to the Malays in the kampung!" And this is on the contrary. This is, of course, negligence record on the Police tapes. Now what I on the part of the Police, and I would like want to know is, in my estimation, this is to know what steps have the Ministry of quite seditious, because this type of state­ Home Affairs taken to-date to trace the ments can arouse public feelings and cause suspect. I would like the Honourable Minister all sorts of commotion and ill-will too. to give an explanation to this House as to What I want to know is whether the Minister why the suspect was not immediately held thinks that these words are seditious or not for questioning at least. It appears that the and if he thinks they are seditious, then why Police has been slipshod in this case and I is it that action has not been taken? Is it would like to know what disciplinary action because his relatives in Seremban are going has been taken against the officer or officers round saying that the present Minister is a concerned in this case. personal friend of theirs and that nothing would happen? Mr Chairman, Sir, the Minister of Home Affairs enjoys the confidence of both sides Number three. I would like to speak on of the House, being a fair-minded person, the F.R.U. Mr Chairman, Sir, the F.R.U. is and I am sure he will bring to book who­ maintained at public expense and it should ever was responsible for this murder-rape case be used for public protection, and not for of a nine-year old innocent girl in Mambau, maintaining discipline in political parties, Negri Sembilan. especially the M.I.C. If the M.I.C. thinks it is going to run into trouble that requires Mr Chairman, Sir, I would like to refer discipline, then it should engage its own to another case where a Court President has Securicor to maintain discipline at meetings. been sued for libel. Businessman Tan Eu I feel it is very unfair for the F.R.U., which Mee is suing the President of the Kuantan is maintained by the taxpayers, to be abused Sessions Court, Encik Ariffin bin Yaacob, for for maintaining discipline at a political alleged defamation. The President was meeting, especially that of a component of the ruling party. It is really a paradox that alleged to have said, "That fellow is a the M.I.C. which is supposed to be a part of gangster. I don't want him to come here next the Government, itself needs the aid of the time. If he comes here, I will shoot himi". F.R.U., which is supposed to be used against Mr Tan has claimed that the words have insurgents in the country. greatly injured his character, credit and reputation and have also brought him into Mr Chairman, Sir, I would like to public scandal, odium and contempt. Encik comment about the housing problems of the Ariffin is represented by fellow Counsel, Police in this country, especially in the big Mokhtar bin Haji Sidin and the question towns like Kuala Lumpur. Although the here is this: why should the President be Police have had their defects, sometimes 6069 15 JANUARI 1974 6070 they are not thorough in their investigation ini adalah betul, orang yang baik walaupun and sometimes they are too thorough, telah menyerang negerinya sendiri. Dia telah especially when it comes to investigation on dijatuhkan hukum digantung, tetapi tak jadi Opposition Members, it also happens that they digantung oleh kerana dia diakui baik, diberi are human beings and the amount of money makan dan dipenjarakan seumur hidup. that is given for housing in Kuala Lumpur Dan saya hairan sebagaimana yang telah is grossly insufficient, especially in view of dikatakan oleh Menteri kita tadi ada pula the inflation in the country. I hope the yang telah diampunkan daripada 37 orang Honourable Minister will look into their tinggal 18 orang sahaja. Dengan sebab itu, plight and give them a better allowance for saya hendak tahu sebagai warganegara housing, if not providing housing itself which negeri ini, pada masa yang akan datang is adequate to their status, especially in view apabila Kerajaan didesak-desak lagi habislah of the fact that the Police in this country penderhaka-penderhaka itu diampunkan. have no union. Jadi, lain kali saya pun hendak memberontak sama, kerana saya akan diampunkan. Kalau 7.10 mlm. begini gayanya semua rakyat jelata dalam negeri ini hendak memberontak. Raja Nong Chik bin Raja Ishak: Tuan Pengerusi, saya adalah menyokong per- Tuan Pengerusi, berkenaan dengan belanjaan yang diminta oleh Kementerian Keselamatan Dalam Negeri saya dapati dari Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri. satu hari ke satu hari tembak-menambak berlaku di Kedah, di Perak dan baharu- Di samping itu, saya suka hendak bercakap baharu ini di Raub (Pahang) tidak jauh sedikit iaitu dosa yang besar sekali di atas daripada sini. Pada hari ini orang kominis dunia ini ialah menderhaka kepada ibubapa percaya iaitu kalau Mao lari daripada dan kepada saudara-mara. Kalau seseorang Nanking Ke Hunan, jauh berjalan kaki, itu penderhaka, kalau anak disumpah oleh tidak sangka boleh balik. Mereka telah lari ibubapanya mungkin anak itu menjadi batu. 10-12 tahun dahulu, tetapi satu hari mereka Jadi kalau ada penderhaka di dalam negara dakan datang akan datang semula. The Long kita ini tentulah lebih besar dosanya. Kalau March menyeberang berpuluh-puluh sungai ada pengkhianat dalam negara kita ini, pengkhianat itu tak boleh diampunkan. besar akhirnya Chiang Kai-Shek jatuh di Tetapi sayang sedikit di masa konfrantasi Tanah Besar. Jadi, saya suka mengingatkan dahulu beberapa orang Warganegara pemerintah pada hari ini iaitu perkara ini Malaysia telahpun menyeberang ke Indo- akan berlaku pada kita dan kita telah nesida, di sana mereka mendapat latihan nampak iaitu mereka berbalik-balik dan tentera untuk menyerang, iaitu mereka masuk pergi kepada kontek-konteknya yang ada kominis di sana, dilatih untuk menyerang pada masa dahulu. Ini terpaksalah kita tanahairnya sendiri. Ada keterangan- berhati-hati di atas perkara ini. Oleh kerana keterangan (evidence) yang jelas mereka Rukunegara kita mengatakan kita percaya datang kemari dengan kapalterbang dan kepada Ugama, kita percaya kepada Raja, turun di Labis, Johor. Mereka dapat tetapi kominis tidak taat setia kepada Raja. ditangkap dan mengikut undang-undang Jadi sesiapa yang menyokong mereka ini sesuatu negara tiap-tiap pengkhianat patut bermaknalah mereka ini adalah menentang ditembak mati. Rukunegara. Kalau menentang Rukunegara, mereka ini adalah menjadi pengkhianat Tuan Pengerusi, bukan sahaja mereka kepada negerinya sendiri. menjadi pengkhianat kepada individual atau perseorangan, tetapi pengkhianat kepada Tuan Pengerusi, saya suka membawa di keseluruhan rakyat negara ini yang taat sini berkenaan dengan Pasukan Kawalan di setia kepada bangsa dan negaranya. Tetapi muka surat 249. Semalam ada dinyatakan saya hairan sedikit, mungkin kerana saya ini bahawa Pasukan Kawalan ini boleh pada bodoh sangat, apakah sebabnya maka orang- satu hari kalau misalnya dikehendaki orang itu mendapatkan tandatangan pihak bersama-sama dengan Pasukan Keselamatan yang tertentu, pergi ke sana dia dapat bertempur dengan pengganas kominis atau- tandatangan, orang tak dikenali pun dapat pun musuh negara. Saya harap Pasukan tandatangannya, maka Kerajaan memikirkan Keselamatan ini seperti dahulu iaitu jadi 6071 15 JANUAR1 1974 6072 Operational Squard masuk bersama-sama they have written a letter to the Minister dan pergi menyerang musuh-musuh negara concerned alleging corrupt practices carried kita. Kalau dapat pada masa yang akan out by their superiors and a copy of the datang Pasukan Kawalan ini hendaklah letter has been sent to me. So, I raise this dibuat begitu. matter in the hope that the Minister will look into the complaints by these police officers Mengenai Keselamatan Sempadan (Border of corrupt practices in the Kampar district. Security). Saya percaya Kerajaan kita telah Corrupt practices have been alleged to have bermesyuarat dengan Kerajaan Siam been carried out by these superior officers— (Thailand) berkenaan Keselamatan Sem­ that they have accepted bribes and so on and padan dan saya harap perkara right of hot so forth from gambling houses, from taxi pursuit ini, saya dengar dapat 15 batu masuk drivers, from lorry drivers and so on and so ke sempadan menyerang musuh atau forth. I do not know whether these pengganas kominis. Kalau boleh right of hot allegations are true or not, but I hope the persuit ini dijauhkan lagi, dia boleh masuk Minister will look into this seriously because ke tempat kita, dan kita juga boleh masuk if we do not have a clean and efficient Police lebih jauh oleh kerana memburu kominis ini. Force, then I am afraid law and order will not be maintained. Tuan Pengerusi, saya harap apa yang saya cakapkan ini dapat difikirkan, dan pada Thirdly, Mr Chairman, Sir, at the moment masa yang akan datang, saya harap, in criminal trial an accused person is put in desakan-desakan daripada sesiapa juga, jika the dock. This, I think, is unfair to the orang itu musuh negara maka mestilah accused person because even before the trial dihukum dan tidak boleh hari ini ditangkap, goes on he is condemned to stand in the esok dilepaskan. dock. In the eyes of the people and even in the eyes of the judges or magistrates he is 7.20 mlm. already a condemned man, a man already docked. We should change our rules so that Tuan Lim Cho Hock (Batu Gajah): the accused person can be allowed to sit (Dengan izin) Mr Chairman, Sir, I will be beside his counsel so that during the course very brief on this. Firstly I must say that the of the trial fresh and better instructions can Police Force is supposed to maintain law be given because as the witnesses give their and order and must be fair to all irrespective evidence, the accused person can convey his of race, irrespective of political belief and so fresh instructions to the counsel who is beside on. But unfortunately, Sir, whenever we in him. This system is being carried out even the D.A.P. apply for police permits to hold in the United States of America and I must public rallies it is rather difficult for us to say that, that system is doing very well. obtain those permits. For instance, if we Another point is that Mr Chairman, Sir, applied a month ago for a police permit to criminal trials are taking far too long to be hold a rally at a particular place the police heard. They should be heard as soon as would not give us a permit until the very day possible. Invariably the police of the rally. If we got the permit in the morning then we have to try to get the public Tuan Pengerusi: Is it a police matter? speaking system and we have to publicise to Trial is a justice matter. the people and put up posters and so on and so forth within a day. This is unfair to us. Tuan Lim Cho Hock: No, it is under the Whereas other parties belonging to the ruling police because the police is supposed to be Government they organise their rallies well the prosecution. Police has the power to ahead even before they get a permit because prosecute. they know very well that they are bound to get the permit and also invariably the police Tuan Pengerusi: I know that. I was grants the permit to them much earlier. I wondering whether this is the right Head to hope the police would be fair to all of us bring this matter of delays in trials. irrespective of political belief. Tuan Lim Cho Hock: Invariably the Secondly, Mr Chairman, Sir, there 'is a prosecution applies for postponment on the very serious allegation by certain police grounds that certain Ministers are not officers in the Kampar District, I understand available, certain Ministers cannot be 6073 15 JANUARI 1974 6074 contacted and then the trial is postponed. In 7.25 mlm. certain cases the accused persons are under detention because they have not been able to Tuan Abu Bakar bin Umar (Kubang Fasu get bailors to bail them out. They are under Barat): Tuan Pengerusi, saya ingin bercakap detention and if the trial is postponed then sepatah dua dalam perkara B. 29 ini iaitu the accused person will have to go back berkenaan Keselamatan Sempadan. Apa yang to jail for another period of time, another saya ingin menarik perhatian mengenai two or three months. The case sometimes keselamatan sempadan ini ialah saya rasa may be postponed two or three times and di masa-masa yang akhir ini kominis telah sometimes even four times so that the accused mula bergerak dan bermaharajalela sedikit, person is made to suffer unnecessarily. I hope khasnya di Negeri Kedah iaitu di Kulim, di the Minister can also look into the matter Pekan Lama ada tembak-menembak dan so that criminal justice is done. baharu-baharu ini di Raub. Saya rasa untuk lebih efektif dalam menjaga keselamatan Mr Chairman, Sir, I have raised a matter sempadan ini, kalau boleh kita menebang before in this House that a police officer in hutan-hutan sempadan di antara Siam the Traffic Branch in Ipoh, had assaulted a dengan Malaysia. Kita buat rancangan. member of the public in public. I complained Kalau tidak ada pokok, hutan dan rimba to the Superior and what happened, Mr senang kita jaga. Saya rasa kita buat pagar Chairman, Sir, is that action was taken, but dawai tinggi-tinggi supaya payah dia hendak it was taken in the wrong way. This melompat. Kalau dia hendak naik dan turun particular officer was promoted instead of dari pagar itu kita boleh tembak. Menjaga being sacked or transferred. He was dalam hutan rimba ini amatlah susah. Kita promoted and three months later, this same menjaga dia, dia menjaga kita, kerapkali police officer in the Traffic Branch assaulted kita yang terkorban. another member of the public in the presence of 20 or 30 people and there was nearly a Yang keduanya di bawah Aktiviti dalam riot; this group of people then marched to Kepala-kecil (4)—Tapisan Filem dan Pe- see the C.P.O. and the C.P.O. promised to nerbitan. Saya ucapkan tahniah kepada take action. But until now, no action has Menteri Keselamatan Dalam Negeri, kerana been taken against this particular officer. waktu beliau baharu dilantik menjadi This particular officer's name is Menteri Keselamatan Dalam Negeri, yang Letchumanan; everybody knows him in Berhormat telah mengharamkan filem-filem Perak. "X". Saya berasa seronok oleh kerana satu jasa dan satu kehormatan Menteri berkenaan So I hope the Minister can also look into telah memberikan kepada Jawatankuasa this so that the people's confidence in the Filem yang dilantik oleh Dewan ini sendiri. police force will be maintained, if not Tetapi dari tapisan-tapisan itu ada juga enhanced. yang terkeluar, barangkali tapisannya jarang sedikit. Saya adalah orang yang tidak pernah Finally, Mr Chairman, Sir, to allay all melihat filem, tetapi ada terdengar cerita ada fears of malpractices, to eradicate all filem-filem yang menyeramkan bulu roma suspicions of malpractices, I suggest that all ada juga ditayangkan di panggung- deaths that occurred in police lock-ups or panggung wayang, khasnya di Ibu Kota dan in Government detention camps should be di tempat-tempat yang lain, Kalau ditayang­ investigated and on enquiry held to inves­ kan khasnya di Ibu Kota ini tidak susah hati tigate into the true causes of each particular saya, tetapi saya khuatir ditayangkan di death, just like in the case of a fatal motor pekan-pekan kecil seperti di tempat saya. accident, an inquest is usually held in court Saya harap Menteri yang berkenaan supaya to investigate as to how the accident occurred meneliti sedikit penapisan itu muga-muga akhlak belia-belia dan beliawanis kita and whether a particular driver is to be selamat dan negara kita daripada diceroboh blamed and to be charged in court for ke satu jurang yang tidak dikehendaki. negligent driving or careless driving. So in any case of death that occurred in a police Kepala B. 31 bersangkutan dengan lock-up or detention camps, the Government Jabatan Imigresen. Baharu-baharu ini saya must hold an inquiry to eradicate all fears or baca suratkhabar ada paspot-paspot palsu suspicions of malpractices. yang digunakan oleh pihak-pihak yang 6075 15 JANUARI 1974 6076 hendak datang ke Malaysia ini. Saya rasa tengah-tengah Malaysia, iaitu di Perak dan ajaib perkara ini boleh berlaku. Saya akhir sekali di kawasan Menteri yang berharap Jabatan Imigresen menyediakan berkenaan sendiri. Saya berasa dukacita satu pasukan intelligence seperti Scotland kerana di kawasan Menteri sendiri kejadian Yard, C.I.A. supaya benar-benar orang- ini berlaku, seolah-olah ini satu cabaran orang yang hendak masuk ke dalam negeri kepada Menteri sendiri oleh pihak penjahat kita ini adalah orang yang baik, bukan orang itu. Saya memanglah dukacita dengan yang hendak menjadi kominis, hendak kejadian seperti ini dan bersimpati dengan membawa masuk candu, madat dan tentera dan polis kita yang telah bertungkus- sebagainya. lumus berada di dalam hutan rimba untuk membasmikan penjahat dan kominis ini. Itulah harapan saya, Tuan Pengerusi, Apa yang saya berasa khuatir ialah kenapa terima kasih. selalu benar polis kita kena tembak. Apakah sebabnya terjadi begitu? Apakah kerana 7.28 mlm. pengawasan kita tidak lengkap, atau kerana untuk menjalankan dan menjaga keselamatan Tuan Haji Abdul Wahab bin Yunus ini tidak begitu berjalan dengan secara (Dungun): Tuan Pengerusi, saya suka meng- teratur. ambil bahagian di dalam Kementerian Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri ini. Tuan Pengerusi: Yang Berhormat boleh sambung esok selama lima enam minit lagi. Tuan Pengerusi, apa yang ingin saya Masa sudah cukup sekarang. Selepas dari­ sebutkan ialah berkaitan dengan keadaan pada itu, Yang Berhormat Menteri akan tentera dan polis kita sekarang ini setiap menjawab. masa didapati kena ambush oleh pengganas kominis. Kalau dahulu kita dengar di Radio Majlis Mesyuarat bersidang semula. dan Talivisyen mengatakan tentera dan polis kita kena tembak di sebelah Malaysia Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua: Dewan Timur, tetapi sekarang ini beralih pula ke ditangguhkan sehingga pukul 2.30 petang Malaysia Barat. Pada mulanya kejadian ini esok. berlaku di sempadan Malaysia dan Thailand sahaja, tetapi dalam sebulan dua ini telah Dewan ditangguhkan pada pukul 730 berpindah daripada tepi sempadan ke malam.