HSCA Volume V: 9/27/78
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2 that time, Mr. McWillie has worked in gambling casinos in Havana, Cuba, as well as Las Vegas, Nev. Mr. McWillie has entered under the rules of the committee a specific request that there be no photographic coverage of his ap- pearance and no electronic coverage. That means no one is to photograph or keep lights on or use any tape recorder to record Mr. McWillie's voice or face. Mr. Chairman, it would be appropri- ate if an order be entered into that effect . Mr. PREYER . Pursuant to rule 16 which reads in pertinent part, at the request of any witness who does not wish to be subjected to radio, television or still photography coverage, all lenses shall be covered and all microphones used for coverage turned off. At this time, the Chair directs that all lenses be covered and that all microphones be turned off. Mr. BLAKEY . It would be appropriate at this time, Mr. Chairman, to call Lewis J. McWillie . Mr. PREYER. The committee calls Lewis McWillie . TESTIMONY OF LEWIS MCWILLIE, LAS VEGAS, NEV. Mr. PREYER. Will you stand and be sworn, Mr. McWillie . Do you solemnly swear the evidence you are about to give in this hearing will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? Mr. MCWILLIE. Yes, sir. Mr. PREYER. Mr. McWillie, pursuant to your request, all micro- phones and lenses, broadcasting equipment, have been cut off. The Chair recognizes counsel Donald Purdy for questioning of this witness. Mr. PURDY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman . Mr. McWillie, what is your full name and where do you live? Mr. MCWILLIE . Lewis J. McWillie. Mr. PURDY. Where do you live? Mr. MCWILLIE Las Vegas, Nev. Mr. PURDY. How long have you lived there? Mr. MCWILLIE . Well, off and on since 1963. Mr. PURDY. What is your present occupation? Mr. MCWILLIE. I work in a gambling house. Mr. PURDY. Prior to your present employment, where did you work? Mr. MCWILLIE. Binion's Horse Shoe Club. Mr. PURDY. Have you been involved in working in gambling casinos since you moved to Las Vegas in 1963? Mr. MCWILLIE . Yes, sir. Mr. PURDY. For how many years have you been involved in gambling casinos and gambling operations throughout the country? Mr. MCWILLIE . I would say 46 years. Mr. PURDY. In what cities have you been involved in gambling operations or casinos? Mr. MCWILLIE. Oh, what cities? Mr. PURDY. Yes, sir. Mr. MCWILLIE. In this country? Mr. PURDY. Or in other countries. Mr. MCWILLIE . Well, I started off in Memphis, Tenn., and then I was in Mississippi. 3 Mr. PURDY. Approximately when? Please give the years in which you were in those cities also. Mr. MCWILLIE . Oh, I would say Memphis, 1932-36 . Mr. PURDY. What city were you working in gambling casinos after that? Mr. MCWILLIE. Prior to that? Mr. PURDY. After that. Mr. MCWILLIE. After that? Mr. PURDY. Subsequent to 1936? Mr. MCWILLIE . Then I was in Jackson, Miss. after that. Mr. PURDY. How long were you working and living in Jackson, Miss.? Mr. MCWILLIE . Well, a short while, and then in Osyka, Miss. Mr. PURDY. Were you also involved in gambling there? Mr. MCWILLIE . Yes sir. Mr. PURDY. When did you leave there and where did you go? Mr. MCWILLIE . I left there, lets see, I would say 1939 or 1940. I don't know exactly. Mr . PURDY. What cities did you work in since then? Mr. MCWILLIE. Dallas. Mr. PURDY. Were you involved in gambling in Dallas? Mr. MCWILLIE. I was a dealer there, yes. Mr. PURDY. During what years did you live in Dallas? Mr. MCWILLIE. I would say from 1940 to 1958. Mr. PURDY. Where did you go after you lived in Dallas? Mr . MCWILLIE . After I left Dallas? Mr. PURDY. Yes. Mr. MCWILLIE. I went to Cuba. Mr. PURDY. Were you involved in gambling in Cuba? Mr. MCWILLIE. I managed the Tropicana Night Club. Mr. PURDY. Were you involved in gambling? Mr. MCWILLIE. Yes sir. Mr. PURDY. Subsequent to your work in Cuba, where did you move to? Mr. MCWILLIE. Subsequent . That means afterwards? Mr. PURDY. Yes. Mr. MCWILLIE . I went to Miami and stayed until the first of June. Mr. PURDY. The first of June of what year? Mr. MCWILLIE. 1961 . Mr. PURDY. Were you involved in gambling in Miami? Mr. MCWILLIE. No. Mr. PURDY. Where did you live after you left Miami? Mr. MCWILLIE. After I left Miami I went to Lake Tahoe. Mr. PURDY. Were you involved in gambling in Lake Tahoe? Mr. MCWILLIE. Yes, I was a pit boss. Mr. PURDY. When did you leave Lake Tahoe? Mr. MCWILLIE. I left Lake Tahoe in September of 1961. Mr. PURDY. Did you move to Las Vegas from Lake Tahoe? Mr. MCWILLIE. I moved to Reno. Mr. PURDY. Were you involved in gambling in Reno? Mr. MCWILLIE . Yes sir. Mr. PURDY. How long were you in Reno? 4 Mr. MCWILLIE. 1961. I left there, let's see, right before Christmas of 1963, I believe. Mr. PURDY. And you moved to Las Vegas? _ Mr. MCWILLIE. No, I went back to Miami to visit with my mother. Mr. PURDY. How long were you there? Mr. MCWILLIE. Oh, 3 weeks. Mr. PURDY. Where did you go after you visited Miami? Mr. MCWILLIE . I went back to Las Vegas. Mr. PURDY. Have you lived in Las Vegas since? Mr. MCWILLIE . Off and on yes. Mr. PURDY. You have been involved in gambling casinos while you have been in Las Vegas? Mr. MCWILLIE . Well the first, you want me to tell you the casi- nos? Mr. PURDY. I don't think we need to cover the specific casinos at this time. Mr. MCWILLIE . Yes, I was involved in casino work. Mr. PURDY. What has been the nature of your involvement in casino work over these years? Mr. MCWILLIE. Working in the gambling part of it, overseeing the gambling. Mr. PURDY. Mr. McWillie, what were the circumstances sur- rounding your first encounter with Jack Ruby? Mr. MCWILLIE . What were the circumstances? Mr. PURDY. Yes, how did you meet Jack Ruby? Mr. MCWILLIE. Well, I told you that in this. I met him in a restaurant . Mr. PURDY. Approximately when? Mr. MCWILLIE . I would say 1951. Mr. PURDY. Someone introduced you to him in a restaurant in Dallas in 1951? Mr. MCWILLIE . Yes sir. Mr. PURDY. Do you remember who introduced you? Mr. MCWILLIE. He introduced himself to me. Mr. PURDY. He just walked up to you? Mr. MCWILLIE . Well, I noticed him at the counter. We went into this restaurant every night to eat and three or four nights he was at the counter and staring at fellows and myself and I asked someone who he was and I don't know, one of them knew him or not, they said he had a night club or something. Anyway, about the third or fourth night when we got up to leave he walked over and introduced himself to me and I said nice to meet you and what do you want, Mr. Ruby? And, he went on to tell me about he was having trouble with his night club and had some kind of curfew put on him and I asked him, I said, Mr. Ruby, you are Jewish, aren't you, and he said, yes. I said well, there is a gentleman here in town by the name of Julius Schepps that might be able to help you, if there is nothing bad wrong with you, so I suggested that he go see Mr. Schepps, and he did, and he seemed to get his trouble straightened out. Mr. PURDY. Mr. Schepps was able to help Jack Ruby? Mr. MCWILLIE . Evidently, because he didn't have any more trouble. 5 Mr. PURDY. What was the nature of your next few meetings with Jack Ruby. How did you happen to see him again after he came up and introduced himself? Mr. MCWILLIE . Well, he called me on the phone and he thanked me and I met him back in the restaurant, and from then on he was just around me every time he got a chance he would be around. Mr. PURDY. How would you characterize your relationship with Jack Ruby in the 1950's in Dallas? Mr. MCWILLIE . 1950's, I wasn't around him a real lot, you might say, he would come out to my apartment and swim in the pool and he was a kind of a leech, you might say. Mr. PURDY. Kind of a leech? Mr. MCWILLIE . Leech. And he was just a hard fellow to get rid of. Mr. PURDY. You say he came over uninvited? Mr. MCWILLIE. Yes, he came over uninvited after so long a time and he would hang around the pool everyday and swim and have dinner with me and different things . Mr. PURDY. Did you ever have to ask him to leave? Mr. MCWILLIE . I don't recall. I could have. I don't recall it, though. Mr. PURDY. Were you and Jack Ruby friends during the 1950's? Mr. MCWILLIE. Yes, we were friends. Mr. PURDY. Were you aware that Jack Ruby considered you one of his closest friends? Mr. MCWILLIE. I would have to say so, yes, on account of the favors I had done him. Mr. PURDY. What was the reason? Mr. MCWILLIE. The favors I have done him. Mr. PURDY. So he liked you because you had done favors for him? Mr. MCWILLIE . I helped him. Mr. PURDY. How had you helped him other than getting Mr.