1941 'CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9055 commander, to rank from the date stated Lt. Comdr. Silas B. Moore to be a com­ world rolls on, enable us to attain to that opposite their names: mander in the Navy from the 1st day of eternal justice still holds the scale as the Harry J. Scholtes, July 1, 1940. July 1941. Robert M. Gillett, July 1, 1941. Lt. (J. G.) Grover S. Higginbotham to be a faith and endurance which even the Passed Assistant Dental Surgeon Raymond lie1,1tenant in the Navy from the 1st day of bravest will not despise. Allow not ambi­ A. Lowry to be a dental surgeon in the Navy October 1941. tion or advantage to harden our under­ with the rank of lieutenant commander, to Surg. Edward M. Harris, Jr., to be a medi­ standing into permanence, neither con­ rank from the 1st day of July 1941. cal inspector in the Navy with the rank of fusion to bewilder our endeavors to ran­ The following-named assistant dental sur­ commander from the 1st day of July 1941. som Thy good earth from its adversaries. geons to be passed assistant dental surgeons Baker M. Hamilton to be an assistant den­ In the bond of unity, grant us light where in the Navy with the rank of lieutenant, to tal surgeon in the Navy with the rank of rank from the 1st day of August 1941: lieutenant (junior grade) from the 8th day there is twilight and purge away the of September 1941. weakness and the prejudice of error. Al­ Gail T. Curren Roger V. Chas~ain mighty God, be pleased to direct our J;lres­ Maurice E. Simpson Wilbur H. Pederson Otto H. Schlicht Stanley W. Eaton ident, our Speaker, and the Congress; CONFIRMATIONS bless our entire citizenship that our peo­ Angus W. Grant to be' an assistant dental ple may rest and abide under just laws surgeon in the Navy, With the rank of lieuten­ Executive nominations confirmed by wisely administered, and Thine shall be ant (junior grade), to rank from the 8th day the Senate November 24, 1941: the praise forever. Through Christ. of September 1941. CoLLECTOR OF INTERNAL REVENUE Pay Director William C. Fite to be a pay di­ Amen. rector in the Navy, '\71th the rank of rear Frazier Reams to be collector of internal revenue for the tenth district of Ohio. The Journal of the proceedings of admiral, to rank from the 1st day of October Friday, November 21, 1941, was read and 1933. POSTMASTERS approved. Passed Assistant Paymaster James J. Mc­ Kinstry to L3 a paymaster in the Navy, with ALABAMA MESSAGE FROM THE SENATE the rank of lieutenant commander, to rank Mae F. Seymour, Goshen. A. message from the Senate, by Mr. from the 1st day of July 1941. The following to be assistant paymasters ALASKA Frazier, its legislative clerk, announced In the Navy, with. the rank of ensign, to rank Alice E. Gurtler, Nenana. that the Senate agrees to the amend­ from the 17th day of November 1941: ment of the House to a bill of the Senate ARKANSAS Niels H. Anderson Shelby C. Leasure, of the following title: John F. Bacon Jr. Ella K. Calhoun, Mineral Springs. S. 1884. An act to make provision for the Leonard F. Burrage Daniel R. McCom- Jewell L. Bodenhamer, Mountain Home. construction activities of the Army. Charles M. Davis, Scott. 3d ish EXTENSION OF REMARKS Claude A. Clefton Frederick D. Muir, FLORIDA Fred Coleman Jr. Mary W. Green, Englewood. Mr. LARRABEE. Mr. Speaker, I ask Robert M. Coman Jack E. Nettles Ida ·Kathryn Gainer, St. Andrew. unanimous consent to extend my own Johnstone L. Cop- Robert H. Ryan Berniece L. Ward, Tice. remarks in the RECORD and to include pock William M. Sander therein a speech made by the Governor Philip W. Evans Theodore E. Sharp IOWA of the State of Indiana, Hon. Henry F. Robert B. Edwards ' Douglas C. Skaife · Hilda Blau, Alexander. Francis M. Fahy Bert Smith Schwicker, at the recent launching of Charles W. Taylor, Janesville. the battleship Indiana. Douglas G. Fink Rodne A. Stanton Gladys M. Braden, Macedonia. Philip P. Finn Hunter W. Stewart John E. Mieras, Maurice. The SPEAKER. Without objection, it Richard E. Forr~t Donald C Storch Eva F. Cupp, Riverton. is so ordered. Stanley B. Free- Erwin N. Thode Lois C. Hewitt, University Park. There was no objection. born, Jr. Harold C. Van Ars- Melvfn P. Gundlach dale MINNESOTA

CO~ENCE REPORT STATEMENT Mr. MARTIN of Massachusetts. Mr. The committee of conference on the dis­ The managers on the part of the House at Speaker, reserving the right to object, agreeing votes of the two Houses on the the conference on the disagreeing votes of will the gentleman tell us how many amendments of the Senate to the bill (H. R. the two Houses on the amendment of the bills he is going to call up? 3774) entitled "An Act for the relief of Fred Senate to the bill (H. R. 768) for the relief Mr. RANDOLPH. This is the only Spencer", having met, after full and free con­ of William E. Thomas submit the following bill. ference, have agreed to recommend and do statement in explanation of the effect of the recommend to their respective Houses as action agreed upon and recommended in the Mr. MARTIN of Massachusetts. Are follows: accompanying conference report: you going to explain this bill to the That the House recede from its disagree­ This blll, as it passed the House, provided House? ment to the amendment of the Senate and for the payment of the sum of $830.7§ t_o Mr. RANDOLPH. Yes; I desire to agree to the same with an amendment: In William E. Thomas for personal injuries sus­ do so. lieu of the figures "$3,258" insert "$3,700"; tained when his right foot was crushed be­ The SPEAKER. Is there objection to and the Senate agree to the same. tween a subway car and the loading platform the request of the gentleman from West DAN R. MCGEHEE, beneath the Capitol BUilding on September 13, 1937. The Senate reduced the amount to Virginia [Mr. RANDOLPH]? w. A. PITI'ENGER, There being no objection, the Clerk LOUIS J. CAPOZZOLI, be paid to William E. Thomas from $830.75 to Managers on the part of the House. $330.75. read the bill, as follows: At the conference a compromise of $500 was PRENTISS M. BROWN, Be it enacted, etc., That no person shall sell, agreed upon. or cause to be sold, or offer for sale any food JosEPH RosiER, DAN R. MCGEHEE, ARTHUR CAPPER, which is unwholesome or unfit for use. ROBERT R,AMSPECK, SEc. 2. For the purposes of this act the Managers on the part of the Senate. Managers on the part of the House. term "food" means any article used for con­ STATEMENT sumption by a human being or an animal. The conference report was agreed· to. SEc. 3. It shall be the duty of the health The managers on the part of the House at A motion to r.econsider was laid on officer of the District of Columbia, and he is the conference of the disagreeing vote of the hereby authorized, to inspect all food pos­ two Houses on the amendment of the Senate the table. J. T. COULTER sessed or offered for sale, and condemn, de- to the bill (H. R. 3774) for the relief of Fred . nature, destroy, seize, or remove such food as Spencer, submit the following statement in Mr. McGEHEE. Mr. Speaker, I ask may be unfit for consumption. explanation of the effect of the action agreed unanimous consent to take from the SEc. 4. The Commissioners of the District upon and recommended in the accompany­ Speaker's table the bill

I agree to· th~t; and yet there .is a of time so as to give this brilliant young Mr. RANKIN of Mississippi; If this feeling that with Leon Henderson given autQ.or, a Member of this House, full op­ bill passes in its present form, I fear it tlie broad powers that are carried in this portunity-and those taking his view­ means peonage for the American farmer. bill the remedy will be worse than the to set forth reasons why he insists upon Mr. ALLEN of Illinois. Mr. Speaker, I disease. the acceptance of his amendment, he will yield 10 minutes to the gentleman from Let me say to you that the main drag commit a terrible blunder which will re­ Michigan [Mr. MICHENER]. on the impulse and urge for this legis­ act ~dversely against his proposal. Let Mr. COFFEE of Washington. Will the lation, necessary as we all recognize it us adopt the rule and then ·proceed with gentleman yield? to be, is Leon Henderson. I think there the debate and at the end enact a bill Mr. MICHENER. I yield to the gen­ is g::meral agreement that he is a man of that will do the job. tleman from Washington. very extraordinary ability. He thinks Mr. ALLEN of Illinois. Mr. Speaker, I Mr. COFFEE of Washington. There so, too. · If you have taken the pains to yield myself as much time as I may re­ is some confusion in the minds of some read the hearings of the Banking -and quire. of the Members because in the press of Currency Committee...:_and I mean no re­ Mr. Speaker, like the gentlemen from Saturday it was reported that the Rules fiection upon anybody-you will get the Georgia and Mississippi stated, this is a Committee had restricted consideration impression that it was his hearing and fair rule, and there is no disposition on by the House so far as the Gore bill is not that of the commUtee. the part of anyone over here that I have concerned to those features not dealing learned of to oppose the rule. However, with limitation on profits for corpora- Mr. WOLCOTT. Mr. Speaker, will tions. · the gentleman yield?· in regard to the bill itself, realizing that this problem of inflation is upon us, it is Mr. MICHENER. Yes; I understand Mr. COX. Not now. important that all of us remain here and what the gentleman means. This House will make a tremendous listen to the members of the committee. Mr. COFFEE of Washington. Will the mistake unless it provides in this bill for The thing which primarily bothers me gentleman discuss that? some kind of restraint upon Mr. Hender­ is the proposition· of who is going to be ·Mr. MICHENER. I will be very glad son. Several days ago I referred to him in charge of this matter. It has been to answer that. as operating under the alias of "Leon suggested many times that certain indi­ The House must always remember that Henderson." I did him an injustice, I viduals who are trying to make the United in theory the Rules Committee functions believe. That statement was based upon States over are going to be given the for two purposes: First, when the regu­ information given me from sources which power of what we might call economic lar rules of the House are inade_quate to · !'believed were reliable. But that he is· dictatorship. They could be fair with give a bill immediate consideration-that tainted with an alien ideology I have not one group and with another group they is, where a bill has been favorably re­ the slightest doubt. To give him these might be -unfair. ported by a committee and is on the broad powers and turn him loose upon It has been stated many time.s that a regular House calendar. Ofttimes, the the people of this country may be the bad law administered by wise people is Rules Committee is called upon to take final culmination of the campaign initi­ much better than good law administered that bill out of its regular place on the ated and which has- been strenuously by unwise people. When the final vote calendar and permit its immediate con- · prosecuted by t.he Frankfurters and the comes on this measure, the fact that tin­ · sideration by the House and under the Hillmans in this Government. Now, · sound, unreasonable men wiil have these general rules of the House. Second,·one make no mistake about that. powers will probably have ~ deciding of the principal functions of .the Rules ·So again I want to urge upon you that effect on the votes of a good many of us. Committee is to make it possible f9r the you set up some sort of respon.sible body Mr. R~KIN of Mississippi. Will the party in power to carry out its legislative that n:ay function as a · restraint upon gentleman yield?. program; that is, the party in power was this man who has the dictator complex Mr. ALLEN of Illinois. I yield to the elected by the people of the country on plus. Now, it has ·been said that you gentleman from :ty.tissis~ippi. a. specific platform, an<;l it seems but fair must have a hard-boiled individual to Mr. RANKIN of Mississippi. May I that some agencies should exist in the administer this law, apd I think that is say to ·the gentleman from Illinois that . House to. permit the party in power to right. But I think that to turn him lqose this program is directed toward revers­ carry out its policies and keep its pledges. without control upon the business of this ing the policy · of the Anglo-Saxon race For this reason, there are at the present . country would bring about consequences for a thousand years, adopting the phi­ time 4 Republicans on the Rules Com­ which it is not within the reach of the losophy of scarcity, which means totali­ mittee and 10 Democrats, a very safe imagination to measure. I say to you tarianism, .as against the philosophy of political majority. That would be re­ again that he is the fear. abundance and free enterprise . . versed if the Republicans were in power. . We had before us one o'f the elder There is only one way to legitimately The rule which w.e are now consider­ statesmen, Mr. Baruch. He took the po­ control prices in any cciuntry, and that is ing does just one thing-that is, it takes sition that the Gore bill was basically a to control your money supply. Prices the Steagall bill from the calendar and better bill than the committee bill; and are regulated by two thing~by the vol­ brings it before the House for considera­ I' agree. While other members of the ume of the Nation's currency multiplied tion under the general rules of the House committee will, of course, speak for them­ by the velocity of its circulation. At a with 2 days' general debate. selves I think it was the consensus of time when farm prices are beginning to The rule is disappointing to me be­ the committee which reports out this bill rise toward proper levels, it seems to me cause in the ·instant case two fundamen­ that the Gore bill was basically the better the thing we should, do is to take back tal principles of price=-control legislation bill. - into the hands of the Congress the power are embodied in two legislative proposals Under the rule· this House will be in vested in it by the Constitution to coin having· the same objectives but proceed­ control and will have the opportunity of money and regulate the value thereof; in ing by different methods. writing the legislation, because after the other words, regulate our supply of cur­ The Steagall bill, which this rule reading of the first section of the bill the rency, and in -that way prevent those makes in order, represents the philos­ gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. G9RE] inflations that were brought about in ophy of the selective-control system. will offer his bill as an amendment; then Europe by the uncontrolled, or unlimited, The Gore bill, which receives no consid­ the House will go about perfecting that printing of money. Now, we are simply eration whatever as such under the terms amendm~nt and making it conform with tugging at our bootstraps and threaten­ of this rule·, proceeds on the oyer-all what the combined judgment of the ing to wreck the greatest economic sys­ theory of price control. House thinks the legislation ought to be. tem the world has ever seen. · It was my hope that the committee On the question of the division ottlme: Mr. ALLEN of Illinois. In conclusion, would grant a rule like this: Make the Finally we gave the committee the break may I say that if it is true the reformers consideration of the Steagall bill in order on the rule. That was fair, they should and people who are trying to socialize under the general rules of the House per­ have it; but in order to insure full con­ America are going to be in charge of this mitting amendment ai\d change in the sideration of the Gore resolution we gave bill, as stated before the Rules Committee bill. When the Steagall bil1 was per­ 2 days' full debate on the bill. If the for 3 days, we will be doing our own fected, then make the Gore bill in order chairman of the Banking and Currency people-a gre~t ~s.se~vice by pass_ipg this , to all intents and purposes the. same as Committee does not make a fair division measure. the Steagall bill. When the Gore bill 9064 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 was perfected, then provide by rule that Committee, and possibly the Chairman Mr. MICHENER. No; I do not want the Gore bill might be offered as a sub­ presiding over the Committee of the to. stitute for the Steagall bill. Whole. Mr. COX. Nobody has finer integrity trnder such a rule, the Henderson Mr. COX. Mr. Speaker, will the gen­ than the gentleman, and nobody endeav­ theory, as represented by the Steagall tleman yield? ors more than he to be fair with the bill, and the Baruch theory, as repre­ Mr. MICHENER. Yes; for a correc­ House. However, we were advised by the sented by the Gore bill, would each have tion, if I have made a misstatement. Parliamentarian, and it was our under­ its day in court, neither having an ad­ Mr. COX. I do not deny that the gen­ standing, that this strict rule limiting de­ vantage over the other in t.he matter of tleman took that position in committee. bate to 5 minutes, to which the gentle­ consideration. There would then be a The question I should like to ask the gen­ man has referred, has not been enfo:..~~ed clear-cut vote as between the selective tleman is, does he expect to vote for or for many, many years and would not be system and the over-all system of price against the rule? . enforced in this case. control. Mr. MICHENER. I shall vote for the Mr. MICHENER. I differ with the Under this rule, the first section of the rule, for the reason that I have been here gentleman, and I ain sure the Speaker Steagall bill will be read for amendment. a long time and know when the second would agree with me. It very, very often 'I'he gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. function of the committee, which I spoke happens that when the presiding officer GoRE] will then offer his bill as a sub­ of in the beginning, is operating, and I in the Committee of the Whole feels that stitute for the first section of the Steagall know that any opposition would be futile. there has been sufficient debate on an bill and will at the same time give no­ I believe that if we are going to have amendment he announces that all debate tice that if his amendment is accepted price control we should have it now. has been exhausted on that amendment he will move to strike out the following Something should be done about it. after 10 minutes of debate. For instance; sections of the Steagall bill as they are The minority of the committee and I see before me that very distinguished read for amendment. the minority of the House have not done parliamentarian who often presides with On page 27 of the Gore bill as now a thing and are not doing a thing to such grace and dignity over the House, printed will be found a provision the pur­ delay the consideration of this price­ the ge:1tleman from Tennessee [Mr. pose of which is to place a ceiling on control bill. CooPER], and I have hebrd him within profits of manufacturers, producers, and I would have preferred that there be the last 3 months on several occasions industrialists akin to the ceiling placed a division of time under the conditions invoke the very rule to which I refer and on wages. This is to be brought about here provided by the Rules Committee. which the gentleman from Georgia un­ by the tax route. This being so, jurisdic­ The closing of debate under the 5-minute derstands has not been invoked in the tion over taxes belongs to the Ways and rule to which I have referred, as well as House for many, many years. Means Committee, and that provision, if the division of time, as a matter of fact, Mr. COLMER. Mr. Speaker, will the left- in the Gore bill, will make the Gore rest entinely within the control of the gentleman yield? bill subject to a point of order if it is chairman of the committee, the gentle­ Mr. MICHENER. Yes; I yield. . offered as an amendment. The Bank­ man from Alabama [Mr. STEAGALL] on Mr. COLMER. I know the distin.. ing and Currency Committee does not the one side and the ranking minority guished gentleman from Michigan al­ deal with taxation, and the amendment . member on the other side. They will ways wants to be fair, and I have a very would not be germane. control. high regard for him; but is it not true In short, the Gore bill, without the Mr. COX. Does not control rest with that the criticism he has made of this profit-ceiling provision, will place a ceil­ the House? rule may be made against any other rule ing on wages, and those who doubt the Mr. RANKIN of Mississippi. · It does, that is brought in here with respect to wisdom of placing a ceiling on wages are under the 5-minute rule. any bill similar to this? going to have a very good excuse for [Here the gavel fell.] Mr. MICHENER. Yes; this rule per­ voting against the Gore bill, with its Mr. MICHENER. Mr. Speaker, I yield mits the consideration of the Steagall bill one-sided cemn·g provision. myself 5 additional minutes. under the general rules of the House with The gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. . Mr. COX, Mr. PATMAN, and Mr. RAN­ 8 hours' general debate and doe.S not do GoRE] has announced that he will intro­ KIN of Mississippi rose. anything else. Rules always do one of duce a reprint of his bill tomorrow and Mr. MICHENER. I yield to the mem­ three things: They either bring the bill eliminate page 27 in order to make his ber of the committee. I want to be fair. in as this was done, or they broaden the bill germane so he may offer it as an Mr. COX. The gentleman said' that rule in order that justice may be done and amendment to section 1 of the Steagall control rested with the chairman of the the will of the House worked in a spe­ bill. I doubt if he appreciates just what committee. As a matter of fact, is not cific case, or they limit or restrict the this means to his bill, so far as votes in control in the hands of the House? action of the House in a specific case, and the House are concerned. If he does Mr. MICHENER. No; I can read the in that case we have what is known as a appreciate the rule situation, he certain­ gentleman the rule, if he wishes. "gag" rule. ly will protest against t.his apparently Mr. COX. I know the rule. open and harmless rule. Mr. MICHENER. There shall be 2 Mr. COLMER. This is not a ·"gag'' In brief, I do not believe that the out­ days of general debate, to be controlled rule; this iS not a broadening rule; this is standing, able, and brilliant young man by the chairman of the committee and just the ordinary rules of the House, and from Tennessee fully appreciates just the ranking minority member of the com­ therefore the 5-minute rule obtains. what is being done to him here. You . mittee; so that settles that. Mr. GIFFORD. Mr. Speaker, will the know, there is an old saying that it is well Mr. COX. But even the House can gentleman yield? to beware of Greeks bearing gifts. When reverse that. Mr. MICHENER. I yield. those opposed to the Gore bill proffer Mr. MICHENER. The only way the Mr. GIFFORD. I think we ought to be him this rule, on the theory that it per­ House .can reverse that is to amend the very grateful to the gentleman from mits him to offer his bill as an amend­ rule. The rule is entirely in the charge Michigan, if I may say so, for clarifying ment, I fear that possibly he is accept­ of the gentleman from Mississippi [Mr. this rule. I thank the gentleman for ing a gift which has strings enough to CoLMER] presenting it, and I have a pic­ showing us that after 3 days of unusual destroy its usefulness. - ture of that gentleman yielding for an hearings on the merits of the case, they Under the general rules of the House amendment to this rule. If anybody be­ bring in a rule which on its face, as he and under this rule, debate may be closed lieves it can be done, I hope the gentle­ tried to tell us, has the blessing of the on any amendment offered to any bili at man from Georgia will use his persuasive Rules Committee, although it is not an the expiration of 5 minutes' debate for powers and ask the gentleman from Mis­ admini~tration bill. I cannot recall when and 5 minutes against the amendment; sissippi to yield in order that the rule may the Rules Committee so plainly gave its that is, when the gentleman from Ten­ be amended so that this time may be blessing to a substitute bill. nessee [Mr. GORE] offers his bill, debate equitably divided. Mr. MICHENER. In answer to the on the entire bill can be limited at the Mr. COX. If the gentleman will yield gentleman, I want to be fair. This is an end of 10 minutes. The matter will be further, the gentleman of course does not open rule so far as the rules of the House entirely within the discretion of the intend to be unfair or to misinform the are concerned, and it does not give any chairman of the Banking and Currency House. special treatment to the Gore bill. 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUS~ 9065 I thank my colleague the gentleman amendment, and then you must deal with Mr. MICHENER. I do not think any­ from Michigan [Mr. CRAWFORD] for his it as an amendment. If we had the sub­ body could "pressure" the gentleman congratulations on this liberal rule. I stitute method, which I suggested, it from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] very far. wonder, however, if he realizes its lim­ would have been read section by section. If there was any pressure put upon him itations. Mr. COX. Mr. Speaker, will the gen­ I do not know anything about it. Mr. CRAWFORD. Mr. Speaker, will tleman yield to me at that point? Mr. GORE. I know that the gentle­ the gentleman yield? Mr. MICHENER. I do not want to man does not want to imply that any one Mr. MICHENER. Yes. . take so much time. attempted to, because they did not . Mr. CRAWFORD~ I still want tO re­ Mr. COX. I know, but the gentleman Mr. MICHENER. I deny any knowl­ peat that I am delighted to have this rule, will concede that full opportunity will be edge of any pressure put upon the gen- because I realize the Rules Committee given the committee to amend the Gore tleman. · could have brought in a so-called "gag" bill. Mr. COX. The gentleman does not rule. They could have made it impos­ Mr. MICHENER. Wait. tmply that any pressure has been put sible for us to offer the Gore substitute Mr. COX. Full opportunity. upon the gentleman from Tennessee, bill. They could have done many, many Mr. MICHENER. I will answer it. does· he? things which were not done, and now Yes; full opportunity will be given to Mr. MICHENER. Oh., no. may I ask the gentleman ~his question: amend the Gore bill. Mr. COX. And he does not mean to Are we not during the 2 days of general Mr. COX. And any germane amend­ intimate that anybody endeavored to in­ debate permitted to argue and explain . ment to the Gore bill will be in order. fluence him in anything? and expound the Gore substitute all we Mr. MICHENER. Full opportunity Mr. MICHENER. No. The gentleman please during the time allotted to us? will be given to amend the Gore bill to does not understand. I will make it Mr. MICHENER. Yes; but the time the same extent that opportunity is given clear. I do not know of any pressure for voting on it will have passed after you in any case to amend an amendment that has been put upon .the gentleman have passed section 1. I do not get much offered to a bill. It cuts out the third­ from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] anywhere, consolation and I do not think the coun­ degree amendment. anyhow, at any time, at any place, for try gets much benefit or aid out of any Mr. COX. That is correct. any purpose. Now. i.: that clear? talking that the Congress may do unless Mr. MICHENER. And some other Mr. COX. Can we not make the fur­ the Congress can implement that talk by things. ther agreement that if there were any action. Mr. COX. But any germane. amend­ endeavor to trick him or to apply pres­ Mr. HEALEY. Mr. Speaker, will the ment will be in order. sure, it would have had no effect what­ gentleman yield? Mr. MICHENER. Any germane amend­ ever? Mr. . MICHENER. I yield to the gen­ ment to the Gore bill will be in order, Mr. MICHENER .. Yes. I will go fur­ tleman. and that is the reason the gentleman ther-- Mr. HEALEY. Under the rule, may from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] has been Mr. COX. The gentleman stands the Gore substitute be perfected ·by offer­ obliged to take out one of the most im­ upon his own feet and within his own ing amendments? portant parts of his bill. It is not ger­ right. Mr. MICHENER. The Gore bill will be mane. Mr. MICHENER. I want to make 'the an amendment, and not a substitute, as Mr. CRAWFORD. Mr. Speaker, will gentleman from Georgia understand, if I we generally speak of it. It can be the gentleman yield? can, and I will say that I have known the amended the same as any other amend­ Mr. MICHENER. Yes. gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] ment. Mr. CRAWFORD. I think at this ever since he has been in the House. I Mr. HEALEY. In other words, it will point the House should be notified that have the utmost confidence in his inde­ bA in order to offer that part of the Gore the SteagaJl bill will undoubtedly carry pendence.. I do not believe that he would bill with respect to a limitation on profits a provision giving the Administrator the yield to improper pressure. His. purpose which has been deleted from it? power to control the profit margins on all might be circumvented, however, by Mr. MICHENER. No; that has been activities, not just the defense contracts. adroit parliamentary maneuvering. I do deleted for the simple reason that page Mr. COFFEE of Washington. Mr. not believe that any unreasonable or im­ 27 of the original Gore bill dealt with Speaker, will the gentleman yield? proper pressure will have any effect on profits, and it did this by a method of Mr. MICHENER. Yes. him-if he knows it. This body cannot taxation. Taxation is a subject over Mr. COFFEE of Washington. I do not have too many Members of the intelli­ which the Committee on Ways and want a wrong interpretation put upon gence, industry, integrity, and courage Means has jurisdiction, and therefore a my question. I did not congratulate the of the gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. point of order against that provision in committee. I agree absolutely with the GoRE]. His bill is entitled to better treat­ the Gore bill would make his whole bill fnterpretation of the gentleman from ment than accorded it by this rule. I out of order. Michigan [Mr. MICHENER] as he has conclude by saying that attention and Mr. VORYS of Ohio. Mr. Speaker, stated the situation. . I think it is very consideration should be given to this leg­ will the gentleman yield? unfortunate that the gentleman from islation commensurate with its impor­ Mr. MICHENER. Yes. Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] was compelled to tance. Mr. VORYS of Ohio. Some time ago eliminate that section dealing . with [Here the gavel fell.] we had the Norton bi11 under considera­ profits. The SPEAKER. The time of the gen­ tion, under special ru1e, and the Barden Mr. MICHENER. I cannot yield tleman from Michigan has expired. bill was also under discussion to take further. Mr. MICHENER. Mr. Speaker, I yield care of the same situation. The special Mr. COX. The Rules Committee did 5 minutes to the gentleman from Indiana rule provided that the Barden bill, which · not compel the gentleman from Tennes­ [Mr. HALLECK]. was under discussion to take care of the see [Mr. GORE] to do anything. Mr. HALLECK. Mr. Speaker, I do not same situation. should be considered. Mr. MICHENER. Oh, no. know that anything particularly can be The SPEAKER. The time of the gen­ adderl, and I am confident the House is tleman from Michigan has expired. Mr. COX. The Rules Committee sim­ ply provided an open rule and under the going to adopt this rule. Mr. MICHENER. Mr. Speaker, I shall I would like to reiterate what has been take 5 minutes more. general rules of the House that part of the Gore bill would not be in order. suggested by. my colleague on this side, Mr. VORYS of Ohio. Provision was and that is that there has been no dis­ made for the consideration of two differ­ Mr. MICHENER. If any pressure was position on the part of the minority to ent bills. However, at this time the Gore put on the gentleman from Tennessee obstruct or delay consideration of this bill cannot be considered as a bill, be­ [Mr. GoRE], I do not know anything very important matter. Rather has the cause when we consider a bill, we may about it. minority cooperated all the way along want to read that bill under the 5-min­ Mr. COX. But back to the question of the line. I think in these times when ute rule, but the Gore substitute cannot the amendment, if 100 amendments to frequently it is charged-! think most possibly be read for possible amendment. the Gore bill were offered and they were often wrongfully-that there is too much Mr. MICHENER. Oh, no. The Gore gtrmane, every one of them would have partisanship, too much obstruction, too bill will be just the same as any other full and fair coP..sideration. much failure in the Congress on our part LXXXVII-572 9066 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 to work together on important matters is the job of government to do what it can sent his side of the question. -We cannot. before the ccuntry, we might well point in its best judgment to avoid disastrous do any more under the terms of the rule. out the careful and nonpartisan consid­ consequences. I, for one, am not willing I repeat, the rule is perfectly fair. I eration given this proposal. tu sit by and say that we shall not at­ think tha~ fair play and the welfare of Mr. PATMAN. Mr. Speaker, will the tempt to do anything about it because it the United States of America demand, if gentleman yield for a question? is an extremely difficult and dangerous you please-at least require-that the Mr. HALLECK. Yes; I will yield. problem. It is our job to work out the gentleman from Tennessee may have full Mr. PATMAN. Is it not a fact that best bill we can and adopt it if we con­ opportunity to explain in his own lan­ the only major difference between the clude that it will operate to the best in­ guage-not as interpreted by somebody committee bill and the Gore proposal is terests of the country, else-to explain in his own language what the question of wages? Mr. RANKIN of Mississippi. Mr. his bi] contains. Then having heard Mr. HALLECK. I am not a member Speaker, will the gentleman yield? both sides of the question, both bills hav­ of the Committee on Banking and Cur-: Mr. HALLECK. I decline to yield at ing been fully considered, the House in rency and I -do not claim to be familiar this time. its wisdom will determine which one is with all details, but I am sure there are The SPEAKER. The time of the gen­ to be preferred. other differences. However, funda­ tleman has expired. [Here the gavel fell.] mentally, as I understand it, there is one The Chair will state there is 1 minute Mr. COLMER. Mr. Speaker, I yield school of thought which holds for a selec­ remaining, however. 5 minutes of my time to t.he gentleman tive price-control scheme by an admin­ Mr. HALLECK. Mr. Speaker, I yield from Virginia [Mr. SMITH]. istrator who determines the points at myself that additional minute just to say Mr. SMITH of Virginia. Mr. Speaker. which the Government shall intervene this: The gentleman from Michigan [Mr. I think the discussion here indicates through this agency. The other school CRAWFORD] made a statement a m..oment there has been some misgivings on what of thought holds that there should be an ago that rather surprised me. If I un­ has gone on in the Rules Committee over-all price-fixing scheme that would derstood him correctly, he said some­ about a rule for this bill. First, I would be fixed by law, as distinguished from the thing which indicated to me that the like to answer a question asked by the operation by an administrator. committee had determined to put in the gentleman from Washington [Mr. CoF­ Mr. PATMAN. Will the gentleman so-called Steagall bill some provision for FEE]. The gentleman from Washington yield further ? control of profits. The thing that strikes wanted to know if we had struck out the Mr. HALLECK. I yield. me is this: If such a provision is not provision relative to a ceiling on profits. Mr. PATMAN. Further, is it not a fact germane to the Gore substitute that is We did not, of course, strike out any­ that both proposals are selective? Under to be offered, I take it that under the thing, for we did not have that authority. one, the committee bill, no commodity rule it would not be germane to the com­ The question before us was whether we is included, but the administrator may mittee bill reported by the committee. would grant an unusual rule that would take jurisdiction over any commodity. Mr. CRAWFORD. Mr. Speaker, will permit that matter to be taken up by Under the Gore proposal everything is the gentleman yield? the House in this bill. The answer to included, and the administrator may ex­ Mr. HALLECK. I yield. that, it seems to me, is very obvious, empt anything he wants to. Therefore Mr. CRAWFORD. I think the gentle­ as the gentleman from Colorado [Mr. the net result is exactly the same? man will find that the Gore profit limi­ LEWIS l has said. There was not a man Mr. GORE. Mr. Speaker, will the gen­ tation is tied in to a taxing feature, in the Rules Committee who did not tleman yield? which would come under the Ways and want to see that the Baruch or the Gore Mr. HALLECK. I yield to the gentle­ Means Committee; while the other ap­ bill had full consideration, and I am sure· man from Tennessee. proach gives the Administrator the power every Member of the House wants it to Mr. GORE. The gentleman from to squeeze down the ceiling and wash out have full consideration; but the question Texas .[Mr. PATMAN] is as wrong about the margin, and operate it on a slide:... of a tax on profits is a matter for the that as he is on the money question. rule basis; · that under the Steagall bill Ways and Means Committee of the Mr. HALLECK. Now, if I may proceed the Administrator can do just as he House. When that was brought to our for a few moments-- pleases. . attention and the fact that a bill had Mr. RANKIN of Mississippi. If that is [Here the gavel fell.] also been drafted on that question and the case, the gentleman from Tennessee Mr. COLMER. Mr. Speaker, I Yield 2 referred to the Ways and Means Com­ . ought to go to school to the gentleman minutes to the gentleman from Colorado mittee, the Rules Committee did not feel from Texas. [Mr. LEWIS.] that we ought to take the unusual step Mr. HALLECK. Mr. Speaker, I decline Mr. LEWIS. Mr. Speaker, I• think in a matter so technical as taxation and, to yield further. it is apparent from the discussion which take it away from the Ways and Means I have heard some of these experts on has been going on in the House dur­ Committee, and I am sure the House money matters make speeches, as I have ing the last few minutes that in the would have felt the same . way about it. heard the gentleman from Mississippi a Rules Committee there was a very strong While I am on my feet I want to express moment ago, and I was trying to remem­ feeling that the gentleman from Ten­ the hope-and I think I express the hope· ber some of the principles of economics nessee [Mr. GoRE] should have oppor­ of a great many Members of the House­ taught me in school. As I remember it, tunity to fully explain his bill. This that the Ways and Means Committee will we were taught one rule that prices vary is an extremely important question. It give early attention to the question of inversely with the quantity of money in is important to every man and woman limitation of profits, whether they do it circulation, assuming that the number of in the United States. We heard in Rules under the theory of the gentleman from transactions remains the same. But Committee a statement by the one whom Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] or some other while I reflect upon that, I am not going the gentleman from Georgia [Mr. Cox] theory. We want to see profits properly tCl get into a discussion with my friend characterized as one of the great elder limited in this national-defense effort. from Mississippi, who knows much more statesmen of the country, a man who If we are going to limit the price of about money than I do, except to say that probably has had more experience in everything, if we are going to take all there are many things that are entering price fixing and similar matters than of these extreme measures, let us get a into this proposition of inflation. It has any ether person now living. I refer to full picture of it, and let us have a limita­ been urged in the past that by revaluing Mr. Bernard Baruch, Chairman of the tion-on-profits measure from the Ways our money we ~ight achieve prosperity War Industries Board in President Wil­ and Means Committee as soon as that overnight. Somehow or other, tha~ did son's administration. He favored the committee can work out a plan. not work out. Gore bill. Mr. COLMER. Will the gentleman I am convinced that the impact of the The Gore bill did not have the blessing yield? tremendously increased purchasing of the committee, but I believe I properly Mr. SMITH of Virginia. 1 yield to the power on a decreasing supply of consumer express the opinion of every man on the gentleman from Mississippi. goods is one very vital factor in the whole Rules Committee when I say that we Mr. COLMER. Will the gentleman picture of dangerous inflation. If democ­ hope-yes, indeed-we hope that the not go further and say that it is the racy is ·to function, if free representative gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] consensus of opinion of all the members government is to function, then I think it. will be granted full opportunity to pre- of the Rules Committee that it was de- 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-H:OUSE 9067 sirable to leave that in there, but as a The first reading of the bill was dis­ those among Government officials who practical matter it would not work? pensed with. now find themselves ardently supporting Mr. SMITH of Virginia. Yes. There Mr. STEAGALL. Mr. Chairman, be­ price-stabilization action by the Govern­ was no disposition on the part of the fore I begin discussion of this proposal, ment said that we did not know what Rules Committee to get away from that may I say that I am a little surprised at we were doing in 1932 when we said that question. the discussion that has taken place with the Government could and should by Mr. CRAWFORD. Will the gentleman · reference to the procedure under which proper action stabilize the economy of yield? this bill is to be considered? I stated to the Nation. If I had no other reason for Mr. SMITH of Virginia. I yield to the the Rules Committee when the Banking supporting this bill or a similar measure gentleman from Michigan. and Currency Committee appeared be­ designed to accomplish the same purpose, Mr. CRAWFORD. The limitation of fore it to ask for a rule providing for the I should support it with delight, because profits to which the gentleman now re­ consideration of this bill that I was ask­ it recognizes and vindicates the correct­ fers are profits made on defense con­ ing for an open rule and that no member ness of the contention made by those of tracts, are they not? of the Banking and Currency Committee us who sought similar legislation to deal Mr. SMITH of Virginia. Yes. - asked for or expected any other rule to with the horrible deflationary conditions Mr. CRAWFORD. Not the profits be submitted to the House. I do not that existed when that bill was consid­ made on other than wartime operations? think the Banking and Currency Com­ ered before the'House in 1932. Mr. SMITH of Virginia. Whatever the mittee is to be censured, certainly not One reason I support this legislation provision in the Gore bill was; I am not by the Committee on Rules, for asking now is that I am glad to have our Gov­ familiar with it. that this bill be considered under the ernment make a record establishing the Mr. DISNEY. Will the gentleman regular rules of the House and left open precedent and accepting the principle yield? for the consideration of every amend­ that it is the sovereign duty of the Gov­ Mr. SMITH of Virginia. I yield to the ment that could be offered relating to ernment to stabilize values and protect gentleman from Oklahoma. price stabilization. Of course, I have no the people of this country against the Mr. DISNEY. How is it proposed to thought of denying recognition to the wild price fluctuations we have had in consider the Gore bill-section by section, gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] the past, with all the resulting suffering or what is the plan before the House? and others who may desire to speak in brought upon the people of the Nation. Mr. SMITH of Virginia. The Gore bill support of the amendment which he con­ When we attempted that legislation in will be offered as a substitute for the templates offering as a substitute for the 1932 the problem was far different and Steagall bill when the first paragraph is committee bill. far less difficult than the problem we face read. Then it will be open for amend­ I need not say that this bill involves a at this hour. I do not think anybody be­ ment just like an original bill. most important as well as an exceedingly lieves that in the situation now confront­ Mr. BARRY. Will the gentleman yield? difficult question. The Committee on ing us that this bill oi' any one effort on Mr. SMITH of Virginia. I yield to the Banking and Currency spent weeks and the part of the Government can accom­ gentleman from-New York. w~eks in a most painstaking and careful plish the prevention of inflationary tend­ Mr. BARRY. May I point out to the study of this question. We could not in­ encies that are recognized as important gentleman that the only fundamental vite everybody who might have desired at this time. Those who by experience difference between the Gore bill and the -to be heard or who might have thought have peculiar knowledge of this problem Steagall bill is wages, because under sec­ they could be helpful to the committee, advised the Committee on Banking and tion 206, just as soon as this bill is en­ but I think no one will deny that we did Currency that this bill alone would not acted into the law, the Administrator can give ample time for presentation and dis­ be sufficient to accomplish the desired say, ''There is no ceiling necessary except cussion of all the facts and views that results, but that it would take an inte­ for articles I have already placed a ceil- merited consideration in connection with grated program, a program of taxation, . ing on," and then we are right back this measure. of monetary policy, of credit control, all where we started. There are differences of opinion in the combined efforts and influences that Mr. SMITH of Virginia. I am not now this House. There were differences in the Government may exercise in dealing discussing the.merits of the bill. I just the Committee on Banking and Cur­ with this problem, if we are to accom­ want to see that both sides have an op­ rency, and there are still differences plish what is recognized as necessary. portunity to present their respective among the members of the Committee on views, fairly and fully, to the House. Banking and Currency; but this bill, No one expects this bill to safeguard Mr. COLMER. Mr. Speaker, I move though it does not in every respect rep­ the Nation completely against all infta­ the previous question on the adoption of resent the individual judgment of any tonary developments. But if we can ac­ the resolution. single member of the Banking and Cur­ complish a large measure of what is de­ The previous question was ordered. rency Committee, does represent the sired we shall have rendered a great serv­ The SPEAKER. The question is on combined judgment of that committee, ice to the Nation. the resoluyion. and it was reported to the House by a Already the present Price Administra­ The resolution '.vas agreed to. . record vote of 18 to 5. tion has been able by agreement and ne- . gotiation to accomplish safeguards and EXTENSION OF REMARKS Those of us who were in touch with developments in the country following restrictions covering about 30 percent of Mr. DISNEY. Mr. Speaker, I ask unan­ the first World War have very definite the price level represented on the basis imous consent to extend my remarks in views on the subject of inflation. As far of the Bureau of Labor Statistics index. the RECORD. as I know, no one contends that 'we Much more can be accomplished, but not The SPEAKER. Is there objection? should not at this time employ all neces­ the full measure of protection necessary There was no objection. sary and legitimate constitutional powers for the years that lie ahead. PRICE CONTROL of the Government to prevent a repeti­ In ordinary times nobody here would Mr. STEAGALL. Mr. Speaker, I move tion of the unhappy experiences and the favor this legislation or any similar legis­ that the House resolve itself into the great distress, demoralization, and suf­ lation. I know I should not favor any Committee of the Whole House on the fering that came from the reaction that such legislation. ! will go further and say state of the Union for the consideration followed the inflation experienced during that if we could know that conditions of the bill H. R. 5990, to further the na­ the first World War. would remain as they are, that there tional defense and security by rhecking I have always been in favor of price would be no worse developments than we speculative and excessive price rises, stabilization by the exercise of the pow­ have experienced down to this time, I price dislocations, and inflationary tend­ ers of sovereign Government of the should not for a moment regard it as encies, and for other purposes. United States. During the first session necessary to pass legislation like this; The motion was agreed to. of Congress in which I had the honor to but we are only at the beginning of the Accordingly the House resolved itself serve as chairman of the Banking and Nation's program of expenditures; we into the Committee of the Whole House Currency Committee of the House, that have just begun. Only a few billions have on the state ofthe Union for the consid­ committee reported a price-stabilization been spent down to this time, but we are eration of the bill H. R. 5990, with Mr. bill to the House which received the ap­ fast coming into a program that will call COOPER in the chair. proval of the House with only 60 votes for the expenditure of several billion The Clerk read the title of the bill. against it on a record vote. Some of dollars a month, and no one knows how. '9068 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER .24 much before we are through. No one Mr. WHITE. Mr. Chairman, will the with the adoption of that view, but the knows when we are to reach the end. gentleman yield? matter is involved in this legislation, and Therefore, first for the protection of Mr. STEAGALL. I yield. it will be before the House for such the Government in these enormous ex­ Mr. WHITE. The gentleman speaks action as the membership of the House penditures in connection with the en­ of enforcing the provisions of this bill. may see fit to take. Of course, it pre­ largement of our Military Establishment, How large an organization is going to be sents a most difficult and disturbing if we want to make our appropriations as required and how much is it going to problem. Nearly every witness before small as we can, if we want to safeguard cost? the committee advised that no such pro­ the Treasury against unnecessary ex­ Mr. STEAGALL. Which bill is the vision should be in the bill. A very dis­ penditures that would burden our people gentleman referring to, may I inquire? tinguished gentleman whose name has and perplex and disturb the Congress and Heaven only knows what it would cost been mentioned here, the gentleman from the leadership of the Nation, it is highly to administer the other plan. New York, Mr. Baruch-and I sp.eak of desirable that we protect the Treasury of Mr. WHITE. I am speaking of the him with the same admiration that has the United States during this emergency. bill that carries the gentleman's name been expressed-appeared before the Banking and Currency Committee and We are now planning $67,000,000,000 and the one he is speaking on now, H. R. 5990. he advised that there should be an over­ of expenditures. If we permit increases Mr. STEAGALL. I cannot give the all freezing of prices as of a certain date, in prices of 25 percent or 50 percent, we gentleman the figures, but I will say to including wages. We listened to him simply reduce the amount of materials him that one of the reasons underlying with the deepest interest and pleasure. and equipment that can be obtained out the support and a favorable report by the The fact is he almost mesmerized the of that fund proportionately, and we committee of the particular bill reported Committee on Banking and Currency, as shall find ourselves confronted with the is because the committee felt that it he seems to. have done the Committee on necessity of making supplemental appro­ would save enormous expenditures for Rules. priations to make up for the increases in the Government as compared with a Mr. MICHENER. Mr. Chairman, will prices or curtail the purchase program. counterproposal, which contemplates an the gentleman yield? But that is not all. We need to protect over-all ceiling, at least temporarily, on Mr. STEAGALL. Not right now, if the public. We need to protect the con­ everything. you will excuse me. sumers of the country. We need to pro-· Mr. WHITE. The gentleman said four ·But, fortunately, the Committee on teet the salaried man, the wage earner, or five billion dollars would be expended Banking and Currency had more time all those who live on definite incomes, monthly by the Government. If that with him in which to discuss his' pro­ against wild and indefensible inflation- · amount of money is going to be expended posals. We went a little further than ary price levels. Already the tendency monthly-- the Committee on Rules. The fact is is here, and, of course, it grows with in­ Mr. STEAGALL. I do not speak au­ · that the Committee on Rules conducted creasing velocity as time runs along. thoritatively about what this program is an ex parte hearing on the question of A great deal is being said in this dis­ going to cost. · . the differences in these two bills and, of cussion about wages and profits. We do Mr. WHITE. If any such sum as that course, they were left where I was when not care, of course, to confuse the legis­ is going to be spent by the Government the gentleman from New York got lative procedure by permitting a price monthly, through what channels does the through with his brilliant statement stabilization bill to be turned into a tax gentleman think that money will flow before our committee. measure; but on the matter of profits, I and what will be its destination? Mr. MICHENER. Was not the real think everybody in this House recognizes Mr. STEAGALL. Did the gentleman tro11ble with your committee that you got that it is desirable that the Government say "if we do not control prices"? under the Henderson spell and you have be protected against extortionate costs of Mr. WHITE. I said that the gentle­ not yet come out? construction in connection with the de­ man proposes by this bill to control prices Mr. PEARSON. Mr. Chairman, will fense program. Nobody questions that. and then he states that we will spend the gentleman yield? I do not know just what a full inquiry four or five billion dollars monthly on · Mr. STEAGALL. I yield. and investigation into the ~ituation would our defense program, and if we are to Mr. PEARSON. The gentleman is dis­ develop. I am not sufficiently informed spend four or five billion dollars monthly cussing the question of including in this to say, but I think we are justified in and prices cannot be raised, through bill a ceiling over wages. I have no pre­ the fear that we are not doing all that what channels will this money flow and conceived notions about the question, of -should be done in that connection. I am what will be its destination? course, because I have ·not had a chance not an authority, of course, on any mat­ Mr. STEAGALL. I do not know that to study it, but I would like to ask the ter of military or naval construction or I understand the gentleman's question. gentleman to explain to the House what matters involved in those programs, and Mr. WHITE. Will there be excess the experts advising his committee say I have no desire to criticize anybody or bank reserves or what will happen to about including a ceiling over wages and even undertake to advise what should be that money that is spent monthly if we how they determine that an over-all done. I have come to the conclusion, cannot raise prices and make adjust­ price can be fixed on any commodity if however, that the best program for the ments by price levels? the cost of the wage that goes into it is Government, perhaps, would be that all Mr. STEAGALL. Of course, what be­ not likewise determined. contracts should be negotiated under comes of the money is not affected by Mr. STEAGALL. I shall address my­ rules and plans that will permit the Gov­ price control, but the amount of money self to the point indicated by your ques­ ernment to stand guard at every turn we expend in carrying out your program. tion. I was about to say in conclusion of to examine materials, to inspect the char­ Now there has been something said my reference to the gentleman from New acter of the work, to watch the pay roll, about wages in connection with this leg­ York that when he concluded his general and to see that the Government gets fair islation. That matter was gone over by statement I asked him what date he value for its expenditures. Then, when the Banking and Currency Committee would name as the time at which prices we get through, we should pay the con­ and voted on in committee. Some and everything should be frozen. W1th tractor what is due him, have an end of members favored some provision not to all due respect to the gentleman, he it, and call it a day. That is -the view I supersede the present Government agen­ found himself in about the same kind of have come to in my limited understand­ cies established as the deliberate action difficulty that confronted many of us on ing of that problem. of the Congress in dealing with the labor the Banking and Currency Committee. Certain it is, however, that one way to problem-not a labor bill, not an anti­ He was evidently in difficulty, because he prevent undue or exorbitant prices in strike bill as such, and not to deal exclu­ did not answer. He talked a little while, connectiOJ with the Government's pro­ sively with the matter of wages-but and I ventured to suggest, as defer­ gram is to have a proper, effective price­ some members of the committee did feel entially as I knew how, ·that he had not · stabilization agency of the Government that there should be in connection with yet given us the date. He still did not stand guc.rd for the protection of the this legislation provision for taking wages answer immediately, but in a little time Government in the matter of prices. into consideration in reaching conclu­ he returned to it and said, "I suggest the This would, to some extent at least, con­ sions upon which a ceiling would be 1st day of January 1941." That is what trol the profit situation. established. That matter is here, not ·he advocated. That was the Baruch plan 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9069 for freezing prices. Is there any Member not had such responsibility in connection urging that you not turn Henderson com­ here who would favor that or who would with the various acts passed by Con­ pletely loose with the power you are put­ vote for it? gress fo:r the benefit of labor, but if what ting into his hands. If you do it you will Mr. O'CONNOR. Mr. Chairman, will we have done is justified, we ·should not do something that you will regret the the gentleman yield? either by indirection or in any other way remainder of your life. Mr. STEAGALL. That was the gen­ permit any such increase in prices as Mr. STEAGALL. I can understand the tleman's time for freezing prices? I ven­ would mean a reduction in the minimum gentleman's viewpoint. I have no quar­ ture to say there is not a Member of this wage of the wage earner. rel with him in approaching this legis­ House who would vote for freezing prices Mr. GIFFORD. Was not the gentle­ lation, as I suggested, in a spirit of dis­ as of the 1st day of January 1941 and man amused today when the Rules trust, because it confers unprecedented perpetuating all the injustice that existed Committee, or certain members of it, powers. But let me say to the gentle­ on that date, but I want to say one thing: were speaking in dread of Mr. Hender­ man, who occupies a key position in this It had at least one advantage over the son, not having confidence in him, and House, who is one of the powerful men plan that is now being submitted to Con­ then offering a bill giving him power over here, and properly so-he is my friend gress as the Baruch plan, because this wages? What would he do about wages? and neighbor and represents the same plan does not set any definite date. No Did not the consistency of that argu­ kind of people I do, and he is a great man man knows what the price would be in ment amuse you? Yes; both proposals and I am proud of him-but let me say this bill if it should go into effect. This would put administration in the hands of to my friend there is not anything in bill would provide the lowest price · Mr. Henderson. this bill that will prevent this House or on commodities named any time during Mr. STEAGALL. If you will permit the Senate providing a different kind of the week in which the bill will be ap­ me to say it, I think it is the duty of machinery for the enforcement of the proved. Does anybody know when it will every Member of the Congress to ap­ law and its administration; and the gen­ be approved? Does anybody know what proach legislation of this kind with a tleman, as are only a half dozen other the price level will be when it is ap­ questioning mind, no matte.1 who the Members of this House, is in a position proved? Does anyone know how high or man is who is charged with the admin­ to help perfect this bill and cure the par­ how low anything would be in price when istration of a ·law carrying the vast ticular defect to which he refers, if it be this bill reaches the White House for ap­ powers embodied in this bill. I have no regarded as a defect. Let me say to the proval? Such a plan would invite specu­ quarrel with any Member, so long as he is gentleman that the gentleman from New lation and undoubtedly promote infla­ fair about it, in approaching the legisla­ York, Mr. Baruch, whose leadership we tion because no definite date is named in tion in a spirit of distrust, if you want to are asked to follow, but who does not this counterproposal as the time when call it that. I think that is wise and happen to be a Member of this body, prices should be fixed. proper from a legislative standpoint. and who had only little opportunity to Mr. GIFFORD. Mr. Chairman, will But I am afraid that some of the state­ discuss this bill in an ex parte proceed­ the gentleman yield? He has clinched ments that have been made about Mr. ing before your committee, told our com­ that argument. . Henderson, as well as some of the state­ mittee over and over, as he told the gen­ Mr. STEAGALL. I yield. ments about this bill, have 'Qeen made in tleman's committee in different language, Mr. GIFFORD. I want the gentleman a spirit of partisanship, due to the stress that Mr. Henderson was the man to ad­ to answer the other question. and strain and excitement incident to minister this bill and that it ought to be They said that if a ceiling were put on the troubles our Government has en­ in the hands of one administrator. and prices there would be no argument for countered recently and about which all of the authority not diffused and confused. higher wages, no threat necessary, be­ us feel very keenly, and, of course, about Does the gentleman want to follow Mr. cause there would be no use to ask for which all of us desire to take any proper Baruch on that? them. Is that satisfactory to you? action for the protection of the Govern­ Mr. COX. If the gentleman will yield Mr. CRAWFORD. Mr. Chairman, will ment during this emergency. further; first, I am not insisting that you the gentleman yield? Mr. COX. Will the gentleman yield throw Mr. Henderson on the scrap heap Mr. STEAGALL. In just a moment. further? entirely, that you put him out of the pic­ Let me pursue this. So the gentleman Mr. STEAGALL. I yield. ture entirely. I am not willing that you from New York found himself in the Mr. COX. When fundamentals are ccmpel him to dissociate himself with midst of difficulties just like the rest of involved, as in the instant case, does not this group of "lefters" with which he has us when he came to the matter of writing the gentleman think it is time for some­ surrounded himself; but I am asking that a specific law that a lawyer or a judge body to be partisan, sufficient to repre­ you retain the power in the hands of this could understand or that an agency of sent the public viewpoint? In other Congress to restrain him, and we know the GoverilDlent could administer. But words, will not the gentleman agree with it is his natural impulse to reach out and that was not all. I had some further me that Mr. Henderson is the drag on establish a sort of dictatorship. But cer­ discussion with the gentleman from New your legislation? Is there not fear that tainly you must agree that it is danger­ York when we discussed the suggestion he is tainted with alien ideology? In ous not to set up some sort of a court of of a ceiling on .wages. I could give you a other words, that he belongs to a group review with the power to set aside any blunt interpretation of what he said. I that has been constantly undertaking to arbitrary regulation that he might make. would not want to be unfair. I would be remake America? Now, let us be fair What you have got in the bill is meaning­ glad to have you read it in the record of about that. Is.it not true that Mr. Hen­ less in that regard. the hearings, but when I asked him about derson has pleased, to a certain degree, Mr. STEAGALL. Let me say to the ·that he virtually told us it could not be the people with whom he has been deal­ gentleman that the Committee on Bank­ done. I submit to you that his answer was ing? We are to understand that he has ing and Currency provided in this bill at least very indefinite. All of us recog­ had no real authority in law for doing for the creation of Office of Price Admin­ nize that wages are a considerable and anything, and it has been a sort of a case istrator by act of. Congress and fixed hiS important part of prices. There is no of the fty stepping into my pie? salary and required that he be confirmed question about that. Mr. STEAGALL. If the gentleman by the Senate. Now, this Congress would Mr. GORE. Mr. Chairman, will the will permit me to resume, I think the have control of his pay. I do not think gentleman yield? gentleman has given indisputable evi­ you will have much trouble with an em­ Mr. STEAGALL. In just a moment. dence of the correctness of my interpre­ ployee where you have control of his If you control prices within a. reasonable tation of a moment or two ago about this compensation. At least, that is one ::,ate­ limit, you will take away any very meri­ situation. Let me say to my good friend guard. We require the office to be estab­ torious basis for demands for increases from Georgia, who knows that I admire lished by act or Congress. We require in wages due to increased costs of living. him and love him, if we are to accept the Administrator appointed to be con­ On the other hand, if we permit wild in­ what he says at full value, which I know firmed by the Senate. We set up a plan flationary prices, they may reach a point we can as far as his sincerity goes, he has for an advisory council to sit with him where the result would be to cut down mighty little excuse left for opposing this and to take part in the considerations the real wages of the wagP. earner. If bill. that enter into the establishment of the that is desired, that is another matter Mr. COX. I am not opposing the leg­ price ceilings. As I said before, of course, aud I do not speak of it because I have islation, but I am expressing fear and the bill is open to amendment. But that 9070 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 is only a detail. You spoke of funda- the world that if the Committee on Rules Mr. COX. Yes; I know. mentals. That is not a fundamental. had listened to him as did our committee Mr. STEAGALL. Like my grandfather. That is only one of the details of this they would have received the same fa­ Mr. COX. Will the gentleman yield for problem about which we are troubled. . vorable impressions. In this connection a question? Mr. GIFFORD. Will the gentleman let me say first of all that I have heard Mr. STEAGALL. Wait a minute. Let yield for a moment? rumors floating around this Capitol here me finish. I also said that he came up Mr. STEAGALL. I yield to the gen- a long time and listened to lots of people the hard way out of humble, adverse cir­ tleman from Massachusetts. talk, some of whom did not waste time cumstances and ·fought his way up and Mr. GIFFORD. I want to say that the as is often done. educated himself. I say it would not im­ Committee on Banking and Currency I do not know that I ever saw a man pair his standing with me that he belongs thoroughly explored Mr. Henderson's fit- handle himself more satisfactorily or to the same political party that the gen­ ness and his sanity. with a deeper, broader, or more complete tleman and I do. I repudiate any idea. If you read the records you will find grasp of his subject and of his responsi­ having to do with Mr. Henderson which that no other man, perhaps, had much bilities and his duties. might influence us adversely when we more of a baptism·than he had from us. We listened to him day after day, week are called upon to consider legislation of Am I right? after week-- this kind. In view of what has been Mr. STEAGALL. Quite right. But let Mr. COX. And the gentleman has no said, however, I believe I am justified in me say this-! do not like to have to say fear-- wasting that much time on this particu­ it but it is just true: My feeling about Mr. STEAGALL. We listened to him lar matter. Mr. Henderson, if he is to be the issue discuss this matter in all its ramifi­ Mr. COX. Does the gentleman think in connection with this matter so im- cations. Mr. Henderson is good enough or wise portant to this Nation and the world, my Mr. COX. Does the gentleman feel enough to be entrusted with the unre­ ·attitude toward Mr. Henderson before I he is wise enough-- strained and unlimited power which you knew him was somewhat akin to that of Mr. STEAGALL. Over and over are putting into his hands, and does the · the gentleman from Georgia. Mr. Hen- again-let me finish, I am not quite gentlema·n believe that so strongly that derson is a vigorous, two-fisted, comba- through-and some refetences were made he has no fear as to what may happen? tive, aggressive man. to him that were naturally disturbing Mr. STEAGALL. In the first place, let Mr. COX. He has a dictator complex, because I had great respect for the source. • me say I dissent from the idea that under has he not? Frankly? as I have respect for all the Members of this bill he is given this power without any Mr. STEAGALL .I do not think so. this House. So I asked him some ques- restraint. Mr. COX. Frankly? tions. I did not tell him I was going to Mr. COX. What are the gentleman's Mr. STEAGALL. I do not think so. ask him, I did not call him into my office limitations? Mr. COX. Did not the gentleman say and say: "Here is something I want you Mr. STEAGALL. I will tell you one so before the Rules C<:lmmittee? to explain," or "I want you to talk about limitation. It is the limitation that rests Mr. STEAGALL. Who? this or about that." I asked him about it in the hands of and in the power of the Mr. COX. That he had a dictator Without a word of warning from my com- Chief Executive of this Nation, the Com­ complex? mittee seat, and I invite the attention mander in Chief of our Army and NavY, Mr. STEAGALL. That I did? of the membership of the House to the the man who holds the leadership of the Mr. COX. Yes; did not the gentle- record at that point. He was a soldier civilized forces of mankind throughout man make that statement? in the World War. He served his coun- the world, who has upon his hands Mr. STEAGALL. I do not think I try during the period and is a member the burden growing out of the present . said that. · of the American Legion-that organiza.:. defense program and this emergency, Mr. COX. Well, is not that so? tion of the boys who stood between us and in whom the people of this country Mr. STEAGALL. I will say this, that and the German fire in the first World have entrusted that responsibility. We whatever temperament he has in that di- War. And he belongs to the Methodist have those restraints upon him as well as rection might become a virtue instead of Church. Hi~ daddy was a Methodist the ones written into the law. a vice in discharging the great powers preacher like my granddaddy, and he of­ Mr. COX. What restraints is the gen­ and responsibilities carried in this bill. I fered the records from the cemeteries of tleman imposing upon the man to whom may have s~id something like that, be- his native State to verify what he said he is delegating these unlimited and far- cause I have thought somewhat like that. about where that name was back there reaching powers? · Mr. HOOK. Mr. Chairman, will the through the years for four generations on Mr. STEAGALL. I have just under­ gentleman yield? monuments in those cemeteries; and he taken to ·answer that question. I think I -Mr. STEAGALL. Just a moment. ·Let came up the hard way in a small com­ have done so. At least, I have devoted me say this about Mr. Henderson: I had munity in New Jersey. A thing that does. enough time to that. I think I have cov­ heard some of the rumors and whisper- not discredit him With me, and I know ered it. - ings around this Hall, and Mr. Hender- with many other Members here-and I do Mr. HOOK.· Will the gentleman yield? son had had one little controversy with not mean anything ·partisan by this, but -Mr. STEAGALL. I yield to the gentle­ a Member of one branch of the Congress he belongs to the Democratic Party. man from Michigan. that gave me something of the impres- That does not sadden me in the least. I Mr~. HOOK. I am · just wondering sion that I referred to just now. could say the same thing, too, if he were -whether or not we are having this debate ~ Mr. CO~.- The gentleman is referring a g.ood Republican like my friend over on a -question of personality or principle, to the gentleman from Texas, MARTIN here, the gentleman ·from Massachusetts . -and whether or not the Rules Committee, DIES? • [Mr. GUFORD]. . -as I -:;et the idea here, has gone -oft on the ~- Mr. STEAGALL. No: I am not ·speak.- · Mr. COX.--· Is.the gentleman still talk- 1 ·question ef personality instea-d of p-rin­ ing about that instance, 'alone. If the .tng.. about -Mv. Hender..sen? If he is, -·1 ·Ciple. - I think -we eught to -debate-this gentleman will let me proceed I will yield ' would like to ask one question. Irr,e- · on the matter· of principle and not per­ to him later. so that I had something spective of how great a soldier he may sonalities. have been-- Mr. COX. I can understand the gen­ ·of the impression the gentleman seems Mr. STEAGALL. I would like for the to have. In other words, to be perfectly tleman that personalities are not to be frank about it, I think I was prejudiced gentleman from Georgia to have heard brought into it. I do not blame him. against Mr. Henderson if such you may what I said about his answer to my He has had experience. call it. I think members of my commit- question. Mr. HOOK. The same to you. tee can appreciate what I am saying. Mr. COX. Yes. Mr. NICHOLS. Will the gentleman We discussed these things in executive Mr. STEAGALL. About these little yield? session as well as in open hearings. We whisperings around here and how he Mr. STEAGALL. I yield to the gen­ said what we believed, and I think we answered them. He told us about his tleman. understood one another. But I want to family history and his name. Mr. NICHOLS. A sufficient answer to say to my dear friend that I was forced Mr. COX. We nave all heard that rot. the inquiry of the gentleman from Mich­ to change my mind about Mr. Hender- . Mr. STEAGALL: He is the son of a igan is the fact that the bill is here for son, and r have not the·slightest doubt in · ·Methodist-preacher. · · ·- ·· the consideration of the House With or 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9071 without personalities, as the House no matter what is done, because we are vide for the national defense may go chooses. This should be a sufficient an­ not going to take awa~· the right of labor successfully forward. swer to the gentleman from Michigan, to strike, that unless some kind of price­ Section 1 (b) of the bill provides that insofar as the attitude of the Rules Com­ stabilization legislation passes this Con­ the powers conferred under the bill shall mittee is concerned. gress, before 6 months come around our terminate on June 30, 1943, unless sooner Mr. STEAGALL. I am not finding difficulties growing out of strikes will be terminated by act of Congress or by a fault with the Rules Committee or any­ worse than they have been heretofore. declaration of the President that such body else. I wanted to analyze this bill I do not say this bill will cure the entire powers are no longer necessary in the fully, but I am tired and I have talked situation or remove all our fears in that interest of the national defense and so long that I am going to ask to extend connection, but it will cure some of the security. my remarks, and I shall undertake to trouble. It will remove at least a part of Section 1 (c) of the bill makes the pro­ put an . explanatory statement in the any meritorious basis for a demand for visions of the bill applicable to the United RECORD on the bill, so that it can be read an increase in wages, and to that extent States, its Territories and possessions, the tomorrow morning, thereby saving some we will have accomplished something in District of Columbia, and the Philippine of the time for other members of the connection with strikes. I should like to Islands. cqmmittee. There are a great many say more about the two bills, particularly Section 2 authorizes the Price Ad­ things I would like to talk about, of more about the provisions of this bill, but ministrator, whenever in his jud·gment course. May I say to the gentleman I am not going to ask the indulgence of the prices of one or more commodities from Georgia and my other good friends the House further to do it. have risen or threaten to rise to an extent that I deplore the developments that If there has ever been a time of need inconsistent with the purposes of the bill, have taken place in connection with the for calm, deliberate thinking, when we to establish maximum prices, referred to defense program, about which the gen­ should keep our feet on the ground, when in the bill as ceilings which, in his judg­ tleman is disturbed, and properly ·so. we should restrain impulses that lead us ment, will be generally fair and equitable Mr. COX. Will the gentleman yield? away from the deliberation essential to and will effectuate the purposes of the Mr. STEAGALL. I yield to the gen­ best judgment, that time is now. I com­ bill. Thl ·se are the basic standards set tleman. mend to this House the calm, the poise, forth in the bill to guide the Price Ad­ Mr. COX. In view of the statement and the patience of our great leader, the ministrator in establishing ceilings. In of the gentleman, he would do me a very one upon whose shoulders rest greater addition, the bill provides more specific great favor if he will strike all that I responsibilities in tNs hour than rest guides. In establishing any ceiling the have said from his remarks when he upon any man in all the world. Administrator is directed, so far as is hands them in. I now come to the provisions of the b1ll practicable, to ascertain and give due Mr. STEAGALL. I did not catch the itself. Section 1 states the purposes of consideration to the prices prevailing for gentleman's statement. the bill. This statement of purposes is the commodities included under such Mr. COX. In view of the statement referred to throughout the bill and pro­ ceiling on or about October 1, 1941. Such the gentleman has just made, he will vides a guide for administrative and October 1 prices may have to be adjusted please me v.ery greatly if he will strike judicial interpretation of the statute, and the bill directs the Administrator . from his remarks all that I have said in provides standards for the exercise of the to take account of such relevant factors the way of questions propounded to him powers delegated by the bill, and indi­ as he deems to be of general applicabil­ during his appearance at this time. cates the constitutional grants of power ity, including specifically speculative fluc­ Mr. STEAGALL. We will leave the upon which the bill is based. · tuations, general increases or decreases RECORD as it is, inasmuch as we have The basic purpose of the bill is to pro­ in costs of production and transporta­ taken all the time. Probably some· of mote the national defense and security tion, and general increases or decreases those things need to be said. in the current world crisis. In order to in profits earned by sellers of the com­ I was going to say that I deplore these accomplish this major purpose it ts es­ modities during and subsequent to the developments as much as anybody. · I sential to stabilize prices and rents so as year ended October 1, 1941. would like to see something done. But to preserve the value of the currency; to · Thus, the bill does not provide a uni­ when you go to consider the matter of protect interstate commerce from the­ versal or mathematical formula, but pro­ wages in connection with this legisla­ interference and disturbances which, vides, in effect, that the Administrator tion-and it was considered by the Bank­ would result from inflation; to prevent may take as his point of departure the ing and Currency Committee and by the dissipation of defense appropriations prices which buyers and sellers have those who testified, and it was considered through continually rising prices; to ad­ worked out for themselves-in this case by Mr. Baruch-we come back finally to vance national unity and morale oy the the prices prevailing on or about October the question of the right to strike. I do elimination of hoarding, speculation, and 1, 1941. In determining whether to hold not know anybody here who says that similar practices, and by the protection to that price or to change it the Admin­ we can compel one man to work for of wage earners and persons of relatively istrator will give due consideration to the another in private endeavor. That is fixed and .limited incomes from undue specified factors, among others, and will where the gentleman from New York impafrment of their standard of living; thus reach a price which will be gener­ came to in the discussion of wages. We and to prevent post-emergency deflation ally fair and equitable and will effectuate could not enforce anything we at­ following upon emergency inflation. · the purposes of the act. tempted to do after you reach the point We are now engaged in a tremendous In specifying the factors to be consid­ that the wage earner says, "This com­ effort to provide for the national defense ered by the Administrator the bill goes pensation is not enough to support my by training and arming our. own forces as far as possible to ptovide guides for family, and I claim my right as a free and providing arms for friendly nations. the exercise of his discretion without lim­ American citizen to cease work." It is this armament program which is iting it so rigidly as to prevent effectua­ That is the final problem that comes largely responsible for the increased de­ tion of the basic purposes of the bill. to us. mand and shortage in supply that is Section 2 (a) requires that every reg­ The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from bringing tremendous upward pressure .to ulation or order establishing any ceiling Alabama has consumed 1 hour. bear upon our price structure and threat­ shall be accompanied by a statement of ening us with inflation. Thus the danger the considerations involved in its issu­ Mr. STEAGALL. Mr. Chairman, I ask of inflation is largely a result of our ar­ ance. This statement will afford those unanimous consent to proceed for 5 addi- mament program. On the other hand, subject to a price ceiling an adequate op­ tional minutes. . this same inflation, if not controlled, will portunity to know the basis for its adop­ The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection seriously interfere with our armament tion and to formulate, in the form of to the request of the gentleman from program by dissipating defense appro­ protests, as provided in section 203 to include, in addition cause of strikes. I venture to predict now, order that this entire program to pro- to commodities, articles, products, and 9072 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 materials, services rendered, otherwise sistent with the purposes of the act. This of the rent currently prevailing in such than as an employee, in connection with power to regulate practices which are areas. The State and locality concerned the processing, distribution, storage, in­ equivalent to concealed price increases or are given a period of 60 days within which stallation, repair, or negotiation of pur­ are likely to result in price increases is to accomplish the recommended stabili­ chases or sales, of a commodity, or in necessary if price control is to be effec­ zation or reduction. Opportunity is thus connection with the operation of any tive. given State or local authorities to effectu­ service establishment.- In these instances Section 2 (d) confers authority upon ate rent control by regulation or volun­ the receipt of payment for the rendition the Administrator to regulate or prohibit tary cooperation or other methods. If of the services will constitute the sale of a any speculative or manipulative practices local action proves ineffective within the commodity for a price. or renting or leasing practices, including 60-day period, the administrator is di­ The bill also provides explicitly in sec­ practices relating to recovery of the pos~ rected to establish rent ceilings to ac­ tion 302 (c) that nothing in the act is to session, fn connection with any defense complish effective rent control. be construed to authorize the regulation area housing accommodations which, in Furthermore, the Administrator is di­ of compensation paid by an employer to his judgment, are equivalent to or are rected to consider suggestions and rec­ any of his employees, or the regulation of likely to result in rent increases incon­ ommendations which may be made by rates charged by any common carrier, or sistent with the purposes of the bilL State or local officials-who are concerned other public utility, which are usually Section 2 (e) of the bill authorizes the . with housing. or rental conditions in the subject to ·· adequate control by State or Administrator to buy, store, use, or sell, area. The Administrator, so far asptac­ other Federal agencies. In cases of con­ without competitive bidding, at public or . ticable, will .consider these recommenda­ ftict between State regulation of enter­ private sale, any commodity produced in tions and sugge·stions in designating de­ prise of a non-public-utility character. _ the Unit~d States by marginal or high­ : fense.-rental. areas, in formulating rent and Federal regulation under this bill, cost producers whenever he deems it ceilings, and in selecting persons to ad­ the Federal regulation would, of cour5e, necessary to obtain the production of minister such ceilings locally. prevail. The powers which the bill does such producers in order to effectuate the In establishing rent ceilings for de­ grant to the Administrator are limited in purposes of the bill. This authority is fense-area housing accommodations, the two respects. In the case of agricultural necessary in order to assure to the de­ Administrator is directed to ascertain commodities, the Administrator is given fense program the benefit of high-cost and coil:sider, .so far ·as practicable, the no power to establish ceilings below cer-· ·. production without requiring the . Ad­ rent· prevailing· for the accommodations tain minimum ceilings described below.· ministrator to establish a price ceiling f.or or comparable· accommodations on or Similarly-the pt'lwers of the 'Administrator an entire industry which is entirely un­ about April 1, 1940. This base date was are ·limited in -the case of newspaper and· justified by the average costs of .the. in­ selected· mainly because .there exists ex­ other advertising. Newspapers and ad­ dustry,_ It is contemplated that the. "Sale tensive 1'ent:data gathered by the Census vertising agencies expressed fears to the · of these commodities· by the Administra­ Bureau as of this date. As a practical committee that the powers in the bill on! tor will in many instances be at a price matter; ·however,·beeause this date is so which the committee held hearings might _ lower than the purchase price, if this much farther back· than the October 1 be susceptible of use, or might operate. to ·subsection. is to operate effectively. date provided · for prices, there will not curtail the advertising services rendered Section 2 (f) of the bill limits the au­ · be a similar degree of maintenance of the by newspapers, and thus interfere with thority of the Administrator to exercise level of that date. The date will serve as accepted policy in relation to the press. the powers conferred by section 2 in any a starting point from which to consider Since newspapers are dependent on ad- manner inconsistent with the agricul- the ·current rent level. The Administra­ - vertising, the committee deemed it wise - tural provisions of the bill in section 3. tor is also directed to consider such in­ also to limit the powers of the Adminis­ Section 2 (g) limits the authority of creases or decreases in property taxes trator with respect to such normal busi­ the Administrator to compel changes in and other costs occurring during and ness practices of newspapers and others~ established business practices or cost subsequent to the year ending on April 1, Section 2 (c) of the bill provides for · practices, means, or aids to distribution­ 1940, as are of general applicability with flexibility in the establishment of ceilings such as advertising-in any industry, respect · to housing accommodations and authorizes classifications, differenti­ except to the extent that such action is within the defense-rental area involved. ations, and adjustments which, in the necessary· to prevent evasion or circum­ The Administrator may- alse consider judgment of the Administrator, are nec­ vention of any ceiling under the bill. other relevant factors of general appli­ essary or proper to effectuate the pur­ Section 2 (h) gives authority to the cability, one of which might properly be poses of the bill. Administrator to include in regulations changes in the amount and rate of va­ It is ·impossible to specify. all the dif­ . or orders issued under section 2, such cancies during the period since April 1, ferent methods-which may have to be em­ provisions as he deems necessary to pre­ 1940. ployed in establishing price ceilings for vent circumvention or evasion of such In furtherance of effective administra.. particular commodities. Under the deft-. regulations or orders. tion and to prevent -the intimidation of nition of "ceiling" in section 302 (g), Section 2 . in connection with the ob­ section requires the Administrator, at the Section 203 assures persons of the taining of information necessary in the request of any substantial portion of the right to object to regulations governing performance of his duties under the bill. industry subject to the ceiling, to ap­ them and to have their objections consid­ - Section 4 (b) protects tenants in the point an industry advisory committee or ered. Even when the number of persons assertion of the rights conferred upon committees. The committee may be na­ concerned makes individual oral hearings them by the bill by making it unlawful .tional, or regional, or both, but is to be ·on protest impossible, the right to :file for any person to remove from any de­ truly representative of the industry or of written protests makes certain that the fense area housing accommodations, the the industry in a particular region, as administrator will be informed of the _tenant, or occup~nt, or to refuse to renew the case may be. The committee is to ·economic situation and will reconsider the lease or rental agreement because of select a chairman from among its mem­ and change regulations which require action taken by the tenant in asserting bers and may meet at the call of the modification. such rights. chairman. The Administrator, from Protection is also afforded by section time to time, is to advise and consult · In the administration of the provisions 4 (c) to those persons required to disclose with the committee, at its request, with of the bill and in making any decision on information to the Administrator by regard to ceilings established for such in­ any _protest the Administrator is author­ making it unlawful for any officer or em­ dustry. The committee may make such ized under section 203 (b) to take official ployee of the Government, or any ad­ recommendations to the Administrator ! notice of economic and other facts, in­ viser or consultant to the Administrator as it deems advisable. cluding facts found by him as a result of in his official capacity, to disclose or to action taken under section 202. Hearings OBTAINING INFORMATION on any protest may be held if the Admin­ use for his personal benefit any informa­ Section 202 provides the Adminis- i tion obtained under the bill. Further istrator so directs, but, under this sub· trator with the information gathering 1 section, any proceeding under the act provision for confidential treatment of powers necessary both for collection of such information is found in section may be limited to the filing of affidavits, 202 (b). the economic data on which intelligent .. or other written evidence, and the :filing judgments may be formulated as to , of briefs. Section 4 (d) speci:fica1ly preserves the proper ceiling and other regulations, and right of persons to refuse to sell any Section 204 provides for the judicial for the enforcement of such regulations. : rev1ew of the regulations and orders is­ commodity or to offer any accommoda­ - The procedure governing the prepara- · tions for rent. sued by the Administrator under section tion and issuance of substantive regula­ ·2 of the act. In keeping with the emer­ The penalty for violation of any of the tions and orders prescribing ceilings or provisions o~ this section or for making 1 gency character of miCh regulations and any false statement in any document re­ regulating practices has necessarily been . orders and to expedite determination of -quired to be kept or :filed under the pro­ adapted to the nature of the powers the validity of such reg_ulations or orders visions of any regulation, order, or re­ ·granted, which involves a broad delega­ without overburdening the regular courts qu_irement issued under the provisions of , -tion of legislative power' to the fact that : . and judges, exclusive jurisdiction to con- the bill is prescribed in section 205 (b). · such regulations will apply to large num­ ·sider and determine the validity of any -bers of persons, and to practical consid- Section 201 (a) of the bill creates and such regulation or order is vested in an erations, such as the necessity for im­ emergency court of appeals, created un­ vests the administration of the bill in an . mediate action to check rapidly rising : Office of Price Control headed by an Ad- · der section 204 (c) of 'the bill, and upon prices and the importance .of avoiding , review of judgments or orders of such ministrator who is to be appointed by tlie speculative disturbances of the market President and confirmed by the Senate. , emergency court, in th~ Supreme Court pending the determination of a price of the United States. Under section 204 The Administrator 1s to receive a salary of ceiling. These considerations may fre­ (c), the emergency court of appeals is to $10,000 per annum. quently render the holding of formal be composed of three or more judges to . Section 201 (b) authorizes the Admin- ; hearings inadvisable. be designated by the Chief Justice of the istrator to hire such employees, establish An opportunity for interested parties United States from judges of the United and utilize regional, local, or other to participate in the formulation of regu­ States district courts and circuit courts agencies: -and to accept such voluntary lations and orders and to voice any ob­ -of appeal, one of whom he is to designate and uncompensated services as he deems : .jections thereto is a:fl'orded, however, as chief judge of the emergency court of n'ecessary; ~nd he may carry out his funo­ through the medium of the Industry Ad­ appeals. Additional judges may be des· tions through such employees and agen­ visory Committees provided in section 201 ignated from time to time by the Chief cies, by delegating any of the powers given ·of the bill, and in such other manner as ·Justice. The chief judge of the emer­ him in the bill. the administrator may de~m feasible. gency court may, from time to time, di- All employees are to be employed pur- . Section 203 affords persons subject . vide the court into divisions of three or suant to the civil-service laws and com- to any provision of a regulation or order more members and any such division may 9074 CONGRESSIONAL ·RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 render judgment as the judgment of the tion for a writ of certiorari may be filed arising under the act, other than those in court. By authorizing the emergency in the Supreme Court of the United the Emergency Court of Appeals. All court to sit in divisions, it is contemplated States, and thereupon such judgment or criminal prosecutions are to be brought that protestants will be able to secure a order is subject to review by the Supreme in the district courts ')f the United States, hearing before the court at or near tpeir Court in the same manner as a judgment while civil proceedings under the statute residence or place of business. of a circUit court of appeals. The effec­ may be brought in either the Federal dis­ The emergency court of appeals is tiveness of a judgment of thP. Emergency trict courts or in State or Territorial given exclusive jurisdiction to affirm or Court of Appeals setting aside in whole courts. Criminal proceedings may be set aside, in whole or in part, any regu­ or in part any regulation or order of the brought only in the district in which any lation or order under section 2 or to re­ Administrator under section 2 is post­ act or transaction constituting a viola­ mand the proceedings, and all the powers poned until the expiJ;-ation 01 the 30-day tion occurred. Civil proceedings may be of a district court are conferred upon period allowed for the filing of such peti­ brought in the district in which any act the court with respect to this jurisdiction, tion, or, if such petition is filed, until an or transaction constituting a violation oc­ except the power to stay the effectiveness order of the Supreme Court denying such curred or in the district in which the of any regulation or order establishing petition becomes final, or until other final defendant resides or transacts business. a ceiling. disposition of the case by the Supreme No costs are to be assessed against the In order to expedite the determination Court. This latter provision insures that Administrator or the Govern,ment. of cases before the e1nergency court of a ceiling or other regulation or orue·· of Subsection (d) of section 205 provides appeals the court is given power to adop't the Administrator under section 2 will that no person shall be held liable for special rules of · procedure in matters remain in effect during thE period of damages or for penalties for anything coming before it. The court is, there­ judicial review until final dtcision. done or omitted to be done in good faith fore, to have a seal, hold sessions at such In order to assure that t.here will be pursuant to any provision of the act or . places as it may specify and appoint a the speediest possible final determination any regulation, order, or requirement clerk and such other employees as it of the validity of regulations or orders of thereunder' or under any regulation or dsems necessary. the Administrator issued under section 2, order of the Administrator of the Office Any protestant subject tc- the prohibi­ section 204 (4) also provides that the of Price Administration or of the Ad­ tions of a regulation or order issued un­ Supreme Court shall expedite disposition ministrator of the Office of Price Admin­ der section 2 and who is aggrieved by the of all cases filed thereunder. istration and Civilian Supply, irrespective denial or partial denial of his protest, may Exclusive jurisdiction is granted to the of whether or not such provision, regu­ file a complaint in the emErgency court Emergency Court of Appeals-and on re­ lation, order, or reqUirement may subse­ of appeals, specifying his objections and view of judgments or orders of the Emer­ quently have been modified, rescinded, or praying that the regulation or order pro­ gency Court of Appeals to the Supreme held invalid. In order to protect the pub­ tested be set aside in whole or in part. A Court of the United States-to deter­ lic interest in all litigation affecting the copy of the complaint must then be mine the validity of regulations and price-control program, this subsection served on the Administrator, who is to orders under section 2 and the .vaiidity also provides that the Administrator may certify and file with the court a transcript of the provisions of the bill authorizing intervene in any suit or action wherein a of the proceedings-including the hear­ such regulations and orders. Accordingly party relies for ground of relief or defense ing, if any, affidavits, statements in sup­ ·section 204 (d) expressly provides that upon the act or any regulation; order, or port of the regulation; briefs, and other except as provided in this section no reauirement thereunder. .evidence-in connection with his consid­ court, Federal, State, t-r Territorial, is Section 206 makes unenforceable cer­ .eration of the protest. The transcript to have jurisdiction or power to consider tain contracts and contract provisions will also contain a statement of the eco- such validity, or to stay, restrain, enjoin, inconsistent with, or conflicting with, or nomic and other facts of, which the Ad­ or set aside, in whole or in 11art, any such providing means of evasion of, price ceil­ ·ministrator has taken official notice. provision, or any provision of any such ·ings established under the provisions of In making its decision the court may regulation or order, or to restrain or the bill or established by the Administra­ consider only objections set forth in the enjoin the enforcement of any such pro- tor of the Office of Price Administration . protest and evidence contained in the vision. and Civilian Supply . transcript. However, upon application ENFORCEMENT Section 301 requires the Administrator made 'to it by either party for leave to Section 205 provides two different to file a quarterly report of operations ·introduce additional evidence which was . means of enforcement, in order that under the act. In this way the Congress either offered to the Administrator and sanctions appropriate ·to the nature of and the public can be kept fully and cur­ not admitted, or which could not reason­ any specific violation may be applied in rently informect of the course and suc­ ably have been offered to the Adminis- the interests of effective enforcement. cess of the price-control program. :trator, the court must, if it deems such · Subsection (a) of section 205 enables The important definitions have already evidence material, order such evidence to the Administrator, whenever in his judg­ been referred to in the analysis of the be received by the Administrator. There­ ment any person either has violated or is major substantive provisions of the bill. upon the Ad~nistrator. must promptly about to violate section 4-which con- . MISCELLANEOUS receive such additional evidence and cer­ tains all the prohibitions-to apply to an · Section 303 contains the usual separa­ tify and file with the court a transcript appropriate court for an order enjoining bility clause, section 304 provides an au­ thereof and any modification made in .such violations or an order enforcing -thorization for appropriations, and sec­ the regulation or order as a result there­ compliance. Subsection (c) gives the tion 305 contains the short title: The .of. On the request of the Administrator, -district courts, concurrently with the ·Emergency Price Control Act of 1941. however, such additional evidence may -State and Territorial courts, jurisdiction 'Mr. WOLCOTT. Mr. Chairman, I be presented directly to the court. of all proceedings under this subsection. yield myself 20 minutes. Section 204 (b) prescribes the stand­ Subsection (b) of section 205 provides Mr. Chairman, finally we have brought ards to be followed by the emergency criminal penalties for the willful viola­ out for consideration a bill intended to court of appeals in determining the tion of any provision of section 4 and help control inflation. I am not sur­ validity of regulations or orders issued for the willful making of a statement or .prised that there should be so much con­ under section 2. It provides that such entry false in any material respect in fusion in the Committee on Rules, in the regulations or orders may be set aside any document or report required to be House, and in the committee thus far in only if the complainant establishes to kept under authority_ of the statute. respect to this bill. It has a very definite the satisfaction of the court that the Whenever the Administrator believes purpose. regulation or order is not in accordance that any person is liable to punishment The Committee on Banking and Cur­ with law, or is arbitrary or capricious. under this subsection, he may certify the rency have, as you know, had no end of These standards are the traditional facts to the Attorney General, who may, trouble in creating a framework upon :standards for the judicial review of in his discretion, initiate appropriate which they expect you, the Committee of legislation and legislative regulations. proceedings. the Whole, to build a suitable and ade­ Within 30 days after entry of a judg­ Subsection (c) of section 205 makes ap­ quate structure. I say this because I do -ment or order, interlocutory or final, by propriate provisions for jurisdiction, not know of any two members of the the Emergency Court of Appeals, a peti- venue, and service of process in suits committee who at the present moment 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9075 agree on all features of this bill. It is this bill as potentially destructive of the Now, if an · outstanding radio com­ hoped that the House will listen as toler­ American way of life as the bill which mentator, as brilliant a man as this par­ antly to the debate as the committee lis­ had been introduced would have been if ticular one is, and, as I say, he is my tened with tolerance if not compl'ete un­ we had yielded to the pressure for ex­ favorite, will make that kind of mistake, derstanding during the 4 months of peditious action, minus judgment, and it is only natural to expect a great deal of hearings. reported out to you the bill to which . I confusion in the mind of the average in­ If we did nothing more than to crystal­ have referred? dividual in respect of this particular bill lize tqe necessity for some price-control Up to this morning there was not a or any other measure. Perhaps it is not legislation, our efforts were perhaps not political vote cast in the committee. The· anything but what we might expect to altogether in vain. It was with this Committee on Banking and Currency as find in the minds of all Members of the thought that many of us voted to report a rule is rather a partisan committee. Congress. If I may, in the time which is this present bill out of the Committee on Frequently we divide along partisan lines. allotted to me, clear up or help to clear up Banking and Currency, with the hope In the consideration of this particular bill, some of this confusion, I will feel the time that with this as a foundation, and per­ however, during the months we had it I have spent down here in the Well of the haps as a· gUide, this legislation might be before us, there was probably as little House is pretty well spent. perfected iii several particulars so as to partisanship shown as on any bill which This presents the most important sub­ accomplish its apparent purpose. In its has ever been considered by any legisla­ ject which in my opinion has been pre­ present form it will accomplish its pur­ tive committee of Congress. I believe the sented to this Congress for the last 8 pose only too well. committee should be complimented upon years. All of the other questions, eco­ · We have before us two very funda­ its ability to report out any bill under nomic questions, social questions, which mental questions. I wish that the com­ those circumstances. have been presented to us for considera­ mittee throughout the debate and the The majority of the committee felt the tion and enactment, have been relatively reading of the bill will have at least the need for price control and were willing to inconsequential and unimportant as com­ first of these constantly in mind. subordinate their own thoughts, their pared with this particular bill. The first question was whether the ad­ own theories, their own philosophies on Mr. PATMAN. Mr. Chairman, will the ministration is as much concerned with this question, in the hope that the Com­ gentleman yield for a question? control of prices as with the control of mittee of the Whole and the House col­ Mr. WOLCOTT. I would prefer not, business and industry. That in itself, lectively might do fully as good a job, at but I will gladly yield to the gentleman. you will agree, was qUite a problem. least, as they had done in getting together Mr. PATMAN. Does not the gentle­ The committee were in accord that the even on the reporting out of some bill. man believe that the bill relating to pri­ bill as introduced perhaps indicated that orities and allocations is of equal impor­ too much power would have been dele­ This bill is peculiarly obnoxious in sev­ tance with this bill? gated, if we have the power to delegate eral particulars. Before I go any further~ Mr. WOLCOTT. I will get to that and it, to the administrative branch of the in order that there may not be any ques­ I will cover it later on. Government. The bill as introduced em­ tion in anybody's mind as to where I per­ Because this is the third element in a barrassed the committee in its orderly sonally stand on it, if my personal opinion control picture which grants the power consideration of price-control legislation. L worth anything, may I say that I shall to socialize America. Now, public senti­ We could have done, I believe, a much oppose the bill with all the strength which ment can, and does to some extent, in­ better job had we had before us only the I have unless several safeguards are writ­ fluence priorities and allocations, but President's message urging price control. ten into the bill which do not now exist in priorities, allocations, and price control The bill which was sent down to us to it, safeguards to protect the American taken collectively contain the adminis­ consider was so far-reaching as to place people against the creation of an eco­ trative power actually to control the eco­ the economic destiny of every individual nomic and social czar. That presents a nomic and social destiny of all of our in the United States under the domi­ fundamental question. pgople. And I might say parenthetically nance and control of the President, be­ At the present time there is no restric­ in that respect something that has been cause he was the only administrator tion, there is J,ittle or no limitation on the on my mind a long time. Did it ever mentioned in the bill. It would have power of the Administrator when he is occur to you that the Congress of the authorized the licensing of not only once appointed to control business and United States is the most impotent today every business but every business trans­ indilstry and control agriculture within it ever has been in the history of this action which dealt with any commodity the limitations of existing law and the Nation? What is there .for us to legis­ over which a price ceiling had been new formulas written into the bill by the late upon except to give the President placed. committee. more power? Who dares to suggest that The bill did and it still does authorize · The action of the committee this morn­ any of the powers which are creating the such far-reaching snooping on the part ing indicates that perhaps there was some conditions which make necessary price­ of the Administration as to compel those justification for the fear of many of us control legislation will be amended? industries and businesses involved to di­ that the administration was more con­ What chance would any of the Members vert their attention from production to cerned with control of business than it on our side or those Members on the gathering information for the Adminis­ was with control of prices as an adjunct Democratic side who believe as I do have trator. to any activity in preventing inflationary with any bill which they might introduce In several other instances the bill was rises and inflation. The committee met at the present time to recoup any of the objectionable from the standpoint of this morning and agreed to undo what powers, no matter how remote they might delegation of such power to the Admin­ they had done in committee a couple of be from our defense program? istration that we would virtually have weeks ago and to write back into the Do you want to control inflation? That created an economic and social czar. bill the provisions which authorize the is what you have this bill before you I believe under those circumstances, administrator to license all business here for. Do you sincerely, honestly, having in mind that it was thought ad­ which has to do with the sale and dis­ want to grant the authority to control visable to perpetuate the American form tribution of any article upon which a inflation? Then may I suggest that if of Government, it is a good thing the ceiling has been put. you do, you must recoup much of the Committee on Banking and Currency did Now, there is more misunderstanding, power you have already delegated to the take a great deal of time in the consid­ perhaps, in respect of that than there is Chief Executive; and, my friends, you eration of this bill. After all, it was the in respect of the other features of the have not the parliamentary courage to committee members who were individ­ bill. I listened to my favorite radio com­ do it. ually inconvenienced as well as the gen­ mentator the other night, and he said W auld you vote to relieve tpe pressure eral public, who . were perhaps suffering that the administration was very anxious on prices by removing the causes of ex­ from price increases while we were delib­ to have the licensing provisions of this treme1y large and unjustified excess re­ erating, but we must first ask ourselves bill written back in and he made the serves in the banks? Would you vote this question: statement, apparently on his own respon­ to take from the President the power Were the price increases during the sibility, that without the licensing pro­ to devalue the gold content of the dollar? time in which the Committee on Bank­ vision in this bill there was no way to You did not within the last 5 months, ing and Currency were functioning on enforce these ceilings. and yet at that time there was the same 9076 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 threat of inflation that· exists at the bonds as security for the Federal Reserve trying to do so. No matter how much present moment. Will you vote to re­ notes; but he would then have the discre­ confidence he has in himself, we should move this constant threat of inflation tion and· the responsibility of not using protect him against any effort which will incident to the monetization of silver? any more gold or silver or any more Gov­ inevitably lead to the socialization of You did not do it when the matter was ernment bonds than are actually neces­ America and perhaps the ruination of our presented to you. sary to meet our monetary and credit entire national economy. Mr. WHITE. Mr. Chairman, will the needs. · This bill goes much further than sa..y­ gentleman yield? You know we stopped an inflation in ing that we shall not sell pins or bians Mr. WOLCOTT. I am sorry, I cannot. 1937. The administration stopped an over and above a certain price. It car­ Mr. WHITE. Mr. Chairman-- . inflation in October 1937. Did you ever ries with it as it is now written control Mr. HINSHAW. Regular order, Mr. give that any consideration? We over the economic and social destinies of Chairman. · stopped it through orthodox methods, all of our people. And there is no re­ The CHAIRMAN (Mr. BULWINKLE). the same kind of methods I am suggest­ view. I want you to listen to this very The gentleman declines to yield. ing now be used to syphon off pressure attentively. I would like the gentleman Mr. WOLCOTT. The monetization of against prices. Why am I talking this from Texas, chairman of the Committee silver is one of the most important fac­ way? Because it is generally agreed by on the Judiciary, to listen to this state­ tors in inflation we ever had before us, all of the economists, by Mr. Henderson ment and then read the bill with it in and we had it before us within the last himself in his statements in the hearings, mind. · There is no review in tllis bill 4 months and you refused to stop the that price control alone will not stop in­ of any equality or injustice incident to monetization of silver. flation, and unless we have adequate the placing of a ·price ceiling. The CHAIRMAN. The time of the credit control to implement price con­ Mr. WALTER. Mr. Chairman, will gentleman from Michigan has expired. trol we will still have inflation. So all the gentleman _yield? Mr. WOLCOTT. Mr. Chairman, I the talk about this being a panacea, a Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield. yield myself 20 minutes more. Another cure-all for inflation is belied by the state­ Mr. WALTER. May I point out one element of inflation, which is perhaps as ments of those in whom I have a great thing further: While under the bill a inflationary as devaluation of the gold :deal of confidence. court is set up for the purpose of hear­ ccntent of the dollar, or monetization of Mr. CRAWFORD. Mr. Chairman, will ing an appeal, the scope of the review is silver, is the use of direct obligations of the gentleman yield? · so limited that the appeal means noth­ the Federal Government as security for· Mr. WOLCO'IT. Yes. ing. The appeal can be from a decision Federal Reserve notes. Would you, if you Mr. CRAWFORD. I think the record which is not in accordance with the were given an opportunity to do so, vote should also show that while in 1936...,37 law. today to take from the Federal Reserve :the administration by proper method did Mr. WOLCOTT. Arbitrary or capri­ the power to use direct obligations of the arrest inflation, that the price level at cious. Federal Government to secure Federal the present time is not as high as it was Mr. WALTER. And under the Con­ Reserve notes?-and there is no closer af­ ·at that time. I think the record will also solidated-Edison case that means that if filiation between any two subjects than show in the hearings that the Secretary there is any evidence at all, more than a there is between inflation and the na­ of the Treasury, Mr. Morgenthau, the mere scintilla, the court cannot dist:urb tional debt. Three months ago you had Chairman of the Board of Governors of the decision of the Administrator. an opportunity to· stop inflation, or at­ ·the Federal Reserve, Mr. Eccles, Mr. Hen­ Mr. WOLCO'IT. I am glad for the tempt to stop inflation, by removing the derson, and Mr. Baruch were all given gentleman's contribution. I was going causes for the excess reserves in banks the opportunity to recommend to the to comment upon the fact that if the today which are a constant pressure committee that such orthodox steps be emergency court of appeals or the Su­ a.gainst any ceiling which you will put on taken, and all declined to do so and pre­ preme Court, after it has passed the any prices. Has anything been done ferred to go on with this licensing and gantlet of the emergency court of ap­ a"l:.lout it? I have said, and I have said re­ business control. peals, finds that there was authorization peatedly, that if the leaders of this House Mr. WOLCOTT. They all agreed that for placing a ceiling, they have to affirm or this administration would bring in a that was absolutely necessary in order to the judgment of the Administrator in bill to remove the causes of inflation, control inflation. that respect. There is not any question _then I am sure that 80 percent of the Mr. CRAWFORD. And I think the of the court's finding substantial evi_. Members of the House would be glad to gentleman will recall that the Federal derice. The substantial-evidence rule vote for the bill at this particular time; Reserve made certain recommendations does not apply, because the law says that but no, because with gold inflation goes aiong the line the gentleman suggested unless the court finds it was not in ac­ power, and with the monetization of ·at that time -and the Treasury and the cordance with the iaw or arbitrary or silver goes power, and with all of these Federal Reserve officials were in violent capricious, all of which mean the same other things goes power, and the Presi­ disagreement. thing, it cannot disturb the ceiling. Do dent is not willing to relinquish any of Mr. WOLCOTT. In January 1940 and you wonder why some of us have insisted this power. If he is willing to go along, in 1941 the Federal Reserve Board made that we go to some extreme in the con­ he will find lt cooperative Congress. definite recommendation that certain sideration of such· far-reaching legisla­ What can we do to save the President's steps must be taken to stop inflation. tion as that? How could we cure that? face if he does not want to give up these Unfortunately the recommendations How can we cure it? Very simply, I be­ powers? have not been followed or, so far as I lieve. By the establishment of a price­ A suggestion which is not germane to know, no consideration has been given control administration with an adminis­ the bill, according to parliamentary in­ to them by the proponents of price-con­ trator named by the President and con­ terpretation, but which would have been trol legislation. firmed by the Senate, with an adminis­ german~ to the bill had it been written in Now, I have said that I would oppose trative board of review, made up of any by the committee, was pffered by me in any measure which created an economic number of people that we want to sug­ committee and defeated, indicating that czar. That can be cured. I did not hesi­ gest-! suggest five-to which expedi­ · the committee itself is willing to go along tate to vote to report this bill out, because tious appeals may be made, _with the with the administratiop in the perpetu­ I felt the committee would be fair to all authority to amend, modify, or com­ ation of those powers that he has instead of us who will make suggestions to per­ pletely set aside the ceilings in case this of writing an anti-inflation bill. I of­ fect this measure. What is wrong with board finds them to be inequitable or fered a simple resolution in the com­ splitting up this power a little? Why injurious to the operation of any par­ mittee to stabilize gold and silver and should it not be distributed? In that ticular business. Unlike the emergency Government bonds as currency and respect I hold no brief for Mr. Hender­ court of appeals which cannot do any­ credit basis. That would have saved his son, but I do not believe there is a thing but say whether or not the fixing face. He would still have the power to single individual in. the United States of the ceiling is in accordance with the buy and to devalue and to monetize, and with the physical and mental capacity to law, this board of review can subdivide he would still have the power to issue all control the economic and social destiny itself into as many committees as it sees of the Government bonds he wants to of 132,000,000 people, and we should hesi­ fit, and under an amendment which I sell and the power to use the Government tate to create the spectacle of any man will offer, can employ masters and com- 1941 CONGRESSIONAL· RECORD-HOUSE . 9077 missioners and lawyers and any other they may seek throughout the length and Mr. WOLCOTT. I would not want to personnel which is necessary to effec­ breadth of this land, they can find say it was because of that alone, but most tuate the purpose of the amendment; to enough people merely to issue the li­ of the pressure for price-control legisla­ sit in any place in the United States censes? tion has been by those who have com­ where it wants to sit and hear these Mr. WOLCOTT. I do not kno.w, be­ mented upon the rise in agricultural questions; with authority to act, so that cause they say in the amendment here prices. an aggrieved person in or that upon. a violation or reported viola­ Mr. AUGUST H. ANDRESEN. The down in Texas or anywhere else in the tion they shall have a hearing. If the gentleman would say, then, that would 'Q'nited States, in order to effectually Administrator finds there has been a vi­ be the primary reason for this type of have the question decided whether the olation, then he can follow through and legislation? · administrator had the right to set a ceil­ take the ·license away. I would rather Mr. WOLCOTT. Up to the present ing, need not come to Washington, or have a decree of court determining that moment I would say yes, with the excep­ wherever this emergency court of ap­ question upon an order to show cause tion that if we continue our spending peals happens to be sitting at that time, why an injunction should not issue than program all prices may rise wholly out to have his case heard. I would on a partial, ex parte hearing of proportion to the rise in agricultural Now, this has two purposes and objec­ before the fellow who sets the ceiling in prices. tives. The administrative board of re­ the first place. . Mr. AUGUST H. ANDRESEN. The view, with authority to amend or modify Mr. WOODRUFF of Michigan. I am gentleman knows that we have an or set aside a price ceiling Will first make wondering if the gentleman got the full abundance of most of the agricultural the Administrator a little more cautious purport of my question. products, both in food and fiber; in fact, before he sets a ceiling, and it will invite Mr. WOLCOTI'. Yes; I did. in most lines we have a 2-year supply. correction of the mistakes which he Mr. WOODRUFF of Michigan. I had The farmer is not getting any tre­ might make. It is democratic and not reference, of course, to the difficulty mendous share of this increased cost to dictatorial. It is a republican democracy which would be. experienced in finding a consumers. It seems to me the increase functioning as it was intended to func­ sufficient number of people simply to is­ is going mostly to those who handle it tion, instead of democracy functioning sue the licenses to every little store in this after it gets out of the farmer's hands. as a dictatorship. · country. Mr. WOLCOTT. Now, if I may com­ I do not know that I followed up the Mr. WOLCOTI'. We can conjecture, ment bnefly on that question-- thought that I expressed a while ago if the gentleman please, that it will take Mr. PATMAN. Mr. Chairman, will the that there was much confusion with re­ thousands of them based upon the num­ gentleman yield on that line? spect to the enforcement features of this ber of people it takes at the present time Mr. WOLCOTI'. In just a moment, if law and that licensing is not to be es­ to supervise even the sales tax in those the gentleman will permit. sential to the enforcement of the ceilings. States which have sales taxes. · What is inflation? I shall place a defi­ I called attention to the fact that this Mr. WOODRUFF of Michigan. That is nition of inflation ~n the RECORD at this outstanding radio commentator made an the point I had in mind. time. The gentleman from Minnesota incorrect statement in that respect, un­ Mr. WOLCOTT. That would be mul­ says there are ample food and fiber stocks doubtedly because of the confusion in his tiplied a hundred times. in the United States to meet any reason­ mind. There are enforcement provisions Mr. PATMAN. Mr. Chairman, will the able demand. We might therefore ex­ in this law other than licensing. Now, gentleman yield for a question on that pect if that is the case-and it is the what are they? If you violate any of part of the discussion? case-Congress might therefore expect these ceilings you would firid out what Mr. WOLCOTI'. if the gentleman that there is not any justified rise in they were. You could be· fined $5,000 or will permit, I will yield later. prices of agricultural commodities. The sent to the Federal penitentiary for 2 Mr. AUGUST H. ANDRESEN. Mr. following is the best definition of infla­ years. The Administrator also could go Chairman, will the gentleman yield? tion which I have been able to find: into the district court in the locality in Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield. Inflation Is defined as an Increase in pur­ which the violator lives and get an order Mr. AUGUST H. ANDRESEN. For chasing power at a. faster rate than the pro­ to show cause why an injunction should duction of goods. Inflation results from a several months in the name of national too-rapid expansion of circulating media of not issue restraining him from proceed­ defense Mr. Henderson, under an Execu­ ing to do business in violation of the exchange, currency, or credit in proportion to tive order, has been fixing prices on the needs and services being produced for sale order or regulation established by the hides, wool, steel, copper, and many other and consumption. Administrator. Now, what more sanction things. If the President already has the have you to almost any law which we authority to fix prices and ceilings on It follows that anything which nar­ set up here? Is it necessary for the prices, why the need for this legislat· on rows the differential between available Administrator to enforce this law, to li­ at the present time? purchasing power and available con­ cense every little four-corner store to sumer goods will retard inflation. If it Mr. WOLCOTT. He has not the au­ were not for priorities and allocations we sell every article which it might have on thority to fix ceilings on prices on any the shelves? commodities. ' . would be able to expand the production That is what is contemplated in the of our stocks of nondefense materials for licensing provision, Mr. Chairman, not Mr. AUGUST H. ANDRESEN. They which there is a demand to effectuate the a license for a store to do a dry-goods have been doing it. purpose of this act just as effectively as business, but for every dry-goods store Mr. WOLCOTT. They have been do­ we attempt· to decrease purchasing to sell pins, needles, a spool of thread or ing it, and they have been doing it effec­ power by putting a ceiling on income and a yard of cloth, if a ceiling had been tively because there is a wholehearted profits and farm profits and controlling placed on those articles, because they desire upon the part of the people to profits by taxation. To expand produc- · enforce this by taking away the mer­ cooperate to stop inflation. tion of demand goods would accomplish chant's license, after a hearing, to sell [Here the gavel fell.l the same purpose. So before we go too the particular commodity that he has Mr. WOLCOTI'. Mr. Chairman, I far in this thing let us find out if all of been charged with selling which is a vio­ yield myself 10 additional minutes. the allocations are justified. There is a lation of the order or regulation In re­ The sanction behind these proposals committee of Congress, as I understand spect to that particular product. So, in is public sentiment. This law cannot be ·it, which is working on this question. order to make the licensing effectual, enforced without a favorable public sen­ Would we not have a terrible disillu­ every concern must have a separate li­ timent; and he has been successful be­ sioned and chagrined Congress if we woke cense for every commodity it sells for cause the people are cooperating to pre­ up some morning and found that the which a ceiling has been established. vent inflation, but what this bill gives need for price-control legislation was Mr. WOODRUFF of Michigan. Mr. him is power to enforce the ceilings. occasioned by the mistakes made by Chairman, will the gentleman yield? Mr. AUGUST H. ANDRESEN. Does 0. P. M., the Army, and Navy Depart­ Mr. WOLCOTI'. I yield. the particular demand for this legisla­ ments? Mr. WOODRUFF of Michigan. Can tion come for the reason that there has Mr. YOUNGDAHL. Mr. Chairman, the gentleman tell the committee whether been some slight advance in agricultural will the gentleman yield? or not, regardless of how assiduously commodities prices? Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield. 9078 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE . NOVEMBER 24 . Mr. YOUNGDAHL. In connection Mr. WOLCOTT. I have covered them of you until you have studied the ques­ with the appeal provision in the present generally, but I can put them in one, two, tion. I do not know as I would vote bill, is it the gentleman's understanding three order. I expect to oppose this bill against a bill which put a reasonable ceil­ that while this appeal is taking place the if the following . proposals are not sub­ ing on wages to prevent inflationary ceiling that has been set by the Adminis­ stantially enacted: First, decentralization raises, but I do not think it is necessary trator remains in effect? of power by creation of an administrative to put a ceiling on wages in this bill to Mr. WOLCOTT. Most definitely. board of review. Second, if the commit­ effectively control prices. I have con­ The law specifically states that. tee amendment which will put back in vinced myself of that not from the Mr. YOUNGDAHL. Therefore, if the the bill the licensing provisions stricken testimony alone but from my contact Administrator desired to ask for a delay out of the bill on my motion in committee with economists, in connection with my in the hearing on the appeal and that de­ prevails I shall feel justified in opposing study of the question .independently of lay might take place two or three times, the bill on the ground that they do not the hearings, and in conversations with the damage to business would be done. need this tremendous power, and further, _ experts and others. There is a human during the delay in hearing the appeal, is it will convince me they are more inter­ problem involved. Perhaps you are hard­ that correct? ested in the acquisition of power to con­ boiled enough to meet it; perhaps I lack Mr. WOLCOTT. Yes. The bill spe­ trol business than they are to control the courage to enact it into law; that is, cifically states that during the time the prices. I hope the Congress of the Un_ited States review is being had before the emergency Mr. AUGUST .H. ANDRESEN. Does never will by fiat, never will by the fiat of court of appeals or before the Supreme the gentleman oppose the licensing Congress, if other ways can be found of Court, the ceiling on prices shall remain power? performing the same job, determine that as set by the Administrator. I can see Mr. WOLCOTT. Yes; I definitely op­ a man's employment and the sweat of his very plainly where, if the emergency pose that. Third, I do not think the brow is a commodity to be bought a.nd court of appeals gave an opinion that the Administrator is going to need the power sold like so many potatoes, beans, coal, Administrator had no authority to set a which is given him under this bill to and steel. It is something very repulsive ceiling, the Attorney General, acting on snoop into every business in the United to me to say to a man, that regardless of behalf of the Price Administrator, could States in order to determine business anything else, "You are a commodity; take that case to the Supreme Court by costs and business practices for the pur­ your services are so many bags of pota­ certiorari or otherwise, and he might take pose of getting information for the Gov-. toes; your services are so many pounds several hundred and thousands of cases ernment to establish competing enter- of steel." up to the Supreme Court, perhaps· for the - prises. I have been told of one instance ·Mr-. Chairman-; if the President of the purpose of so encumbering the Court as· where the Price Administrator has asked· United States, that much vaunted friend· to compel a situation where that price for certain reports from . a relatively and leader of labor, cannot by his counsel would remain in force, and, although the small concern. They have paid hun­ and his example, and by the commis­ act says the emergency court of appeals dred of dollars already to a firm of sions and boards which have already been and the Supreme Court will give expedi­ certified public accountants. The re­ established, control this labor situation tious consideration to the matter, how is ports-which have already been submitted and these wage questions without the the Supreme Court of the United States, to·them necessitated turning their whole resultant damaging strikes, how do you and how is the emergency court of ap­ omce force over to cooperate with the expect a relatively minor omcial-the peals going to expedite consideration of certified public accountants. The re­ Price Administrator-to do it? perhaps hundreds and thousands of ports are about 2 inches thick, about a My observation is that the machinery cases? I may say in this respect that the yard long, and about 2 feet wide. already eXists for the control of wages; so-called Gore bill, in my opinion, would [Here the gavel fell.] but if that control does not exist, then invite a multitude of lawsuits or hearings Mr. WOLCOTT. Mr. Chairman, I at least the machinery is there. Having on the equity of a ceiling which was yield myself 10 additional minutes. in mind that this is not a labor-reform placed, but we will meet that question Mr. Chairman, I do not think that bill or a farm-reform bill but only-and . when the matter is presented in the. form' power is necessary. I do not believe it 1~ only-a price-control bill, ·then- we- had of amendment~ necessary to give blanket power to bUYl better meet this labor· situation and this. Mr. DONDERO. Will the gentleman and sell commodities. -for the purpose·~ofi -·wage situation by ·amendments to· exis~ yield? taking care of a few marginal cases os­ ing legislation, and meet the farm situa­ Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield to the gentle­ tensibly for the purpose of increased pro­ tion by amendments to existing farm leg­ man from Michigan. tection by subsidizing high-cost produc­ islation, instead of setting up new yard­ Mr. DONDERO. I have been trying to· ers. We are told that the purpose of the sticks and new formulas · under a bill reconcile in my mind the necessity for buying and selling provision in the bill is which has solely for its purpose the con­ placing a ceiling on farm products and to take care of a situation like the fol­ trol of prices . . at the same time having the Government lowing. The Administrator might set a In considering this legislation we must . pay about $1,000,000,000 a year in Gov­ price ·of 10 cents on ·hydraulically mined ta}te into consideration that legislation ernment subsidies on farm products. copper. Hand-mined copper might have has already been enacted having to do Does the gentleman wish to discuss that? to get price of 14 cents in order to exist. with farm prices and wage disputes; that Mr. WOLCOTT. I would not care to It is essential that they produce all· the fc;>rmulas had .already· been created by discuss that. I am not an expert on copper they can produce. What they which his prices and his wages could be anything, and surely I· am not an expert ·-want to· do with that is perfectly all determined and controlled without hav­ on agricultural legislation. I have read right. They want the authority-to buy hig to enact, by the fiat of.this Congress, a great many agricultural bills, I have copper from . the high:..cost producer at - the fact that ~he wage earner was- merely listened to a ·great deal- of ·· agriculturaL 14. cents and sell it toethe consumers- at socmuch -steel and -potatoes. , I reiterate debate on this fioor, and- I am frank· to' the ceiling price of 10. cents, which will that this. is a price-control· billrand not .admit that most agricultural btlls are n:ot be a subsidy of 4 cents a pound. But a- labor-reform bill. I hope ·this Con­ as understandable to me as the average the · bill provides such a wide and far­ gress, if it finds it essential in its judg­ tax bill. · reaching power as to authorize them to ment to control wages and control farm Mr. TREADWAY. Will the gentleman go into the general market and l;my and prices, will do so in an orderly manner yield? sell almost any kind of commodity with­ by amending existing machinery. Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield to the gen­ out too many limitations in order to ef­ As I started to say, it was my purpose. tleman from Massachusetts. fectuate a price ceiling, which I believe is that this particular bill in its enactment Mr. TREADWAY. The gentleman in contrary to all precepts of how the Gov­ should interfere as little as possible with the opening part of his excellent speech ernment should function in protecting the orderly operation of any existing ma­ referred to the fact he would oppose the private enterprise. chinery for the control of farm prices, present bill and would be prepared to In making the following statement I wages, and credit. This bill is to imple­ offer numerous amendments. Would the am speaking now only with respect to the ment the orthodox methods by which we gentleman . care at this time to give us particular bill under discussio_n, and 1 am control costs of production. It should not some idea of what those amendments going to make a statement which 1 know be our purpose to establish new yard­ will consist of? is going to.be very· unpopular with many sticks and new formulas_by·which we ·will, 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9079 perhaps unconsciously and unknowingly, May I ask the gentleman if he does not Mr. WOLCOTT. Yes; I think the repeal or amend in effect much of the believe that if we included a ceiling on farmer has a protection in this bill which agricultural, labor, and social legislation . wages we would have set up a czar who no other class of people have. which we have enacted. would control practically the breathing Mr. STEFAN. Does the gentleman Mr. MASON. Mr. Chairman, will the and the living of every person in this think he is on a par with industry and gentleman· yield? country? labor, so far as cost of production is con­ Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield to the gentle­ Mr. WOLCOTT. If we do that, we cerned? man from Illinois. have written into the law a most peculiar Mr. WOLCOTT. If he is not on a par Mr. MASON. The gentleman states incongruity because we state that the with labor and industry in this bill, then that he is opposed to establishing by fiat right of the laborer to strike shall not be it is because of the failure of existing a limit over wages because that places denied, and at the same time setting a 1£-gislation passed by the Congress to put the workman and his efforts in the same ceiling on his wages so that regardless of him on that basis. We have established category as commodities. Does the gen­ whether or not his wages are out of line 85 percent of parity "to put the farmer tleman not agree that when you estab­ with the cost of living he cannot effec­ on a more equitable basis. The Banking lish prices on farm products, wheat, ·po­ tually strike as a means of enforcing col­ and Currency Committee has said that tatoes, or anything else-and they are lective bargaining to correct the inequal­ no ceiling would be put on which was less the result of the sweat and labor of the · ity. In.other words, we say to him, "You t:r.an 110 percent of parity in order to give farmer-you are doing identically the can strike, but you cannot strike for the him a :floor and to prevent the adminis­ same thing? purpose of enforcing new wage stand­ t!·ation of this act in such manner as to Mr. WOLCOTT. I quite agree with the ards in keeping with an increase in the dE>nY him the · benefits of any existing gentleman. cost of living." lf·gislation, and that was my point. We Mr. MASON. Then the gentleman is Mr. STEFAN. Mr. Chairman, will the should not set up any new standards arid opposed to both these things? · gentleman yield? we should protect the legislatiQn already Mr. WOLCOTT. Absolutely, because enacted; ·it -should not be indirectly otherwise you would not be consistent; Mr. WOLCOTI'. .I yield-to the gentle­ man from Nebraska. amended or repealed. you cannot blow both ho~ and cold, you Mr. STEFAN. The gentleman agrees cannot put a ceiling on wages without Mr. STEFAN. In colloquy with the with all of us that the farmer should be putting a ceiling on farm products, arid gentleman from· Illinois the gentleman on a par with industry and labor and is you cannot put a ceiling on farm prod­ from Michigan, who has given a won­ eotitled to cost of production? ucts without putting a ceiling on wages. derful explanation of this bill, indicated Mr. WOLCOTT. Yes, and I would go I reiterate that I believe the machinery that he is not in favor of any provision a little further and say that if he got a exists and is pretty well oiled for the in this bill having to do with placing a little more than parity I would be in control of both farm commodities and ceiling on wages, neither is he in favor ffivor of that. He should at least have labor cos~3. of a ceiling on farm prices. In the gen­ cost of production. Mr. ROBERTSON of Virginia. Mr. tleman's discussion he mentioned some­ Mr. BARRY. Mr. Chairman, will the Chairman, will the gentleman yield? thing about the cost of production. g('ntleman yield? Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield to the gentle­ Does not the gentleman agree that there Mr. WOLCOTI'. I yield. man from Virginia. is nothing in this bill that would protect Mr. BARRY. Will the gentleman tell Mr. ROBERTSON of Virginia. As the . the farmer, who-is actually a laborer, and us what differentiation he makes between ranking minority member of this com­ guarantee him actual cost of production farm commodities and industrial com­ mittee- on his farm products? modities? Are there not wage earners on Mr. WOLCOTT. Perhaps because of Mr. WOLCOTT. I may say to the farms just as there are wage earners in the statements I have just made I am gentleman that we have written into this industrial establishments? Is it not · a now considered by some the rankest. ' bill three · formulas. The first, the 110 fact that there are wage earners on farms Mr. ROBERTSON of Virginia. Hav­ percent of parity, was designed to protect just as there are wage earners in the ing studie( this problem for 4 months, I the advantages which the farmer has factories? am sure my colleague has a well-defined under A. A. A. The second sets a :floor as [Here the gavel fell.] view as to whether or not we should at of October 1, 1941. I do not know what Mr. WOLCOTT. Mr. Chairman, I ask this time have any price-control legisla­ the standard for that is. I do not know unanimous consent to proceed for 1 addi­ tion. I have followed the gentleman's what the standard is for the average of tional minute. remarks very closely r nd have been inter­ prices between 1919 and 1929. · The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection ested in much that lie has said, but I have If I were to go as far as to say that this to the request of the gentleman from yet to hear him say whether or not he standard should not be any less than the Michigan? · favors legislation on price control at this prices of the average of 1919 to 1929 or There was no objection. time. the price as of October 1, 1941, if I wanted Mr. REED of New York. Mr. Chair­ Mr. WOLCOTT. Perhaps the gentle­ to put the farmer on the same basis as· it man, will the gentleman yield? man did not hear me say that the reason is proposed by two or three bills before Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield to the gentle- I voted to report this bill out of the com­ this House to place business while re­ man from New York. · mittee wa:: that I had the hope that we stricting its profits, then I would say that · Mr. REED of New York. The gentle­ could get some price-control legislation, no ceiling should be placed on any farm man is a very good lawyer and, of course, because I thought it very essential that commodity which would be below the is familiar with this bill. I am wondering we enact some price-control' legislation. cost of production to the farmer. if he can tell me whether he thinks there The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman He has got just as much right to have is any provision in this bill that would · from Michigan bas consumed 1 hour. that protection as has any of these other rise to the dignity of standard, · as we Mr. WOLCOTT. Mr. Chairman, I ask interests which are now denouncing the usually think of that term, that would unanimous consent to proceed for 5 a.c1di­ agricultural provisions of this bill to have guide the administrator? tional minutes. protection. I voted against the 1919-29 Mr. WOLCOTT. The only standard in The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection provision because I was told by those in this bill is the finding of the adminis­ to the request of the gentleman from · authority that the 110 percent of paritY trator that a particular ceiling is neces­ Michigan? was sufficient, and, if it is sufficient, that sary to prevent inflation. There was no objection. is all that should be in the bill. Mr. REED of New York. And that is Mr. HEALEY. Mr. Chairman, will the Mr. STEFAN. If I may go a little about as arbitrary as anything could be. gentleman yield? further on that, if the gentleman means Mr. WOLCOTT. That is the only Mr. WOLCOTT. I yield to the gentle­ what he said, then he believes the farmer standard in the bill. · man from Massachusetts. should be placed on a parity so far as Mr. WILLIAMS. Mr. Chairman, I Mr. HEALEY. Before the gentleman cost of production is concerned with the yield 30 minutes to the gentleman from concludes his remarks, I take this occa­ laboring man and with industry. Is Tennessee [Mr. GoRE]. · sion to compliment him on his clear and there anything here that puts him on Mr. GORE. Mr. Chairman, it is a cogent explanation of a very difficult and such parity with industry and labor so source of genuine disappoir:tment that I, complex bill. far as cost of production is concerned? for the second time in 3 years, find myself 9080 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE . NOVEMBER -. ~4 in direct disagreement with the majority onstrate its inefficacy during an emer-. be effectuated and as to how it should be of the great committee on which I have gency, done. The substitute proposal which ~ I the privilege of serving, and it is a great Our national-defense program must be propose will be at each o: your offices to­ · committee, headed by a great chairman our foremost concern. We have no right morrow morning. I have made some re­ and made up of a strong membership, te make it secondary to anything else, let vision in order to meet the rule_of ger­ our colleagues of the House. alone to our own puny political interests. maneness. I will send immediately upon There is no disagreement as to objec­ We as two great political parties have no printing early tomorrow a copy to each tives. I think we are all in agreement as right in this hour of emergency to give office. That proposal err.bodies the over­ to that. · The disagreement is rather any color ·of partisanship to the consider- all approach. The committee bill under­ upon the methods of achieving those ob­ ation of so vital a question. And, Mr. takes to control prices by the application jectives and upon, perhaps, the degree·of r.hairman, this is no piddling issue. It of ceilings on a selective basis, with cer­ seriousness of ouF situation. may mean the lives-of thousands of Amer- tain limitations and restrictions. ican boys. It may mean the difference I make the following statement after ~- Perhaps I consider the danger of in­ . between victory and defeat for the demo- considerable thought. I believe the com­ flation as fuore serious than members of cratic peoples of the world. It is a vital mittee bill is more inflationary than de­ the committee and, perhaps, more seri-' . part of the mobilization of our strength, flationary in character. I do not belieye otis than many Members of the House. and I for one think that it is high time· I should make that .statement without · If I could feel that ·the worst we could that the people of the country, the Con- . explaining that'tne committee bill would ~ expect from the · impending danger of . gress and the Pres-ident ask just what -is allow the Administrator to .exercise ce.r­ inflation was a repetition of the disas­ this job which we have undertaken, ~ and tain restraining infl.uences on rising trous cycle of run-away prices and de-, resolve that from now on to make an all- prices in a limited field, but, on the other pression which we experienced during out approach to all the problems of . na- hand,. there are ·three reasons, which I and after the World War, then I could tiona! defense. Therefore we must meas-· entertain as valid reasons, why I consider approach this great and momentous' ure the usefulness and the efficacy of it more ,inflationary .than deflationary. question niore dispassionately .and with' these two proposals by their contribution Mr. BOGGS. Mr. Chairman, will the less alarm. to the effective mobilization of our na- gentle:rp.an yield? : After a. diligent study. of the proplem, -tiona! strength. Mr;· GORE. ·I would. like to· go ahead, howev_er, day and night, for. nigh on _to A drastic rise in the ·cost of- living ere- but,· of course, .I will yield .to my colleague 4 montns, I _find no gJ.:o-qnds .for sueh. · ates unrest and undermines the morale - on the committee. complacency and no .excuse for ti_midity. - of the people. A drastic rise in the cost Mr. BOGGS. Does the gentleman be­ . The impending danger of inflation_grow~ . of living leads to strikes for higher wages lieve that any ,price-Gontrol legislatiQn, _ out and stems out _of our unpreceqented ·in order that the workman who ·sees 'his whether it .be over-all or selective, can _ eff{)rts for,· nl:l.tional defense. Reportedly real ·wage diminishing day by day, the co_ntrol inflation without other measures? the Government plans to ;spend $50,000,-. - workman who· sees that he can buy less Mr. GORE. I am very glad the gentle­ 000,000 . f_or .war _production next year., . shelter, fewer clothes; and less wholesome. · man. asked the,question. I think that This, mind you, is approximately three, · food for his ·· family, may maintain his effe~tive price control . is our principal times what .we ar~ sp,ending this year for; · standard of living. -It leads to suffering . weapop, but acco_mPStnYing that must be war production. What will this do to our and deprivation on ·the part of people taxation, must be cr.edit control, must be economy? Will it be doubled again in who are not in the position to strike-the fiscaJ and monet_ary policy. 1943? How long are we to be engaged poor people of the country. It under.: · The Governme.nt h~s already moved, in this tremendous spending program?. mines the civilian population .on the one commendably, I believe, and effectively, I do not know. Only the Master in the hand except those who through specula- in the field of curtailment of credit by heavens knows. I submit to you, though, tion, profiteering, and the use of force on two steps, the restriction of installment without attempting to predict the dura­ the bottleneck of production gain their buying and the .raising of bank-reserve tion of the war, that all signs, as plain as selfi-sh end. This in turn undermines the requirements. guideposts, point to a long period, per­ morale of the boys in uniform at a paltry I believed and I still believe that profit haps several years, of war economy. We sum per month, who believe that the limitation· has a definite part in ·this cannot afford to take it for granted that cause, for which they are called upon to program. I reg-re~ that it is not in order we can come out of another run-away make so great a sacrifice, should not be to -offer that provision, but before you use inflation with nothing more serious than - used by so many others for selfish gain.- that as an excuse for voting against the a depression. Quite to the contrary, the Up to a certain point rising prices ih- over-all approach-to the problem, just volume, the intensity, and the apparent crease production. We all admit that. remember these things: duration of our spending program, indi­ Theoretically, that point is reached when First. You may and probably will soon cates more severe consequences than we we approach full utilization of our -pro- ·have a ·chance to vote for as drastic tax suffered following the other war, which ductive facilities. Actually we reach it and profit legislation as you will desire. came perilously near-perhaps nearer before then. After that, rising prices Segond. The excess-profits tax is al- than we know-to wrecking democracy in . hamper the full utilization and mobiliza- ready in.operation. I think it is too weak. ' the early years of. this decade. · tion of our strength. When we approach I think it should be greatly strengthened. We have committed ourselves to this full utilization of our existing facilities, Third. The President has already re­ program of national defense, and to this we can get additional war production quested the Ways ~ and Means Committee program of aiding the victims of aggres­ through only two means: One, the con- to consider re":•amping our whole tax sion, because we believe that this spread­ version of more civilian industry to war structure,' and there have been reports in ing war of aggression and enslavement· production; and, two, the building of . the pap~rs that . that great committee threatens the freedom of mankind every- more faclities and tools. Rising prices w~ withholding consideration until the . where. Democracy ·is challenged, chal­ hamper both~ The civilian producer re- House had finished with price control. lenged by the ·words anr"i the acts of the sists the conversion if he can stay in the · Fourth. Whenever you control the totalitarian dictators and· the democra­ inflationary field .of civilian. production.~ pzice you· can in some cases, at least, cnn­ . cies must ffnd a way to mobilize their and why? . Because. there he can make troi the profit. So-lest you vote ·against · strength within the framework· of exist-. more money, and there he can betterpr.e- the over-all appr-oach to-this great 'prob­ ing free institutions to met the chal­ serye his positl-an. in ·post-war . .civilian lem, contemplate those steps.- I, for one, lenge else the democracies themselves commer.ce. .Therefo.re_,_ we see that it .is. readily admit that the· great ·Ways · and will eventually be driven to totalitarian necessary to control prices if we are to Mean·s. ·committee is better qualified to methods. .The history of the failure of attain with any degree of certainty and consider that problem than one indi­ democracies in this century is replete with efficiency the needs of national defense. -.vidual:M.ember, ·although I think it might inadequate measures to meet extraor-. Drastic controls ave -necessary. · · · well have · been .in this one .bill just as di!lary ~itua_tiqn§, _and unless the legisla-. , Now; ·I· come to ~ the ·controversy-.pre- · · further ·· credit ~ restrictions · might · have tive branch of tne Government acts with - s{m_ted· by the two proposals· before ·t:Qis been, if necessary; and just as it might courage . and with unselfishness in · the . body, As the body- has been told several have been. well ·for monetary policy leg­ national interest, we may, while trying :- times,_tpere ,are two schools of thougptl · islation tQ be l:lere_if the-administration · to preserve democracy· elsewhere, dem-· as t_o ~o~~ i!lfl~tion and pljee.contt'9l ~ay_ had indicated that their scope of author- 1941 CON.GRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE · 9081 ity was not now broad enough to cover prices except those few that you touch time at whatever level he chooses, with the problem. Does that answer the gen­ and it just cannot operate. certain restrictions which I hope to ex­ tleman's question? The gentleman from Texas [Mr. PAT­ plain in a few minutes. The bill which Mr. BOGGS. Yes. Thank you. MAN] has suggested that there were I propose, the over-all bill, places, not by Mr. BARRY. Mr. Chairman, Will the 1,800,000 commodities, there being 30,000 administrative decree but by legislative gentleman yield? in the Sears, Roebuck catalog. Does enactment of Congress, a ceiling on all Mr. GORE. I yield. not that illustrate the utter futility of commodity prices at the levels at which Mr. BARRY. I do not think the gen­ trying to control the general price level they are selling this week, provided that tleman's bill is an over-all bill as the by placing a ceiling on a few? Mr. Hen­ in the case of an agricultural commodity Baruch plan proposes. Under section 206 derson said that he had in mind control­ no ceiling shall be applicable on those do you· not say in e:ffect to the Admin­ ling 75 or 100. That would be like trying commodities selling at a price below par­ istrator, "I have frozen all prices as of to keep grass from growing on a Western ity until they reach parity. a certain date,. but you have the power to ranch by sitting down on the high places. [Here the gavel fell.] remove the ceiling on everything, includ- It just will not work. The experience of Mr. CRAWFORD. Mr. Chairman, ·1 -ing labor," so that the. net result will be this country and of every other country yield 10 additional minutes to the gen­ what you wanted· in the beginning, · which has tried the selective method tleman from Tennessee. namely, the selective price. shows that when a ceiling is placed upon Mr. GORE. There is, in the section to Mr: GORE. I am glad the gentleman . one commodity price rises. occur all over which the gentleman refers, an escape asked the question. He is entirely in · the lot on allied and kindred materials valve to make exemptions. There is an­ · error, ·but if he would permit me I would · and substitute commodities. . other section which grants to the Admin­ like to proceed and get· to that in the Yes,,Mr. Chairman, we must have dras­ istrator discretionary authority to make orderly 'way, and I will be very .glad to tic controls if the plan is to work .• Other­ .adjustments up or down in order to re­ . reply to that. . ' . wise the Administrator would sit down lieve hardship cases. This criticism Before replying to the interrogation of on a price here, a price there, and a price which is embodied in the interrogation the 'gentleman - from Louisiana [Mr. over·yonder, and grab at a dozen. as they ·of the gentleman from New York was BoGGS] I had just begun ·to give three go over the hill. He would be not un­ leveled in the committee. All of · us, of reasons why I . consider the committee like a flea on a hot stove jumping about course, would like to come to the floor bill rn:ore inflationary than deflationary -trying .to catch this one, and ·. that one, . with a bill which could not be criticized. in character. First, it invites and en- and this one. All the time the general I do not propose that this is a perfect . courages prices to rise to the restricted · . ·price level would be going up. · Now, measure. I do, however, say that this · levels written into the bill. Second, -it there is proof of that; We have had price . point is a virtue rather than a fault of · encourages, augments, and manufactures · control in this country on certain selected . the legislation. In order to relieve the the inflationary psychology. · co~modities for several months. Dur­ -bill of that criticism I would not bring it We all know ·that one of the principal ing the ~ 4-we.ek . period in which Congress · . in .here with it removed, because I think · causes of inflation is psy..chologjcal. Peo­ was recently in recess Mr. Henderson told ,it is necessary in order that it be admin- ple get into their heads ~hat prices are us he was able actually to lower the price , istratively feasible. We cannot have an -going to ·be . higher· next ·month· or 3. level of the basic commodities on which ·inflexible bill of so great a scope as this. months from now and that all things are he had placed ·ceilings. But what· hap­ .It must not be too rigid if it is to be ad­ going to be scarce, and they start buying pened to ·the general price level, which ministered. Let me read that section · perhaps ·more than they need. They makes up the cost of living, during that ·which gives to the Administrator the . start hoarding it. When you do it on a . same period-? He told us that it increased right to make exemptions in certain selective basis, every time the Adminis- 2 percent, the. greatest increase of any cases: trator announces a price ceiling he adver- similar period since the war began. SEc. 206. The Administrator may, by regu­ . tises to the Nation that we are ·in a period We tried this selective method in World lation or order, exempt from sections 202, 203, of spiraling prices. Yes, more than that; War No. 1. In 1917 the War Industries 204, and 205, articles, services, labor, and every time he puts a ceiling on a com­ Board imposed ceilings on selected basic dwelling accommodations with respect to modity he encourages people not only to ccmmodities, and from 1917 to 1918 the which he makes a finding of fact that: 1. .Such exemption is necessary to promote seek that commodity, but to buy substi­ price level of those commodities, selected the national defense. ' · tutes. Therefore, the piecemeal approach ·and controlled, was actually lowered, contemplated in the committee bill en­ but .what happened to the general price Does ·anybody find fault with that? courages, augments, and manufactures le~· el during this same period? It went 2. It is unnecessary that a. ce11ing be ap­ the inflationary psychology, which is one out the ceiling, that is what happened. plicable to such articles, ser\T_ices, labor, o~ · of the causes of price rises. Great-Britain and France tried the se­ dwelling accommodations in order to pre­ Third, the selective method encourages lective -method during World War No. 1. serve the Nation's price structure ~nd t~ speculation. We all know that the specu• It failed both nations. Great Britain prevent a rise in ~he cost of living. lator, the hoarder, the market -manipu­ has tried it in this war. Again it · h·as Now, if an article, commodity, service, lator is also one of the prime causes of proved a failure. Their cost of living, or wage meets ·those ·conditions, then i't · inflation. accor~ing to the bes.t estimates I can get, should be exempted. That was put into What happens? The Administrator .has nsen f~om 43 to 44 percent. Canada ·tlre act in order to take care of ·inconse­ announces through the press that he has has tried it in this war. Canada has al­ quential items, such as toothpicks. That ·placed a ceiling upon that commodity or ready discarded it and adopted the over­ was put into 'the act in order to relieve that study is being given to the placing all system. If we are to be effective w·e · some urgent situation that might develop of a ceiling on a certain commodity, let -must place ·a general ceiling over the price when it was necessary to exempt from th-e us say cotton yarn. What happens? structure of this country. 'ceiling in order to accomplish the pur- The speculators know that the pressure The bill which I 'propose would place a ·poses of national defense. I do not will be transferred to substitute ma­ ceiling on the price of all commodities think the gentleman is .at all correct when terials, so they go · into the market and where they ar.e this week. The Admin- ' :he .says that that gives authority for the start buying up and; hoarding and cor­ istrator would be given · authority to , Adminis.trator to exempt everything, Not nering wool yarn, -rayen yarn, and other : ·make adjustments ·up or down in· order :at all. He.must read the language of th.e allled· materials, if any_. They, therefore, . to-relieve hardship cases. Now I_am com!. . proposal. : . .become scarcer. and scarcer, ~ and - the ihg to the question which the gentreman · ·· Mr. BARRY . . Of course, the gentle­ price goes up and up so the Administra­ from New York [Mr. BARRY] propounded. man has read a different section than tor has to reach out and clamp a ceiling -He asked if-the two bills were not simi- .was in the bill. - He must have changed on them. That is the heart . and the .lar. This question was also propounded it. Nevertheless, under the gentleman's essence of the piecemeal approach. by -the gentleman from ·Texas [Mr. PAT;. own language as substituted now, does it Let me say to you that ·one of the ·MAN]. The two bills are as :di:fferent ·as · not give him the, power on everything he principal differences in the over-air ap- . day and night. The commi-ttee bill places decides is under those two qualifications plication of ceilings and in the piece­ no ceiling on any price· anywhere. - It and. changes that are essential to national meal method .is that · by the piecemeal 1 gives -to the Administrator -authoritY- to defense? Can he not exempt every­ . method you nowhere call a halt to rising place ceilings on any commodity at· any . . t~ng? LXXXVII-573 9082 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 Mr. GORE. The gentleman, by his Mr. VOORHIS of California. Does not fire on the high places, but the gentle­ question, assumes that the Administrator, the gentleman agree that one of the man wants to burn the whole ranch up. regardless of these provisions, irrespec­ main reasons for the collapse of farm Mr. GORE. That is exactly what the tive of the intent of Congress, totally dis­ prices at that time was a terrifically and . selective method would do; it would hit dainful of the organic law would, upon artificially brought about restriction of the fire at the high places and splash his own motion and by his own opinion credit on the part of the Federal Re- it all over the ranch and burn the whole and action, exempt everything. If I be­ serve Board? Was it not a monetary ranch up. lieved that I would not vote for any bill influence that knocked the bottom out Mr. GIFFORD. I thought that is granting authority, much less for price of those farm prices? what the gentleman wanted to do--burn control. If I believed the Administrator Mr. GORE. There is considerable to the ranch. was going to take that attitude I would what the gentleman says. The under- Mr. GORE. I beg the gentleman's not vote to place anything in his hands. lying fault, I may say to the gentleman pardon, what I want to do is put a · ceil­ Mr. BARRY. I take the position that from California, was that they had ing over the -fire, across the board, and the Administrator starts out with the reached an inflationary peak which could quench it. conviction that only certain selective not be supported by a normal economy. Mr. GIFFORD. I have one more ques­ prices are necessary. The gentleman says That failed and they were the first hit tion about getting time. Are there other ceilings are necessary, so he will · and the hardest hit. We have fast lost · others on the committee here who want wind up by having the prices he thinks our world markets. Another inflation time to speak in support of the gentle­ are necessary. would again raise the price structure man's side? Mr. GORE. The gentleman is incor­ and again the tendency would be for the Mr. GORE. May I proceed? That is rect if he is referrfug to Mr. Henderson, durable goods and for the wages of large not a question on t ·.1e bill because Mr. Henderson has taken no such organized groups to remain high. But Mr. GIFFORD. It is unfair? position with respect to commodities or the farmer enjoys no such tendency. · Mr. GORE. :trot unfair, just not perti- wages. Quite to the contrary, he has said LHere the gavel fell.l nent to the bill. · it was necessary that we have wage sta­ Mr. WILI.JAMS. Mr. Chairman, I Yield Mr. GIFFORD. I want the gentleman bilization if we are to prevent rising the gentleman 5 additional minutes. ' to have alL the time he wants for the prices; and he said by the selective Mr. WOLCOTT. · Mr. Chairman, I discussion of his bill. method he did not hope to prevent rises in yield the gentleman 5 additional min- ' Mr~ GORE. I thank the gentleman. prices· but only to control the rises. utes. He is very courteous and charitable. The gentleman from Texas said that Mr. GORE. I thank both gentlemen. Now to get .br..ck to the agricultural the Administrator could by one order put I regret to have to ask for more time, but pro·/ision. There is another section of everything under the ceiling. Well, he this is a vital subject, and after 4 months the bill which directs the Administrator cannot do that because every ceiling must of day and night study it appears that we to use his power of adjustment in a man~ be accompanied by a statement of fact, ought to have a fuli discUSSion of the ner which will support prices to the with a :finding of fact, and he does not proposition. farn1er and give him average year-round contemplate an over-all. But Jet me ask, Mr. HINSHAW. It seems to me that as parity. . if the gentleman from Texas is right that each one of the proponents of the other I ask you if you did not go through the the Administrator can and will place an bill took an hour the gentleman from · last inflation. I live in a little community over-all ceiling by administrative decree, Tennessee should also have an hour for which suffered the failure of six of its why _in the name of Heaven does he op­ his discussion and that he should be · seven banks within a 10-mile radius. My pose doing it by legislative action? l yielded that time by the gentlemen who people, my neighbors, . my kinfolks were believe in a Government by law instead have control of the time. ·plunged into the abyss of desperation and of a Government by men. Mr. GORE. The time is in control of despair. I hope ths.t we can provide bet­ I want to go to other provisions of the these gentlemen and they have been very ter leadership ·than to allow a repetition act now. I would like to speak before charitable. of that. Just because some people want my time expires about how the two bills Mr. WOLCOTT. What would the gen- to gain some selfish advantage we should would apply to· some of the major eco­ tleman feel is sufficient time to present not welch from our duty. nomic segments of our society. First, I his question? We have all afternoon. I I believe the American farmer is will­ would like to take agriculture. do not see any 'reason why the gentle- ing to have restrictions imposed upon The committPe bill, in my opinion, to man's time should be restricted. He can him, and I am willing to impose them on all practical purposes excludes. agricul­ have all the time he wants. him, if we impose them likewise upon ture from the application of ceilings. In Mr. GORE. I thank the gentleman other segments of our population. · the case of some commodities that prob­ very much. I will proceed and I will look The gentleman from Michigan said ably would not be true, but in the main, to the gentleman for more time. that he thought it was a terrible thing, to all practical purposes, agriculture is Mr. GIFFORP. Will the gentleman which tore his heartstrings,. to say to a excluded. Is that to the best interest of yield? laboring man that he was worth only so agriculture? I hope none of you will Mr. GORE. I yield to the gentleman many bags of potatoes. I think it is,~ too. come. to the conclusion that I .have: no from Massachusetts. It goes against every sentiment of my farmer~. no miners, no laborers, no busi­ Mr. GIFFORD. I do. not like the sug- heart. But if it· is for the national in­ nessmen in ~Y distri.ct. I represent. a gestion of the gentleman from Texas. terest, I am willing to say that to him, grea_t. people ju~?t like you do, who are The questioning is the interesting part when I know that his real wage will buy interested in the economic structure of to us. more bags of potatoes now than it will this Nation. Mr. GORE. I will be glad to yield, I 3 months from now unless we do apply To the farmer inflation is much like may say, to the gentleman. restrictions. I am willing to do that if intoxication. It is exhilarating in its Mr. GIFFORD. All the others have we also say to the farmer that he shall development, but fraught with headaches yielded for questions at all times, get only so much for the same bags of and heartaches in its recession. · The Mr. GORE. So shall I. potatoes. I think it is very fortunate, price structure of this Nation is vital to from my point of view, that the gentle­ the farmers' welfare and to the economic· Mr. GIFFORD. Now will the gentle- man from Michigan used that analogy, welfare of the Nation. During the other man yield to me? It fits both cases. war we had inflation which raised our Mr. GORE. I shall be delighted to Is it in· the interest of the farmer to price structure high. yield to my distinguished colleague. allow his prices and the whole price What happened after the war? In Mr. GIFFORD. I want to remind the structure of the Nation to go into an the main, the price structure upon many gentleman of a statement he made this inflationary spiral? I can think of oath­ of the commodities that the farmer had afternoon that was very devastating in ing more -detrimental to the funda­ to buy remained high, but the farmer favor of his remarks, about the rancher mentals of his welfare. The all-im­ fell first and farthest. sitting down on the high places. I want portant thing· to the farmer in a price­ Mr. VOORHIS of California. Will the him to think it over about putting out control bill is not how high we place his gentleman yield? . the fire on the high places when it gets ceiling level, not by a long shot; rather, Mr. GORE. I yield to the gentleman. out of control. We want to put out the it is that the ceilings apply to all major 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9083 segments of our economy, to the end that Some people cry that it is unfair ·to The committee· bill absolutely exempts the farmer will not finally suffer more the farmer and some people say that I am wages and salaries and prohibits the plac­ disparity than is now his unhappy lot. advocating an antifarmer bill, an anti­ ing of ceiling on either. I turn no'w to the application of ceil­ labor bill, and an antibusi_ness bill. No; It is elementary that you cannot con­ ings on wages. There has been a lot of it is neither. It is a vigorous attempt to trol the price of the commodity unless talk about freezing wages. There is no preserve the American economy .for all you control the cost of that commodity. freezing in the substitute proposal which Americans of all classes of o·ur society No matter how much an administrator I make. It applies ·a ceiling to the and of all walks of life. may fume and fulminate and cuss, he amount of pay which the employer of Mr. BOGGS and Mr. VOORHIS of could not hold down the price of an eight or more persons is paying for the ·California rose. automobile unless he held down the cost performance of a specific job this week. Mr. GORE. I must first yield to my of the steel in the motor, the tin in the It does not apply a ceiling upon an indi­ colleague on the committee. body, the plastics and the fabrics, as well vidual worker, not at all. He can trans­ Mr. BOGGS. The gentleman has dis­ ·as the cost of the labor that fabri­ fer from a mechanical job to a book­ cussed the wage phase of his bill, and I cates it. It is silly to think you can hold keeper's job and then get the ceiling t.m asking this question · as a matter of down our price structure and let that price for the bookkeeper's job. He may information because I have never heard element which makes up the greater part move from Tennessee to New York and the gentleman discuss the service and of the price structure go free. You work for another employer who has a commission provisions in his bill. It is might as well say to the sun "Do not higher ceiling for a specific job. The my understanding that under the bill as rise tomorrow morning." You might as ceiling applies upon the compensation it is drafted, you cannot only freeze the well follow the attempt of Canute in which an employer pays for the perform~ wages of the working man, but you would ordering the waves of the sea to recede. ance of a specific function. freeze the fee paid to a lawyer, a doctor, You just cannot do it. Some folks say, "Well, you have Gen­ or engineer, or the fee paid to a barber We must have uniformity of sacrifice, eral Motors, with thousands and thou­ or to a beauty operator, making it apply and we cannot approach this great un­ sands of employees." The administra­ to all other branches of society. dertaking with a winning spirit if every­ tion of the act would be comparatively Mr. GORE. I will say to the gentleman body is trying to make a profit out of it. easier to administer on that employer that he is partially correct. Ceilings not Under ·the system thus far followed, than it would be on some smaller em­ only could be applied, but they would .be about the only fellows making any real ployer, because there you have classifica­ applied to the charge for .standard serv- · 'sacrifice are the boys whom we have put tions just as much as you have in the ices. I do not think that it would .50 to into uniform by our vote, sweeping them civil service, with classification of the some of the inconsequential things which away from their homes and their em­ functions performed, the jobs done. If the gentleman says are necessary, but ployment. They are training to defend the employee advances from one position it 'NOUld apply to a commission. Are and fight for this country, and yet we to a more responsible position he can you going to propose a ceiling upon a are debating and quibbling falteringly get the increase. He can likewise get the salary, a ceiling upon a wage and then whether to place a ceiling upon the ris:. increase which would ordinarily come to let the CGlmmissions, let the piece worker ing cost of living and upon the ·wages him by his rights of seniority. There is go free? Oh, no, the gentleman is right, and salaries of workers who are making nothing unfair about it unless we single at least in part, because a ceiling would many times the soldier's paltry pay. I out the wage earners. be placed upon a Lharge for services, and say we must face all of the problems of What I hope the proposal would ac­ let me say that this ceiling would be ap­ national defense with an all-out spirit plied to salaries of corporation execu­ from now on. complish if enacted would be the pres;. tives. One of the most scandalous de.:. ervation of the status ,quo through this velopments of the year has been the in­ Mr. WILLIAMS. Mr. Chairman, I emergency. The important thing to the yield 30 minutes to the gentleman from wage earner is not the amount written crease of executive salaries. Texas [Mr. PATMAN]. into his salary check, not the figures on I placed in the committee hearings rec­ ords from the Securities and Exchange ' PRICE-CONTJtOL BILL the check, it is what that check will Commission showing that 21 corporations buy-his real. w~ge. The importap:t -filing reports on June 30 showed an 18• Mr: . PATMAN. Mr~ Chairman, · the thing in inflation for the worker ·is to percent average increase in the highest­ hearings. on thiS bill commenced before preserve _tpe worker's real wage, because paid executives' salaries. Yes; it showed the committee more than 3 months ago. if we allow prices- to ·continue to rise, that the increase in the salary of all ex­ .When the hearings first commenced I .poorer fpod, poorer _shelter, and poorer ecutives in those corporations had been concede that I had the · opinion that clothes must be the_ unhappy lot, the increased 14 percent. One company, the wages should be in the bill, or that we mean lot, of poor people who spend the W. ·B. Jarvis Co., showed an increase in should not have any bill. Of every wit­ greater portion of their earnings for the pay of its highest-paid executive from ness I asked this question: Since wages .such necessi-ties. .Only a fraction of a $17,540 to $80,000, including a $30,000 represent a major part of what the Co.ngressman's salary, goes for . shelter, bonus. Are we going to let that gO? Do farmer produces, .would it not be untair food, and clo_thing, but think of the poor you blame the workers, when we are al­ to :fix a .price on the farmer's production man who spends all of his money for lowing tremendous profits, when we are and not :fix a ceiling over wages? I food and clothing and shelter for his asked every witness that question. allowing executive salaries to be increased 1 .wife and ba.bies. _ . by such proportions, for asking a bigger . There ~ere two things about which I [Here the gavel fell.l share of the .profits if the Government" is c:Q.anged my .mind- during the course of · Mr. ROLPH. Mr.. Chairman, l yield , ·to -aUow them. the hearings. One was that . wages ·the gentlemQ;n ;fr.om Tennessee 10 addt- , ·· -We must ~o across .the-· board!'with. this 1 should not be included in a price.~control -tional minutes. ·bill. We· must be fair to everybody,· and ! ·bill at this time,_and if ·they a"I"e ever .in.­ · Mr. GORE. The wage earner is ·hurt · -unless we are, we· are headed for a catas- • cluded, they should be under a separat~ more than any group of people on earth trophe. Yes; we are all trying to catch administration and not under the Price by in:fiation. It is he who is hit hardest up. The farmer is trying to catch up, Control Administrator. Another thing by an in:fiation. The farmer is hit worse industry is trying to go higher' and wage on which I changed my mind is that . by a depression, but not much worse than earners are trying to catch up. They Will when I went into that committee, just as the wage earner. It is the wage earner all catch up over a precipice unless we the chairman suggested, I had a prejudice who, when the depression comes, which take bold and effective action. against Mr. Henderson, I am glad to .pub­ is the inexorable counterpart of in­ I ask you, as I approach the end of this licly confess, from statements that I had :fiation, loses his emplojTment, joins are­ discussion, which of the two bills would heard around this Capitol. I am glad to lief line, and turns in desperation to the apply more fairly and uniformly, which say now, however, that I have no preju­ succor of the Government. Oh, it is not of the two proposals would make the dice against him at this time, and I am to the wage earner's interest that we al­ greater contribution to the Nation's ef­ convinced that he is an able, honest, con­ low in:fiation to come. It is to his in­ fort to mobilize its strength for national scientious Administrator, who is trying terest that we preserve his real wage and defense, which of· the two proposals would his very.best to do_a good job in the best that we control in:fiation. more likely prevent inflation? - possible way in the. public interest. 9084 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 I congratulate my friend and able col­ Mr. GORE. I have never presented a jections I have to the substitute, and if league, the gentleman from Tennessee proposal on this subject which did not the House goes ahead and puts wages in [Mr. GoRE] upon his fine presentation of apply a ceiling by law. The gentleman the bill, of course, this is a democratic the proposal that he had before our com­ knows that it became necessary to sub­ body and it is perfectly all right with me mittee to include wages in a bill. It is mit an additional proposal because of the if the House and the country want it my opinion that when you analyze the action. of the Rules Committee.. I did done. But I am personally against it two bills there will be only one major dif­ make a minor change to meet what 1 con­ because it is against the interests of the ference between them, and that is that sidered the specious objection, which the country .at this time. wages are specifically excluded from the gentleman has been making, and now he Mr. MONRONEY. Will the gentleman bill that the committee has presented to is complaining because it is removed. yield? this House, while in Mr. GoRE's bill he Mr. PATMAN. I will ask the gentle­ Mr. PATMAN. I would like to yield to permits wages to be put in, but allows the man another question. Does labor have all of you, but my time is limited. Administrator to specifically and im­ the right to strike in the bill as you now Mr. MONRONEY. I want the gentle­ mediately exempt them. The gentleman have it? man to follow his thought about how put­ stated awhile ago-this afternoon-that Mr. GORE. I do not think-- ting wages into this bill will break the he has an amendment to the bill which Mr. PATMAN. Well, just answer my industries of the West and the South? will require the Administrator to make a question. Mr. PATMAN. All right. I will do finding of fact in each case before he can Mr. GORE. Yes. It is not an anti­ that. If you fix the wage of a first­ exempt anything. strike bill. It is no effort to solve the class mechanic at $1.50 an hour and Mr. GORE. Mr. Chairman, will the labor problem of the country. It is a then the same concern is paying 50 gentleman yield? price-control bill. cents an hour in the South and 75 cents Mr. PATMAN. Yes. Mr. PATMAN'. Now, the gentleman in the West--the same concern-a·ad you Mr. GORE. The gentleman from had a lot of time. I hope he will not have · hundreds of thousands of people Texas says the proposal which I make take up all of I lY time. working for the same concern, how ate would permit ceilings to be placed. He is Mr. GORE. But you interrogated me. you going to ans'"er their argument in error there. The ceiling would be ap­ Mr. PATMAN. I just asked a simple when they say "Up in New York and in plied by law to wages the same as to question. Did .,ou strike out that pro­ New Jersey they would pay me, a first­ . other segments. vision that labor has the Fight to strike? class mechanic, $1.50 an hour. Down Mr. PATMAN. Then let me ask the ·Mr. GORE. I am glad to reply to the here they are paying 50 cents an hour. gentleman this question. In the bill gentleman. I am working for the same employer, which the gentleman presented, up until Mr. PATMAN. Is it stricken out or is producing the same commodity and he noon today, the bill permits the Ad­ it in? is making the same profit." How are ministrator to exempt everything. Mr. GORE. It is not in the bill. you going to answer that? Mr. GORE. The gentleman is en­ Mr. PATMAN. It is not in the bill. Mr. MONRONEY. Does not that con­ tirely wrong. I thank you kindly. It was stricken out. dition exist today? Mr. PATMAN. If the gentleman will Mr. PATMAN. Now the Government Now, about this inflation, I concede has no national prevailing · wage as read his ·bill on the page where it appears, that something has ·to be done about in­ he will find that I am correct. · flation. We will have ruinous inflation would be established by the Gore bill. Mr. GORE. The gentleman is entirely You cannot answer it. that will absolutely destroy our country, Mr. MONRONEY. These wages will wrong. . if something is not done. Whether you Mr. PATM.l\N. The language of the be frozen into this bill. I cannot see how pass the committee bill or Mr. GORE's bill, it will establish any ceiling. bill presented by the gentleman on this it is not going to be sufncient to stop in­ point is as follows: Mr. PATMAN. You cannot explain :flation. It is going to take other things. it to save your life. You are not fixing EXEMPTIONS We must deal with excess reserves of· the profits of the employer. You are SEc. 206. As soon as practicable after the banks. We must deal with installment willing to freeze the wages of the man Administrator qualifies and takes office, he buying. We must deal with a lot of making $400 a year or the man making shall by regulation or order exempt from the things. So regardless of the bill that you provisions of sections 202, 203, 204, and 205 pass, this bill is not a cure-all. The Com­ $700 a year or $800 a year or the farm articles, services, labor, and dwelling accom­ mittee on Banking and Currency comes hand making 75 cents a day, but you are modations, with respect to which, in his into this House with a bill under very not doing anything about the enormous opinion, a ceiling is n<'t necessary to carry out adverse circumstances, · under many profits that are heing made. .the purposes of this act. Mr. MONRONEY. Will the gentle­ handicaps; when .many Members of the man yield further? That makes the bill a cover-all, ex­ House are actually mad about different Mr. PATMAN. Now, please do not empt-all bill. situations that are existing and are anx­ take all of my time. Today the gentleman has presented an ious to do anything to give vent to their Mr. MONRONEY. The gentleman entirely different amendment. He makes feelings. In the first place, they are mad said I was trying to freeze these men in it cumpulsory upon the AdminiStrator to about these strikes. I am, too. I do not an unfavorable situation. I do not think have a finding of facts that it is necessary like these strikes in defense industries. he wants that to remain in the RECORD to exempt the matter of wages or any I am tired of it. I know the feeling is unanswered. other exemption. Am I correct on that? to do something to labor; do something Mr. PATMAN. There is nothing per­ Mr. GORE. Is the gentleman o.bject­ to labor in this bill. Some of the feeling of putting wages into this bill is for the sonal in this. ing to the removal of the excuse he has Mr. MONRONEY. I think it is just as been hiding behind? purpose of expressing dissatiSfaction against labor, in the hope that you are important to protect the purchasing Mr. . PATMAN. Oh, I am not hiding doing something- to labor. May I suggest power of the man who is making $400 a behind any excuse. I hope the gentle­ to you that if you include wages in this year now as it is to permit him to try to man does not get that idea. I ask the bill you will not hurt labor. You will help run up his wages 10 percent further. gentleman this question: Does he now labor. You would increase wages all over Mr. PATMAN. So you are freezing consider this bill an over-all compulsory the Nation. You would increase wages the wages of the man who makes four bill, or an over-all voluntary bill? by billions of dollars and break industries or five hundred dollars a year; but the Mr. GORE. It is an over-all bill ap­ in the South and West within a short man who is making millions and tens of plied by law of the United States; and if period of time. They could not survive millions in excess profits you are doing the law is not compulsory then I don't it. So take that into consideration. You nothing to him in thiS bill at all; not at know what is compulsory. will not be doing something to labor in all. How are you going to answer that? Mr. MONRONEY. Mr. Chairman; will the event you put wages in thiS bill. I am not asking you to answer it now, but the gentleman yield? Now, in connection with this bill, I want you can answer it in your own time. Mr. PATMAN. No; wait. Up until to say to my friend from Tennessee I My answer to it is to let the question now it has been a voluntary bill, but the have no personal feeling in this matter. of wages and profits go before the Com­ gentleman has changed it. Now he says I consider this debate just like trying a mittee on Ways and Means; they will it is a compulsory bill. lawsuit. I expect to point out the ob- soon have a new tax bill and they will 1941 CONGRESSIONAL- RECORD~HOUSE 9085 deal with that problem all at the same too much money in proportion to their istrator could just exempt · anything, time, and you will not be freezing the real value in our national-defense prob­ that it was about the same bill as our own. $400 man and letting the $1,0(10,000 man lem. The only difference was we did not put go. He said first metals-aluminum, cop­ everything in and let the Administrator The gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. per, steel....,...things like that. He satd if pick out the ones that were becoming in­ GoRE] had lots to say about these big we do not fix a price on metals our na­ flationary and in his bill he put every­ salaries, and some of them had increased tional-defense program cost will increase thing in and let the Administrator ex­ 300 and 400 percent. Under his bill he a larger amount each year than what we empt anything. So the net result is would freeze them where they are, and expected. Then he said chemicals. Then exactly the same. We gave him a good he would freeze the $400 man where he he said imports. Then he said rents in respectful hearing, and I am glad we did. is. He would freeze the $100,000-a-year defense areas. May I suggest to you, Mr. Then we put it to a vote, and Mi. GORE man or the $300,000-a-year man where Chairman, that this bill that we have received 5 votes out of 25 Members. There he is. presented here is a well-considered bill. were only 23 Members there, but his bill Mr. GORE. Mr. Chairman, will the Every line, every sentence, every para­ received 5 votes, Mr. MoNRONEY and Mr. gentleman yield? graph, and every section of it has been GORE on the Democratic side and 3 Re­ Mr. PATMAN. If the gentleman will thoroughly considered by the whole com­ publicans. Is that right? just wait until I get through my general mittee. Mr. MONRONEY. That is right. statement. I made some points and I Mr. MONRONEY. Mr. Chairman, will Mr. PATMAN. After the committee want to cover them hurriedly so as to the gentleman yield? spent months on this bil( it should know answer questions. Mr. PATMAN. In just a minute. all about it. There are some very im­ This bill is a far-reaching bill. It can­ The bill covers all those major points portant items in this bill. Now, are you not be justified in peacetime. I hate a that Mr. Henderson said he needed . the going to throw their work overboard, 3 bill like this. This is dictatorial; this worst at this particular time, and I or 4 months overboard, and say it is no is regimentation of the worst sort; and helieve he is right about it. good at all and pick up some bill that the only time you can justify it is in a Mr. MONRONEY. Mr. Chairman; will has not been considered by the commit­ time of national emergency that de­ the gentleman yield? tee except the question of wages? Are mands it. That is the only reason you Mr. PATMAN. In just a moment. you going to presume that the adminis­ can afford to vote for this bill. But if This bill keeps down. the cost of !lational trative features of that bill are good? you have a bill like this, you have got defense $20,000,000,000 out of a $60,000,- If you harbor that opinion, let me to have one person to enforce it. We do 000,000 expenditure. So it is not the show you where you are mistaken. In not want a boatd that can dodge and kind of bill that uught to be sneezed at. the first place, if you freeze wages where pass the buck from one person to an­ Now suppose we were to say offhand, they are, and you cannot increase them other. "Let us take a substitute." Now, as much except by special order, you will get a · We want one man and place all re­ confidence as I have in the gentleman call one of these nights about midnight, sponsibility on him and charge him with from Tennessee [Mr. GoRE], no one has and a constituent of yours will be on the the responsibility under the direction of considered his bill but himself so far as phone telling you that one of these fel­ the President of the United States. I know; at lea.Jt the committee has not lows who employs fewer than eight men This job involves 1,800,000 different considered it and I am therefore not will­ has employed his foreman and he has commodities-think of that-if you in­ ing to accept a one-man bill in preference got to have another foreman. He can­ clude style, models, forms, and different to a committee bill. He changes it from not pay more money to employ another things; and if you put wages in, it will time to time and time to time, and even foreman. The defense plants have taken include 3,000,000 different kinds of wage today when he presented it here in his all the foremen and he will tell you, "I scales. There are about 5,000,000 ques­ speech it was different from what it was want you to see ·~hat Mr. Henderson gives -tions, types of questions, to be passed on. .this morning when I got the bill from me the authority right away to pay more If you have as many people in America · the document room. money for a foreman." That is one to handle this thing in proportion to Mr. MONRONEY. Mr. Chairman, will question out of millions. The exact what they have in Canada, considering the gel}tleman yield there for a very im­ language of the Gore bill on this point -industries, capacity, and number of portant observation? is as follows: workers, and the population of the 2 Mr.. PATMAN. No. I am sorry. Not CEILINGS APPLICABLE TO WAGES AND SALARIES ·countries, it will take between 500.000 at this particular time. The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman de­ SEc. 204. (a) Except as provided in sub­ and 1,000,000 people to enforce this section (b) and section 206, the ceiling ap­ over-all bill. If you make it compulsory clines to yield. plicable in respect of labor performed by an as the gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. Mr. PATMAN. So if you take that bill individual shall be- GoRE] now proposes, you could not find you would want a committee to consider ( 1) in case such labor is the same labor enough qualified people to do it. I want it, would you not? Would you want to as labor performed, whether or not by him, to tell you something more about this take his v·ord for it, as much confidence for his employer during the base period, the bill. as you have in him? It has not been highest wage paid by his employer during 'considered by a committee at all. The the base period, at the place of employ-. This is too much power to grant except ment where such individual is employed, for in wartime; and I have not found in only thing considered in the Gore bill was the same labor to an employee with the same . this bill everything I would like to have in the question of wages. His whole fight seniority rights and length of service. it. There are several changes I would can be determined by him offering an like to make; but remember this, Mr. amendment to strike uut the exemption It would take a hundred people in the Chairman, in a democracy we cannot of wages in the committee bill. office of every Congressman to intelli­ have everything we want. Leg ~ slation Mr. GORE. Mr. Chairman, will the gently and properly answer inquiries is giving and taking. Every major law gentleman yield? they would get about these 5,000,000 set­ represents a sacrifice of view or a com­ Mr. PATMAN. In just a minute. I ups provided for in the over-all bill. We promise of opinion on the part of prac­ say that because the gentleman from have not reached that psychological point tically every Member of the two legisla­ Tennessee had the Baruch idea and plan, in our national-defense preparations tiVe bodies. We must give and take. If at least the one that was claimed to be where we will accept that kind of regi­ we do not it is absolutely impossible to Mr. Baruch's plan. I do not, however, mentation. lwve legislation. So we have to take think it was his plan when he was be­ Suppose it is a defense plant estab­ thmgs in this bill that we do not like to fore the Rules Committee, but anyway it lished in the district of either one of you. have and do not like to agree to, but if was represented as his plan. The Com­ Where are they going to get their work­ ·we have price control that will keep down mittee on Banking and.Currency let the ers? You know we cannot stop defense, the rising cost of living and the cost of gentleman from Tennessee go out in and you entice a man to leave his pres­ national defense we have got to have front of the committee like a witness and ent employment where he is getting goo~ scme sort of bill. - present his bill just as long as he wanted wages, where he hal) his home, where he When Mr. Henderson came before our to. has his comfortable surroundings, his committee I asked him what items would After he got through, we showed where children in school with his neighbors, ~ likely get out o4' hand, that would cost it was not compulsory, that the ~dmin- relatives, and friends' children, in order 9086 'CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE NOVEMBER 24 to get him to go to the defense plant and Mr. MONRONEY. They are getting Mr. PATMAN. I do not know, but if give up his present rights and privileges them now. I were a mechanic comfortably situated as an employeeJ you have to pay him Mr. PATMAN. This substitute bill, in my own home, I should be reluctant to more money. Of course you have. Com­ with all due respect to my good friend, go somewhere else, regardless of what a mon sense dictat~s that. Now, this would help Hitler more than anything desirable place it might be, to accept the would be a bill to hamper and retard and else that has been proposed here. same wage. I would not do it. I prob­ stop national defense. That is what it If a concern operates over the entire ably would not do it unless I was prompted would do, because you could not get peo­ Nation its price will be fixed at the by an urge to contribute to the national ple to go to the national-defense plants. lowest price charged anywhere. The defense, of course. We would say, ''Let Do you think these workers would leave language of the Gore bill on this point the other fellow do it." the districts of my friends, the gentle­ is as follows: · Mr. BECKWORTH. In that connec­ man from Oklahoma [Mr. MoNRONEY] CEILING APPLICABLE TO SALES OF ARTICLES tion, has it not been the policy of those and the gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. SEc. 202. (a) Except as provided in sub­ who have been locating these defense GoRE] and go off down in the swamp and sections (b) and (c) and section 206, the plants to try to place them where labor work in a defense plant or in these differ­ ceiling applicable to the sale of an article by is available, to a great extent? That is ent plants that are set up in various parts any person shall be-- one of the main questions they ask. of the country? Perhaps it might be a ( 1) In case the sale is at wholesale and Mr. PATMAN. I know that is very true, desirable place. Let us say it is a desir­ the article is the same article as an article but they will never have enough. Of sold at wholesale by such person during the able place. Why leave your home if you base period, the lowest price at which it was course, they have enough of the common cannot get better wages? You would sold by such person during the base period. labor. The first thing they need is com­ freeze the people where they are. They mon labor. They can get common labor would be satisfied to let the defense-plant With the highest wages and the lowest from the surrounding countryside. But work go. They would say, "Let some­ prices, many concerns will have diffi- skilled labor is what you need in these body else do that work. I am not going culties. · plants, so this would probably stop na­ over there." Then you would have to Mr. MONRONEY. The gentleman tional defense. repeal your over-all on the wages in or­ awhile ago spoke about the ill-conceived Let us see, now, if this is the Baruch der to carry on your national-defense · Gore bill that was hastily drawn. Is it plan. Mr. Baruch said that no bill was program. This would freeze national de­ not a fact that the committee bill at this sufficient that did not require the licens­ fense, along with everything .else. minute has not been completely decided ing of retail stores. You heard him say Mr. MONRONEY. Will the gentle­ on? · that. The Gore bill does not have any man yield? Mr. PATMAN. Certainly it has been. licensing at all and the Gore bill does not Mr. PATMAN. I yield to the gentle­ We struck out one section and we agreed even include retail prices. That is right, man from Oklahoma. to put it back. is it not? It does not even include re­ Mr. MONRONEY. Is it not a fact that Mr. MONRONEY. Are we not meet­ tail prices, and one of the most inflation­ the national-defense plants are now ing tomorrow to decide what we are going ary things in the world is retail prices. drawing labor from Oklahoma City and to do about the section? Mr. GORE. Mr. Chairman, will the the district of the gentleman from Ten· Mr. PATMAN. We are not changing gentleman yield? nessee [Mr. GoRE] into Texarkana? the phraseology at all. Mr. PATMAN. I yield to the· gentle­ Mr. PATMAN. Yes. Mr. MONRONEY. We are changing man from Tennessee. Mr. MONRONEY. And that is because the whole tenor of the bill. Mr. GORE. It includes retail prices the wages are high enough to pull them Mr. PATMAN. But we have consid­ in just the same way the committee bill over there. ered this thing, and wise men change includes them. If the gentleman indicts Mr. PATMAN. Yes. They are offered their minds. The committee has not my bill-- more money. considered this other bill. The Gore bill Mr. PATMAN. Just a moment; wait, Mr. MONRONEY. Would not this bill has been changed a number of times, ac­ now. The gentleman has told me, and I provide they could do that? cording to the views of the author, and concede that he is right, but he includes Mr. PATMAN. Oh, no; it would freeze .without the consultation of the commit­ retail prices by selecting them. If the them. tee. 'gentleman is opposed to our method of Mr. MONRONEY. But the rates in Mr. BOGGS. Mr. Chairman, will the selection, why offer one of his own? the defense plants would be the same as gentleman yield? Mr. GORE. If the gentleman ·iS op­ they are this week, and they are now Mr. PATMAN. For a question. posed to the substitute bill because it is drawing employees from places like my Mr. BOGGS. Is it not a fact that Mr. selective in method as to retail prices, home city, that has no defense plants Baruch recommended a base period of then wpy is he for a bill which is entirely into places like the gentleman's district January 1, 1941, and further recom­ selective? that has. mended a licensing provision for retail Mr. PATMAN. We can argue that Mr. PATMAN. You would have to pay stores? back and forth. I could assert the same comparable wages. Mr. PATMAN. I thank the gentle­ thing about the gentleman and he could Mr. MONRONEY. If the gentleman man; I am coming to that. Mr. Baruch .say the same thing about me, but the will read the bill carefully, he will see seemed to be evasive on the date, I be­ point is there is no licensing in the Gore · where it provides that the;Y" will get the lieve. bill, and Mr. Baruch said that it is abso­ same wages as in other defense indus­ Mr. ·BECKWORTH. . Mr. Chairman, lutely necessary. Next, he said retail tries. will the gentleman yield? prices must be included. They ara in­ Mr. PATMAN. The same wages; yes. cluded indirectly in the Gore bill. They Mr. MONRONEY. As in other defense Mr. PATMAN. I yield to the gentle­ man from Texas. must be selected. plants. Next, there is the provision to buy and Mr. PATMAN. We are talking about Mr. BECKWORTH. I have been in­ sell. Mr. Baruch said no law would be a new plant that is going to be built terested in the observation the gentle­ any good that did' not give the Admin­ down near Oklahoma City. It is all set man has been making about wages. Is istrator the power to buy and sell. The up. They need 15,000 men. Where are the gentleman assuming that if we keep Gore bill does not have anything about they going to get the men? Do you on expanding our national-defense plants that, not a thing in the world. The com­ think these men are going to leave their every time we shall continue and con­ mittee bill does have. comfortable places where they are, where tinue and continue to raise wages in or­ Therefore, the main provisions brought they had their homes, where their chil­ der to get workmen for various plants? up by my friend the gentleman from dren are in school, where they have their Mr. PATMAN. We have to carry on Louisiana [Mr. BoGGs], that Mr. Baruch churches, and everything else? You national defense. If it is necessary to said were essential to a good bill, are all would :hot have a man at that plant. raise wages to get the men, we have to lacking in the Gore substitute, wholly Mr. MONRONEY. They are getting have them, because we must build planes, lacking. them no\\Z. tanks, and guns. Possibly we could take the bill back to Mr. PATMAN. You would have to re­ Mr. BECKWORTH. Does the gentle­ the committee and in another month's peal this law. man believe a limit will ever be reached? time could insert them at the right place 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9087 and change the language and do things Suppose an architect does not have a have mentioned only a few of the possi­ like that, but we have worked on this bill case this week, and next week a man bilities. Thousands could be mentioned. about as long as I should like· to work comes to him and wants some plans Now, as to wages, possibly the time on it. drawn for a certain commercial building. will come when wages should be frozen. This bill states that the base period He will say, "I do not know what fee I am not 1ur J the time will not come. I shall be the week in which it passes, but to charge; I have got to take that up am not closing the door. I am not saying since the gentleman from Tennessee with Mr. Henderson; I did not have any that I shall never vote to place a ceiling [Mr. GoRE] came up here this morning case like that last week. I will call up on wages. I do not know what is in store he has changed that provision and says my Congressman and see what I can for us. It is possible we will have to swal­ that the base period will be this week charge." He calls up his Congressman low a lot of things in this program we from November 24 to 29, inclusive. This and the Congressman gets the bill down have never swallowed before in peace­ is an invitation to inflation. If the and says, "Well, charge the same price time, but I do say with all the earnest­ people of this country believed that that somebody else in that business in ness and the sincerity that I possess that prices would be fixed as of this week, do that city charged that week for doing the I believe this committee bill goes just as you not think they would greatly in­ same work." The Congressman will read far as any well-considered bill can afford crease their prices? They would not it to him over the phone. He goes out to go at this particular time. have enough sense to be in business if and looks around and finds out that the The Gore bill freezes the wages of 50,- they did not. So any time you let the only fellow who drew any plans for a 000,000 people gainfully employed in the word go out here today or tomorrow building of that type was the sorriest United States in the following occupa­ or the next day that you are going to architect in the town and charged a very tions: freeze prices and wages and commis­ low fee, and therefore he has to put his AGRICULTURE sions and fees as of the week commenc­ fee on the basis of the fee charged by the Farmers (owners and tenants). ing today and ending Saturday, you have poorest architect in the town. Farm managers and foremen. a paved road to inflation and a special [Here the gavel fell.J Farm laborers: Wage workers; unpaid invitation to it, with the knowledge that Mr. WILLIAMS. Mr. Chairman, I family workers. you are not using good sense and judg­ yield the gentleman 5 additional minutes. FORESTR~ AND FISHING ment if you do not increase your prices. Mr. PATMAN. The same way with a Fishermen and oystermen. Mr. GORE's bill contains the following doctor. Suppose this week he has a char­ Foresters, forest rangers, and timber cruis­ provisions about the base period. ity case. He is working over here at the ers. hospital on charity and poor patients and Owners and ruanagers of log and timber (t) "Base period" means the calendar week camps: Owners and proprietors; managers within which this Act is enacted. is not making money and next week and officials. a case comes to him and the question Lumbermen, raftsmen, and wood choppers. It is now changed to November 24 to 29, comes up as to what he is going to 1941, EXTRACTION OF MINERAtS inclusive. charge. If he charged the charity pa­ Mr. Baruch said that a date should be Operators, managers, and officials. fixed when there was no inflation of any tient $10 for an operation the base­ Foremen, overseers, and inspectors. kind, no spiral of any kind, that some period week he could charge no more Coal mine operatives. date should be arrived at when prices thereafter. All right, take it up with Copper mine operatives. Mr. Henderson, and then the next fel­ Gold and silver mine operatives. were neither too high nor too low, but he low comes along and he is a lawyer. He Iron mine operatives. would not suggest any such date. So gets a divorce case and he says, "Now, I Lead and zinc mine operatives. that does not comply with Mr. Baruch's would sure like to have it, but what can Other and not specified mine operatives. plan. I charge you on this? I did not have any Quarry operatives. Let me tell you something else about Oil and gas well operatives. divorce case during the week the prices Salt well and works operatives. this bill. Architects, lawyers, doctors, were frozen." So he calls up his Con­ preachers, every professional person, and gressman and after a few conversations MANUFACTURING AND MECHANICAL INDUSTRIES any person in any occupation, trade, or over long distance with Mr. Henderson, Apprentices to building and hand trades: business would have his fee, his wage, he finally gets the information that he Carpenters' apprentices; electricians' appren­ his commission, his service charge fixed has to charge the same price that some tices; machi;nists' appr~ntices; plumbers' ap­ by this bill, and if the gentleman from prentices; apprentices to other building and other lawyer charged in that town that hand trades. Tennessee [Mr. GoRE] is right that week for the same kind of work, and he Apprentices to dressmakers and milliners. freezes them where they are. It includes finds that some jack-leg lawyer got a Apprentices to printers and bookbinders. ·hundreds of others. The Gore bill on divorce for $10, and he would have to Other apprentices in manufacturing. that point is as follows: charge only $10 to a rich client. Bakers. CEILINGS APPLICABLE TO SERVICES Under this bill that is what you would Blacksmiths, forgemen, and hammermen. SEc. 203. (a) Except as provided in sub­ Boilermakers. do, because every fee, every commission, Brick and stone masons and tile layers. section (b) and section 206, the ceiling ap­ every service charge of any kind is plicable to services performed by any person Builders and building con tractors. frozen as of that week. Cabinetmakers. shall be- Take the minister, for instance. A Carpenters. ( 1) in case such services are the same serv­ Compositors, linotypers, and typesetters. ices as services performed by such person dur­ -couple is being ·married, and, of course, the groom wants to compensate the Coopers. .ing the base period, the lowest price for which Dressmakers and seamstresses (not in fac• . such services were so performed by such per­ prea~her, and the preacher says, "Well, tory). .son during the base period; and I do not know what to charge; I did not Dyers. (2) in case such services are not the same marry any couple last week, when these Electricians. services as services performed by such person fees were fixed." He calls up his Con­ Electrotypers, stereotypers, and lithograph- during the base period (or in case such per­ gressman, ru1d his Congressman gets hold ers. son did not perform any services during the of Mr. Henderson ~md the rest of them Engineers (stationary), cranemen, etc. base period) , the towest price for which the down there, and they say, "Let him Engravers. same services were regularly performed by Filers, grinders, buffers, and polishers .any other person within the same county or charge the same fee that some other min­ (metal). parish, or within the same State if there be ister charged in that same town for per­ Firemen (except locomotive and fire de-· no such other person within the same county forming the same kind of marriage cere­ partment). ·or parish, during the base period. mony." They find some preacher that Foremen and overseers (manufacturing). (c) "Services" means any service, opera­ performed such a ceremony for a dollar Furnace men, smelter men, heaters, pud­ tion, or function performed otherwise than or $2, and he will have to fix the fee to dlers, etc. as an employee by a person (other than a conform. The minister could not be given Glass blowers. State or political subdivision thereof) for Jewelers, watchmakers, goldsmiths, and sil- any other person for compensation. a Christmas present without Mr. Hender­ versmiths. (d) "Labor" means any function performed son's permission. Loom fixers. by an individual as an employee of a person I am telling you these things to let you Machinists, millwrights, and toolmaker•. other ·than a State or political subdivision know how far this bill goes. It goes just Managers and officials (manufacturing). thereof. as far as ,it is possible for a bill to go. I Manufacturers. 9088 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD_:_HOUSE NOVEMBER. 24 Mechanics (n. o. s-.): Air transportation, Laborers (n. o. s}: Building, general, and tion laborers), steam railroad, street rail­ automobile factories; garages; repair shops; not specified laborers; laborers and helpers, road; locomotive engineers; locomotive fire­ railroad and car shops; other industries. building construction; general and not speci­ men; motormen, steam railroad, street rail­ M1llers (grain, flour, feed, etc.}. fied laborers. roadi officials and superintendents, steam Milliners and millinery dealers. Chemical and allied industries: Charcoal railroad, street railroad; switchmen, flagmen, Molders, founders, and casters (metal}. and coke works; explosives, ammunition, and and yardmen, switchmen and flagmen, steam Oilers of machinery. fireworks factories; fertflizer factories; gas railroad, switchmen and flagmen, street rail­ Painters, glaziers, varnishers, etc: Enamel­ works~ paint and varnish factories; petro­ road, yardman, steam railroad; ticket and sta~ ers, lacquerers, and japanners; painters, gla­ leum refineries; rayon factories; soap fac­ tion agents. ziers, and varnishers. tories; other chemical factories. Express, post, radio, telegraph, and tele­ Paperhangers. Cigar and tobacco factories. phone~ Agents, express companies; express Pattern and model makers. Clay, glass, and stone industries: Brick, tile, messengers; railway mail clerks; mail carriers; Piano and organ tuners. and terra-cotta factories; glass factories; postmasters; radio operators; telegraph and Plasterers and cement finishers. lime, cement, and artificial-stone factories; telephone linemen; telegraph messenge1s; Plumbers and gas and steam fitters. marble and stone yards; potteries. telegraph operators; telephone operators. Pressmen and plate printers (printing). Clothing industries: Corset factories; glove Other transportation and communication: Rollers and roll hands (metal). factories; hat factories (felt); shirt, collar, Apprentices, steam railroad, telegraph and Roofers and slaters. and cuff factories; suit, coat, and overall fac­ telephone, and other transportation, etc; avia­ Sawyers. tories; other clothing factories. tors. Shoemakers and cobblers (not in factory). Food and allied industries: Bakeries; but­ Foremen and overseers (n. o. s.): Air trans­ Skilled occupations (not elsewher-e classi- ter, cheese, and condensed-milk factories; portation; garages, greasing stations, and fied). candy factories; fish curing and packing; automobile laundries; road, street, etc., build­ Stonecutters. flour and grain mills; fruit and vegetable ing, and repairing; telegraph and telephone; Structural-iron workers (building). canning, etc.; slaughter and packing houses; other transportation and communication. Tailors and tailoresses. sugar factories and refineries; other food fac­ Inspectors: Steam railroad; street railroad; Tinsmiths and coppersmiths. tories; liquor and beverage industries. telegraph and telephone; other transportation Upholsterers. Iron and steel, machinery, and vehicle in­ and communication. Operatives (n. o. s.), building industry. dustries: Agricultural-implement factories; Laborers (n. o. s.): Air transportation; ex­ Chemica ~ and allied industries: Charcoal automobile factories; automobile repair press companies; pipe lines; telegraph and and coke works; explosives, ammunition, and shops; blast furnaces and steel rolling mills; telephone; water transportation; other trans­ firework!' factories; fertilizer factories; gas car and railroad shops; ship and boat build­ portation and communication. works; paint and varnish factories; petroleum ing; wagon and carriage factories; other iron Proprietors, managers, and officials (n. o. s.): refineries; rayon factories; soap factories; and steel and machinery factories; not speci­ Air transportation; telegraph and telephone; other chemical factories. fied metal industries. other transportation and communication. Cigar and tobacco factories. Metal industries (except iron and steel) : Other occupations: Road, street, etc., build­ Clay, glass, and stone industries: Brick, Brass mills; clock and watch factories; cop­ ing, and repairing; steam railroad; street rail­ tile, and terra cotta factories; glass factories; per factories; gold and silver factories; jewel­ road; other transportation and communica­ lime, cement, and artificial stone factories; ry factories; lead and zinc factories; tinware, tion. marble and stone yards; potteries. enamelware, etc., factories; other metal fac- TRADE Clothing industries: Corset factories; glove tories. · Advertising agents. factories; hat factories (felt); shirt, collar, Leather industries: Harness and saddle and cuff factories; suit, coat, and overall fac­ Apprentices: Wholesale and retail trade. factories; leather-belt, leather-goods, etc., Bankers, brokers. and money lenders: Bank- tories; other clothing factories. factories; shoe factories; tanneries; trunk, Food and allied industries: Bakeries, but­ ers and bank officials; commercial brokers and suitcase, and bag factories. commission men; loan brokers and pawn­ ter, cheese. condensed-milk factories; candy Lumber and furniture industries: Furni­ factories; fish curing and packing; flour and brokers; stock brokers; brokers not specified ture factories; piano and organ factories; and promoters. grain mills; fruit and vegetable canning, etc.; saw and planing mills; other woodworking slaughter and packing houses; sugar factories "Clerks" in stores. factories. Commercial travelers. and refineries; other food factories; liquor and Paper, printing, and allied industries: beverage industries. Decorators, drapers, and window dressers. Blankbook, envelope, tag, paper-bag, etc., Deliverymen: Bakeries and stores. Iron and steel, machinery, and vehicle in­ factories; paper and pulp mills; paper-box dustries: Agricultural implement factories; Floorwalkers and forem,en in stores. factories; printing, publishing, and engrav- Foremen: Warehouses, stockyards, etc. automobile factories; automobile repair ing. · . shops; blast furnaces and steel-rolling mills; Inspectors, gagers, and samplers. Textile industries: Cotton mills; knitting Insurance agents, managers, and officials. car and railroad shops; ship and boat build­ mills; silk mills; textile dyeing, finishing, ing; wagon and carriage factories; other iron Insurance agents. and printing mills; woolen and worsted mills. Managers and officials, insurance com­ and steel and machinery factories; not speci­ Other textile mills: Carpet mills; hemp, fied metal industries. panies. jute, and linen mills; lace and embroidery Laborers in: Coal yards and lumber yards; Metal industriea (except iron and steel) : mills; rope and cordage factories; sail, awning, Brass mills; clock and watch factories; copper grain elevators; stockyards; warehouses. and tent factories; other and not specified Laborers, porters, and helpers in stores. factories; gold and silver factories; jewelry textile mills. factories; lead and zinc factories; tinware, Newsboys. Miscellaneous manufacturing industries: Employment office keepers. enamelware, etc., factories; other metal fac­ Broom and brush factories; button factories; tories. Proprietors, etc., advertising agencies. electric light and power plants; electrical ma­ Proprietors, etc., grain elevators. Leather industries:. Harness and saddle fac­ chinery and supply factories; rubber factories; tories; leather belt, leather goods, etc., facto­ Proprietors, etc., warehouses. straw factories; turpentine farms and distil­ Real-estate agents and officials. ries; shoe factories; tanneries; trunk, suit­ leries; other and not specified manufacturing case, and bag factories. industries. Retail dealers: Automobiles and acces­ Lumber and furniture industries: Furni:­ sories; books, music, news, and stationery; ture factories; piano and organ factories; saw TRANSPORTATION AND COMMUNICATION. buyers and shippers. of livestock and other and planing mills; other woodworking fac­ farm products; candy and confectionery; Water transportation: Boatmen, canal men, cigars and tobacco; coal and wood; depart­ tories. and lock keepers; captains, masters, mates, Paper, printing, and all1ed industries: Blank ment stores; dry goods, clothing, and boots and pilots; longshoremen and stevedores; and shoes; drugs and medicines; 5- and 10- book, envelope, tag, paper-bag, etc., factories; sailors and deck hands. paper and pulp mills; paper-box factories; cent and variety stores; flour and feed; food Road and street transportation~ Bus con­ (except groceries and hucksters' goods); fur· printing, publishing, and engraving. ductors, chauffeurs and truck and tractor niture, carpets, and rugs; gasoline and otl Textile industries: Cotton mills; knitting drivers; draymen, teamsters, and carriage filling stations: general stores; groceries: . mills; silk mills; textile dyeing, finishing, and · drivers; garage owners, managers, and offi­ hardware, implements, and wagons; hucksters printing mills. cials; garage laborers; hostlers and stable and peddlers; ice; jewelry; junk and rags; Woolen and worsted m1lls. hands; laborers, truck, transfer, and cab lumber; opticians. Other textile mills: Carpet ·mills; hemp, companies; laborers, road, ;;treet, etc., build­ Auctioneers. jute, and linen mills; lace and embroidery ing and repairing; laborers, street cleaning; Canvassers. mills; rope and cordage factories; san, awn­ owners, managers, and officials, truck, trans­ Demonstrators. ing, and tent factories. fer, and cab c9mpanies . . Sales agents. Miscellaneous manufacturing industries: Railroad transportation: Baggagemen and Salesmen and saleswomen. Broom and brush factories; button factories; freight agents; boiler washers and engine Undertakers. electric light and power plants; electrical ma­ hostlers; brakemen, steam railroad; 'conduc­ Wholesale dealers, importers, and exportera. chinery and rupply factories; rubber factories; tors, steam railroad; conductors, street rail­ Advertising agencies. straw factories; turpentine farms and distill­ road; foremen and overseers, ste&J:Il railroad, Grain elevators. eries. street railroad; laborers (includes construe· Warehouses and cold-storage plants. 1941 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE 9089 Wholesale trade and retail trade (except Laundry owners, managers, and ofilcials. Mr. VOORHIS of California. Mr. automobile) : Fruit and vegetable graders and Lauhdry. operative&, deliverymen, laborers. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent to ex­ packers, meat cutters. Midwive3. Nurses (not trained) . tend my remarks in the Appendix on two PUBLIC SERVICE (NOT ELSEWHERE CLASSIFIED) Porters: domestic and personal service, different subjects; in one to include a por­ Firemen, fire department. Professional service, steam railroad. tion of an address delivered by a master Guards, watchmen, and doorkeepers. Other porters (except in stores) . of the National Grange, and also a por­ Laborers, public service. Restaurant, cafe, and lunchroom keepers. tion of the report of the legislative repre­ Detectives, marshals and constables, pro­ Servants, cooks. sentative of the National Grange, and in bation and truant officers, sheriffs. Other servants. the other one to include a portion of a Ofilcials and inspectors: City, county, State, · Waiters. statement by the Central Japanese Asso­ United States. Cemetery keeper~. Policemen. Hunters, trappers, and guides. ciation of America. Soldiers, sailors, and marines. Other occupations. The SPEAKER. Is there objection? Other public-service pursuits. There was no objection. CLERICAL OCCUPATIONS Mr. TINKHAM. Mr. Speaker, I ask PROFESSIONAL SERVICE Agents, collectors, and credit men. unanimous consent to extend my re­ Actors. Accountants and auditors. . marks in the REcoRD by the inclusion of Showmen. Bookkeepers and cashiers. Architects. .Clerks (excep_t "clerks" in stores). . a speech delivered in Chicago on Wednes­ Artists, sculptors, and teachers of· art. - . Messenger, errand, and ofilce boys and girls. day last by Mr. Hoover. ·I have an Authors. · Stenogrl?-phers and typists. · estimate of ·the cost from the Public Editors and reporters. Printer. - Chemists, assayers, and metallurgists. Mr. Speaker,· the bootblack charging ·5 The SPEAKER. Is there objection? Clergymen. cents for a shine, the base period week There was no objection. · College presidents and professors. would have to get an order from Wash­ Dentists. LEAVE OF ABSENCE Designers. ington to increase it. Draftsmen. Consider the millions of .problems that By unanimous consent, leave of' ab­ Inventors. would immediately arise and would re­ sence was granted as follows: Lawyers, Judges, and justices. quire early consideration by boards and · To Mr. LYNCH, for November 25, 1941, Muscians and teachers of music. commissions here in Washington that to ·attend the fiftieth wedding anniver­ Osteopaths. · · could not be established for months. · sary of his parents.- Photographers. Mr. STEAGALL. Mr. Chairman, I SENATE ENROLLED BILL SIGNED Physici_ans and surgeons. . move that the Committee do now: rise. . . Teachers (athletics, dancing, etc.). The Speaker announced his signature Teacl:ers (school). The motion was agreed -to. to an enrolled bill of the Senate of the Technical engineers. Accordingly the Committee rose; and toll owing ti_tle: · Civil engineers and surveyors. the Speaker having resumed the chair, Electrical engineers. Mr. CooPER, Chairman of the Committee _ s. 1884. An .act to ,make provision for the Mechanical engineers. of the Whole House ·on the state of the construction activities of the_Army. _ Mining engineers. Union, reported that the Committee, · BILLS PRESENTED TO THE PRESIDENT Trained nurses. . having had under consideration the bill Veterinary surgeons. · Mr. KIRWAN, from the Committee on County agents, farm demonstrators, etc. to be the conferees on the part of H. R. 3174. An act for the relief of H . L. 2083. By the SPEAKER: Petition of the the Senate. Reppart and others; Ladies' Auxiliary, No. 69, International Wood- The message also announced that the H. R. 3182. An act to provide for the ·altera­ workers of America, Camp No. 3, Shelton, Senate insists up.on its amendment to the tion, reconstruction, or relocation of certain Wash., petitioning consideration of their res- bill (H. R. 3141) entitled "An act for the highway and railroad bridges by the Ten­ elution with reference to House bill 1410; to nessee Valley Authority; the committee on ways and Means. relief of Fred Farner and Doris M. H. R. 3315. An act for the relief of Tibor 2084. Also, petition of the United Electrical Schroeder," disagreed to by the House; Hoffmann and Magda Hoffmann; Radio and Machine workers of America, agrees to the conference asked by the H. R. 3499. An act for the relief of Frank E. Lynn, Mass., petitioning consideration of House on the disagreeing votes of the Day; their resolution with reference to House b11l two Houses thereon, and appoints Mr . . H. R. 3500. An act for ·the relief of .J. B. "1410; to the Committee on Ways and Means. BROWN, Mr. 'RoSIER, and Mr. CAPPER to Giles;